All Of It on WNYC

Episode: 'A Very Royal Scandal' Tells the Story of the Infamous Prince Andrew Interview
Host: Alison Stewart
Guests: Emily Maitlis (Former BBC Newsnight journalist, executive producer), Ruth Wilson (actor, portrays Emily Maitlis)
Date: September 16, 2024

Overview

This episode of “All Of It” dives into the new Amazon Prime Video series A Very Royal Scandal, which dramatizes the events leading up to the notorious 2019 BBC interview between journalist Emily Maitlis and Prince Andrew. The conversation unpacks both the mechanics and lasting reverberations of the interview—amid the Jeffrey Epstein scandal—as well as the making of the series. Alison Stewart is joined by Emily Maitlis herself and Ruth Wilson, who brings Maitlis to life on screen. The episode explores journalistic ambition, the fallout for both the British monarchy and Maitlis personally, depictions of women in scandal narratives, and the lines between public persona and private chaos.

Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. The Cultural and Journalistic "Get"

(01:00–01:56)

• Stewart introduces the idea of the “get”—the interview everyone chases—and frames Prince Andrew’s sit-down as the ultimate example in the UK, given his royal status and scandal.
• A Very Royal Scandal focuses on Maitlis’s team’s pursuit, preparation, and execution of the interview, highlighting not just the media side, but the royal family’s attempts at damage control.

2. Portraying Emily Maitlis: Inside and Out

(03:37–05:36)

Ruth Wilson on Playing Emily Maitlis

• Wilson wanted to understand Maitlis as more than a “Newsnight reader”; she asked about personal items (“What’s in your handbag?”) to get an authentic sense of her off-screen personality.
• Quote:

  “What’s really interesting about playing this particular character... we see a very public version on screen... but we get to go behind the scenes, see her at home.”
  —Ruth Wilson (03:52)

• Wilson describes discovering “the chaos and the sort of right on the line energy it takes to be a news journalist—and then what the effects that has at home...". (05:01)

Emily Maitlis on Her Real Life

• Maitlis admits Wilson saw the messiness behind her on-air composure, recounting that her handbag was “covered in, like, makeup and pen and ink... there are wine gums stuck to the bottom...” (04:16)

3. Why This Dramatization? Pivotal Historical Moments

(05:36–07:45)

• Maitlis emphasizes the broader historical and societal implications, not just the interview event but its ongoing fallout and the monarchy’s shifting relationship with the public.
• Quote:

  “Five years later on, we are still seeing the reshaping, the realignment... of the relationship between the monarchy and the British public now.”
  —Emily Maitlis (06:47)

• The series follows the full arc: “the buildup... the sit down... and the fallout”—arguably “the most dramatic episode of all.” (05:46)

4. The Personal and Political Backdrop

(07:45–10:02)

• Maitlis reflects on balancing the stress and intensity of her role at Newsnight with family life, and the broader “brittleness” of British politics coming off Brexit and parliamentary upheaval.
• The Prince Andrew interview, coming from a show known for hard politics and current affairs and not royal coverage, was profoundly out of character and framed as a “clash” of worlds.

5. Ruth Wilson’s Perspective: Drama as Reality

(10:02–12:12)

• Wilson recounts being “gobsmacked” watching the real interview in 2019: “It was the best piece of drama I’ve seen on TV. I couldn’t look away.” (10:06)
• She highlights the interview’s intensity and Maitlis’s “master class” in technique—“You made him feel safe enough to reveal himself, but then you also never dropped the ball.” (10:48)
• The series, per Wilson, is less about rehashing the events and more about asking substantive questions on press power, news as entertainment, privilege, and accountability.

6. Non-Biased Journalism, BBC Culture, and Institutional Clashes

(12:12–15:09)

• Stewart raises a scene in the series of Maitlis being reprimanded for “rolling her eyes at a politician,” exploring the tension between impartiality and personal reaction.
• Maitlis dissects the different “rulebooks” of two British institutions: “The BBC goes by one set of rules... the monarchy by a very different set of rules... We bring them together and it’s like that’s the Big Bang.” (14:26)

7. Inside the Craft: Portraying Real People

(15:09–17:20)

• Wilson discusses the challenges of portraying Maitlis, noting Michael Sheen’s advice (“stick the least amount of things on your face... get the essence of someone”) and the importance of “interpretation, not imitation.” (15:22)
• Wilson comments on the journalistic “stereo brain” and multitasking—watching, writing, listening all at once.

8. The Infamous “Sweat” Defense: Anatomy of an On-Air Moment

(18:16–22:26)

Clip and Reaction

• Stewart plays a clip from the real interview in which Prince Andrew infamously claims he “didn’t sweat” at the time of the alleged incident due to a medical condition. (18:31)
• Maitlis reflects on how jarring it remains to hear:

  “I can’t listen to that even now...” (19:18)

• She explains that Andrew viewed this “as a very categorical alibi,” showing his disconnect from public perception—a symptom of royal isolation.

Constructing Narrative

• Wilson: “You see him trying to second guess what Emily knows and thinks... he’s inside his head constructing... a narrative.” (21:02)
• Maitlis observes that, crucially, Andrew’s own advisers failed to intervene to prevent such damaging lines in the interview.

9. The Mechanics and Stress of Securing the Interview

(22:51–24:29)

• Wilson and Maitlis recount that the interview was at one point cancelled, then rescheduled, with Maitlis kept in the dark by her team to avoid unnecessary stress (23:14–24:05).
• The harried dash to the palace—toting extra outfits—mirrored both reality and the dramatized production.

10. Centering Women and Fallout

(24:29–25:42)

• Stewart notes the “very female forward” feel of the series—the perspectives of Maitlis, his daughters (Beatrice), Fergie, Virginia Giuffre.
• Wilson admits she only realized, upon viewing, how central the women’s emotional experiences were:

  “The fallout happens for all the women in Prince Andrew’s life. You start to see the impact on all the women...” (25:25)

11. When Journalists Become the Story

(25:42–26:27)

• Stewart raises the discomfort for Maitlis at being a central part of the story herself.
• Maitlis responds:

  “It doesn’t feel right. It doesn’t feel comfortable... I’m always kind of like, forget the BBC side, just concentrate on the palace stuff...” (25:54) “Yeah, it still makes me feel slightly uncomfortable.” (26:23)

Notable Quotes

• Emily Maitlis (on historical significance):

  “Five years later... we are still seeing the reshaping... of the relationship between the monarchy and the British public.” (06:47)

• Ruth Wilson (on the original interview):

  “It was the best piece of drama I’ve seen on TV... terrifying and sort of uncomfortable to watch.” (10:06)

• Emily Maitlis (on her composure):

  “Ruth not only got to see the inside of my handbag, she carried around the handbag for the duration of filming... all the calm, smooth, swan-like behavior completely evaporates in my real life...” (04:16)

• Emily Maitlis (on Andrew’s “sweat” story):

  “I can’t listen to that even now without – tell me more stomach. It’s really hard, isn’t it, just to listen to that...” (19:18)

• Ruth Wilson (on acting real people):

  “It’s about getting the essence of someone, really... you want the audience to believe in the character you’ve created, because acting is an interpretive art.” (15:22)

Timestamps for Key Segments

• (01:00) — Introduction to "the get" and Prince Andrew interview
• (03:37) — Ruth Wilson’s approach to playing Emily Maitlis
• (05:46) — Why dramatize this story now?
• (07:45) — Balancing personal life and high-stakes journalism
• (10:06) — Wilson’s reaction to the original interview
• (12:42) — Debating impartiality and BBC newsroom culture
• (15:22) — Portraying real-life figures: insights from Wilson and Sheen
• (18:31) — The infamous "I don’t sweat" exchange (played and discussed)
• (23:14) — The logistical nightmare: interview cancellation and scramble
• (24:50) — The series’ female-forward lens
• (25:54) — The discomfort of journalists becoming the story

Memorable Moments

• The irreverent exchange about “what’s in your handbag?” sets the tone for a portrait of charisma and chaos underlying journalistic professionalism.
• Candid recollection of Prince Andrew’s rationalizations—“if you said that to a normal person... they’d go, what? What the— you know.”
• Wilson noting the emotional cost carried by women adjacent to scandal, and how the drama foregrounds that impact.

Conclusion

This episode offers both a cultural autopsy of a watershed media event and a meta-examination of how such moments are reimagined for drama. Through lively, honest banter, Stewart, Maitlis, and Wilson explore the power dynamics of journalism, performance, institutions, and gender—bringing both the story and the storytellers into sharp, very human relief. The series A Very Royal Scandal premieres September 19th on Amazon Prime Video.