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- [00:00]
A
Obviously it all comes down to lighting. That is the number one thing that you will be taught in terms of filming or photography. You know, you're doing it in your video now, it looks like anyway there's all, you're supposed to block all your window light if you want to do this properly. And that's one of the mistakes I'm trying to navigate with clients is they still like the daylight look but they, they, you know, but they do need to block their, their lighting so they can start from like, like zero, start from black. And then we can build up in terms of layers, the background layer lighting, the foreground layer lighting.
- [00:33]
B
I interrupt this interview just for a few seconds to tell you about our offerings. We offer one on one coaching that's personal with me, where I sit down with you and you can ask me questions. I do a deep dive on your channel. I also offer just a smaller channel review and then we also offer a great Mastermind group that you can pay a few dollars to get into. We do monthly Mastermind calls. We're going to start doing calls hosted by other members of the group and it's just a great place, place to kind of rub elbows with other creators. So if that's interesting, definitely check that out. But everything that we offer and have to provide to you is down below in the show notes. Thank you guys for listening. Now back to the show. Hello and welcome to this week's conversation on the YouTube Creators Hub podcast. I'm Dusty, your host as always, joined today by another wonderful creator. My guest today is James Kelly. James has a YouTube channel where he says he helps business creators build a professional looking YouTube studio that positions them as experts and attracts high value clients. So if you want to look good, James is your guy. So James doesn't even have a hundred videos uploaded on the channel. As far as long form goes, he's already getting very close to that 20,000 subscriber milestone. And we're going to talk today a little bit about how you can make really good money with not having astronomical numbers as far as subscriptions and views. So with that said, James, how are you doing today, my friend?
- [01:59]
A
Very good. Thanks Dusty. Thanks for having me. Been a fan for like five years, so it's an honor to be on here.
- [02:05]
B
Yeah, I love it. I love it. I said to my, my wife, I've packed up a lot of my gear, we're going on a couple of week vacation and so I don't look as good as, as I, I normally do here on camera. And I thought James is gonna just judge me, but hopefully, hopefully you're not not doing that right now. I love the considering I've got a
- [02:23]
A
webcam going right now.
- [02:24]
B
So I love the Tagline on your YouTube channel. It says premium studio design for experts and creators. You do videos such as the new way to build a pro YouTube studio with AI. How AI can turn a tiny space into a pro YouTube studio. So you're leaning into artificial intelligence, but you're also helping people do the simple things like easy lighting Setup to make YouTube videos look professional. So can you talk to me briefly about the origin story of the channel? How did this come to be? What were your thoughts and your kind of history and background?
- [03:00]
A
Yeah, for sure. So when I was about 18, I became a graphic designer after leaving college. And then from then I've been a designer in design agencies in my area in the south of the uk and with that skill set I learned how to use cameras obviously and lighting because I became their photographer and their video guy. So. And then at the same time I then obviously as a probably like half the population, I started watching Peter McKinnon and seeing what he was doing on the platform and I was like, I want to do that. So straight away I went and bought a Canon 1 DX Mark II, hid the cost for my wife, obviously business expense, and just got making videos. And then at the same time I Covid happened and I lost all my graphic design work. So it's another one of those Covid stories where it was like, right, my wife's pregnant, breastfeeding the other child and I decided to just tell her I'm going to be a YouTuber, no money coming in anymore. And that's how I started. I just started making content. In terms of the first videos were pretty bad. They were obviously about understanding cameras like ISO, shutter speed, aperture and that sort of thing. So they were pretty bad. But then I started finding something I was into and then during the lockdown, obviously we all started having more beers at home because there's no work. So I had these beer cans in the fridge and then I started making product commercials in my kitchen at home. So just showing how you can make something look really epic and pretty sexy with no cost. Just go to the shop, buy a can of beer, film it on like a 40 pound lazy electronic lazy Susan. And that was my first like viral video. It's got I think quarter of a million views now. And that then led me to getting some clients in terms of doing product design, commercial work for their advertising and stuff. So Some spice companies, other beer brands. And that also then led to when lockdown finished from COVID I was able to then get that skill set into more eyes of agencies and then they saw me more of a video guy now, not a graphic designer. So I was then positioned myself in myself as a, yeah, I can create cool looking content with pretty basic gear. And so that led to that. Then at the same time a guest you've had on once or twice at the same time I was like posting to the usual Facebook pages like, like my video please. You know, the ones that we all say don't go on but you know, at the time I didn't know don't go on it. And at the same time there on those channels, those pages on Facebook is where I met Ed Lawrence. And so you may know him as obviously Ed from film booth. And, and he started telling me about, you're doing it wrong, you're posting to the wrong people, they're not going to care about your video. You need to be, you know, reaching out to actual companies and stuff. Bit of chit chat. He loved my videos. He learned a lot from my like quick two minute camera set video. He said like, where was this like 20 years ago when I was like trying to figure out how to use a camera? And then he, we had a little chat about like potentially working together and I wasn't ready to commit yet, but he knew that my passion was there for YouTube and then it would have been a couple years later. He then out of the blue messaged me again, just saying, do you still want to be a YouTuber? I'm like, yes, I do. And he said, okay, I've got an opening. Name your price. I was like, wow, okay. So I gave him a, a salary price and he said yes. And then we started working together. And then so based on that I then started helping him film quite some slick content for I started, I started showing him how to use the camera properly and how to light his videos properly because at the moment he was just winging it. But he was getting success at the time and we then decided to start making some courses together. Well, he was going to make a course but he used me to help film it to do some sections. So we then launched something, a course called Thumbnail University where it used my graphic design skills and Photoshop skills from the past like 20, 25 years to show, you know, what are you doing wrong with your thumbnails? How can we improve them? Then we launched a studio mini build course which was okay. So we Got this tiny boxed off bedroom room we marked out on the floor and we got a slightly bigger room. What can we do in that space? So I went through everything on that course as well, in terms of camera setup, lighting setup, what you can actually do in a tiny space. And used Ed as the subject. And those videos today actually on, on his course are still. He said, we said to me today actually that they're still the most watched section on the whole course. I think it's because they're, you know, an easy watch. People are genuinely interested in how to look better on camera. They got all this fancy gear, but they don't know how to use it. And so that's where I was thinking, okay, there's something there. I think my niche, as much as I love the product commercial work, it just wasn't financially viable because dealing with after effects, dealing with slow render times, amendments from clients, it was just a nightmare. So even though you, yeah, we got this cool like 3000 pound job come in, it would take, you know, best part of a month to complete. This isn't sustainable. And I want to make content at the same time. So now I was thinking, okay, let's go back to making the thing that I'm actually good at, which is teaching people how to use their camera and lighting and say that's where I've now relaunched the channel as of about half a year ago, a bit more, maybe not much content, but that's because busyness and finding the direction. But that is the direction now where I'm positioning myself as the studio guy. Do thumbnails as well, but the studio guy that can help you look good on camera. I can either come and do it all for you or I can give you advice and you can use my videos to get advice. And that's, that's where we are today.
- [09:01]
B
So I've used a handful of your videos. I know have known Ed for a long time. You mentioned Peter McKinnon and both of those guys. I don't know Peter, but I've consumed his content for probably seven or eight years now. I love what he's doing. I've used a lot of your videos to help me, you know, optimize my setup. Because I've always told people, you don't have to be an expert at this stuff to look and sound good. You just have to be able to follow, you know, a few steps. And now with AI, it's made that even easier. So can you talk about maybe the top two or three things that you see creators doing? Wrong with their setup. That are easy fixes because they may be listening to this right now, James, and saying to themselves, oh yeah, I'm going to James's channel. And of course he looks great. And I go to Ed's channel and he looks fantastic. Well, it didn't start that way. It's not like you guys started looking like that and sounding like that. So what are a couple of kind of low hanging fruit things that we can do as creators to make ourselves look and sound better in our videos?
- [10:01]
A
Yeah, for sure. Obviously it all comes down to lighting. That is the number one thing that you will be taught in terms of filming or photography. You know, you're doing it in your video now, it looks like anyway, there's all, you're supposed to block all your window light if you want to do this properly. And that's one of the mistakes I'm trying to navigate with clients is they still like the daylight look, but they, they, you know, but they do need to block their, their lighting so they can start from like, like zero, start from black. And then we can build up in terms of layers. The background layer lighting, the foreground layer lighting. How do we get you to pop from the background?
- [10:39]
B
So let's, let's do this for a minute and I don't mean to interrupt you. So let's kind of walk through what I have set up, which is kind of a gu. And again, a couple of my lights are packed up in the moment. But the room here, my studio, completely dark. I got blackout curtains on the window over there. That is kind of, if you're watching this, you can see me pointing, but if you're listening, I have a blackout curtain over the only window from the outside in this studio. I have all other computers turned off. I have. And you tell me if my terminology is off because I claim to be a YouTube consultant and coach, but not necessarily a guru on all of this stuff. So I then have a key light coming in from an angle. Is that correct?
- [11:17]
A
Yeah, I, I, I dumb it down for a lot of people. So like I call it your main light because key light might scare people. But yeah, key light, your main light. Yeah.
- [11:25]
B
Okay. And then I want you to finish kind of what else because what, what I, and you can explain this much better than me, but what I found is that when you add a bit of darkness or contrast on one side of the face and more light on the other, it, the video just pops more. Can you explain that? And kind of the easy setup that you explain to people, I Didn't mean to interrupt you. I just kind of wanted to kind of walk people through that.
- [11:47]
A
Yeah. Because most people, obviously, when they get a light, they'll set it up in front of them, not knowing the angle. And it will just destroy any. No shadow. It will destroy the 3D look that your face naturally has. And the way we get that dimension back is by positioning the light at an angle. And so the typical one is like Rembrandt lighting, which is a 45 degree angle. And then you get, as you can see on your side, you get a triangle of light on the shadow side. And that is classed as Rembrandt lighting, which is quite a classic look. But most people will put. Probably put their light in front of them and that destroys all. It just makes it flat. So it's called flat lighting and it's good for beauty channels, that one, because obviously then it's eliminating all the shadows and stuff. But for. Mainly for men, you want to be side lighting, Rembrandt lighting. So going from an angle. But the thing that you're missing, which you might have it packed away, but that will make your setup killer and pop straight away, is you're finding it now you've got a shadow side that is quite shadowy and the background's quite dark. If you were to introduce a hair light behind you on the opposite side of the key light, it'll cause a rim around the shadow, the darker shadow side. And that will give you that edge that we're missing at the moment. And that's what gives you that final polish. That. That's the other thing that most people miss that I see is they. They haven't got a hair light. And it's. It hasn't got to be expensive. It can be literally, you know, like a 20 pound tube light. As long as that's positioned in the right place and it's just catching an edge.
- [13:20]
B
And where would you. Where would you. Let's do this live. Where would you position? So we have the main light. If you're listening to this, let's try to. Let's try to explain things to where people who are listening can understand it. The main lights coming in from an angle. And for those of you I think I have, it's a Luma. I can't think of the name of the light right now. It's a Luma something. It's a really expensive light that is coming in about 45 degrees, kind of what you mentioned here from this side. And then I don't really have anything behind me. And I have a hair light. I just have not set it up properly in the past. So explain. Like in my case, where would you position it? So if I'm. If this one is front left, the main light, where would the hair light be?
- [13:59]
A
The opposite to the. To the key light. So behind your shoulder. If the light's in front of your shoulder, the other side. So literally, you're going light facing you. You in the middle, there's another light behind you, exactly the same parallel line. And they'll just naturally work together. Obviously, you got to tweak it a little bit depending on what light source it is, if it needs to have barn doors, if it needs to have a grid. But like I say, you can get by with just a cheap cheat tube light. And for you, if you were to match, for example, the blue in your background, it just links then you to the background. So that's the. That's the other thing. Like, if you've got a practical light in the shot, like a lamp in your background, the. The number one thing you can do is go, right, I've got a lamp. I'm gonna make that lamp look like it's hitting me. And you'll see that in every film, every Netflix show. You. They. I won't talk about the proper lighting they do, but I'll talk about. There's always a practical light in shot, but that practical light is not the light that you're seeing on their skin. They light that separately with their hair light, their rim light, and it just gives the illusion that that lamp is causing that glow on that person's skin and stuff. And it just. It makes the whole background connected rather than just being random. So you wouldn't have like a. A tungsten bulb in the background and then have a blue light on you that then breaks realism. We're trying to make it look like it's naturally supposed to be there.
- [15:23]
B
And these are off camera. My main light is off camera. The hair light would be off camera. And it just. It gives the illusion of. If you ever watch someone who has a good setup, the guy that used to do tutorials for Riverside, his name is Stephen Robles, I believe is his name. He has phenomenal lighting in his room, and he does this very well. So if you want to go check him out, I've been trying to get him on the podcast. With that said, as time has progressed, James, the ability to do this well has completely decreased in cost. The budget of a good setup, you don't have to have the nice, expensive, you know, the camera is going to make a difference. You know, I got a Sony A7, 2 or 3 up there right now, so it makes a difference. But as far as the budget to set up a studio, walk us through that. It's not what it used to be, is it?
- [16:10]
A
No, but I still recommend people do, if they can push it, go for a full frame camera. But I'm using the cheapest full frame Canon camera. The, the, the Canon R8 and that does anything I ever need. Like to me it still feels like an upgrade from my Canon 1 DX Mark II which is the flagship model at the time, which is like a five grand camera. And the, the Canon R8 if you can find it from the right sites. Like I got mine, you know, directly from Hong Kong because it, you can skip on some sort of tax stuff then you can definitely get it for like less than £800 and probably cheaper now because I think there's a new version of it out. And then lens wise you don't even have to go for an L series lens anymore. A premium lens, you can just go cheap as chips, Even like the Nifty 50 or one of the cheap primes that just frame you correctly like a 35 mil, then you're done like. So the camera, camera size is probably about a thousand pounds total. Obviously a lot of people, the course that I help with ed in, I give all my advice there as well to the students but they, they always say the same cameras, they say that the Sony ZVE10 or whatever like that, that's like one of the most common ones that pops up for a creator that's looking to buy a camera. And then I'm trying to tell them like you can go for that but you are going to be more limited on lens choices because it's a crop sensor. So even though you're getting a, what you says is a 16 to 35 millimeter lens, it's, it's not, it's like a 24 millimeter when you factor in the crop and so you obviously, and obviously blur that you can get with a full frame and all that sort of stuff. But I've, I've done tests where you, you can match pretty well a crop sensor to a full frame in terms of quality. It's just lens choice becomes a thing. There's no reason for me like if you, it's a couple of hundred pound more to go for a full frame I think nowadays. So I, I would just say just do it. And even if you're not going to Film in the full 4k quality with all the codecs that it's got just, it will just be better because it's got the newer eye tracking. All the stuff that you need for staying pin sharp. Even if you're wearing glasses, it can see your eyeball still. So that's a big improvement.
- [18:23]
B
What other things do creators normally make mistakes on other than lighting, as far as the way that they look and sound? What are some things, some practical things that you can give us here today that can help people now maybe with their current setup, things that they. They're doing?
- [18:38]
A
I think you need to look at the background and almost treat it as. Treat us two elements. Look at your set like, as in like, am I framed properly? Because that's one of the other mistakes I see a lot is people just slap the camera up, it's probably too high and then we're getting all this distortion from the furniture behind them. So if you got like vertical wood panels, like you got some vertical stuff in the background. If they're not straight, people see that straight away. So it's. If you've got furniture, you need to get the camera at the right height so the furniture doesn't get distorted. You need to look at your framing. Go like, I got a space on my left, I got a space on my right. How can I balance this framing nicely? Like do I need to put a bit of art one side and then balance it out with a nice house plant? And then that's the most easy, easy win to me is in like you've got the gear, you've got the furniture. You've probably just got the camera in the right wrong position and a quick hammer on the wall. Reposition that photo artwork and it will look a lot better.
- [19:35]
B
I interrupt this interview just for a few seconds to tell you about our offerings. We offer one on one coaching that's personal with me where I sit down with you and you can ask me questions. I do a deep dive on your channel. I also offer just a smaller channel review. And then we also offer a great mastermind group that you can pay a few dollars to get into. We do monthly mastermind calls. We're going to start doing calls hosted by other members of the group. And it's just a great place to kind of rub elbows with other creators. So if that's interesting, definitely check that out. But everything that we offer and have to provide to you is down below in the show notes. Thank you guys for listening. Now back to the show. What's a rule of thumb for that, James, as far as where you should be placed in the frame, because a lot of my coaching clients, I'll go watch some of their videos. And we did a watch along this month where the creators in our Mastermind group, we watched five minutes of one of their videos that they submitted. And a lot of the people in these videos, it was an easy fix because I said, hey guys, it, this looks strange.
- [20:34]
A
You're.
- [20:34]
B
You're kind of sitting off to the right, you know, quadrant, and there's nothing filling that space. So what's a rule of thumb of where should we be in the frame? Because right now on the podcast, I always center myself, right. I just do a center frame, try to keep my head up here. That way it's kind of aligned where the guest, you know, is. So what is the rule of thumb for that?
- [20:55]
A
Every camera does have like a grid that you can get open. So there's a three by. A three by three grid. That's the one that I would recommend people turn on. And then you want to get your eyes on that upper line. That should then give you enough of like a couple of inches spare of headroom. You don't want your hair to be cropping above the. The frame. And you want to. Ideally, you don't have to, but I think this definitely helps a lot is have it far enough back where you can show your hands a lot more. Because hand gestures on camera just make you look a bit more confident. If you've got a desk in shot as well, it gives you somewhere to place your arms and then relax more. And if you've got an iPad you need to take notes on, you're doing like an overhead view at the same time, then it can link naturally that way. So, yeah, it's more about like getting that grid open, getting yourself. Yeah, I'll always say dead center. But if you look at Ed's latest. Not his latest videos, his videos for the past, like couple of years, he's actually been framing himself off center at an angle now. And that's. That was just a happy accident, to be honest, when he did that. And it works for him because he's got his laptop in front of him, so it still balances the shot well because we're still seeing a central, you know, combination of him and the laptop in frame. And he's balanced it well because he's got a light either side on the wall behind him, like the wall lights. So it all works that way. But yeah, most people just probably don't get their framing right. And that is the, the simplest thing to fix straight away.
- [22:30]
B
Let's, let's talk audio now. I'm an audio snob. I'll go ahead and admit that to you, James. I, when I listen to a podcast, if it does not sound the way that I think that it should, it bothers me. So can we talk audio now?
- [22:45]
A
Yes, audio is, is important still, but it may not be as important as it was maybe a couple years ago because I use through all my recordings now. I run my audio. When I come to exporting, I export an audio track and then I run that through Adobe Podcast Enhancer. I don't know if you've used that at all or tested it, but for me, that definitely gives me the polish that I need. I'm not saying I don't have good mics. I've got the, the rode nt one a there for my calls. I, I use a Sennheiser MKE 600. This one. People should definitely invest in this one if they can. And it's cheap for a Sennheiser mic. And the best thing about this mic is you don't have to use an xlr. It's also battery powered. So rather than having to use an XLR lead, which can be a pain because then you've got to record the audio separately, you can then just plug this directly into your camera through the 3.5 millimeter jack and still get proper, proper audio as long as you're positioned that correctly. That still needs to be if I'm instead of being there, like literally just out of frame if you're going to be using one. But yeah, most people obviously still like that look of the Shure SM7B for some reason. So I'm still always navigating that with client builds because they, they like the look of the, the Shure mic. Okay, you do realize that isn't ever designed originally for YouTube, but we can
- [24:10]
B
do it still coming from my background of doing voiceover work for almost well over a decade now, I have tons of microphones. I have the Shure SM7B. It's somewhere back there right now. I'm using a Newman microphone. That probably cost me way more than I would like to admit. And I also have a lapel microphone. I, I have, have the DJI, the one that clips on people, you know, on YouTube. They're always clipping it on their hat or putting it on a spoon and using it as a microphone, which I think is amazing. I love that that has become a thing on YouTube. But I think that Audio is almost as important as video. I think if people come on your video and they can't hear you and they can't understand you, then it doesn't matter. And so I really appreciate you kind of leaning into that. Now let's talk about storage and systems and things of that nature. You're going to be recording all this footage. What are your opinions on setting up an ecosystem on the back end, things that people don't see in your studio? What are your recommendations for all that stuff?
- [25:10]
A
I personally, I don't do anything like a NAS drive. I don't, I don't store it offline. I just use.
- [25:17]
B
He's rolling off screen right now as we speak, picking it up.
- [25:20]
A
I just have a handful of the, you know, the solid state little sandisk drives. These are so fast, so good, and I've never had any issues with them, so I've always got one connected to there. In terms of filing, though, you just got to get a good file system set up from the off. So as soon as I open a new premiere project, it's already got folders set up for export, thumbnail audio clips, links, so it's just completely ready to go. I know exactly where the filing is because there's nothing worse than getting overwhelmed. And you're like, I want to get a video out and my desktop's a complete mess. So storage is definitely something I'm used to because it's built into me from my graphic design background anyway, where everything's got to be clean. We work in agencies where we're sharing files all the time, so it needs to be. If I'm ill that day, someone needs to pick up that work and continue it when I'm off work.
- [26:13]
B
So, yeah, it was drilling from the off. Simple as getting a few external hard drives. Unfortunately, we're living in a time where external hard drives are uber expensive.
- [26:24]
A
Yeah.
- [26:24]
B
With AI gobbling up all of the, the, the compute power and all of these hard drives, it might be a little more pricey now than it used to be. But, yeah, that's the best way to do it. You know, I use Google Drive, you know, because people can very easily navigate that interface. And so when I'm working with sponsors or other collaborators on a video or a podcast, the Google ecosystem is kind of, kind of what I use. So I completely agree with you. There's.
- [26:51]
A
And if they need, if you need to save file space as well and you still want high quality, most modern cameras will have a lower 4k option, which still looks amazing for YouTube you don't have to shoot in the top, top tier settings. You know, for YouTube stuff they're there for filmmakers, but for YouTube, no one's gonna know. I know TV content's getting consumed a lot more nowadays from YouTube but a lot of people still watch it on their mobile too. And nobody is going to be, you know, still people are uploading in 1080 so it's not even, it's not even really a debate yet about, you know, do I need to record in the best settings? So you can definitely cut the file sizes down by like 2/3 by going to a lower setting.
- [27:34]
B
Right. The next question that I do want to ask you is about monetization. So you have this channel now, you are an expert at studio setup. What are ways that you are monetizing and on average, you know, how much money can you make from your creator business now? And can you break down the different buckets?
- [27:54]
A
Of course, yeah, obviously there's, there's ad revenue from YouTube but that is not really the thing that I'm focusing on because I did lose my, my ad revenue amount my, my partner program because I wasn't uploading enough content. So my watch hours dropped. But then I managed to release a video recently. Well, recently the TV background one with AI and that shot my watch hours straight up past the 4,000 requirements. So I'm back in the program. But nothing figures wise to talk about there. That's like currently at 20, 20 pounds or something. So nothing big there. But in terms of what the channel has allowed me to do, it's allowed me to generate thumbnail clients where I can charge a, a decent amount for. We're talking about 300 pound per thumbnail video. So I will still do about, not 18 different concepts but we'll have like a good handful of three concepts. Maybe we'll try 18 or so different text variations. Because since the A B testing came about, we need to have complete flexibility now to change a thumbnail if it's not performing. So I've got a good couple of client relationships there where we've been doing that for a couple of years. And then in terms of studio work, I've got multiple levels of what I offer and they can range from, you know, like a 500 pound entry level studio session all the way up to 5,000 pounds plus for a, a full studio build where I'll come out and I'll set up the studio for you. And that's for like people that have, you know, they want to get going as quickly as possible. They don't want to have to learn camera settings, they don't want to learn nowhere to put the lighting, they just want it done. And that's why I'm tired of targeting the experts in the field that they're in, because we know that they're going to have money, they got the knowledge, they don't need to learn about camera gear, they just want to get going and look good on camera. And that's where I come in and help them. So the 5,000 pound plus ones are the full studio builds. It can be worldwide, I can, I can fly out if I need to, but in terms of local ones, yeah, I've gone around, all around the country, south, north Cornwall, Manchester, and I've got some, some really good case studies coming out soon on channels that I've set up, some pretty big channels where I've kind of transformed them from a green screen background into something that looks proper now. And it's just going to elevate their content and their positioning in their niche. And so, yeah, I've got, I've got buckets. In terms of the entry level, one would be I can use photos and stuff that they would send me and I can use my skills as a photographer and film guy from my past history and I use that along with AI and together with my knowledge of how to prompt the AI and what I'm looking for from an image and from the room, I can get AI to generate a good looking image to show them what's actually possible in their room that they were kind of not even considering. So, like, one I did last week, for example, is a. It ended up shooting at an angle that we had never even considered because AI helped me see the vision that I was kind of trying to describe to it and that's really powerful. And that's like my latest video, it's called the Studio Vision Audit and it's my entry level tier. But it can provide so much value because you've now got almost like this visual to copy and it's like, right, so based on that I know that I need to get that sort of furniture position, the light, this sort of area. And if they need help, that can then be upgraded, like a blueprint plan where I can kind of guide them where the light should be. And then there's also, yeah, the done for you builds. All they're done for you where I come out and help you build it. So that can be remotely or it can be in person as well.
- [31:44]
B
And so that's really the business that you're building, right is you're providing the free content on YouTube to what I call confirm the expertise. And then once people watch a video and a light bulb goes off, they're like okay, I don't want to go through all this myself. I just want James to do it for me. And they either hire you virtually which is your 5, 600 pound, you know, I don't know what the conversion is to US dollars but it's you know, a few hundred bucks where you basically get on a call, you get some photos and you kind of do it virtually and then you have one that's a little more pricey and then you have one that's five, six grand right where you go out on location. So you're building the freebie up and your call to action is these high ticket items. Can you talk about has how YouTube has allow you to basically do this and run it. I mean you never did answer the question but on average how much are you earning now that you're about six, eight months into this?
- [32:35]
A
Typically it's a, excluding the thumbnail work because that's just constant. Anyway, I might be lucky to get a studio build a month now because it's, it's quite a high ticket thing and it's quite new. So it's in the early stages. But I've got a good handful of case studies now that I, I'm ready to share and it's just going to start going up and up from there and yeah, so a good average month for me would be anywhere from five to 7,000. It could go higher and it could go lower a lot. Also depends on how much thumbnail work I get as well. But it's mainly the studio builds that I'm trying to aim for nowadays.
- [33:12]
B
And I think the power of what you're doing is that you're at the, you're at the ground level making that amount. You're only going to go up once you bring the proof of concepts, once you do the case studies, once you get a better landing page which as a YouTube consultant that's where if I was working with you I would say okay James, you know, you got this calendly link, you know that that's, that's doing all the work for you. But man, if you had a, you know, and I'm sure Ed's told you this but if you had a nice running sales page, lead magnet, whatever, I think that you, your sales would instantly 3 to 5x within literally that next month. So I think there's, there's levers that you can pull really quickly and efficiently that can help your, the how much money you make go up tremendously. Now you mentioned thumbnail. You answer this question quickly. I have a lot of people in our mastermind group and people ask me all the time, how much money should I be paying for a thumbnail? You said you charge what about 300 per individual thumbnail?
- [34:08]
A
Yeah, it's, it got a bit, the lines got a bit blurred when YouTube introduced the AB testing because then I would be like, wasn't sure how to position myself because I was charging, I think at the time when the AB came about, I think I was charging 275 pounds to my main client and, or 200 pound. And because of the A B testing we worked out like, hang on, if you want three variations of different concepts, I can't, I can't give you, I can't charge you 600 pound for a thumbnail for one video. So as long as the concepts stay within, you know, I can do them in a relatively good amount of time and they're not vastly different concepts, then yeah, I'm happy to charge that, that one video cost per. And it doesn't matter how many variations of thumbnails then, within reason. But yeah, it's problem is like I'm, I'm putting myself at the top and whoever gets in touch with me about thumbnail work, I say, look, I'll be honest, I'm not a cheap option. But I am coming from experience working with Ed for years, working with hundreds of ED students, working as a designer, a photographer. I know what composition looks good and stuff. You can go with someone cheap, you know, from a different country where it might only be like a fiverr option, where it's only like 15 pound a thumbnail or something, but you ain't going to get good results. We're not. You might get okay results.
- [35:32]
B
You're going to get what you pay for. And I found that basically when hiring editors, when hiring thumbnail artists, if you want to do this the right way and someone may hear 300 and think, well, I can't afford that. Well, you can't now.
- [35:44]
A
Yeah.
- [35:44]
B
But eventually if you want to get to where you want to get and looking at, you know, James, his thumbnails and Ed's thumbnails and the ones that, that you've worked on, they're top tier. And it's not like you're just staying status quo. You look at what's working on YouTube, you do the research, you do the due diligence it's not like you're using your graphic design background and just saying, oh, I'm good at that. No, you're looking at what, what works and applying that. So I, I absolutely love that. James, you've been an amazing guest. The last question I have for you is this. It's. It's less about studios, you know, set up and optimization, and more about just YouTube in general. You know, tens of thousands of creators listen to the show every single week. What would you say to them wherever they are in their journey? Some of them haven't even started yet. Some of them are frustrated because they can't get over a certain milestone. Some of them are trying to monetize. You know, they're all different, you know, versions of where creators are in the spectrum. What bit of advice would you give the listeners today as we leave?
- [36:42]
A
I mean, I feel for you. I, I was in that boat for many years. The struggle to even get a hundred subscribers was intense. And to get a thousand was like, oh my gosh, we've done it. To get monetized was a great feeling. So it just takes like, I, and I've proved it with the video from a couple months ago. It just takes one good idea and you can get monetized in an instant. You've got an idea that's fresh. Like that video led to eight studio calls all asking about, how do you do that TV background idea? So much so that, like, I use that now as my set. So my background is now a tv and I use AI to help me generate different studio looks. And I like them so they match accordingly. But that idea only came about from testing different things. And you'll eventually find your, you know, your passion and your niche, and that is where you just got to go all in on. I've tried it with the product commercial stuff, but now I know that, okay, I, I'm. I love helping people and I love helping people with stuff that I know, which is lighting and camera gear. And so lean into whatever is your passion and you should get success if you, you know, there's always that can keep consistent. I'm not consistent and I need to be, but I'm not. And I, I kind of prove that. You, you do, but you don't need to be consistent as in, it just takes one idea, a title that might work. So that title, it had two key things in it that was the key to it being successful, which was it had the word new in it, so people knew it was new news. And it had with AI so it had those two things like, okay, there's something with AI and it's new, I want to see what it is. And yeah, there's, there's one going around at the moment that I'm going to be using in the next couple of videos saying it's boring but X. So like having boring in the title at the moment is something that people should test as well because that is a very, very trending thing at the moment.
- [38:38]
B
So I think a good point to close on there is, you know, just what I said with the thumbnails. You are looking around the YouTube space and Ed talks about this all the time. You're looking around the YouTube space and you're seeing what's working because it, it's not always going to be the same thing. You know, I do, I do tutorials on my main YouTube channel and have for almost 16 years now. What worked then does not work now. You know, back in the day you could put step by step or you could put full guide. Now people want to see like 20, 26 or the year. Like you have to know and be in tune with what's working. Not number one in your space, but outside of your space as well. So again, check out James over on his YouTube channel. It's just James Kelly, man, you're one of the best in the biz in regards to studio setups and looking good on camera. So I'm just so glad I was able to lock you down and have you on the podcast. And my friend, I appreciate you very much and we'll talk to you later.
- [39:30]
A
Thanks so much, Dusty.
- [39:31]
B
And that's a wrap on this week's episode of the Creators Hub podcast. I hope you enjoyed that conversation. Just, it was a wonderful conversation and if you are even thinking about in the future going full time as a creator or as an entrepreneur, this show is so valuable. Don't forget to check the show notes for everything that we offer creators. Everything from our mastermind group, YouTube channel reviews and audits, and one on one coaching with me. And then lastly, I want to mention my email newsletter, the Entrepreneurs Minute. If you're looking at behind the scenes of what it takes to run a business like mine, definitely check that out. And then we have a running list of all the tools mentioned here on the show in a spreadsheet and that is linked down below as well. See you guys next week.