You're Dead to Me – Aztecs

Host: Greg Jenner (BBC Radio 4)
Date: December 17, 2025
Featured Voices: Mally Ann Reese, John Luke Roberts, Ray Winstone, Supporting Cast
Script Consultant: Professor Caroline Dodds Pennock
Episode Theme: A fast-paced, comedic yet deeply informative look at the Aztec Empire, its society, religion, eccentricities (including human sacrifice and chocolate-based economy), and how its world ended with Spanish conquest and disease.

Episode Overview

Greg Jenner, historian and host, takes listeners on a whirlwind tour of the Aztec Empire—its awe-inspiring cities, religious practices, culinary contributions, surprising social customs, and the devastating impact of Spanish colonization. True to the show’s tone, the episode blends historical facts with sharp comedy and witty skits, all while spotlighting just how much the Aztecs contributed to global culture (and how their end was both tragic and profound).

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Founding and Power of the Aztec Empire

• Founding of Tenochtitlan (1325): The future capital city is established in central Mexico.
• The Triple Alliance (1428): "Tenochtitlan joined forces with two other city states, Tezco and Clacopan, and formed something called the Triple Alliance. This helped them fight off the powerful Tepanecs of Azcapotzalco." (02:00, Greg Jenner)
• Population Boom: By 1503, Tenochtitlan's estimated 200,000 people made it bigger than any European city at the time, including London.

2. Religion and Human Sacrifice

• Centrality of Religion: The city’s main pyramid (over 300ft tall) featured shrines to both the god of war and god of water.
• Polytheism: Dozens of gods with roles in every aspect of life—from war and health to feasting and dreams.
• Human Sacrifice:
  • "Aztecs believed that since the gods gave so much to them, it was important to give back... They chose human sacrifice." (03:11–03:28, Greg Jenner)
  • Comic dialogue reimagines the grim practice with dark humour. For example, Ray Winstone quips: "Oh, stop whining. You know, it's a huge honour to be a sacrifice." (04:41, Ray Winstone)

3. Mythology and Cannibalism

• Creation Myth: The world was formed when Tlaltecuhtli, the earth crocodile, was torn in two.
• Cannibalism: While present, archaeological evidence suggests it wasn’t widespread. Ritual consumption of war captives’ flesh (especially thigh meat) was reserved for certain ceremonies.
  • "The captor himself would skip the stew and observe the feast all dressed in white. We think this was a sign of respect." (06:32, Greg Jenner)
• Comic Side: "I've got prisoner of war stew all down my front." (06:50, Supporting Voice)

4. Warfare and "Flower Wars"

• War Purpose: Less about killing, more about capturing future sacrificial victims.
  • "Aztec warriors fought with a huge 3 to 4 foot long club covered in sharp obsidian glass. And these were really good for hacking at people's legs." (07:10–07:24, Greg Jenner)
• Shortage of Prisoners: When needed, Aztecs staged 'flower wars'—ritual battles to capture more sacrificial victims, not to settle political disputes.
  • "Flower wars were possibly scheduled battles just for the purpose of capturing future human sacrifices." (08:19, Greg Jenner)

5. Chocolate, Economy, and Daily Life

• Chocolate as Currency: Cacao beans, not gold, were prized and even used as money.
  • "Aztecs didn't think gold was that fancy. They also didn't have money... but instead had a barter system... So chocolate was a bit like money." (08:51, Greg Jenner)
• Wordplay: In Nahuatl, "Teocuitlatl" (gold) literally means "excrement of the sun."
  • "And who pays for things with poo anyway? That's a quick way to get thrown out of Tesco." (09:08, Greg Jenner)

6. Food and Culinary Legacy

• Diet Staples: Maize (in tortillas), beans, avocados, squash, potatoes, chilies, tomatoes (before Europeans!), turkey, fish, and... the occasional lizard and algae.
• Lasting Influence: Many foods now central to global cuisine originated with the Aztecs.
  • "They also ate chilies long before they popped up in curries. And they had turkey before it became a fixture of Christmas dinners." (09:59, Greg Jenner)

7. Social Customs and Marriage

• Marriage Rituals: Matchmakers (often older women) arranged marriages; the bride received a piggyback to the venue; wedding garments were tied together ("literally tying the knot").
  • "At an Aztec wedding ceremony, the groom's cape and the bride's skirt were tied together to symbolize their commitment." (11:06, Greg Jenner)
• Writing: Aztecs used pictorial writing—effectively "emojis before they were cool." (11:28, Greg Jenner)

8. The Spanish Conquest and Catastrophe

• Cortes Arrives (1519): Emperor Motecuzoma initially welcomed Cortes, but betrayal and siege quickly followed.
• Destruction and Disease: After Motecuzoma's death and city’s fall, 90% of Mexico’s native population died, mostly due to diseases like smallpox, flu, and measles brought by Europeans.
  • "The Spanish conquistadors brought smaller invaders with them that were just as deadly. Germs... while the Spanish got gold, chocolate, tomatoes, maize and potatoes, the Aztecs got smallpox, flu, measles and mumps in return." (12:37–12:56, Greg Jenner)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Human Sacrifice, with Grim Humour:

  • "This pyramid was the main temple... Imagine being the priests who had to commute to the shrines up there." (02:22, Greg Jenner)
  • "Aztecs believed... these gods needed to be sustained through human blood." (03:47, Greg Jenner)

• On Aztec Cannibalism:

  • "Thigh meat was apparently the best legal brist. Boss lag, please." (06:30, Supporting Voice & Greg Jenner)

• On Aztec Value System:

  • "The word for gold [meant] excrement of the sun... Surprise, they weren’t obsessed with gold." (08:56, Greg Jenner)

• On Spanish Conquest and Consequences:

  • "While the Spanish got gold, chocolate, tomatoes, maize and potatoes, the Aztecs got smallpox, flu, measles and mumps in return." (12:54, Greg Jenner)
  • "No. Wave after wave of disease devastated the indigenous population until about 90%... had been wiped out within a hundred years." (12:59–13:12, Greg Jenner)

Timeline & Key Timestamps

| Timestamp | Segment | |-----------|----------------------------------------------| | 01:09 | Introduction to Aztec civilization | | 02:00 | Formation of the Triple Alliance | | 02:22 | Aztec religion, gods, and main pyramid | | 03:28 | Human sacrifice and its role | | 04:14 | Earth crocodile myth and ritualized cannibalism| | 05:17 | Skull racks and evidence for cannibalism | | 06:54 | Aztec war strategy: capturing over killing | | 08:13 | "Flower wars": ritual battles for captives | | 08:51 | Economy: chocolate as currency; gold's low status| | 09:31 | Daily life: food and culinary legacy | | 10:23 | Weddings and social customs | | 11:06 | Wedding symbolism: "tying the knot", chocolate feast| | 11:49 | The Spanish arrive: conquest and disaster | | 12:56 | Catastrophic population loss from disease | | 13:19 | Humorous recap quiz |

Quiz & Recap (13:19–14:04)

Greg wraps up with a light quiz reinforcing learning points:

• Capital city: Tenochtitlan
• Currency/treat: Chocolate (cacao beans)
• Purpose of flower wars: Capture enemies for human sacrifice

Episode Tone and Style

• Blend of Comedy & Scholarship: Playful dialogue, role-play, and jokes (“unexpected poo poo in the baggage area” (09:23)), with consistent factual accuracy.
• Contemporary References: Uses Tesco, emojis, and pop culture for relatability.
• Candid Acknowledgment of Tragedy: The devastation wrought by colonization and disease isn’t sugar-coated— “Yeah, pretty depressing. Sorry they can't all have happy endings.” (13:19, Greg Jenner)

Further Learning

Greg signs off by recommending the full-length episode of You're Dead to Me with Professor Caroline Dodds Pennock for listeners who want deeper historical insight into the Aztecs.

Summary compiled for listeners seeking a lively, witty, and fact-rich snapshot of the Aztec Empire and its fate.