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All Of It with Alison Stewart
Director Kelly Reichardt on Her 30 Year Career Film Retrospective
00:26:49
Kelly Reichardt on her career retrospective at the Metrograph.
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- [00:01]
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Kelly Reichardt
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McDonald's Customer
I'm gonna put you on, nephew.
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Kelly Reichardt
All right. Welcome to McDonald's. Can I take your order, miss?
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McDonald's Customer
I've been hitting up McDonald's for years. Now it's back. We need snack wraps. What's a snack wrap? It's the return of something great. Snack wrap is back.
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Kusha Navadar
This is all of it from WNYC. I'm Kusha Navadar in for Alison Stewart. 30 years ago, acclaimed filmmaker Kelly Reichart made her first movie, 1994's river of Grass, which follows a bored Florida housewife whose life takes a turn when she meets a man at a bar. Since then, Reichart has made a name for herself as a portrait portraitist of the Pacific Northwest through films like old Joy Meek's Cut Off, First Cow and last year's Showing Up. Reichardt's films are moving portraits of everyday people, whether they're set in modern day or in the American past. She has a unique ability to make actors, even major stars like longtime collaborator Michelle Williams, make them feel like people you might know. As Doreen St. Felix wrote in her profile of Reichardt for the New Yorker, Reichardt is the this country's finest observer of ordinary grit. Now the Metrograph is honoring her filmography with a retrospective series. It's called American Landscapes the Cinema of Kelly Reichart. And kicking off on Saturday, the Metrograph will screen all eight of Reichardt's features To date. And Kelly herself will join some of the screenings for a Q and A session afterwards. You can find more information on the Metrographs website. And joining me now in the studio to discuss the retrospective and her career is director, screenwriter. Screenwriter editor, Kelly Reichart. Kelly, welcome to the show, and welcome back to wnyc.
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Kelly Reichardt
Oh, thanks for having me.
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Kusha Navadar
Absolutely. When did you first know you wanted to be a filmmaker?
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Kelly Reichardt
I grew up in Miami, Florida, and it was kind of a cultural void as far as art went. But I had a Pentex K1000, and then we got a Super 8 camera. And I really, looking back, I'm not sure how the idea occurred to me, but I did sort of. Well, A, I wanted to get out of Florida, but B, I don't know. I don't really know where the idea came from, but I ended up just randomly at Mass Art, taking night classes so that I could get some equipment and making films for some friends of mine.
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Kusha Navadar
Do you remember the first time you did something with a camera and you thought, oh, this is something that I want to keep doing? Do you remember how old you were? Do you remember where you were?
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Kelly Reichardt
Well, I wanted to keep doing it because it's interesting and it's fun, but I'm not sure it was that. I looked at something and said, oh, I should keep doing this. But more out of, you know, it was something to do in those days. There was a lot of bands about and which seemed to be mostly for guys. And so I was trying to find a way to do stuff and not just be on the sideline. And so I started filming some of these bands and stuff.
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Kusha Navadar
Oh, interesting. Like rock bands, you're saying?
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Kelly Reichardt
Yep. Indie rock.
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Kusha Navadar
That's great. You know, so many people want to make it as directors and writers and actors and creatives in this world, but most people don't ever really get that dream realized for you. Is there even a moment when you first realize, like, hey, I made it, or, hey, this is gonna be a long career.
- [05:04]
Kelly Reichardt
Oh, I don't know what making it is exactly, but I got very fortunate after I made my film Old Joy, that I got a teaching job at Bard College, where I am today. And so Bard has allowed me to have time to work and to be around colleagues who make different sorts of films and teach film and have enough time to make film. So that put me sort of in a place where I, you know, could make the sort of projects I want to make without having to think of that I would be necessary making a career of filmmaking, because that always Seemed like a shaky thing. And so that kind of back and forth between teaching and making films has gone on for a long time. But it always, every film feels like the last film and you feel lucky you're getting to make it and you have no idea if you'll, you have no idea if you'll get to make another one. I mean, I still feels that way because it's a, it's a hard industry to keep making sort of art films, as it were, or smaller, more personal films.
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Kusha Navadar
Yeah. How do you find maybe strength is a word, maybe motivation, dedication in between projects, I guess. Is it taking lessons that you learned from the previous film and finding the next thing you want to work on, or is it just this, this feeling of being compelled to make it and it's the thing that you do well?
- [06:40]
Kelly Reichardt
Yeah, it's something to do. And I, I like thinking about how films are structured quite a lot. And I think about that a lot when I'm teaching and then I want to have time to dive. My filmmaking world is very connected to my friend world in a lot of ways. And so talking about seeing art and talking about art and seeing music and then wanting to make stuff, you know, that's all kind of in the mix of life and with a community of people. And so usually, I mean, I've worked a lot off with a friend, Jonathan Raymond, a writer friend, and often those ideas, by the time I'm finishing a film, he has an idea of something he wants us to dive into next. That's happened a lot.
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Kusha Navadar
So it's not just an independent kind of thing that you're talking about. It's from the community, drawing inspiration in that sense.
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Kelly Reichardt
Yeah, I work with, I mean, filmmaking is not, you know, one person sport. It involves working with a lot of different people and you work one on one with people intensely and you know, and then you leave that person and you work intensely with the next person, whether it's like a writer and then a production designer and then a cinematographer and you know, so there's a lot of very intense one on one with the casting person first really, or your producers. And then you kind of, you kind of move along to the next intense relationship and collaboration. And so. Yeah, but it's, I don't know, filmmaking is not something I think you kind of can conquer. And so there's just so much to figure out all the time new with each project. So, yeah, I mean, I'm happy to do it for as long as the film gods say I'm allowed to still.
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Kusha Navadar
And Give you that right away. Yeah, totally. Totally. It's. You know, listeners, we're talking to Kelly Reichardt, the director, the screenwriter, the editor. The retrospective called American the Cinema of Kelly Reichart. It kicks off Saturday at the Metrograph. And I'd love to get into some of the movies from your long career. Your debut film was released 30 years ago. That was 1994's river of Grass. When's the last time you watched that film?
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Kelly Reichardt
Well, Larry Fessenden and I. Larry Fessenden stars in the movie, and he was the editor of that film. And he and I, oscilloscope, sort of brought the film back to life and remastered it and made a fresh print and we got it recolor timed and all that. That's what I guess I mean by remastered. But anyway, we did a. When they did the dvd, we did a commentary. And so we watched the film as we were doing the commentary. I really don't like to go back and look at the films, but we. And so it was a funny commentary because we were remembering things as we saw them. And. Yeah, it was a long time ago. So.
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Kusha Navadar
So how. What. How is it. Because you mentioned that you don't really like going back to watch your old films. How is it for you to. To be ready to watch all of these films all together as part of this retrospective?
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Kelly Reichardt
Oh, I'm not gonna watch. I'm not gonna watch them, but I'm really happy that they're gonna play. I mean, I just can't bear it. But, you know, just. I think, you know, I cut my own films mostly, so I'm just. I don't want to. I'll just be too critical and. Yeah, I don't know. I just won't. But I love that they're playing together. And I really am a fan of the Metrograph. Like, I go there to see movies. It's a nice place to see films. And so. And they're playing on the weekend, so they're playing. It's not just like they're off by themselves. They're playing around. All these other films from different eras, some contemporary, some older. I think Melville film is playing the same week. I mean, it's great. So it's part of, you know, it's like a way to feel part of something.
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Kusha Navadar
Yeah. Thinking about the river of Grass, right? That first movie for you. Do you remember learning anything from that film 30 years ago that you still carry with you today? Any big lessons, any big insights from that first go around?
- [11:45]
Kelly Reichardt
Well, I learned don't Make a film on your credit cards, which was like a thing at the time. Everyone was just like, just put it on your credit cards and then don't do that. You'll carry debt for a long. It's worse than a student loan. And I think my big thing. Well, I learned a lot of life lessons on that film. I. Yeah, that was a education in really. I learned a lot about misogyny on that film. I did. But, you know, just what it was to be a woman and trying to make a film and trying to. But I learned that I really needed to much more than I did at the time, you know, sort of, you know, that I shouldn't just be describing a shot. I should know what my lens is. And, you know, that I needed to. I learned everything I didn't know, basically, and what I needed to know in order to sort of, yeah, be able to articulate exactly what I wanted to do. And so, yeah, it was very difficult. But I worked with some friends. Some. One friend who's no longer with us. My dear friend Dave Dornberg was the production designer. And that was a great thing. And also my friends from Yola Tango did some of the music for it. Not under Yola Tango. They did it. And that has been a very long lasting friendship with those guys. And so that's really sweet that that exists in there. And then there's a lot of Miami that. That we shot, which is where I grew up, that doesn't exist anymore. And so I'm really pleased about that. And it's interesting that sort of the things that interested me at that age in a lot of ways are still kind of themes that, you know, just about the landscape and the environment and how industrialism, like, invades the environment or capitalism, I should say. And just those sorts of things, highways that those things have kind of stuck with me.
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Kusha Navadar
You know, it's interesting that we've talked about Miami a lot in this interview, because folks who are familiar with your work know that most of your work is set in the Pacific Northwest, actually. How did that particular region of the country become such an area of focus for you?
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Kelly Reichardt
It was as far away as Miami as I could get.
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Kusha Navadar
Opposite diagonal.
- [14:30]
Kelly Reichardt
Got it. And a really different landscape I lived in. You know, I've lived in New York city for over 30 years, and now I live mostly in Oregon. But, you know, my friend Todd Haynes, I had worked on his film Poison, and we became friends, and he eventually moved to Portland. And I kind of. I started going out there to visit him, and I was really taken with the landscape. And then I met Jonathan Raymond, the screenplay. He was a novelist and then we, and I did old Joy with one of his short stories and then he and I started working together and he and Todd now often work together. So it was sort of, I started getting drawn out there. I met my, the producer I've made all these films with, Neil Kopp lives out there. And I just sort of the pull of, you know, I was always sort of more and more sharing my time with Portland. But I think working with John Raymond had a lot to do with it because those, he's from Oregon and those were the sort of stories he wanted to tell. And I realized it was fantastic to not be retreading the area. I knew and didn't, you know, I didn't, you know, it was great to sort of forge a new territory, new landscape that was different to my eye and seasons were different and yeah. So I really, it just ended up being the place interestingly. Yeah. I became a regional filmmaker for a place I didn't lip listeners.
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Kusha Navadar
If you're just joining us, we're talking to Kelly Reichart, the director, the screenwriter, the editor, the retrospective of her 30 year career. And going is American the cinema of Kelly Reichart. It kicks off Saturday at the Metrograph. Kelly, we just got a text that I want to read from a listener. It said I'm lucky enough to have a wonderful theater in town. The Claridge run by Montclair film where I saw showing up. Absolutely loved it. Have recently seen First Cow, Old Joy and Wendy and Lucy. A big fan. Can't wait for the next one. So whoever texted that, thank you so much. How does it feel to hear, you know, that, that.
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Kelly Reichardt
Thanks, mom. That's so nice. Yeah, that's great. Oh, I've heard of that theater in Montclair. That's cool. I know people in Montclair.
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Kusha Navadar
You know, you had mentioned something when we were talking about the lessons that you learned in your first film and the first thing that popped into your mind was misogyny, which I thought was a pretty big lesson or I guess a big thing to touch on as a female director working in the 90s, how have you noticed things changing in Hollywood for female directors? And what are some areas that you feel like still need to improve?
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Kelly Reichardt
Well, I don't really. I've never, I guess I never thought of myself as being part of Hollywood, but I don't know. I've made films with a 24 and I don't know what I don't know what's the line is. But I've made films in this really particular, very fortunate way of where, you know, our budgets are quite small and, you know, relatively speaking. And so we've been pretty much left to our own devices. I guess my early attitude was, you don't want me. Well, I don't want you, no. So, you know, I was just figuring out ways to make film around a system that I've probably kind of more waded into now, really. It was Adam Yock helped a lot with Oscilloscope Films to help get the movies out, but they were. And Kino and ifc, more independent distributors. And so I don't know. I guess I don't necess. It's hard for me to speak about Hollywood because I don't. I mean, I'm sure it's better than it was, and I am sure it's not where it should be. I guess I could say that. But from a teaching standpoint, I can say, you know, when I started teaching, there was maybe one female student for every. You know, I think the ratio at NYU, where I used to teach, was one girl for every 16 boys. And I don't know if it's the times or teaching at Bard or whatever, but my classes have more women in them than they do men at this point. And so that's changed. And. But it's a. I mean, schools are also a bubble, you know, so it's. Well, you will know when people quit saying, like, you know, we're gonna have a women's film festival, we're gonna do a woman's series, you'll understand that women have entered the flow of things, you know.
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Kusha Navadar
Has that been a sudden shift in that you're talking about or a gradual one?
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Kelly Reichardt
I don't know. I shouldn't talk about these things because I don't really know. I'm just in my own little world. And it's gotten easier for me because I've made a bunch of films. But, you know, one of the hardest relationships can be within the crew and women sort of finding the people they can work with that will support them and. And finding the. You know, like, Cruz can be very dude oriented and so which is fine as long as they're the right dudes, you know, but, yeah, I really don't have a bird's eye view on it, to be honest. I just sort of keep my head down and try to.
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Kusha Navadar
And see how it is for you, film to film. Like you can speak from your own perch.
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Kelly Reichardt
I totally hear that. I mean, I'M I'm old now, so it's different, you know.
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Kusha Navadar
But yeah, you know, you were talking a lot about the different folks that you've worked with that have been great collaborators. One of them is Michelle Williams. How did that collaboration begin?
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Kelly Reichardt
I should just say, you know, I work with a lot of men and I've been supported by a lot of men. You know, it's not like one thing at all. And, you know, I've been. It's. If you get to make a film about the things I'm making film, you know, we're making films about, you know, an injured bird or someone stealing milk from a cow. It's lucky that anyone gives you the chance to do it. So I feel very fortunate. But Michelle, that was another fortunate thing we. So many things happen by accident. I had written Wendy and Lucy and I thought it would be much more of a sort of. I was looking at, you know, casting someone like Sadie Benning, the artist, and I sent her the script. Even in the week I sent her the script, her dog had passed away, so she couldn't even really look at it. But Michelle Heath had worked with Todd and as Michelle had with Todd Haynes, and. And it was sort of through that relationship that Michelle had seen Old Joy and she said, oh, I want a part like the Will Oldham part in Old Joy. Wow, that's cool. You know, is she really gonna show up and do this movie? And she did. And that was fantastic. And that was a really no frills, super, super shoestring budget. And she, we, you know, gave her an apple box to sit on and she just rolled with it. And so, yeah, I've gotten to work with her a lot, which has been a, you know, obviously a great thing in life.
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Kusha Navadar
What keeps you inspired to keep working with her? What do you think is special about her as an actor?
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Kelly Reichardt
She, to me, like, she just keep. Especially if we go away and we do things without each other and we come back, obviously she's doing stuff all the time that she's just. She's forever growing and I have fun watching her and seeing what she's doing. And she just, she just keeps, you know, like, just as she, you know, I guess everything is like practice and process and, you know, just how she uses her body and her voice and the way she likes to try things. And mostly how trusting she is. I mean, God, she's a she. You know, I don't know how I got so fortunate to just work with someone who is so trusting from the get go, but that's you know, really what you want when you're directing a film is someone to trust you. And I trust her. And so that gives us each a lot of leeway, you know.
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Kusha Navadar
In a profile for the New Yorker that I mentioned earlier, Doreen St. Felix called you America's finest observer of ordinary grit. What do you think about that phrase to describe your work? An observer of ordinary grit?
- [24:28]
Kelly Reichardt
I think all of us, you know, John, who I'm writing with, I do think we're focused on the minutia of life and more day to day struggles than, you know, big moments. So, yeah, I mean, sometimes, you know, you hear when people, something tragic happens, they say, you know, I'll never go to that graduation or that wedding or. And they name all these big events that you'd like, just totally like to avoid in your life. And I think we're more interested in the day to day and the, you know, the sort of smaller strokes and things. Yeah.
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Kusha Navadar
You know, thinking about your entire filmography so far and the retrospective, is there a film that you're particularly excited to talk about or revisit?
- [25:31]
Kelly Reichardt
I. They each. Well, let's see. I don't know. I've been lately thinking about how nice it's been music wise that I've gotten to work with. Well, I mentioned Yola Tango and the guitarist Smokey Hormel made music for film. And more recently, Andre Benjamin got to have some of his flute music in the movie, which was unexpected. And yeah, just those things are nice to think about and along with. I don't know, they're so. The places, the people, the animals, the music, all of it. Yeah, it's. I don't know, I'm kind of just happy it's happening and that we lived through all those films.
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Kusha Navadar
Yeah. And what do you think about a.
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Kelly Reichardt
Lot of winters, A lot of shooting in winter.
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Kusha Navadar
Let's think about the future winters. Like, how do you think about the next phase of your career? Is there something that you're hoping to work on next to achieve? How are you thinking about the next phase?
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Kelly Reichardt
Well, life goes on and I'd like to keep making films. I'd like to shoot less in the winter if possible, but that might not be possible. I really shoot around my teaching time, but shooting in the winter is really difficult though. We made showing up during a heat wave and that was. Also had its challenges. But I think of, you know, it's really. I just think of the project I'm interested in doing and how in the world are we gonna a. How in the world can we get the money for it? And how in the world will we. Then Anishani and Neil Kopp, who I've made all these films with, who produced them all. They, you know, sort of have the challenge of figuring out how we're gonna pull it off for whatever budget we have and all those things. Just getting in it with everybo and figuring out the big issues and the small ones and, I don't know, just kind of being in something with people. It's fun. I live a pretty unadventurous life usually. And when you make a film, you're definitely on an adventure.
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Kusha Navadar
Yeah. Finding the next adventure.
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Kelly Reichardt
Yeah.
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Kusha Navadar
Well, we've been talking to Kelly Reichardt, the director, screenwriter and editor, 30 year career and counting. The retrospective American Landscapes, the of Kelly Reichart. It kicks off Saturday at the Metrograph. Kelly, thank you so much for coming on.
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Kelly Reichardt
Thanks a lot for having me.
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McDonald's Customer
I'mma put you on, nephew.
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Kelly Reichardt
All right, unk. Welcome to McDonald's. Can I take your order, miss?
- [28:24]
McDonald's Customer
I've been hitting up McDonald's for years. Now it's back. We need snack wraps. What's a snack wrap? It's the return of something great. Snack wrap is back.
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