All Of It: A Gilded Age Queer Love Story in 'Mutual Interest'

Podcast: All Of It
Host: Alison Stewart
Guest: Olivia Wolfgang Smith, Author of Mutual Interest
Release Date: March 6, 2025

Introduction to Mutual Interest

At [00:38], host Alison Stewart introduces the episode by highlighting Mutual Interest, a novel by Olivia Wolfgang Smith. The story is set in the twilight of New York City's Gilded Age and revolves around three queer protagonists navigating societal expectations and personal secrets.

"The new novel Mutual Interest by Olivia Wolfgang Smith follows three New Yorkers trying to make money at the tail end of the Gilded Age. And they all have a secret." – Alison Stewart [00:38]

Guest Introduction: Olivia Wolfgang Smith

Olivia Wolfgang Smith joins the studio to discuss her book and the inspirations behind it. She delves into the historical nuances and personal motivations that shaped her narrative.

"Thank you so much for having me." – Olivia Wolfgang Smith [02:05]

Inspiration Behind the Novel

Olivia explains that the seed for Mutual Interest was a historical anecdote about William Proctor and James Gamble of Procter & Gamble fame. Initially rivals in the candle and soap industries, their eventual partnership inspired the complex relationships in her novel.

"The main seed was this little piece of historical trivia... One was a candle maker, one was a soap maker... I obviously took that and ran very far with it, made it a true love story." – Olivia Wolfgang Smith [02:09]

Research Process

Smith discusses her extensive research into the Gilded Age, emphasizing her lifelong fascination with the period's material culture and aesthetics. She highlights how specific plot points, such as a public altercation at the New York Aquarium, were meticulously researched to ensure historical accuracy.

"Research kind of happened in phases for this project... I got to do a little bit of a research scavenger hunt... ended up with the New York Aquarium, which at the time was down in Battery Park at Castle Garden." – Olivia Wolfgang Smith [02:53]

Literary Influences

Edith Wharton emerges as a significant influence on Smith's writing style, particularly The Decoration of Houses. Wharton's strong opinions on societal norms and interior decor inspired the authoritative voice present in Mutual Interest.

"Edith Wharton probably most of all... her fiction was a huge inspiration." – Olivia Wolfgang Smith [04:10]
"She's very against sliding doors, hates sliding doors. So that book was actually a huge inspiration." – Olivia Wolfgang Smith [04:30]

Depiction of Queer Life in the Gilded Age

Smith reflects on the challenges of portraying queer life in the historical context, noting the resilience and ingenuity of queer communities despite societal constraints. She acknowledges the complexities of labels and identities that have evolved over time.

"Queer people of all persuasions and personalities were making lives for themselves all over the city then as now." – Olivia Wolfgang Smith [04:57]
"It's a lot of great expertise from historians that I... lean on in learning about this." – Olivia Wolfgang Smith [04:57]

Character Analysis

Vivian: The Ambitious Inventor

Vivian is portrayed as a driven individual seeking to reinvent herself in New York City. Her ambition and strategic alliances, particularly her marriage to Oscar, reflect her desire for control and stability.

"She wants to be able to invent herself... very intense, almost like Machiavellian person." – Olivia Wolfgang Smith [07:51]

Oscar: The Repressed Entrepreneur

Oscar grapples with his concealed sexuality while striving to maintain his successful soap and perfume business. His internal struggle and vulnerability make him susceptible to Vivian's influence.

"He's really uncomfortable with himself and trying very hard to repress himself." – Olivia Wolfgang Smith [09:24]

Squire: The Eccentric Heir

Squire, born into old money, exhibits obsessive interests and seeks community acceptance. His character explores themes of identity and belonging within the rigid structures of high society.

"He's searching for understanding and community... part of his mother's maiden name." – Olivia Wolfgang Smith [10:55]

Themes Explored in Mutual Interest

Smith weaves themes of identity, secrecy, and societal pressure throughout her novel. The personal care industry serves as a metaphor for self-expression and the capitalist forces that often suppress it.

"The way that it is sort of like this double-edged sword of being a tool of self-expression and maybe gender expression." – Olivia Wolfgang Smith [06:45]

Narrative Style and Voice

Smith employs a high omniscient narrator with an intrusive voice, reminiscent of early 20th-century social satire. This narrative choice allows for deep character insights and societal commentary.

"It's a very strong voiced novel... a pastiche of this style that was common to turn of the century novels." – Olivia Wolfgang Smith [12:03]

Risks of Exposure for Characters

The potential exposure of Vivian, Oscar, and Squire's relationships and business dealings poses significant threats to their personal and professional lives. Smith highlights the delicate balance they maintain to protect their secrets.

"There are obvious legal, reputational, physical safety risks to their queer domestic romantic sexual relationship coming out." – Olivia Wolfgang Smith [14:02]

Conclusion

Olivia Wolfgang Smith's Mutual Interest offers a compelling exploration of queer life and ambitious enterprise in the Gilded Age. Through meticulously researched historical details and richly developed characters, the novel delves into the complexities of identity and societal expectations.

To delve deeper into this intricate love story and its historical backdrop, listeners are encouraged to read Mutual Interest and attend Olivia Wolfgang Smith’s upcoming book discussion at Pete's Candy Store in Brooklyn on March 20, 2025.

"To find out what happens, you should read Mutual Interest." – Alison Stewart [14:02]

Note: This summary excludes advertisements, intros, outros, and non-content sections, focusing solely on the substantive discussion between Alison Stewart and Olivia Wolfgang Smith.