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- [00:00]
A
Hello everyone and welcome to this week's conversation on the Creators Hub podcast. I'm joined today by Spencer Scott Pugh. He is a Roanoke based creative and product tech Reviewer. He spent 10 years in marketing and advertising before going independent to focus on his own brands. Spencer and the more editorial form and function which is his YouTube channel. He's a husband, father of two, a man of faith who cares about craft, family and doing good work with good people. Good, that all sounds wonderful to me. Spencer, how you doing today?
- [00:32]
B
Good. How are you? Dusty?
- [00:34]
A
Doing fantastic. I stumbled upon one of your videos when I was doing some research on a product that I was looking to buy and I watched the video all the way through and this happens occasionally where I will watch a video, I'll go to the person's channel and I'll say to myself, I've got to have them on the podcast. I reached out to you, we made it happen and I'm really looking forward to this conversation. The name of your YouTube channel is just your name, right? Spencer Scott Pugh. But you also have have form and function, which is more kind of the brand umbrella for everything. So we'll talk about that for sure. Can you give my audience a brief story of the origin of the channel? How did you come to be a creator?
- [01:16]
B
Wow, that's long. I would say. I started on YouTube in 2009. I'm a musician so I was doing music covers and you know, through college I had a band and I was exploring video photography, web design. And then you know, after college, after the ban days, I was just really into to brand building and those things as well. Video photography, web design, branding, social media, which led me into a marketing career which I really enjoyed. And I, I had my own business doing social media content for local companies. And when I started that, I started my main channel, Spencer Scott Pugh and it was at first just about what I was doing, like building a business and social media and tips and tricks. And then I started to explore more of the concepts of minimalism and journaling and things like that. And I had a bullet journal video that did really, really well. And it brought In I think six to 10,000 subscribers off of like a, like maybe two videos. And that's sort of how this main channel started. And then after a while, you know, I'm, I'm running, you know, a 9 to 5 job, but this kind of fun thing on the side. Brands started reaching out, started working with them probably about 2024. I sort of said like I need to niche down in Some way, like I would do a journaling video and then I would review a product like a smart ring. And my audience was a little confused. So I sort of put my foot down and said like, I love tech, I always have. And so let's start reviewing tech products. And since then it's bloomed a little bit outside of tech specific, but still very tech forward. And that sort of brings us up today for Spencer Scott Pugh. That's, you know, I work with brands and create content reviewing their products. And the more I was working with brands, I started to work with some brands that just, I don't know, I held a higher regard for. They were like really intentional with their product design and what they were trying to build and solve a specific problem in the market. And I wanted a place to put those products and sort of put them on a pedestal. So form and function was born out of that idea of, I mean, it's very on the nose, you know, products that are, you know, that beautifully marry form and function. So that's sort of a side brand, which I'm sure we'll get into here in a minute. But that sort of brings us up to how those two brands started and where they are now, if that makes sense.
- [03:33]
A
So I'm going to focus more today on the YouTube channel and kind of how you marry the two together. This is your full time gig. I asked you before we got started, so you are doing this full time now. When you made that decision to niche down, what was the determining factor? Because a lot of people ask me on coaching calls, they'll say, well, am I trying to target the right audience or is it too broad or is it too narrow? How did you decide? Okay, because you had some success with the bullet journaling and the analog style videos. What, what was the turning point for you where you were like, okay, I understand that I may have more success short term with this, but long term I know I'm going to enjoy doing the product reviews more.
- [04:16]
B
Hmm. I would say I kind of, I feel like I've done things differently than most people would suggest. Like I love tech products, so it's not like I'm making content around something I don't love. But I think from early on I had a 9 to 5 job. You know, I'm married, I have two kids. And so from the start, especially in talks with my wife, it was like, if I'm going to put time and effort into something that's not my 9 to 5 job and is sort of taking away some from my Family, it needs to make money, it needs to be helpful for the family. Hobbies are fine, but you know, with video editing and things, these things can take time. And so when I, I think I had one video I did with a brand called Ultra Human, they make a smart ring and it was not paid, they just sent me the product. This was like one of the first like kind of bigger brands that I worked with. And I said before the call I'd be an open book. So within the year of that video going live, I think I made four videos for them and it drove over like $280,000 in sales for them in the year. And so I got, you know, 10% kickback on that. And that was sort of where it clicked where like I can make money doing this. And it's not about YouTube AdSense, it's about working with a brand. And because I had come from marketing and advertising background, I was like, I have, I've been working with brands and you know, that was my 9 to 5 job working with brands and different companies and stuff. And so I actually, I would say I didn't focus on what most people focus on first, which is like building an audience and building like a group of people who share like, you know, like minded things and trying to build that up and then work with brands to monetize that audience from that sort of first successful brand deal that I did. I've been on the track of I work with brands to make content for them. My vehicle happens to be my YouTube channel and the audience has grown because of that, which, you know, it sounds like I don't want to serve my audience or anything like that, which I do. And I still have certain things I like to review over others. And I think people have sort of come around what I didn't enjoy reviewing. But that, that was the, that was the factor for me. It was like I need this to make money before I need to be famous or have a following and spend a lot of time on that. So that was long winded, but that's why I put my foot down. And then the tech space, especially like cutting edge tech, they have so much funding and they get, you know, all these resources to invest into affiliates or marketing and advertising dollars. And so I just found it to a great space to make a good amount of money while doing something really fun that I love.
- [06:50]
A
I think that's the perfect answer and it's very relevant to most listeners because they may be in a situation like you where yes, they want to start a YouTube channel. But they do need to have at least enough to cover their cost of doing it, whether it be their time commitment or whatever it may be. You had a family and so you obviously had to replace what would eventually become, you know, the full time gig from what your day to day job was, which I love that answer. That was very transparent and honest. Now let's talk about the YouTube side of things as far as the video creation goes. What does your process look like from start to finish, from ideation to upload? What does that look like for you?
- [07:30]
B
Yeah, well, I think trying to be helpful of your audience and aware of maybe what questions they might have for a while. I would come home from my lunch break, I would have been sent a product. I grabbed it off the porch, I would go into my basement, I would unbox it on camera, I would sort of just kind of give my first impressions or why I was excited about it. Maybe I'd have a few talking points from the brand. I would stop recording, I would go edit, you know, for an hour or so and then I would publish it. And it was a very, again, trying to be conscious of my time, of the time of the companies that I was working for. I didn't want to take too much time away from them or any time obviously. And so it was a very quick like trying not to be perfect, trying to be as, as good quality as I can on behalf of these brands. But it was very much like a quick turnaround kind of thing. And you know, when I went full time, that allowed me to say, okay, I can take more time with this, I can actually work on scripting, I can work with editors. And I think hiring an editor was huge, which a lot of people will say. But currently it usually works. We get a ton of ins bound emails so there's a lot of negotiating. I'd say 90% of my time is talking with and working with brands. Like I'm on camera very little, which I actually love. I love the business side. So yeah, I'll, I'll negotiate with the brand, I'll get the deal, the contract signed, they'll send over the brief. I'll usually take the brief of their product, which is all just kind of factual and what they're trying to market. And then I'll sort of mash that up with my own personal thoughts of the product. I'll sit with it for a week or two, I'll test it out, send the script to the brand, they'll sign off on it. Then I go into, you know, filming, I Have a guy who shoots all my B roll for me. So I'm really just on a roll camera. Then I send a roll and B roll off to my editor. He edits, sends me the first draft, I send it to the brand to get the sign off. Once everything's good there, upload, publish and move on to the next one. Really.
- [09:29]
A
So I love your thumbnails because they're so simple. It's just the product. And I think something I've been preaching lately is, is with thumbnails and packaging is keeping the visual focus to one central thing. And I think for you being a product reviewer, you've really honed in the skill of okay, here is the product. It is at the center of this video. I want to make sure I give you and deliver on what I'm advertising with this packaging. Can you talk about maybe the evolution of your packaging style over time and why you do what you do and use the, you know, have thumbnails the way that they are?
- [10:05]
B
Yeah. So I would say when I first started getting into, you know, reviewing products and that became like the main thing that I was doing. I really love a YouTuber named Ollier. He goes by Ultralinks. And he always just had these beautiful, just photos of the product he was talking about. And I always thought that was so sick. And I was like, I want to do that. And I would, early on I would do that and the click through rate would be terrible. And so I was like, you know what, I need to give and take here a little bit. Maybe I'll do the usual. So I went through a phase where I was doing the whole like, ah, surprised face, holding out the product. I went through a phase where I was kind of like making the product large, you know, using Canva to really highlight the product, but also have like the face there, which is great. And that the click through rates were great on that. So I stuck with that for a while. But I think I got to the point where enough brand deals were coming in where like I was making the money that I liked. And so I was like, let me kind of pull back and make this what I want it to be because, you know, once you're established more, you can kind of do what you want. It becomes your style. People expect that, they look for it. Brands hire you on because they like your style. Right. So I got to the point where I could pull back on the whole flashy YouTube click here. But at the same time, no matter how famous I get, I guess at some point my face will matter. And people will be like, there's that guy. I want to watch his video. But to your point, I, you know, what I'm doing is reviewing a product. Someone's searching for a review of that product. They don't know me. They don't care about me. They might want to hear someone else's opinion. Yes. And that's the whole review side of things. But it's about the product. And so I want to make it shine for the brand. I want to put it in a good light. And then I also, yeah, I want someone to be like, there's the thing I'm looking for, and it's that simple. So that's sort of how it's evolved over time.
- [12:00]
A
What's something along the way where you failed or something that you've looked at and you've said to yourself, man, I wish I would have known that sooner. You know, getting to where you are now, you know, to where you can do this full time, you can hire editors. You've obviously had to, you know, there's ups and downs, you know, unless you're the anomaly, which there are those creators out there. But can you maybe talk about the lessons learned from mistakes that you've made?
- [12:26]
B
Yeah. So I think probably the one that's really hitting me right now was there was a smart, wearable brand and they reached out. You know, I had checked them out very briefly, but I was like, this is cool. My audience tends to like wearables. It's a trendy thing in the market, like a health tracker, basically. And so I was like, cool. And I negotiated with them, got a rate that I liked, and I was about to start working on the video, and I was chatting about the brand with my buddy who's also a YouTuber, and he was like, hey, just so you know, like, there's talk about this brand on, like, Reddit, and it's not good things. And I was kind of like, well, I've already signed with them and it'll be fine. Like, I'm making it for the brand. And I went ahead and posted the video, and then I was getting comments saying the same thing on the video, basically, like, the brand was kind of funny. They just sort of took the product from AliExpress or somewhere and, like, rebranded it and sold it for a ton more. They had, like, fake doctors listed on their website. So, like, really not great stuff. And I think, like, that was just a point where it was like, you know, I've never. I've never been sort of audience first. I make Videos for brands. But there's a certain amount of due diligence that I need to do. And so I would say that was kind of a mistake on my part. And I always like, look for like the silver lining or like the, the best parts of a product because again, like I'm trying to help a brand get their product out there. And even with some of these products that like I don't love, I can usually find like who I think it would be for or the best selling points or, you know, that kind of thing. And I think in working with brands there is a lot of they might not want you to say something. And I know a lot of creators will say like, I'm going to say what I want and up front I'm going to the brand that. And if I hate the product, like, you know, and I've, I've just never been in that thing where like I'm, I'm gonna bash a product if I don't like it or something. Like, I always try to find a good angle for the product, you know, as I'm working with the brand. But I do think, and that's the reason again, form and function came about like relationships that are deeper with brands, I can explore them better and I really want to promote those brands. But that would, that would be the mistake is doing a little bit more research, especially with working with brands, which is hard, especially if you're doing like we're doing two videos a week on average. So I'm working with a lot of brands all the time. And to take a ton of time to deep dive for everyone is, I guess, my responsibility. But at the same time, like, I don't know, it's my YouTube channel and I could start talking about slime if
- [14:58]
A
I wanted to interrupt this conversation just briefly to tell you about our services for creators. First off, we have a mastermind group. Five or ten bucks gets you in the that group. You get to rub elbows with other creators. You get our exclusive mastermind call monthly. We do creator hosted calls. We do hot seats. I also offer channel reviews and audits that I do myself. That's very inexpensive way to get another set of eyes on your channel. And then obviously I offer one on one creator coaching if you're interested in taking it to the next level. So don't forget to check those out. And now back to the show. Speaking of brand deals and communication in relationships that way, that's obviously one of the main ways that you monetize being a product review channel. Can you talk about the handling of that and how important it is to do it the right way and build the relationship from the ground up the right way. Talk about how you, you know, how you land deals and make the most money possible within these brand deals.
- [15:55]
B
Yeah, I think that was the thing with that brand too. Just to sort of tie it in was I had had a favorable experience, like communicating with them and like, they were really excited. They showed a lot of interest in my channel and it was like a good relationship. It's on me to kind of check people and I tend to give people the benefit of the doubt and I trust people very easily, which maybe I shouldn't. But yeah, I think it comes down to, I would say, like the biggest thing, especially if you're just starting out or if you have a big audience. You don't know how to monetize, you don't know your worth. People are always just like, know your worth. But like, how do you know your worth? And I think time is a thing. Trial and error. Like when you're getting to a point where you can say no, that's really powerful. Because even if a brand comes at you with a really high price tag, to be able to say no to them is powerful. To be able to pick and choose is powerful. But that only comes over time, you know, especially if you're trying to make a living out of this or if you were like me and you've like agreed with, you know, your spouse or something, like, I'm only going to spend time on this if it's helping out the family and making money or something, then every brand deal needs to be lucrative for you. And so you might be taking a lot of things that maybe you don't love. And you might be saying yes to smaller amounts of dollar than you think you're wor because you're just trying to make it work for you. I would say there's a lot of. I would always recommend. YouTube is such like a full business thing, especially in my sort of vein of YouTube. Like, I'm working with brands a lot, so I have to be good at negotiating. I have to be able to talk and communicate well. I have to price myself well in the market. I have to know what other people are doing. There's so much more to YouTube and making money from it than just I like making and uploading videos. There's nothing wrong with that. Which we could go down that rabbit hole. But I think there's a lot you can learn from business books and selling and marketing. And nowadays there's even people like Justin Moore who are like, this is how you do YouTube business. Right. So very specific to this niche of YouTube and running a business there. So the more you can learn about how to price well and how to, you know, give people options when negotiating and really sit in those deals. I think it does two things. I think it proves that you're serious about this to a brand. It builds the relationship. As much as you might be scared of the brand saying no to your price, most brands will be like, we can't do that. How about this? Or we can't right now. And usually they mean it. It's not just blowing you off. It's like, we don't have the budget this quarter. Sorry. But I've found a lot of times they come back the next quarter and they're like, we really liked how you went about negotiating with us and talking through that with us, and we want to work with you. So there's a lot of positives in negotiating beyond just trying to get more money out of a deal, if that makes sense.
- [18:43]
A
It makes a lot of sense. And I now want to transition into monetization and how you are making money in order to pay an editor and do this full time and support your family. Can you talk about the different buckets and then within this answer, do you mind walking us through? You mentioned a very good point in that previous answer where you talked about knowing your worth and you're like, you're right. How do you find that? Like, what? We need more people telling us, like, what Justin's doing. I've had him on the podcast a few times, and there's a lot of creators out there who are helping other creators figure this out. So let's talk about how you make money and then kind of walk down that path.
- [19:19]
B
Yeah. So I'd say the biggest thing is the brand deals themselves. So I'm at a point now where if a brand wants to work with us, sometimes there's outliers, but most of the time they pay a flat fee to have the video done or the content made. And then there's the affiliate side. So if. If we sell anything through our links, we get a kickback of that. YouTube pays us a little bit. Those are kind of the. The buckets, I would say they're in that order. So the most money we make are from the flat fee brand deal itself. And then it's affiliate stuff that compounds and builds over time. Like, we're still selling that smart ring that we originally did a video on. Way less than we did, but that.
- [19:59]
A
And are you. When. When you're negotiating these deals are the affiliate partnerships and the links and the amount that you're getting. Like, is all of this included in. In the negotiation? Like, can you talk about. Do you have some brands where you require them to pay more upfront? Because there will not be an affiliate partnership? Because I would believe the more evergreen of the making of money, where you, like you said you have that smart ring that you did a video on a while ago, you're still making money. Is that part of the negotiation?
- [20:29]
B
It can be, I think, the most helpful thing. And this is kind of. Since we both know Justin, a lot of. We'll go down a little bit of a tangent or rabbit hole here, but I think it's helpful. A lot of people will say, like, when you price someone or when you pitch, you want, like three options. And basically the middle one's, when you actually want. You might have a lower one where they don't get a ton. You have the high one, which is like, that would be awesome if they paid that. But the middle one's what you want. And I think it's less about that as it is showing a range of things you could do for a brand because it helps in negotiation. If they say, what does it cost to make a video? And you say, a thousand dollars, then it's. It's all down from there. They'll be like, well, how about five? 500? And then you're kind of like, well, shoot, I really like a thousand. So it's hard to, like, bring them back up to, you know, you can explain yourself and things like that. But if you give them a ton of things where they feel like they have a choice to choose one of the three, they'll usually come back and say, well, I like that in package three, your most expensive one, we definitely want that, but we don't need the rest. And a lot of times you'll find when you price it out that way you'll make way more than your flat rate, because you're able to speak to that. So as without overwhelming a brand, the more options you can play around with, usually the higher dollar you'll make per deal. Affiliate comes into that. So I've had brands say, like, hey, we can't pay the full rate for package three if we did a little bit less, but we increased your affiliate percentage, right? So there's. There's places to move and wiggle on both sides. Once you sort of present things in a good way, where they feel like they do have a choice and they have some power in this negotiation, but also, you know, you also have an equal amount of power, too. And again, I think that speaks to professionalism and the experience they have. And they felt they were able to pick and choose what they needed and what was best for them. They paid a little bit more than maybe they wanted to at first, but they got a lot more out of it. Right. So everything is negotiation territory and it's all about, you know, at the end of the day, do you feel you're getting a good deal? And they're getting a good deal as well.
- [22:36]
A
I also hear a lot of this. Well, my subscriber count isn't high enough yet, or I don't have the amount of views that will allow me to land sponsorships. Can you speak on that? As far as, you know, as recording of this podcast, you have right, over 44,000 subscribers, over 520 some odd videos uploaded. Is there a perfect time to start reaching out to brands and, you know, for creators listening to this episode, what advice would you give them as far as how timely they should be and at what stage in their journey should they start doing this?
- [23:16]
B
There's a lot of factors that go into that. I, I don't think there's. I mean, if you have one subscriber, you probably won't get a deal. But being a person, you have lots of connections. Unless you just stay in your room by yourself your whole life. Like, you've got friends, you've got family, you can pull together an audience, and you just have to show a brand the amount of value that audience has. I always give the example, if I had 500 newsletter subscrib and all 500 of them were Fortune 500 company founders, it doesn't matter that there's only 500. Like, brands would pay an arm and a leg to get in front of 500 Fortune 500 company founders. So you really have to think about it that way. And you're, you're pitching your audience. Like, a lot of brands work with us because they like our quality and we can negotiate a brand deal based off of, you're going to get a great video out of this. That's the, that doesn't have to do with the audience at all. Like, that's them getting a nice video about their product, which I think a lot of brands work with us because of that, because brands usually will look at the average video views over the past 90 days or something like that, and I have found they care more about that number if they're going for eyes on product than subscribers. I could have a hundred thousand subscribers, but If I'm getting 200 views per video, they're going to see that number and want to price based off that. So it's all about positioning. It's, you know, if, yeah, it's 200 people watching, but I know for a fact that they're this type of people. There's not like a perfect place to start, like you can start pitching brands before you even make your first video. I've literally talked to people who are like, I'm starting a YouTube channel like next month. I'm already pitching brands because they know what they're going to be aiming to do. Maybe they've done something similar in the past so they have the experience, they can speak to that even to say, like, I've been in marketing and advertising in 10 years, so I understand that lay of the land, I'm going to start something next month. It's going to be great. Here's everything I'm doing. Here's how I can promote your brand. Like, it's just a matter of doing your research on, on what you're able to offer. Now the caveat is again, if you're just talking about journaling and you know, for me, again, I came from the business side first so like I wanted to make videos for brands to get their product into the market, specifically on my platforms, but into the market and help them. So from the start my brand deals are that way focused for a lot of other people are just talking about something that they love. So let's say journaling. Their audience loves journaling and things like that. So you have to be wary of like if I just start putting 10 ads in every video, like that might drive people away. However, if it's helpful ads like here are pens that I like working with, you know, for journaling or here's the journals I would recommend. And you know, today's sponsor is this journal company. There's, there's tasteful ways of doing it. I'm very long winded with this stuff because I've thought about it a lot. But I don't think there's a right time to start. I think, I guess yesterday is a good time to start and getting the practice in getting the reps start pitching again. It's going to be a matter of how much time you have to pitch to brands and things like that. But it's, it's one of those just like get started, talk around to other creators, look at someone Like Justin Moore, who's trying to help other creators look at this podcast to get ideas. But don't like wait too long. Don't just only do research and then doubt yourself and like, well, I'm not there yet. Like getting your feet wet and just diving in is the best thing you can do.
- [26:42]
A
Yeah, I'm glad you're long winded because these are the answers that I think are the most helpful to the creators that listen to this show. I want to now talk about you are doing this full time, you have a family. What does the back end look like as far as systems you've put in place? What is your time management like as far as the running of the YouTube channel? How do you make sure that you are able to upload the two videos every week?
- [27:06]
B
Yeah, so I have an editor and I have kind of a B roll cinematographer. So as I mentioned before, a lot of my time is spent talking to brands and then once I have a script ready, I sit down for 20 minutes or less and I shoot the A roll. And that's really all I spend on the creation of the content. I send it off to my editor or I have the B roll guy send it off to my editor. That's done. Again, I communicate with the brand. When we're good to go, we, we upload. And so I think the big part for me is just making sure we're on schedule as much as we can be. Consistency is great, but I think there's like, to me there's like a sweet spot where some people get away with like one video a month and they make these masterpieces and they grow an audience because they just put so much time and effort. I feel like I couldn't stay on a project that long. So for me it's like as long as we get one out per week, we're good. And when talking with brands again, I'd say 90 to 95% of the videos we post are brand deals. So brands will be like, well the, you know, we're not ready to launch yet or you know, let's re edit this or we have to have a higher up watch at first. And so as much as we like to try to stay to a specific like Tuesday, Thursday posting schedule, it usually isn't that. And I have found usually if, if a brand's ready to go and I'm ready to go and the video's ready, I won't even like wait till a Tuesday or Thursday because I just feel like getting it out as soon as possible. One allows us to start working on other things. It just gets it out there. And YouTube's so great because of the searchability and the evergreen nature of things that to me, I haven't found. There's like a perfect time to upload as long as my audience gets it, you know. So, yeah, go ahead.
- [28:49]
A
And I was just gonna ask on the other side of that, are there ever times when you are dealing with burnout and how do you deal with situations where you might not want to upload that week or you're wanting to do something else, but you're working on a product that might not be as interesting to you? Are there things that you do to alleviate that?
- [29:05]
B
Honestly, I think the biggest help is having a team because they aren't burning out the same time you are. So you know, having someone be like, hey man, where's the video? You know, I need to edit it or. And then, and then having deadlines with brands, I mean it's, it's hard to just drag your feet on a project when a brand needs it out because they're launching next week. Right. So there's factors that you can build in outside of yourself that aren't dependent on your own. Like, is volition the right word to like get things done where that matters? The fact that this is my full time job and I'm providing for my family, like I don't have an option to just take a month off from creating. And I also just, I love again the whole business. The negotiation is like what gets me excited and get out of bed in the morning. Like when I wake up to five inbound, you know, two of them are really cool products and I'm like, wow, you know, I want to negotiate with them. I want to figure this out because I'd love to do that. So there's a certain excitement on that front. Yeah, I would say trying to build those things in. But I honestly the, the most help I had was having a team for sure.
- [30:10]
A
Yeah. Having people that can take the things that you may not be as good at or as interested in. Those two things are important to help you. Kind of like you said, not worry about the burnout. And when you are having to do it to provide for your family, that adds a whole new dimension of like, hey, yeah, a lot of people don't want to show up to their jobs this morning to their nine to fives, but they're doing it anyway. Right?
- [30:30]
B
Yeah.
- [30:31]
A
And so that is a different mentality. So I, in our mastermind group, our premium group that people, creators kind of hang out and we have mastermind calls. I give them the ability to ask questions to the guest each and every week. Sometimes we do it, sometimes we don't. But this week I want to ask you a question coming from David, from that group. He says, what common good advice, you know, so called good, right? In quotations, advice given to YouTubers hasn't work for you and your journey.
- [31:01]
B
Like a general thing people say to be.
- [31:03]
A
Yeah, like things that maybe, yeah, maybe the gurus say things that, that people think, you know, oh, that's what you have to do. As a, as a creator, I found this question interesting because people always say, well, on your thumbnails you got to put a shocked face or you got to do this or you got to do that. Right. I, when I heard this question and read it, I thought to myself, what are things like that where people would think would be common good practice that for me, in my case, I found it not to be the case.
- [31:30]
B
Yeah, I think there's a lot of those things I'm trying to think of, like the most helpful. And I, I do think the biggest one for me is like again, and I'm not like groundbreaking here, but I'm, I have found my way working with brands first. And I think at the start, as I, you know, people would say that's a sellout or you know, you're supposed to be on YouTube making content that's entertaining, but all you're doing is like you're just making commercials. But I think there's a joy I've found in making commercials. And again, coming from marketing and advertising, it's like, honestly, like my channel could be considered a marketing and advertising channel in a way because that's what I'm doing. And I think a lot of times people are like very wary of like how much you advertise to your audience and things like that. But I remember I put out a poll to my audience and I was like, man, I wonder if like they're getting tired of me just every video just being a sponsored video. And so I said like, what other types of content would you like to see? Would you like me to start interviewing founders? Cause I have all these relationships with founders. Would you like me to do more how to stuff? Would you like me to make more like editorial? You know, this is how I'm using my technology and stuff like that. Or just keep doing what I'm doing. And it was overwhelmingly just keep doing what you're doing. I think people come to my channel wanting to be exposed to New things. And it doesn't matter how I'm doing it or if I'm getting paid or not. Like, that's the value they're getting out of my channel is they get to learn about this new AI recording device or this new retro handheld. And like, that's what they wanted from me. And so I think because of the position I was in, where it was like, this needs to provide for my family first and foremost, I have felt good and comfortable with that being what I'm doing first and foremost. And so there's not like a right or wrong way to do YouTube and it can fully be just an enjoyable. I love making videos and I think those genuine channels can grow really well. There's definitely tips and tricks you can learn to get better at doing that, and you should. But yeah, it also depends on what your goal is with it, right? So having a blanketed general, this is what your thumbnail should look like. Who's seeing your thumbnails? Like, what are you trying to accomplish with your thumbnails? Like, there's. There's just so many things. And I think it is looking inward and saying, what am I trying to accomplish here? And then finding the best tips and tricks and best practices based on what your goals are with what you're building.
- [34:01]
A
That was exactly what I hoped you would say. Because I think that sometimes we get put into a box, right, as creators and, you know, you can only do what Mr. Beast does, right? Where you make these high, highly edited, very curated type videos. Where, you know, before it was like what Casey Neistat was doing, right, where he did these vlog style videos and he did such a good job of telling stories with such unique ways like making sounds. And there's a lot of creators birthed from that kind of generation of YouTube. But I think that understanding that it doesn't have to be done a specific way, you can be unique with actually that's what makes creators stand out. And that's why, you know, I think that if Spencer didn't come at his channel with the mindset of I'm making videos for brands first, his channel wouldn't work. But if he was kind of up in the air about that, where he was like, oh, I want to do some brand style videos, but I also want to grow, you know, and do it for the viewers, you couldn't do that. You couldn't be wishy washy about it. You have to kind of really land on one specific thing and what makes you different. Now that's going to really Lead me to my last question that I love. Kind of leaving the podcast with knowing that there'll be creators all in different phases of their journey, listening to this. What piece of advice, if any, would you give them kind of in conclusion today with this conversation?
- [35:18]
B
Yeah, I think kind of what we just spoke about, I think you need to sort of decide what you're trying to get out of YouTube. Are you trying to make money? Are you trying to build an audience that loves you and then you can monetize them? Are you. Are you in it for the fame? Are you in it for the money? Are you in it for the fun of making videos? Because based off what you're trying to achieve with it, and it could be all the above, but you have to sort of find your solid way of pursuing that. As you say, you can't be wishy washy. You can't be doing all sorts of different things. Once you decide, like, what you're trying to do with this, you can just go down that path and you can be yourself. And you can also be looking into best practices and things like that, you know, and then from there it's, you know, I think burnout comes or dropping something comes when you. You're not doing what you want to be doing. Or maybe you haven't decided fully what you want to be doing. You're just trying new things, but that's also a best way of finding out what you want to be doing. So, yeah, it's just such a great, explorative, creative place to figure out what you want to do. And maybe the answer is you don't want to be doing it. Maybe you just loved the idea of doing it, or you watched Casey Neistat and said, I want to be that, but you don't. You know, you watch Mr. Beast and you're like, he's famous, so I'm gonna do what he does. But you don't enjoy doing what he does. Right? So that's never gonna work either. So, yeah, finding what you want and then researching within that how to be the best at what you're trying to do.
- [36:50]
A
Absolutely. Spencer, you have been phenomenal. Thank you so much for agreeing to come on the podcast and share your knowledge around your creator journey. A lot of great topics talked about and discussed today, but I'll have everything of Spencer's linked in the show notes, as I always do. Don't forget to check out all the things that we here at Porter Media offer creators here and check those out down below. And Spencer, we'll talk to you later.
- [37:14]
B
Awesome. Thanks, Dusty.
- [37:15]
A
And that's a wrap on this week's episode of the podcast. I hope you enjoyed that conversation. If you did and you are not subscribed, whether it be on your podcast player of choice or over on YouTube, if you prefer to watch the video version of the show, do so. It's absolutely free. Don't forget to check the number of things that we have as far as offerings for creators, one on one coaching, YouTube channel reviews, mastermind group. All of that will be linked down below. With that said, if you know someone who you think would be a great fit as far as a creator to have on this podcast, please send me an email dustyustyporter.com and with that said, we'll talk to you guys next week.