Podcast Summary: "You Should Be Taking More Risks. Here’s How To Get Over Your Fear And Do It." | Sue Ashford

Podcast Information:

• Title: 10% Happier with Dan Harris
• Host/Author: Dan Harris
• Episode: You Should Be Taking More Risks. Here’s How To Get Over Your Fear And Do It. | Sue Ashford
• Release Date: March 17, 2025
• Description: Self-help for smart people. World-class insights and practices from experts in modern science and ancient wisdom. Hosted by veteran journalist and best-selling author, Dan Harris.

Introduction

In this episode of 10% Happier with Dan Harris, host Dan Harris welcomes Professor Sue Ashford, a distinguished faculty member at the University of Michigan's Stephen M. Ross School of Business. Sue is the author of The Power of Flexing: How to Use Small Daily Experiments to Create Big Life-Changing Growth. The conversation centers around overcoming fear to take risks, adopting a growth mindset, and implementing practical strategies for personal and professional development.

Flexing: Concept and Examples

Sue Ashford introduces the concept of "flexing," which deviates from the colloquial meaning of showing off. Instead, flexing refers to adopting flexible approaches to personal growth by integrating small, manageable experiments into daily life.

Sue Ashford [05:29]: "Flexing means that we can approach our lives and our growth in a flexible way, integrated into the lives we're living anyway, but also achieve growth to be the person we most want to be."

Examples of Flexing:

1. Personal Application: During hectic family gatherings, Sue implemented strategies to enhance her patience without adding extra burdens.
2. Professional Application: Leaders can adopt flexibility by trying new approaches, such as taking more frequent breaks or delegating tasks to reduce stress and improve effectiveness.

Growth Mindset vs. Performance Mindset

Sue delves into the distinction between a performance mindset and a learning (growth) mindset, drawing on the work of psychologist Carol Dweck.

Sue Ashford [13:30]: "A performance proved mindset is a very tense, structured, stiff, fearful mindset. And a learning mindset is a little looser. You feel a little more empowered because you know whatever comes your way, you're going to grow and learn from it."

• Performance Mindset: Focuses on proving one's abilities, leading to fear of failure and avoidance of challenges.
• Growth Mindset: Emphasizes learning and improvement, fostering resilience and openness to feedback.

Managing Fear and Anxiety

The conversation addresses how fear and anxiety can hinder growth by keeping individuals trapped in comfort zones.

Sue Ashford [12:57]: "Fear, anxiety, you know, these things we all live with and live by."

Mechanism of Reduced Anxiety with Growth Mindset:

• Confidence: Believing in the ability to grow fosters confidence to handle setbacks.
• Resilience: Learning mindset individuals recover better from failures, reducing overall anxiety.

Self-Compassion and Inner Scientist

Sue emphasizes the role of self-compassion in maintaining a growth mindset, distinguishing it from complacency.

Sue Ashford [29:28]: "Self compassion is not about letting yourself off the hook. It's about talking to yourself the way a good coach would talk to you."

Unleashing Your Inner Scientist:

• Treat personal growth as experiments.
• Implement small changes and observe outcomes.
• Example: Simon aimed to become more approachable by setting specific behaviors during meetings, such as sitting on the side of the table and smiling more.

Running Experiments: Choosing and Measuring Flexes

Sue outlines a framework for selecting and implementing flexes based on two primary motivators:

1. Pain of the Present: Addressing current challenges or behaviors causing discomfort.

   • Example: A woman recognized that her overly positive or negative expressions were disrupting team dynamics and sought to modulate her emotional displays.

2. Fantasies of the Future: Aspiring to embody future self-visions inspired by role models.

   • Example: Aspiring to emulate a respected CEO or parental figure.

Implementation Intentions:

• Specific Planning: Setting clear "if-then" statements to reinforce habit formation.
  • Example: "If I wake up on Sunday, then I will stand up and exercise immediately."

Sue Ashford [65:28]: "If you set intentions around the things you're hoping to achieve, you're much more likely to achieve them."

Feedback: Importance and How to Obtain It

Obtaining feedback is crucial for growth, yet often challenging due to fears of appearing insecure or facing negative responses.

Sue Ashford [39:05]: "People saw it more as a sign that you cared, not that you're insecure."

Strategies to Obtain Valuable Feedback:

• Ask for Advice Instead of Feedback: Research suggests that seeking advice can elicit more actionable and honest responses.

  • Example: "I need some advice on how I'm handling my approachability. How am I doing?"

• Diverse Sources: Gathering feedback from a variety of perspectives ensures a more comprehensive understanding.

  • Sue Ashford [46:47]: "It's always valuable just from an information averaging standpoint, but I think it's never been more valuable than it is today and will be in the future as organizations get more diverse."

Reflection and Emotion Management

Reflection is essential for internalizing experiences and learning from them. Sue offers practical methods for integrating reflection into busy schedules:

Sue Ashford [49:39]: "One person... writes in a journal every day for 20 minutes. When he gets up, he says, some people exercise for their body. This is an exercise for my mind."

Managing Emotions:

• Emotional Regulation: Controlling emotions like defensiveness, anxiety, and shame to remain open to feedback.
• Practical Techniques: Structured questions post-experience, journaling, or seeking coaching to navigate complex emotional responses.

Restorying and Savoring Successes

Restorying:

• Reframing Narratives: Changing the internal story about experiences to reduce negative emotions and enhance performance.
  • Example: Viewing a challenging colleague's questions as a sign of genuine interest rather than an antagonistic intent.

Sue Ashford [59:37]: "Restorying is just telling yourself a different story about it in the light of the fact that you don't know where truth lies."

Savoring:

• Positive Reflection: Taking time to appreciate successes and positive moments to build confidence and hope.

Sue Ashford [62:33]: "If you take time to savor successes, savor things that went well as well as look at things that didn't go well, you feel more empowered."

Interpersonal Effectiveness

Sue discusses teaching interpersonal skills to high-powered MBA students, emphasizing the importance of understanding assumptions, perceptions, and feelings (APF) in interactions.

Sue Ashford [67:57]: "Assumptions drive our perceptions. If I assume that my boss thinks I'm doing a bad job, I perceive his lack of communication as evidence of that and then I feel bad."

Key Skills Taught:

• Feedback Exchange: Exercises like "Flowers and Onions" where participants practice giving and receiving feedback.
• Self-Understanding: Recognizing how personal narratives and emotions impact interactions and leadership effectiveness.

Conclusion and Resources

Sue Ashford reiterates the importance of being interpersonally effective for leadership and personal success. She references her book and additional resources for continued growth:

• Book: The Power of Flexing: How to Use Small Daily Experiments to Create Big Life-Changing Growth.
• Additional Resources:
  • Jerry Colonna's Reboot – Emphasizing self-awareness in leadership.
  • Ego Free Leadership by Learning as Leadership – Focused on personal development for leaders.

Sue Ashford [78:36]: "The Power of Flexing is a set of ideas that are empowering and help people to grow to be the person they most want to be."

Final Insights:

• Growth involves continuous self-reflection and willingness to adapt.
• Flexing provides a practical framework for integrating growth into everyday life without overwhelming commitments.
• Embracing a learning mindset and self-compassion fosters resilience and sustained personal development.

Notable Quotes:

• Sue Ashford [05:29]: "Flexing means that we can approach our lives and our growth in a flexible way, integrated into the lives we're living anyway..."
• Sue Ashford [13:30]: "A performance proved mindset is a very tense, structured, stiff, fearful mindset..."
• Sue Ashford [39:05]: "People saw it more as a sign that you cared, not that you're insecure..."
• Sue Ashford [62:33]: "If you take time to savor successes, savor things that went well as well as look at things that didn't go well, you feel more empowered."
• Sue Ashford [78:36]: "The Power of Flexing is a set of ideas that are empowering and help people to grow to be the person they most want to be."

This episode offers a comprehensive exploration of overcoming fear to take calculated risks through practical strategies like flexing, adopting a growth mindset, seeking and utilizing feedback, and enhancing interpersonal effectiveness. Sue Ashford provides actionable insights grounded in research, making complex psychological concepts accessible and applicable for listeners aiming to achieve meaningful personal and professional growth.