You Made It Weird with Pete Holmes

Guest: Lucius (Jess Wolfe & Holly Laessig)
Release Date: October 22, 2025

Episode Overview

This vibrant, candid, and often hilarious episode spotlights the acclaimed indie-pop band Lucius, comprised of Jess Wolfe and Holly Laessig. Pete Holmes guides a wide-ranging conversation that explores parenthood on the road, artistic evolution, the weird gendered roles in music, and the joy of shared, honest creative collaboration. With Lucius in the midst of their Gold Rush tour and reflecting on new music, the trio dive deep into the realities behind artistry, touring with children, and the challenges and rewards of following their own path as a band.

Key Discussion Points and Insights

Touring with Kids and Parenthood Balance

Timestamps: [09:48]–[16:40], [32:03]–[40:44]

• Parenting on Tour: Both Jess and Holly now tour with young children, navigating buses modified for naps and shared nannies.
  • "We share a nanny on tour." – Jess Wolfe [10:41]
  • "On a bus... one of the bunks has like a zip mesh zipper thing." – Jess Wolfe [11:01]
  • "Tour before the, I mean before kids though, is...waiting...now it's a little bit more evened out, you know, because you're using your energy all day." – Holly Laessig [38:31]
• Creative Challenges: Jess is open about postpartum struggles and the “tunnel” of tiredness, but performing can bring a sense of relief.
  • "I feel like I'm in a bit of, a bit of a tunnel at the moment." – Jess Wolfe [37:31]
  • “I feel relief and release from performing. And I also feel like...in a tunnel.” – Jess Wolfe [35:24]
• On-stage vs. Family Life: Pete and the band relate over the intense split between domestic responsibilities and the glow of performing.
  • "Parenting is so much compromising...Then you go on stage and you're like, I know what I'm gonna do. These people all seem rested." – Pete Holmes [35:07]

Navigating Genre and Authenticity

Timestamps: [14:15]–[24:10], [25:46]–[30:07]

• Genre Fluidity: Lucius is classified as pop but frequently branches out, leading to confusion but artistic satisfaction.
  • "You are listed as a pop band, but you also like rock really hard. What's going on there?" – Pete Holmes [15:34]
  • "We never know what to call ourselves, so we can't expect other people to." – Jess Wolfe [15:43]
• Resisting Boxes: Both band and host discuss the external push to “package” art into familiar boxes, while their own voices/ideas evolve with life’s changes.
  • "People, like, tend to...This is why we're not successful." – Jess Wolfe [53:25]
  • "It's a little weird when artists don't [evolve]. When they're still kind of doing an impression of who they were when they were 25." – Pete Holmes [17:56]
• Authenticity, Not Commerce: Attempts to “write a hit” often backfire; the most resonant work comes from honesty and inspiration.
  • "When we've tried...it's not even, oh, let's try and make something more accessible...it never happens that [it's a hit]." – Jess Wolfe [21:57]
  • “Just write the best thing, do the thing that is the most honest, feels the best. At some point, probably something will hit. Or not.” – Jess Wolfe [22:30]
  • "If I think it's funny, I think that's valuable...But I'm also sensitive and there's also fatigue." – Pete Holmes [28:00]

The Big Stage, Gender, and Background Singer Stereotypes

Timestamps: [44:34]–[54:25]

• Breaking Norms: Pete leads a deep dive into how Lucius, as a dual-voiced band of women, subvert the music world’s patriarchal models — challenging the trope of the “frontman" and the role of female vocalists as backup.
  • "Why is my brain going, 'Oh, this is the sound I associate with background singers?'...the stage mimics...societal structures." – Pete Holmes [44:34]
  • "People automatically think background singer when they see two people singing together in harmonies, which has been a blessing and a curse." – Jess Wolfe [46:27]
  • "We are lead singers together. We are a band." – Jess Wolfe [48:38]
• Band Identity: Lucius discuss the choice to dress alike and present as a “unit” — a distinct entity that sometimes is misperceived.
  • "We could be a double tracked vocal live...and then eventually like perfectly matching our outfits so that people would see us as a unit, the way they hear us as a unit." – Holly Laessig [47:51]
• Market Realities: Collabs often credit Lucius less visibly than soloists; Pete and Lucius unpack the music biz’s centering of individuals over groups.

Connection, Community, and Creative Process

Timestamps: [68:21]–[75:39], [85:24]–[103:05]

• Advice for Young Musicians:
  • Investing in real community and in-person musical circles is key — social media can't replace old-fashioned scene-building.
    • "I do think that it's still that nothing beats like face to face community and going to shows and seeing live music and meeting people." – Holly Laessig [69:21]
    • “Community is everything.” – Jess Wolfe [69:33]
• Meaningful Work vs. “Clipification”:
  • The necessity of focusing on depth and meaning over social metrics.
    • "If you make something meaningful...people will connect. So just worry about making the thing that's meaningful." – Jess Wolfe [72:11]
• Live Shows as Communion:
  • Pete suggests and Lucius agree that live music is about a deeper collective experience, not just performing hits.
    • "It's this excuse to be together, and the songs are like this blanket that kind of tie everything together." – Pete Holmes [74:27]
    • "Laugh together...It's about joining into some placeless place. You kind of lose yourself into an audience, into a show, and then you're not even there. But then...we're all there." – Pete Holmes [74:41]
  • The nourishment of focused, present experiences — a contrast to the distracted, hyper-edited world.

Creativity, Technique, and the Weird Joy of Performance

Timestamps: [40:44]–[44:22], [43:42]–[44:34]

• Vocal Power & Technique:
  • Memorable moment: Erykah Badu’s pre-show advice — “Sing from your pussy” — and the significance of singing from deep within the body.
    • “Erykah Badu, once before a show, stopped us and said, all right, girls, sing from your pussy.” – Jess Wolfe [41:01]
  • Jess shares vocal health tricks (blowing through straws into water — “straw phonation”) for maintaining endurance.

Playfulness & Meaning of Life (Games, Ram Dass, Humor)

Timestamps: [84:10]–[96:48]

• Mind Meld and Five-Second Animal:
  • Joy in playful creative games before shows, underscoring that connection and fun are as meaningful as any Big Answer to life.
  • Pete: “This is the meaning of life — playful connection.” [88:14]
• Ram Dass & Spiritual Frameworks:
  • The enduring inspiration from Ram Dass — the ongoing value of his teachings, even after his passing.
    • "Love a good Ram Dass. I'm so glad we had some time with Ram Dass." – Jess Wolfe [84:22]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On artistic honesty and connection:
  "Just write the best thing, do the thing that is the most honest, feels the best. At some point, probably something will hit. Or not."
  – Jess Wolfe [22:30]

• On creative evolution:
  "It doesn't all feel the same. Why would it sound the same?"
  – Jess Wolfe [18:17]

• On gender roles in music:
  "We have a... We are lead singers together. We are. We are a band."
  – Jess Wolfe [48:38]

• On the joy and struggle of parenting:
  "It's the best. Hardest best."
  – Jess Wolfe [79:24]

• On live music's function:
  "It's this excuse to be together, and the songs are like this blanket that kind of tie everything together."
  – Pete Holmes [74:27]

• On vocal advice from a legend:
  "Erykah Badu, once before a show, stopped us and said, all right, girls, sing from your pussy."
  – Jess Wolfe [41:01]

• Ice and Sonic Ice:
  An extended, comedic “debate” about the relative merits of Sonic vs. Coffee Bean nugget ice and how to acquire the "best" ice as a touring musician.
  – [82:13–83:58]

• Best Laugh Ever Story:
  Holly tells the delightful tale of laughing while rollerblading as a child, peeing her pants, and having her friend douse her with water to save her from embarrassment.
  – [101:27]

Structured Timeline

• 00:00-03:59 – Intro, tour dates, Lucius song preview
• 03:59-09:15 – Age, eyesight, Comedians in Cars & authenticity in showbiz
• 09:15-14:15 – Touring, parenthood, children on tour
• 14:15-24:10 – Genre fluidity, artistic evolution, Lucius’ varied sound and approach
• 25:46-30:07 – The unpredictability of hits, honest connection, responding to audience energy
• 32:03-40:44 – Touring tedium, balancing music and family, community among touring musicians
• 40:44-44:22 – Singing styles, vocal health and iconic advice
• 44:34-54:25 – Gender, roles in pop music, band identity and industry packaging
• 54:25-62:39 – Lucius’ origins, Brooklyn era, house as creative incubator, NY vs. LA
• 62:39-67:38 – Changes in creative scene, city moves, shifts in artistic community needs
• 68:21-73:44 – Advice for musicians, connection over clout, making lasting work
• 74:27-81:20 – Meaning in communal experience, parenting
• 84:10-96:48 – Games, playful meaning, Ram Dass, creative rituals
• 101:27-103:04 – Favorite laugh memories, closing

Tone & Atmosphere

The episode is conversational, playful, intellectually curious, and laced with warmth and insider anecdotes. Pete’s signature earnestness and sense of wonder meets Lucius’ authenticity and candor, making for an engaging reflection on both music and life.

For Listeners Who Missed It

This episode charts the joys and challenges of a band genuinely charting their own path — musically, personally, and professionally. It’s a must-listen for those interested in the rich, often unseen side of music-making, and for anyone wrestling with how to stay true to themselves across life's changing chapters.

End note:
“Keep it crispy!” — Lucius, with their signature wit and camaraderie. [103:04]