Podcast
AI and I
Hosted by Dan Shipper · EN
Learn how the smartest people in the world are using AI to think, create, and relate. Each week I interview founders, filmmakers, writers, investors, and others about how they use AI tools like ChatGPT, Claude, and Midjourney in their work and in their lives. We screen-share through their historical chats and then experiment with AI live on the show. Join us to discover how AI is changing how we think about our world—and ourselves.
For more essays, interviews, and experiments at the forefront of AI: https://every.to/chain-of-thought?sort=newest.
47episodes
Episodes
Newest firstAll episodes
Inside OpenAI: Coaching the People Creating AGI | Joe Hudson, Founder of The Art of Accomplishment
Jun 18, 202500:53:56Summary readyJoe Hudson is a coach who works with the executives building AGI at OpenAI. From inside OpenAI, he witnesses the full spectrum of human emotion that comes with bringing something new into the world—the exhilaration, the terror, the weight of it all. He feels these emotions, too: He believes AI will eventually replace what he does as a coach.But instead of fixating on that fear, Hudson is asking a deeper question: Who is he becoming in the meantime? He believes that moments like this—when we can feel the ground quiver—can be powerful catalysts for transformation, but only if we’re willing to face the uncertainty they bring.In this episode of AI & I, Dan Shipper sits down with Hudson to talk about how he’s answering that question. They get into what happens when the thing you’ve built your life around might disappear, how to find who you are beneath your professional identity, and why Hudson believes intention is the key to growing with AI.If you found this episode interesting, please like, subscribe, comment, and share! Want even more?Sign up for Every to unlock our ultimate guide to prompting ChatGPT here: https://every.ck.page/ultimate-guide-to-prompting-chatgpt. It’s usually only for paying subscribers, but you can get it here for free.To hear more from Dan Shipper:Subscribe to Every: https://every.to/subscribe Follow him on X: https://twitter.com/danshipper Sponsors: Google Gemin: Experience high quality AI video generation with Google's most capable video model: Veo 3. Try it in the Gemini app at gemini.google with a Google AI Pro plan or get the highest access with the Ultra plan.Attio: Go to https://attio.com/every and get 15% off your first year on your AI-powered CRM.Timestamps:Introduction: 00:01:49What it feels like inside the room where AGI is being built: 00:03:14The most important question to ask yourself as AGI approaches: 00:08:15The importance of sitting with uncertainty: 00:17:49How Joe is preparing his daughters for a post-AGI world: 00:21:11How we think, feel, and react; the three layers of human awareness: 00:27:25Staying grounded while coaching the people shaping our future: 00:35:34Why Joe doesn’t take things personally—even when the stakes are high: 00:42:44Links to resources mentioned in the episode:Joe Hudson: @FU_joehudson; Learn more about the coaching and workshops that Joe runs: Art of Accomplishment
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How Two Engineers Ship Like a Team of 15 With AI Agents | Kieran Klaassen, Nityesh Agarwal
Jun 11, 202500:54:02Summary readyIf you’re using AI to just write code, you’re missing out.Two engineers at Every shipped six features, five bug fixes, and three infrastructure updates in one week—and they did it by designing workflows with AI agents, where each task makes the next one easier, faster, and more reliable.In this episode of AI & I, Dan Shipper interviewed the pair—Kieran Klaassen, general manager of Cora, our inbox management tool, and Cora engineer Nityesh Agarwal—about how they’re compounding their engineering with AI. They walk Dan through their workflow in Anthropic’s agentic coding tool, Claude Code, and the mental models they’ve developed for making AI agents truly useful. Kieran, our resident AI-agent aficionado, also ranked all the AI coding assistants he’s used.If you found this episode interesting, please like, subscribe, comment, and share! Want even more?Sign up for Every to unlock our ultimate guide to prompting ChatGPT here: https://every.ck.page/ultimate-guide-to-prompting-chatgpt. It’s usually only for paying subscribers, but you can get it here for free.To hear more from Dan Shipper:Subscribe to Every: https://every.to/subscribe Follow him on X: https://twitter.com/danshipperSponsors:Microsoft TeamsWant seamless collaboration without the cost? Microsoft Teams offers a robust free plan for individuals that delivers unlimited chat, 60-minute video meetings, and file sharing—all within one intuitive workspace that keeps your projects moving forward. Head to https://aka.ms/every to use Teams for free, and experience effortless collaboration, today.Attio: Go to https://www.attio.com/every and get 15% off your first year on your AI-powered CRM.Timestamps:Introduction: 00:01:16Why Kieran believes agents are turning a corner: 00:03:18Why Claude Code stands out from other agents: 00:06:36What makes agentic coding different from using tools like Cursor: 00:11:58The Cora team’s workflow to turn tasks into momentum: 00:15:20How to build a prompt that turns ideas into plans: 00:23:07The new mental models for this age of software engineering: 00:34:00Why traditional tests and evals still matter: 00:39:13Kieran ranks all the AI coding agents he’s used: 00:42:00Links to resources mentioned in the episode:Try Cora, our AI email assistant: https://cora.computer/ Kieran Klaassen: @kieranklaassenNityesh Agarwal: @nityeshagaThe book that helps Nityesh form mental models to work with AI agents: High Output ManagementA guide to Anthropic’s prompt improver: https://www.anthropic.com/news/prompt-improver
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The Future of AI in Medicine: From Rules to Intuition | Awais Aftab, Psychiatrist and writer
Jun 4, 202500:53:02Summary readyOCD treatment changed my life—but it took me a decade of chasing down wrong answers to be diagnosed. In the rush to create scalable treatments, disorders like depression and OCD are squeezed into diagnostic checklists—from which the complexity of the human mind invariably leaks out. The field of psychiatry is broken, and I spoke to someone on the inside about how AI can help fix it .Awais Aftab has been questioning psychiatry’s rigid categories from inside the field. He’s a clinical assistant professor at Case Western Reserve University, editor of Conversations in Critical Psychiatry—an Oxford University Press volume that tackles philosophical and critical perspectives in psychiatry—and author of the Substack newsletter Psychiatry at the Margins. We get into how AI is transforming psychiatry by embracing the complexity of human minds instead of flattening it.If you found this episode interesting, please like, subscribe, comment, and share! Want even more?Sign up for Every to unlock our ultimate guide to prompting ChatGPT here: https://every.ck.page/ultimate-guide-to-prompting-chatgpt. It’s usually only for paying subscribers, but you can get it here for free.To hear more from Dan Shipper:Subscribe to Every: https://every.to/subscribe Follow him on X: https://twitter.com/danshipper Sponsor: Microsoft TeamsWant seamless collaboration without the cost? Microsoft Teams offers a robust free plan for individuals that delivers unlimited chat, 60-minute video meetings, and file sharing—all within one intuitive workspace that keeps your projects moving forward. Head to https://aka.ms/every to use Teams for free, and experience effortless collaboration, today.Timestamps:Introduction: 00:01:20The case Awais makes for pluralistic thinking in psychiatry: 00:03:38A pragmatic approach to mental healthcare: 00:15:30Awais’s take on why my OCD diagnosis took 10 years: 00:19:04Why psychiatry is stuck where machine learning was decades ago: 00:24:19Why psychiatry’s focus should shift from explanations to predictions: 00:31:05How Awais thinks AI is already changing the psychiatric profession: 00:39:19Links to resources mentioned in the episode:Awais Aftab: @awaisaftab, awais aftab Awais’s Substack: Psychiatry at the MarginsThe book Awais edited: Conversations in Critical Psychiatry
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GitHub CEO on the AI Coding Arms Race: One Agent, 150M+ Devs
May 28, 202500:30:30Summary readyGitHub Copilot has 15 million users—more than Cursor and Windsurf combined. So why does it feel like they're losing the AI coding race?Last week at Microsoft Build, I interviewed the CEO of GitHub Thomas Dohmke to find out.I wanted to know: Is their huge existing user base a blessing or a curse? And will their latest launch—an autonomous coding agent built into GitHub—let them retake the lead? Watch this episode of AI & I to find outIf you found this episode interesting, please like, subscribe, comment, and share! Want even more?Sign up for Every to unlock our ultimate guide to prompting ChatGPT here: https://every.ck.page/ultimate-guide-to-prompting-chatgpt. It’s usually only for paying subscribers, but you can get it here for free.Sponsor:Attio: Go to https://attio.com/every and get 15% off your first year on your AI-powered CRM.To hear more from Dan Shipper:Subscribe to Every: https://every.to/subscribe Follow him on X: https://twitter.com/danshipper Timestamps:Introduction (00:00:38)Copilot’s place in the AI coding agent race (00:07:40)Inside the product decisions behind Copilot’s new agent (00:10:42)How Dohmke thinks about shaping Copilot’s personality (00:16:18)How GitHub supports both AI-native developers and legacy enterprise users (00:20:29)Dohmke’s predictions for the future of software development (00:26:57)
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Kevin Scott on The Future of Programming, AI Agents, and Microsoft’s Big Bet on the Agentic Web
May 20, 202500:28:02Summary readyI interviewed Microsoft CTO Kevin Scott about the future of agents and software engineering for another special edition of AI & I. With 41 years of programming behind him, Kevin has lived through nearly every big shift in modern software development. Here’s his clear-eyed take on what’s changing with AI, and how we can navigate what’s next:The real breakthrough for the agentic web is better plumbing. Kevin thinks agents won’t be useful until they can take action on your behalf by using tools and fetching data. To do this, agents need access across your systems—and Microsoft’s answer is adopting Model Context Protocol, or “MCP,” that allows an agent to access tools and fresh data beyond its knowledge base, as their standard protocol for agents to move through contexts and get things done.How the agentic web echoes the early internet. Just as protocols like HTTP and HTML gave the web a shared language, Kevin believes the agentic web needs its own infrastructure—the first glimpses of this include MCP (the HTTP of agents) and NLWeb, Microsoft’s push to make websites legible to agents (similar to what HTML did for browsers).Open ecosystems can coexist with strong security systems. Kevin argues that the “tradeoff” between ecosystems that allow “permissionless” innovation and robust security is a false dichotomy. With AI agents that understand your personal risk preferences—and know your communication habits across email, text, and other channels—they could detect when something suspicious is happening and act on your behalf. The craftsman’s dilemma in the age of agents. Kevin is a lifelong maker—of software, ceramics, even handmade bags—and he cares deeply about how things are made. Because this can feel at odds with coding with AI agents, Kevin’s approach is to notice where the process matters most to him, and where it's okay to optimize for outcomes. After four decades of seeing breakthrough technologies, his advice is simple: be curious, try stuff, and use it if it works for you.The future of software engineering agents is plural. Kevin believes the future of software engineering agents will be diverse because developers who enjoy the freedom of playing with different tools is one of the most consistent patterns he’s seen in his decades in tech. What will drive this diversity, he says, is builders who deeply understand specific problems and tailor agents to solve them exceptionally well.How agentic workflows will evolve. Kevin sees a shift from short back-and-forth interactions with agents to longer, async feedback loops. As the agentic web matures and model reasoning improves, people will start handing off bigger, more ambitious tasks and letting agents run with them.Timestamps:Introduction: 00:01:44The race to close the “capability overhang”: 00:02:49How agents will evolve into practical, useful tools: 00:04:31The role Kevin sees Microsoft playing in the agent ecosystem: 00:06:48How robust security measures can coexist with open ecosystems: 00:12:05Kevin's philosophy on being a craftsman in the age of agents: 00:15:39How the landscape of software development agents will evolve: 00:20:52The future of agentic workflows: 00:25:33
SummaryDwarkesh Patel’s Quest to Learn Everything - Ep. 27
Jul 24, 2024Tap to summarizeThis episode is sponsored by Command Bar, an embedded AI copilot designed to improve user experience on your web or mobile site. Find them here: https://www.commandbar.com/copilot/ Dwarkesh Patel is on a quest to know everything. He’s using LLMs to enhance how he reads, learns, thinks, and conducts interviews. Dwarkesh is a podcaster who’s interviewed a wide range of people, like Mark Zuckerberg, Tony Blair, and Marc Andreesen. Before conducting each of these interviews, Dwarkesh learns as much as he can about his guest and their area of expertise—AI hardware, tense geopolitical crises, and the genetics of human origins, to name a few. The most important tool in his learning arsenal? AI—specifically Claude, Claude Projects, and a few custom tools he’s built to accelerate his workflow. He does this by researching extensively, and as his knowledge grows, each piece of new information builds upon the last, making it easier and easier to grasp meaningful insights. In this interview, I turn the tables on him to understand how the prolific podcaster uses AI to become a smarter version of himself. We get into: - How he uses LLMs to remember everything - His podcast prep workflow with Claude to understand complex topics - Why it’s important to be an early adopter of technology - His taste in books and how he uses LLMs to learn from them - How he thinks about building a worldview - His quick takes on the AI’s existential questions—AGI and P(doom) We also use Claude live on the show to help Dwarkesh research for an upcoming podcast recording. This is a must-watch for curious people who want to use AI to become smarter. If you found this episode interesting, please like, subscribe, comment, and share! Want even more? Sign up for Every to unlock our ultimate guide to prompting ChatGPT here. It’s usually only for paying subscribers, but you can get it here for free. To hear more from Dan Shipper: - Subscribe to Every - Follow him on X Timestamps: 00:00:00 - Teaser 00:01:44 - Introduction 00:05:37 - How Dwarkesh uses LLMs to remember everything 00:11:50 - Dwarkesh's taste in books and how he uses AI to learn from them 00:17:58 - Why it's important to be an early adopter of technology 00:20:44 - How Dwarkesh uses Claude to understand complex concepts 00:26:36 - Dwarkesh on how you can compound your intelligence 00:28:21 - Why Dwarkesh is on a quest to know everything 00:39:19 - Dan and Dwarkesh prep for an upcoming interview 01:04:14 - How Dwarkesh uses AI for post-production of his podcast 01:08:51 - Rapid fire on AI's biggest questions—AGI and P(doom) Links to resources mentioned in the episode: - Dwarkesh Patel - Dwarkesh’s podcast and newsletter - Dwarkesh’s interview with researcher Andy Matuschak on spaced repetition - The book about technology and society that both Dan and Dwarkesh are reading: Medieval Technology and Social Change - Dan’s interview with Reid Hoffman - The book by Will Durant that inspires Dwarkesh: Fallen Leaves - One of the most interesting books Dwarkesh has read: The Great Divide - Upcoming guests on Dwarkesh’s podcast: David Reich and Daniel Yergin
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She Built an AI Product Manager Bringing in Six Figures—As A Side Hustle - Ep. 24 with Claire Vo
Jun 20, 2024Tap to summarizeClaire Vo built ChatPRD—an on-demand chief product officer powered by AI. It’s now used by over 10,000 product managers and is pulling in six figures in revenue. The best part? Claire has a demanding day job as the CPO at LaunchDarkly. So she built all of ChatPRD herself—over the weekend—with AI. I sat down with Claire to talk about how ChatPRD works, how she built it as a side hustle using AI, and all of the ways she’s using AI tools to accelerate her work and life. We get into: How she used AI to build ChatPRD over Thanksgiving break The part of product management that Claire thinks AI will disrupt Why the PMs of tomorrow will be “proto-managers” who create prototypes rather than just specs How junior PMs can use AI to upskill faster The ways in which ChatPRD is baked into her own workflow How building ChatPRD is making Claire a better PM How Claire uses AI as a tech-forward parent This is a must-watch for anyone interested in turning their side hustle into a thriving business or who works in product. If you found this episode interesting, please like, subscribe, comment, and share! Want even more? Sign up for Every to unlock our ultimate guide to prompting ChatGPT here. It’s usually only for paying subscribers, but you can get it here for free. To hear more from Dan Shipper: Subscribe to Every: https://every.to/subscribe Follow him on X: https://twitter.com/danshipper Links to resources mentioned in the episode: Claire Vo: https://x.com/clairevo ChatPRD: https://www.chatprd.ai/; https://x.com/chatprd; https://www.linkedin.com/company/chatprd/; https://www.youtube.com/@ChatPRD Some of the AI tools that Claire used to build ChatPRD: http://Clerk.dev; https://tiptap.dev/ Greeking Out, the Greek mythology podcast that Claire’s son enjoys: https://www.nationalgeographic.com/podcasts/greeking-out
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