All Of It – Bobby Finger’s Second Novel, ‘Four Squares’

Podcast: All Of It
Host: Alison Stewart (WNYC)
Guest: Bobby Finger
Air Date: July 2, 2024

Episode Overview

This episode centers on Bobby Finger's new novel, Four Squares, a moving narrative that explores queer life in New York City across two time periods: 1992 and 2022. Host Alison Stewart delves into the novel’s themes of friendship, loss, the legacy of the AIDS epidemic, community, and the overlooked experiences of queer aging. Finger discusses the research, character inspirations, and the writing process, giving listeners both a window into queer history and contemporary struggles as well as insights into his craft.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Setting the Story in New York City

• Why New York, and Why Now?

  • Bobby Finger initially found it more natural to write about his Texas upbringing but eventually felt prepared, after 15 years living in New York, to capture the city authentically.

    "I wasn't quite ready to write about New York City yet. And I felt like I hadn't been here long enough...But I wanted to be sure I got it right." – Bobby (03:08)

• Research and Authenticity

  • Finger immersed himself in non-fiction, fiction, and archives to recreate the nuances of 1992 New York during the AIDS epidemic.
  • Volunteering with SAGE, an LGBTQ organization, inspired the senior center “GALS” in the novel.
  • An impactful research moment at the Library of Congress gave him “permission” to focus on the everyday lives of his characters.

    "What I found so nice about this is...just the sort of everyday, banal things...I realized, like, this is life. This was life then and it's life now." – Bobby (05:33)

2. Novel Structure and Main Character

• Artie Anderson: Then and Now

  • Set in 1992, Artie is a 30-year-old aspiring novelist and copywriter, navigating friendships and love during the AIDS crisis.
  • By 2022, Artie is aging, alone, dealing with loss and confronting loneliness in the LGBTQ+ senior community.

    "What's exciting to him are his friends...they are allowing themselves to see that they have time." – Bobby (06:45)

• Passage Reading – The Pain and Resilience of Queer Community [08:09]

  • Bobby Finger reads a moving excerpt highlighting emotional fragility, stigma, and the strength of community during AIDS-era New York.

    "Since his childhood as the most effeminate boy in school, the word had struck him like the remnants of broken glass, non-lethal but liable to scar..." – Artie, read by Bobby (09:26)

3. The Four Squares—Symbols and Significance

• Title Origins
  • The titular “Four Squares” (Abington, McCarthy, Father Demo, and Washington Square) are deeply meaningful, serving as both Artie’s fictionalized world and Bobby’s lens onto the West Village.

    "Part of the fun I had researching this book...was just sort of wandering those streets and really looking up at the buildings for the first time and taking in those squares..." – Bobby (10:38)

4. Art as Writer—Reception and Creative Parallels

• Artie’s Experience as an Author

  • Artie’s novel is published to “a whisper” with a dismal turnout at the book signing. Ultimately, completing the work is what matters most to him.

    "There's a sting to the lack of success...but really, the fact that his friends came...was really all that mattered." – Bobby (11:30)

• Bobby’s Personal Parallels

  • Bobby relates to Artie's emotional journey as an author, sharing a poignant memory about the completion of his debut novel.

    "'You can die now.' He meant it as a joke, but I think he was kind of serious...You did this thing that you didn't think you could do, and it's huge." – Bobby (12:10)

5. The Aging Queer Experience and Community

• Artie’s Later Life & GALS

  • After the departure of close companions, Artie confronts his solitude and seeks new community at GALS.
  • Abraham, Artie’s love, is revealed as a source of unresolved longing and regret.

    "He puts his entire affection for Abraham onto these two women...when they announce that they are leaving New York City, he realizes that he's always been...alone." – Bobby (14:06)

• The Value and Challenges of Queer Aging

  • Bobby emphasizes the privilege and zest for life among queer elders at SAGE.

    "They just really do...see every day as a gift. And they feel extremely fortunate and extremely lucky." – Bobby (16:57)

  • The cast of elders, especially Annabelle, Gregory, Jasmine, and Sterling Bismarck, provide both comic relief and poignant commentary on aging, community, and survival.

6. Writing Process and Habits

• When & How Bobby Writes
  • Afternoons are his productive time, with weekly word count goals rather than daily ones, shaped by his morning podcast schedule and love for evening unwinding.

    "I cannot write in the morning...the afternoon has become the time I can write...I love a deadline...so I give myself weekly word counts." – Bobby (20:17)

7. Summer Reading & Book Recommendations

• Bobby’s Summer Picks
  • Ways and Means by Daniel Lefferts – for compelling contemporary New York storylines.
  • People Collide by Isle McElroy – praised for its suitability as a potential TV series.
  • Loved and Missed – commended for its memorable title reveal and emotional payoff.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "One of the toughest things about any friendship is remembering that the mere act of listening is often not only enough but also the totality of what the other person wants." – Bobby reading Four Squares (08:25)
• "This is the world now they knew. The world he meant. It was the world too many straight people had spent the first decade of the pandemic pretending didn’t overlap with their own." – Bobby reading (09:18)
• "If you hadn’t had the leg injury, what might have happened to him?...That’s why I injured him...I needed him to break his foot. I needed him to put him on a scooter. It slowed him down." – Bobby (16:02)
• On queer elders: "They're kind of broad in the book...But I really wanted them to celebrate life in a way that was almost infectious to Artie because he internalizes it." – Bobby (17:33)

Key Timestamps

• [00:39] Episode introduction, Four Squares overview
• [02:19] Bobby Finger joins; origin of New York setting
• [03:36] Researching 1992 NYC & inspiration from SAGE
• [06:33] Protagonist Artie’s motivations in 1992
• [08:09] Author reads excerpt from novel
• [10:04] Significance of the four squares
• [11:05] Artie’s novel reception
• [11:48] Bobby on his first-time author experience
• [13:50] Artie’s life in 2022 and the impact of loss
• [16:57] Lessons from queer elders
• [19:43] Bobby’s writing schedule
• [21:14] Summer reading recommendations

Conclusion

This episode of All Of It provides a nuanced look at Bobby Finger’s Four Squares, an intergenerational, emotionally resonant portrait of queer life and friendship in New York. Listeners gain both a sense of the warmth, humor, and pain in the novel and insight into Bobby Finger’s creative mind, community engagement, and literary influences. The discussion is rich in empathy and reflection—serving as both a tribute to queer resilience and an invitation to treasure community, in whatever form it appears.