Podcast Summary: 10% Happier with Dan Harris

Episode Title: A Radical Buddhist Antidote for Anxiety

Guests: John Makransky & Paul Condon

Release Date: November 24, 2025

Episode Overview

In this episode, Dan Harris interviews John Makransky, Professor of Buddhism and Comparative Theology at Boston College and a Tibetan Buddhist lama, and Paul Condon, Associate Professor of Psychology at Southern Oregon University. They discuss their new book, "How Compassion Works," and introduce listeners to the concept of sustainable compassion training. The episode explores how compassion—not detachment or toughness—is a radical antidote to modern anxiety, burnout, and interpersonal conflict.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Case for Compassion

• Skepticism Around Compassion:
  Dan opens by sharing the common resistance people have to practicing compassion: "We want other people to be nicer. How do you make this attractive to a skeptical, time-starved audience?" (05:11)
• The “Sales Pitch” for Compassion:
  Paul argues that being compassionate is actually our natural state and increases well-being:

  "If we're really honest with ourselves, we feel better when we are being kind and compassionate.” (05:48)

• Compassion as Home:
  Both guests agree compassion is not a weakness, but a fundamental part of our being.

  "Compassion is one kind of expression of our fundamental being, or the depth of our being, or the ground of our being." – John Makransky (06:45)

2. The Science & Evolution of Compassion

• Attachment Theory & Evolution:
  Paul outlines how attachment theory explains that humans are evolved to seek out caring, supportive relationships not just from parents, but from communities:

  "Humans are specifically prepared to be in connection with multiple adults. Our capacity for pro-social behavior is rooted in the instinct to maintain proximity to compassion or care." (09:08)

• Scientific Studies:
  Reference is made to studies showing that infants consistently prefer warmth and benevolence, indicating a hardwired preference for compassion. (07:54)

3. What is Sustainable Compassion Training?

• Definition:
  Paul explains sustainable compassion as tapping into internal and external resources of care, such as memories of caring figures, to access an ongoing inner resource of compassion and well-being:

  "It's sustainable in that it's not something we're trying to self-generate... we're learning to tap into or bring out from our underlying natural state." (10:52)

• Relational Starting Point:
  The practice begins not with striving to be compassionate, but by recalling and inhabiting moments where one has felt cared for or loved, using that as a foundation for further practice. (13:15)

4. Guided Compassion Practice (Live Demonstration)

• John guides listeners in a brief, embodied compassion practice:

  “Come down from the thinking mind into the body... recall a simple, caring moment with another person or a pet... bring this to mind not just as a memory, but as happening right now.” (14:34)

5. Shifting the Framework (From Self-Help to Relational Practice)

• Difference from Traditional Approaches:
  John notes that modern Western practice often edits out the relational or refuge component that’s foundational in traditional Buddhism, reducing it to an individual self-help project:

  "We began with an understanding of ourselves as autonomous, isolated individuals... And that framework is not the framework successful practitioners of the Buddhist teaching have had ever." (18:58)

6. The Neuroscience of Compassion Practice

• Embodied Cognition:
  Paul brings in neuroscience findings that the brain simulates experiences vividly—when practicing loving-kindness or safety, the body reacts as if it's real:

  "We're actually simulating the experience as if it's happening now... and those relational practices help draw out these natural capacities for compassion." (22:41)

• Muscle Analogy:
  Practicing compassion repeatedly strengthens ease and readiness, just as exercise does for physical muscles.

7. Benefits of Receptive Compassion Practice

• Research Findings:
  Attachment priming (recalling secure relationships) leads to increased emotional regulation, patience, willingness to help, and a deeper narrative self-ease—"more than just feeling good." (26:06)

8. The Three Modes of Compassion Training

(Major Pillars of the Book’s Method)

• Receptive Mode:
  Begin by recalling caring moments or benefactor experiences (either actual or imagined) to feel safe and cared for.
• Deepening Mode:
  Progressively settle into a simpler, deeper layer of awareness, allowing the mind to relax into what is described as non-dual, foundational simplicity—accessing a state prior to self-other distinction.

  “Letting these qualities... help the mind and body to start to relax and settle so deeply that another level of consciousness... starts to emerge.” – John (31:20)

• Inclusive Mode:
  Once grounded, extend the sense of care and ease to include others, especially those we habitually react negatively toward.

  "We can sense that person... is not their entire being. There's a sort of deeper story to that person than just that simple action." – Paul (51:14)

9. Integrating Compassion Into Daily Life

• Start Small:
  Repeatedly engage with simple, caring moments—from a pet, nature, or a supportive memory—to access compassionate awareness throughout the day.

  “The practice that's most connecting for you right now... and you do it a lot throughout your whole day, in little breaks, little moments.” – John (45:54)

• Everyday “Benefactor” Moments:
  Paul describes noticing tiny, ordinary “benefactor” experiences (like seeing the sky or hearing a neighbor’s table saw) as opportunities to reconnect with ease. (48:37)
• Handling Conflict & Frustration (Inclusivity):
  Use compassion practice to see others, even difficult people, as more than their behavior—cultivating curiosity and holding both their humanity and one's own emotional reactions in warmth.

  "Other people do not bother us. What bothers us is the feelings in us that are triggered by them… what if we could be a profoundly healing holding environment for all of our feelings?" – John (52:30)

10. Compassion & Burnout

• Empowerment Beyond Reactivity:
  Compassion practice supports both personal resilience against burnout and more effective engagement with dysfunctional institutions:

  “This does not do away with the need for institutional changes... But we could find some empowerment by becoming more of a holding environment for all of our feelings that could empower us to challenge what needs to be challenged also in our institutions, but without so much reactivity and with more of a sense of sensing the humanity in everyone involved.” – John (53:38)

11. Compassion in the Face of Global Suffering & Injustice

• Dalai Lama Example:
  Dan recalls a meeting between the Dalai Lama and a frustrated activist, where the Dalai Lama insisted that compassion gives us full access to our mind's resources—“we have access to the full brilliance of the human brain and mind when we are not in the grips of hatred.” (54:43)
• Holding Environment as Agency:
  Both guests affirm that genuine, sustainable action comes from not being overrun by strong emotions, but by holding them in warmth and awareness.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “Our factory setting is compassion.” – Dan Harris (07:54)
• “Compassion is closer to what we really are... It is an expression of our true home.” – John Makransky (08:45)
• “We can then take more advantage of our own powers and our own capacities to then show up and respond to others and do things with more effectiveness. We can still draw upon the information of our reactions and emotions, but they're not so controlling of us.” – Paul Condon (55:58)
• “What's going wrong is that most people don't know how to be with their feelings. They only know two ways: either to reject them, or to fully act on them. But there's a third way... to become a profoundly healing, holding environment for them.” – John Makransky (56:54)

Timestamps for Major Segments

• [05:11] Why compassion as an antidote?
• [06:45] Compassion as the ground of being
• [09:08] Attachment theory and the roots of compassion
• [10:52] What is sustainable compassion training?
• [13:15] Relational starting point vs. individualized effort
• [14:34] Short, guided compassion meditation demo
• [18:58] Why the “relational” foundation matters in Buddhist training
• [22:41] Embodied cognition and simulating care in the mind
• [26:06] Research on attachment priming and emotional benefits
• [31:20] Deepening mode: entering non-dual simplicity
• [37:11] Infants, depth perception, and non-dual experience analogy
• [41:20] Simplicity as entry to non-duality
• [45:54] Integrating and sustaining compassion practice daily
• [48:37] Everyday benefactor experiences
• [51:14] Using compassion practice in conflict
• [53:38] Compassion, burnout, and institutional dysfunction
• [54:43] The Dalai Lama on compassion’s effectiveness
• [56:54] The “third way” of being with feelings

Final Takeaway

Makransky and Condon encourage re-imagining compassion not as a nice-to-have add-on, but as a birthright and foundational practice for resilience, happiness, and healthy relationships—grounded in both ancient spiritual wisdom and modern psychology. Their sustainable compassion framework offers a practical, accessible approach to healing personal and collective suffering and fostering courageous action in the world.

Further Resources

• Book: How Compassion Works
• Guided Meditation by Christiana Wolf: Available on danharris.com
• Weekly Live Meditation & Q&A: Tuesdays at 4 Eastern