Chad Goes Deep (Tom Allen)

Summary

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You Made It Weird with Pete Holmes – Episode Summary

Episode: Chad Goes Deep (Tom Allen)

Date: March 26, 2025
Guests: Tom Allen (aka "Chad" from Chad & JT Go Deep)
Host: Pete Holmes

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Overview

This episode of You Made It Weird features Tom Allen, best known as "Chad" from the YouTube and Netflix comedy duo Chad & JT Go Deep. Pete and Tom dive into Tom’s comedic persona, his family and upbringing, boarding school culture shocks, personal and professional insecurities, playfulness in comedy, spiritual practices, and psychedelic experiences. The conversation is candid, playful, and philosophical, with heartfelt detours into self-acceptance, existential anxieties, and finding one's true self both on stage and in life.

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Key Discussion Points

1. Tom Allen’s Comedy Roots & Family Background

• Tom’s Upbringing & Family Expectations:
  • Raised in a high-achieving family—dad was a doctor, siblings in finance and attended prestigious schools.
  • Felt like a “secret goof” in a family that valued traditional success.
  • “I always kind of felt a little bit kind of in real life, that kind of scared to be myself a little bit when I was younger…” (09:07)
• Comedy as Self-Expression:
  • Found playfulness and his “real self” through stand-up and developing the Chad persona.
  • Got the “green light” from his father to pursue acting/comedy at age 21 after resisting more conventional career paths.
  • “He’s actually the reason I...just went like hard, full steam.” (28:55)

2. The Boarding School & Culture Shock Experience

• Transition from California to East Coast Boarding School:
  • Attended Hotchkiss after siblings; describes boarding school as highly competitive and a cultural shock from laid-back California.
  • “First guy I met...he’s like, ‘I want to manage a hedge fund.’ You know, we’re like 14.” (16:51)
  • Felt an increased pressure to fit in, leading to party culture and a search for identity.

3. Fitting In, Insecurity, and Playful Rebellion

• Openly discusses experimenting with drugs at boarding school, not for substance’s sake but as a way to find confidence and expression.
• Felt partying allowed him to “be himself a little bit,” a preview of how comedy would later become his primary outlet.
• Parallels between the rush of performing and the thrill (and social container) of party culture.

4. The Role of Naivete and Fearlessness in Creative Pursuits

• Both Pete and Tom discuss the “necessary naivete” to pursue comedy, echoing Anthony Jeselnik:
  • “You need like a large amount of naivete to go into comedy.” (13:24)
• The importance of playfulness and not worrying about long-term outcomes:
  • “There’s what I do, and I love what I do...But when you see people just playing and being purely silly…there’s something quietly inspiring.” (07:52)
  • Pete praises Tom’s work: “It’s like somebody woke up completely unafraid.” (08:08)

5. Spirituality, Non-Duality, and Personal Practice

• Deep dive into non-duality and spiritual inquiry, citing Eckhart Tolle, Rupert Spira, and experiences with psychedelics.
• Tom and Pete discuss the blend of Eastern wisdom (Vedanta/Advaita), the “playful, fearless” mindset, and living in the present:
  • “[Spirituality is] wanting to reach a place where you just always feel playful and secure, knowing who you really are is awareness and nothing can really hurt you.” (46:22)
• Gratefulness practice:
  • “The real thing is to say thank you for everything. I’ve been doing it. I’ve been, like, really stressed, and I’m just trying to be like, thank you.” (61:01)

6. Ego, Achievement, and Letting Go

• Open exploration of deep-seated anxieties about worth and the pressure to "kill it" in comedy:
  • “My biggest fear...I’m worthless.” (67:05)
• The role of inherited family values in shaping personal ambition.
• The realization that self-worth can't only be tied to traditional success or outside recognition.

7. Psychedelics, Death, and Consciousness

• Pete shares experiences with 5-MeO-DMT and ketamine, likening them to ego death and merging with awareness.
• Both relate these experiences to non-dual philosophies—“You don't go anywhere. There's nowhere to go. You can't move an inch away from source...” (77:39)
• Discussion of near-death experiences and the comfort found in merging stories from “the other side” with spiritual teachings.

8. Art, Joy, and “Fight Club”

• The importance of following one’s unique “triangle” (per Conan O’Brien): keep doing your distinct thing amidst the noise.
• Tom’s approach to his comedy videos: “following joy” and not just chasing what the industry expects.
• Validation through play and first-hand “feedback” in art and life.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Playfulness & Comedy:
  “It’s not only funny, but there’s something kind of quietly inspiring, like, why am I so tight?” – Pete Holmes (08:48)
• On Living Out Loud:
  "You woke up and realized the infinite potential of reality—and went at it without feeling fear." – Pete Holmes (08:32)
• On Spiritual Playfulness:
  “One of the indicators of knowing your true nature is a certain playfulness and a certain fearlessness.” – Pete Holmes (47:56)
• On Death & Awareness:
  “You don't go anywhere. There's nowhere to go. You can't move an inch away from source, God, being, knowing, consciousness. It's what you are.” – Pete Holmes (77:39)
• On Life's Challenges:
  “Your tax problems are a tiger chasing its food. And it’s like the happiest it’s ever been.” – Pete Holmes (63:06)
• On Marriage & Partnership:
  “Respect is a great avenue of love... putting your thing over here because you respect that they want that week to do that thing.” – Pete Holmes (129:16)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [03:41 – 13:24] Family background; Boarding school and the California vs. East Coast divide; Pressure to follow conventional paths.
• [16:51 – 23:40] Culture shock at boarding school; Partying, experimenting; Realities behind “professional” careers.
• [34:03 – 43:55] Playfulness, comedy as identity; Open mics as “fight club”; Finding real competitive drive through comedy.
• [43:55 – 55:36] Existential anxieties before performing; Spiritual practice, non-duality, and fearlessness; Eckhart Tolle anecdotes.
• [61:01 – 67:05] Gratefulness practice, real-world stressors, therapy, and inherited ego.
• [77:06 – 87:58] What happens after death; Psychedelics, direct wisdom, near-death experiences.
• [108:17 – 111:55] Art and career: Forcing vs. flowing, following joy; Conan's advice about triangles; The origins of Tom’s Fast & Furious in-public bit.
• [124:14 – 126:52] Hardest laughs: Starship Troopers, dorm buddy mishap; Classic dorm humor.
• [127:02 – 129:55] Marriage, respect, and the surprise of deep partnership; Allowing space for feelings.

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Additional Highlights

• Comedy in Character vs. Authenticity:
  Tom reflects on the paradox that playing a character (Chad) lets his real self shine.
• Culture & Success:
  Both discuss the difference between being happy vs. being “better than your enemies”—insight into American social dynamics. (113:03)
• Psychedelics as Death Rehearsal:
  Pete likens ketamine and DMT experiences to “dress rehearsals” for dying, returning always to the essential experience of being.
• Advice for Creatives:
  Echoing Conan, Tom, and Pete agree: keep hitting your triangle—consistency and authenticity will eventually cut through the noise.
• Anecdotal Gold:
  Tom’s hardest laugh? Watching Starship Troopers stoned in college and a dorm incident with shaved eyebrows.

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Tone & Final Takeaway

The conversation sails between funny, weird, vulnerable, and philosophical, peppered with moments of stoner giggles and deep dives into why humans fear, love, and strive. Both Pete and Tom advocate for play, presence, and acceptance—on stage, in art, and in life. The episode is a candid celebration of weirdness, spiritual curiosity, and living authentically, “completely unafraid.”

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Classic Sign-Off

Tom Allen: “Keep it crispy.” (131:49)
Pete Holmes: “Because when the wave tosses you down—just surrender, you cruise. Just cruise, man... that was the word we were looking for, and you got it.” (131:50)

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Transcript

[Tom Allen]

You made it weird. You made it weird. You made it weird.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, yeah, you made it weird. Yes, you did. You made it weird with Pete Holmes. What's happening, weirdos? This is. Well, this is interesting. This guy's name is Tom Allen, but most of you probably know him as Chad from Chad and JT Go Deep, their YouTube channel. He's so funny. I actually met him doing stand up as himself. He's very funny as himself, but he's his most well known. You got to go to Chad and JT go deep on their YouTube. They basically. They're like surfer. I sound like my mom. They're like these surfer stoner guys, but they go to, like, town meetings, like real town meetings, and, like, argue for a statue of Paul Walker or they want to fight for the right to party in Delaware. And it's real. It's a little like Borati and very, very, very funny. You got to check them out. And check out Tom when you can see him live. But look for Chad and JT Goes deep. So glad you guys are here. This show is. What? I don't know what I was going to say. This show is important to me, and I'm glad you're enjoying it as well. Go to PeteHomes.com for my tour dates. I had to reschedule Atlantic City. My apologies to our friends in New Jersey. We're gonna get a new date for that. I. It was work related. Everything's fine. We just have to move the date. But keep an eye out for that. So the next show will be Austin. Well, April 5th. I'll be at Largo. Always so fun. And actually that I think we had to cancel as well. We're gonna get some new dates for April. Part of April just kind of got, you know, moved around, but for sure, April 19 in Austin, followed by St. Louis, Toronto, Nashville, Irvine, San Jose, and Royal Oak, Michigan. All of those are available on petehomes.com Apologies for the reschedules. I always hate canceling and we avoid it whenever possible. So trust. If we did it, we had to do it. And we will redo it. We will find a way to make it make it happen. And we look forward to all of that. All that will be on PeterHomes.com so in the meantime, enjoy our friend Tom Allen. Chad and JT Goes deep. This is Chad. I'm going to ask you to get into it. Get in here, Thomas. Right here, if that's. Is that comfortable?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

It's very comfortable.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, you did put a good amount of distance between us. Most guests will go right there.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Well, they go right there.

[Pete Holmes]

No, no, you don't have to.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I mean, I'm a middle. You like that?

[Pete Holmes]

You like that?

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Does that work for you? Katie, she's gonna adjust the camera for your middle couch lifestyle.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I thought, I've seen people in the middle.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, you've seen the show?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Oh, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, then, first of all, thank you. But said full respect for middle mid couch. I mean, let me ask you this. We go to the movies, courtesy seat between us.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

It's like that kind of.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yeah, maybe. Maybe I have some intimacy.

[Pete Holmes]

Get on that ice cream cone, bro. Tell me about your interest. Are we.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Are we rolling?

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, dude. Welcome to the show.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

We always get home. There we go. I didn't realize.

[Pete Holmes]

We don't have to. We can trim all that out. But I like that middle seat.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

You know, I like to. I like to spread out.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, dude, get relaxed, man spread, they call it.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I'm a man spreader.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, yeah, you spread it out.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I can't believe you heard the show. That's so nice. We met briefly at a. At a. Where was that?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Salana Beach.

[Pete Holmes]

Salana Beach.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I remember. I forget the name of the club.

[Pete Holmes]

Me too.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

But it was a fun show.

[Pete Holmes]

It was fun.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I want to do it again.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Me too.

[Pete Holmes]

It's real pretty down there.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I like Salana Beach. I left. That's what I mean.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I left there and I was like.

[Pete Holmes]

I want to move here to Salana Beach. I do. Isn't it like 90 minutes south of where we are right now?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yeah, it's not that bad.

[Pete Holmes]

It's not that bad.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I mean, you're in Ohio. How.

[Pete Holmes]

90 minutes north.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

So that's three hours for me.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And how did you drive this morning?

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'll make. I'll make myself a nice little. Nice little Monday.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I won't drive. I have driven in just for this. That's fine.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But usually I'll, you know, do this and then a couple other things and then I'll go home.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Is Monday your LA Day?

[Pete Holmes]

When is my LA Day?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Nice?

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. I'm like Tim Ferriss.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Real regimented.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Always say that. You Google Tim Ferriss, it says. Did you mean Pete Holmes? It's like the similarities.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

That's why I thought. That's what I thought I was coming on.

[Pete Holmes]

That's right.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

To talk about peak performance. The Biohacks.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Four hours.

[Pete Holmes]

Four hours for our work week.

[Tom Allen]

Oh, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Does he do that anymore?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Though I feel like I have no idea.

[Pete Holmes]

I don't mean to make that face, but I'm like, I feel like that was like. I bet he would have a term for that. He's like, that's your splash. You got to get into the market with a splash.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

That was a huge splash.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, later you go like, I'm working four hours a day. You know what I mean? There's no way you're Tim Ferriss and you're working four hours a week.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I know. Well, it's. What do you do? For what? The rest.

[Pete Holmes]

What do you do? That's the other problem. Yeah, go. Oh my God. Life is so long. Just playing through Red Dead over and over and over and Zelda over and all the long games because you only work four hours a week is like, that's like 30 minutes a day.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Well, and do you think he feels beholden to his brand?

[Pete Holmes]

That's what I'm saying.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, I have emailed Timmy Fair and he at the end, like, he has a signature that says, like, you may notice my emails are short. And that's because. And it links to four hour work week which says we should be writing short ass emails. It's like, don't waste time being like, hey, yeah, hey, Tom. Thanks for your interest in talking to me. One thing before we get started. My cat just attacked me. I just needed to tell somebody. So he's just like, I'll see you Monday.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Eleven. Done.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And in the emails, was he Kurt?

[Pete Holmes]

It wasn't. Now I want to look it up. You want to look up what? A Tim Ferriss email.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I do.

[Pete Holmes]

I do too.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I'm interested.

[Pete Holmes]

I'm like trying to live life, you know what I mean?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Are you a biohacker?

[Pete Holmes]

I get, I go through periods in my life.

[Tom Allen]

Mm.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I'm similar.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. Like, what do you mean? Like, cuz I'll flare up real hot.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And then I'll get real crazy for a while.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yep.

[Pete Holmes]

Then it's almost like the other half of the year. I'm like Jabba the Hutt. And I'm like, shut up. Just like slothing around on my slug holder.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Well, that's, that's where I'm at right now. Because when I started comedy I was like, was like, I need to, I need to have a morning routine. I need to set myself up for success.

[Pete Holmes]

Yes.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I need to breathe, to meditate, you know, to like unlock my potential.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

But then I, my morning routine became like three hours and I would stress myself out about adhering to that and it'd be like, noon, and I'd be like, I'm exhausted, buddy.

[Pete Holmes]

You are just right talking to me right now. I relate. So, first of all, I looked it up. It was a totally normal email. It was a normal length.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

There was no signature at the end. I misremembered that.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

You're like, did you. Like, this took out most of your week.

[Tom Allen]

What?

[Pete Holmes]

Say what?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Or his email took up most of his work week.

[Pete Holmes]

You don't have this kind of time. I'm worried about you right back. Well, I'm so with you, like, right now. I usually get real flared up in the winter. Like, I come to life. I'm so, like, in the summer. I was just watching your. Hilarious, by the way. You just are hilarious.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Oh, thanks.

[Pete Holmes]

Watching fast and furious lines in public.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

There's what I. There's what I do, and I love what I do.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

But when.

[Pete Holmes]

When you see people just playing and being purely silly, like, I understand there's, like, strategy and there's editing and there's production. I'm not saying it's sloppy ye. But I am saying it's pure.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

It seems really playful.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Oh, thank you.

[Pete Holmes]

And the. And the town hall stuff, I don't know if those are town halls, but, you know, you go into those meetings and it's just so. I don't know. I think the highest compliment I can give the videos that I've seen of yours is like. It's like somebody woke up completely unafraid.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Completely unafraid. And that's like. I think that's a really high compliment. You woke up and realized the infinite potential of reality.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And went at it without feeling fear. Because a lot of those ideas, like saying fast and furious lines in public, somebody might have that, but then they'd be like, it's weird, or.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And you just go and do it. Or you go and petition in Delaware for parties or whatever it is.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And it's just. It's not only funny, but there's like, something kind of quietly inspiring, like, why am I so tight?

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You know what I mean?

[Tom Allen]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Would you say that that's important to you, like, playfulness and not being afraid?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

First of all. Thank you.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I mean, that means a lot. High praise coming from you. So I.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

You know, I was thinking about that because, like, growing up, I was very. I always had that playfulness about me, but I was shy, and I did feel a little. I've always kind of felt a little bit kind of in real life, that Kind of scared to be myself a little bit when I was younger and through, like, Chad and the character and stuff that was like that. That was sort of my way of. Of.

[Pete Holmes]

Think I was like a therapist. Taking a scary note.

[Tom Allen]

Keep going.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I love this.

[Pete Holmes]

You felt more comfortable as a character, is that.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And. Or even just. Or through comedy, like through stand up, you know, because I started in stand up and. And found this kind of Persona on stage. And. And, and through that, I was able to. I was. My brother actually said he's like, that's the real you on stage. And. And I think, because maybe I. My family's great, you know, but there it's, you know, highly educated, you know, very focused on success growing up. And. And so where I grew up in California.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. I imagine.

[Tom Allen]

But.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, maybe you're just doing.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I'm from. I'm from Northern California, though. And. But like, I went to boarding school back east and like, I'm the fifth child, so my brother, older brother's in finance, and then sisters and went to Yale and all that kind of stuff, so. And they were all very supportive and encourage me to be myself. But I did, like. I think I always had, like, a little bit of a guardedness to me.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

But that side of me would come out through.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Am I hearing you correctly? That loving family, but also not exactly like your dad and mom and dad aren't, like, doing bits at the dinner table necessarily.

[Tom Allen]

No. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

So here you are kind of feeling like a secret goof.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

And yet you're being kind of pushed and. No. No disrespect here, but, like, go to dental school or whatever it is.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

That's exactly what my dad encouraged me.

[Pete Holmes]

No.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Well, okay, that's crazy. He's a tapes.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I'm claiming it.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

He's a doctor, so.

[Pete Holmes]

Okay.

[Tom Allen]

He.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

You know, in college, I was kind of like, I did. I did fine. Like bees and. But he was like.

[Pete Holmes]

He's like, you know, nothing to sneeze.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Nothing sneeze. But he was like, you should be. You should be a dentist because they have a great lifestyle. You can surf and do what you want. And.

[Pete Holmes]

Sweet. He was thinking about you.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

He's. He's always thinking about.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Like, our futures.

[Pete Holmes]

It's not the dad from Dead Poets Society.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

No, no, no, no.

[Pete Holmes]

It's a dad who's trying to, like, he just wants. Trying to vibe with you. Like, use words like that. Like, trying to vibe with you, like, like surfing, taking it easy. So you should be a dentist.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yeah, he's Very like loving and supportive.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And he just cares. He wants us to be safe and secure. And so he's like, kind of like, you know, I was into surfing, I studied philosophy. And he's like, what, what major is that? I'm like, I'm like, it'll, it'll work out.

[Pete Holmes]

And you're just in a barrel talking about Plato.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And he's like, what?

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Like as a look, that's not my style. But as a dad, as I get older, I worry about me. When I was in my 20s.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I look back and I sometimes I see somebody's in a show.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Like I went and saw Stomp and I was like, I love this. And I caught myself going like, what are these guys going to be doing in 10 years? You can't do stomp for 10. That's how I feel. Like I've hardened.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I don't like it.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

When I was in my 20s, going to open mics, being like, this is going to be fine.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Like you totally.

[Pete Holmes]

But now I'm a middle aged man and I'm like, sure, you're in Stomp now, but those years could have been used. And I don't actually feel this way. I'm just kind of like embarrassed that I can relate to how your dad feels.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Oh, yeah. And I totally get it. Especially I'm in my 30s now, so I like, you know, it is funny looking. I remember Anthony Justin like said you need like a large amount of naivete to go into comedy.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

You know, like this kind of feeling that you can do it because you just go into open mics and you're like, you're just kind of trusting that it'll work out.

[Pete Holmes]

And what's weird is I'd like to hear your thought. I don't recall worrying.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Like, I know that sounds crazy.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, sure.

[Pete Holmes]

I worried like when or how it might happen. And I was aggressive and I was anxious. Yeah, sure. But I never was like. And this sounds like a brag. I don't really mean it as a brag. It was more of that naivete you're talking about where we were just kind of doing it.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And we thought we were doing the right thing. And I've said this a million times. I was like, we would be doing better than the other people at the open mics. And that's all we knew for that day. Very good for like ADD types. You're like, I won that day.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You know what I mean?

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But I didn't spend Too much time being like, what am I gonna do when I'm 50? You know what I mean? Like, I didn't think in those terms.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Oh, 100%. It was like. It was that thing of like, oh, I just got a new bit. I'm making my way.

[Pete Holmes]

See, this is what your comedy reminds me of. The guy that's like, I got a new bit.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You wake up. Yeah, things are good. I got a new bed. It is kind of that surfer mentality. Like, yeah, what could be wrong? I got a pop Tart. You know what I mean?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Exactly.

[Pete Holmes]

We're fine. Yeah, we have it. And there's the dad from dead Boat society going, get this hemp furniture out of my fucking house. Okay, so keep. I don't mean to interrupt. I'm very interested. Your dad told you to be a dentist. You started in. Stand up. Your brother said that's the real you feeling pulled like. Like kind of like an episode of the Crown.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You're supposed to go to the boarding school.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Exactly, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Was it rough like that? Was it like kind of beating the silly out of you?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I don't know if it was beating the silly out, you know, I think I went to boarding school. You know, I was excited to go because my brothers went and I really looked up to them, or look up to them.

[Pete Holmes]

What was it called?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Hotchkiss.

[Pete Holmes]

It always has names like that.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yeah, Hotchkiss. Yeah. Choate.

[Pete Holmes]

Choate.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I got into Cho. I didn't go to Choate.

[Pete Holmes]

Choate is another one. Yeah, dude, I got a choat. It sounds like a kind of a. Like a prickly dick or something.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Like a choad.

[Tom Allen]

But it's good.

[Pete Holmes]

It's not prickly. It's something.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

It's a chode.

[Pete Holmes]

It's a long chode. It's just a huge dick.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

It's an intellectual chode. It's. It's a new. It's a New England.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, it's a New England choad.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

New England, Yeah.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You got into Choate.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But you went to Hodgkiss.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Uh huh.

[Pete Holmes]

And you were excited because your brothers went, but what is it? Are we making our bed? Tell me everything.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Okay. So I was really excited to go because my brothers went there, my sister went there, my other sister went to St. Paul's similar school.

[Pete Holmes]

Okay. Overnight boarding school.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Boarding school. And, you know, coming from. I was born in Sacramento and no one I grew up with went to. It was like unheard of.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

They're like, what are you doing?

[Pete Holmes]

Very anti California Yeah. And about the Pacific Ocean says, no.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Come home.

[Tom Allen]

I know.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Well, that's.

[Pete Holmes]

After school.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I was excited because I, like, literally, I was like. I looked at the east coast culture, you know, Connecticut.

[Tom Allen]

I was like, oh, wow.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

They wear, like, polos, you know, pastel. And my brother, it was on in fine. He's 11 years older, so he was in finance. And I was like, wow, he's. He's making moves. He's on Wall Street. Like, this is so cool.

[Pete Holmes]

You liked it?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I liked it in eighth grade. I was really excited to go. And then I went, and it was a huge culture shock. Just the competitiveness and, you know, it's. I remember one of my first. I'm kind of writing a bit about it now, but when I. One of the first guys I met, he's like, what do you want to do after college? I was like, I work for Billabong. I don't. And he was like. I was like, what do you want to do? He's like, oh, I want to manage a hedge fund. You know, we're like, 14.

[Pete Holmes]

I relate so hard.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

This is going to sound silly, but when I would ask other. I remember being like, 12.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Maybe even younger. Like, how old are you in eighth grade? Like around 11. 12.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

No older than 14.

[Pete Holmes]

15 even then. 14. So older than I thought. No, because you graduate high school, you're.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I turned 13 in seventh grade. Something like.

[Pete Holmes]

Okay, so let's say I was around 12, I think. And I would ask a kid, like, what music he liked, and I liked Vanilla Ice or just whatever the fuck was happening.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And he'd be like, stones are Beatles. And I was like, what? That's my version of Hedgehog. Like, when you talk to a kid.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And you realize they have, like, a rich and, like, learned relationship with their father where they're, like, sitting around talking about Stones versus Beatles.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Are you an Elvis man? Are you a. I was just like, what the fuck? I knew my dad, but my dad wasn't like, there's two kinds of people in this world. Stones and beetles. And here's why you want to do a hedge fund or even be a dentist.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

So you were. I relate to your out of water feeling.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I don't even. I still don't know what a hedge fund is.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I don't either.

[Pete Holmes]

I don't know what it is.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I don't think people in hedge funds even know.

[Pete Holmes]

I don't think they know either.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

No.

[Pete Holmes]

It's like that game they're playing in Severance.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Where they're clicking the numbers and they go into the. That's a hedge fund, I'm pretty sure. But at the end of the day, you get $3 million.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Exactly. And they're just moving blocks.

[Pete Holmes]

It's severance, but you know who you are. And at the end of every day, you get $3 million. And Ben Stiller is directing you.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

They're like, you just put the block on. They're like, wow, you just.

[Pete Holmes]

You did it, man.

[Tom Allen]

You.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

The older I get, the more I feel like that's what Wall street kind.

[Pete Holmes]

Of like no one knows what's going on.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Finance. It's just words.

[Pete Holmes]

It's words for. I fuck with money.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

It's like, I feel like finances. You have $100 billion and I know you.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And then I say, you don't want to worry about that hundred bill. And they're like, I absolutely don't. I have all these candelabras burning down. You're like, you handle the candel. Yeah, I'll take it. And I'll take a.01% fee. And I do that 10 times. Now I make. Well, I should have said 0.1% because now I'm making 1% of $100 billion.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Which I'm not here to do math, but that's got to be at least 100 million.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Something like that.

[Pete Holmes]

Something like that. And that's what finance is.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

It's crazy. And it's like. It's exactly that. Hey, I'll take this money and I'll put it in bonds. And you're like, what are bonds? It's a made up thing, but it earns you a little bit more money.

[Pete Holmes]

And it's great name, by the way.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

The balls to call something a bond. I'm going to put your money in a bond or a trust.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

A trust.

[Pete Holmes]

We're going to put in a trust bond. Fixed rate.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Roth ira. Yeah, yeah. Roth ira.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

These are. All of those words that we just said are the same as Code Red Mountain Dew. Like, it's the same style. Like, what do I say to make you think I'm an extreme beverage?

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Or what do I say to make you think you can trust me with your hundred bill?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

That's like Wolf of Wall street where he made up the name.

[Pete Holmes]

I love that.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

What was it? What was the name of it? Like Wolf and.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Gray or something.

[Pete Holmes]

He makes up the name, makes it. Because it's supposed to sound like you can trust these people.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Exactly.

[Pete Holmes]

I was just saying to Val, the other night, dude, this is such a. This feels like a Chad and JT kind of thing. Like, what I mean by that? It's like a lava lamp. Kind of like beach conversation.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But I said to Val, I was like, we should only be talking about this. All we're doing as a species is trying to get each other's money. And that is so weird. It is with some exceptions.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But for the most part, even the exceptions, like a pastor or a priest, these are, like, state sanctioned. Nice people.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

That will kind of like help you. Or like FEMA or, you know, the Red Cross, but they're. They're still getting financed by the state. Everyone else is going like, do you like this? Do you like this? Yeah, give me some. Give me some. And that's. That's Pepsi all the way to a fucking Roth ira.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Everyone. We're just. But, like, if you look at it, like, zoomed out, like you're on a very intense psychedelic trip. If you could see it from above, it's just energy just constantly moving back and forth, and that's what we call reality. It's just like, you have it, I have it. He has it. You have it. We have it. But, like, you could also just be like, could we just stop this? I know I sound like a fucking deadbeat, but I'm like, what if we all just took some of it?

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

No, it's true. Well, and also, like, going back to the fencing, it's also. It's like we just make. We make things up.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And we're like, this is. You know. Or even what's funny is, like, growing up, you're like. You go to, like, the dentist and you're like, oh, they're just a dentist. They just fix teeth.

[Tom Allen]

Right.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

But then you grow up and you're like, no, it's a business. And they need.

[Pete Holmes]

They're selling you.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

They're selling.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I can't believe you said that, because the first time I went to a dentist, and they were like, you need braces. I mean, my teeth were like this. I was in my late 20s, and they're like, you need braces.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And I was like, oh.

[Pete Holmes]

Like, it clicked.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Like, it was. I felt like Steve Martin and the Jerk. Like, I had been a child.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And then I was like, they want my money.

[Tom Allen]

They just.

[Pete Holmes]

They will sell me braces. I decidedly don't need braces. I didn't get them. Yeah, my teeth are very straight. I don't. I didn't need them.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

This Guy was gonn put braces on me for money just for the four grand.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And he's like. And he goes home and his wife is like, how was your day? And he's like, great. I sold this some fuck braces. And they feel good. And our culture is like, he's good.

[Tom Allen]

He won. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

The dingus got braces, but you get like one eighth of a boat payment.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, exactly.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Oh, my God, it's so fun. Yeah, it is. My dentist is so transparent about it too. He's like, tell your friends about me. I need more money. He didn't say, I need more money. But he's basically like, help. He's like, look, man, I'm hurting here.

[Pete Holmes]

He's like, I'm gonna be invisalign. Okay.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I need help. I'm gonna let you see right through my corrective structure. Also, when your dad said to be a dentist, isn't like the number one fun? Not fun. It's not A fun fact about dentists is that they kill themselves. Yeah, yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Number one, you know, is so antithetical to who I am.

[Pete Holmes]

You mean just being a dentist?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yeah, he's antithetical right there.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. Like, it's completely against.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Well, I was just all about. I was all about having fun.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, yeah. Antithetical.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Being tan antithetical. And he's like, you should be a dentist. But, you know, it's a fun, fun fact, though.

[Pete Holmes]

Okay. Can I just hard agree?

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Don't forget your fun fact, because you're so not a dentist.

[Tom Allen]

I know.

[Pete Holmes]

Neon light.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

But if you think about it, I would be a fun dentist.

[Pete Holmes]

You'd be a fun anything.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But you'd have to do it on the beach, which also, like, why aren't we doing that? You ever get a massage on a beach? You're like, yeah, this is where it should have been.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Give the cat. I mean, you hear the ocean?

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, yes. It's a free white noise machine.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Why do all things medical offices have to be so sterile?

[Pete Holmes]

And I completely agree.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Unfun.

[Pete Holmes]

I completely agree. I went to a urologist that made his office like a man cave. And I was like, okay, but not this, but something. Yeah, something. I like some intention.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

It's like IKEA was like, can't furniture be fun?

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Here's the two things they need to fix in the medical industry. One, you should go in. And it shouldn't be khaki and light blue and fucking dead inside with the neon and it sucks. And it just. The whole lobby looks like you have it. And the magazines are so old, and it's George Clooney's wrinkled face, and everything's in this Kleenex, and there's always a old woman, and you're just watching, and you feel terrible. The whole thing stinks.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

The other thing is, it's 2025, and we're still filling out the same form five times. You're like, how many times do I have to write the date?

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Get on board.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Paperwork.

[Pete Holmes]

Get. No one's doing this. It's because. Oh. Because you cut open people.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You feel like you don't have to get an app.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, Dude. Our handymen have an app.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And ladies. Okay, keep going.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

How crazy is it that there used to just be files? Oh. And if it went paperwork.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Everywhere.

[Pete Holmes]

And if there was a flood or any sort of disaster, they're like, yeah. We don't know when you were born anymore.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Wow.

[Pete Holmes]

We don't know. My doctor before, my present doctor was one of the dying breed of, like, when he would, like, he'd take your height and your weight, he'd take out the little wheel and tell you if you were obese based on a little wheel. Look like the decoder ring from A Christmas Story.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

He's telling me to drink more Ovaltine. I'm like. He's like, you're fat. That's what he did. He went, you are medically fat. And I was like, you're. That's a ring. That thing doesn't work anymore. Joe Rogan, giant guy would be chronically obese based on his height and his weight. It's so dumb.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Oh, my God.

[Pete Holmes]

Anyway. Yeah. That needs an update.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

He's out of business, though. New lady app.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

That's hilarious.

[Pete Holmes]

So you don't want to be a dentist. Antithetical.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

No. But, you know, what is I. Oh, fun fact.

[Pete Holmes]

You said.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yeah. So at the end of college, my. I saw I always had an interest in, like, Hollywood and entertainment, and I thought the acceptable path would be producer. And I was like, that's the hedge.

[Pete Holmes]

Fund of show business.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I mean, I was like, the title sounds good.

[Pete Holmes]

It does.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

It's. It sounds acceptable.

[Pete Holmes]

By the way, who involved in a production isn't producing, isn't making it. You know what I mean?

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Like, the actors and the writers are producing the movie.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But they're like, no, I produce.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I'm the producer.

[Pete Holmes]

But you're. You're just calling in everyone. Well, then I've producers. I still. I've been in show business for like 20 years. I still don't know. Because there are different kinds of producers.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

There's some that are incredibly involved and then there's some that are just the money people.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Then ep. I don't know what episode I've been.

[Pete Holmes]

An EP and I don't know what an EP is. It's literally when there's an argument, it's like the military.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You go like, staff Sergeant, I'm a colonel. And that's spelled in a way you wouldn't guess. So I win. It's just a way anytime large groups of people get together, there need to be power structures to say who wins when there's a disagreement.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Exactly.

[Pete Holmes]

That's what an EP is.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

We're gonna be a producer.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

So I said, you know, we were at. It was the holidays. I was like, I want to be a producer. And my dad was like, I think you should be an actor.

[Pete Holmes]

What?

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

So dentist dad.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Has a strong second act.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yeah. So I'm the fifth child, so youngest. Seven. There's seven. Yeah. So I'm the youngest of my mom's kids.

[Pete Holmes]

Seven kid Adventist Adventists. Are you seven kid Advent kid Adventists.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

So he was like, you should be an actor. And I was like, really? And he's like. He's like, yeah, I think that's what you want to do. And so he's actually the reason I, like, he gave me the green light and then I just went like, hard, full steam.

[Pete Holmes]

How old were you when he said that?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

21, 22.

[Pete Holmes]

This is incredible.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

So wait, do you have a guess on this? Did he. Is it like in a movie, your mom's putting cold cream on and looking in the mirror and he's taking off his watch. You know, it's got that kind of like two tiered watch system.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And he's like, I just don't know about Tom. And he's like, sweetheart, let him go. Yeah, he's going to be an actor. You could. He's going to do it with it without your blessing. So give it to him. Do you think it was that?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I think it was like. I think I was like subtly resisting all these, you know, this kind of path.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Of, you know, going to medicine or finance or whatever. Not that I don't even think I could have done it past the classes, but, you know, that was what I was being pushed towards and I was just subtly resisting it. And I think he was kind of like, by the time he got to me, he's kind of like, I'LL just let him be himself.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, you had been. He. The other kids had whittled him down.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Like a rock.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

We call him Laid Back Bob now.

[Pete Holmes]

Lbb.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Lbb.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

So he's now Laid Back Bob.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Your first sibling who's 11 years.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

11 years older.

[Pete Holmes]

Older.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

12.

[Pete Holmes]

He got the brunt of Bob. Yes, he got full power Bob.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

He got like. So it's my.

[Tom Allen]

My.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

My brother and two sisters. They're, you know, 12, 11, and nine years older.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, wow.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And then it's my brother and I. My brother's two years older. So it's sort of like they were. We grew up kind of separately.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. Of course. They took a big intermission.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Same.

[Pete Holmes]

Same mom and everything.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Same mom.

[Pete Holmes]

They just were like, what do we do now? And they just did. Another family.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

They're like, it's the late 80s.

[Tom Allen]

We need.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yeah, we gotta restart.

[Pete Holmes]

Gotta do something else.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And they made a second batch.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Huh.

[Pete Holmes]

And now you think just by virtue of being worn down and laid back because of having so many fucking kids, he was cooler by the time you showed up.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And I think, too, he. He loves, like, action stars, and he had this dream of me being an action star.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, my God.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

He still pushes me towards that. Like, even last week, he's like, hey, if you got on, like, Special Ops or what, there's a reality show about being like a.

[Pete Holmes]

Is there?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Do you know what it's called?

[Pete Holmes]

I think it's called, like, Special Ops.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

He's like. He's like, if you got on Special Ops, the reality show Special Forces Special, think that could get you into action movies? And I was like, I think it's the other way. I think you go movies and then reality. Not reality.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, my gosh. Wait, are the people on Special Forces X?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I think, like, Denise Richards was on it. I haven't watched it.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, but he wants you to be. It's interesting because you look like the Memento guy.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Oh, yeah. What's his.

[Pete Holmes]

Guy Pierce.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Guy Pierce. You should be him. I'm telling you what to do for Halloween. Well, it would be a good Halloween costume.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You just have to write, remember Sammy Jenkins on your thumb.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I mean, I think if my dad saw me kicking ass in a movie, he would. He would be so stoked.

[Pete Holmes]

He would love it. Yeah, but then I still want to hear about boarding school and your morning routine, but, like, you get this green light from your dad. What a great moment in the movie of Tom. Like, that's a Key scene.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

If we're. If we're beating out your life.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And then you start doing stand up, and then is this when your brother says, like, oh, that's the real you. Like, I saw you.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

He actually said that recently.

[Tom Allen]

No way. Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

But I think he's always kind of known that.

[Pete Holmes]

It's the there you are, Peter from hook moment.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Where it's like, oh, my God. That's, like, your essence.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yeah. Because that goofy side of myself would come out with, like, him and, like, my mom. I'm really close to my mom, so I was always just really silly with my mom. And this is so cute.

[Pete Holmes]

I can't handle your story.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You got the softened, laid back Bob. You have the silly mom.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Everybody's loving you. Your brothers are seeing you.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

My sisters are great. I know. It's so. And then boarding school.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah. I.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

You know, I was. Yeah. Just. I kind of. Yeah. I became adolescent, and I just kind of rebelled a little bit and start.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, go ahead.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I just started partying a lot.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Because I was like.

[Pete Holmes]

I was.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I think I was just kind of searching for an identity because it was like, you know, C.T.Is. everyone was really good at hockey or lacrosse, and. And I think I was.

[Pete Holmes]

I was friends with some lacrosse players. It's not like they were classic bullies or anything, but I just remember being like, I can't. With the.

[Tom Allen]

Oh, yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Like, competitive sports, too. I was like, I was into it. I'm not competitive. And I was like, I played water polo, and. And everyone would be really intense. I'd be like, this is. Who cares?

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. Can I ask a kind of against our timeline?

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

When you got into comedy, did you. This is a leading question. I'll just say it instead of making it a question.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I was never competitive. And then when I found comedy, I recognized that when I cared about something.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

That's when my competitive juices appropriately would kind of flare up.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

100. Okay.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

It's because we don't care about the outcome of the game.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And it's. I was like, this is. I just knew. I was like, oh, this is. It's kind of like where you just recognize this is exactly what I want to do. So I was like. I was like, especially starting out. It's like with open mics, you're like, I'm gonna do this. This is my life. You know, I'm not gonna, like, drink or. Or, you know, do any. I, like. I partied a lot in college and high school because I think I was just kind of like, didn't know what I wanted to be and just kind of searching for an identity and it's Fight Club, man.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Do you remember that part in Fight Club where he goes, suddenly we had a reason to trim our nails.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Or to like. I don't think he says not drink, but essentially what you're saying.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

It's like a lot of times when you're trying to quit something. Like for me it would be like overeating or let's say smoking too much weed or whatever it is. It's actually. It's not about stopping something, it's about starting something.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

It sounds like an Internet clip where you should play swelling music under it.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But it's like, don't stop smoking. Start swimming.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Like, I've served. When you're surfing, you regret every cigarette you've ever had. I mean, you're like, that was insane. Like, I need to be strong.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

So stopping something sucks. But when you find your Fight club.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Then you have the reason to trim your nails and you are getting up in the morning or you are getting. Keeping your hair neat because you don't want someone to pull it in the fucking ring. So you found the reason to. I don't want to say clean up your act, but like, get focused.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

It was like pure focus. And were you. Were you similar when you.

[Pete Holmes]

When you stand up?

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

When did you start?

[Pete Holmes]

Like, it was. It was. I basically say 2000. 2001.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

It was to be clean. We can say 2000.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But when I first got to Chicago, it took me a while. I dragged my feet for a bit because I was scared. And then I went. And then. And then like once I was in, I was.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Very in.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

You just get hooked. You totally. That first laugh and. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, my God, you're so right. In fact, I don't want to sound like a turd, but when I talk to people and they're like, yeah, I did stand up for whatever. I did stand up for two years and I've been meaning to go back. I was going to be like, okay, that may be. But also there's probably. You're going to find a fight club. You're going to find the thing that, like, you have to do it or you kind of feel off.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You feel better and more comfortable and it. And just because culture, values stand up or values humor or values being special or whatever it is, doesn't mean that's your thing. Your thing could be something else.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Totally and it's also. You'd see with people, a lot of times it would be like, I hate open mics and doing it. But I'm like, to me, I was always like, I love open mics. Like, just, like, low risk.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

If you're at, like, Liquid Zoo in the Valley and you're making, like, some degenerate laugh on, like, a Tuesday night.

[Pete Holmes]

Yes.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I was like, that is like, that means that joke works.

[Pete Holmes]

That is so beautiful.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Really lighting it under me, that. That nostalgia for, like. I mean, the thing, like, how I'm not proud of this, but if I. If there's a gig and I'm like, I don't want to take two planes, and then what's the money? And then by the time I'm done, it's like, when. When you're young and starting. I take three trains in a fucking car and lose money to do five minutes and no one's there.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Never once was like, that was stupid. Like, if I did what I did in my 20s now, every night, I'd get home and be like, I gotta fucking change. I gotta figure this out. I can't be doing this. Yeah, but in your 20s. I was. I. I'm not just saying this. I was like, you. I was like, there was a table. I still remember sometimes where they were sitting at an open mic. Not their faces necessarily, but I did a show in Chicago where there were two girls that came. I remember every moment of the show. I remember the bits I did.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

One of them was, and I saw a road sign that said, end road work. I was like, man, people will protest anything. That's the dumbest joke. But I remember where I was, and I remember these two girls laughing at it because it mattered. We found our fight club.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

It's like. And it's working.

[Pete Holmes]

And it's working.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Especially open mics, if people are laughing, you're like, wow, this joke really slaps. Like an LA open mic. Or like, Chicago, you know, it's like. It's like, this must really work.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. That was even more so in New York. I bet in Chicago it was rough, but people wanted to have fun, I think. And then in New York, it was like 99.9 comedians.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Oh, yeah.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And it was just. That wasn't as fruitful of a. Of a scene. Although that's not true. There were some places that were okay.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But, yeah. So, okay, we're kind of on boarding school, but we're also just kind of on.

[Tom Allen]

Yes.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I keep going back for it.

[Pete Holmes]

No, no, no. We don't have to. Speaking of memento, we can go on a board as long as at the end we find out the guy from the movie Sneakers is Sammy Jenkins and is you.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Spoiler. So you can pick up wherever you want. I'm interested in. You were. You were partying because you were looking for your identity. I'm assuming you just, like, mean weed and drinking. You're not like.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yeah, I mean, I dabbled in some, you know, pills and powders.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I mean, because it's boarding school. Because.

[Pete Holmes]

Is it, like, true?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Well, yeah, I mean, it was, you know, it was a zero chance policy. So if you get caught once you're out, so you kind of look for alternatives. Because weed stinks. So does booze.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, my God.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

That is cr. I've never considered.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

That if you have a zero tolerance policy, you're driving kids towards cocaine or ketamine.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

It's like prison.

[Pete Holmes]

It is.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

That's crazy.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I Actually, one. One thing I did is. We heard that if you eat a. Eat enough nutmeg. The spice.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You can get high nutmeg. And then what was the one that's like weed? It's a seed. It's another spice. Anyway, that one's not true either. But nutmeg. You did.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I ate a bunch of nutmeg.

[Pete Holmes]

Did you mix it with water?

[Tom Allen]

See?

[Pete Holmes]

Kids are so fucking dumb. You were probably eating it like the fucking red clay of Mars and you're just scooping it in. It's going up your nose.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And you just chalked it down.

[Tom Allen]

Yep.

[Pete Holmes]

Edit nothing.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

No. I thought I felt a little bit goofy for a second, but I don't. That was probably just in my head.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, my God.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

But that's like. Yeah. So I kind of was, like, going off the rails a bit. I was always kind of. I was good at not going, like, crazy, but too far. But it was kind of. My parents actually got a little concerned.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, really?

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

What was it? If it wasn't weed or booze? What was your thing?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

There's some coke.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, cocaine.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

That's the coke. Smile.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, coke.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Because, you know, I never intended on doing any of it, but, like. And I always thought at that age, I was like, if you do hard drugs, you go insane.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Like, you just lose your mind. And then someone, like, had somebody's doing it a little bit. And so I tried, like, a little bit. I was like, oh, that's it?

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

So I was like, well, how old are you? 30.

[Pete Holmes]

4:34. So even I think you caught probably, like, the tail end of what I really got, which was like, the DARE program.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And all that stuff, which I'm actually, again, as an old man now, worrying about the people in Stomp.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I'm also like, that was a good program. I'm glad I did that.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But it certainly wasn't. Remember, like, even just say no. It was like, let's stop the nuanced conversation. Just don't do it. And then that gets kind of turned into, like, we had a cutout from a newspaper that was a woman with a gun up her nose, and it said cocaine. Like, that was. That's how they were dissuading us. Like, it was. It was a disturbing image.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But that was the 80s and 90s approach.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And I'm not even faulting it. Like, they didn't want to be like, look, you can do a little. Little toot. Ye want to say that.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

But.

[Pete Holmes]

So you did a little toot and did it. Like, was it your thing? I know this is weird to talk about, but, like, did your brain go like this?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

No, I was never, like. I was never really at risk of getting addicted to it.

[Pete Holmes]

Some people. That's the other thing we hear is like, some people do it, and they're like, that's what I've been looking for. And that's. That's what addiction is.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

That's like the voice of addiction is, this is what I've always wanted.

[Tom Allen]

You know?

[Pete Holmes]

And some people do light up that way.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yeah. And I. I definitely enjoyed it, but I. You know, it was more so. It wasn't more so. The. It was. The. The feeling of partying was, like, kind of going back to, like, performing. It allows me to be myself a little bit. Whenever I was partying, I was like. That's why I felt like I was like, that's who I am.

[Pete Holmes]

I knew what you were gonna say.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Because, look, I've never done cocaine, but stand up, it's gotta be like that. I mean, you could tell me if it's similar, that feeling of elation.

[Tom Allen]

Oh, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And the feeling of fearlessness. Right. Like, it can be really nervous and existentially dreadful before a show. Then afterwards, I'm like, what is there to fear? There's nothing to fear. Like, just feel fantastic.

[Tom Allen]

It.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

It is crazy, that roller coaster you got.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Right. It never goes away either, in my experience. It doesn't go away.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Doesn't go away.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And that's. That is Funny you bring up existential dread, because I do sometimes feel that before I get really. I'm like. I'm like, what is life? What am I. Am I gonna get through this thing?

[Pete Holmes]

I've. Before you're going on stage, you're very vulnerable, I think.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And your body doesn't know what's going on, and it kind of wants you to just get out of that situation. Yeah, I don't really feel that anymore, but I think the body does. The body is like. Or maybe we could just get the fuck out of here. And it'll start lobbing some weird balls at me, which are like, what is this? And I've had, like, strange panics, really. It's like it's looking for something to stick the panic to. So it'll find, like, the easiest one, which is like, what is life? What is reality? We're all gonna die. Like. And it'll stick it to that because it needs somewhere to hold it.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Does that still happen, would you say.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, now you know, we'll get to this. But you and I, when we met, we bonded. We only had, like, five seconds, but we were talking about our friend James Bashara, and we were talking about non. Dual. Non duality. Non duality. I was gonna say. Non dualism, I guess you could say. And I was like, now when I perform, my spiritual beliefs are very helpful because I go, it's just us. It's just a dream. Give them a good dream. Like, let's. Let's all have a nice moment together. But it's not going. Like, if you can take an audience. If you can take the otherness away from an audience and really see them as an aspect of your true essence, then there's nothing to be nervous about. So it's actually a really helpful. But when I was kind of in the beginning of my non duality, I would sometimes be backstage and be like, basically, it all comes down to, can you. If the universe is one thing, can you trust that thing? Or is it devilish and sinister and strange? The more I've encountered it, the more I've trusted it and the more I've softened. And then it does help me, before I go on stage to go, like, what are you talking about? It's all just play. Just go out and just play. It's not as serious as you think. It's just you watching you, and we're all just doing nothing, and it's all gone. But it was also beautiful. It can be empty and beautiful at the same time, but that's why all my heroes, you know, that. That speak on non duality seem so chill. They're talking for like a thousand people and they seem like they could fall asleep at any second. I'm like, that's. That's what's up. I'm not being spiritual to be practical, but it does have a practical implication to public speaking.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Totally.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And it's. I mean, that's what's attracted me to. To spirituality. Non duality is. Is like. Is the. The playfulness is like. Yeah. Wanting to reach a place where you just always feel playful and secure, knowing that you know who you really are is awareness and it's. Nothing can really hurt you.

[Pete Holmes]

That's exactly it.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, yeah. What is the quote? It doesn't matter. It's in the Bhagavad Gita where it's like. Well, actually, it's also in course in miracles. Nothing real can be threatened and nothing unreal exists. That's a really nice way of putting it.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

So it's like, well, my body and all this. This can be threatened. Well, then it's not real. The only thing that's real is this thing that can't be hurt. And that's really you. And that actually goes back to my original compliment. When I see you going into these situations. What's so appealing and attractive about fearlessness? Is it. It looks like someone who's secure in who they are.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Does that make sense?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yeah, it's. Thank you again.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. It's a chillness that comes from. What do you. What do you say that. Oh, that person is secure in themselves.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You know what I mean?

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And that's always in comedy, too. It's always what's. I've always loved comedy and certain characters. Even like Kramer. I would watch Kramer on Seinfeld.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And to me, he had that. He's so secure.

[Pete Holmes]

Yes.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

In just being crazy, unafraid. He's not afraid and afraid. He doesn't really care what other people think. And he's just living.

[Tom Allen]

Well, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Sorry. I don't know.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

He's just living.

[Pete Holmes]

I'm just so with you. I'm so with you. I think I don't want to encourage us to grade levels of spiritual realization. It's very tempting to want to do that. But I would say one of the indicators of knowing your true nature is a certain playfulness and a certain fearlessness. And those two things are incredibly appealing when you run into them. And you do see it. I just watched. I'm going through a Bob Dylan Phase. The joke I make is for no reason, but lately I've been getting into Bob Dylan. No reason. So stupid. I'm such a fucking ham.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I love it.

[Pete Holmes]

Chalamet movie. It's a great movie. But then I get into it. I'm such a fucking hack. But you watch Don't Look Back, the documentary of him in the 60s, and you're just like, this guy's not afraid.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

That's what it is. And when you know who you are and you know yourself to be the impervious awareness, then. Yeah. There was that moment in that doc where someone says, bob, you got a death threat. They're in the green room, they go, bob, you got a death threat. He's like 20 years old. And he goes, they said. Somebody said they're gonna shoot you. And he's smoking, and you see the whole thing on camera. He goes, I don't mind getting shot. I just don't want to be told about it. And I was like, that's a guy.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Whether or not he conceptualizes it in the way that you and I would conceptualize it. Oh, he knows his true essence.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Know it, schmo it, teach it. It doesn't matter. He is it.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

He's a guy that's just like, all right.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

It was like, wow.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Cool. It's awesome.

[Pete Holmes]

It's awesome.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

It is. I'm like, I. I remember watching, like, Ferris Bueller growing up. I'm like, ferris Bueller.

[Pete Holmes]

There's something Buddha y about him as well.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yeah. It's just like, you're just.

[Pete Holmes]

It's in the moment.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

In the moment.

[Pete Holmes]

But that's what I said about your work. Your work feels like guys that woke up and went, no one would stop. Like, it's a fun thought experiment. If you realize you were only going to be you for one day, it's just like a little vacation. Like, there are entities in another dimension. They vacation in you, and they can use your access, your friends, your talent, your location, your country, your year. What would you do? And, like, when things are exciting, you feel like you're honoring that experiment. And a lot of the videos you make, and I'm not leaving some out. I'm just saying the ones that I've seen all have that, like, wait, we can play. So they're playful and they're unafraid.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Thank you again.

[Pete Holmes]

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[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Non duality. All that kind of stuff is just. And you see it in or even like Eckhart Tolle. Yeah, you just see this in his eyes. He's like, yeah, not afraid. And he laughs at when people bring up their issues. He like giggles. I love that.

[Pete Holmes]

Rob Bell tells the story of Desmond Tutu and the Dalai Lama. He was doing a talk with them and they came on stage, they were the headliners. I think whenever spirituality and show business collide, it's really funny. So to think that they're planning on who they're gonna introduce first. They're like, well, we'll bring Rob out. Cause he's like the opener. Then we'll bring out the Bishop, Desmond Tutu and the Dalai Lama at the same time. Because they're co headlining.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But so Rob is sitting on the stage And Desmond Tutu and the Dalai Lama come out and these two, like, you know, holy people walk up to each other. He's like, what are they going to do? And he says they get real close and they start tickling each other. Literally, just like babies, like toddlers. They're just tickling each other.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Interesting.

[Pete Holmes]

And giggling children.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And I was like, that is also what I see in Eckhart. There's this talk. I've plugged it many times. It's called the Sun Will Also Die. It's a talk that Eckhart Tolle gave. It's an interview. There's no audience on 911 on September 11th. And I actually don't think you should start there if people listening aren't familiar with Eckhart, because you might be a little weirded out. But he's so. His equanimity is so secure. And that goes back to the metric of how you measure. It's unafraid and, like, trusting in the unknown.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Like, there isn't a moment where you go, like, it's okay. I met God. And he said, don't worry. Like, we all have some mystery and some uncertainty, but the fully cooked ones, for lack of a better term, seem to just like, giggle at that too.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And he's that way and he's laughing and being light. Like, in a way that, like on 9 11, that no one human would be. I don't mean he's unsympathetic. He mourns and he gets serious, but he's also light. And it's. It's not. It's not what you or I would do.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

That's so much. I gotta check that one out.

[Pete Holmes]

It's worth checking.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

What's it called again?

[Pete Holmes]

The Sun Will Also Die. I'm pretty sure you have to. Like, you can't just go on itunes. It's like a deep cut.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Okay.

[Pete Holmes]

Like, I had to get it and then get an MP3 player on my phone. But it's worth checking out. But he's saying the same thing he always says. And, like, that consistency is so appealing. My life is so up down every day. Like, even today, I woke up in a terrible mood. I'm in a great mood right now. I can't staple down who the fuck I am. So I'm very drawn to people that are just like, this is how I am. Because I'm not just running errands for the screaming baby.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Which is kind of. I'm still running errands for my screaming baby.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I mean, it's yeah, it's. It's.

[Pete Holmes]

I mean, my ego, Lila, if you see this, I don't mean you. I mean my own importance, my own safety.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And validity.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And it's that.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, it's.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

That conditioning is so hard to break.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And that's. You know, you're from New Hampshire, right?

[Pete Holmes]

I'm from Boston.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I'm from Boston.

[Pete Holmes]

Outside of Boston.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But I'll accept New Hampshire. I love it.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I love that New Hampshire.

[Pete Holmes]

I mean, it's new and it's Hampshire.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Live free or die.

[Pete Holmes]

Live free or die, man.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And they got fireworks. Pretty sure.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

New Hampshire still intimidates me. I'm from Massachusetts. You look at New Hampshire like you want to go in the attic. It seems frightening.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Connecticut, too.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But Connecticut is dirty because it's so close to New York. Close to the city.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

So it has a little grip. New Hampshire, I don't. I have no sense for it.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yeah. And that's hilarious. But there's that conditioning of like. Of, like, the east coast. Like, I got in, like, boarding school or growing up where you're like. Like, man, if I'm not successful, I will die.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And. And I still have that where it's like, you know, like, I'm just got engaged.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, nice. Congrats, bro.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Thank you. And I have, like, this, like, paddleboard ceremony. Oh, yeah. We got christened by our shaman landlord. No, but I did propose at the beach.

[Pete Holmes]

You got to, man. Do the proposal. Your face dictate. It's a beach proposal.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Sunset.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

No, midday, it's even better. Crisp December day.

[Pete Holmes]

Even better.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I was pretty pumped.

[Pete Holmes]

See, the visiting tourist is waiting, checking when sunset is. You're just like, beach is beach, baby.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Nice guy.

[Pete Holmes]

Nice.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

But it is when you, you know, kind of. That, like, added responsibility. You're like, man, I got. I have to make a certain amount of money to, like, you know, keep ever. To, like, kind of keep things afloat. And that's. I think that's when the James, actually, Bashar always says that, like, the real world will always. You can study philosophy all day and meditate or whatever, but the real world will always really test it.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And it's like maintaining that center when new kind of responsibilities, for sure, are thrown your way.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, I mean, you see that in a lot of the spiritual traditions. Right. Jesus goes into the desert, Buddha went into the woods, I believe. But they all come back. And I was actually just this morning, so Rupert Spira is my non. Duality, friend, teacher, person.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Do you know him?

[Pete Holmes]

No, but he. That's a hymn thing. He's like, just call me your friend. He's like, please don't call me.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Oh, that's cool.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I was listening to him on the way here to prepare it for.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, my God, that's hot. I love that. I mean, like, fucking fire. That's sexually erotic. I love that. But he was talking about, like, if you can only be peaceful when you're meditating, or, like, when you're on a retreat, it's not really going deep enough. We have to bring it back.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And I wrote it on my mirror. He was like, the real thing is to say thank you for everything.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I've been doing it. I've been, like, really stressed. And I'm just trying to be like, thank you.

[Tom Allen]

That's.

[Pete Holmes]

I'm not controlling this manifestation. And I'm a frustrated kind of feeling, like, a little overworked this week. And also, like, a lot of parenting and just like, a lot of body aches and a lot of flying and a lot of headaches and.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

My family's been getting sick and I'm just sort of like, like. And then he's like, thank you.

[Tom Allen]

Thank you.

[Pete Holmes]

Like, I. Like, who am I? It's almost like old school religion. It's like, who am I to say how things should be? This is how it is.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And I'm saying. I'm choosing to say thank you.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Like your dad with letting go of the dentist thing.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

True.

[Pete Holmes]

Don't fight it.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And just saying thank you. And it's. It's kind of. Sometimes I can get to a place of where stressful things arise. You know, like just life comes at you, and you can either. Yeah, you can either go, you know, like, why. Like, why is this. Why do I have to deal with this? Why can't everything just be smooth?

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Or you can get to a place where you're like, isn't this cool? Like, I've got tax problems, you know.

[Pete Holmes]

Funny, I wrote about that in my book. And it's advice that I'd do well to take from myself. But I go, when you're having tax problems.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You said like a TV show. You go, this is a good episode.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I don't know how I'm gonna get out.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Cool story.

[Pete Holmes]

It's a cool story.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And when you see. Sorry, if I've said this a million times, I know I've said it before, but zoos aren't prisons. Zoos are actually nursing homes. I know there are Bars, but really it's much more doting. There's your meals and medicine and they're just keeping you alive as long as possible. I don't feel like the vibe in prison is like all that medical care and all of that. Like, whatever. So when I'm at a zoo, that depression that you feel for the animals is actually like, oh yeah. Because that's not life. That tiger wants to chase its food. So your tax problems are a tiger chasing its food.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

That's interesting.

[Pete Holmes]

And it's like the happiest it's ever been.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And look for other examples of this. Not to minimize PTSD and the trauma of war or fighting, but military people with that intense purpose really miss it. Even people in certain traumatized areas talk about the bonding and the purpose and the togetherness of that. It's the opposite of a nursing home. Like having your meals brought to you and having no tax problems is actually. It goes back to the four hour work week.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

We're all falling in on itself. It's like. And then what? Like, we need to actually. We can't just clean the plumbing. We have to flush the toilet. Like we want to see the water go through the pipes.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You know.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yeah. It's, it's, it's, it's the, the journey. And a lot of it too is like, like going back to like the pressures I put on myself of like, you know, like getting married. It's like, it's like that's just a story I'm creating. I'm putting that on.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

What my mind thinks her expectations are. But it's.

[Pete Holmes]

That's right.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

It's, that's just, you know, the mind just doing its thing.

[Pete Holmes]

It's so good what you're saying. You're absolutely right. It's, it's, it's hard to have real time perspective. That's really another thing I feel like spirituality is. It's about not looking back and being like, what was I so upset about? But going like, what am I so upset about now? Let's look at it honestly. Now that's really interesting. I had another thing and it flew away. I started thinking about Eckhart Tolle again, but. So you're about 10 years younger than I am and when you talk about achieving and getting married and success that I've been doing parts work therapy, which has been really couldn't. Internal family systems couldn't recommend it enough. People have been, were telling me about it for 10 years before I finally did it. And it's like one session this sounds like an ad promo code. I'm just kidding. There's no promo code. In fact, I don't even have a person to tell you to go to. But internal family systems therapists. One session, I would say is like 10 sessions of regular, maybe more. Because you go in and you find the part of you that actually thinks it will die if it's not successful and you talk to it.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Interesting.

[Pete Holmes]

It's really interesting. I can't. It's one of those things. I get so excited. And I'm also aware that it's kind of boring.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

No, no.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Not, not to you, but I'm worried that the listeners might be like this again. But like, I realized in doing it like my, I like my drive and my dreams, but like they, they're at a five alarm fire. If I lose a thing or a gig goes away or that, that, that like I really think I'm go, I'm going to die. Like, there's a part of me that's like, you're gonna die or your wife's gonna leave you or the only reason people like you is because you provide.

[Tom Allen]

Right.

[Pete Holmes]

And then you start to realize that your dreams aren't even really. It's not as clean as that. It's not your dreams. And there's nothing wrong with this. We can work with it. You're kind of like mirroring. You mentioned your father. I'm mirroring my father's drive to be successful and to be seen as a success. So I'm like, they're not even my dreams. They're just the dreams. They're just like the pressure.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Right.

[Pete Holmes]

It's like. And when I say I inherited it, I don't mean like a disease. I'm just sort of like, no, I'm carrying something that I saw that my daughter is also going to say. I have to be very careful to be like, yeah, that's not your value. But still, I sure am going out to the batting cages a lot.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

For someone who claims to not care about hitting a fastball. You know what I mean?

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And that speaks pretty loud.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But so you have that a little bit. Like, especially from your boarding school days.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Like if you don't kill it big time, I'd say.

[Pete Holmes]

Really?

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

That's your biggest fear? Like, I'm worthless.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I think so.

[Pete Holmes]

Welcome to the podcast. Is that your biggest fear? I'm worthless.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

That's a lot of people. There's a lot of people in show business. I'm. I'm worthless.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I'VE been getting through, studying this stuff. I've been, you know. You know what's funny is I started. I got into, like. When I first got into comedy, I got into, like, Wayne Dyer and even, like, the secret, you know, visualization.

[Pete Holmes]

Me, too. Everyone has to start at the secret. I'm not saying the secret isn't worth something. I'm just saying, like, I feel like we all start.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

That's your gateway.

[Pete Holmes]

It is a gateway because it's fun.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Oh, I can visualize a yacht.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, exactly. Yeah, exactly.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

So. So I.

[Pete Holmes]

And when my chips are down, by the way.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You'll hear me going back. It's like, you have to see it first.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Like, I'm the guy with the briefcase, but the briefcase is really just filled with, like, cracker wrappers.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I'm just like. You're out there hustling, trying to get something going.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I'll start talking about manifestation. If I ever say manifestation to you, it's because I'm in a tight spot.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I'll be like, well, you're going through it.

[Pete Holmes]

I don't just mean circumstantially, like something thin and tired. And I'm really like, we need to start taping up some pictures.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

After an early flight.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, exactly. No coffee.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

So you started with the secret.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yeah. You know what?

[Pete Holmes]

And Wayne Dyer.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Because I think I still love Wayne Dyer, but I think that the uncertainty of, like, this just. The comedy, you know, is I was like, I need something to grasp onto.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Like, and. And then that kind. It provided that kind of security, spirituality.

[Pete Holmes]

Like the big picture. Don't worry. Kind of stuff.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Or even more so at that time, like, the vision board kind of like, if I visualize this and I just work towards it every day, which I don't think it's a bad thing to do.

[Pete Holmes]

I don't either.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

But I'm like, then it will. Then it can manifest, and I'll be okay.

[Pete Holmes]

You know what it is? It's. It's. We're on a ship going on a huge voyage.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And nobody begrudges you for having, like, a little wooden parakeet that you rub every once in a while.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And, like, the value of that little wooden parakeet might not be scientifically provable, but the psychological. It's. Wilson volleyball.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

It's a joke. Just for Val. Val, my wife used to teach middle school, and she showed them Castaway, and she's like, what's an example of conflict? And someone went, wilson, the Volleyball. So we always say Wilson the volleyball. But, like, Wilson isn't literally helping him, but he really is helping him. And when you're in that uncertain place, that's exactly what I've been saying. That's when you're like, fuck it, man. A vision board does help. But I also think knowing what you're aiming for is deeply important, even if it's not exactly what happens. No. At least you're aiming in that direction.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And it's.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And I think, too. Yeah, it just gives you kind of something to grasp onto. But then, yeah, I guess what I was. And then. But I really started to, like, I'd listen to Eckhart Tolle, you know, like, the present, you know, I'd kind of grasp it. I feel like it has to marinate for a lot of people for like a year or two till you. Or maybe even longer. Maybe it just has to marinate your whole life, and you just continue to grasp it more and more.

[Pete Holmes]

I think there's something about. There's even a Bible verse where it's something like, verily, verily, comes the word of God. It's like, you have to, like, do it over and over.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You said conditioning and neural grooves. I really think there is something in the gray matter about, like, okay, you were told that your value was your achievement, and this, this and this. And. Well, we have to, like, wash it over. Second time I'm thinking about a rock underwater, but waves have to go over it so many times before it gets smooth.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yeah, it's. And go back to James Bashar. Shout out magic mine.

[Pete Holmes]

Drink your mind, man. Yeah, you didn't drink your magic mine.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Oh, yeah. Deserve. Oh, dude.

[Pete Holmes]

Of course.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

There's a magician for you, James, for watching. What up?

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, dude. James, get it. Promo code weird.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Is that the promo code?

[Pete Holmes]

It is added to your build. It's 10.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Promo code weird for Magic Man.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, there you go. It's actually 10% off. This gag is over. You guys probably see me all over the Internet talking about modern mammals, but it's real. It's absolutely real. In fact, I was just shooting something this week, and my hair needed to look perfect. And what I used to do in the past was I wouldn't wash it. I wouldn't wash it for three, four days. And that's how I got my hair to have that hold and that flow and look correct and not poofy and fluffed out, which is what shampoo does. But turns out modern mammals is a different kind of shampoo that cleans your hair, but makes it look like you didn't wash it. With shampoo, it's clean, it's manageable, it holds, it's got a flow, it looks perfect. It's almost like you don't even have to put in product afterwards. It's like it has enough natural oil retained through the washing process to make it look like, you know, when you just got back from the beach and your hair kind of looks perfect because you were swimming. It's like that and it's on demand. It's fantastic. It lasts forever. Get yourself the bottle, which is a traditional shampoo feel, or the bar, which is a ph balanced plastic free version. Both are fantastic and you can try both for 44 bucks. That's a special deal. Go to modernmammals.com weird and get that special combo deal and try both the bar and the bottle for 44 bucks. Like I said, that will last you a really, really long time because you don't even have to use it every day. Just when you want your hair clean, wash it like this. Looks perfect in about 30 seconds. That's modern mammals.com weird. Absolute game changer. Also, I'm wearing my Apollo right here. My Apollo Neuro is a wearable piece of tech that I wear on the inside of my wrist. This is a true story. Last week my daughter Leila took it off my wrist. I'm always wearing it. She put it on, she was playing little data and she ran away. Then she lost it, she didn't know where it was. And I spent a day and a half without my Apollo. And guys, I couldn't believe how much I've come to rely on my Apollo. It vibrates directly into your nervous system, sending soothing, calming messages, basically in the language that your body speaks to calm down, to regulate, giving you the sense of being held. The first thing I noticed was my sleep was dramatically worsened. It was harder to fall asleep and I was waking up way more. Because when you put the Apollo on the sleep setting, not only does it lull you to sleep by establishing a vibration rhythm on your body and then gradually slowing it down, lulling you into serenity, it also automatically reruns at the moment in your sleep cycle when you're most likely to wake up and stops you from waking up. If it only did that, I would be telling you that the Apollo is incredible. But it can also help you wake up, feel social, feel clear and focused, rebuild, recover calm, unwind, good night. There's even a joy setting if you don't like it on the inside of your wrist. You can wear it on your ankle. It was developed by a neuroscientist and a board certified psychiatrist who have been studying the impacts of. Of stress in humans for 15 years. This is not a mood ring. It's not a crystal. Apollo's effects on stress, sleep, cognitive performance and recovery have been proven in multiple clinical trials and real world studies. It's amazing. Give it a try. You get 40 bucks off and support the show. Go to ApolloNeuro.com weird use promo code weird. That's a P O L L O N e u r o.com weird for 40 bucks off. All right, back to the show he talks about.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Because he studies Vedanta and he talks about how, you know, it's you Vedanta. Like you have to wake up. Or they prescribe every morning. You wake up at like 4am and meditate and study the philosophy. Because it's like it's. You need to. If you don't do that, the old conditioning will come back and it's sort of like. It's like breaking through. I don't know what a good metaphor is, but it's kind of like cracking the ice a little bit.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. It's also like your security guards are still asleep.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You know, you get up before they're up.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Because I feel that I like to get up early in the morning and I can feel Pete. I can see him down the freeway. I'm like, God damn it, he's gonna be here any minute.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And you do get a good couple hours where it's just kind of clean. I've also heard Rupert say that it's an auspicious time to meditate and study is because you were just deeply asleep. And when you're deeply asleep, you're consciousness without an object. So you're basically like merged, which is why we love the piece of deep sleep. You also don't remember it because there's nothing there to remember. It's completely objectless, which means it's timeless. But he would say it's not the absence of awareness, it's the awareness of absence. So it's just awareness with nothing to notice. So it's a non experience. Another way to say that very simply would be like you were just hanging out with God and then you wake up and then like you start kind of conceptualizing it. Those two things. Getting married, I think has a very profound interest impact.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yeah, I love that.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Just kind of going off.

[Pete Holmes]

But yeah, go ahead.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

What do you. What do you think happens when we die?

[Pete Holmes]

Well, you know, it's interesting when you ask me a question like that. I've. I've noticed that I often tend to quote my teachers, and sometimes when I'm quoting my teachers, I'm telling you something that I aspire to fully, to use the 60s word, grok. Like embody and believe and take into my cells. So with that card showing, I like what Rupert Spirer says. He's like, our lives are like. It's like we're a current. You like this because it's the ocean.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

We're like a current in the ocean or a wave. And when you die, nothing happens to the water or to the ocean. You just kind of like, go back, emerge. Emerge. Yeah, but I smoked 5 Meo DMT, which is like a death trip. It's like a death experience.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And when I came back, well, even saying that is wrong, because that was the big takeaway. I was like, you don't go anywhere. There's nowhere to go. You can't move an inch away from source, God, being, knowing.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Consciousness. It's what you are. So no matter what shows up on the screen, no matter how far out your death experience is, it was still on the screen.

[Tom Allen]

Right.

[Pete Holmes]

Which is what you are, which was always right there. So I smoked five meo. I felt like I went into infinity, but then when I came back, I was like. But I was here the whole time. You don't. You don't go in, you don't go up, you don't go out. You were there and you've always been there. And that's the big joke is you go like you were looking for something and it was you. That's the joke.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

That's so interesting.

[Pete Holmes]

So that was my death experience.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And was it just really. Was it really blissful and peaceful when I was there?

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, well, it's.

[Pete Holmes]

It's like being deeply asleep there because it's timeless and a little bit objectless.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You come back and you start speaking in metaphor.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But the way that I described it to some of my other brothers that were doing it as well was I was like, this isn't literally it, but I felt like I went through like a. Kind of like a birth canal.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

There was, like, definitely, like, a tightness and then an expansion.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And like a very, like, rocket engine of, like, through and. And popping through.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Even though you're not really seeing that, but you've stopped seeing, like, your senses are. Are gone.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

So metaphorically, you're in A place that felt like being on the top. Layer of clouds, if you've ever been flying. And there's like a real.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Layer. Like a ground of cloud. Like a heaven. Like a classic heaven, to be honest. But it's dark. And the sky, it looked like stars and then there were just like bouncing orbs and. And the feeling I actually just had a ketamine experience is very similar. It's like, this is beyond yes and no. This is beyond. I like you. I don't like you.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And that's the only way to describe it. We only know yes and no.

[Tom Allen]

Right.

[Pete Holmes]

And when you go to something that's beyond yes and no.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

That's when the tears start flowing. That's when you start crying and laughing.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And that's pieces is you go like, we only. To quote Rupert, we only look at snow through orange tinted glasses. The five senses are orange tinted glasses. So everywhere we look, we see orange snow.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And when you take them off and you. And you go beyond the senses and beyond yes and no. You go into this other place where you could say you're accepted, or you could say everybody is accepted, but even the thought of accepted unaccepted, or me and everyone is so absurd that you realize we've only ever tasted an echo of an echo of an echo of peace or an echo of an echo of an echo of acceptance.

[Tom Allen]

Wow.

[Pete Holmes]

Because the real thing is actually so much fucking. It's so inexplicably potent.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Interesting.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. So that's what I think. Not to. Not to have hubris here, but that felt like a little bit of a dress rehearsal.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

For dying.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

What? So and. And then when we manifest in this kind of physical plane.

[Pete Holmes]

And you mean manifest, you mean come into manifestation, you don't mean make a boat just because we were talking about the secret earlier.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

You mean our true selves made a vision board? No, I'm just kidding. We are the true selves, the physical plant. You know, this is. That's just the pure awareness, having an experience of itself in this physical plane. Does that make sense?

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, I think. I think so. For sure. Again, Rupert would say it's like the ocean. So solipsism is. My limited mind is the only mind.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Right.

[Pete Holmes]

It's the only thing I know for sure. So it's the only thing I can know for sure. So I'm going to hypothesize that you're not real. You're not having an inner experience. You're not thinking or feeling, you're just appearing in my limited mind, and it's the only mind there is. Non. Duality is like. No, the one infinite consciousness is like the ocean. And it's. It's simultaneously manifesting as seemingly 10,000 things. That's. That's what they say. And.

[Tom Allen]

Right.

[Pete Holmes]

The tradition, obviously is billions of things.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But it's really just one ocean and a wave and. And nothing's really changing. And the ocean in itself never ceases to just be totally fine and peaceful.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Right.

[Pete Holmes]

But. Yeah. What do you think happens when you die? I mean, I know you enjoyed what I was saying, but like I said.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I like what you're saying, but I do.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I think it was. I listened to like near death experience stories.

[Pete Holmes]

Me too.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I find them so uplifting.

[Pete Holmes]

We had a great near death experience guy on this pod. Can you look that up, Katie? I'm sorry, because I'm blanking on his name, but it was great.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

It's so uplifting. And sometimes I'll listen to him while I go to sleep.

[Pete Holmes]

Adam Tapp is a great one.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I'm tap.

[Pete Holmes]

You could listen to him on this podcast or you can just type them into YouTube.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I'll check it out.

[Pete Holmes]

Because he shocked himself to death and he has. Let me just. I. I really feel so privileged in this moment to be talking with you and to have talked with Adam and just like to take things that you read from Rupert to experience them in psychedelic ways, to experience them in meditative ways, but then to also talk to people who have died.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And have them reflect the non dual understanding back to you with like a very firsthand sort of thing. And then I mentioned the telepathy tapes earlier. Do you know the telepathy tapes? So non verbal autistic kids are across the country, across the world showing very quantifiable meaning, verifiable signs of telepathy. So much so that I have a friend whose brother has autism, so he's non verbal. They tested it on him. So it's not just a podcast anymore. They got a random image generator on an iPad.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

The mom was looking at it. He's very close with his mom because that's his caregiver.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

He's over here watching an iPad. He's not even paying attention. She'd look at an image, he'd just start typing what it was.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Wow.

[Pete Holmes]

Isn't that incredible?

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I'd go into more detail, but it's their story.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

So interesting.

[Pete Holmes]

But you can listen to the telepathy tapes. But that is also like, if it is one ocean, then One wave presumably could merge or borrow the shape or an aspect of another wave. And a near death experience is also like, they'll use things like, we're always here. We've never not been here. You don't go to the afterlife. The veil is removed. Like it's more like stimuli is removed and the naked processor of your computer is removed. You're the blinking cursor now.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

If that makes any sense. So sorry, you were saying?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

No, I'm loving this.

[Pete Holmes]

I'm enjoying it too.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

It feels so. I love talking about it because it just makes you feel so joyful, which is so weird.

[Pete Holmes]

I completely agree.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Just talking about death, you know, because I'll listen to like near death experiences where he's like, you know, I was hit by a car and that's how it starts.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

You go to sleep to that. I'm like, trust me. It's like when they talk about it, it's so there's something scary to me.

[Pete Holmes]

It was never the zombies that were scary in Night of the Living Dead. It was that no one believed you. I've said that a million times. But like, you're running from zombies, you go into the police station, go, there's zombies. They'd always be like, yeah, right, this guy smoked. That sucks. So when you have a near death experience person or a spiritual teacher that does talk about death and goes, there are zombies out there. Like, your shoulders go down and you're like, thank you.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Can we talk about it? Yeah, that's, it's way more peaceful than denial.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

To me, I love it. I, I, I think it's a similar, basically what you're saying. I think it's, it's, you kind of merge back with pure consciousness and, and you're stripped of the, you know, kind of the egoic mind, the, the ego constraints. And so things like, like desire or fear are kind of stripped away from you.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Because you're not in this physical body where you can sense threats.

[Pete Holmes]

Right, right.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And then that, and that's just pure love.

[Pete Holmes]

That's right. The reason we use that word, love too, is that it's, it's again, it's a Rupert metaphor. But like the space in this room allows these couches and you and me, no matter what we do, we could be having a vicious fight. The room would still sort of neutrally, but you could also say lovingly, like accommodate it. And that is the spirit in which I've encountered God's love. We'll say, I put in quotes because that's just. Those are words. But God's love is this unbearable. Yes.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Aggressive. Yes.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Way more than you would even. Than is polite.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Right.

[Pete Holmes]

And. And sorry, I'm going on and on. But Jesus even tells stories. I love the one where the landowner hires three workers and one shows up at nine, one shows up at noon and one shows up at five. They all stop working at six and the landowner pays them all the same.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And people are just kind of like, what? And Jesus, like, that's like the kingdom of heaven. And I'm like, yeah, that's what we're talking about. Or the prodigal son coming home and the father being like, you're always with me. Everything I have is yours. Let's have a party. Like, you go. Like, that doesn't even make sense. And you're like, yeah, I know. Because we're in. What's the meaning? What's the purpose? Where's this going? We want to know if a moving rock is a tiger. We want to know if I gather this food, will it help me for the winter? And God's love is just kind of like. Like doesn't compute. Like deep sleep and like a deep meditative state.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yeah, it just is.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, it just is. Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And I. I think with near death experiences, one thing that, I guess one of the fears I have about death is like, your loved ones.

[Tom Allen]

Right.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Is. Is not being able to see your loved ones after you die.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, of course.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And. But. And then they talk about near death experiences where you kind of. You know, people say they saw their dead parent and they kind of guided them through the process. So I think that that's. That's. I don't fear death for myself, but it is kind of. I fear, like, not seeing loved ones.

[Pete Holmes]

Of course.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I think that's the biggest fear for me.

[Pete Holmes]

And I'm talking to myself. I'm certainly not. Pete, splaining this to you. What? I. I was thinking about it this morning, dude, on the ride down. Because I was in such a bad mood.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Again, my body's wrecked. I did six shows this weekend. I'm just kind of burnt out. Doing a lot of parenting and just feeling wrecked. And. And when I'm in a bad mood, I'll be driving. And like, every car I see, I just. I don't. I hate them. You know what I mean? I'm just so mad.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I'm embarrassed to tell you this, but it's true. I don't act on it.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I have to say that my. My Pride won't let me tell you that. I don't act on it.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But, like, in my internal reality, I'm just bitter.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And, like, scared. And then I always. I'm so lucky to have my partner, Val. And she's always just telling me, like, it's not about perfection. But that was ingrained in me. Like, be perfect, always. Be happy. Be smiley.

[Tom Allen]

Be good.

[Pete Holmes]

It's like. No, it's about giving space and being. Allowing. And kind of even the playful, spacious giggle at all of it, too.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Like, yeah, it sucks.

[Pete Holmes]

And, like, when you're gonna die and you're gonna miss your loved ones, you have to be like. You have to be allowing of that. Nothing is gained by being like, I should be spiritual about this.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Right?

[Tom Allen]

Right.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Right.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You have to be like, yeah, dude. Like, it has to be both. And.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Like, I'm infinite awareness and nothing happens when a. When a tide or a whirlpool unravels into the ocean.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Right.

[Pete Holmes]

That's ultimate reality, relative reality. Are you fucking nuts?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Like, I can.

[Pete Holmes]

I got things to do. I got things to see. I have a daughter. I have a family. I have art to make. I have friends. Like, it's both. It's never. It's even what we were saying earlier, that's Jesus in the desert. Then Jesus comes back. I'm sure Jesus was like, I would have loved one more supper.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Right.

[Pete Holmes]

I'm not even trying to be funny. That was the last Supper.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Would have loved another supper. These guys are great.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You know what I mean? And that's not wicked or not spiritual.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

If it was not spiritual, to kind of like. Like your character.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

To just kind of like, rock out and enjoy life.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Then what are we even doing? Like, why even do it?

[Tom Allen]

Right.

[Pete Holmes]

Rupert would say the meaning of life is it's this loving, one singular thing. It's just its nature to overflow and to dance and to play. That's what Leela's name means. Leela is the play, the dance. It's not for a purpose. It's not for some sort of. There's no spreadsheet that ultimate consciousness is filling out. It's just its nature to clap against itself and just like sparks flying off of two clashing, beautiful. Whatever. And those sparks are us. And it's there, and then it's not there. And then spirituality is like, don't worry about the there and not there. Just focus on what's always there. And then you can enjoy being the thing that's there and then not there. Wow, let's do some academy.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I've never tried it.

[Pete Holmes]

I highly recommend it. But I mean, like, yeah, you can do it legally and with their therapist. That's what I recommend to you is to do it legally and in a clinic where it is legal. But I. It's an incredibly non. Dual experience because you don't have a body when you do it.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

You have the out of body.

[Pete Holmes]

I wouldn't even call it out of body. I would call it a vanishing out of body. I would think like, oh, I'm a spirit and I'm floating over the earth or whatever. And I used to be fascinated by things like that. Like, that was another near death astral projecting. Ketamine is like, you know when you're using a paint program on a computer and you get the eraser and you just erase everything Interesting. And it's gone. And then you're just, just, you're just consciousness.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And if you're cool with that, you'll love it. If you're not cool with that.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yeah, you won't like it.

[Pete Holmes]

Like, you'll be like, where am I? But you'll still be so kind of comfortable that I don't think interesting. I don't know. It's not like mushrooms, where sometimes mushrooms is like welcome to the game show of your life or whatever.

[Tom Allen]

It's.

[Pete Holmes]

It's less mischievous.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

It seems cool.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. But have you, what have you done.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Psychedelics is that I've done mushrooms. I haven't done lsd. I haven't done, like, I haven't done. I've done an eighth of mushrooms a few times. But, you know, I was, I was younger, so I did some like, microdosing. But I, I do want to do Mushrooms or Academy with the intention of having a more spiritual experience. Because I haven't really done that.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. What's interesting about. Not to oversell it, but if you did work with a ketamine therapist in a legal manner, you can step it up.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Mushrooms. You take your mushrooms and you're on mushrooms.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You can kind of try. And I've known people that like wait an hour and then maybe take more. But ketamine is really like, here's a little.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

How do you feel? Here's a little more. How do you feel? You really can walk slowly up.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And you make like a very conscious decision to be like, all right, I'm really out there. But I'm gonna go, I'm gonna go for the, the void.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I'm gonna step into it. But again, Sorry to make this the ketamine sponsored podcast. Although, what was it? Mind Bloom. Mind Bloom used to be a sponsor of this podcast.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Oh, really?

[Pete Holmes]

So it is the ketamine sponsored podcast, but when one of the things is. It's a. It's a painkiller.

[Tom Allen]

Right.

[Pete Holmes]

It's a tranquilizer. So you feel bodily euphoric, and that emboldens you to be like, I'm ready to go meet the universe.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Like you.

[Pete Holmes]

You end up making. That's why it's good to do it with a therapist or a guide. You end up making decisions that are impeded or I would say, helped by the fact that you feel no pain and no fear.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Whereas opposed to, like, if you asked me to right now, just cannonball into infinity, I might need to, like, do some breath work. You know what I mean?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Do some Wim hof.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Are you into that too?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yeah.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I did something this morning. I. I hadn't done it in a while, and I did it. I was in Dallas this weekend, so I did some there, and I was like, oh. I. I was like, this is awesome.

[Pete Holmes]

I figured out about it.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

It just feels great. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Breathwork is the secret. I don't know, man. It's like, the one thing forget. Even take psychedelics off. There's my friend Tatiana, who actually happens to be a ketamine therapist. She sent me a breathwork thing because I was always like, how do you trip just by breathing? And she sent me this thing. The answer is so boring. It's like when you find out how a magic trick works. You do breath work for an hour. That's how. And I've never done it. Even when I've been on the road and I have nothing to do, I'm like, I'm gonna go for it. I've made it, like. Like 40 minutes, tops.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But the breath is just. It's the no gap circular. Like.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And if you do that for.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

For an hour, if you.

[Pete Holmes]

The program that I have is. Is a. I. I've never gone past 40 minutes. I'm assuming it's at least an hour.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But when you come out of that, you're desperately seeking Susan. You're, like, looking for an anvil to hold on to because you actually want to come back to Earth. You feel so good in your body and so kind of out there. It's very similar to being on drugs. You go like, but how could I ever make a phone call again?

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You have to remind yourself, like, in literally 15 minutes, you'll be back.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Right.

[Pete Holmes]

But you have to, like, with all of these things, you have to kind of coach yourself and be like, on ketamine, too. You have to be like, I promise you'll be back. I know it seems like you're never going to be back. I promise you'll be back.

[Tom Allen]

Wow.

[Pete Holmes]

So where did you get introduced to non dual stuff aspect of our chat?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I mean, I. I guess it started for me maybe with Eckhart. My brother showed me Eckhart.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And then Power of Now. Power of Now.

[Pete Holmes]

Did you read it or listen to it?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I listened to it. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I think that's the way to go.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And it's better, you know.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And he showed to me maybe like six years ago.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, wow.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And I was into all. I just. I was just drawn towards spirituality. And so I, you know, in my early 20s, like, the manifestation kind of stuff. And then Wayne Dyer and then. And then.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

It was kind of probably about, like four or five years ago when I started to get more into it, and I was like, oh, I should. I should ramp this up, because I just love it so much. So then I listened to Eckhart, I think. I think during COVID and I really started to grasp what he was saying.

[Pete Holmes]

Not to be disrespectful to all the people we lost during COVID but what a great time to, like, go through to reflect.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Because the world is, like, kind of on pause, but also on fire.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And you. And you found it at that time. That's great.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I was starting to just read more book, like, just philosophy books. And just like that, I really started to grasp Eckhart. And then I would have these moments just like when he tells you to just sort of observe the world without judgment. I would have, like, brief moments of, like, that kind of euphoric feeling of like, oh, that's presence. You know, on, like, a walk, you'd see trees, and you'd be like, whoa.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You tasted it.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

You taste it.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You start. Yeah. I love those.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

You're just those moments.

[Pete Holmes]

Great.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I was in a movie theater with my mom, and I tried to do it, and I had that moment. I was like, oh, I love it.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I. You know, it's funny. It's taken me a really long time, but Eckhart Tolle teaches that when you're, like, even watching tv, he goes, just keep a piece of your awareness.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

With you.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

That's aware that you're.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

That's a good impression.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

My. My Eckhart is glass Case of Emotion. It's an. It's an anchorman line.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

It's actually car totally saying it was his emotion. I listen to those books, like, once a year.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

A New Earth and a Paranoia.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

They're so good.

[Pete Holmes]

They're so good. And. And like we were saying.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You just need to wash it over. But now, again, I. I don't count how many years I've been doing spiritual things. But now when I'm watching a movie, I will notice that there's another part that's just kind of like. It's not really thinking about it, but it's, like, weird. Like I'm a thing in a thing that is kind of like a movie. And one of the things in the movie I do is watch other movies.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Watch it.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Watching tv.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Thinking about watching TV is so interesting.

[Pete Holmes]

It is.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

You're just that. Or even, like, nowadays, too, with, like, live stream. Like, I'm just gonna watch this guy play video games.

[Pete Holmes]

Yep. Yep. We love it, though. We can't get enough of it.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Maybe it is like, kind of like a. Brings us back to that feeling of like, oh, we're kind of just playing avatars or something.

[Pete Holmes]

I think it does. I think video games, for sure.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I got stoned recently and played Red Dead Redemption. And I was like, what the fuck? It was like an overwhelming.

[Tom Allen]

Like, what the fuck?

[Pete Holmes]

Like, there was a time where it was the Wild west and now it's these times. And then we made a simulator of that. But that's all fine and well, but when you think that reality is, in a sense, a simulation, so the nature of reality is a simulator. You can call God like a simulator. And then being in God's image. I know that's religious language, but being like our source, we then use the simulation to further simulate. The simulation is enough to get you pretty giggly while you're playing Redstone.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

It's so ridiculous.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, it's.

[Pete Holmes]

It's. But it's. We're back to that holy laughter. It's like, it's not, you know, you're going down the wrong path if it starts to freak you out. And with respect, maybe this is kind of freaky to some people, but you just. That's why teachers and. And people like Buddha or Christ or Eckhart or whoever you might have that are just telling you, like, relax, it's okay. Relax.

[Tom Allen]

It's okay.

[Pete Holmes]

Because you can be like, but, yeah, that's the wrong direction.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And it's. I think. I think going back to, like, Eckhart is like, I would have those moments of, like, kind of presence, and it is kind of this, this, this. This desire I've always had, I think, to reach that point of playfulness and because I just want to exist there. And so I started getting to that. And then I met James Bechara. He got me into Vedanta, which is like, I think Rupert Sparrow, Vedanta Advaita means non dual.

[Pete Holmes]

And Vedanta, I think, just means wisdom.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

So I think Advaita Vedanta is. This is just two white guys figuring it out.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But Advaita Vedanta, I think, just means non dual wisdom, understanding, teaching. We could Google that. But let's just live in the unknowing. Who cares? But, yeah, he probably gave you that book.

[Tom Allen]

The.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

The Eternities.

[Pete Holmes]

Eternities, yeah.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I tried to read that. For some reason, Rupert is just more of my jam. But did you read.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I read Eternities. I. I listened to Swami G, who's the Vedanta teacher. Okay. In the.

[Tom Allen]

The.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

The swami in.

[Pete Holmes]

That's James's person, right, Swami? Yeah, yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And. And then. Yeah, I love that. And then I loved his lectures. And he talks about, you know, being objective in. In this world. Like, it's kind of like the way we're able to watch a movie and not. And we're able to. It's. We're entertained by tragedy because we're not, you know, you're not. We're not attached. Attached to those.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

To what's happening. And. And so.

[Pete Holmes]

And then so many of the teachers I've been running across are like, that's entertainment. Like, you're having, like. Like my morning. I'm having, like this bitch of a morning.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And if I was non objectively watching that morning, it'd be a hoot.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Like Pinched Pete.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Is a hoot just watching it.

[Pete Holmes]

If you're not pinched Pete.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Exactly.

[Pete Holmes]

So a lot of Ramana Maharshi, Rupert, they use the movie analogy where it's like, if you can identify as the screen that out of which everything arises, like, when you. It's so interesting. This is either fascinating or it's not anything. But when you close your eyes and like, let's say an image comes up or a feeling comes up, the question, the holy question is like, out of what is that emerging and into what is that receding? And you can really get that sense. Like, I had a feeling in my throat because I just took a sip of the water, and it. Like, there's like, A million little dots of we don't know what. Of knowing show up, and then they go. And like, spirituality and Vedanta is, like, going, but out of. What is that? What is the ground of being? Or what is the piece of paper that those dots are written on? The golden thread that was there before the feeling in my throat and remained after the feeling in my throat. You can really do it easily with an image. If you picture. I always say, Michael Jordan. If you picture Michael Jordan, it dissolves in, and then eventually it dissolves away. But the screen of your knowing was there before it and after. It was there before your thoughts and after your thoughts. It was before your feelings and after your feelings. This is why the Bible uses the language of, like, the Alpha and the Omega, the beginning and the end. And when I was on ketamine going, like, it's beyond. Yes and no. It's just this, like. It's this infinite potential of knowing.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Within which and out of which everything is made.

[Tom Allen]

Wow.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yeah.

[Tom Allen]

The.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

The screen. The analogy, too, of, like, the screen coming to life and then going back in.

[Tom Allen]

That is. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But it remains.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

It remain. It's just green.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

The next level is me. Next level is even wrong, though, because I'm just like. That's, again, one of the things. Sorry, I know I'm talking a lot, but Rupert says, like, waiting for an enlightened experience, waiting for something incredible to happen, including your equanimity in every situation, is like saying, when this movie shows me a movie of a guy who's not bothered by anything, then I'll be able to see the screen.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And it's like, what. When the real masters, I think, are like, bad mood, good mood, good fortune, bad fortune. Losing my temper in a casino, sitting by a river. All the same.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And I've never really understood that, but they're going, like. Because that's, you know, that's not the real thing.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Right.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

It's like there's. There's a. It's kind of riding with the emotions, but having. Having a sense of peace.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. Through it all, this too shall pass. Or.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I know it always sounds like you're doing a voice, but also like. Oh, I see. Like.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Like this. This too. This too. This too. And the perhaps and the thank you. And the like. I don't know what's going on.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And that ability to step back and giggle at it.

[Pete Holmes]

And to giggle.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Michael Singer, too. I forgot. He's. He wrote Untethered Soul.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh. I don't know if I know that one.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

It's a good one. I like that guy a lot. He's interesting. He wrote this book called the Surrender Experiment where he just. He's a yogi in Florida and, like, he just got into meditation and he just did this experiment where he's like, I'm just going to surrender to life, so whatever life throws my way, I'll say yes to. And he ended up becoming, like a billionaire.

[Pete Holmes]

What?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

He created, like this computer software in the 70s, and it just like.

[Pete Holmes]

Sorry, what?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

It's crazy.

[Pete Holmes]

The Surrender Experiment. He's just like, I'm just going to do whatever comes my way.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And he's like. He felt drawn towards software and ended up creating, like, this billion dollar company. And it's really interesting.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, I'm with that because I. And for what it's worth, so is Rupert. He's like, following your gifts and what makes you happy and what lights you up. What are you following? Like, what is that intuition, that instinct and. But that sharing. There's something to that. Even if ultimate reality is all just one and nothing's really happening.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Relative reality, like going with your intuition and, and sharing your gifts and, and looking to connect and.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

What. So if you ask Rupert why. Why are you not a solipsist? Right. Why? Why? If you're. Everything you do is evidence based, experience based, but you can't experience my consciousness, how can you be sure I have one?

[Tom Allen]

Right.

[Pete Holmes]

How you should be a solipsist, he says, because when I act like a solipsist, I'm not rewarded with peace, love, and happiness. So it's like we're using the feedback as a. As a metal detector, as a guide. So I'm not surprised that this guy, even with something like software, he's drawn to it. There were the right people, then there were the right circumstances, and now they're feeling juiced. Like you when you started doing comedy. There you are, Peter.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

That, relatively speaking, is really exciting.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And that's why I was saying, like, we don't want to force our dreams and be like, I'm supposed to be Brad Pitt. You're supposed to, as Joseph Campbell said, follow your bliss and listen to the feedback.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Like, you're sending out that sonar ping. Did it ping back? Well, maybe go in this direction.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And it doesn't have to be in the NBA. Maybe it's something else.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And that. And that's. It's. It's. I remember, you know, I. A few years back, or even, like, I work on it now is like. Especially with this. You're like, I need to. I need to force an outcome. I need to, like, you know.

[Pete Holmes]

You mean getting engaged?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

No, no, no. I'm talking about career stuff.

[Tom Allen]

Okay.

[Pete Holmes]

Sorry. That's what you meant by even now. No, no, no. Yeah, yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I mean, just like, I need to sell a TV show or I need to, like, this is what needs to happen.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

For my path to, you know, become realized or for my vision to become realized.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Whereas as opposed to, you know, what you're saying is like following your joy. It's like making the Fast and Furious movie quote videos. Because I just love doing that. And then trusting that if I keep doing stuff like that, then the right things will come along, as opposed to being like, well, you know, I don't know if that's really what, like, an exec is. Look. You know what I'm saying?

[Pete Holmes]

Totally.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, maybe you've heard me say it. I say it all the time. But it's. If you get firsthand great advice from Conan o', Brien, you share it.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And he goes, the whole of show business is a million billion people playing tubas and oboes and banging on pianos. He's like, all you can do is hit your little triangle and just keep hitting it. And then the singularity of you doing what you're supposed to do, which is your little triangle, will start to stand out because of its consistency while everyone is switching it up, trying to guess when an executive might, like, yeah, maybe I'll play an organ while I chew on a harmonica. You just keep doing what's written on your bones to do. Eventually all the noise will become the backdrop of your clean triangle sound. He didn't exactly say it like that. Yeah, but that's. That was what he meant. So, like.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

That you're fast and furious as you're trying to.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

It's like just your fight club. It's my fight club.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Just saying fast and figures close to.

[Pete Holmes]

People is the line I had to ask.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

So one of the scenes. So they go around to, like, a car show, basically, and they're doing. In the wild scenes from Fast and the Furious. And it's so funny. And one of the lines is like, Rodriguez, he's hitting her from.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Oh, oh. Fuentes. Verones tapping her.

[Pete Holmes]

Barones tapping her.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And then Tavener tapping her. How. And then. Does he say doggy?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

No, no.

[Pete Holmes]

I was like, how bad is that scene?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I didn't know that's.

[Pete Holmes]

Does he say tapping her out?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yeah, he says tapping her out. So it's Paul Walker and Tyrese talking to the cops, and they're undercover. And Varrone is. This is too Fast and Furious. So that Verone is the drug dealer played by Cole Hauser, who's Rip And Yellowstone. Do you watch Yellowstone?

[Pete Holmes]

Should I?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

It's good, I'd say first few seasons.

[Pete Holmes]

Okay.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And so he's. Oh, Evan Mendez is undercover. So she's. You know, and she's, like, hooking up with Cole Hauser. And so Tyrese is like. To the undercover. He's like. To the cops, he's like, Fuentes, Evan Mendez. Verones tapping her. The guy goes tapping her. Tapping her how?

[Pete Holmes]

And then he doesn't know what tapping her means. The cop is like, such a square.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Okay.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And then the other cop goes, that is crap. And then Tyrese goes, what you talking about, homeboy? We know what we seen, so we just did.

[Pete Holmes]

He took that scene.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

To the street.

[Tom Allen]

Yes.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

So, yeah, we just.

[Pete Holmes]

It's too good.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Just. It just interweave. Just only speak in Fast and furious quotes. That's the bit.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, my God, Joe, you gotta clip this with clips of that. It's too funny. That is just. People have to see what we're talking about.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

We did Point Break. Oh, yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I saw that too.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And then we did Nicholas Cage recently, which was. Which is really fun.

[Pete Holmes]

They're so funny.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

So fun.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

So, yeah, I have a blast doing those.

[Pete Holmes]

I love that. Well, I'd be remiss if we didn't hit some of my fave quests.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

First of all, when I get stoned, I talk like your character.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Oh, you do?

[Pete Holmes]

In the videos.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

There's something about the California surf guy. It's like a vacation for talking. You know what I mean?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

It's fun.

[Pete Holmes]

Do you feel the same way?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Oh, 100%.

[Pete Holmes]

Like, it just feels great to be like, hi. Just. Just smashed a burrito. Like, it just feels right and good to abbreviate words. That's what. That's what made me think of it.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Some of my fave questions.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

What's the ish?

[Pete Holmes]

What's the ish?

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

It just feels great.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Why? That didn't take over the world because we don't really care about being happy. We want to be happier than our enemies.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

We don't want to be happy as much. We want to be a winner.

[Tom Allen]

Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

Which means someone has to be beneath us, that we've humiliated, and that's really? The American way. It's not being happy.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Happy is stupid. Happy is like some guy's, you know, whatever. I don't want to drag some place. I'm just saying, like, we. Our culture does not value happiness very much.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

No.

[Pete Holmes]

We think we. We like the pursuit of happiness.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But we don't actually want to be happy. We just want to destroy somebody.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Winning and dominating.

[Pete Holmes]

We want to win and domina dominate and know we won and dominated. And if we're a little happy with that for a moment, that's fine.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But then we'll think about, like, how we can sell a commemorative coin of the day. You know what I mean? Like. Or sell the movie rights.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

We gotta just keep pursuing or start.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

A hedge fund, whatever the fuck does.

[Pete Holmes]

Sonic the hedge fund. Yeah, Sonic the hedge fund, man.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

That's a good spin off.

[Pete Holmes]

That's a good. That's a TikTok right there. Sonic the hedge fund. Yeah, that's me just going, like, what, am I gonna ask Ben Schwartz to do it? That's interesting to me because then I'll know I'm winning. I'm asking Ben for his time and I'm dominating him and he'll do it. And that means I'm important. That's interesting to me. Not the actual idea, but can I get Ben to do it now? I'm an American. Have you ever seen a ghost or an alien ufo?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I wish.

[Pete Holmes]

Ever seen a psychic that knew something crazy?

[Tom Allen]

No.

[Pete Holmes]

Really? Seemed like a guy who's maybe sat.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Down on a. I'm searching for it, but maybe that's my problem. Yeah, maybe, you know, I'm scared of ghosts, but, yeah, I love aliens. But I will say this about aliens, you know, it's now become so mainstream. I know it's kind of not cool anymore.

[Pete Holmes]

Agreed.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

The government's talking about it.

[Pete Holmes]

Lame.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I think aliens are out.

[Pete Holmes]

I agree.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And I'm like, if the government's like, yeah, can you believe, like, this thing is nerd?

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I'm like, shut up. I liked when it was like, underground and.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Like, say people are like, like, hey, man, you believe in aliens? Do that kind of. It's kind of like when weed became legal. That's a bet.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You have a bet.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I'll do things I've been trying to find.

[Pete Holmes]

That's a bit.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Cool.

[Tom Allen]

Cool.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, all you need is the hinge. The turn of the. Of the comparison. And now it's a bet. Because there's already kind of a bet. Yeah, it's your bet. Obviously, just to be super clear, you're like, I miss when liking aliens is cool. Because now it's like your teacher is lecturing about aliens.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

So boring.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

So boring.

[Pete Holmes]

And now weed is like my mom. Not really, but like some people in my family who maybe don't want people to know that they do, but they like taking gummies to sleep.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

That's not George Clinton and the Funkadelics. No.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

You're supposed to go into, like, a Camry.

[Tom Allen]

Yes.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Buy it in a plastic baggie.

[Pete Holmes]

That's right.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And smoke it in another Camry.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

The second Camry.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Is where you get baked.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

For alien documentaries, you're supposed to go on rumble and not tell anyone.

[Pete Holmes]

The website where you get your alien videos should also have faces of death. You know what I mean? It should be like, do we want to watch people really dying or do we want to watch aliens?

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

By the way, how weird is that that that's just all over the Internet?

[Pete Holmes]

Faces of death.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Well, just like, if you go on, like, Twitter now, it's like, oh, people dying. People dying. I can't even look at Twitter because I don't. It's non stop.

[Pete Holmes]

I will say, and I don't have any pleasure in saying this, the what the news will show has changed quite a bit.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You know what I mean? Like, even, like Luigi Mangione shooting that guy. They loved showing that clip of him putting the gun up over and over and over. And if you're like, like, I'm not even weighing in on that as a. As a. As an event. I'm just saying, like, that's footage of someone who's about to be murdered.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And we're just like, when we come back from the Kellogg's Frosted Flakes news bump, Luigi Maggione. And it's just showing.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

It's crazy.

[Pete Holmes]

A murder.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And I'm like, call me old fashioned, but like, there was a time when you could just say, like, his mug shot.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And this guy killed a guy. We have to show the footage. And like, like, if somebody's like, in a prank, dies or hit by a. But like, we're seeing too many people.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Dying out there.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I agree. Have you seen a ghost?

[Pete Holmes]

What? I'm trying to think if I have a new one, I think I would know. Brett Goldstein has the best ghost story.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Oh, really?

[Pete Holmes]

Of all time. You should listen to that one. When a whole family leaves a vacation rental, that's how you know it's a good ghost story.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Although that's not always true. Sometimes. Sometimes you just get the sense that it's like a little Salem witch trial. Like, they're freaking each other out. But Brett is, like, poltergeisty, wow. Like, he tells a story of, like, classic. Cupboards opening and closing, things flying around the room. And it started slow, classic. Like, the ghosts are, like, trying to scare you out. It's like, it's not working, so they. More.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Wow.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. So I've heard some really great stories, but I've never seen anything incredible. And one time recently, I was very stoned, and I saw somebody standing by my bed, but I was like, I was very stoned. And weed is a hallucinogen, so, like, let's not count that.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Do you.

[Tom Allen]

If.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

If Rupert Spira were being haunted by a ghost and it was trying to scare him, do you think he'd get scared?

[Pete Holmes]

Okay, so you. You've touched on the thing that not only me, but most people who like Rupert want to know, which is, are you always is calm? And, like, would you be chill if, like, if we put you in a room with a barking dog for three days straight? Like, what will break you? Would a ghost break you? And he's usually pretty good about just being like, you have the sensation, then you return to your right being. So, like, he. I think he would be. It's hard for me. I'm not speaking for him, but, like. Like, I think, holy. Like, freaked out.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And then you just kind of. The practice seems to be, like, how quickly can you just return.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

To your. To yourself, no matter what's happening.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And that's a lifelong, like, Iron man marathon.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Oh, my goodness.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, I wish I could do Rupert. I listen to him.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I love the way he speaks. His voice is so always dreamy.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Dreamy.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

His voice.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

It's a little bit like that, but I.

[Pete Holmes]

He goes, no, no. The only one I can do is. He says no in this way. I can't quite. Does that mean we're supposed to. No, I can't. I can't do it.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

What it is, is when you love someone, it's oneness.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Love isn't a relationship. It's the collapse of a relationship. I have listened to him for so long that when someone asks a question.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

80 of the time, I have a guess what he's gonna say. And I'm such a Super fan, the 20 that I don't. I'm like, turn it. It's. I went through the same thing with Ram Dass. I was like, oh, Someone asked Ram Dass about vegetarianism or asked him about. Specifically about baseball or whatever. Like.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And I'd like, tune in. Like a super fan.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I love that stuff.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, me too. Have you ever almost died?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

No, by surf. So I've. I've been in, you know, big waves and.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I've never, I've never had like a.

[Pete Holmes]

You had some scary ones.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I've had just some scary moments where you see you're pushed underwater for a while or. Never to the point where I'm like, I'm gonna drown.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. But it's scary.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

It's scary and it's. But that's why I say surfers are so calm is. Is because they put themselves in near death experiences all the time. So it's like you put yourself in that high stress situation and then you. And then you. And then, you know. Or like fighters too. It's like, totally.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, you get them. Your body and your nervous system gets the message. You can tell your brain nothing is gained if you stress out past a certain point.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

If this point, it's like adrenaline, clarity of vision, all this sort of stuff. Alertness, that's good. But up here, you're actually hurting us.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

So I feel like surfers have a. They stop at the useful point and they're not gonna panic. Because I've, believe it or not, meaning I don't surf that much, but I've gotten pushed under way longer than I was comfortable with.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Like, I'm like, I love swimming underwater. That's actually how I prefer to swim.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But I was down there and then it's like turning you over and then it's like you're down there still and you're like, nothing is gained by panicking right now.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You'll lose air if you panic.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yeah, you can. You can panic and start to move and then. But kind of like remembering the practice too. It's kind of like you. Then you. You're like, no, I'm just gonna let this tumble me and be calm. And then I will come up.

[Pete Holmes]

That's what it is.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Or I'll merge back with consciousness.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, my daughter gets real dark. She goes like, well, what if you. Because I often like need water to swallow something, like it gets stuck. Something that happens in your 40s, I hope, or something weird that happens to me. So I have a bottle of water and I told Lela, I was like, can I please have that back? Because it's my emergency bottle of water if I'm ever eating in the Car. And I've had to. I need to wash something down. She goes, what if you didn't have it? I was like, I don't know. I would go into a bathroom, I'd pull over, blah, blah. And she's like, but what if you choke and die? And I go, well, then I die. But even just kind of like a. Like what you just said, just being like, yep. That's something we all have to deal with. And I'm not gonna say, well, that's not gonna happen. Like, I do say, don't worry about that. That's not gonna happen. But, yeah, if I choked and died, then I would choke.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Maybe that's not correct, but that's what I say. She seems totally.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I think that's great.

[Pete Holmes]

I'm. I'm mirroring her comfort level with it. Just for anybody that's judging my strange parenting answer, she's very groovy. Talking about death, she's okay with it.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

How old is she again?

[Pete Holmes]

She's six.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Six? Wow.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

That's awesome.

[Pete Holmes]

So, yeah, it's the best. What was I gonna say? You were saying, oh, I really think we've ended our chat here with a perfect metaphor. It's like, for people that have surfed, and when you get thrown off your board and you're underwater, your resistance is actually making the suffering.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

If you look at what's happening, you're actually floating weightless in this. Buoyant. You know what I mean? Like, yeah, unless you get crashed into a rock. But, like, for the most part, you're just kind of in the water, and all you have to do is just calm down and you will bob back up.

[Tom Allen]

It'll pass.

[Pete Holmes]

It'll pass.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

This too shall pass. Is a big one. Is a big one. And. And just kind of, like, enjoying the toss.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

What about this as our final. Can you tell me the time in your life you laugh the hardest?

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I was stoned in college and seen Starship Troopers.

[Pete Holmes]

Yes.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I was really stoned in college watching Starship Troopers.

[Pete Holmes]

They're, like, fighting bug people.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

It's like a parody of alien invasion movies, and it's way over the top.

[Tom Allen]

And.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Oh, actually, I have two. I have two. So there's a part where this guy is like, you know, they're training, like, the soldiers, right. And this guy's like, why do we have to do this? This is stupid. And the guy goes, put your hand right there. And he puts on a board, and the guy just throws a knife into it. The guy, he's like his face, he goes, ah. And seeing that stone, I literally laughed for like a day straight.

[Pete Holmes]

Because it was so small. His reaction or just the whole thing?

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Just the guy throwing a knife in the guy's hand. And then his reaction, he's like, ah, it was just so funny to me. And then. And then the. The next one is in high school, we were just messing around the dorms and we were like. We were like, with like some tremors. We were like shaping like lines into our eyebrows.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, yeah, sure.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And my buddy Zach, who's from Canada, he's like a big hockey player. He asked my other friend George, he's like, can you give me one of those?

[Tom Allen]

He goes, yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And so George, for some reason goes right in the middle of his eyebrow and then just shaves half of it off. And his face, after his face, he just.

[Tom Allen]

He's like, well, you gotta shake the other one to make it even.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

So this guy just had two tiny eyebrows.

[Pete Holmes]

That story is good.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And then it becomes great when he's mad. And then he goes, well, you gotta.

[Tom Allen]

Do the other one.

[Pete Holmes]

That is a classic.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And if you know his phase two, it makes it even funnier because it. His face, just the way he looked. Him having tiny eyebrows made it even funnier.

[Pete Holmes]

Like here.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Like, like, like just a little guy.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yeah, like just a little one.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, my God. Two.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Two.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

He just goes, oh, my God, his face. He goes for like a minute.

[Tom Allen]

He's just.

[Pete Holmes]

A non event, a non experience, like deep sleep. Yeah, buddy. I have loved this.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Thank you so much for having me.

[Pete Holmes]

What can people check out Chad and JT go deep.

[Tom Allen]

Yep.

[Pete Holmes]

You're not Chad. You're Tom Allen. Red has already figured that out.

[Tom Allen]

Yep.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Oh, you saw that?

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah. That's a big deal.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Chad goes deep on Instagram for tour dates. It's my buddy JT and I, we tour together.

[Tom Allen]

So.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Chadjt.com and yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Such a great duo. Why are all duos are kind of the same?

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Like, if I saw you and then you're like, and who should this duo be? I'm not saying I could do it.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Then you see, jt, you're like, exactly. Yeah, that works great partnership.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I'm glad you guys are found one another and found your fight club.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And congrats on getting married.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Oh, thanks. Yeah. I'm pumped.

[Pete Holmes]

You're going to love it.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, it's the best.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yeah. That was an interesting thing. Whereas you just know right away that with your partner.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Is that Is that your experience? I mean. Yeah, I certainly agree with that.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I never experienced anything like that where it's. Me neither. Like, within, like, the first date, you're like, oh, I. This is it.

[Pete Holmes]

I wrote. I wrote in my book that when I'm older, I'll just say it was love at first sight. And that's basically true, but there's just this feeling of, like, thank God. Intuition. We couldn't have given who to marry to the math of the brain.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

The brain was involved. It wasn't like a total dingus, but, like, the heart was like. Yes. And now all these. We've been together 12 years, and, like, when I'm hanging out with Val and we're just like. She sent me a text this morning that made me want to cry, but it's not even about that. It's about, like, we just, like, being together always and supporting each other. And a big one is. It's gonna sound weird, but, like, respect and, like, honoring somebody and giving them space.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I'm not saying you need to use any of that language, but there's something about respect that even in friendships, people like respect. It's gotten diluted and turned into, like, calling people sir.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Or being tight.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

It's not like respect is. Is doing the dishes or respect is, like, putting your thing over here because you respect that they want that week to do that thing. And.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

It's. It's huge. It's a great avenue of love.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And it's even like if. If you. I think too. One thing I've realized, too, is that if you. If you think. If you think in your mind, like, they should do something this way or like, they should make.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

And just letting it be and kind of giving space and being like. No. Like, trusting that they know their path. That's better than you think that. And it always works out if you. I think if you.

[Pete Holmes]

I agree.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

If you just allow them to.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, that tooth. Space.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And then when they're having feelings.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Allow them to have their feelings.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And Val is an inexhaustible refuge for me, and I'm a very sensitive person. So, like, I go through times where I'm just like. I just feel. And she's like, it's okay.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Over and over. And you're just like, when will I come to you? And you're just like, jesus Christ. Hasn't happened. It's amazing.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I do want to say, too, I'm a huge fan, and this. When I was starting comedy, this Podcast was kind of a guiding light.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, wow.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Because I would listen, you know, when you're just talking to comedians and stuff, and it was always like a very. When you're kind of trying to figure out what to do. Yeah, it was. Yeah, it just helped. Helps you find your way.

[Pete Holmes]

That's great.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I'm listening to the Valley Heat podcast. I'm obsessed with it, and he always says, I'll take that remark. It's when someone's insulting him. But you just said that, and I was like, I'll take that remark. I really appreciate that.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Not to keep bringing up drugs, but sometimes if I'm on mushrooms or something, I'll remember that. Like that. Especially in the early years, the podcast was meaningful to people who wanted to make art, like yourself.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And so I really received that, and I appreciate it. Thank you for telling me.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yeah. So it's cool to be on here.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. What fun.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, you were a real pro when you. When you said you were a fan. I. I didn't see that coming. It's not that you're not being kind and excited and respectful and all that, but, like, you're a great guest.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Oh, thanks.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Oh, it was great chat with you.

[Pete Holmes]

See you at your wedding. What if I'm dead serious? See you at your wedding.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Hey, Palm Springs. You got to be there.

[Pete Holmes]

Where's. Oh, that's in California, right?

[Tom Allen]

Yeah, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Palm Springs sounds like it should be in Florida.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

I know, right?

[Pete Holmes]

There's probably a Palm Springs, Florida.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

There's got to be.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Palm Beach, Palm Springs.

[Pete Holmes]

Who knows, man? I'm just putting ketamine on your wedding cake.

[Tom Allen]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, thanks very much, man. Would you say keep it crispy? It's just how we end.

[Guest (Tom Allen)]

Keep it crispy.

[Pete Holmes]

Zero hesitation. Because when the wave tosses you down on just surrender, you cruise. Just cruise, man. That was the word we were looking for, and you got it.