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- [00:00]
BBC Announcer
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- [00:06]
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- [01:11]
Maggie Adairin
Support is available 247 with VRBoCare. We're here day or night, ready whenever you need help. Because a great trip starts with the right support.
- [01:30]
Tim Peake
Welcome to 13 Minutes presents Artemis 2. From the BBC World Service, I'm astronaut Tim Peake and this is episode 13.
- [01:39]
Maggie Adairin
And I'm space scientist Maggie Adairin. We're following the progress of the first crude mission around the moon in more than 50 years. And today we welcome back the Artemis 2 astronauts.
- [01:57]
Mission Control / Narrator
Houston, integrity splashdown.
- [01:59]
Tim Peake
Sending post landing command now. Splashdown confirmed.
- [02:03]
Kristen Fisher
Copy Splashdown. Waiting on VLDR.
- [02:07]
Tim Peake
Perfect. Communications established.
- [02:09]
Mission Control / Narrator
A journey.
- [02:10]
Tim Peake
We are stable 14 green crew members.
- [02:15]
Maggie Adairin
Yes, Artemis 2 crew successfully splashed down in the Pacific Ocean exactly when and where it was planned to do so many weeks ago. And once again we're joined by space journalist Kristen Fisher. Hi, Kristen.
- [02:28]
Kristen Fisher
Hi, Maggie.
- [02:29]
Dr. Anna Fisher
Hi, Tim.
- [02:30]
Kristen Fisher
I feel like I'm. I'm suffering from a bit of a post mission hangover. All the adrenaline, all the excitement, all the nerves and now they're back safely and it's like, oh, I want to say we did it, but I really had nothing to do with it. They did it. And I'm just so proud of the crew in NASA.
- [02:47]
Tim Peake
It was spectacular to see. And I love Reid's comment there saying we've got four green crew members. We had to qualify that by saying they're not actually looking green, they're not sick, they're color state green, meaning they're in great medical health. That was a great moment.
- [03:03]
Maggie Adairin
Although this series of 13 minutes is coming to an end. I'll be sharing some news with you later on in the podcast. I about our next series, but before that we're also joined by BBC News science editor Becky Morrell. Hi, Becky.
- [03:16]
Becky Morrell
Hello there. Hi. It's nice to be here again in person. I must warn you, after about two hours sleep, but I'm a bit sleepy. But happy to be here.
- [03:25]
Tim Peake
Good to see you, Becky. And whereabouts were you watching Splashdown last night?
- [03:29]
Becky Morrell
Well, we were at Mission Control in Houston, actually in the press centre. But wasn't it extraordinary? I mean, I don't think I've really watched something quite so anxiety inducing as that for a while. I mean, you know, these astronauts have traveled for thousands of miles and it all came down to that last 13 minutes. And the press room, which has been just, it's very echoey, it's been full of hubbub all the way through, was silent. I mean, no one was speaking, just everyone listening to the feed from Mission Control and the astronauts in their ear.
- [04:05]
Tim Peake
Yeah, I mean, it was palpable, wasn't it, that. That feeling of apprehension, especially during that blackout period and we knew it was coming. I think what got me was it went on a little bit longer than expected. So hearing Reid's voice as they came out the other side was just a massive sense of relief. But I then had another bit of a moment, I must admit. I hadn't realized that they spend an entire minute under those two drogue chutes. I don't remember that for Artemis. I. And I was kind of watching and watching and watching and thinking, it's no, this isn't good. We need mains, we need the three manes here before we can breathe the sire. And finally, after that long minute, we got those three big canopies and then I could breathe again.
- [04:43]
Kristen Fisher
I had the exact same experience, Tim. I was like, where are the main parachutes? Those drogues felt like they were out for way too long. And then the other moment, I wasn't really nervous about this moment, but it did feel like it took a bit more time than initially planned to actually get them out of Orion. And that whole return to the ship process took a little bit longer than I think everybody was intending.
- [05:08]
Maggie Adairin
Yeah, Difficulty with the sat phone, which is things. We've got all this amazing technology, speech people, you know, as they travel around the far side of the moon, but it's the sat phone brings the trouble. But it's funny watching the parachutes and when the main parachutes did deploy, they didn't get puffy for a while. I was like, oh no, that's not big enough. You need to get bigger. And they did eventually, but it was, but I think these moments of jeopardy throughout the thing and then they had to sit around while they tried to fix.
- [05:35]
Tim Peake
I wonder, Becky, did you hear anything in mission Control about the whole sat phone saga? Any sort of updates there as to why it took or it seemed to take a little bit longer than perhaps planned to get that crew out of Orion?
- [05:48]
Becky Morrell
Do you know what? I don't know, actually. I don't know what happened. So that's, that's probably not the answer. You want to, you want to go?
- [05:56]
Maggie Adairin
No, no. Yeah, a mystery.
- [05:58]
Kristen Fisher
A lot of people have questions about that though.
- [06:00]
Becky Morrell
Yeah, no, it's true. I mean, obviously, you know, so much went right with this mission. I mean, a few toilet problems along the way. You know, I was obsessed with those. But you know, this, it was extraordinary, this moment when they kind of splashed down and they couldn't quite connect with them. They knew they were there obviously because they weren't far away. They saw their capsule bubbling along the waves, but it was a bit longer than usual. But I know now they are going to be streaming through all of the data collected on the spacecraft when it's recovered. It's going to be, it has been recovered, it's been brought back on board. They're going to be scaring every inch of the surface. They're going to be looking at the satellite communications because, you know, what if there had been a problem? You know, they have to make sure that stuff works. Thankfully there wasn't, you know, this went, this went swimmingly. It just took the astronauts a bit longer to get out. I think one of my favorite things though, you know, not only have they done this crazy white knuckle ride through the atmosphere, then after they come out of the capsule, helicopters come down and airlift about there and this amazing footage where you see the helicopters kind of, you know, hanging over the astronauts in a little dinghy and then one by one they grab a rope and they're taken off. I was like, come on guys, come on. Couldn't someone not just give them a bit of an easier journey back to their ship again? When you saw them on the ship as well, they had the option of being kind of helped and carried over from one side to the other, but they were all walking a little wobbly looking, but not, not too bad. I mean, this hasn't been that long a duration flight compared to say, you know, your stay on the International Space Station, for example, Tim. But they have gone a long way, and they have had quite a ride back home. But they looked very happy, I have to say. There's been some very lovely still photos which have been released this morning, and they look joyous.
- [07:53]
Tim Peake
Yeah, they were looking in great shape. But I was thinking there, you know, we did have a good sea state. We had low wind conditions, and we had lights, plenty of light until sunset. But you're right, if it had been bad weather, I think we would have wanted to see that crew out that capsule a little bit faster. So it'll be interesting to see. Was it a problem with the handover from Houston to San Diego? Was it just a problem with the sat phone? Were they having any technical difficulties setting up that stabilization ring and getting the front porch in there? So it'd be really interesting to see if that actually went according to plan. And they were just taking their time. They had the weather. There was no rush. The spacecraft had to be powered down, and they had to confirm it was powered down before it was safe for the divers to approach. So lots of things to kind of unpack there.
- [08:39]
Kristen Fisher
Especially since they rehearsed that exact moment multiple times, both at the. The pool, the neutral buoyancy laboratory at the Johnson Space center, and in real life off the coast of San Diego. You know, I think one of my favorite moments of yesterday and the whole Return to Earth journey was the amount of people that were clearly so excited about it and watching. You know, I spent so much time thinking about how best to educate the public about space and get them excited about it. And I was a little bit pessimistic and jaded heading into this mission, Worried that it wouldn't capture the public's attention in the way that it has.
- [09:17]
Maggie Adairin
And to see.
- [09:18]
Kristen Fisher
See people at bars watching the splashdown on all the big screens. And there was like, there was one where a band was playing, and they started playing Rocket Man. As the parachutes opened. All the baseball stadiums in the United States that had baseball games going on. They played the splashdown live. I mean, it really felt like space had finally re. Entered the mainstream. And I'm wondering if y' all felt the same experience as well.
- [09:46]
Maggie Adairin
Yeah, I call it the taxi driver test. So I was going off to do an interview yesterday, and I was in the taxi, and I said, oh, yeah, I'm going to do an interview about Artemis. Oh, Artemis. So many questions, you know, tell me about this, tell me about that. So when the taxi drivers are asking the questions, I think, yes, we have made, we have made an impression.
- [10:03]
Tim Peake
Yeah, no, you're right. And I was getting lots of messages, but it was mostly by people who were tucked up in bed watching it because it was kind of like what, 10, 10 past 1 in the morning here. So it was hot chocolate and a laptop in bed rather than bars and baseball games.
- [10:18]
Kristen Fisher
It was a Friday night here in the United States, you know, and beautiful weather in most parts of the country. So it was prime time viewing for, for moments like that.
- [10:26]
Maggie Adairin
But I'm quite excited. Well, I'm so glad that the heat shield did its job. And I guess what we're going to do is analyze that now. Take the capsule, analyze it, because I think they're coming up with a restructuring or replan of the heat shield. So it'd be nice to get this extra data from this moment.
- [10:43]
Becky Morrell
Yeah, that's right. Because Artemis 3, the next mission, which was going to be the one that was going to be heading, taking the astronauts on the lunar landing, Artemis 3 is now a docking exercise where they're going to dock with maybe one or two of the commercial landers which are being supplied by SpaceX and Blue Origin. But they will be analyzing it. And of course, when we saw the pictures, because the heat shields at the bottom, I mean, I was sitting there trying to have a look, but no chance. You know, it was beneath the waves. But they will be analyzing. But I mean, I think sort of one of the things that's struck me about this mission and covering this mission, I mean, I've reported on science space for, you know, nearly 20 years, not wanting to date myself. But I think what's really struck me is how much this story has brought the world along with it. You know, it's almost like sort of for a few brief days, the people watching at home sort of lifted off with those astronauts. They sort of traveled with them around the moon, you know, that the lives streaming that was happening, I mean, I didn't expect we'd see so much inside the caption. We kind of saw all of it apart from them sleeping. And, you know, we followed them from the magnificent with these spectacular views to the utterly mundane, you know, their toilet problems. And it's, I think that's what struck me. It's just, it's brought people with him and I'm kind of interested to see what happens sort of now they have come down because obviously, you know, they, they went up. I mean, they're known within the space community and the astronaut community, of course, you know, we all knew their name But I'd say, you know, most people, my mum wouldn't have known their names and now everyone knows their names. So, you know, not only are they going to have to deal with this extraordinary experience, they're also going to have to cope with being, you know, doing the media rounds, everyone recognizing them, their families as well. You know, they've come back to a slightly different Earth, haven't they?
- [12:40]
Tim Peake
They have indeed. I mean, it's part of the job as being an ambassador for space, as an astronaut. But it'll certainly take them a while, I think, to appreciate what we appreciate, which is just how much public support this mission has garnered. Becky, it's been great talking to you. Thank you as ever for all of your brilliant updates. And I guess you'll be seeing the crew later perhaps when they arrive in Houston. But for now, thanks very much.
- [13:04]
Becky Morrell
Yeah, it's been, it's been lovely and I've enjoyed seeing you, Tim and Maggie, and hearing you on air. Kristen, too. It's been really good fun. But, you know, I'm going to have a bit of a sleep first, but nice to join you.
- [13:15]
Maggie Adairin
Thank you for joining us.
- [13:16]
Kristen Fisher
Bye, Becky. Thank you so much.
- [13:17]
Becky Morrell
Bye. Bye, Bye, bye.
- [13:19]
Kristen Fisher
All right, well, later on we are going to be joined by a very special guest. Let me tell y', all, the most difficult guest to book, but we got her and she's coming up. But first, we want to hear from some of you again.
- [13:32]
Tim Peake
Yes. And throughout this series, we've been loving all of the emails, questions that you've been sending in. So thank you so much for that. And we're sorry we can't answer all of them, but we do read them all and we're going to have time to answer a couple more right now.
- [13:45]
Maggie Adairin
So first up, Jamie in London wrote. Hi, team. Thanks for a great podcast series. I was wondering if any of the four astronauts on Artemis 2 are likely to walk on the moon in the Future. On Artemis 4 or beyond, how far in advance are crews planned and does their experience with a capsule increase their chance of being selected?
- [14:06]
Tim Peake
That's a great question. I remember we kind of put this to Jackie Mahaffy, didn't we? The Artemis 2 Chief Trainer. And the thing about Artemis 2 is it was a little bit of a one off. This is the very first time they're trained humans for the Orion spacecraft. So I think with Artemis 3 and 4, they'll be able to refine that training period. They'll be able to thin it down and, you know, it could be as little as eight months to A year to get a crew from being assigned to the mission to be ready to go. But in terms of flying again, I mean, what do you think, Kristin, in terms of the chances of this for getting a chance to go on the moon?
- [14:43]
Kristen Fisher
Well, I've had a few conversations with them about this. And I mean, you tell me, Tim, I mean, is it tough to retire after what you've just experienced? I feel like that might make it even more difficult to retire. But I also know, you know, just look at the ages, right? 50, 50, 49, 47. I think there's a chance that for some of them, this is their last flight to space. But I bet after a moment like what they've just experienced, maybe, maybe you don't want to retire. And our guest coming up can actually speak quite a bit about how much life there is at NASA and how long you can stay at NASA. And just one more point in terms of how quickly you can assign the crew. You know, Jared Isaacman was saying we don't want to talk about this until the Artemis 2 crew is back. Obviously, they're now back and Artemis 3 is going to fly next year in 2027. So they're already thinking about who the Artemis 3 crew is, but they're going to have to assign it pretty quickly if they want to stick to this timeline.
- [15:38]
Maggie Adairin
I was also looking historically because several astronauts from the Mercury and Gemini programs went on to fly to the moon during the Apollo program. And notably, six of the nine astronauts from the Gemini era flew to the moon with three of them walking on it. And sort of Gemini veterans were pivotal with the Apollo missions because for all but one of the Apollo missions, they were the commanders as well. So sometimes there can be transfer, I think.
- [16:02]
Tim Peake
Yeah. And NASA's not afraid of flying astronauts, you know, towards the later end of the year. We've already seen a few go to the space station recently. And when you think about, you know, Sonny Williams, Butch Wilmore, Don Pettit being on board the space station, so you. I'm 54. I'm hoping to go again.
- [16:21]
Maggie Adairin
I'm 58 and I still want to go.
- [16:23]
Tim Peake
So thank you, Jamie, for that question. And David asks, when the capsule was about a mile up the official NASA feed, it had an infrared camera and we were seeing periodic bursts of light that were coming off the capsule. Was that the maneuvering thrusters keeping it on course or was it part of the ablative heat shield breaking away?
- [16:40]
Maggie Adairin
I was trying to find some something out on this, and I don't know because I saw exactly the same thing it was with the infrared image. And every so often you'll get. So I put a sound effect on it because this is a podcast. But yes, I wasn't sure what that was and actually I was going to ask you, Tim. Oh, Kristen, do you know what that was?
- [16:58]
Tim Peake
I don't think it was the thrusters. The thrusters would have been disabled at that point. They've done their job. There's absolutely no need for them. So it's most likely ablative heat shield parts that are just coming off. You know, that capsule's still descending reasonably fast, and it's either hot gas as the heat shield, perhaps small bits come out, the hot gas is being released. And so you're seeing a little plume. It's like a little exhaust plume, really, this hot gas that's been trapped in the heat shield that kind of bursts and then it scoots up towards the canopy there. So I think that's what it's most likely going to be because it was coming from the underside of the heat shield, that was where it was originating from.
- [17:36]
Kristen Fisher
And that would be the heat shield doing its job. I mean, that's exactly how you would expect the heat shield to perform. That avcoat eroding away, hopefully in a more even pattern than it did in Artemis 1. And that's going to be one of the big things that the NASA teams and engineers are going to be looking at once they're able to get this spacecraft back up for inspection.
- [17:55]
Tim Peake
And just on that, Kristen, actually, Artemis 3, we spoke about it very briefly. Be interesting to know maybe, you know, already with this new change of low Earth orbit rendezvous docking with the lander system, whether they'll actually then decide to send it into a really high elliptical orbit so that they can then again test the heat shield on a fast reentry. Otherwise they're going to come back at, you know, about 17,500 miles an hour, which is the standard speed for a low Earth orbit. But they'll probably want to use Artemis 3. It wouldn't surprise me if they want to test that heat shield once again, and therefore they might just send it up quite high to get a bit of speed on the way back down.
- [18:31]
Kristen Fisher
Yeah, and it really is fascinating how, I mean, just now we're already immediately the questions about Artemis 3's architecture and the mission profile starts coming into question. What is Orion going to be docking with SpaceX's Starship, or Blue Origins, Blue Moon? I mean, those questions very quickly are coming into sharp focus this. And we've got one final question from Charlotte in Australia. She writes, I'm absolutely loving the podcast and following the Artemis 2 crew. As you might imagine, I've also been looking up at the Moon over the last week, and it struck me that I actually don't know where the south pole is. I'm viewing the Moon from Australia, from the Southern hemisphere. So is the South Pole actually at the top? Maggie, you want to take this one?
- [19:12]
Maggie Adairin
Yeah, yeah. One of the things I do is when I travel around the world, I'm always looking at the Moon. And the moon does change orientation. So if you see a crescent moon in the Northern Hemisphere, seat it at the crater, it's on its side, and see it in the Southern Hemisphere, it's actually upside down. So the south pole on the Moon does appear at the top of the lunar disk from the Southern Hemisphere. And although the orientation and the sort of. The mapping is sort of just done by, I suppose, the International Astronomical Union. But one of the things that the Southern hemisphere do gain is even though the Moon may appear upside down to them, to the current reference, they do get many more stars in the night sky because they look into the heart of our galaxy, the Milky Way, and the views of the southern skies are glorious. So, yeah, the moon may be upside down, but they see a lot more stars.
- [19:56]
Tim Peake
Thanks very much for that explanation, Maggie, and thank you, Charlotte, for the question. So thanks again for all your lovely emails. And if the Artemis mission has brought you to the 13 Minutes podcast for the first time, then do go and check out the three previous seasons available to binge now.
- [20:11]
Maggie Adairin
Actually, our special guest today featured prominently in our third series. Tim. I'm delighted to welcome a hugely important figure in NASA's history. She was selected as an astronaut in 1978 as one of the 35 New Guys and went on to fly in the space shuttle program, becoming the first mother to fly in space. Later, she worked on the International Space Station and the Orion programs. Dr. Anna Fisher, welcome back to 30 Minutes from the BBC World Service.
- [20:48]
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- [20:51]
Kristen Fisher
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- [20:53]
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- [20:58]
Kristen Fisher
They sure are.
- [20:59]
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- [21:07]
Tim Peake
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- [21:09]
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- [21:12]
Tim Peake
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- [21:18]
Mission Control / Narrator
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- [21:51]
Kristen Fisher
Hi, Mom. You're on mute, Mom.
- [21:55]
Dr. Anna Fisher
See?
- [21:55]
Becky Morrell
There.
- [21:55]
Dr. Anna Fisher
Okay, got it. Hey. So good to see you.
- [21:59]
Kristen Fisher
It's so good to see you.
- [22:01]
Maggie Adairin
So, Anna, first of all, how did it feel following this Artemis 2 mission and watching the splashdown last night?
- [22:09]
Dr. Anna Fisher
It's just been amazing. And getting to know two of the crewmates on the flight are good friends. Victor Glover, I mean, they're all good friends, but Victor was my office mate for many years, and Christina was when she first arrived. So getting to see them take part in such an amazing mission was really fun. Except that I'm jealous.
- [22:32]
Tim Peake
Anna, thank you so much for coming on the podcast, and it's great to see you. You know, you grew up in the Apollo era, which inspired a whole new generation of astronauts and scientists and engineers as well, of course. Do you think the Artemis program is going to now have that same sort of inspirational effect for a new generation?
- [22:51]
Dr. Anna Fisher
I certainly hope so. I grew up when the space program started and got to watch all those amazing early flights. And actually when I came to NASA, I got to work with some of those people in, and it's so neat to see something positive. That's what I love about space program. It tends to unite people who feel the same way about space operation.
- [23:15]
Kristen Fisher
Mom, you're very comfortable with a lot of superlatives and being the first. Right? The first mom in space. You were in the first class of women astronauts, and yet you kind of handle the first questions in a similar way that I think Christina Cook did, which was you're obviously aware of it and you like it, but you also kind of look forward to a time when we're not having to use these types of firsts to introduce people. And so I'm curious, as you were watching Christina and Victor and Jeremy Hansen, the first international astronaut, the first woman to the moon, the first person of color to the moon, as you were watching them break these barriers, what you were thinking about in your own role as somebody who broke so many barriers in human spaceflight.
- [24:02]
Dr. Anna Fisher
I just heard Victor do a wonderful little interview saying the same thing when we're not going to care about the first. And I certainly can speak for myself. Nobody went into space to be the first. And I'll just be so glad when it's just. And NASA is starting to be like that, when it'll just be the best person for the job. I truly feel that NASA is one of the best places to work because within NASA, it's who's the best person for this job.
- [24:34]
Maggie Adairin
One of the things I'd like to do is just thank you because I grew up in the space shuttle era and I saw you and your colleagues go into space, and it inspired me to become a space scientist. So thank you for all you've done. But you worked on the development of the flight instrument display for Orion. Now, this is a technology area that is moving sort of quite quickly. So what was it like to incorporate some of this, some of this new technology? And were there any challenges?
- [25:03]
Dr. Anna Fisher
Well, say that space station displays were not very great. They were not intuitive whatsoever. It took a lot of training to learn how to use them. And there's a lot of history there. Could talk about that for a long time. So anyways, as my colleagues and I, led by Lee Moore and one of the other astronauts who's very instrumental in developing the displays for the Orion spacecraft, we wanted to try to do a better job and make display intuitive, use a lot of the new technology. And so one of the things I'm going to be so excited to talk to when they get back and see if we were successful. But the brief glimpses that I've gotten into looking at the displays is that they have done a good job. One of the big things we incorporated was a procedure viewer that could also interact with the displays. That was something that was not permitted in the earlier programs because people wanted humans always in the loop to make sure you were authorizing every action that the computers took.
- [26:15]
Kristen Fisher
So.
- [26:15]
Dr. Anna Fisher
So it'll be really interesting to see how that procedure viewer interacted with the displays and how intuitive they were. But definitely new technology has also been incredibly helpful in being able to develop the displays for Orion.
- [26:33]
Tim Peake
Anna, that human machine interface that you mentioned there is so important. As a test pilot, we were always trying to make our aircraft as intuitive as possible. Especially when you've got those glass screens and you can get lost five, six pages deep. You need to make it really simple to be able to know where you are and to be able to get the information you need with minimal button pushes as possible. And I agree. I think what I've been seeing from the interaction, it looks to be brilliant. And on this podcast we've got various questions from listeners. And so this next one is from Mark, and we felt that you might be able to help us answer it. And Mark says, I was wondering how astronauts feel in the days and weeks after a mission. Are they elated about the success or is there an element of depression that that Ms. Mission is over, or are they just simply too busy to think about it? Do the space agencies do any particular things to help manage this period?
- [27:25]
Dr. Anna Fisher
Very interesting question. I've never been asked that before. You know, I remember my first reaction, the first things I said to my husband when I saw him after we landed is it was all worth it, all the work and getting ready and then having a successful mission. I'm sure the crew is going to be on high for quite some time. The immediate post period is so busy. You get home, you try to spend a little time with your family, but you immediately have to go into debriefs while all of that is still fresh in your mind. Especially on a flight like this one, where it's the first flight of a new vehicle, you want to impart everything that you can remember about how the vehicle responded while it's all still fresh in your mind. And then in the shuttle program, I'm not sure what it is today, but it's probably several months of doing public affairs, going up to Congress. We got to go to the White House. I know President Trump has invited the Artemis tube crew to come visit. Really don't get a chance to just chill and relax probably for a couple of months because there's just so much going on. But as you listen to the NASA administrator Jared Isaacman say, you know, now we got to go worry about Artemis 3. The rest of the program doesn't get time to just sit back and relax. If we want to do this schedule that NASA has announced, we need to learn what we need to know from Artemis 2, and then we have to get right to work. I guess that's probably the hard part. You know, you just come off of this big high and then all of a sudden the program's got to turn around and worry about, okay, Artemis 2 is done. We're on to Artemis 3. That's a little bit of a shock to the system after you're used to being the big dog for the last three years.
- [29:27]
Kristen Fisher
It does sound like that is something that energized the Artemis II crew, though, the thought that they were going to get to play a critical part in informing the next crew. Mom, one of my greatest joys throughout this whole mission has been getting to experience so much of this with you as a family. I got to watch the launch with you down in Florida with my kids, your grandkids, and to be texting last night during splashdown with you. It's been so, it's been so special to share these moments with you. It reminded me a lot of my childhood. And I know that some of our listeners have been doing this as well, following the mission as a family. And we have a question from Kate and her daughter Beth, who have been listening at bedtime. And their question for you is what will the astronauts do after they return to Earth, and what will their jobs at NASA involve after this mission is over? And I know we kind of answered the first part of that question, but if you could really help folks understand what they'll be doing at NASA after this mission is over.
- [30:31]
Dr. Anna Fisher
Well, from a personal point of view, I just listened to an interview with one of Reed's daughters, and they were asking what they're going to do when he comes back. And she said, we just want to be quiet and let him talk as much as he wants to talk. Looking back on it, you know, in some ways I'm glad you were very young when I flew and you didn't understand. But at the same time, I've been really been really fun sharing that with you. And you know, all of this crew that has family, have older children and get to come back and talk with them. So that part, I think is going to be something really important to be able to share that with their family. And I've really enjoyed these last 10 days or so getting to share that with you. But now what are they going to do? Well, like we said initially, there's going to be all these debriefs and things like that, that and then I guess there's going to be a time for them to sit back and reflect on where they want to go. They're all still relatively young, either their late 40s or just turned 50. So they can choose to stay with NASA or the Canadian Space Agency. They can choose to go on and do other things. I've been a big proponent, as you know, of Victor Glover, remark president.
- [31:53]
Kristen Fisher
So my mom has been saying that Victor Glover should run for president of the United States for over a decade now, has ever expressed any interest in this. But my mom is like, I will be your campaign Manager long before.
- [32:09]
Dr. Anna Fisher
Who knows what the future is. But whatever they decide, I know that all four of them will do a wonderful job.
- [32:19]
Kristen Fisher
And, mom, just to make sure we're answering Beth's question here, if they do decide to stay at NASA after this mission, there's kind of two paths they could take. Either stay an active astronaut, meaning you continue to be eligible for flight assignments, or take the management astronaut route, which is something that you did for many years. Right. And maybe just explain what that is. A management astronaut.
- [32:40]
Dr. Anna Fisher
You just worked in various areas of the program. Like I was chief of the space station branch, for example, within the astronaut office, other astronauts have gone on to be the head of the safety division. In fact, Dick truly eventually became NASA administrator. So, you know, there's all sorts of different things that are available depending on the needs of the agency at the time. And your desire is to what you want to do. I just ran into Don Pettit, one of the astronauts in the office. And so I was asking him what he's doing, and he is 70 years old. He is still an active astronaut, and I think he wants to get in line for another flight, but he's doing one of those support roles. But I had the chance to tell him in person that if I were going to Mars and I could only choose one person to take with me, it would be him. Because Don can fix anything, can take pictures, you know, having someone like him. And I'm a doctor, so if I could only pick one person to go to the moon or Mars, it would probably be Don.
- [33:52]
Tim Peake
He certainly is one of the most resourceful people that I have ever met. He's absolutely incredible. And I think something that struck me as a test pilot looking at this mission, I was really looking forward to the rockets, the technology, the engines, the orbital mechanics of it, the heat shield and everything. But actually, this mission is, for me has now become more of a human story. It's been a story of courage, of passion, of dedication, sacrifice, teamwork. And as you mentioned there, Anna, this positivity of what we've achieved. And also I wanted to say something to you three, as well as hugely inspirational female role models, is how wonderful that has been to see throughout this Artemis mission. We've had Dr. Kelsey Young on the podcast, who is was brilliant, the NASA lead scientist. We've had Jackie Mahafee, who was the chief trainer. We watched Charlie Blackwell Thompson, who was the launch director for sls. That was brilliant. And Jenny Gibbons, Jeremy's backup in Capcom. And I was speaking to a family friend just recently who's doing A level, just chosen her A level subjects and doing physics. But out of a class of 15, she's the only female doing physics. And I just think for young women who are watching this space mission and just wondering, is there a career path for me as a scientist, as an engineer, as an astronaut, or as a, you know, a launch director? How wonderful I think this mission has been in terms of giving those role models and how important that has been.
- [35:23]
Dr. Anna Fisher
Totally. And if you look at mission Control, launch control, there are women throughout everything. As compared to when we first showed up the 35 new guys you looked in mission Control, it was, it looked just like really the Apollo program, almost exclusively male, perhaps one female. And so just to see how far we've come, it is truly amazing. It's amazing what the women have accomplished since the original six of us.
- [35:55]
Tim Peake
Anna, it's been amazing having you on the podcast. Thank you so much for joining us. But that's all we've got time for, so thank you.
- [36:02]
Dr. Anna Fisher
Thank you so much. It was great to meet all of you and bye, sweetie.
- [36:06]
Kristen Fisher
Bye, Mom.
- [36:07]
Maggie Adairin
Thanks, Anna.
- [36:08]
Tim Peake
And so with Artemis 2 safely splashdown, we're coming to the end for this series of 13 minutes. However, our Artemis coverage isn't finished yet. Do keep an eye out as we'll be doing more analysis and reflection in the weeks to come. So we will be back. So don't forget to follow or subscribe to 13minutes. And talking of which, Maggie, you said earlier you had some news to share.
- [36:30]
Maggie Adairin
Yes. So we are currently constructing a new series of 13 minutes and it's talking all about the Hubble Space Telescope. Now the Hubble Space Telescope in itself was groundbreaking. One of the things it gave us an understanding of is our place in the universe. How many galaxies are out there, how many potential stars are out there. But it also suffered from Hubble trouble. So we'll be going through that. Its many challenges, but the glorious images and how it's changed our understanding of the universe. So all that coming up in the
- [36:58]
Tim Peake
next series and thank you all for listening and we really do mean that. It's been fantastic knowing that so many of you have been enjoying this adventure as much as we have. So we will be back soon and as ever, thank you so much, Kristen, for joining us. It's been brilliant having you on the podcast.
- [37:16]
Kristen Fisher
Oh, Tim, Maggie, it's been such a pleasure. I've got, you know, we just heard that question about do astronauts suffer from depression after a mission? I don't know about them, but I know I'm. I'm really going to miss talking to both of you every, every day.
- [37:30]
Tim Peake
Likewise.
- [37:30]
Maggie Adairin
We have to meet up again.
- [37:33]
Kristen Fisher
Deal.
- [37:34]
Tim Peake
So that's it for today and goodbye from me, Tim Peake and me, Madhya Darin.
- [37:39]
Maggie Adairin
The producers are Alex Bansfield and Sophie Ormiston. The series editor is Martin Smith and the commissioning editor is John Minnell.
- [37:47]
Tim Peake
And our thanks to Hans Zimmer and Christian Lundberg at Bleeding Fingers. Music for Our Theme Music 13 Minutes
- [37:53]
Maggie Adairin
Presents Artemis 2 is a BBC Audio Science production for the BBC World Service.
- [38:15]
Mission Control / Narrator
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- [38:43]
BBC Announcer
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