Orin O'Brien, First Woman Hired for NY Phil, Profiled in Oscar-Nominated Short

Summary

Podcast Summary: "Orin O'Brien, First Woman Hired for NY Phil, Profiled in Oscar-Nominated Short"

Podcast Information:

• Title: All Of It
• Host: Alison Stewart
• Episode: Orin O'Brien, First Woman Hired for NY Phil, Profiled in Oscar-Nominated Short
• Release Date: February 24, 2025
• Description: ALL OF IT is a show about culture and its consumers, aiming to engage thinkers, doers, makers, and creators about the what and why of their work.

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Introduction

In this compelling episode of ALL OF IT hosted by Alison Stewart, the spotlight is on Orrin O'Brien, the first woman hired by the New York Philharmonic (NY Phil). The discussion centers around O'Brien's groundbreaking career, her modest approach to fame, and the recently released short documentary, "Only Girl in the Orchestra," directed by her niece, Molly O'Brien. The documentary has garnered critical acclaim, including an Academy Award nomination.

Background on Orrin O'Brien

Alison Stewart introduces Orrin O'Brien as a trailblazer in the world of classical music. Hired in 1966 at the age of 31, O'Brien played the double bass for the NY Phil for an impressive 55 years. Despite her significant contributions, she remained largely out of the limelight.

Alison Stewart [00:50]: "Orrin O'Brien would not have liked [recognition]. She eschewed the limelight even though she broke through a glass ceiling."

Breaking Barriers in the New York Philharmonic

O'Brien's entry into the NY Phil was a monumental step for women in classical music. Her perseverance paid off after three auditions, encouraged by her teacher, Fred Zimmerman.

Molly O'Brien [08:28]: "She auditioned three times. It was on the third time that she got in."

Her role was pivotal, challenging the gender norms of the time and paving the way for future generations of female musicians.

Family and Early Influences

O'Brien hailed from a family deeply rooted in the arts. Her father, George O'Brien, was a prolific actor with over 80 Hollywood films, including significant roles in John Ford's "Iron Horse" and F.W. Murnau's "Sunrise." Her mother, Marguerite Churchill, was a Broadway actress and model who supported the family from a young age after her father passed away.

Molly O'Brien [04:13]: "Her mother took on a second job at one point to pay for bass lessons."

The supportive environment fostered O'Brien's musical talents, emphasizing the importance of the arts in personal development.

Choosing the Double Bass

Originally a pianist, O'Brien's transition to the double bass was serendipitous. During high school, her desire to join the orchestra was redirected when her prospective position was filled by a piano player, leading her to embrace the double bass.

Molly O'Brien [05:58]: "She fell in love with the tone, with the beauty of the double bass. It's an unsung hero of the orchestra."

Her dedication to the instrument not only highlighted its significance but also showcased her commitment to ensemble harmony over solo recognition.

Fame and Personal Philosophy

Despite her achievements, O'Brien remained humble and focused on her role within the ensemble rather than personal fame. Her aversion to the spotlight was influenced by witnessing her parents' relationship with fame in Hollywood.

Molly O'Brien [11:25]: "She turned her back on all of that, moved to New York City, picked up a 19th-century instrument and said, I'm going to be part of an ensemble."

O'Brien's philosophy centered on collaboration and collective success, valuing the contributions of her peers over individual accolades.

Teaching and Legacy

O'Brien's influence extended beyond performance. She was passionate about teaching, mentoring hundreds of students worldwide, with several joining the NY Phil.

Molly O'Brien [12:45]: "The film is really about her philosophy of life, which is if you want to be a happy person, learn how to play the second fiddle and pass it on, become a teacher, be generous."

Her legacy is not only in her performances but also in the generations of musicians she inspired and trained.

Challenges and Apartment Relocation

Life in New York City presented its own challenges, notably O'Brien's struggle with maintaining her long-term, rent-stabilized apartment. After over 50 years, neglect and deteriorating conditions forced her to relocate, marking a significant personal upheaval.

Molly O'Brien [13:43]: "She'd been there for over 50 years, so it was a great bargain. But the landlords were neglectful, and she couldn't live there anymore."

This episode highlights the personal sacrifices and challenges faced by even the most accomplished individuals.

The Documentary: "Only Girl in the Orchestra"

Directed by Molly O'Brien, the documentary "Only Girl in the Orchestra" delves into O'Brien's life, capturing her dedication to ensemble work and teaching. The film emphasizes the joy of collaboration and the beauty of being part of a collective effort.

Molly O'Brien [07:19]: "What she's looking at is her fellow musicians and artists. The joy of ensemble is what I think is in her eyes."

The score, composed by Laura Cartman, reflects this philosophy, incorporating isolated double bass segments that resonate with the film's themes.

Molly O'Brien [14:19]: "Laura operated on the same philosophy that Orin O'Brien has taught us all, to work in ensemble."

The documentary has been lauded for its intimate portrayal of O'Brien's life and her profound impact on the classical music world, earning an Academy Award nomination.

Notable Quotes

• Molly O'Brien [02:44]: "I want to make a movie about you." (Regarding her initial pitches to her aunt)
• Orrin O'Brien [10:35]: "She doesn't want any part of it. She wants to be seen as a professional musician."
• Molly O'Brien [12:45]: "If you want to be a happy person, learn how to play the second fiddle and pass it on."

Conclusion

This episode of ALL OF IT paints a comprehensive portrait of Orrin O'Brien, celebrating her as a pioneer who valued collective harmony over personal fame. Through the insightful conversation with her niece, Molly O'Brien, listeners gain a deep appreciation for O'Brien's contributions to the NY Phil, her teaching legacy, and the philosophical underpinnings that guided her illustrious career. The documentary "Only Girl in the Orchestra" serves as a testament to her enduring influence in the world of classical music.

For those interested in exploring O'Brien's remarkable journey further, "Only Girl in the Orchestra" is available for streaming on Netflix.

Transcript

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[Alison Stewart]

This is all of it on WNYC. I'm Alison Stewart. In 1965, there wasn't a woman to be found playing in the New York Philharmonic. In 1966, there was one. Her name was Orrin O'Brien. She was 31 years old and she played double bass and she did so for 55 years. Now you would think we would all know her name. There would be a day named after her or possibly a street. Well, Orrin O'Brien would not have liked that at all. O'Brien, who is now nearly 90, eschewed the limelight even though she broke through a glass ceiling. A new short documentary explains why it's called the Only Girl in the Orchestra and has been nominated for an Academy Award. You can stream it now on Netflix. Joining me now is the film's director, Molly O'Brien. She's a longtime filmmaker who was a producer on several films recently, including a 2023 documentary on Sherry Height. Director Molly O'Brien, who is also the niece of Orin O'Brien. Welcome to all of it.

[Molly O'Brien]

Thank you, Alison. It's a pleasure to be here. I'm a big WNYC fan.

[Alison Stewart]

Love it. So when you were a child and you came to New York to visit your aunt, when did you realize what she had done? That she was a groundbreaker?

[Molly O'Brien]

You know, it was family legend. She was a legend in the family as much as she wanted to be not considered that. So I can't remember a time where I didn't know that my Aunt Oren was the first woman ever hired to be a full time musician with the New York Philharmonic. When I was 11, I came to New York City. I visited New York with my mom and we went to go see the New York Philharmonic and Leonard Bernstein had come back to conduct a Mahler piece. And it was during that concert that I really realized what a master she was and what a rare and beautiful life she had led. And was leading.

[Orrin O'Brien]

You begged her for years to let you make a movie. What did the pitch sound like?

[Molly O'Brien]

Well, for about nine years, the pitch was, I want to make a movie about you. I want to make a movie about you. And that didn't work because she didn't want a movie to be made about her. A biopic was not in her plans. However, when I listened. When I really listened to her and changed the film and the direction, the film was going to go in from just a biopic to a film that focuses on the joy of playing in an ensemble, the joy of being in the background and. And the joy of teaching classical music and the double bass. She said, yes. And I think I. I've kept that promise to her. The film is very much about all of those things.

[Orrin O'Brien]

How did she get her name?

[Molly O'Brien]

Oh, that's a great question. Oren in is an old Irish name, and I believe I'm blanking what it means. Oh, my goodness. It'll come to me in a moment. But her middle name is Yanez with a Y, and that's after the Santa Inez mission just above Santa Barbara, where her parents met and fell in love. But Orin is a Gaelic name and I'm forgetting the meaning of it. We'll come to it, I'm sure.

[Orrin O'Brien]

So let's talk about her parents. Her parents are pretty famous movie stars. Tell us a little bit about.

[Molly O'Brien]

Well, Orrin's father and my grandfather was an actor named George O'Brien who made over 80 films in Hollywood. He got to start with John Ford, starring in the 1924 movie Iron Horse, a silent film. His most famous role was as the man in FW Murnau's Sunrise, Also the director of the original Nosferatu. But he went on to make many, many Westerns, especially. He started as a stuntman, so he did all his own trick riding. He could flip over a horse at full gall and that sort of thing. He was. He was really athletic and quite. Quite masterful in those kinds of. In that kind of work. And then her mother, my grandmother, is Marguerite Churchill. She made about 12 films in Hollywood before that. She was a Broadway actress and model who supported her whole family from the age of four, when her father died, as an actress and a model.

[Orrin O'Brien]

Would you consider them actively engaged parents.

[Molly O'Brien]

With Orin in 2025 speak. But, I mean, I understood, yes, I know that Orin would describe them as incredibly supportive. She never once felt that she couldn't do anything because she was a girl. No one ever made her feel that they recognized her Talents. Early on, they. Her mother took on a second job at one point to pay for bass lessons. And, you know, they were parents who really understood that finding meaning and purpose through the. Through the arts is one of life's true joys, and every child should be exposed to that. Yeah.

[Orrin O'Brien]

How did she pick the double bass, of all things?

[Molly O'Brien]

Well, she played the piano. And then when she was in high school, she tells the story better than I will in the film, but she saw the orchestra, the. The high school orchestra. And she was entranced and ran up to the conductor afterward and said, I want to join the orchest. And he said, well, what do you play? She said, the piano. He said, ah, we have too many piano players now, but there's four double basses over there in the closet. Go pick one, practice for six months, you come back, you can be in the orchestra. And then she fell in love with the tone, with the. Just the beauty of the double bass. It's an instrument that is an unsung hero. I think, of the orchestra. And as you'll hear in the soundtrack of the Only Girl in the Orchestra, so beautifully arranged by Laura Cartman, our composer, you'll hear in that. In that soundtrack, the. Just the double bass by itself isolated, and it's just. It gets under your skin. It's really a beautiful instrument.

[Orrin O'Brien]

We're talking with director Molly O'Brien. The name of the film is the Only Girl in the Orchestra nominated for an Oscar in the short documentary category. You know, when we watch Orin play, she's so emotive when she plays, her eyes are just going. Where does she look? I know it's an odd thing, but watching her eyes, she's looking something.

[Molly O'Brien]

Wow. You know, that's a question for Oren. I know that Leonard Bernstein said that whenever he looked up at Orne when he was conducting the orchestra, she was always looking directly at him. And it baffled him because he felt like maybe she must have memorized every note of every. Every piece they play over 300 years of repertoire, which is. Which is astonishing and maybe true. She really enjoys playing in ensemble. She is not a soloist. And I think that's what I really wanted people to take away from this film. I think all of us have to play an ensemble, no matter what profession we're in or what family we're in. But we find ourselves in situations where everyone's elbowing each other out of the way to be in the spotlight, and Orin is begging us to settle in and be part of this ensemble and listen to what's going on around you. So what she's looking at is what she's. Which is what her fellow musicians and artists are doing around her. And the joy of ensemble is really what I think is in her eyes.

[Alison Stewart]

How did she meet Leonard Bernstein?

[Molly O'Brien]

Oh, well, her teacher is a wonderful double bassist, a master also in the New York Philharmonic for I think 36 years. A man named Fred Zimmerman, and he was, he played in the New York Philharmonic. So he encouraged Orrin to audition for the Philharmonic every single time she did. And she auditioned three times. It was on the third time that she got in. And so I'm sure that that's, you know, that's the Bernstein connection is through her teacher, Zimmerman.

[Alison Stewart]

Once she became part of the orchestra, the press came running. They had a lot of things to say about her. We'll talk about those in a minute, but let's listen to a clip from your film. This is her friend reading a piece of press that much later. This is their. They're now in their 80s and she's reading this piece of press to her. We can talk about it on the other side. This is from the Only Girl in the orchestra.

[Friend of Orrin O'Brien]

Wow. I bet you my father's had this. Probably because he seemed to know all about you.

[Molly O'Brien]

Oh, dear.

[Friend of Orrin O'Brien]

Orrin O'Brien.

[Molly O'Brien]

This is painful.

[Friend of Orrin O'Brien]

The newest member of the New York Philharmonic scurried into Philharmonic hall one rainy night and ignoring the musicians locker room, got dressed in a washroom. Ms. O'Brien, who is the daughter of old time western star George O'Brien and actress Marguerite Churchill, may be the best woman bassist in the world. To a man, they say Orrin is one of the boys, only Orin is one of the girls. The only girl, in fact, in the 104 member orchestra, a situation unique at the Philharmonic. So there is yet no place for her to dress.

[Alison Stewart]

They called her the pretty bassist, the best woman bassist. They commented on her curves. First of all, how did she feel about being called the best woman basis versus the best bassist?

[Molly O'Brien]

Well, I know that Oren really shuns the idea that there, you know, is this woman versus man dynamic in any arena. She doesn't want any part of it. She wants to be seen as a professional musician, which she was. And she is one of the best. So she didn't like that.

[Alison Stewart]

Would she consider herself a feminist?

[Molly O'Brien]

No, she wouldn't. Much to my chagrin and to many in my generation. But she didn't grow up with feminism. She had none of that. As an example, she's the same age as Gloria Steinem and she would consider herself lucky and she would consider herself a professional and she would not want you to consider her gender. And she doesn't consider it. So you know, she's definitely a pioneer in women's liberation, but the word feminist is not one that she would use.

[Orrin O'Brien]

She also doesn't like the attention, the bottom line. And I had to wonder if that had something to do with her parents relationship to fame.

[Molly O'Brien]

Yes. Growing up at the, during the birth of celebrity culture in Hollywood, California, she witnessed, you know, what that does to the adults in her life. And while she loved her parents very much, she saw that they craved the spotlight and she didn't want to have anything to do with that. So she turned her back on all of that, moved to New York City, picked up a 19th century or even earlier instrument and said, I'm going to be part of an ensemble. I am not going to be seeking the spotlight here. And yet, you know, the irony and the tension in the film, which is what makes drama and makes good film, is that she didn't want the spotlight but she was thrust into it when Leonard Bernstein made her the first full time woman in the New York Philharmonic. So she had to reckon with the spotlight even though she didn't want it. And then I, it doesn't go unnoticed on me that and my, my partners who made this film with me that, you know, we've done, done that all over again to her and thrust in the spotlight with the Only Girl in the Orchestra, the short documentary. But I think that again we've done it for a good reason. I think her story of being part of an ensemble and enjoying the work of the people around you, that's a story worth telling.

[Orrin O'Brien]

She also seems to love teaching.

[Molly O'Brien]

Exactly. So not only is the Only Girl in the Orchestra about her groundbreaking move into the New York Philharmonic in 1966, it's really about her philosophy of life, which is if you want to be a happy person, learn how to play the second fiddle and pass it on, become a teacher, be generous. You know, she, the things that her teacher Zimmerman taught her, she has pushed forward through hundreds and hundreds of students that are all over the globe. Three of them, or I think maybe four, are part of the New York Philharmonic double bass section. Now three or four of her students and one being of course David Grossman, who is highlighted in the film, who's a masterful player as well.

[Orrin O'Brien]

One thing we see in the film is we see her have to change apartments. That's for New Yorkers. Ah, change apartments. What are you Kidding me. How hard was it for her to move?

[Molly O'Brien]

It was really hard. I mean, as a New Yorker, you'll know about rent stabilized apartments. She'd been there since for over 50 years, so it was a great bargain and a beautiful, large, high ceilinged, gorgeous apartment. But the landlords were neglectful, and they were neglectful for many decades until it got it untenable. She couldn't live there anymore. The flooding, the black mold. We had to get her out. Yeah, but it was very hard.

[Orrin O'Brien]

Before I let you go, you mentioned Laura Cartman, her role in creating the score for you. What was her goal in creating the score?

[Molly O'Brien]

Well, Laura operated on the same philosophy that Orin O'Brien has taught us all, and that is to work in ensemble. And the first thing Laura did is send Oren a questionnaire. What are your top 10 orchestral pieces for the double bass? Orin immediately pointed Laura toward again her teacher Zimmerman's double bass quartet arrangements. And they settled. We all settled on Marler's second, Beethoven's second seventh, and a few other pieces that were we re recorded with Orin present, not as the producer, but as the approver. So Laura Cartman is incredibly collaborative and incredibly talented. And you know, of course, she's a Juilliard alumnus, so is Orin. So there's a lineage there that's all very, I don't know, just all very organic and terrific. And unfortunately, I had Covid during the recording, so I couldn't be there. But according to my producer, Lisa Remington, my amazing. It was a transcendental experience to be in that room with those four double bassists, all who were students of Orange in some way.

[Alison Stewart]

The name of the film is the Only Girl in the Orchestra. Its director, Molly O'Brien, has been my guest. It's nominated for an Academy Award, by the way, and you can stream it on Netflix. Molly, it was really nice to talk to you.

[Molly O'Brien]

Thank you, Alison. Nice to talk to you.

[Alison Stewart]

And we'll go out on a little bit of the score from Laura Cartman.

[Molly O'Brien]

It.

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