Podcast Episode Summary

Podcast: All Of It with Alison Stewart (WNYC)
Episode: A New Zine Exhibit at Brooklyn Museum
Date: November 17, 2023
Guest: Brandon Joseph — Professor of Modern and Contemporary Art at Columbia University, Co-Curator of "Copy Machine Manifestos: Artists Who Make Zines"

Overview

This episode explores the opening of the Brooklyn Museum’s new exhibition, Copy Machine Manifestos: Artists Who Make Zines, highlighting the cultural significance, history, and contemporary relevance of zines. Host Alison Stewart interviews Brandon Joseph, one of the exhibit’s co-curators, discussing the unique role of zines in art and activism, their community-building origins, and ongoing influence. Listener calls provide personal anecdotes and connections to zine culture.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

What Is a Zine? (03:12–05:33)

• Origins & Definitions
  • Zines are DIY, independent publications often made with simple means (photocopy, staples, folding), rooted in self-expression and community.
  • Historically linked to fan culture: began in the 1930s, especially among science fiction, comics, and later rock fandoms.
• Community Building
  • Zines are interactive and participatory: open to reader feedback, correspondence, and contributions, unlike traditional magazines with editorial gatekeeping.
  • Core to fostering inclusive, collaborative communities.

Quote:

"So they're really open to creating and fostering senses of community in that sense."
—Brandon Joseph (05:19)

Mail Art & Early Zines (05:33–08:11)

• Mail Art Networks
  • Early artist zines originated from “correspondence art” communities in the 1970s, operating via postal exchanges rather than galleries.
  • Artists mailed work to each other, sometimes modifying and resending pieces, creating a collaborative chain.
  • Example: The New York Correspondence School Weekly Breeder started as a mailer, expanded by different artists, illustrating the evolving, collective process.
• Alternative Platforms
  • These mail art and early zines were viewed as alternatives to institutional “high art” spaces, democratizing art sharing and viewing.

Quote:

"It was also a sense of feedback. You would mail your piece to someone and they would mail you another piece, or maybe they would even take the piece you mailed to them and modify it and send it on to somebody else."
—Brandon Joseph (06:13)

Why “Manifestos”? (08:26–10:26)

• Exhibit Title Origin
  • "Copy Machine Manifestos" was borrowed from a 1990s article referencing the explosion of queer zines, specifically foregrounding both activism and art.
• Manifesto Forms
  • Zines often contain explicit or implicit manifestos—declarations of purpose, challenging the mainstream ("oppressive to just plain boring").
  • The act of zine creation itself can serve as a manifesto, bridging activism and artistic intent.

Quote:

"And just as often, the zine itself acts as a manifesto in its form and in its content. Whether it says this is a manifesto or not, it serves as a calling card, as advertisement, as a billboard of a particular person or a particular group's point of view."
—Brandon Joseph (09:26)

Listener Calls: Personal Connections and Scene History

[Fact Sheet 5 & Ray Johnson] (10:34–11:53)

• Caller Jerry recalls Fact Sheet 5 and Ray Johnson (“godfather of mail art”).
• Joseph: Exhibition includes Ray Johnson’s drawings and references his archival influence; early zines in the exhibit often corresponded with Johnson.

Quote:

"Most of the artists in the first section...were in male correspondence dialogue with Ray Johnson. So he was a very central figure."
—Brandon Joseph (11:42)

[Copy Shops & Gathering Places] (11:53–14:36)

• Caller Cliff: Asks if Todd’s Copy Shop—a vital locale for 1980s zine makers—is featured.
• Joseph explains while the shop isn’t specifically highlighted, such production and distribution nodes were essential to zine culture. The exhibit focuses on spaces like the Spew Festival (early queer zine conference) and moments where virtual communities meet in person, underscoring the importance of both physical and networked gathering sites.

Quote:

"The copy shop was itself a node of production and often of distribution as well...You know, the record store was also not a site of production, but a note of distribution, certainly, even if your zine was not necessarily one that related to music."
—Brandon Joseph (12:41)

Brooklyn’s Unique Zine Scene (14:36–16:40)

• Local Flavor
  • The exhibition is rooted in Brooklyn: early zine work by John Dowd (Park Slope), contemporary works with Brooklyn connections, and a thread running through the show’s entirety.
  • Exhibit also represents national and international scenes: LA, San Francisco, Chicago, Toronto, Mexico City, and beyond.

Quote:

"There's a through line of Brooklyn that starts and ends the exhibition, but we also have Manhattan, Los Angeles, San Francisco, Chicago, Guadalajara, Mexico City, Toronto, Vancouver are all pretty important nodes throughout this exhibition."
—Brandon Joseph (16:17)

The Zine Landscape Today & Closing Thoughts (16:40–18:02)

• Current Relevance
  • Zines are highly popular among artists—affordable, accessible, and maintaining community-based intent even as the art market grows.
  • Recent years saw a surge in production (2019 onward), culminating in vibrant scenes and major events like the Printed Matter zine fair.
• Accessibility
  • Zines provide a way for people to own a piece of art or support an artist for just a few dollars, a democratizing force in art.

Quote:

"They're just a way, I think, for artists, especially in a sometimes burgeoning art market, to be able to make work that can be bought cheaply, given away, that can have that community function and network function."
—Brandon Joseph (16:57)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Paper and Process:

  "Paper and language are the two most essential tools for zine making, aside from a copier or a printer. It is really helpful for me to be surrounded physically by the material image in the liminal space of selecting and framing. It is as if the paper and I are having a tactile conversation. This conversation becomes the language of the zine, the content."
  —Niall G. Kim Kaliske (01:31, quoted by Alison Stewart)

• On Community:

  "They’re more open and collaborative with a community than your typical magazine that has a sort of gatekeeper function of editors and others."
  —Brandon Joseph (04:44)

• Manifesto as Method:

  “Often the zine contains manifestos in it. This is what we're doing. This is why we're doing it. And just as often, the zine itself acts as a manifesto in its form and in its content.”
  —Brandon Joseph (09:26)

Timestamps for Important Segments

• [01:31] — Show intro, exhibit context, zine definition, and quote from Niall G. Kim Kaliske
• [03:53] — What makes a zine a zine? Joseph on the history and community aspect
• [05:33] — Mail art and the evolution of early zines
• [08:32] — Explanation of the “manifestos” in the exhibit title
• [10:34] — Listener call: Fact Sheet 5 and Ray Johnson’s influence
• [11:58] — Listener call: Production and distribution hubs like Todd’s Copy Shop
• [14:50] — The “Brooklyn-ness” of the exhibition and locational threads in zine culture
• [16:53] — The contemporary zine landscape; current trends
• [17:44] — Closing summary and thanks

Conclusion

This episode delivers a rich, engaging look into zine culture through the lens of Brooklyn Museum’s latest exhibit. Host Alison Stewart and Brandon Joseph highlight zines' community roots, artistic and activist roles, and how these DIY publications persist as accessible, vital forms of cultural production and self-expression today—right in the heart of Brooklyn and beyond. Listeners are invited to reflect on their own connections to zine culture and to experience the ongoing vibrancy at the Brooklyn Museum’s exhibit and accompanying zine fair.