We Made It Weird #228

Summary

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You Made It Weird with Pete Holmes

"We Made It Weird #228" – September 26, 2025

Hosts: Pete Holmes & Valerie
Theme: Exploring Secret Genius, Personal Weirdness, and Mental Wellness

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Episode Overview

This week's episode of "We Made It Weird" (#228) features Pete Holmes and his wife, Valerie, diving into what makes people "weird," how personal quirks and mental health shape our lives, and the everyday magic in coincidence and self-insight. The pair swing between playfulness and depth, riffing on everything from numerology to hygiene to the limits of human bandwidth for world news, all with the blend of earnestness and self-deprecating comedy that defines their dynamic.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Meta-ness of “We Made It Weird” (05:02–06:18)

• The Show’s Heart: Pete riffs on the real hook of the podcast—not the topics per se, but the chemistry between him and Valerie. “What’s really gripping, engaging, and grappling about the show is our dynamic, Valerie.” (05:15)
• Valerie’s Confession: For the first time, Valerie says she “understands the show,” having listened back and reflected on its vibe (05:44).

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2. Numerology, Math, and Pattern Recognition (06:02–08:40)

• Valerie’s Birthday Episode: The number 228 (her birthday) spirals into musings on numerology, movie obsessions with numbers ("A Beautiful Mind"), and how math as a discipline can feel insane when stretched too far.
• Pete’s Joke: “I love when numerologists realize that all numbers are numbers that are added or subtracted.” (06:18)

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3. News, Media, and Overwhelm (09:13–15:45)

• Getting News via Friends: Pete proudly admits he gets news “from people,” especially his friend Matt McCarthy:
  “I get my news from one guy, so it’s biased and off-kilter and lopsided just like everybody. But at least I know it’s one fucking guy.” (10:52)
• Modern Bandwidth: Both discuss their vulnerability and feeling overwhelmed by the pressure to be globally informed, pointing out that human brains are still “meat puppets” evolved for small, tribal communities.
• Valerie: “I look around our house and I’m seeing 50 tasks I have to do… none of them are things that I want to do. We’re always sort of living at capacity.” (15:01)
• Pete: “I think there are people who have a lot of bandwidth... But I also… sometimes I feel that way about people that get really into completionist video games. You just must have a different kind of brain.” (14:06)

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4. The Thin Line Between Insight and Mania (16:28–20:57)

• Pattern-seeking and Psychosis:
  They discuss how looking for meaning in everything can be both spiritual and a sign of mental instability—“A stereotypically unstable person sees meaning in all things.” (17:18)
• Ram Dass Anecdote: Pete brings up Ram Dass’ story about visiting his brother in a psychiatric facility:
  “‘I’m Jesus Christ.’ And Ram Dass was like, ‘Me too. But I don’t think we mean this in the same way.’” (17:44)
• Psychosis Defined: Pete: “Psychosis is what I believe, plus your ego.” (18:15)

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5. Synchronicity vs. Delusion (22:09–23:08)

• Peanut Farmer Coincidences: The pair marvel at how they'd independently referenced Jimmy Carter as a peanut farmer before being reminded by a TV show—acknowledging life's “magical, weird things” but stopping short of acting on every coincidence.
• Magic & Reality: Pete: “We just go, like, ‘Whoa.’ But we don’t go, ‘Okay, sell all our bonds or something.’” (22:38)

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6. Trauma, Motherhood, & Staying Grounded (24:16–26:39)

• Parenthood Anchors: Valerie describes her commitment not to “lose it,” especially after having their daughter, Leela:
  “I remember seeing the words pregnant on the pregnancy test, and the feeling I had was, you’ve got to keep it together forever now.” (25:02)
• Earthiness Over Abstraction: Having gone from whimsy to practicality, Valerie stresses grounding herself: “Sandra Bullock kissing the ground in Gravity and just being like, ‘I’m staying here.’” (25:44)
• Rupert Spira’s Teaching: Pete repeats Rupert’s insight on reality as an “illusion,” clarifying: “Illusion just means it’s not what it appears to be. You think there’s a snake in your garage… turns out it’s a rope.” (26:39)

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7. Accepting What Is—Mental Wellness Strategies (37:09–44:57)

• Thankfulness as Practice: Pete discusses his struggle with anxiety and shares a tool:
  “The one practice that would be enough is to say thank you for everything.” (40:53)
• Valerie on Anxiety: “You can’t feel gratitude and anxiety at the same time. So it is sort of just shifting that.” (41:01)
• Parenting Analogy: Valerie likens emotional work to conscious parenting—suggesting connection (not control) is the path forward: “When you’re trying to get your kid to do something and they’re not, the first thing you should do is try to connect.” (43:45)

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8. Mind, Body, and Present Moment (48:01–49:40)

• Embodied Awareness: Pete explains how returning to physical sensation roots him in the present:
  “When you go to the body… you are going directly to the spacious field that you do label body.” (49:04)
• Eckhart Tolle Plug: Valerie: “He says that the body is one of the most effective portals to the present moment.” (49:40)

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9. Bit Dump: Peanut Butter, Hygiene, & Puberty (53:26–64:44)

• Peanut Butter People: Funny riff on how some people (mostly men, supposedly) are obsessed with peanut butter. “You don't even exist. That's how much like dust you taste [walnut butter].” – Pete (53:43)
• Adolescent Hygiene: Pete recalls his seventh-grade primping and experimentation with deodorants, gel, and skincare driven by the urge to impress and fit in:
  “Once I figured out that, like, deodorant was a rite of passage, I was like, oh, I can't wait to wear deodorant.” (57:21)
• Relatable Frustrations: Valerie voices annoyance that Pete never washes his face but still has great skin:
  “It’s very much frustrating to me that you don’t wash your face and your skin is great.” (60:13)
• Pete’s Old-Man Tip: “Coconut oil in the sock drawer. So when I get my socks, there it is… Oil up those [toenails]. And it's been working like gangbusters.” (62:15)

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10. Love, Shadows, and "You've Got Mail" (65:04–70:10)

• Movie as Metaphor for Real Relationships:
  • Pete and Valerie dissect the character dynamics of "You've Got Mail" as a metaphor for accepting each other's flaws in relationships:
  • “You know that I’m Fox Books. And when I say it was me, I know you say, ‘I was hoping it was you.’” – Pete (68:09)
  • Valerie: “That’s what he’s saying is like, this is my shadow. And can you love me anyway?” (69:48)

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• On News Avoidance:
  “If you hit a part where you’re like, ‘oh, this isn’t for me,’ don’t swap to Smartless. Just maybe skip forward a couple minutes, because I promise you, it’s like the weather in Maine. Wait five minutes.”
  – Pete Holmes (00:37)
• On Pattern-Seeking:
  “A stereotypically unstable person sees meaning in all things.”
  – Pete Holmes (17:18)
• On Anxiety:
  “My brain prioritizes everything: code red.”
  – Pete Holmes (14:17)
• On Parenting and Acceptance:
  “With kids… our instinct is to not connect, is to control. Isn’t that exactly what we’re doing with our undesirable feelings?”
  – Valerie (43:45)

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Tone & Flow

• The conversation moves fluidly from comedic bits (peanut butter debates, putty jokes) to raw vulnerability (anxiety, fear of losing one's mind), to philosophical musings (Ram Dass, illusion vs. reality), all punctuated by gentle teasing and mutual encouragement.

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [05:02] – Podcast meta-talk and chemistry
• [10:52] – Pete’s news habits and bias
• [13:43] – The tribal brain and capacity for caring
• [17:18] – Patterns, psychosis, and anecdote about Ram Dass
• [25:02] – Valerie on motherhood and mental grounding
• [37:09] – Practice of saying “thank you” for everything
• [49:04] – Discussion of body awareness
• [53:26] – "Bit dump" on peanut butter and hygiene
• [68:09] – Reflections on "You've Got Mail" and accepting flaws

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Takeaways

• Embracing weirdness is universal and healing.
• Mental health is a continuous negotiation between cosmic insight and staying grounded.
• Being grateful, accepting one's mind (and its chaos), and lovingly connecting with others is more than self-help—it’s survival.
• Relational intimacy blooms when we accept each other’s, and our own, “shadow” sides.

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Keep it crispy, weirdos.

Transcript

[Valerie]

You made it with. You made it with.

[Pete Holmes]

You made it with.

[Valerie]

Oh, yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You made it with. Yes, you made it weird. You made it weird with Pete Holmes.

[Valerie]

What's happening, weirdos?

[Pete Holmes]

I know. I know. I always say it, but what a great one.

[Valerie]

I know.

[Pete Holmes]

And you have to listen to the whole thing.

[Valerie]

I'm gonna say we did an in. I think an inverted.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, it's inverted. We've done that before. It's sort of silly and more jokey in the second half, but, like, the first half has some real hits, too.

[Valerie]

Real hit.

[Pete Holmes]

I'm just glad you're here.

[Valerie]

Yeah, we're glad you're here. We're glad you're here.

[Pete Holmes]

And I want to say that it's not just one podcast. There's, like, chapters. And you should, like. I don't know why I'm saying this, but, like, if you hit a part where you're like, oh, this isn't for me, don't swap to smartless. Just maybe skip forward a couple minutes, because I promise you, it's like the. The weather in Maine.

[Valerie]

Wait, five minutes.

[Pete Holmes]

That's it. So thank you for being here. This is. We made it weird. These are the. The. I don't want to call them bonus. It's the Friday episode where Valerie and I sit down and we're so glad you're here. And the show is brought to you by things that we like. The tour is one of them. Go to peteholmes.com I'm going on the road. I'll be in Cleveland very, very soon. Then New York, New York, all sorts of stuff. New York, New York, 1, 2, 3, or whatever it is. And PeteHomes.com for all the tour dates. And we have Largo. Oh, that's tonight. Largo. You just missed it. But we do it every month. Petehomes.com for that. And Katie, roll those ads and then we'll roll into the episode. This episode is brought to us by our friends at Mud Water. It's officially fall, and honestly, I am here for it. It's crisp, got layered outfits and that back to routine energy that just makes you actually start getting things done. But if your go to coffee routine is leaving you jittery, crashy, or just kind of over, it might be a time. It might be a time for a new kind of morning ritual, which is where Mud Water comes in. It's a coffee alternative that is delicious. It is made with cacao chai, turmeric, and functional mushrooms like lion's mane and reishi. So you get energy and Focus without the wired feeling or the midday slump. Just the right amount of energy without feeling jittery or wired and no crash. Or if you're more of a matcha person, their matcha starter kit is a total game changer changer. I'm talking smooth, earthy and just the right amount of lift without the bitter aftertaste or weird additives that a lot of matchas sneak in. I've been swapping it for my usual latte usually in the late morning and honestly, no regrets. I'm obsessed with Mud Water because it is grounded, it is delicious, it is warm and doesn't get you jacked right around when 3pm rolls around, I want that little boost. Hit it up. No crash, no problem sleeping. It's 100 organic, gluten free and vegan coffee alternative. So if you are ready to make a switch cleaner energy, head to Mud Water M u d w t r.com and grab your starter kit today right now. Weirdos get an exclusive deal up to 43% off your entire order plus free shipping and a free rechargeable frother when you use Code Weird. That's right up to 43% off with code weird@m u d wtr.com after your purchase tell them we sent you time to swap it up. Keep your energy natural and refreshing all year long with Mud Water because life's too short for anything less than clean delicious energy. We're also brought to us by our friends at Kenobody. This is a company that has completely transformed my health and the way that I feel day to day. I am obsessed. One of the main ones main ones that I love taking is Mojo, which is a healthy testosterone support that is really changing the way I feel, the way I behave. My workouts are better, feel sharper, more decisive, more energy. Testosterone is linked to so many ways, wonderful things. There was a study found between 1987 and 2004, men's average testosterone levels were dropping about 1% a year and that suggests that about 30, 40% lower testosterone is what we're dealing with than our grandfathers did in the 80s. I didn't even know that was a problem. But now that I'm taking Kenobody mojo, I'm feeling so much more motivated, driven, creative. My workouts are longer and easier and my energy is up and my blood flow wink wink wink is up and everything that that could possibly mean to get your blood flow blood flow totally mojoed. So mojo is the solution. Giving your body the vitamins and minerals it needs to produce testosterone naturally, lowering that cortisol, getting you less stress so your body can do it on its own and give you your mojo back. I love all their supplements, but that's the one I'm shouting out today. I also love their keno octane. I just had one this morning. Is their pre workout, natural, clean energy, euphoric focus. It is awesome. Try everything you see on that website. 20% off at kinobody.com K-I-N-O-B-O-Y.com with your first order with code. Weird. All right, everybody. So glad you're here.

[Valerie]

Valerie, get into it.

[Pete Holmes]

Yes, Here we are. It's. We made it weird. It's a podcast where you, you know, there's the content of what we're saying, but really, if you're really honest, the reason it's dynamic. It's interesting and funny and entertaining. Ultimately, I mean, that's what we're in the entertainment business. What's really gripping, engaging, and grappling about the show is our dynamic, Valerie. It's how we relate. It's a space that we create in our love that draws them back week after week. And we're here for. We made it weird.

[Valerie]

This is the first time I understand the show.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, we've been listening to it, actually.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You've been listening.

[Valerie]

We don't usually listen to it, but I've just been, like, feeling compelled to.

[Pete Holmes]

Check in, check in on our own.

[Valerie]

Pod because sometimes I really am like, what is this?

[Pete Holmes]

What did we do?

[Valerie]

What did we do for. Oh, I think this is the 228th episode, which is my birthday.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, 228.

[Valerie]

228. 28. My lucky number. Twos, eights. I'll. I'll extend it even to tens because eight plus two, you know, but mostly twos and eights.

[Pete Holmes]

I love when numerologists realize that all numbers are numbers that are added or subtracted.

[Valerie]

I know when. When you.

[Pete Holmes]

Jim Carrey was promoting the movie, 23 was like, and the axis of the earth is 23.5 degrees and five is two plus three.

[Valerie]

You can really get into.

[Pete Holmes]

That's true. Five is also four plus one or six minus one or a million and five minus a million.

[Valerie]

I know. That is why math. And honestly, when I was doing math as a kid, I felt that insanity.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, yeah. It's an ocean.

[Valerie]

Like, because I. And I know that it is a. It's technically like probably more of a grounded practice than. Or discipline math. Yeah, than like literature, maths. Maths as they Say, across the pond.

[Pete Holmes]

I know Rupert says maths, and I'm.

[Valerie]

Always like, there's something about maths specifically, that's so cute.

[Pete Holmes]

It's just math.

[Valerie]

It's just math.

[Pete Holmes]

We're back to my love of America. But come on.

[Valerie]

I like maths. I think it's cute, but it's, you know, it's more grounded, and I think in the way that it's like, it feels very tangible to people. There's a wrong answer, there's a right answer, it's binary, it's whatever. But to me, it really seems like the. The, you know, workings of a madman. Especially when it's like. And everything is numbers. This is. That tree is math. And you're just like. You're losing it.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, I think you're. You know what's funny is we're not so dissimilar in age.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

That I have a strong feeling that you were very influenced by the movie A Beautiful Mind.

[Valerie]

Oh, I've never seen it.

[Pete Holmes]

Wow.

[Valerie]

But you know what? I was.

[Pete Holmes]

Take the movies you've seen. Minus one.

[Valerie]

You know what I was influenced by? Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Valerie]

Is Proof, the movie Proof with Anthony Hopkins and Gwyneth Paltrow.

[Pete Holmes]

Right.

[Valerie]

Which is really similar. And I saw that when I was taking geometry in high school, and I saw my math teacher there with his wife, and I was like, oh, my God.

[Pete Holmes]

Square root later. Yeah, the Australians loved that one. They're dorks. So they're squares, and they're going to root. They're going to square root.

[Valerie]

But is. But that. All I really remember about that is that he's, like, a mathematician, and he's working the whole time. It's like he's working on this project. And then when she looks at it, it's all nonsense. It's like, yeah, teacup is shining. Square root of tree in the. Whatever.

[Pete Holmes]

It's mania. It's a good way to understand mania.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And as a person who has feelings of mania, I don't know where I am on a diagnosable scale. Ken. Our doctor friend Ken. Dr. Ken. Ken Jiang.

[Valerie]

No, no, that was our doctor.

[Pete Holmes]

I. I actually just go to the set of Dr. Ken when I need a physical.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And just ask anybody who's there.

[Valerie]

We go to Dr. O. Dr. Ken.

[Pete Holmes]

Ooh. Dr. Oz. Recently Qu. Cited by RFK Jr. As one of the people who, like, agrees with I. I watch the briefest. Nobody tunes into this podcast for political updates.

[Valerie]

No. If you do, good luck.

[Pete Holmes]

If you. By the way, good luck. Is this funny? I get my news and my good friends know this from people. So when I see Matt McCarthy.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

He tells me what's going on. And believe it or not, like, I don't. Big events, like we were working. I don't want to bring up things, but big things in the news, I still don't know. So he'll tell me about it and I'll get the details and I'll ask him. And then I'm like, in one way, I'm sort of like a king. I'm like, bring in the newsman.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But in another way, it's folksy, you know, it's like, I just get it, like, around coffee.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And in a third way. I didn't know it would be three ways. Three is two plus five. No, I'm just kidding. It's not. It's decidedly not. But in a third way, two plus five. I get it from a biased source. Like Matt. Matt is liberal, right? I'm a liberal.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

He's liberal to me.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But at least I know, like, CNN is like, we're. We're not. You know what I mean? And FOX is like, no, we're fair and balanced. I'm talking to Matt. I know his lens.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

So when he tells me what's going on, I know. So it's like. I guess the joke version of that would be I get my news from one guy, so it's biased and off kilter and lopsided just like everybody. But at least I know it's one fucking guy.

[Valerie]

Yeah. And you know what the bias is? And, yeah, not to take it too.

[Pete Holmes]

Seriously, but to kind of be like, okay, at least I know what happened.

[Valerie]

Right? Totally. I mean, oh, God, it's such a.

[Pete Holmes]

Are you overwhelmed?

[Valerie]

A little. Only in that, like, I. I want to be careful. Like, I know there are people listening that, like, it's like, you have to be informed or like, we're in, like, an OHI bubble and we're like, you know, privileged to not need to know.

[Pete Holmes]

I am. I'm not in the mood for nude in this regard, but I do feel like a day is coming when I will be able to intelligently, compassionately, and with full awareness of my own blind spots and the flaws of my strategy.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Give a little TED Talk on the argument for not being informed. Today is not that day.

[Valerie]

That's so funny.

[Pete Holmes]

Today is not that day.

[Valerie]

That's exactly how I feel right now. Like, that's why I was like, oh, God. Because I'm like, I could. I think I. I think I could.

[Pete Holmes]

The Day is coming.

[Valerie]

Give a good argument for this way of living. But right now how I feel is like, I can't do it. Maybe it is wrong. I don't know. This is what I have to do to survive. I'm already like just a fried out person. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I think there are people that have a lot of bandwidth.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You know, when it comes. Look, I understand, but. Okay. I guess we're having this conversation. I get my news from reality, from people. And I do talk to people. And believe me, people be talking about what's going on.

[Valerie]

People loved you.

[Pete Holmes]

You'll get it.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And you'll get my manager, Dave Rath, who I love is all over it. And Dave is spending whole weeks worried because somebody reported that China moved a nuke or something.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

So he's literally spending weeks. I'll see him. I'm like, how are you? He's like, because he spent weeks worrying that we agree we were gonna be vaporized or something. And guess what? You know what I mean?

[Valerie]

It doesn't move the needle on whether we are or not.

[Pete Holmes]

Yes. That's true. I mean, he's not leaving the country. So we're both in the country. And I understand there's that thing in the Simpsons where Lisa's like, dad, I wanna sell you this rock because it repels tigers. And you'll notice it doesn't work cause there's no tigers around. And Homer goes, I'd like to buy this tiger repelling rock. Like, I know that there's blind spots and flaws to this system.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I do know, and I quote this all the time, the tribe thing. Like, we're not we. Biologically speaking. The way you're designed as a meat puppet is to be in little communities and tribes and. And sort of have smaller concerns.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And I'm not saying that there isn't a huge place for people that can seemingly care about lots and lots of things.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But I also, you know, sometimes I feel that way about people that get really into completionist video games. I'm like, you just must have a different kind of brain. I'm very overwhelmed.

[Valerie]

Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

So there is a vulnerability at the core of this that goes. It's a lot. I take it very seriously. My brain prioritizes everything. Code red.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And you know.

[Valerie]

Right. And I do think like, you know, we get involved in our community, which we do have more of an impact on our community than we do. Well, I like that larger scale stuff.

[Pete Holmes]

You don't know who. I know who's getting divorced. You don't know who. I know who's having a hard time creatively and all this stuff. And I can't. I go and I have coffee with these people, and you watch that. And there's something like. It's like gardening as opposed to, like, trying to stop Monsanto.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

I don't know.

[Valerie]

Exactly. And that is how I feel is I'm. I think we both. I was just saying I'm overwhelmed by the. Like, I look around our house and I'm like, I'm seeing 50 tasks I have to do.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Valerie]

And like, none of them are things that I want to do. It's not the things I want to put my creative energy into. You know? And so it's like, we're always sort of living at capacity.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Valerie]

And then, you know, for better or worse. But I do think there is something too. And what we're finding is, like, it's all just sort of trying to figure out how to live in this modern age now where we know what's going on in the whole world at all times.

[Pete Holmes]

Right. And there are.

[Valerie]

We weren't built for that.

[Pete Holmes]

Just biologically speaking. Yes. And I hope to address some of the people that are like, oh, we're that weird couple in White Lotus that just don't pay attention.

[Valerie]

Right. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But I. There. Vote donate. The thing with Kimmel just happened. I'm signing things, I'm adding my name.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Sharing.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Talking about it, pushing it forward. All that stuff. I don't know. So it's. It's not absolute shutdown.

[Valerie]

No, no.

[Pete Holmes]

It's just like, I don't necessarily know everything that's going on. I don't know, man. I don't know. It's not my favorite topic because I'm. I'm really worried that we sound like absolute dipshits.

[Valerie]

I know.

[Pete Holmes]

And usually at the beginning, there's a. There's a. There's a bit dump.

[Valerie]

I know. Well. Dump it.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, I was gonna say the pattern recognizing part of our brains.

[Valerie]

Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

Is like math. And when you think about a mentally unwell person, especially in a movie or conspiracy theories. And I. I enjoy. I used to. Back when it was more casual. Enjoy a good conspiracy for the storytelling and all of it, but not all of it. Not all of the implications. I'm just saying, like, clearly we have these levels that are appropriate for our brain. One is like, how much maths are we looking at? How many patterns are we recognizing and how are we interpreting the conclusions that we're drawing? Because a stereotypically unstable person Sees meaning in all things.

[Valerie]

Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

I spent a lot of time thinking about how my world view is. This is quite probably the same as. And I don't know how to say this compassionately. A guy wearing a TV, like a box, a TV came in in front of a 7 11. I feel like. I know the joke was that I didn't do it compassionately. I'm saying a mentally unwell person.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Because, like. And Ram Dass talked about this. Like, he had a brother that had a psychic break. And the joke was that he visited him. The joke, the anecdote. Ram Dass visited him in a psychic ward, and his brother was like, I'm Jesus Christ. And Ram Dass was like, me too. But I don't think we mean this in the same way.

[Valerie]

Yeah, yeah. Because.

[Pete Holmes]

Because psychosis is what I believe. Plus your ego.

[Valerie]

Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

And I'm not saying I'm immune to that. I. I fall into the. The special trap of being like, oh, I'm all of it. Every once in a while. That's something you have to keep tabs on. But if you really go like, this is everything is me, meaning the me of awareness. And it's all. And then you go. And I am Steve Smith.

[Valerie]

Right. And I'm. Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

Then that's literally what can break your brain.

[Valerie]

Right. And that is sort of. Gosh, I've been thinking about this so much lately. I don't remember if it's Alan Watts or.

[Pete Holmes]

Or Terence McKenna, but I have both impressions ready.

[Valerie]

One of them says the thing like, you have to grow up and have to grow and then wake up.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, no, that's. That's not either of those people.

[Valerie]

That is just some other, you know, one of those.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, my God. It's on my bookshelf. It's. It's the guy that Ram does like. Well, you have to clean up, clean up. You have to grow up, clean up, wake up. And it's actually.

[Valerie]

You have to do it in that order.

[Pete Holmes]

Yes.

[Valerie]

Because if you wake up before you clean up and grown up, then it's like, that's where you get psychosis.

[Pete Holmes]

When Leela's having a, like, a friend drama, I'm all in. And honestly, that's how I try to be with myself. If I'm kind of harping on something, just kind of encourage it. It's okay. Grind this out. Ride it out.

[Valerie]

Right.

[Pete Holmes]

But I never go to Lela. Like, we're all in God's mind. That's insane.

[Valerie]

That would be so crazy.

[Pete Holmes]

A good way to go through the Experience.

[Valerie]

Right. And yeah, and I've been thinking about this lately, too, because I've heard a couple, a few different cases, unfortunately, of like, friends of friends sort of having psychotic breaks. And often it is. It's like very intelligent, very intuitive people who have taken the, like, signs and manifesting and, you know, things like, oh, like, I see this number everywhere. Even me being like, 28's my number, you know, but like, taking it to, like, a degree of delusion, and it's really pointing out to me what a fine line it is.

[Pete Holmes]

It is a fine line. We had a good one last time we did an episode because we're watching. Oh, my God, 30 Rockefeller Plaza.

[Valerie]

What was that? It was Jimmy Carter in the Peanut Farmer.

[Pete Holmes]

Peanut farmer.

[Valerie]

Okay.

[Pete Holmes]

Remember last episode, I said, you can't picture Donald Trump squatting down in a farm and touching dirt and rubbing it between his hands and then smelling it.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And I was like, come to think of it, you can't picture Obama doing that.

[Valerie]

And you said, only Jimmy Carter. Only Jimmy Carter who was a peanut farmer.

[Pete Holmes]

But I didn't know that.

[Valerie]

But you didn't know that.

[Pete Holmes]

I didn't know he was a peanut farmer. But there was also a peanut thing.

[Valerie]

And yeah. And then we were watching 30 Rock and they mention Jimmy Carter as a peanut farmer. But we had had. Oh. The reason it came up was, was because we were talking about the Snickers factory and that they.

[Pete Holmes]

Yes.

[Valerie]

Benefited from listening to the episodes after.

[Pete Holmes]

We were talking about how the there one Snickers factory in America that does do 70%. This is too much math. 70% of the Snickers production does 30. I know, it's like 30 acres. Remember we talked about an acre is an amount of land. You were like, you can't see all of it.

[Valerie]

Not true. But yes. It's not even a ton of. It's not even like we know people who have 40 acres of land.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, we do.

[Valerie]

Yeah, I think so. But. But yes, I. I think the. So it came from, like, the peanut farms to then Donald Trump bent down in the dirt to then Jimmy Carter, and we didn't even know Jimmy Carter was a peanut farm.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, that's right. So we had the 30 acres of peanuts and the presidents being farmers. And then I was like, only Jimmy Carter could do that. And then that night, that night on, it wasn't airing, but we watched 30 Rock.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And they said, what am I, a peanut farmer? Like Jimmy Carter or something? And we were like, what? So. But what I think is very good here is that we do live in a world where there's lots and lots of magical, weird things happening.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And for people who don't like the word magical, we could just say very strange coincidences that your brain desperately wants to turn into magic or interpret in a meaningful way, because that's a big part of our physiology or our psychology. Fine. Either way, you're getting a lot of stuff. And I think we handled it appropriately. We always just go like, whoa. But we don't go like, okay, sell all our bonds or something. I don't even know if we have any bonds. I'm just saying.

[Valerie]

Right. I know, and I do. I am deliberately. You know, maybe it's not. I'm not saying this is the right thing, but this is where I'm at. Because I have a unique sort of trauma, fear of losing my mind. I have really leaned into just, like, the body, the earth, this plane, even, like, in spirituality, just basic mindfulness of, like, just being the observer, like, not going so deep into the like. And all of this is a dream. And this is all that, you know. And I've. Which I know serves a lot of people, but because for me, Val, and. And this. Guys, to the people who've listened to this podcast, I've. This has been, like, a very slow.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. But I. I just. So you feel solidarity. I'm so. All of that stuff is really stomach flippy. Weird.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

It still is. I'm sure for a lot of people listening, that's probably weird. And it can still be weird for me. So. Yeah.

[Valerie]

Yeah. And. But there was a time where I was, like, really fearless about all of that stuff and was just like, yeah, like, what is all this? Like, what is that? You know, And. And so there is, like, maybe a loss of the, like, whimsy of it for me, but. But now I'm like, honestly, having leela. I think 1. I've said this before, probably, but because I was in such a fragile mental place when I found out I was pregnant.

[Pete Holmes]

An fmp.

[Valerie]

An fmp. I. When I. I remember seeing the words pregnant on the pregnancy test, and the feeling I had was, you've got to keep it together forever now.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, wow.

[Valerie]

Because you have this person now that's going to, like, really be affected if you lose it, which I know there's maybe even people listening who've had nervous breakdowns or postpartum stuff and mental episodes, and they have children, and it's. It's not that black and white, like, you know, but that clearly was, like, a trauma thing for me. Was like, don't spiral out.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Valerie]

And so. So I think since having Leela, I've just been more like, you know, like Sandra Bullock kissing the ground in gravity and just being like, I'm staying here.

[Pete Holmes]

No, me too. You know, of all the things written on my mirror, now there's one that's like, you're a child of the earth, supported with every breath, and you're a part of a lineage. And like, all of that is. And when I say relatively true, I don't mean. I just mean it's not the top of the mountain, but it's a huge piece of the mountain. Is this idea of the land and the planet and the people and all of that. And there's a. I find more. I don't think it's exclusive. Rupert always says, just because we say reality is an illusion, it doesn't mean it's not real. He's like, illusion just means it's not what it appears to be. And the example they always use in Vedanta is that you think there's a snake in your garage. Yeah, I must see a modern translation garage. You think there's a snake in the corner of your garage? I've only ever seen his garage, but a lot of these books were written, you know, in the past 100 years.

[Valerie]

Oh, okay.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, yeah.

[Valerie]

How old are garages?

[Pete Holmes]

How old are cars? What if garages came first? The old question, which came first, the garage, the carport or the car?

[Valerie]

The vagina or the dick?

[Pete Holmes]

Well, the dick came first. And then it had sex with someone who had nothing and it made a vagina.

[Valerie]

Someone had. Who had nothing?

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, they were just soft down there, like a putty. And then the dick was like, oh. And that's why a vagina is. This. Is. This riff is the worst. That's how that used to be in the Bible before they cleaned it up. And Adam met Eve, who had a squishy putty place. And then after their first.

[Valerie]

I hate squishy putty place.

[Pete Holmes]

Squishy putty place was presented, and Adam did what was natural.

[Valerie]

Wow.

[Pete Holmes]

And then the putty hardened around like it was a semen activated.

[Valerie]

Hardening was like. You know how people make, like, the. The. What's the word I'm looking for? Like, the casts of their. It's not cast.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, totally. You step into a foot mold for a shoe, Some sort of corrective boot. Yes, absolutely. Where were we?

[Valerie]

Oh, God, who knows? No, math.

[Pete Holmes]

Mental wellness.

[Valerie]

Mental wellness. Yeah. Who knows?

[Pete Holmes]

Well, just. Just. Oh, illusion. They Say that.

[Valerie]

Michael.

[Pete Holmes]

What? Oh, my God. Job.

[Valerie]

I don't know.

[Pete Holmes]

Illusion. Michael.

[Valerie]

Yes. Wow.

[Pete Holmes]

It's me, Will Arnett. I'm so happy to be a guest on. You made it weird. I feel like this is good.

[Valerie]

This is like.

[Pete Holmes]

Keep it crispy.

[Valerie]

This is a deep fake, but it's.

[Pete Holmes]

I do deep fakes, but vocal. All right. Michael Winslow trying to rebrand. I'm the original deep faker. Please leave.

[Valerie]

Please leave.

[Pete Holmes]

Poor Michael Winslow. Why did. We loved him so hard and then we were like, get out of here. Goof. Goof. He was the best. The sound effect guy from Police Academy.

[Valerie]

I never saw it.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, yeah. If you're not seeing A Beautiful Mind, A Beautiful Mind, you're not.

[Valerie]

Well, Beautiful Mind, A Beautiful Mind was, you know, it was like, rated R when I was still not allowed to watch it.

[Pete Holmes]

It's rated R?

[Valerie]

I think so.

[Pete Holmes]

Wow. And it's rated PI R squared.

[Valerie]

And. And also, it was one of those. It. It's not. It's not a Shyamalan, is it?

[Pete Holmes]

No, no, no. I can see why you would think it's a Shyamalan. Because it's a twist.

[Valerie]

Yes, exactly.

[Pete Holmes]

That's why you know the twist.

[Valerie]

Because I always. With. As with all Shyamalan movies, I hear before I've ever seen the movie.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. There's a market for twists.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You can go into the Dark Web and find the twists. You can go to the regular web. But it's so much more dangerous on the Dark Web.

[Valerie]

I don't even know how do people know how to get to the Dark Web?

[Pete Holmes]

There's a couple things. Thank you, by the way. One, the cloud is just someone else's computer. There is no cloud and there is no Dark Web. There's a web. You know, There is. Everyone relax. There is.

[Valerie]

What is it?

[Pete Holmes]

I'm just saying, the way I understand it, we differentiate, but it's all data. You know what I'm saying? And there might be data that's hidden from the regular web. So in that sense, there is a. Do you know what? Do you see the point I'm trying to make?

[Valerie]

But there's like, a way. Yeah, sure. It's all there. You're still accessing it.

[Pete Holmes]

It's like there's a but Internet behind the Internet.

[Valerie]

But you have to, like, jailbreak to get to it or something.

[Pete Holmes]

Look, I'm going to say there's an IP rs. I don't know. Full respect to the Dark Web. I get nervous talking about it.

[Valerie]

I'm like, everybody, clearly we don't Know what the hell we're talking about.

[Pete Holmes]

I just. I'm trying to say that there's a cloud and we're like this part of the cloud is the Internet and then there is a part that's dark and inaccessible, but it's still cloud. It's still the Internet.

[Valerie]

Right.

[Pete Holmes]

That I wonder if that's right. I'm saying it very boldly.

[Valerie]

You really are, Clarity. So, so convincingly.

[Pete Holmes]

But the Dark Web, I don't know what it is and I don't want to know what it is.

[Valerie]

Do you think I would like it.

[Pete Holmes]

Knowing Dark Web, Facebook?

[Valerie]

No. Going back to A Beautiful Mind knowing that?

[Pete Holmes]

No. You'd hate it.

[Valerie]

Yeah. I can't really watch things like that anymore about people losing their minds.

[Pete Holmes]

I don't want. Yes.

[Valerie]

But you know what I discovered? I think I. I used to.

[Pete Holmes]

But he makes peace with it. He's a. It's a true story.

[Valerie]

Oh, that's nice.

[Pete Holmes]

And.

[Valerie]

But you know that I have that, like. I'm like. Yeah. Any sort of slow, like slow realization that reality isn't necessarily what you think it is is like. I can't even watch Severance because of that.

[Pete Holmes]

Right.

[Valerie]

Because I'm like, where.

[Pete Holmes]

I actually think you would love Severance because at the end of the day, I think it's about parts, work. There's this scene and. Oh, I don't want to ruin it for people, but let's just say he's severed.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

So that's the exile. So there's a part of you that you're not in touch with.

[Valerie]

Right.

[Pete Holmes]

This is a spoil free zone.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

It's the story about a group of people who have an aspect of themselves that is kept away doing work that makes no sense. It's exactly what our parts are doing. I don't mean our body parts. I mean these aspects of ourselves that are personified. They're off churning on things that don't even make sense.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And our work and the work in the show is to make contact with them and integrate them and integrate them. And they get. There's a scene in it that you're like. That you would. There's a couple scenes actually, but you have to watch. It's three seasons. Or is it two?

[Valerie]

Three. I think three.

[Pete Holmes]

You have to slog through. Not slog. I enjoyed every moment of it. You have to go through a lot of like the feeling watching the show lost to get to like these tear jerking.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Psychological breakthrough metaphor moments. But I think it's obviously worth it. I don't think it's worth it for you.

[Valerie]

You don't. You're going back to it. You said you think you. I wish started with, I think you'd love severance.

[Pete Holmes]

I do. If you could change your personality, your fundamental makeup.

[Valerie]

Well, I sure would because everybody else does. I. I go back and forth. Like, I want to try it, but we watched like the first three episodes. But this was also like, pretty close to like, still kind of in lockdown. Like it was like the year after. So. And we were living in LA and I just really was like reeling from the trauma of the pandemic and feeling trapped and feeling fragmented.

[Pete Holmes]

We needed 10.

[Valerie]

Yeah. An anxiety disorder.

[Pete Holmes]

Ted Lasso making finger length cookies.

[Valerie]

Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

That's what we need.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And now I have not as much need for that. I was gonna say no need for that. That's not true. But I am. I have more room for that.

[Valerie]

But I. Now it's like. Yeah. So I. We watched the first three episodes and I remember driving to pick Leela up from school and I was like, I think that might be real. Like, I think I like. And I. I remember having the thought that scared me, which was, what if all people who are like schizophrenic and in menstrual mental institutions menstrual and have cracked the code of the reality and then they institutionalize them to like, shut them up. And I'm like, well, that's, that's paranoid schizophrenia. So maybe I shouldn't watch the show anymore.

[Pete Holmes]

Well, I. Again. Ramdos coming up. Again. He used to say that in India. Forgive me, Indian friends, if anyone's listening from India. That's like, that's not true. Just something I heard from Ram Dass, probably in the 70s, probably on drugs. But he said that in India there was more of an allotment for what we call insane. And people would go like, oh, the veil is just very thin with this person. And they don't have like Ananda Maima before she became the saint.

[Valerie]

Right.

[Pete Holmes]

That. I mean, she was the same. I'm just saying the, the calm saint that we have pictures of in our house was swirling. Yeah. Naked and.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Was behaving in a way that we. And Neem Karoli Baba, Ramdas's guru, was called Crackpot Baba because he used to break pots and wear them on his head and just walk around naked and left his family and all that stuff. Just every. Oh, that's a. That's a. Like a broken person.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

In India, again, forgive me if I'm wrong, but there Seems to be more of an understanding of like, this person has like split their consciousness. They're like in the big picture and a little bit here. And that's why you hear all those stories. Like there's stories of gurus, saints, mystics going into caves. I guess it would be yogis or renunciates going into caves and staying there. And their devotees. Devotees would just visit them once a year. They'd roll the stone away and there'd be a skeleton man sitting there. And they would sit with him and then they'd leave and they'd roll the stone in front of him. And these stories are again, this is like the synchronicities. I go like I hold them lightly.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

But apparently the idea of ambrosia, like food from the heavens. These yogis, they said in Indian culture, their understanding is would eat like a sweet honey substance that comes from the roof of their mouth, that they're literally being fed from beyond.

[Valerie]

Wow.

[Pete Holmes]

And that's why they're alive, but they're barely alive. So there's a thin like a spider web connecting them to the earth. And that's how barely in this reality they are. And that's why. That's why people want to sit with them. They're like. This is like visiting the. The transcendent, I guess you could say.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You can see, though, for all the fun I had with all of that stuff, my. And even A Course in Miracles is very. There's some drama to A Course in Miracles. It's kind of exciting. The fact. Just the tiniest. Rupert Spira plug. I'm just like, I love my little Oxford button down.

[Valerie]

Plain spoken, really grounded, simple.

[Pete Holmes]

He seems like a stone. In the same way that Eckhart Tolle. When we saw him, I was like, these guys just seem like they're. It's not carved out of wood. It seems like they're a stone in a river and reality is just passing over them. And they are completely at peace with the transitory nature of all things.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And can I. I've been reading a lot about resistance. So seeking and resisting. Right. So the Buddha said reality is desire. Another way of kind of looking at that is everything that we are, we are. The separate person is seeking and desiring. That's like we don't exist. But there is this activity that gets clothed in this identity. So when we're talking about like kind of the not truest self or the false self, it's the activity of seeking and resisting. And that one of the keys to life. And we Come over this time and time again is to try to say yes to what is happening, to say thank you for everything. And I know I've made this point a million times, but the past couple weeks, I've just been doing it again. Meaning 4am up, and here comes every email. They're all here. Every move, every play, every job, every lost job, every rejection. It's all there. It really. It might not even be emails, but it feels like I'm looking at a screen of emails, like, and it's just all these urgent things.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And I used to just be like, you know, we don't have to deal with that right now. I promise it'll be there in the morning. Kind of negotiating with the mind.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And that works. Okay. And then more recently, I would go, like, just go into your being. Just be the spacious awareness around that. Like, is it worried about these things? Like. Or is it peaceful? Okay, it's peaceful. And that would work better. But there's nothing better than thank you.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Thank you for this. How flawless. How flawless and perfect and. And it's one of these weird little. My mind games is like, you can't be thanking it or saying, yes, thank you. Obviously. That's the thing I say more than anything. You can't say yes, thank you to Leela running away last night when I was trying to put her down for bed. That was weird. I'm just put her to sleep. What?

[Valerie]

Oh, my gosh. What's happening to you right now? We call it putting.

[Pete Holmes]

I just don't like that. That's the same language they use at the vet.

[Valerie]

I mean, we've noticed this before.

[Pete Holmes]

So I'm helping her go to sleep, and then she's running away from me, like, literally, like, naked and running downstairs. And, like, the best strategy has to be like, an earnest. This all belongs.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Remember I had that ketamine experience where I. It wasn't literally a hallucination because it's not really a visual experience, but I just pictured everyone I knew giving an Oscar speech, like, at the end of Reality. And my mom comes up and she's like, how was I negative? So effortlessly, I just did what was natural. And everyone just keeps giving her standing ovations and people are crying at how flawless she is.

[Valerie]

Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

So it's that, like, aggressive. So you're not tricking it to get it to go away. You're going, like to use religious language. You could say, here it is.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Here's Pete waking up with anxiety. Do I know better than reality? Yeah, it's here. I'm gonna say thank you. So I. I've made this point before, but at least I'm almost done. Rupert Spyra said if there was one practice that you could do, and there's no theory in this. He's so theory. He has so much theory. The one practice that would be enough is to say thank you for everything.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And I lose that. But when I get it back and can really understand it, I'm like, it's the thing.

[Valerie]

Yes, totally. And even in the simplest way, they. I've read this somewhere, probably Instagram, that you can't feel gratitude and anxiety at the same time. So it is sort of just shifting that. That feeling. And it's. You know, it clearly, it's like, it's a fundamental truth of the nature of. Of humans and reality. It's like Moana with Te Fiti incorporating it or Taka and saying, like, this is not who you are. You know, it's like loving the monster. And then the monster transforms, and you see that it never was a monster.

[Pete Holmes]

Right?

[Valerie]

Because, like, monsters aren't real in the realest sense. Even people. And, you know, when I was sort of. Sometimes when I'm, like, losing touch, I would say not of, like, reality, but just losing touch of, like, the. These fundamental truths of life, the one that can always bring me back. And I know this isn't relatable to everyone, but some it might be to somebody is, like, how in love with humans I am, like, in the human experience. And I just used this the other day where I was like, okay, what do I know for sure? And I'm like, human beings are precious. Like, our vulnerability is our most, like, unique feature.

[Pete Holmes]

Right.

[Valerie]

And those of us who are monsters, who are, like, you know, the worst of us doing the worst damage are the most vulnerable. They're so squishy. They can't even be honest with themselves about their vulnerability. And they have to, like, build up these walls and literally and figuratively. And, like, they're so scared. They're so tender.

[Pete Holmes]

Right.

[Valerie]

And so, like, even that you can love and say thank you to. And going back to what you were saying with Leela, that's such a good example, because with kids, this is a. You know, this is sort of a conscious parenting concept. But when you're trying to get your kid to do something and they're not listening or they're not doing something, the first thing you should do is try to connect. Like, so if you're. And we. So often, our instinct is to not connect is to, like, control. And isn't that exactly what we're doing with our undesirable feelings?

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Valerie]

We're trying to control them, to make them go away, to force them to be a certain way. And like, it's like, actually you need to just make contact.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Valerie]

And connect and see it and feel it, and then you. That's all you really have to do it. It sort of shifts and changes, which is, for me, no surprise. I've talked about this on the podcast. Like, all of that is just going back to the felt experience in the body, because your brain. And you said something like this, too. I'm surprised I'm remembering all of this. It was like every fifth word that you said on that tear I had thing. And I was like, I'm not going to remember any of this. But I'm like. I'm like, yeah, going backwards chronologically. But you said, you know, like, laying in bed and the emails. Yeah. And all the emails. And like, it. It's. If you are playing the game of the mind, if you're trying to reason with it, you said something about that. Like, trying to.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, I would say that can wait till tomorrow.

[Valerie]

Yeah. Just trying to play its game. For me that never. It can sometimes be grounding. But, like, I can't just keep playing the mind's game. I have to totally change the game.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. So you go into your body.

[Valerie]

Yeah, and I go into my body. And for example, also, I had therapy a couple days ago and I was talking about how I'm reading Elizabeth Gilbert's new book, which I want to talk about maybe after the mid rolls or I don't know. Are we going to do mid rolls?

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, Val.

[Valerie]

Okay.

[Pete Holmes]

I'm not mad. I'm looking and I'm like, oh, yeah, we probably should.

[Valerie]

This is over.

[Pete Holmes]

No, no, no. That Yaval was just like a whoops, a doodle.

[Valerie]

Yeah. But that. I was just saying, like, I will. One of my voices in my therapist now, after being my therapist for seven years, really knows this voice to the point where I'm like, is she as sick of this as I am? But it's like one of my main protective voices is like, am I going to lose my mind? Am I losing my mind? Or, like, am I going to be able to keep it together for my whole life? I told you recently, one of my, like, darker thoughts that I'll have is like, I don't want to die, but if I died, at least when I die, which I hope I'll be old when that happens, I'LL at least be able to have the relief of like, I kept it together the whole time.

[Pete Holmes]

That's funny.

[Valerie]

Which is really, you know, really points to a lot. And I'll really. What I'm saying is I'm giving voice to this one part that's not like the. The whole of me, but that part is just sort of like, keep it together, don't spiral out, don't lose your mind. Don't fall into addiction. Don't. Don't self sabotage, you know. And she was, she's dealt with. We've dealt with this voice so much in the last seven years that this time she gave me totally different advice about it where she was like, yeah, at this point, I think that's just a reflex thought. And you can just say something to it like, yeah, that's not a thing.

[Pete Holmes]

That's so. Dr. Gary Penn.

[Valerie]

I loved it.

[Pete Holmes]

I know. Casual language on big things. Just being like, I'm gonna bounce or like, yeah, get real.

[Valerie]

So valuable. And that's not really.

[Pete Holmes]

Because it speaks to the attitude you should have when you say it.

[Valerie]

Yes. And it's not really my therapist's style. Like, she's very much honoring all the parts and stuff which, which I think is what made the impact is like, it was. It's like, look, we've cradled this part. We've heard everything it has to say. We've loved it, we've touched on it. At this point, we can just be like, it's over. We. We're done. That's not a thing. You're just.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Valerie]

You're just running on. On.

[Pete Holmes]

It's a reflex. Yeah.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

We will go to the mid rolls. Yeah, Val.

[Valerie]

Yeah, Val.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, Val. Excuse me. There's a hiccup that turned into a burp. That turned into a fart question mark. I'm just kidding. I want to say, because I love finding ways that you and I are exactly the same, even though we talk about it differently. When you say so, you're 4am and you go into your body, right?

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

When you go into the experience of the body. I'm sorry to be so. No, no. That was amazing, by the way. Just a full schoolyard mockery. I loved it. I actually think I'm going to say something different. When you close your eyes, I mean, I'll do it. What is your experience of the body? It's these floating sensations.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You don't have the experience of the whole body.

[Valerie]

Right.

[Pete Holmes]

At all times. And you can experience this now, Rupert. Others do this. Go to the tingling Sensation at the bottom of your feet. And there it is. Now go to the tingling sensation of your face. Your face, when your eyes are closed, feels like a mask floating in space. So when you go to the body, which sounds so. And I'm not taking any of this away. Solid and not being and not awareness, you are going directly to the spacious field.

[Valerie]

Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

That you do label body. I would label it. I.

[Valerie]

Sure. I'm with you. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

No, no, no. This is. This is me saying we're the same.

[Valerie]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Don't even change. I'm signing your yearbook. It's the same. And in the same way that when we say be in the present moment, we go into that same space. The present moment, the experience of the body and the experience I am. And being and awareness. All. It's only one thing.

[Valerie]

Well, yes. And Eckhart Tolle, and this was a real big moment.

[Pete Holmes]

Don't bring him into this.

[Valerie]

I'm just kidding.

[Pete Holmes]

Love him.

[Valerie]

He says that the body is one of the most effective portals to the present moment.

[Pete Holmes]

Yes.

[Valerie]

Which is why women brag. Could be a little more brag. Enlightened brag than then. Because we can.

[Pete Holmes]

Yes. Or.

[Valerie]

Or can access the presence easier because.

[Pete Holmes]

They'Re not burdened by like active minds.

[Valerie]

Yeah, we'll be. Oh, my God, you burn. Well, I think active minds is a dumb thing, so. Jokes on you.

[Pete Holmes]

100% JK. With that, we will go to the mid rolls and we'll. We'll be right back. This episode is brought to us by our friends at Apollo Neuro. Apollo Neuro is a revolutionary new wearable that helps you naturally manage your stress, improve your sleep, boost your focus through gentle, scientifically backed vibrations. You always see me wearing this on stage. See me wearing it when I'm recording the podcast. It is ideal for those seeking a holistic approach to wellness. Meaning you don't have to ingest anything. It's just on your body. Apollo Neuro fits seamlessly into any routine, using these specific vibration frequencies to signal safety to your brain, helping to calm your nervous system and promote relaxation. These silent, soothing sound waves gently calm your nervous system and can help you fall asleep, stay asleep, which is huge. I always say if that's all it did, it would be worth it. But it can also help you dial in, fight off some add symptoms and focus. That's one of my favorite settings, is focus. There's also joy. There's also unwind. There are all these. When I'm traveling, I have it rocking on, unwind the entire time, reduce stress, improve Sleep boost, focus support recovery, drug free and non invasive and science backed. Developed by neuroscientists and supported by clinical research, it's versatile. You can wear it on your wrist, your ankle or you can even clip it to your your clothing. Trusted by experts Made in the usa. Try Apollo Neuro today and transform your wellness routine. Act fast. They're always selling out. Go to ApolloNeuro.com weird. You'll get 60 bucks off and a free sleep band. That's a P O L L O N e u r o.com weird. Support your body. Support the show. Speaking of supporting your body, one of the best Pete's picks. These ads. Call them Pete's picks that you can do Supporting your body and supporting the show is a tush bidet. I'm obsessed. Once you try a tushy bidet, there's no going back. There's only one way to clean your butt and it's a tushy. Why in 2025 are we still using toilet paper after a deuce? If you had shit on your hand, would you just wipe it with a tissue and be like, all right, I'm clean? Of course not. You want to power blast it off like that weird neighbor on your street that's always hosing off the leaves. Get it up there, spray it down and feel clean. Be clean and fantastic. Tushy is the everyday luxury bidet that instantly transforms your bathroom habits and your bottom health for life. Tushy is easy. It's fast. I thought it would be weird to have it. Nope. Bullseye and feels A. Okay. A stands for asshole. It makes pooping any other way feel primitive, backwards and stone age. It's like a midday shower in five seconds. These are so easy to install. Less than 10 minutes. Get it in your life. Keep your swampiest body parts fresh and cool for a limited, limited time. Our listeners get 10% off your first bidet when you use code weird at checkout. That's 10% [e-mail] with promo code weird. Back to the show. Okay, we're back. Sorry. That was the weirdest way I threw to the mid rolls ever. Now let's try pizza pick. Go do a bit dump.

[Valerie]

Do a bit. Dump. You can't just turn it on like that.

[Pete Holmes]

Almond butter. Why aren't you better? Peanut butter. Yes. And then almond butter's like, I can be mushed up too.

[Valerie]

Don't you think?

[Pete Holmes]

You're like walnut butter. I'm sorry, am I cleaning out my attic? You don't even exist. That's how much like dust you taste.

[Valerie]

Oh, I.

[Pete Holmes]

You don't even exist. That's how much like dust you taste.

[Valerie]

I. Okay.

[Pete Holmes]

Put that on a bumper sticker.

[Valerie]

I love peanut butter, but I think there are peanut butter people. Peanut butter is one of those things.

[Pete Holmes]

It's crazy that you're saying this. I almost Googled why do men. But I don't know.

[Valerie]

Yes, that's what I was gonna say. I think there are peanut butter people. They are all men, the peanut butter people.

[Pete Holmes]

If you went to Lilith Fair and you were like, why isn't there jars of peanut butter with a spoon in it?

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

You'd be like, oh, right.

[Valerie]

And they're not all men. Lisa Gunger, my best friend.

[Pete Holmes]

She loves pb.

[Valerie]

Loves pb. Really loves pb.

[Pete Holmes]

Because usually the PB people have a little chunk on their dunk and she's like. She looks like something you'd eat peanut butter with.

[Valerie]

Yeah, she's something you would dip in peanut butter.

[Pete Holmes]

I can't quite get this little smudge of peanut butter at the bottom. Hand me Lisa Gunger.

[Valerie]

Yes. She.

[Pete Holmes]

She would reach something like. That looks like a lowercase L. No, it's just jeans.

[Valerie]

It sucks, man. I eat everything she eats.

[Pete Holmes]

Buddy. Look, we're in jeans.

[Valerie]

I know.

[Pete Holmes]

So fucking dumb. I really do think that's one of the things that, like, we're just, like. Just don't talk about jeans. You know what I mean?

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

G E N E S. Not the perfect gene. The perfect gene.

[Valerie]

But I was gonna ask you a question that. This is apropos of nothing. I just thought of it.

[Pete Holmes]

My walnut butter dust dump. That was a riff.

[Valerie]

Yeah, it was a riff. And this.

[Pete Holmes]

I'm just happy we did it.

[Valerie]

And this is just like, a light. A light question that we can.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Valerie]

Discuss.

[Pete Holmes]

I'm not worried about it.

[Valerie]

All right. Do you want to talk more about the dust?

[Pete Holmes]

No, no. I just wanted to be like, hey, that was. You did it.

[Valerie]

You did a riff.

[Pete Holmes]

We did it.

[Valerie]

Sure.

[Pete Holmes]

Look, if you're standing next to a manic person when they did it. Yeah, we did it.

[Valerie]

Yeah. Like, I'm wearing a shirt that says, I'm with mania.

[Pete Holmes]

I'm with mania.

[Valerie]

You're wearing a shirt that says, we did it.

[Pete Holmes]

We. Exactly. Right. Yeah, we did it.

[Valerie]

Yes. Do you remember a time, like, in puberty, or maybe it was before, or maybe it hasn't happened yet, where you were like, I'm going to start making a concertive effort to, like, have hygiene, good hygiene. And what was the motivating force if you did?

[Pete Holmes]

Didn't we just have. I had some, like, psychological breakthrough. There was like, an, like, in therapy. I realized why I was primping so much.

[Valerie]

Primping?

[Pete Holmes]

You don't know the word priming.

[Valerie]

No, I do, but I'm. I. I don't think of you as a primper.

[Pete Holmes]

I am not a primper. Yeah, but that's because whatever this demon was, I K. Pop demon. Hunted it. I used seventh, eighth into high school. Slowed down a little in high school, but I think.

[Valerie]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because then you got punk.

[Pete Holmes]

I got punk rock. Punk rock. Please, please.

[Valerie]

You were a punk.

[Pete Holmes]

No, a punk is a kid who. Stop moving your sprinkler.

[Valerie]

Yeah, I do miss calling kids punks. I wish we.

[Pete Holmes]

Let's bring it back. I'm always saying riff raffle. Punks riff. When I say riff raff, I mean punks. Yeah, but punks, to me, seems really judgy.

[Valerie]

I know punk is hard. I don't think we can bring it back over.

[Pete Holmes]

Used to be called the P word. I'm just kidding. So anyway, I used to, like. Okay, so it was seventh grade, and once I think I figured out that, like, deodorant was a rite of passage, I was like, oh, I can't wait to wear deodorant. And I would wear Old Spice and Drakkar Noir, and I would gel depth gel in my hair, and then I'd spray it.

[Valerie]

Gel, gel, gel.

[Pete Holmes]

And I would. I. And I.

[Valerie]

Were you slicking back?

[Pete Holmes]

I did the Zack Morris. It was up in the front, and then the door combed forward on the top.

[Valerie]

That's not a Zach Morris.

[Pete Holmes]

I know. I didn't do it as well. I did what I thought he was doing.

[Valerie]

Combed forward.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, that's a thing.

[Valerie]

But I remember when. Combed forward and then a flip up.

[Pete Holmes]

No, no. You picture it like a flat top, like a buzz cut. Oh, but with hair.

[Valerie]

Oh, got it.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Valerie]

I'm with you. That helped me.

[Pete Holmes]

I was picturing it longer, but then Noxzema. Like, I. Once I figured out that, like, girls were washing their face, I was like, I want to wash my face. I was the only. I loved having girlfriends. And we talked about Noxzema and, like, shampoo. I wash my hair every day. That's why I look like dog shit. Modern mammals dot com. Anyway, I'm just saying, like. Yes, I got into it.

[Valerie]

You were washing your face Seventh grade.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah. I don't wash my face.

[Valerie]

You know, sometimes I think about how you don't wash your face. Now what do you mean? I mean, I know you wash it in the shower.

[Pete Holmes]

I don't wash it in the shower.

[Valerie]

You don't wash your face then I.

[Pete Holmes]

Don'T wash my face.

[Valerie]

That is.

[Pete Holmes]

So the feet also don't get any dedicated time. The feet are lucky to get the table scraps of suds. The feet are the dogs. You can get what I drop. You're the dogs. And I love them.

[Valerie]

Maybe this is why. But you do.

[Pete Holmes]

But they're my dogs.

[Valerie]

You do take multiple showers a day.

[Pete Holmes]

I shower a lot.

[Valerie]

That makes sense because I'm taking one shower a day. If we're lucky.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Valerie]

And, but it's because I am like using the cheese grater on my feet. I'm shaving everything. I'm washing the stuff. And, and I wash my, I have like a seven step process of washing my face every really night. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

To, to avoid acne.

[Valerie]

Yeah. And, and fine lines and just keep it, keep it.

[Pete Holmes]

Fine line, but toy. Really? You think washing keeps it toit?

[Valerie]

Yes. That's what all of the products are for. Are for tightening. Well, like. Yeah. Keeping in the collagen and the, the stuff that keeps it toy.

[Pete Holmes]

I'm more in the. But look, I was gonna say if you never got pimples.

[Valerie]

Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

Wouldn't you lax up?

[Valerie]

Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

Because I don't get pimples.

[Valerie]

I know. No, I know.

[Pete Holmes]

It's, it's very wooden ship. So you're just like, okay, that's done.

[Valerie]

No. It's very much frustrating to me that you don't wash your face and your skin is great. I, I, I mean, I think I would still.

[Pete Holmes]

Let's end there. Thank you.

[Valerie]

I think I still would because of just like aging stuff and also just like hygiene.

[Pete Holmes]

Who got to me with the like, drying out. I remember when I would use Noxzema and Clearasil and all that stuff.

[Valerie]

Oh.

[Pete Holmes]

Because that's what I used. I would wash Noxema and then I would cotton ball. I bought my own cotton balls.

[Valerie]

Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

And I'd put the astringent on it, wipe it on my face. Every oil was ripped from me.

[Valerie]

Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

Another one of those moments where we're like, anybody want to weigh in here?

[Valerie]

I know.

[Pete Holmes]

I didn't live alone.

[Valerie]

No. The, the skin care of the 90s was crazy. It was fucked up. Now we're all about hydrating.

[Pete Holmes]

Living Libe is no longer a sponse. But they were a sponsor for so long. I still use them and I still love them. And I think promo code Weird still works. But I. I'm oiling the face more than I'm never washing the face.

[Valerie]

Well, yeah, you want. You definitely want to. You use hydrating products now. That's the difference. I used to use that astringent. And I remember, of course, Neutrogena. Was Clear Cell a cleanser or was that like.

[Pete Holmes]

The Clear Cell was for pimples.

[Valerie]

Pimples. Yeah, yeah, pimples. What were you gonna say?

[Pete Holmes]

Look, look, it's me, Anthony Jeselnik. I don't know if that was right. I want to say that I noticed that the first thing that seems to me that makes you like a gross old man is your feet. So I've gotten more serious. This is almost over, everybody. I got a big dedicated thing of coconut oil. Every man. Every man. If you're over 31, okay, maybe 35. Coconut oil in the sock drawer. So when I get my socks, there it is. That's how I work. I have to see it. Take the coconut oil, get it on those nail, like, hydrates.

[Valerie]

I'm wondering why that coconut oil was in your sock dress.

[Pete Holmes]

Because I'm tired of nothing. Makes me feel like I'm Howard Hughes just falling apart. Like I picked the wrong grail.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Then putting on my pants and a nail that I keep them trimmed, catches and breaks. I'm like, first of all, it fucking hurts.

[Valerie]

Yeah, of course.

[Pete Holmes]

But then the next thing, you're just like, oh, I'm just like a. I'm decaying the toen. The toenails are like the windows of an old cottage.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

It's not the eyes. It's like if they're broken, the whole thing looks like. So oil up those. And it's been working like gangbusters. I love it.

[Valerie]

I'm so glad that works. Yeah. No, I'm. I do appreciate, you know, like, it's not like you have style. You don't have style me. No, but you do take care of yourself in those ways. Like, you'll notice that nothing. Or you're like.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Valerie]

You're like, obsessed with your breath. Not being bad.

[Pete Holmes]

Because every man. No, I'm sorry to all the men, but every man I know in Boston.

[Valerie]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Smells like a man. Like, lights out. I'll find the men.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And some of the burlier women. I'm just saying there's nothing gets me motivated than going home.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

Because, like, there's just so many smells and. And I just wanna beat it.

[Valerie]

Yeah. I do think that men with really good hygiene practices is very cute. I also love, like, A. I remember for my. And this is a probably very 50s housewife of me, but, like, anytime a man cleans up something for a girl, it's so cute. Like my. I remember my first date.

[Pete Holmes]

Can I talk to you first?

[Valerie]

I was with. It was with my first husband, and I had seen his car a million times.

[Pete Holmes]

Car.

[Valerie]

Can I tell you? But he, like, picked me up for.

[Pete Holmes]

A. Cleaned up the car, and he.

[Valerie]

Had cleaned the car, and I was just like, this is the cutest thing. The thought of him vacuuming a car with, like, our date in mind.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Valerie]

You know what's something else that I always thought was. Would be cute, but neither one of my husband's has ever done.

[Pete Holmes]

Maybe number three. Brett Goldstein, will you take me and make me the happiest soccer player? I say soccer so you don't feel weird. Football.

[Valerie]

Yeah. Right.

[Pete Holmes]

In the world.

[Valerie]

I'm moving on, but my hands are sweating. But is like bringing coffee in bed.

[Pete Holmes]

Oh, yeah.

[Valerie]

I would love someone to bring me coffee in bed.

[Pete Holmes]

Can I. We do have to end, but I want to say we want marriage. No, no, no. We watched you've got Mail, which is how you know we'll be together forever.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

If you can rock out some you got Mail together and just watch 30 Rock and I know occasionally put it in the soft putty. Okay. Come on. That was awful.

[Valerie]

I hated it. I was offended by the word occasionally just as much as.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah, yeah, no, I know. Every part of that was just the worst thing that's ever happened. Bah. Boo. We watched you've got Mail.

[Valerie]

Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

And you and I really have this. And it's classic meaning. It's stereotypical or maybe it's majorative or something. I don't know. But one of the ways that I. I feel fortunate or one of the ways that we're aligned with the culture so we see it in movies and stuff. You've got Mail. He is Joe Fox. Tom Hanks's character. F O X. F O X is a tyrant. He's a businessman. He has killer instinct. He learned it from his father. It's important you meet his father. Her. Her mother's dead. Spoiler. I'm just saying, like, you need to meet Tom Hanks's father, and he needs to look like he has bad breath and a lot of money.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And so he's inherited this burden, I think is so brilliant.

[Valerie]

It is that the best movie a.

[Pete Holmes]

Lot of men feel, which is like, I will carry forth the success and the prosperity and this isn't inherently wrong of my Father, I'm going to continue to grind this down. I will kill the old bookshop around the corner with Fox Books because the bottom line and the neighborhood doesn't even mind and Dave Chappelle is there.

[Valerie]

So never forget.

[Pete Holmes]

What's key about you've Got Mail is they're obviously falling in love and they don't know it's one another over email. And, and in real life they hate each other. And what's key about that is when they do eventually get together brilliantly by slowly getting to know each other and all that stuff. And then he reveals I'm the person that you've been pen palling. I love this so much I could cry.

[Valerie]

You did cry when we watched.

[Pete Holmes]

Of course I cry every time. But she loves him and she knows his shadow.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And so many people. I'm not going to gender it, but so many couples I think can thrive in that setup of like, you know, that I can be a blowhard and you know, I can be too success driven or too outwardly focused or whatever it might be. All these different flaws, those were dumb, dumb self serving guesses. I'm sure there's way worse stuff, but like, you know that I'm Fox Books.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And when I say it was me, I know you say, I was hoping it was you.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

That is.

[Valerie]

I love you.

[Pete Holmes]

That is. And I'm like, that's a sweet boy. I'm Fox Books. And I got the lady with the, the bookshop around the corner and she knows that I put, I did put her out of business. Stupid Hollywood note. Can her book, can her bookstore not be put out of business? No. He fucking breaks its neck.

[Valerie]

Yeah.

[Pete Holmes]

And he doesn't even apologize.

[Valerie]

Well, he, he, yeah, you're right. He kind of does.

[Pete Holmes]

He sort of does. But he doesn't.

[Valerie]

But that's the thing about that.

[Pete Holmes]

There's no, like one aisle into my shop will be called your shop and all the proceeds will go to your mother's charity.

[Valerie]

Yes.

[Pete Holmes]

It's just. Sorry. I'm a big old putty pusher. I'm terrible pushing into that putty.

[Valerie]

No, he says in that last, you know, thing where he's, he's like his, his Hail Mary where he's trying to really seal the deal right before she goes and meets, meets the man that is him, you know, he says like, I wonder if I hadn't been Fox Books and you hadn't been Shop around the Corner. And she like concedes like, yes, we would have. And that's really. Say that's him saying. And then he does say, like, how can you forgive this guy for standing you up and not forget me for this tiny little thing putting you out of business? Which is so good. But what really, that's. What he's saying is like. Like this is. This is my shadow. And, like, can you love me anyway? And you. And it's such good acting on her part because mostly she's just responding with facial expressions.

[Pete Holmes]

Yeah.

[Valerie]

And somehow she perfectly conveys like, that she really wants to be able to like. She does.

[Pete Holmes]

I know.

[Valerie]

But yeah, it's so good. I love a good Nora Ephron rom com genius more than anything weird.

[Pete Holmes]

I know people throw around genius a lot, but.

[Valerie]

No, she really.

[Pete Holmes]

She really was. All right, everybody, have a good.

[Valerie]

Have a good weekend.

[Pete Holmes]

Thanks for being here. Thanks for sharing some time.

[Valerie]

Thanks for sharing some time.

[Pete Holmes]

And look, we're in the mix politically and globally.

[Valerie]

Whatever we're supposed to do and say.

[Pete Holmes]

What do you need me to say? We're doing it.

[Valerie]

We're doing it.

[Pete Holmes]

That thing we're all worried about. Ah, now it sounds like I'm mocking it.

[Valerie]

No, it is, it is. There's plenty to be worried about. And thank you.

[Pete Holmes]

No, no, no, I'm worried. I'm worried. I'm worried.

[Valerie]

No, no, no, I know, I know, I know, I know.

[Pete Holmes]

I like to think I'm the right amount of worried and the right amount of not worried.

[Valerie]

Yeah, I think that's right. It is holding the tension of that. Yeah, I think. Yeah. All right, everybody, go ahead and keep it crispy.