← Youth Justice Transformation in Action
Youth Justice Transformation in Action
A Blueprint for Youth Justice Reform: Lessons from Juvenile Redeploy Services
00:41:16
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- [00:00]
Mark Werner
Foreign.
- [00:10]
Jody Martin
Transformation in Action we are the RFK National Resource center for Juvenile justice and we are on a mission to transform the youth justice system by partnering with people like you who are passionate about improving outcomes for youth, families and communities you serve. I'm Jody Martin, Deputy Executive Director.
- [00:27]
John Toole
And I'm John Toole, Executive Director. As we embark on Season three of Youth Justice Transformation in Action, we're diving deeper into crucial areas that shape our approach to juvenile justice. This season we're thrilled to explore special topics that have a profound impact on the lives of young people within the justice system, including the complexities of emerging adults, the pivotal role of family engagement, the transformative power of growth, focused case management, and many more. Through insightful discussions, expert interviews and real life stories, we aim to shed light on innovative practices, challenges and opportunities in the realm of youth justice. Together, let's continue our journey toward creating a more fair, just and supportive system for our youth, families and communities.
- [01:14]
Jody Martin
In today's episode, A Blueprint for Youth Justice Lessons from Juvenile Redeploy Services, John interviews Mark Werner, Director of Juvenile Redeploy Services for the Circuit Court of Cook County Juvenile Justice Division. Juvenile Redeploy Services, in partnership with Probation, offers an alternative to incarcerating youth in the Illinois Department of Juvenile Justice. Through collaboration with community based organizations, the program employs a trauma informed public safety approach to deliver intensive evidence based services and individualized treatment to high risk youth. Join John and Mark as they explore the initiative, successes, challenges and and its positive impact on youth and the community.
- [01:55]
Mark Warner
Welcome everyone to another episode in Season three of the Youth Justice Transformation and Action podcast series. I'm thrilled to introduce Mark Warner, Director of Juvenile Redeploy Services, as our special guest today. Mark is also a member of the RFK National Resource Center's Transformation of Youth Justice Practice Network, a distinguished member who has been a partner with us since our inception over 10 years ago. Mark, it's great to have you with us. Can you introduce yourself with a little more detail in your current title and role and tell us a little bit about your experience in the field?
- [02:29]
Mark Werner
Good morning, John. Thanks for having me. I really appreciate it. So, yes, as you said, I'm the. I'm the current Director of Juvenile Redeploy Services for the Circuit Court of Cook County Chief Judge's Office. I've been in that role for a little over a year. Prior to that, I was. I've been with the Circuit Court in the Juvenile probation department for 24 years, starting as a Juvenile Probation Officer in the field and then becoming a Supervisor, then deputy chief. And I finished up with them last year as their chief of administration and director of human resources.
- [03:02]
Mark Warner
We've had a chance to talk about the transition that you made to take over leadership here. What led you to that transition into this current position? Mark?
- [03:10]
Mark Werner
I was lucky enough to have been chosen to help with the planning process for this grant, and that kind of led me into wanting to apply for this position. So we were in the planning stages for a couple years. I think probably the change from going from administration back to youth programming, that drove me to apply for it. And I think it was a. It was a good choice. I missed that in my career. And although administration is a. Is an important role, I wanted to get back to youth programming.
- [03:42]
Mark Warner
I applaud the move, and I believe that. I understand at this point, you're really pleased that you're in this position, able to drive the success of this program.
- [03:51]
Mark Werner
Absolutely.
- [03:52]
Mark Warner
So, originally, what drew you to the field of youth justice? Mark, tell the audience a little bit about why you do what you do.
- [03:58]
Mark Werner
I probably different path than many people. I started out in more in the justice field and police work. I was a police officer first. I was kind of thrown into youth work. The youth officer in our jurisdiction retired, and the chief needed somebody new for it, and no one else wanted it. So I was a junior in seniority, and I kind of gotten chosen. But I will forever be thankful to him for that. He was really progressive. And this is back in the early 90s where I think there was more punishment than anything. But he wanted to start a restorative justice program in our police department department. He wanted to start a peer jury. He wanted to have counselors on site to help families. And I was lucky enough to be part of the planning process for that and the implementation. So it was a blessing. And that's kind of what led me to learn more about juvenile probation. And when I finished my degree, I applied for that job, too. But I was also a foster parent and an adoptive parent. I adopted my son. I saw the effects of trauma on youth and how it manifests itself. And I also saw that caring adults and a supportive community can make a huge difference. So that's kind of how I got kind of focused on youth justice.
- [05:16]
Mark Warner
Well, that's a laudable background. And of course, again, our friendship allows me to know that you've been a foster parent for a couple of decades, and that young person is now a young adult and I believe doing really well.
- [05:30]
Mark Werner
Yeah, yeah. And, you know, trauma is long lasting, and so I know He. He struggles with that, but he's a great person and a great adult, and I'm proud to be his father.
- [05:42]
Mark Warner
Yeah. And I love the example you set by the pathway to this point in your career that involved both that personal commitment on a very intense level. It's certainly something that we should all applaud. Mark, you know, we're here today to learn a little bit about what it is that you're overseeing. It's an important program targeted at a very critical population of youth. And we'd be remiss if we didn't at least acknowledge in the city of Chicago, in Cook County, Illinois, an area experiencing great challenges. So once again, we applaud your commitment to the youth, even the most challenging youth. So why don't you tell us a little bit about the juvenile Redeploy Illinois program and its primary goals that you're overseeing right now.
- [06:23]
Mark Werner
Mark, I'll start out by saying Redeploy Illinois is a statewide program. It's throughout Illinois. It's operated by the Illinois Department of Human Services, and they've been a great support to me. They have a great team there that supports all the programs in Illinois, and they're active in all of the Illinois counties, either with full programs or if this. The county's too small to support something like this. They are allowed to use what they call redeploy focus money to help individual youth if they apply for it. So really, it's available throughout the state. The overall goal is to reduce incarceration in our Illinois Department of Juvenile justice, which is our youth prison system. However, it's so much more than that. Redeploy is about providing evidence based services in our community and collaboration between the court and the community partners. Yes, the overall goal is to decrease the prison population, but also to improve the overall well being of the child and the family. In Cook county, our model was an emphasis on intensive services provided in all of our redeploy hubs. And so we have four redeploy hubs in the community. We're operating in half of Cook county right now. And we started that a little bit over a year ago, June of 2023. One of the unique pieces of the program is each jurisdiction is given the freedom by the statewide oversight board to develop their own program that fits their community. So we're about providing safe, supportive environment in those redeploy hubs that provides therapy, life skills, mentoring, positive youth justice activities in an incentive based environment. And I want to emphasize that the use of the incentive based environment this is a big culture shift for a lot of communities. We still have a lot of youth justice professionals who have a hard time with this and they believe in the consequence based environment. We are seeing success using the incentives. We're seeing a lot of changes in behavior and we're seeing some success from our young people. Each agency also has a line item in their budget to bring in services they may not provide in house. So they've used this for art therapy, psychiatry services, special speakers and other supportive services. Those barriers to success for the youth.
- [08:46]
Mark Warner
That's outstanding. And you started your answer as I might expect you would, and that's to speak to the collaborative partners with whom you work and the great staff. I think we should identify as this podcast gets published, the website that holds the video that you guys produce to describe the program is really reinforcing and inspiring to see the people that you're talking about who are so inspired to work with this challenging population in those hubs. You want to comment a little bit more about who those people are and what their role is?
- [09:16]
Mark Werner
Absolutely. So we have some really talented people and as you know, for somebody to be in the youth justice field, I think they really have to be dedicated to helping our youth youth. It's certainly not for the salary. So they are youth outreach services and national youth Advocate Program. They provide the staffing, each operate two of the redeploy hubs and just some really, really dedicated people. And the youth really gravitate towards them and connect with them. And I think that's one of the most important things. You know, evidence based therapy, absolutely important. Good services available. Yes, absolutely important. But people that can connect with kids and families, that's one of the most important things.
- [10:00]
Mark Warner
Yeah, I would certainly invite the audience to look that up and see how they could become inspired just by watching the folks in that video and their commitment to youth. Mark, you also mentioned in that earlier response the incentive based approach. Certainly RFK National Resource center is strongly committed to understanding adolescent brain science, applying positive youth development principles. We have a partnership with the Growth Focus case management which really focuses on supporting a positive identity formation for these youth. You mentioned certainly incentive based approaches. That's not without a balance of sanctions where necessary, am I correct? And I'm probably addressing this question so that you can respond to that. For those in the audience that may be inclined to say you can't just reward bad behavior. That's not what you're doing when you speak to incentive based approaches, is it?
- [10:51]
Mark Werner
No, absolutely not. There are sanctions also in this Program, we try to balance that out. We want the youth to feel that success, but they're required to do so many things by the court. There's so many sanctions along the way, and most of them don't see those incentives. So we want them to be successful. What we do is we have a redeploy bucks. So when they are successful that they're able to do something with those, they could save up for something big. AirPods for their phone. Some of them just want simple things like clothes, Amazon gift cards, Target gift cards, or they could just buy a. A candy bar or a bag of chips too. So when. Whenever they're achieving their points in the redeploy hubs, they can earn redeploy bucks. When they move to the next level, they get a significant amount of redeploy bucks. And of course, when they graduate, that's a big thing. Some of the other ones have earned doing really extra things too. We had one youth who saw, when he transported to the redeploy hub, he. They. He saw some homeless people, and he really wanted to do something for them. So at the end of the day, he noticed they had food left over from dinner. I think it was a pizza that they hadn't even touched. He brought that down to the encampment that was maybe half mile away, and a staff member went with him, and they delivered that, and it became a thing after that. He wanted to go on a weekly basis down there and bring food. It really changed his attitude. So service learning is also a big component of our redeploy program.
- [12:28]
Mark Warner
I think it's obvious when you stack incentives and see the behavior change because they appreciate the incentivized reward, you manage to create a pattern of changed behavior away from the behavior that keeps them involved in the youth justice system. Kind of a simple concept, Mark, isn't it?
- [12:46]
Mark Werner
Yes, absolutely.
- [12:47]
Mark Warner
Individualized treatment. I'm going to dive a little deeper, Mark. It is an important component. This is not just a group of young people. Each young person that is a part of the program is an individual. And you apply certain methods to assess what their treatment or service needs are and how those are offered and connected to those youth. Can you tell us a little bit about that process?
- [13:07]
Mark Werner
Absolutely, yeah. We use the Yazzie assessment, that's the youth assessment screening instrument. We just started using a new version of it called the Yazzie too, which I'll get into. But we use that right on the front end to assess the youth, and then we bring everybody to the table in a Wraparound using a wraparound philosophy. And we have a wraparound staffing to really get that youth and family voice. Bringing that youth and family voice to the table right in the beginning has been our key to parent engagement and success. It's a newly modified assessment that we're using the Yazi 2. It's more focused on strengths and needs than the original Yazi. And as I said, it's used in conjunction with this wraparound staffing to develop our success plan. We also are able to bring others to the table too, such as coaches, teachers, extended family, neighbors, anybody the family identifies as being important towards that success of that youth. And then we can also try and identify services for these families in the community. So we've identified things like food pantries, domestic violence agencies, mentoring programs, and positive activities that the youth can use to help them with their success. Each agency has a flex fund in their budget, and they can use that in many different ways to help engage that family. I've seen them purchase groceries and clothing and furniture. We've helped with moving expenses, utility expenses, rent, and I think that has gone a long way towards showing that family that we care about them.
- [14:40]
Mark Warner
You know, we're talking about the incentives, we're talking about the services. In the development of this program, it seems to me it would be necessary for others who may want to mimic this program to intentionally focus on a budget for incentivized rewards, a budget for the services, a budget for maybe non traditional intervention treatment, community opportunities. Can you comment on how that was done in the development of the redeploy in Illinois and in your Cook County?
- [15:10]
Mark Werner
Very much like you just said, we wanted to make sure we put as much flexibility into the program as possible. Each youth and family are individuals. Each community has different needs. Throughout Cook county, we're. We're servicing six unique areas using those four redeploy hubs. So what might work in one area doesn't work in another area. So we have a budget for flex funds, which, you know, that could be for clothing or utilities or anything like that. We also have a budget for. For contract services. That may not be something that we're having in house. Although all the youth receive therapy, there might be a special type of therapy that a youth needs or psychiatric services. That's a different line item. We make sure that there's money in. And we've actually been, you know, using transfers within those line items too. When we see that we may have ran out of money in one area and we need it, the state gives us enough flexibility in there to kind of move money around. And then next year, when we're building that budget, we'll go, oh, yeah, we need. We need to put a little bit extra into that budget, maybe a little less in this one. And then each of the hubs also has an activities budget, so positive youth activities. They've gone to plays and concerts and movies and. And they also try to take advantage of all the free things that might be offered in the community, too.
- [16:31]
Mark Warner
I know you've spoken about collaborators, and I've identified that as a key just for the audience. This is grant funded, as you stated. There were collaborators who thoughtfully developed the program components of this. Can you restate who some of those key collaborators were in the program planning and initial implementation?
- [16:50]
Mark Werner
Mark, Collaboration was the key to this. And the stakeholders were so important in our early success. So working with the state's attorney, the public defender. We've worked with other redeploy agencies throughout the state. Some of the jurisdictions in Illinois have been operating for almost 20 years. So making sure we were using them to provide advice to us. One of the most important was our judges. They were essential in having and designing this program.
- [17:22]
Mark Warner
So we talked about program development, we talked about the collaborators, we talked about the goals. What specific outcomes, Mark, are you identifying you seek for the youth involved in this program?
- [17:34]
Mark Werner
Yeah, we are lucky enough to bring on Chapin hall at the University of Chicago as our evaluation partner in this. So they've been working hard at developing our outcome measures. You know, and obviously we have to look at our overall goal of reducing incarceration in the Illinois Department of Juvenile Justice. But also, are we looking at the whole child and looking at the family and looking at those outcome measures? So we just started a satisfaction survey this month, and we're. We're making sure that we're talking to the youth about how they feel about the program, what can be improved, what they liked, what they didn't like. And we're going to be implementing the parent one and also a staff satisfaction survey. So that. That is definitely being looked at. Recidivism, obviously, but really, really trying to focus on youth outcomes. So using that Yazzie doing our reassessments and our closing assessments so that we can measure improvement in protective factors and hopefully a decrease in dynamic risk.
- [18:41]
Mark Warner
Mark, with this program, you've been in operation for.
- [18:45]
Mark Werner
You're in your second year, Just started the second year. Yes.
- [18:48]
Mark Warner
How's the program evolved? I mean, obviously there's a lot of intense planning. The stakeholders have given it careful thought about the Services, the programs, the incentives, the community itself, involvement, and certainly the family and the youth. But whenever you implement, there has to be some evolution. How has the program evolved since its inception, even in this short period of time?
- [19:08]
Mark Werner
You know, I think every program has a little bit of drift too when you start a program. And some of that drift is good, but you have to watch for making sure you're not drifting from your original mission either. I'm proud to say that we've stuck to our program plan. We've done some changes. We meet on a weekly and monthly basis with different stakeholders depending, and we're able to kind of change things that aren't working. So we've made slight changes to our incentive program. We've made changes to our level system and those little changes have really helped and the youth have provided feedback into that. The redeploy hubs meet with the youth on a daily basis, but really talking to them about what they like, what they don't like, what they want to do. So they're involved in the planning process for activities and things like that. And we're just starting to develop our youth advisory board. Now that we're having graduates, we want to make sure we take advantage of those alumni and really reach out to them and have them help us improve the program. So a lot, a lot of good things going on. I would say that probably our biggest challenge has been in staff hiring and retention. Hiring for the youth justice field is not easy sometimes, especially when you're talking about the community based agencies. So we have looked at that. We made some changes to our salaries going into year two and we're hoping that really improves. There's a lot of workers looking for hybrid work or remote work that we're not able to do because we need youth working with their justice professionals hands on. So we looked at things that we had more control over, such as salaries.
- [20:55]
Mark Warner
And Mark, that is a great capture of so many of the key elements that form the basis of an effective assess and reassess and evaluate program components to make sure that you're staying away from drift and directly affiliated with those activities that will achieve the successful goals you outline. That's a really great answer, Mark, and actually you just take me back to want to follow up. Can you tell me a little bit more about what occurs in the hubs on a daily basis?
- [21:23]
Mark Werner
Yeah. So youth are coming out of summer right now. So during the summer they had a little bit more time in the redeploy hub. So we were able to use some of that Extra time to do activities and field trips and service learning. But right now, everybody's back in school. So the youth are reporting to the redeploy hubs after school. As I said before, they're. They're transported there. So they're usually picked up at school and brought to the redeploy hubs. And they start out with group activities. They might be getting individual therapy. They do group substance abuse therapy on a weekly basis. They're meeting with their case managers. They're fed. We have right now 100% boys. And so we use a significant part of our budget for food because they eat and they really like the food. Both hubs are using caterers. After dinner, they'll work on homework, and then they usually will be doing some kind of activity. So it might be the boys like to play basketball, but they also go to the movies and have done other activities, too. We have guest speakers coming in. It's really packed with a lot of structured time.
- [22:33]
Mark Warner
Structured time in a positive and safe environment. Is that a fair assessment of what goes on in the hubs?
- [22:39]
Mark Werner
Absolutely. We actually did a survey the other day. I was out of one of the hubs and talking to the youth, and one of the evaluators from Shape and Hall had asked about safety. And the boys commented they feel very safe when they're there. They're more concerned when they're back in their community. So that's. That's a different topic, probably, that we try to talk to them about and develop safety plans for each of them back in their communities.
- [23:06]
Mark Warner
So you've given so many components of this program to the audience. I really appreciate the depth of understanding and detail. I'm just going to ask you, what do you think are the critical elements from all of those components of the program that contribute to successfully achieving your goal? Keeping youth out of the correction system, maybe establishing a pattern of desistance, but at the very least, reducing the amount of recidivism. Mark, in your experience, what do you think most contributes to successfully achieving the goals of the program?
- [23:36]
Mark Werner
I really thought about this prior to this conversation, John, and I was trying to think of, like, one thing that really stood out to me, and the thing that stood out to me is parent engagement. We've really noticed a direct correlation between having that parent engaged with that youth and how the success of that youth goes. I think the wraparound helps with that. Engaging those parents right off the bat has really helped. But I will tell you, it's a struggle, and it's probably not unique to this Program or to juvenile justice. We're probably seeing that across the board and across the nation. But really engaging those parents, I think is something that's crucial. So I think we have to think outside the box a little bit on this. And one of the family facilitators or one of our redeploy hubs told me that she was having a hard time with one of the parents, never had time to talk to her, was difficult to reach. And she got her on the line one time, and she said, I really need to come out and talk to you. It's been 30 days since your son's been here. And she said, I don't have time. I have four other kids and I need to go grocery shopping. She goes, I'll pick you up and take you grocery shopping. This mom was on public transportation, so she didn't have a car, so she appreciated just the. The transportation to the grocery store. But the family team facilitator also paid for the groceries, too. And I think that took some of the burden off mom a little bit too, but also developed that relationship a little bit. She was able to spend that money she was going to use for groceries on something else, take a little bit of that stress off. But it allowed 45 minutes to an hour for them to talk while they were going around shopping for items, too. I really applaud that type of thinking, like thinking outside the box a little bit and trying to figure out, how can I reach this parent.
- [25:30]
Mark Warner
Mark, you've spoken to so many elements and components that you've constructed in the program that have such a solid research foundation. The highlight you gave there is not a convenience for us to be successful. The research would suggest it's a necessity. And the vignette you just shared in the ways in which we have to be persistent and diligent about exploring, building those relationships, building that trust to engage the family and the youth in the process ends up being critical to the success. I'm glad that you highlighted that. I appreciate that that was the area of focus. It's just imperative to any success that any program has. So I appreciate that response. You know, Mark, there's also, particularly where you're working and among the youth that you're working with, there's maybe a history of recalcitrants, a history of challenges and obstacles to them changing the behavior. More broadly, what do you see as the biggest challenge that Juvenile Redeploy Illinois and Cook county faces?
- [26:26]
Mark Werner
We're working with some really, really challenging youth. These are youth that otherwise were not for this program would have been going to the Illinois department of juvenile justice and some of them for a significant period of time. But it should be noted, like, all these youth would have reentered the community at some point. And do we want these youth re entering the community better and better able to handle their behavior and reduce criminal activity, or do we want them just to go to a youth prison and then return to the community with no services? So we're really trying to focus in on making sure that we are addressing the highest risk of the youth. So I don't mind that we have the most challenging youth. I think that's our job. So as we approach this conversation, John, I was trying to think of, like, what youth are we serving? What's their profile? And how can we encourage them to be successful? So I thought of the three most recent graduates. So we just had three graduate in the last three months. It's just so exciting when you go to one of these ceremonies and you see how proud these kids they are of themselves and how proud the parents are. But I was trying to think like, is there a correlation between the success of a youth and their initial profile? And I hadn't thought of it before, but because these youth are all different, they're all from three different judges, three different communities, but they were all older youth. They were 17 or 18 years old. They all had a past history of probation coupled both with technical violations and new charges. All three of them had serious, serious felony cases which would ended them up in youth prison. But they each progressed in the program and made significant changes in the program. It did not go without challenges, though. Each one of them had behavior problems in the beginning, but they had a judge who believed in them, a probation officer that believed in them. And I'm proud of each and every one of them and the changes they made while they were in the program for anywhere from nine months to a year. I want to say that every single one of them had good parent engagement, too. They each had good connection with their staff and developed a strong relationship. And I think that was one of the big things that motivated them to change. And every single one of them, if you met with them today, would say that the program itself and the staff, coupled with all the external staff like probation and the judges, all helped them achieve success. And they got through the program with no new arrests, no violations of probation.
- [29:07]
Mark Warner
So that's an outstanding recognition of the impact you can have even when the population of youth you're serving are right at the edge. With a long history of involvement in youth justice system. And when I say right at the edge of becoming part of the youth correctional or the adult correctional system, and yet you guys didn't give up, you build a comprehensive set of services, programs, interventions, supports for those youth and their families within their community, and you're achieving that kind of success that should inspire all of our listeners that replicating a program of this type is not only worthy for those youth and our communities, but probably very cost effective as well, which is kind of the minimal factor compared to the impact on the youth.
- [29:53]
Mark Werner
Right, right.
- [29:54]
Mark Warner
And Mark, you've had people notice you've shared with us that the National District Attorneys association has noticed your program. I believe you've either spoken to or about to speak to again the National District Attorneys association about this work. That's impressive to garner their attention for a program of this, of this type. Can you share beyond even anecdotal vignettes about the success, is there data at this point that begins to compel other people to realize we need to move in this direction on behalf of this population of youth?
- [30:26]
Mark Werner
I would say that and one of the reasons the National District Attorneys association reached out was because they were really looking for someone to speak to youth that were heavily entrenched in the system. Those older youth who are hard to treat, 14, 15. You know, youth are sometimes just getting involved in the youth justice system and, you know, hopefully you can reach them with traditional methods of probation and evidence based treatment. But these youth have all been through that period already and they're 17, 18 years old. So that's one of the main reasons we wanted to talk to them about it. And I would say we don't have a ton of data yet at the Cook county level, but there is some data at the state of Illinois level too, which I'd be glad to share with you. Like I said, they've been going for about 20 years now. Not only is there huge cost savings, which always appeals to your politicians and your taxpayers, but also a huge drop in recidivism across the board. I can speak to our decrease in commitments to the Illinois Department of Juvenile justice, which we have had a decrease in that, especially in the last year since we've been open as far as well being. I can't speak to that yet. We haven't gotten that far yet. But we are working on it because we want to show that too. We think that's just as important, if not more.
- [31:54]
Mark Warner
Those are pretty significant findings and outcomes, so I appreciate you highlighting those. And one would have to expect In a year and a half. We don't exactly have a long history of baseline data for the population that is being served by the Juvenile Redeploy program you're overseeing. But you also sound like you're positioned well to capture the data and begin to see those emerging trends of the outcomes or the impact of the program. That's great, Mark. You know, I'm going to ask you to look ahead. You're obviously deeply committed. You are a passionate professional, committed to the youth who you served over more than a quarter of a decade. What are your hopes for the future of Juvenile Redeploy Illinois program in the Cook County Circuit Court?
- [32:36]
Mark Werner
Yeah, my hope is we continue to expand. I hate the fact that we're only in half of Cook county right now, so I would love to be in all of Cook County. I want to make sure we're avoiding the use of locked institutions whenever we possibly can. Our judges are really committed to this. They work extremely hard to avoid this. And I see redeploy as one important tool that we can offer to help them with that. So that'd be my hope as far as redeploy goes.
- [33:05]
Mark Warner
So I think you're in a position to instruct and certainly I've tried to highlight when you've made observations about critical elements, components, programs and services. But for other states or jurisdictions looking to implement a program similar to this, maybe with a similar target population and target outcomes, Mark, what would your advice be based on your experience in this program and your overall experience in the youth justice field?
- [33:29]
Mark Werner
I would encourage them definitely to explore this and look into it, but to really take their time, be methodical about their planning process. You really need to get buy in from all your stakeholders, especially the judiciary. But will the prosecutor's office support it? Will the public defender support it? Can you bring the community's voice into your process? Make sure you're using implementation science. The voices should be heard throughout the planning process so you can overcome any hurdles that there are. And then I probably One piece of advice I would say is try to have the judiciary lead this process or at least co chair the process with you, because their voice carries a lot of weight.
- [34:12]
Mark Warner
I'm going to seize on the implementation science and specifically ask you. I think you were referencing the notion that it's a collaborative effort, that it's not just at the highest level that the planning takes place, but the planning involves supervisors, practitioners, field based personnel. Is that what you're referencing when you're speaking to the infrastructure of developing such a Program based on implementation science.
- [34:35]
Mark Werner
Right, right. Take your time. Go to every level. Make sure that everybody's voice is included in the process. You know, you don't want to leave anybody out. We also included line staff, probation officers. We included law enforcement. When we were doing this, we included community based agencies. We had guest speakers come in from different programs that were successful throughout the county and tell us what they thought was the most important thing about their success. So don't try to rush through the.
- [35:05]
Mark Warner
Process and I'm going to backtrack at this point. Mark, there was one key point I wanted to make sure you had an opportunity to respond to these days. The research is supporting with some credibility certainly that persons with lived experience can be invaluable in this work. Are those persons featured in the work of your program?
- [35:24]
Mark Werner
Thanks for bringing that up, John. We want to make sure that we're using people with lived experience. So I encourage both my community based agencies to look for these people when they're hiring. It's not as easy as as you want it to be sometimes because there's different laws in place that sometimes prohibit people. But we try to obtain waivers when we can to get people in who have had that experience and can share it with the youth. So we've been lucky enough to get a few of these people in each of the hubs too. I think it makes a big difference. We also bring in guest speakers and mentors who have lived experience too. I know that two of the boys that just graduated have been part of a mentorship group with someone with lived experience. And they both have said what a huge difference listening to this man has had on their lives.
- [36:14]
Mark Warner
Appreciate you commenting on that, Mark. It's pretty important if we can at least consider that kind of involvement to support these changes that we're seeking. Back to the question about implementation of similar programs and your advice. This is obviously having some impact in Chicago, Illinois. Large city, large urban environment. Is there reason to believe that this same kind of approach would work in rural and suburban communities as well from your perspective?
- [36:40]
Mark Werner
Yeah. Great question. Redeploy. Illinois is throughout the state of Illinois and a lot of our jurisdictions are rural jurisdictions. And they use some of the same concepts that we use. They don't necessarily have all the services under one roof like we do because they're so, so far apart from each other, but they, they use the wraparound philosophy. They used evidence based therapy that evidence based therapy might be over zoom though. Instead of being under one roof like we do, they try to provide transportation because there's a lack of public transportation in a lot of these jurisdictions. So they spend a significant amount of money making sure they have transportation services available. A lot of the, a lot of the same philosophies. We have mentoring too, and it's showing.
- [37:27]
Mark Warner
Efficacy and perhaps for a slight grin. You and I have had the privilege of working in the state for a number of years together, and that's been my benefit and my privilege. I've also worked in what Illinois calls downstate. I think for the uninitiated, downstate, Illinois is predominantly, if not almost exclusively, rural. So the data that you're speaking to has worked both in Chicago and in the downstate rural areas as well. I would encourage everyone who is a part of our listening audience today to consider the development of this kind of program for these most serious offenders or most chronic offenders that are close to leaving the youth justice system for a correctional alternative. You've identified the opportunities that exist to interrupt that pattern, interrupt that trajectory, and actually achieve success with even our most serious or chronic offenders. Mark, I really appreciate all that you've described today. I hope the audience could take some of those cues and perhaps replicate the success that you're experiencing in Chicago. But I don't want to leave this discussion without at least recognizing your enormous experience, your incredible passion and commitment to this field, and ask at least from your perspective, if you could change one thing about the youth justice system, what would it be?
- [38:45]
Mark Werner
The biggest impact I see on the youth justice system is when a youth has a youth justice professional. You know, whether that be a probation officer, whether it be a counselor, whether it be a redeploy staff member that cares for them and develops a trusting professional relationship that can affect change. If I could find one of those people for every single youth, I could retire with no problem at all. I think our job as managers and administrators is to seek those individuals out, hire them, and then retain them. It sounds easy, but it certainly is not easy. It requires planning. It requires implementing policies that support those individuals by supporting good community based probation work.
- [39:31]
Mark Warner
I have the belief that you believe while it's challenging, it can be accomplished.
- [39:37]
Mark Werner
Absolutely.
- [39:38]
Mark Warner
And until it's accomplished, you and I will continue to be employed, working diligently to achieve that kind of goal.
- [39:45]
Mark Werner
Yes, sir. Agreed.
- [39:47]
Mark Warner
Mark, you're an incredible person, an incredible professional. I wish the audience could know you as I've been able to get to know you, for that passion, for that commitment. Thank you for sharing about this particular program and your work that's led to the success. And I would be remiss if I didn't say and all of your collaborators and partners who have made this possible, we appreciate your efforts. Their efforts and the success is what we wish for you as you continue in these efforts. Mark, thank you very much.
- [40:16]
Mark Werner
Thanks Jen. I really appreciate it.
- [40:19]
Jody Martin
And that wraps up this episode of Youth Justice Transformation in Action. Thank you for joining us today. To learn more about Juvenile Redeploy services, we've included a link to a short documentary in the show Notes. Before we go, we want to remind you that the Growth Focus Case Management Guidebook is now available on our website at www.rfknrcjj.org along with our entire online resource library. All of our publications and resources are free to help support the transformation of Youth justice in communities everywhere. If you enjoyed the podcast, we'd be grateful for your support. Please take a moment to leave us a five star rating, write a review on your favorite listening platform and share the podcast with your network. Thanks again for tuning in.