← All Of It with Alison Stewart
All Of It with Alison Stewart
'Didi' Tells the Story of a Taiwanese-American Teen
00:17:29
Sean Wang's latest feature film, "Didi," is a slice of life story about Chris, an impressionable teenager living in Fremont, California.
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- [00:04]
Alison Stewart
Listener support WNYC Studios this is all of it on wnyc. I'm Alison Stewart. We're spotlighting independent filmmakers and their films. Now we'll turn to Dee Dee, which takes place in 2008 during a summer in Fremont, California. Right before a 13 year old Chris has to go to high school. He's getting new rubber bands for his braces. He's spending the evening chatting with his crush on a messenger and trying to fit in somewhere. Chris, whose friends call him Wang Wang, is a bit awkward. The guys he surrounds himself with are more social, sporty and outgoing than he is. And at home he feels stifled. His mom, sister and grandma all have trouble reaching him and he makes some unfortunate choices. That's because Chris is focused on more important things, like trying to figure out how to impress his crush Maddie and the new group of skater bros who take interest in his amateur filmmaking skills. He's really into this thing. It's called YouTube. The film is called Dee Dee and is now streaming on Peacock. The film received four nominations for Independent Spirit Awards, including Best First Screenplay and Best first Feature. Writer. Director and producer Sean Wong joined me to discuss the film earlier this summer. I began our conversation by asking him what it was about that phase of life that interested him that he hadn't seen on screen before. Let's take a listen.
- [01:46]
Sean Wong
I mean, I think it was two things. One, that period of my life that the movie captures, this sort of cusp of, you know, middle school to high school I think was just so formative for me. My friends and I describe it as like this time in your life where you're the worst version of yourself having the best time of your life. You're still impressionable, but you have no sense of identity. You're really figuring things out. And it just really felt like in all the movies that I loved about that period of adolescence, you know, Stand by me, rat catcher, 400 blows. I love those movies and I love how they really treated adolescent boyhood with as much emotional maturity as I think boyhood really is crass and irreverent, but it's also very scary and confusing and sad and lonely. And in all of the movies that I loved about that period, that kind of movie, I never saw a kid that looked or talked or felt like me and my friends, not just me. And so in thinking about the specifics of my childhood and my upbringing, it felt like there was stuff to mind there that wasn't just like a self aggrandizing, let's put my story on screen. But in a way that I was like, I think there's stuff here for like an entire generation of kids who grew up in the late 2000s that will be universal and relatable. But let's get at it through a very specific point of view and try to put like a Taiwanese American portrait on screen and see what that does to the movie.
- [03:03]
Alison Stewart
Let's dive into the protagonist, Chris. We meet him at the tail end of 8th grade. Where is he in his life all 13 years of it? What's important to him?
- [03:12]
Sean Wong
I think his friends are important to him. And I think being cool, you know, being accepted. I think, you know, my producer and I talked a lot about, like, what does he want? I was like, I think he wants to be cool. And like, that's so much for a 13 year old boy to just like be accepted, to be seen as relevant and to feel like he belongs in the spaces that he wants to be in. And I think that's so much of what the movie is. It's him thinking he has to be a different version of himself in all of these different spaces and then he tries to be that version and then fumbles the ball. And I think it is this period in his life where the friends that he has in the movie and the friends I think you have at that age, they're all friends by proximity, right? Like it's the people you grow up with and then only later do you start creating friends because of shared interests. And I think that's where he finds himself in his life. He's starting to be interested in skating and filming and all these different interests that his friends don't share. So they don't relate to him in that side of things. And I think he's trying to figure out what that looks like for him, you know, as he moves forward in.
- [04:11]
Alison Stewart
Life in the 2008 atmosphere. You got the flip phone, you got AOL messenger, you've got MySpace. What was it like getting your cast members, your teenage cast members to understand the technology of that time?
- [04:27]
Sean Wong
It was, it was really funny. You know, luckily all the MySpace stuff, the Facebook, the AIM, that was all created in post production so I didn't have to walk them through, you know, what a MySpace top eight was all this kind of stuff. But the flip phones and the T9 texting was stuff that they actually had to make sure we sold it accurately. And so before production started, we sent them all flip phones and they did not practice. And we got to set and I remember the first scene we filmed with Isaac, who Plays Chris with the flip phone. He was, like, opening it with two hands and typing. I was like, oh, God, we got some practice to do. And so they got there. But it was definitely. That was the biggest learning curve, the T9, texting, everything else actually came pretty easy.
- [05:11]
Alison Stewart
Chris goes by many names. There's Dee Dee, which is what his family calls him. He goes by Wang Wang, his friends. What do the different names signify? Chris, Wang, Wang and Dee Dee.
- [05:24]
Sean Wong
I mean, it's interesting, you know, I think almost when I was describing the movie, you know, before we made it, it was like, this is a movie about this kid. It's who he is with his friends. It's who he is with the people he wants to be his friends. And it's who he is with his family. And so, in a way, it's those three things, right? It's who he is with his friends. And when he's with his friends, he's Wang Wang. When he's with the people he wants to be his friends, he's Chris. And then when he's with his family, he's Dee Dee. And. And then I think by the end of the movie, that was kind of a thing we wanted to come back to. It was like. That was a question that was asked of me when we were developing the script. It was like, by the end of the movie, when the movie cuts to black, is he Wang Wang? Is he Chris, or is he Dee Dee? And I think that's, you know, I have an answer for that, but it's something. I'm curious what other people will think, too.
- [06:03]
Alison Stewart
Well, let's listen for a clip from Dee Dee. This is where Chris is talking to some girls at a party. One of them is Maddie, his crush. Let's listen and we can talk about it on the other side. This is from Dee Dee. You want to try?
- [06:19]
Sean Wong
Sure. So you know each other?
- [06:25]
Alison Stewart
Yeah.
- [06:25]
Sean Wong
You look familiar. You go to Hoarder, right? Yeah, but not anymore. I just graduated, so, you know, thank God. Yeah, horror kind of, like, sucks, you know? I liked Warner. Yeah, I thought Warner was fun. What was your name again? I'm Chris, but all my friends just call me Wang Wang. What should I call you? You just call me Wang Wang Wang Wang.
- [07:04]
Alison Stewart
Is that, like, the sound a duck makes? You know, like, Wang Wang. Maddie is so much cooler than he is.
- [07:12]
Sean Wong
I love that scene so much.
- [07:15]
Alison Stewart
Why does he let her call him Wang Wang?
- [07:18]
Sean Wong
Well, I think it's in that moment that he realizes, oh, Wang Wang. The thing that my friends call me is not the Greatest thing, the greatest name. And so that moment kind of gets played, the theme of it gets played a couple times throughout the movie where the next time someone asks, oh, what's your name? He takes a beat to think and he goes, no, it's Chris. And so, yeah, I think in that moment he learns like this thing where it's like, oh, like this nickname I have. I don't know if it's as endearing as, you know, my friends think it is.
- [07:51]
Alison Stewart
We're discussing the film Dee Dee about a coming of age story about a Taiwanese American teenager. My guess is director Sean Wang. It doesn't work unless the casting is right. The casting of Chris Isaac Wong, he. What were you looking for generally when you were looking to cast Chris and then what sold you on Isaac?
- [08:11]
Sean Wong
Yeah, well, I think the ethos of the movie in terms of especially the kids is again being inspired by movies like stand by me, 400 blows. And I, when I think about those movies, the boys feel so real. They don't feel like movie kids. And so I was really looking for a kid that again, like, felt like a real teenage boy and wasn't, didn't necessarily have the feeling of like a trained, polished actor. And so all of the kids, with the exception of Isaac, they're all basically first time non actors who had never even considered being in a movie before. Isaac, though, was sort of the exception and he comes from an acting background and he's been in movies like Good Boys and Raya and the Last Dragon and these sort of, you know, you know, more like children's movies. And I think what we were trying to do is something different. It's a movie about kids, but not for kids. And so we actually found him at a time where I think he was maybe like considering taking a step away from acting because he, he wanted to spend his summer being like a kid. He wanted to bike with his friends and he wanted to like go and hang out with his friends and not be on a movie set with a bunch of adults. And he again, he wanted that lived experience of being a teenage kid. And I think when our movie kind of found him, he was sort of like, we were kind of basically asking him to completely shed all of the previous experiences that he had as an actor and bring that irreverent teenage boy energy into it. And Isaac, I mean this in the most complimentary way is, you know, both an extremely professional actor and understands what he needs to, you know, carry an emotional arc and a character. But he's also like a real punk you know, like, he's a teenage boy, and you can feel that sort of irreverence, which is something. It's what the character needed, and it's what I wanted. It was. It was like, the best experience getting to work with him.
- [10:01]
Alison Stewart
What was it like for you to have to wrangle all those teenagers?
- [10:05]
Sean Wong
It was fun. And also, like, we're asking all of these kids to spend a formative year of their summer. You know, Those summers between 13 and high school are like the summers that really define your childhood. And we're asking them to spend, like, a month of their lives with us, you know, filming this movie again, like, they've never been on a film set before. They walk on a set, and there's, like, a bunch of trucks and lights, and it's like, me, when I enter a skate shop when I was young, it's like an intimidating situation. And it was really, really important to me, our producers, our whole team, that whether or not the movie was good or bad, that these kids walked away with, like, a very, very special experience, that they could look back on this experience 10 years later and be like, wow, even if I never act again, that was such a unique and special time. And, like, I'm so glad it happened. And so we really went out of our way to make sure the experience was catered to them. But also, selfishly, I knew that if the kids are having fun, I think the performances are gonna feel so alive and electric and. And so sometimes we'd be in between takes. I'd be like, all right, let's go again. We'd be like, where are they? And they'd be in a field, like, a hundred, you know, just so far away, and be like, all right, guys, get back here. But it was stuff like that where it was like, you know what? Don't try to keep them here. Like, if they want to go run around and play tag, let them be. We'll figure it out.
- [11:19]
Alison Stewart
What did you learn about being a teenager in the 2000s that was so different from when you were that age? After hanging around with these kids, I.
- [11:29]
Sean Wong
Mean, they definitely have, like, a different vernacular of speaking. You know, the slang is a bit different. But I think the bet that I took with the movie that I do believe is that even though the cultural context around being a teenager is constantly changing, you know, like, again, like, the MySpace and the Facebook and all the AIM stuff, but I do truly believe that the emotional weight of being 13 doesn't, like, you still feel embarrassed by your parents. You still are like wanting to fit in with your friends again, the context changes. But the bet that I took with the movie was that those emotions and the irreverence and the sort of chaos of boyhood doesn't. And that's why I can watch Stand by me and 400 blows and all these movies that take place and were filmed decades ago. But I'm like. I see myself in those characters in that movie. I think, you know, these kids have never. I wasn't trying to tell them, like, be a teenager in 2008. I was. What I told them was, no, you know what it's like to be a teenager more than I remember what it's like to be a teenager. So, you know, be. Bring, like, your whole self into it. And a lot of the work for me was actually, like, we did a lot of improv, and they would, like, do a take, and they'd be like, all right, bet. And I'd be like, okay, that take was great. But don't say bet.
- [12:43]
Alison Stewart
Can't say bet.
- [12:44]
Sean Wong
Right. Cause that wasn't. You know, we weren't saying that back then. But otherwise, that energy, that irreverence, that's all them. That's all, like, their real selves.
- [12:51]
Alison Stewart
So you let them banter back and forth.
- [12:53]
Sean Wong
Yeah, so much.
- [12:54]
Alison Stewart
Chris is at home with his mom, his sister, older sister, I have to say, and his grandmother. There's a lot of female energy in the household. How do you think gender plays into the dynamic of Chris, Chris and the house full of women?
- [13:11]
Sean Wong
I don't know. You know, I hope the movie speaks for itself in that sense, you know, like, what it's like to be raised in a house full of women and then all of a sudden walk out into the world and be thrust into this world of, like, adolescent pubescent boyhood. And, like, what they're saying and, like, the way they kind of treat, you know, women as, like, you know, like, social currency. The way that they talk about it, you know, it's. It's. It's boyhood, but it's also, like, the cultural standard at the time. And the different ways that, you know, I really see this movie about. As a movie about shame and the different ways that shame can manifest itself in a young boy's life. And I think in our movie, it's. It's personal shame. And that personal shame, I think, has to do with that, like, his inexperience with certain things, whether it's. You know, I don't know if I could say this on, like. Like, you know, like, drinking or something when he's at an older party or like with his friends and he's like lying about his experience with girls and then cultural shame and societal shame. But I think all three of those kind of come into play together. And I think part of the first part of it is like being raised in a household hold of women, like, and not having that, that male figure to be like, okay, this is how the world works type of thing. And so he's kind of searching for that. His version of it is his older sister. And I think our version of the trope is normally the younger brother goes to his older brother's closet and like, tries on his clothes. But in our movie he goes to his sister's room and tries on like her tight skinny jeans and, you know, it's like wearing her dress and it's kind of like, okay, like, interesting.
- [14:39]
Alison Stewart
Your actual grandmother is in the film. She plays Nai. Nai. It's not the first time you've worked with her. You worked with her on the Oscar nominated short earlier. How did you broach that conversation to have her in this film? What was her reaction?
- [14:53]
Sean Wong
It was, it was a conversation that was years long. And it was, it was just like for a couple years I was, I would just kind of joke with her. I'd be like, hey, you're gonna play the grandma in the movie, right? And she'd be like, no, I'm not an actor. Like, we can do the short and the documentary, but I'm not an actor. And every once in a while I would just be like, no, but you're gonna do it. And she's like, no, no, but she's like, no, like, you know, you should do it. And then eventually when we actually started to prep the movie and we did, you know, you know, like, consider other people. But it got to this point where she was like. I was like, well, no, I really think you might be great for this. Like, you should do it. And she was like, well, if you're that confident in me, if you believe in me that much to do it and you think I'll do a good job, like, I'll do it. And then we casted her and she did a great job.
- [15:40]
Alison Stewart
My guest is Sean Wong. The name of the film is Dee Dee. So I don't want to give anything away, but if you had to imagine Chris is 13 in 2008, where would he be now in 2024?
- [15:57]
Sean Wong
I mean, I guess the easiest answer is here at wnyc, but, you know, I don't know, I think I was very fortunate to have realized that the thing I discovered when I was in seventh and eighth grade is the thing that I just want to do for the rest of my life. You know, different forms of it, whether it's storytelling, filmmaking. I still skate today. And those things that I discovered that were, you know, for lack of a better word, passions, like, they, they still give me that same buzz today. And I know that's not common for a lot of kids because for whatever reason, what you do for your hobby is not something you can always pivot into a career. And so I would hope that Chris, whatever he's doing, you know, that I think for every kid out there, everyone who grows up, like the thing that you like to do doesn't have to be your career all the time. I hope that whatever he grows up into, like, he, he can hopefully be happy and not be, be a well adjusted human being.
- [17:01]
Alison Stewart
That was my conversation with director Sean Wong about the film Dee Dee. Up next, the movie follows a couple's attempt to fight back against rules preventing two people with disabilities from getting married without losing their benefits. Director Ted Passon and subject Patrice Jeter join us to discuss the film, which is now streaming on Hulu. That's Next NYC now delivers breaking news, top headlines and in depth coverage from WNYC and Gothamist every morning, midday and evening. By sponsoring our programming, you'll reach a.
- [17:49]
Sean Wong
Community of passionate listeners in an uncluttered audio experience.
- [17:53]
Alison Stewart
Visit sponsorship.wnyc.org to learn more.