Podcast Summary: All Of It with Alison Stewart – Episode: Adam Haslett's 'Mothers And Sons'

Release Date: August 15, 2025

Introduction

In this episode of ALL OF IT, hosted by Alison Stewart on WNYC, listeners are immersed in a deep conversation with Adam Haslett, the author of the acclaimed novel "Mothers and Sons." The episode, part of the March "Get Lit with All Of It" book club selection, delves into the intricate themes, character dynamics, and emotional landscapes portrayed in Haslett’s latest work.

Overview of "Mothers and Sons"

"Mothers and Sons" centers on Peter, a dedicated asylum lawyer in New York City, and his strained relationship with his mother, Ann. Set against the backdrop of 2011, the novel navigates the complexities of familial bonds, personal trauma, and the quest for connection.

[00:08] Alison Stewart: "In the latest novel from Pulitzer Prize finalist Adam Hayslett, a mother and son try to find their way back to each other."

Character Development and Inspirations

Haslett begins his creative process by deeply understanding his characters. Peter, characterized as a workaholic asylum lawyer, is estranged from his mother, Ann, a former Episcopal priest who now runs a spiritual retreat in Vermont. Their relationship is further complicated by Peter’s unresolved guilt over a tragic event from his youth.

[01:42] Adam Haslett: "I'm always trying to find a way into the mind, the rhythm, the voice of the person that I'm going to spend time, probably years writing about."

Peter's dedication to his profession mirrors his inability to engage deeply with his personal life, highlighting themes of loneliness and internal conflict.

Setting and Socio-Political Context

The novel is meticulously set in 2011, a deliberate choice by Haslett to explore the immigration system's fragility without the immediate influence of the Trump administration's policies. This timeframe allows for an unfiltered examination of systemic issues that have persisted beyond specific political eras.

[04:48] Adam Haslett: "You don't have to wait till Trump's in office to find an immigration system that was in crisis."

Themes Explored

1. Loneliness and Workaholism: Peter's relentless dedication to his work serves as a coping mechanism for his loneliness and internal struggles. Haslett emphasizes how individuals in helping professions, like Peter, often become disconnected from their emotions by focusing intensely on others' plights.

   [06:34] Adam Haslett: "I wanted to explore what the emotions are underneath that urge to just fill up all the time."

2. Dissociation and Trauma: Peter's interactions with Vassal, a young asylum seeker from Albania, force him to confront suppressed memories of a violent incident from his teenage years. This confrontation leads to dissociative behaviors, disrupting his perception and functionality.

   [10:45] Adam Haslett: "He spends a lot of time sort of in a back and forth... things about Vassal that remind him both his story and him that begin to kind of bring this up."

3. Mother-Son Dynamics: The relationship between Peter and Ann is central to the narrative. Ann’s transition from priesthood to running a feminist spiritual retreat creates an emotional rift, further strained by Peter’s unresolved guilt and her protective silence.

   [12:12] Alison Stewart: "To Anne."

   [12:21] Adam Haslett: "She thinks it's a kind of alienation, that it's, in some sense, about her and the decision she made."

4. Cultural and Legal Nuances: Vassal's Albanian background introduces cultural elements such as the Kanoon, an extrajudicial legal code still influential in certain Albanian communities. This adds layers to the asylum case, highlighting the intersection of personal history and broader societal issues.

   [09:42] Adam Haslett: "There's a kind of almost medieval... legal code called the kanoon... which is extrajudicial."

Author’s Research and Writing Process

Haslett details his extensive research into Albanian culture and legal systems, aiming to authentically portray Vassal's plight. His background in law school informs his depiction of the asylum process, balancing the emotional narratives with the procedural rigidity of legal work.

[08:43] Adam Haslett: "The kind of research that I was doing is, in essence, the same sort of research that an asylum lawyer has to do."

Haslett also discusses his writing structure, utilizing fragmented sections and flashbacks to mimic Peter’s dissociative experience, creating a sense of fragmented memory and emotional revelation.

[28:37] Adam Haslett: "I wanted to create for the reader... the experience of dissociation."

Deep Dive into Characters: Peter and Ann

Peter: A first-person, present-tense narrative captures Peter’s immediate and dissociative experiences. He is portrayed as someone yearning for intimacy but constrained by his inability to process his own emotions.

[16:21] Adam Haslett: "Peter is... someone who wants to connect with... but doesn't even really understand that absence."

Ann: Written in third-person past tense, Ann embodies a more reflective and connected character, able to process her life’s narrative and the complexities of running a spiritual retreat.

[16:21] Adam Haslett: "Anne has... a capacity to narrate her own life."

Supporting Characters and Their Impact

The novel features multiple mother-son relationships, including Jared and his mother, Vassal and his mother, and others, each reflecting different facets of familial bonds and personal trauma. Peter’s sister offers a contrasting dynamic with her garrulous and open nature, providing a counterpoint to Peter's reserved demeanor.

[16:39] Adam Haslett: "I wanted to explore... relationships where there's the proximity of parenthood, but the difference of gender."

Audience Interaction: Questions and Insights

During the live event at the Stavros Niarchos Foundation Library, Adam engages with audience questions, providing deeper insights into his characters and themes.

1. Ann’s Inability to Connect:

   Question: "Do I read that correctly, that she just can't hear him, can't do for him what she does for everybody else?"

   [23:56] Adam Haslett: "Ann is essentially saying, this didn't happen the way you think it happened."

   Haslett explains that Ann’s silence and protective instincts prevent her from fully engaging with Peter's desires and trauma.

2. Agency and Solving for Others:

   Question: "It made me wonder about the question of agency and trying to solve things for other people."

   [26:26] Adam Haslett: "The complexity... how you navigate it... pull the reader in the shoes of the character."

   He emphasizes the delicate balance between professional obligations and emotional connections, especially for characters in helping professions.

3. Narrative Structure and Emotional Impact:

   Question: "How you develop that overall structure with the parallel flashbacks and the relation to the overall emotional impact of the story."

   [28:37] Adam Haslett: "I wanted to create for the reader... the experience of dissociation... islands in the fog."

   Haslett discusses his intention to reflect Peter’s fragmented memory through the novel’s structure, enhancing the emotional resonance of his journey.

4. Lawyers Turning to Fiction:

   Question: "Why so many people who educated as lawyers end up writing novels... how do you deal with that?"

   [30:18] Adam Haslett: "I was writing fiction before I went to law school... precision is great... but it's not the end... you need space and ambiguity."

   He shares his transition from legal writing to fiction, highlighting the need for creative freedom and emotional ambiguity in storytelling.

Conclusion and Author’s Final Thoughts

As the conversation wraps up, Haslett reflects on the pervasive theme of loneliness in modern society, exacerbated by technology and changing social structures. He underscores the importance of addressing this often-stigmatized emotion through his characters, aiming to resonate with readers who experience similar feelings.

[31:45] Adam Haslett: "Loneliness is an experience that often has a lot of shame attached to it... the consequences of it came up."

Final Remarks

Alison Stewart concludes the episode by highlighting the collaborative effort with the New York Public Library, encouraging listeners to engage with the book club and look forward to more insights from Adam Haslett in future episodes.

[32:43] Alison Stewart: "That was my conversation with Adam Haslett. His new book, Mothers and Sons, was our March Get Lit with All Of It book club selection."

Note: This summary captures the essence of the conversation between Alison Stewart and Adam Haslett, providing listeners with a comprehensive understanding of the themes, characters, and narratives explored in "Mothers and Sons." For those interested in the intricate dynamics of mother-son relationships, the challenges of personal trauma, and the complexities of the asylum system, this episode offers valuable insights and a compelling discussion.