Gary Shteyngart's New Novel "Vera, or Faith"

Summary

Podcast Summary: All Of It with Alison Stewart – Episode Featuring Gary Shteyngart’s "Vera, or Faith"

Introduction

In this episode of All Of It, hosted by Alison Stewart on WNYC, the focus centers on Gary Shteyngart’s latest novel, Vera, or Faith. Released on July 22, 2025, the episode delves deep into the themes, characters, and creative process behind this thought-provoking work. Shteyngart, a New York Times bestselling author, joins Alison in the studio to discuss his new book, offering listeners an intimate look into his literary world.

Overview of "Vera, or Faith"

Vera, or Faith is set in a near-future America marked by technological advancements such as self-driving cars and assertive artificial intelligence. The novel explores a society where the government monitors citizens' locations and even tracks women’s menstrual cycles. A significant political movement within the story advocates for an "enhanced vote" for Americans whose ancestors arrived before or during the Revolutionary War, granting them increased voting power.

The protagonist, Vera, is a precocious 10-year-old girl grappling with her identity in a tumultuous family and a fracturing nation. She is half Korean, leading her on a quest to find her birth mother, a journey that highlights themes of belonging and self-discovery. The Washington Post aptly described the novel as initially sweet like “a cherry flavored gumdrop” but ultimately impactful, stating it “will burn a hole in your tongue” (00:07).

In-Depth Discussion with Gary Shteyngart

Writing Process and Challenges

Shteyngart shares insights into his writing process, revealing that Vera, or Faith is his seventh novel. He candidly discusses the struggles of getting his previous novels started, noting, “[...] it took me 51 days to write the first draft of this novel, which is the fastest” (04:25). He emphasizes the importance of persistence and adaptability, often repurposing elements from unsuccessful projects into new narratives.

Crafting a Child’s Perspective

Transitioning from adult-centric stories, Shteyngart found writing from a child’s perspective both challenging and rewarding. Reflecting on his own experiences, he explains, “I never really thought I would have a child [...] Their way of forming ideas is so fascinating” (07:06). This shift allowed him to explore fresh emotional depths, particularly through Vera’s quest for friendship and understanding in a politically charged environment.

Themes of Dystopia and Political Polarization

The novel presents a subtle yet pervasive descent into a dystopian society. Shteyngart illustrates how the political climate permeates daily life, especially through the eyes of a child. He remarks, “[...] Children know about all this stuff and they feel it very, very closely. And that reminded me of growing up in the Soviet Union” (08:46). This comparison underscores the novel’s exploration of authoritarianism and the erosion of democratic values.

Character Dynamics and Family Struggles

Vera’s family serves as a microcosm of broader societal issues. Her father, struggling to keep his magazine afloat, represents a failing establishment, while her stepmother embodies traditional expectations and the pressure to maintain familial stability. Vera’s relationship with her brother, Dylan, who benefits from the "enhanced vote," highlights the disparities and favoritism ingrained in the system.

Shteyngart introduces humor and poignancy through Vera’s interactions, such as her participation in a debate to support the very amendment that disenfranchises her. This ironic twist emphasizes the societal pressures on youth to conform and succeed within an increasingly competitive and divided landscape (17:01).

Personal Reflections and Societal Commentary

Drawing from his background—growing up in the Soviet Union and witnessing his immigrant parents’ struggles—Shteyngart infuses the novel with authentic socio-political commentary. He reflects on the challenges of raising children in a polarized environment, questioning the societal emphasis on hyper-competitiveness and success from an early age. “[...] how are we raising our children?” he asks, prompting listeners to consider the long-term impacts of such pressures on the younger generation (12:41).

Notable Quotes and Insights

• On Writing Persistence: “You may be writing three more novels before the one you really want to be writing hits” (04:31).

• On Children's Awareness: “Kids know about all this stuff and they feel it very, very closely” (07:06).

• On Political Satire: “Whenever [the dominant group] feels threatened in any way, needs to put on this air of actually being marginalized” (20:16).

Humor and Personal Anecdotes

Amidst the heavy themes, Shteyngart brings humor into the conversation, discussing his unexpected reputation as a men's style icon and his newfound passion for watches. This light-hearted segment showcases his multifaceted personality and provides a relatable balance to the novel's darker elements.

Conclusion

Gary Shteyngart’s Vera, or Faith offers a compelling exploration of a society teetering on the brink of dystopia through the innocent yet insightful perspective of a child. In this episode of All Of It, Alison Stewart and Shteyngart engage in a rich dialogue that not only unpacks the novel’s intricate narrative and themes but also mirrors the very cultural and societal questions the show aims to explore. For listeners seeking a nuanced understanding of contemporary culture and its future trajectories, this episode serves as an enlightening and engaging resource.

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Timestamps & Notable Quotes

• Introduction of "Vera, or Faith": 00:07
• Gary on Writing Challenges: 02:17 – “It took me a couple of tries to get the last three novels started.”
• On Writing from a Child’s Perspective: 07:06
• Exploring Political Climate through a Child’s Eyes: 08:46
• Humorous Take on Style and Watches: 26:07 – “I am wearing. This is called a Ming.”

Note: Sections such as funding appeals, advertisements, and unrelated digressions have been excluded to maintain focus on the episode's core content.

Transcript

[Alison Stewart]

This is all of it. I'm Alison Stewart live from the WNYC studios in soho. Thank you for spending part of your day with us. I am grateful you are here. A quick notice. As you've been hearing, public media is being defunded by the federal government. For New York Public Radio, this means a loss of nearly $6 million over the next two years. We need listeners like you to fill this funding gap. Join [e-mail] donate coming up on today's show, we'll celebrate the life and work of Malcolm Jamal Warner. We'll speak with Robert tsitsima and Melissa McCart about where to find the best burgers in this city. And we want to hear about the summer jobs you had when you were a teenager. That's our plan. So let's get this started with Gary Steingart's new novel Vera or Faith. A precocious 10 year old girl named Vera attempts to make sense of the world around her in Gary Steingart's new novel Vera or Faith. It's quite a world set in American, not the too distant future where there are self driving cars and AI has a bit of an attitude and the government tracks your location and even women's periods. There's a political movement brewing to grant Americans whose descendants arrived before or during the Revolutionary War with something called an enhanced vote. Vera is very smart. The book is told from her point of view. She's close to her dad, sort of a potty mouthed man who owns a magazine he's desperately trying to make profitable. Her blue blooded Bostonian stepmother is busy being, well, busy and her little brother Dylan is both annoying and entitled. She wonders about her birth mom. She knows she's from Korea and Vera wants to find her. The Washington Post said in its review Steingart's new novel tastes at first like a cherry flavored gumdrop, but it'll burn a hole in your tongue. Vera Faith joins us now, is on shelves now and Gary Steingart joins us in studio. Gary, it's nice to see you.

[Gary Steingart]

Oh so great to be back. Thank you.

[Alison Stewart]

Alison, I have to ask you, coming off your last this big hit novel, it was our get lit with all book club pick, our country friends. It took you a couple of tries to get this novel started. What happened?

[Gary Steingart]

Actually it took me a couple of tries tries to get the last three novels started. My new sort of M.O. is I write 200 pages of a novel. Then I meet with my wonderful editor at Random House and he says Gary, what do you think this novel's about? Which is his way of saying, this is not working out. So I always have a plan B, because I know that he, you know, that he's appropriately critical of some attempts. So I wanted to write a novel. I was on a plane for 14 hours from Tokyo and I was watching Kramer vs Kramer, that old Dustin Hoffman vs Meryl Streep. And I thought, huh, families falling apart are interesting. This kid, I think Bobby or Billy, I can't remember his name, but something with a B. What's his point of view as Dustin Hoffman and Meryl Streep battle it out? And I was also thinking of what Maisie knew, the Henry James novel. So there's a couple of small attempts at writing from children's point of view in problematic families. And here it's a problematic family, but also a problematic country, the United States, few years, very few years in the future. So Vera has a lot of things to get through in this very short novel.

[Alison Stewart]

When you're pivoting from one story idea to the other, do you just put it in a draw and start anew, or do you take pieces of the previous story you were working on?

[Gary Steingart]

Well, interestingly enough, there was a. The novel I was writing was this multi generational saga. Sorry, I'm yawning as I'm saying it. It was so boring, just the thought of it. A multi generational saga, but with a spy, a Russian spy. I've been very much into what my former homeland is doing to the rest of the world. And there is a spy motif not to give, but there is a spy motif in Viera or Faith as well. So not everything dies when your editor says no. You can go back and use some of it for different purposes.

[Alison Stewart]

What do you do when something just. It just won't work out. You want it to work out, but it won't.

[Gary Steingart]

Well, thank God for psychiatry. You know, there are people who help us get through. Look, you know, like I said, there's. I mean, I teach creative writing at Columbia, and I always tell my students who are writing their first novel, you may be writing three more novels before the one you really want to be writing hits. I know that that's not something people want to hear. Now. This is my seventh book. So by now you think I'd be better at getting it right from the first attempt. But, you know, it took me 51 days to write the first draft of this novel, which is the fastest.

[Alison Stewart]

That's really fast.

[Gary Steingart]

It's really fast. But I've wasted. Not wasted. Sorry. Let me correct myself. I spent two years Cultivating the failed novel and then, you know, guiding myself into this.

[Alison Stewart]

Are you someone who revisits what you write or do you put it away, come back, write more, put it away, come back, write more. Or do you sort of revisit along the way?

[Gary Steingart]

I'm a very, you know, I treat this very much like a job. So every day I have to write three pages, you know, oh, really? Rain or shine, the three pages have to be produced. Whether they're good or not, I don't know, but they're gonna be there.

[Alison Stewart]

Is that for just practice? In a way. So it's a time.

[Gary Steingart]

Yeah. I mean, I don't think once you have an idea, I don't think it makes any sense to sort of dawdle with it. Now maybe I'm wrong. And by the way, a large part of what I do, I write about two hours a day to get those three pages, but I also spend about two, three hours walking around, whether in the city or upstate New York in the countryside, and taking copious notes of what I'm going to write about. So the process of actually writing is shorter than the process of thinking about what I'm going to write and also coming up with, you know, so when I'm writing Vera, I'm thinking, okay, she's a 10 year old girl. My son at the time was 10 years old and he had friends who were that age. So what do they sound like? What are their problems? What are bits of dialogue that make sense? So you're sort of cultivating what's going to happen on the page the next day.

[Alison Stewart]

That's hard for writers because you can go for a two hour walk and people don't think you're doing anything. You're like, no, I'm thinking, I'm thinking about a character. I'm observing what's going on around me.

[Gary Steingart]

Yeah, it's so funny. I sometimes think of walking as my job. You know, walking while thinking is my job. I started listening to a lot of podcasts and I know they're wonderful, but I realized that at least in New York, when I put on my earbuds all the time, I'm missing out on some of the greatest conversation in the world because New Yorkers are so hilarious. And so, you know, yesterday I took off my earbuds and I walked through Washington Square park and there were like five amazing fights going on between couples. I'm like, thank you. You've just, you know, I know what to write next. Now.

[Alison Stewart]

My guest is New York Times best selling author Gary Steingart. His new novel is called Vera or Faith. Vera has a 10 year old as our protagonist. What was interesting for you to Write from a 10 year old's point of view?

[Gary Steingart]

It's funny, I've always written very, very adult novels where adults usually hang around and have relationships and, you know, all kinds of problems surface. But, but I've had a child. I never really thought I would have a child. I thought I'd be one of those artists who commit themselves to art to such an extent. But then the child started speaking and I thought, whoa, he's pretty interesting. You know, I thought he's a lot more interesting than many of my peers whom I love. But you know, I could pretty much predict what's going to happen when we all sit down to our martinis and steaks and whatnot. But with a child you never really know what's going to happen. Their way of forming ideas is so fascinating. Now I grew up in the Soviet Union, so this was a authoritarian system. And watching my kid grow up in the current political environment was interesting in the same sense that when I was a kid I knew the members of the Politburo because I was living in such a society where you had to know everything political. It was everywhere, everywhere you turned this question. And the same thing I noticed with my son and his smaller friends. They would reference Trump all the time. So there's a kind of thing when you happen, when you're living in a very polarized environment where politics isn't just something because I don't know, should a 10 year old know this much about politics? Maybe, but they should also be having fun on a different level. But they feel, and it's not just politics, it's the environment, it's all the other, all the inequities of life in America today. Kids know about all this stuff and they feel it very, very closely. And that reminded me of growing up in the Soviet Union. So I thought a 10 year old child growing up in a slightly even worse off America than today would be an interesting and with way worse parents than my kid hopefully has. I think we're pretty okay. But not his parents though.

[Alison Stewart]

How would you describe the Bradford Schmulkin?

[Gary Steingart]

Yeah, so the mom, Ann Bradford, is a Boston blue blood and she takes care of these two kids. Her husband keeps asking her to please get a job because he's barely making it, but she's committed to these kids and the husband is, I don't know, I mean, he's working, he has a magazine which is always failing he's always trying to make it into the New Yorker and it's always not happening. He's trying to sell it to a musk like billionaire character, which is also not happening throughout the book. So most of the book is him ignoring his kids or being very absent with them while lying on the couch doing social media in his underwear and constantly reminding everyone that social media is what pays the bills around here. Which I don't think it does, but in any case. So you know. But in this, Vera also has, because she doesn't look like her brother, she is half Korean, so her birth mom is somewhere else. And a big chunk of the book is her trying to find her mom results in, spoiler alert, a long journey outside of New York. And let me add one last thing, because this is, I think the most important part of this book for me is this is also the story of a 10 year old child who's precocious in some ways emotionally, maybe not so, but also dying to make a first friend.

[Unnamed Guest]

Yes, she is.

[Gary Steingart]

Which I was at age 10 and I still am at age 53 any day now. But she really is trying to make a friend. And I think that is. And yeah, spoiler alert, she does make a friend. And when I was writing those scenes, that is about as emotional as I've ever gotten writing my own work because, you know, I've had characters who fall in love and it's unrequited love and things like that. But there's nothing as sensitive in a way as a 10 year old child putting herself on the line trying to make a friend. And so much more is at stake there than I think what happens when you're much older and you've already made many decisions socially and emotionally?

[Unnamed Guest]

The novel has sort of a specific rhythm to it. Vera speaks in quotations, and I mean quotations like quotations. People can't see me on the radio. Right. Could you explain why you have her speak in these sentences that she kind of has overheard before?

[Gary Steingart]

Right. So I find it interesting the way kids pick up language. It's absolutely fascinating. And I know my son has always been a vacuum cleaner when it comes to languages, but so was I when I was a kid. My issue was more that I came to America when I was seven years old. So for me it was picking up English in general and the whole family was doing it. We were all writing on these IBM punch cards of the 1970s and 80s. We would write on one side the English and on the other side the Russians. So we'd have you know, heart attack, and then the Russian work, you know, stroke, mortgage, diabetes, all the things that kill Russians by age 30 usually. So all that stuff was. And I was constantly absorbing all these words. And Vera, even though obviously she's an American born, is also trying to make sense of what her parents are talking about, because when they fight, it's at a very high level. So she's trying to figure out what they're saying, and she's also trying to figure out what the political climate is. The problem is she's such a sponge for language that then she brings it into school and then she starts using these words. And the kids around her are like, what is wrong with you? They start calling her Facts Girl, because she seems like to be so. And that was exactly what was happening to me. I've done a couple of readings around the country, and so many, especially women who, you know, were also kind of very anxious children. I think a lot of readers were anxious children because I think that's almost a requirement for becoming a reader. And a lot of them were saying, wow, I really feel seen, because that was exactly me at 10 years old. I was absolutely in love with language. And then when I played with my peers, they're like, what are you talking about?

[Alison Stewart]

Did you have that sort of same idea with language, or was yours colloquial? Because I remember going to college with a man who is now like a world famous oncologist, but he learned to speak English watching cartoons. And at 18, everything was like, hi, buddy. I mean, he doesn't speak like that now, but initially he spoke like a cartoon when he came into college.

[Gary Steingart]

God, that is very funny. That would be a very funny show, I think. Let's see, when I was learning English, I think it was. God, it was funny because I just did a reading in Dallas. It was the show Dallas. So for a while I had this very stupid, very fake Larry Hagman accent. And I'd be like, hi, darlin'. You know, I was growing up in Queens, it was like, what is wrong with this man? This boy? Sorry. I was like nine years old, so. And it'd be kind of like half Russian, half texting. Hi, darling. You know, it was complete. This is why I didn't make friends until very much later. But yes, I agree. And so, you know, what she's sort of ripping off is very high level stuff that, you know, throughout the book, the question is, how are we raising our children? It's a very interesting question, especially places like New York, Palo Alto, you know, where kids are Supposed to be super successful or death. You know, they have to succeed and we cram so much into them. I'm very familiar with these gifted and talented programs. That obviously is a very controversial part of New York education. But to me it's a very. I went to Stuyvesant myself. My kid goes to one of these schools. So, you know, it's. And I love them on some level, but I also wonder, like, is it the fact that the pie keeps getting smaller and smaller that we need our kids to be so, so super successful? And Vera always talks about, you know, her parents always tell her grades don't matter, and yet they also like telling her, you know, if you don't get into Swarthmore, we're in big, big trouble, you know.

[Alison Stewart]

I'm gonna ask you to read the first page of Vera or Faith so people can get a little grip of what we're talking about. This is Gary Steingart reading from his book.

[Gary Steingart]

So the first chapter is called she had to hold the Family Together. School started and it was awful. Predictably awful, as Anne mom would say. A self fulfilling prophecy, she might add, of Vera's disdain for school. Ann mom was always predicting things in the near future. I'm the Nostradamus of two weeks from now, she told Vera over and over again. And Vera knew the correct social response was to laugh because an mom was trying to be as witty as Daddy. Though when Vera became a teenager in three years she could roll her eyes because she had seen it done on television and sometimes on the devices Anne didn't allow her. She added Nostradamus to her things I Still need to know Diary. The hallways of the school were a faded red and pink and orange, and there were motivational posters and funny sayings from the Peanuts gang and dusty green floors and mesh over the windows looking onto the rump of another sad uptown building. Daddy compared the color scheme to an ice cream shop in hell and Aunt mom had yelled at him not to use that language. You know she's going to imitate you. She worships you, she said. Or to talk the school down. The school was a point of pride for Daddy because you had to take a test when you were only four years old to get in and you needed to score in the 99th percentile, although Vera had overheard that Dylan had been admitted because they wanted to keep siblings together and she thought the contrast between their intelligence to be exquisite and delectable. Two words an mom wanted her to drop if she were to make any friends at her school.

[Alison Stewart]

That's Gary Stengart reading from his book Vera or Faith. We'll have more after a quick break. This is all of it. You are listening to all of IT on wnyc. I'm Alison Stewart. In studio with me is author Gary Steingart. His new novel is called Vera or Faye. It's about a family that's trying to stay together as the nation falls apart. In the novel, there's a push for this new amendment that would give enhanced voting rights to Americans who landed on the shores of our continent before or during the Revolutionary War. How did we get here?

[Gary Steingart]

It's interesting. The book came out July 8th.

[Alison Stewart]

Oh my.

[Gary Steingart]

And yes. And July 9th, JD Vance said that people who can trace their heritage back to the Revolutionary War were exceptional. He did not say that, as in Vera or Faith, that they would be granted 5/3 of a vote, the 5/3 compromise that would allow them this enhanced vote. But if that were to happen, would I be incredibly surprised? No, I wouldn't be. So much of the past 12 years has been about talking about ways to sort of separate different tranches of Americans, with some Americans having more rights than others. Obviously, that's always been the case in this country, but now it's been a very, very explicit push. You know, Trump has been talking recently about denaturalizing citizens. Now, I am an immigrant. If I am to keep saying things about this administration, writing books like Barrier of Faith, is there a chance that down the line I will be asked to return to my country of origin, Russia, which, you know, would be, you know, kind of a jail sentence for me, given what I've written about Putin myself. So it's an interesting idea of what this kind of system does in terms of making people feel like really don't belong here, that there are Americans and there's real Americans. And in this family, in Vera's family, Vera, because she's half Korean, is not a real American. Her brother, who can trace his heritage back to the Revolutionary War through his blue blood Boston mom, is so in.

[Unnamed Guest]

The future, yeah, he's kind of adult.

[Gary Steingart]

He's a little bit of adult, as brothers are, can be younger brothers. But the sort of sad thing that begins to happen is that Vera is on a kind of debate team in her class and she has to debate pro this five thirds Amendment. So she ends up in this position where she is advocating for her own disenfranchisement. But because she's so she's been taught to be so competitive in these very competitive schools, she's dying to win Even though what she's talking about is making herself three fifths of a person.

[Alison Stewart]

Also the subtext that is kids dying to win. Kids constantly being tested at 4 to get into schools.

[Unnamed Guest]

I just have to say that out loud. Something I got in the book.

[Gary Steingart]

Yeah, no, I remember, you know, when my kid tested into one of these schools and my wife took him to the test and she was in a bathroom and there was, you know, this was age 4 and there was a mom screaming at a 4 year old kid for not doing well enough and the kid was crying and I thought, wow. I mean, I can't think of another society throughout history. I'm sure maybe it existed in the Paleolithic or Bronze age where we put kids through this much stress for. I don't know for what.

[Unnamed Guest]

Vera even feels it. She corrects a teacher and she ends up getting a B minus because of that.

[Gary Steingart]

Yes. One of the plot lines of this is that I think she gets a B. I think she actually gets a B plus. It's not even that bad. It's not even that bad. But her mom has to go into school and negotiate the grade to an A minus.

[Alison Stewart]

Unbelievable.

[Gary Steingart]

It's really funny.

[Unnamed Guest]

In the novel, Vera and her family sometimes witness protests called the march of the hated or the moths. Where does this come from?

[Gary Steingart]

The people in the moths are usually white people. Some have privilege, but some are kind of cosplaying and dressing in mechanics overalls and stuff and they're just shouting about how hated they are and how we gotta get rid of all this anti white hatred. Even though as they're about to get this 5/3 of a vote. So I think it's part of the interesting. I mean we've seen this in other societies as well where there's a dominant group and the dominant group, whenever it feels threatened in any way, needs to put on this air of actually being marginalized. Even while there are entire groups that are being actually marginalized economically, socially and in this case politically. So I thought it'd be fun to get all these people together and have them march down, you know, march down 3rd Avenue complaining about all the good stuff they have here.

[Unnamed Guest]

As I was doing research to interview you, I found your piece in the Guardian reflecting on your parents decision to come to the United States from Soviet Union when you were seven years old, I believe it was. How much of that time were you able to recall and did you touch on that time when you were writing this book?

[Gary Steingart]

Yeah, I actually was surprisingly enough able to recall quite a bit of it. I Had parents who were very intellectually engaged. My mother was teaching me piano even when I was a kid. My dad was taking long walks with me and explaining history and explaining politics, but up to a point, because you could only say so much in the Soviet Union because you were worried your kid would sort of tattle on you. So even that was an interesting thing, the fact that I had to watch what he had to watch what he was saying. And I wonder at what point I'll have to watch if our society keeps going in the direction it's going, at what point I have to watch what I'm saying, both here at WNYC and in taking the very long walks I enjoy with my son. And the question is that I posed in that Guardian article is when does one say, well, maybe it's time to move somewhere else? Because that was the best decision my parents ever made. And they gave up so much in terms of jobs, culture, language. Obviously they had to learn English, but it was the best thing they could have done for me. Now we're not here yet in the States, despite it all, I think. But it's something to be, especially for those of us who have kids, it's something to consider. While of course the other part of it is to stay and to try to change the system as much as we can.

[Alison Stewart]

Try to fight, try to fight.

[Gary Steingart]

Which is another theme of this book. Who stays and who fights.

[Alison Stewart]

When you're imagining a dystopia in fiction, what aspects or what descent into fascism do you think about showing people? And on what level? Do you want it to be a subtle level? Do you want it to be a strong level? Because later in the book, I won't give it away, but I was like, whoa, it hits you hard, but then you realize it's really been there the whole time.

[Gary Steingart]

Yes, I'm so glad that you phrased it that way, because that's exactly what it is. Because this is set from the point of view of a 10 year old. You have to think of what the priorities for her are. Now, of course, the political system is everywhere she looks. You know those marches we just talked about, the way this Constitutional Convention is being used in school as a kind of teaching moment of what might happen to the country. It's all there. But making a friend and keeping her family together are the most important things in her life. They take up, you know, 70, 80% of her life, then the story. And so we're kind of. We're not, I hope we're not lulled into the sense that this is just a, you know, young. It's not a YA book, of course, but it's, you know, it's interesting. Readers have said that they've given this to their 12 year old kids to read and that it went over fine. There's some language, but I guess that that might work for some families, for some children, but for me, that it's only in the last 20, 30 pages, especially as she begins to leave the confines of New York, that you begin to see what the rest of this picture looks like. And it's a much, much scarier picture. But her aunt, mom, that is her stepmom, keeps saying that we never thought what was happening there would come to our doorstop, to our doorstep. And that's exactly what this book is about. How all these things, you don't think they'll happen, you don't think they'll happen, they happen. And then you say okay, okay, but this other thing's not going to happen. And then that other thing happens. And I think we've seen that in so many societies around the world, from Argentina to Brazil to Hungary to Israel to Turkey, I mean to Russia, obviously the list goes on and on and on. This won't happen. It happens. And then what?

[Alison Stewart]

I don't know if you've heard, but we've been defunded by the government.

[Gary Steingart]

Well, exactly. No, NPR won't be defunded by the government away. It's been defunded by the government. And shows like this may not exist at some point. So what happens? Do we move to Australia where I think public radio and television is being very well funded? I don't know. And also we're privileged enough that possibly we have, you know, some of us have the chance to just pick up stakes and move in wonderful, lovely Melbourne, which I love dearly. But what happens? Is that wrong to leave a place that is being so assaulted by powerful people is, is liquidating your own power for your own sake and of course for the sake of your children. Is that worthwhile? I don't know. These are very heady questions. I assure readers this is a funny book because I know we're getting super depressing. It's funny, but at the same time, beneath all that humor, I'm a Soviet Ashkenazi pessimist, a SAP. And I think the glass isn't even half full. It's like there is no glass. But at the same time everything that's happening makes me believe in that half full glass because I here I am. Whatever little power I have, I do Want to use it? Because I've seen what happens when you.

[Unnamed Guest]

Don'T land on a happy note.

[Gary Steingart]

Thank you.

[Alison Stewart]

The New York Times recently released a.

[Unnamed Guest]

Piece calling you a men's style icon.

[Alison Stewart]

I raved til you took a drink.

[Gary Steingart]

I spit out that water. Oh my God. Oh my good God.

[Unnamed Guest]

It talks about how you enjoy accessories, especially watches.

[Gary Steingart]

Oh boy.

[Unnamed Guest]

Is this true?

[Gary Steingart]

Well, yeah. I mean, and I really apologize for, for all of this. I always dressed like a, like the schlubbiest person ever. I mean, I probably, I could have been ranked. I remember in my yearbook picture in high school, I wore a jacket that later caught on fire. It was made out of some polyester.

[Alison Stewart]

So much polyester.

[Gary Steingart]

So much polyester. I mean. And I think I was just walking down the street. I think the sun, the sun set it on fire. And I was like, like, God, I gotta go to my graduation. But I'm aflame. I don't know, you know, So I actually didn't make it to graduation because of that fire. But lately. Is this a midlife crisis perhaps? Because actually it was in 2016, when certain things began to happen that I began to fall in love. First with watches, a terrifying middle aged hobby, and then with dressing in this. There's a store in New York called the Armory. They have two branches where all these bizarre but beautifully dressed male dresswear nerds show up. And it's really something to see. I mean, not all of them are super wealthy or work in finance. There's just this is what they love. And they dress so beautifully in these kind of mid century outfits. And oh my God, when I enter that place, I just feel so at home. And if you asked me that three years ago, I would have said you're crazy. I'm a, you know, I care about the life of the mind, but yeah, that life is getting smaller and smaller.

[Unnamed Guest]

Okay, we have a question about what watch are you wearing?

[Gary Steingart]

I am wearing. This is called a Ming. This is a very strange watch. It's made. Some of these watches are now literally made by like one person in a particular country. I know, it's gotten that crazy. And Ming Thien is, he's in Malaysia. Some of these components are made in Switzerland, but he designs the watches in Malaysia. So sometimes you get to travel around the world. I've done articles where you meet the maker of your watch. Yeah, it's very bespoke. It's crazy.

[Alison Stewart]

The name of the new novel is Vera or Faith.

[Unnamed Guest]

My guest has been author Gary Steingart.

[Alison Stewart]

Gary, thanks for coming in.

[Gary Steingart]

Thanks so much.

[Unnamed Announcer]

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