Sara Gran's New Choose Your Own Adventure Book

Summary

All Of It: Sara Gran's New Choose Your Own Adventure Book – Detailed Summary

Podcast Information:

• Title: All Of It
• Host: Alison Stewart, WNYC
• Episode: Sara Gran's New Choose Your Own Adventure Book
• Release Date: February 11, 2025
• Description: ALL OF IT is a show about culture and its consumers, aiming to engage thinkers, doers, makers, and creators in discussions about the what and why of their work.

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Introduction

In this episode of All Of It, host Alison Stewart welcomes Sarah Gran, the author of the newly released book, Little Mysteries, Nine Miniature Puzzles to Confuse, Enthrall and Delight. The conversation delves into Gran's literary universe, her creative processes, and the inspirations behind her work.

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Exploring Claire DeWitt: The World's Greatest Detective

Alison Stewart introduces Claire DeWitt, Gran's iconic character, highlighting her exceptional detective skills and the personal struggles she faces.

[00:37] Alison Stewart: "The character Claire DeWitt is not just a private eye. She's the world's greatest detective."

Sarah Gran emphasizes Claire's complexity, describing her as both troubled and misunderstood, traits that often accompany those at the pinnacle of their fields.

[01:46] Sarah Gran: "People who are sort of at the top of their field often have to do things in a different way to kind of move things forward. And that's what she does."

---

The Role of 'Detection' in Claire's World

The discussion shifts to Detection, a fictional book within Gran's series that serves as Claire DeWitt's spiritual and investigative guide.

Alison probes the significance of this internal guide, noting its emphasis on intuition over empirical evidence.

[02:08] Alison Stewart: "The Detection, which is fictional and she uses it as an inner spiritual guide... if we do not put it first and foremost always, there's no point in carrying on in the detection or in life."

Sarah Gran explains how Detection offers Claire a unique worldview, balancing mystery-solving with personal philosophy.

[02:38] Sarah Gran: "It's both a way of solving mysteries and sort of a worldview... listening to one's inner."

Gran also touches on her approach to integrating these passages, creating a dynamic and evolving guide rather than a static text.

[03:28] Sarah Gran: "I write the passages as needed... it being a sort of ever changing, ever shifting, evolving work."

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Inspirations Behind the Series

Gran shares her literary influences, citing Nelson Algren's Nonconformity as a pivotal inspiration that underscores the importance of staying true to oneself.

[04:09] Sarah Gran: "Nonconformity by Nelson Algren... staying true to oneself, of being who you are as a writer rather than chasing glory and money and fame."

She also references classic spiritual texts like the Tao Te Ching and the Bhagavad Gita, which inform her characters' philosophies and actions.

[04:57] Sarah Gran: "There's a lot that's sort of borrowed from the Tao Te Ching in there, the Bhagavad, the yoga sutras..."

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Connecting with Readers: The Bookstore Experience

Reflecting on her time working in bookstores, Gran reminisces about the joy of matching readers with the perfect books, a sentiment that fuels her passion for writing.

[05:02] Sarah Gran: "That's the best part about being a writer, is when you hear from someone that they picked up your book in a bookstore or even found it."

She shares anecdotes about how readers discovered her works in unexpected places, reinforcing the serendipitous nature of literary connections.

[05:10] Sarah Gran: "I love that they found the book in the garbage... it feels like such a privilege and such a gift."

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Introducing 'Little Mysteries: Nine Miniature Puzzles'

Alison Stewart transitions the conversation to Gran's latest work, Little Mysteries, exploring why she chose a short story format over a traditional novel.

[06:45] Alison Stewart: "It's coming. There will be another DeWitt novel... But let's concentrate on the short stories. Why not another Claire DeWitt novel?"

Sarah Gran explains her desire for creative freedom, allowing her to experiment with storytelling techniques without the constraints of mainstream publishing.

[07:46] Sarah Gran: "I could have complete freedom to kind of experiment with format and experiment with the way the words are actually laid out on the page."

Gran highlights the unique and playful formats within Little Mysteries, such as interactive elements inspired by children’s mystery books and choose-your-own-adventure narratives.

[08:54] Sarah Gran: "I hope people will cut it out and use it... experiment with the typography and the page layout."

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Publishing Independent: Founding Dreamland

Gran discusses her decision to establish her own publishing company, Dreamland, to fully realize her creative visions without external pressures.

[14:58] Sarah Gran: "It was just sort of a dream come true... to be more involved in the design, more involved in how they're introduced to the world."

She reflects on the challenges and rewards of independent publishing, emphasizing the importance of maintaining artistic control.

[15:46] Sarah Gran: "It wasn’t really about the money. It was about the dream come true of always being into books... to have a lot of creative freedom."

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Interactive Segment: Book Recommendations

Alison and Gran engage with listeners by offering personalized book recommendations based on the books callers love. This interactive segment showcases Gran's expertise and passion for literature.

1. Caller Robert from Piscataway:

   • Favorites: All the Old Knives by Steinhauer, books by Daniel Silva, Michael Connelly.
   • Gran’s Recommendation: Parable of the Sower and Kindred by Octavia Butler.

     [23:19] Sarah Gran: "They are quite prescient regarding the fires and the state of the city right now."

2. Caller Alicia from Queens:

   • Favorites: Angela's Ashes and The Grapes of Wrath.
   • Gran’s Recommendation: Savage Grace Memoir by Natalie Robbins.

     [21:16] Sarah Gran: "A memoir of a woman who was a very wealthy woman, had a really messed up family."

3. Caller Sheila from Oyster Bay:

   • Favorites: Hair with Amber Eyes by DeWalt, Possession by A.S. Byatt, Pride and Prejudice by Austen.
   • Gran’s Recommendation: Instance at the Finger Post by Ian Pears.

     [19:35] Sarah Gran: "It's a book told from multiple points of view... historical context, swept up in world events."

4. Caller Lucille from Hazlett, New Jersey:

   • Favorites: House of Sand and Fog, Handmaid's Tale, Wool by Hugh Howey.
   • Gran’s Recommendation: Gran suggests Gran's top picks despite not having personally read them, highlighting community favorites and current relevance.

5. Additional Suggestions:

   • Gran also recommends Middlemarch by George Eliot and an essay by David Grann on arson research, relevant to ongoing LA fires.

     [27:15] Sarah Gran: "It's about this incredibly fascinating field of arson science..."

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Navigating Disasters: Writing Amidst Chaos

The conversation naturally progresses to how Gran's experiences with disasters like 9/11, Hurricane Katrina, and the LA fires have impacted her writing.

[24:42] Sarah Gran: "It's hard. It does not affect it well... I had to throw it away. I could never make sense of it again."

Gran speaks candidly about the emotional toll of these events, particularly how they necessitated abandoning projects tied to their before-and-after landscapes.

[24:58] Sarah Gran: "With Los Angeles, it's a little bit different... I hope no one has experiences again. And I hope I never experience again."

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Closing Thoughts and Final Recommendations

As the episode draws to a close, Gran offers insights into her writing interests and shares final recommendations, emphasizing her attraction to the unknown and complexities of mystery.

[20:53] Sarah Gran: "Things that I don't know... Mysteries is because the things that you don't know... what really draw you in."

She advises writers to focus on their ideal readers rather than an abstract audience, fostering a more authentic and passionate writing process.

[21:16] Sarah Gran: "Write for your ideal reader. Just imagine your perfect reader is out there and write for them."

Gran concludes with additional book recommendations tailored to listener preferences, demonstrating her ongoing commitment to literary engagement.

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Conclusion

This episode of All Of It offers an in-depth look into Sarah Gran's creative journey, her beloved character Claire DeWitt, and the innovations embodied in Little Mysteries. Through engaging dialogue, listener interaction, and personal anecdotes, Gran provides valuable insights into the art of writing, the challenges of independent publishing, and the profound impact of real-world events on storytelling.

Listeners gain a comprehensive understanding of Gran's literary philosophy, her dedication to creative freedom, and her passion for connecting with readers on a meaningful level. Whether you're a long-time fan or new to Gran's work, this episode is a treasure trove of inspiration and thoughtful conversation.

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Notable Quotes:

• Alison Stewart [00:37]: "The character Claire DeWitt is not just a private eye. She's the world's greatest detective."

• Sarah Gran [01:46]: "People who are sort of at the top of their field often have to do things in a different way to kind of move things forward. And that's what she does."

• Sarah Gran [02:38]: "It's both a way of solving mysteries and sort of a worldview... listening to one's inner."

• Sarah Gran [04:09]: "Nonconformity by Nelson Algren... staying true to oneself, of being who you are as a writer rather than chasing glory and money and fame."

• Sarah Gran [05:10]: "I love that they found the book in the garbage... it feels like such a privilege and such a gift."

• Sarah Gran [07:46]: "I could have complete freedom to kind of experiment with format and experiment with the way the words are actually laid out on the page."

• Sarah Gran [14:58]: "It was about the dream come true of always being into books... to have a lot of creative freedom."

• Sarah Gran [21:16]: "Write for your ideal reader. Just imagine your perfect reader is out there and write for them."

• Sarah Gran [24:42]: "It's hard. It does not affect it well... I had to throw it away. I could never make sense of it again."

---

This detailed summary encapsulates the essence of the episode, providing listeners with a comprehensive overview of Sarah Gran's insights, her creative process, and the rich discussions that make All Of It a compelling show about culture and its consumers.

Transcript

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[WNYC Studios]

Listener supported WNYC Studios.

[Alison Stewart]

This is all of it on WNYC. I'm Alison Stewart. The character Claire DeWitt is not just a private eye. She's the world's greatest detective. In fact, she's been a detective since she was a kid. But that was many decades ago. And now, even though she's still at it, she's faltering a bit. She's self medicating. Her mental and physical health are taking a hit. And even, even though she can't solve crimes that other detectives and the police can't figure out, even though she can solve crimes that other detectives and the police can't figure out, she can't solve the greatest mystery of all. Her missing best friend Claire is the unforgettable main character in a series of novels by Sarah Grand. Now in Grand's latest book, we get to learn a little bit about some of the other characters in Grand's universe. Little Mysteries, nine Miniature Puzzles to Confuse Enthrall and Delight is out today. Sarah grand joins me now. Hey Sarah, Happy pub.

[Sarah Gran]

Thank you so much. I'm so happy to be here. What better way to celebrate?

[Alison Stewart]

Glad you're here as well. Even though Little Mystery stands alone, you don't have to, you know, read your previous work to like it and to understand it. But I think maybe we should talk a little bit about Claire DeWitt. Who's Claire DeWitt?

[Sarah Gran]

Sure. As you said, she is the best detective in the world. People often think I'm joking or she's joking when we say that. Not joking at all. Definitely the best detective in the world. But she is, as you said, a bit troubled and also, I think, somewhat misunderstood. I think people who are sort of at the top of their field often have to do things in a different way to kind of move things forward. And that's what she does.

[Alison Stewart]

She has a couple of source materials books that kind of guide her. One is called Detection, which is fictional and she uses it as an inner spiritual guide. For example, the book reads above all, the inner knowing of the detective trumps every piece of evidence, every clue, every rational assumption. If we do not put it first and foremost always, there's no point in carrying on in the detection or in life. So what does this, this book, the Detection, do for her?

[Sarah Gran]

Yeah, I mean, I think it does guide her, as you said, it gives her a different way of looking at things. It's both a way of solving mysteries and sort of a worldview. And I would stand by a less hyperbolic version of that statement you just read. I think life is still worth living. Can't all follow our intuition all the times. But I am a big believer in intuition and sort of listening to one's inner. I got a review once that said that thought those bits were supposed to be funny and maybe they are to some people, and that's completely fine. But I will stand by all of them to some degree. Not 100%, but up to like 80%.

[Alison Stewart]

So I bring these passages up because they're woven throughout the Claire DeWitt series, including little mysteries. Do you write the passages as needed or do you have a manuscript you pull from? Is there a Detection book in your brain?

[Sarah Gran]

I write the passages as needed and there have been a bunch of versions of the books in my brain. And, you know, when I started this series, I always thought I would do Detection as a standalone book at some point. But over the years I've come to really love the idea of it being not a real book, of it being a sort of ever changing, ever shifting, evolving work that reflects my views and views of people who are smarter and better than me that I am trying to understand.

[Alison Stewart]

I like the way you pronounce it, the French pronunciation detection.

[Listener]

Is that correct?

[Sarah Gran]

I mean, I have no idea. I'm trying. I don't know.

[Alison Stewart]

Was there a book like Deduction that played a role in your life?

[Sarah Gran]

There have been a bunch of them. One of the books that's a big inspiration for this, which is not a spiritual book, it's a book about writing, which I guess is a spiritual activity, so it counts. Is a book called Nonconformity by Nelson Algren, which one of my all time favorite books, but one that's very difficult for me to read, perhaps not for anyone else. It's a sort of difficult, impenetrable book about writing and about what's important. And it's very much on the same theme of staying true to oneself, of being who you are as a writer rather than chasing glory and money and fame. That's been a big inspiration. And of course, all the kind of classic spiritual texts. There's a lot that's sort of borrowed from the Tao Te Ching in there, the Bhagavad, the yoga sutras, things like that, that Whole, whole universe of all the classics, the greatest hits.

[Listener]

This is a bit of a digression, but you worked in bookstores, right?

[Sarah Gran]

Many of them, yes.

[Listener]

Did you ever have that experience where you were selling the right book to the right person at the right time?

[Sarah Gran]

Yes. That's the best part about working in a bookstore, and that's the best part about being a writer, is when you hear from someone that they picked up your book in a bookstore or even found it. I have a lot of stories of people saying, I found your book. I found Vacation Cottage once. I got a great agent. Cause they found a copy of my book on the street. They're like, when people move and they leave things on the street, I'm like, you mean garbage? You mean it was garbage, which was great. I love that they found the book in the garbage. I thought it was wonderful. So, yes, as a bookseller and a writer, it feels like such a privilege and such a gift to be able to give someone the right book at the right time.

[Listener]

I'm speaking with Sarah Graham, the author of Little Nine Miniature Puzzles to Confuse, enthrall and Delight. The book is another one of Claire's touchstones. Is Cynthia Silverton a teen detective, AKA sort of Nancy Drew Little stories, has a story about her in it. What does Claire get from reading Cynthia Silverton?

[Sarah Gran]

You know, I think it was formative for her, and I think it's inspired by the books that were formative to me, which were Two minute mysteries by Donald J. Sobel, who also wrote Encyclopedia Brown, the choose your own adventure books, all of those kids mysteries, you know, the whole universe of children's mystery sort of got me on this field for better or worse. And I think it's the same for my character Claire, that the exposure to these books when she was a kid really got her interested in mysteries. And they also turn out to have a sort of bigger role in her larger mysteries that she has to solve.

[Alison Stewart]

All right, let's dive into little Mysteries. First of all, it's a book of short stories. Why not another Claire DeWitt novel?

[Sarah Gran]

It's coming. There will be another DeWitt novel. You know, I sort of dug myself into a big fat hole with these books. If any younger writers are listening, don't do this. That I made the plot so complicated. And I also was so devoted to this idea that every book should work as a standalone and also devoted to the idea that the character should reflect me as I change and go through life. That was why I wanted to do a series. But, you know, sometimes life Takes you in strange and interesting directions. And it's hard to reflect that in the book while also keeping up with the plot while also making it work as a standalone book. And I like a challenge. So it's been super fun to work on it, but it's gonna be a couple more years. It's been a few years and it'll be a few years more.

[Listener]

All right, well, let's concentrate on the short stories. But you're not following a traditional short story format. What made you wanna play around with the format?

[Sarah Gran]

The fact that I could, you know, I started my own publishing company to publish my own work. And one reason why I did is so I could do weird, different stuff that I knew I could never publish otherwise. And I just had this idea to inspired by again, these two minute mysteries. Choose your own adventure. A lot of the stories are proposed as a mystery with a solution at the bottom. And I realized I could have complete freedom to kind of experiment with format and experiment with the way the words are actually laid out on the page. Not just the content, but the actual pages themselves. So that was a super, super fun thing to do.

[Listener]

The first story, the first page is sort of like one of those DIY fortune tellers. Like that origami square you make with paper and you fold it into something and it fits on your fingers. Except here you call it a tool of psycho spiritual divination.

[Sarah Gran]

Yes.

[Listener]

They say if one chapter you can go, hopefully try again. Nothing is what it seems. Take the low road. This is a really interesting way to start a book. Why did you do this?

[Sarah Gran]

I hope people will cut it out and use it. I'm glad you brought it up. I forgot I have to do a PDF on my website for people to download because they're out of their book, of course. But I hope if anyone has the book, they do. Cut it up or I will get that PDF up today. It is 100% guaranteed to work. You will get absolutely nothing back. If I'm wrong, I guess I could give you like a dollar back on the book or something. I don't know, you probably bought it from a bookstore. But yeah, again, it was just such a dream come true to be able to experiment with the typography and the page layout and everything like that and hopefully bring some, some joy and a little mystery and a little excitement into someone's life for a couple minutes.

[Listener]

One of the stories I wanted to mention is the Good Smell of New York City. Slash, the Ocean of Salt, the Air. It's written now, it's written in two Colum column is 1988. The other is 2020 and I'm going to. And it's they, they're parallel on the page. For example, it says, under 1988, you are Claire DeWitt, the greatest teen detective in the world. You are standing on the corner of Rivington and Ludlow streets on the Lower east side of New York City. Under 2020, it says, you are Claire DeWitt, the best detective in the world. You are standing at the junction of the Venice Boardwalk and Windward Avenue in Los Angeles. It's been a long day. It's such an interesting way to, to read the story, to tell a story. Am I supposed to read 1988 first and then 2020? Am I supposed to go back and forth? Which way? How do I read this?

[Sarah Gran]

How did you read it? I'm curious.

[Alison Stewart]

I read that one. I started going back and forth and then I got confused. So I read 1988 first.

[Sarah Gran]

Yeah, yeah. It's however it works for you is the way to read it. And I really, you know, I started that during the early days of COVID and I grew up in New York City. And I became sexually active during the early days of the HIV AIDS crisis. And it loomed really, really large in my life, this absolute mortal terror of getting HIV AIDS back when there were no treatments, when it was really, we knew the basics of transmission, but a lot of the subtleties of transmission were unknown. And it was such a similar feeling and mood and just like vibration in the air to the early days of COVID when we weren't entirely sure about transmission, when people were scrubbing their groceries. When people start attributing moral qualities and judgment to a virus which is not a moral being. You know, a virus is not there to judge people. You get sick or you don't get sick because you're lucky or you're unlucky. So I really wanted to write about the similar feelings between those two time periods.

[Listener]

My guest is Sarah Grand.

[Alison Stewart]

Her book is called Little Mysteries, Nine.

[Listener]

Miniature Puzzles to Confuse, Enthrall and Delight. Will we'll be right back with more from Sarah Grann. This is all of It.

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[Alison Stewart]

This is all of It on WNYC. I'm Alison Stewart. My guest is Sarah Grann, author of Little Nine miniature puzzles to confuse, enthrall and delight. Sarah, are you up for a little bit of a challenge with me?

[Sarah Gran]

Yes.

[Alison Stewart]

If we open our phones. Because you worked in bookstores, you said many, many bookstores. If we open our phones and someone says, I need a book that sounds like X, Y or Z, would you be willing to suggest that to somebody?

[Sarah Gran]

Sure.

[Alison Stewart]

All right, our phone lines are open. 212-433-969-2212, wnyc. What you have to do is name three books you like, and maybe Sarah will suggest a book to you based on the three books that you like. Okay? So think about that and then give us a call. 212-433-969-2212, wnyc. You can call and join us on air or you can text to us. We'll continue having our conversation until people call. You've written for film and for television. How would you compare and contrast writing for TV and film versus writing books and things that you. You read, maybe, but you don't speak.

[Sarah Gran]

Yeah. I mean, one pays a whole lot more than the other. That's a big contrast. One of them pays you a very, very generous living wage. In my circumstance, you know, times have changed in Hollywood and some writers are not really getting the fees they used to get, including me. But I still do. Well, I'm very, very fortunate. And then trying to make a living writing books is a huge challenge. Almost no one does it. You know, there's only about 100 people or something who make a full time living writing fiction with no other source of income. And, you know, that number might even be smaller this year. They kind of do surveys every couple years, so that's the biggest difference. And the other thing is they're. One is a collaboration, which is wonderful, and one is working alone, which is also completely wonderful working in film. I was just listening to the Noah Wiley interview before, and, you know, it's working with a team of people. I'm gonna steal his mantra that he had, which was so wonderful about working with people with brilliant hearts and minds or whatever that was. That is what film and TV is at its best. It is such a joy to have these wonderful people on the team, and you really are a team. But then I really, really love just doing my books and being completely alone. Getting to make every decision 100% myself is a joy as well. It's nice to do both.

[Listener]

Well, let me ask you a little bit about your own publishing company, Dreamland. That's the Name of it, it was the publisher of Little Mysteries. Why did you start that?

[Sarah Gran]

Because I wanted to do whatever I wanted, whenever I wanted is one reason. And the other reason is because it was just sort of a dream come true that I could do, you know, as I said, work. Hollywood does pay so much better that it kind of gave me the finances to take a chance and not getting an advance from a big publisher and instead spending some money up front and seeing if I would make more later. But it wasn't really about the money. It was really just about the dream come true of always being into books, wanting to be more involved in the design, more involved in how they're introduced to the world, and to have a lot of creative freedom. You know, when you work for a. When you write a book for a big publisher, of course no one tells you what to write, but you're going to encounter some strong opinions and you're also going to encounter rejections. Like, no publisher would have published this book of short stories.

[Listener]

Why do you say that?

[Sarah Gran]

Because it's weird, I think. I mean, you never know. Maybe someone would have. But it was such an odd book. I think they would have wanted to tone down some of the stylistic stuff. I don't think the fortune teller at the beginning would have worked for a big publisher.

[Listener]

That's funny. That made me laugh. Let's take a call. This is Robert calling in from Piscataway. Hey, Robert, can you hear me?

[WNYC Studios]

I can hear you perfectly.

[Listener]

All right, tell me three books you like. Tell Sarah three books you like.

[Sarah Gran]

Hey, Robert.

[WNYC Studios]

One of my all time favorite. Hey, how are you? My all. One of my all time favorites, whether I'm not sure if you're familiar with it or not. Is called all the Old Knives.

[Sarah Gran]

No.

[WNYC Studios]

What's Stein? All the Old Knives by The woman who answered the phone knew the author's name. I think it's Oleg Stein.

[Alison Stewart]

Steinhauer.

[WNYC Studios]

Like that.

[Sarah Gran]

Okay.

[WNYC Studios]

Yeah, right. You're probably not familiar with it. Most people aren't, but it's brilliant. My. The second two choices are any book by Daniel Silva because I think he's a brilliant writer. And Michael Connolly, Michael Connelly just gets it right every time. No matter what character he uses. The Lincoln Lawyer or. Or his Bosch character. So those are my three. I guess I. I'm a little pigeonhole there.

[Alison Stewart]

That's okay.

[WNYC Studios]

I'm in the cry milieu.

[Sarah Gran]

Me too. I like the cry milieu. First of all, my dad was from Jersey. I had family in Piscataway. Hope everyone in Piscataway is doing well. I will tell you to read A Coffin for Demetrios by Eric Ambler.

[Alison Stewart]

All right, let's talk to Alicia. I believe that's how you say your name from Queens. Hi. Thanks for calling all of it. What three books do you like?

[Sarah Gran]

Well, I only have two. One is Angela's Ashes, and the other is the Grapes of Wrath.

[Alison Stewart]

Okay. Oh, what do you think?

[Sarah Gran]

That's an interesting combination. Trying to think of a good memoir for you. My mom was a good memoir for you. Savage Grace. Boy, I'm drawing a blank on the author's name. It is a memoir of a woman who was a very wealthy woman, had a really messed up family. You will find it just by the title. Savage Grace Memoir. Wish I could remember the author right now.

[Alison Stewart]

That's what we have producers for here.

[Listener]

They're looking it up. Why would you recommend that?

[Sarah Gran]

Oh, sorry. In this Boy's Life by Tobias Wolf. And, you know, I am not a big memoir reader, but my mom, who's gone now, was a huge memoir reader, and those were her favorites.

[Listener]

And it's by Natalie Robbins, by the way. Here's one. It says, Gilead. This is Happiness and March. That was a text. What do you think?

[Sarah Gran]

I don't know what March is. Huh. But Gilead, the Marianne Robinson book, I think what they're talking about, you know what's been so popular lately? It's funny, so many old books are having a comeback on social media, which is wonderful, is Middlemarch by George Eliot.

[Listener]

And why would you recommend Middlemarch?

[Sarah Gran]

I think it has that sort of same intimate portrait of a woman, but also a larger sort of context to it.

[Listener]

Let's talk to Sheila on line two, calling from Oyster Bay. Hi, Sheila.

[F]

Hi.

[Listener]

How are you doing?

[Alison Stewart]

Great.

[Listener]

Let's hear your suggestions.

[F]

All right, I have an odd mix here. The first is that Hair with Amber. Hair with amber eyes by DeWalt, possession by AS Byatt and pride and Prejudice. Austin.

[Sarah Gran]

Oh, what was the first one? I missed it.

[F]

Hair with Amber Eyes.

[Sarah Gran]

I don't know that one. I love the title, though. And Pride and Prejudice. And. Tell me the middle one again. Sorry.

[F]

That's fine. Possession by as. Buy it.

[Sarah Gran]

Oh, right.

[F]

Amber Eyes is the DeWalt book about. He traces his whole family history through a collection of netsuke that his uncle had.

[Sarah Gran]

Oh, I love that. An Instance at the Finger Post by Ian Pears, which I have been wanting to reread. But I have to give you a warning. You got to stick with it. It's a book told from multiple points of view. And the characters, their depth is sort of revealed as they go on. It's historical like Pride and Prejudice and it is about characters interacting in this historical context, swept up in world events. But the different points of view reveal themselves as you go on. So I remember the first time I read it, the first couple pages I was like, this guy's a dummy. And then you find out there's a lot more depth to the character than that.

[Alison Stewart]

Good luck with reading that. My guest is Sarah Grann, author of Little nine Miniature Puzzles to Confuse, Enthrall and Delight. It's out today. So what interests you as a writer, Sarah?

[Sarah Gran]

Things that I don't know I think interest me more than things I do know. I think that's one reason why I'm a. And so many writers are attracted to mysteries is because the things that you don't know about that you know just enough about to want to know more are what really draw you in.

[Alison Stewart]

Who do you find yourself when you're thinking about writing? Who are you writing for?

[Sarah Gran]

You know, I try not to think too much about that because that can put you into a place of. A bad place of trying to make some imaginary person happy. The. The harshest critic on earth who lives in your head and has a vendetta against you. I think I read somewhere some good advice which is to just write for your ideal reader. Just imagine your perfect reader is out there and write for them.

[Alison Stewart]

Someone wanted to know what book about.

[Listener]

Writing that you recommended earlier. Can you repeat it and tell us a little bit more about it?

[Sarah Gran]

Yes, it was by Nelson Algren who is most famous for writing the man with the Golden Arm, Walk on the Wild side and the book is called Nonconformity.

[Listener]

And why was that meaningful for you?

[Sarah Gran]

It is such a strange little book and Nelson Algren was a writer who at this point in my life was probably in a similar position to I am some success, but certainly not like a top of the bestseller super popular writer and had really gone his own way in life, had sort of turned his back on the mainstream publishing world in New York and quite intentionally done so because he wanted to be his own person and kind of follow his own intuition and his own heart as a man and as a writer. And the book is about what it's like to take that path and there's nothing else like it. And then of course if you want a book about the sort of practical stuff of writing, the all time classics are the Artist's Way by Julia Cameron. You cannot go wrong with that book. And again, that's one that seems to come back every 10 or 15 years and have a huge surge of popularity, as it well deserves. It's a wonderful and insightful book on starting an artistic practice. And Stephen King's book on writing is one that has done a lot for a lot of people.

[Listener]

My guest is Sarah Grand. She's also offered to give you advice on based on three books that you liked. Let's talk to Lucille from Hazlett, New Jersey. Hi Lucille, thanks for calling, all of it. You're on the air.

[G]

Hello. And I am a writer too, although that's a long story. My three books are pretty different. The first one is House of Sand and Fog, which I absolutely love. Handmaid's Tale, again, really love that. And then and then a book called Wool. It's a science fiction book by Hugh Howey. It's actually the show Silo is based on it.

[Sarah Gran]

Oh, cool. I'm going to recommend something I haven't read, but a ton of people have recommended to me two books by Octavia Butler, the Parable of the Sower and Kindred, and again, neither of which I've read. I'm not a big sci fi person and I cannot tell you how many people have said, I know you don't like sci fi, but you will love these books. So those are on my list for this year. They've also come up a lot. I live in Los Angeles and apparently they're quite prescient regarding the fires and the state of the city right now. So that's my recommendation for you.

[Listener]

I wanted to ask you about the fires that are going on because you're working through the LA fires. You were working in New Orleans during Katrina and your first novel, Saturn's Return came out a few days before 911 and you were living in New York. How does it, how does working through a disaster affect your writing?

[Sarah Gran]

It's hard. It does not affect it well, effect, you know, when 911 came along, I had a book I'd been working on for a couple of years. It was set in New York City. I had lived there all my life at that point and I just kind of had to throw it away. I could never make sense of it again. And the same thing happened a couple years later with Hurricane Katrina. I was writing a book that took place in New Orleans and it was a different city afterwards. You know, the book just didn't make sense anymore. With Los Angeles, it's a little bit different because Los Angeles is such a spread out city. You know, I had a lot of smoke in my neighborhood, but thank God I was untouched by the fires. And thank God so few people lost their lives here. I think the number is 25 or something. And of course that's absolutely terrible. And those lives are a huge loss, but it's nothing compared to the thousands of people in New York and New Orleans. So it's. It's. The city wasn't destroyed because of the loss of life. There's much more physical destruction in this case. But that to live in a city where the so many people have lost the people they love is something I hope no one has experiences again. And I hope I never experience again.

[Listener]

We got a text. I think this person has been in my house looking at my bookshelf.

[Alison Stewart]

It says Antarctica. The Antarctica by Claire Keegan, the Goldfinch by Donna Tartt, and Motherless Brooklyn by Jonathan Lethem.

[Sarah Gran]

Oh, nice. The Terror by Dan. Oh my gosh, what's his name? Simmons. The Terror by Dan Simmons. They did a TV show of that and at one point I was talking to them about maybe working on the show, which I ended up not doing. So I read the book and I just loved the book. So tell me about is these people in 18 something? Early 1800s, I believe. And they get stuck in the ice, which I guess is a thing that happened on a ship back then. You know, it's hard to imagine the way people lived kind of before modern technology. Not computer technology, but better ships, better navigation tools. They got stuck in the ice and something is coming to stalk everyone. We don't know for quite a while if it's supernatural or another person or what it is. A huge amount of research is in the book regarding the indigenous populations, the ecology, what life was like for these sailors. It's an unbelievable work.

[Listener]

All right, the last one. I love nonfiction, exploration and adventure books. The Lost City of Z, the Wager that was great. And Dead Mountain.

[Alison Stewart]

Go.

[Sarah Gran]

Oh, I will recommend an essay because I was just looking to reread it rather than a book. David Graham, no relation, as far as I know, who wrote the City of Z, has an amazing article in the New Yorker from 10 years ago about arson research which is very relevant to those of us on the West Coast. Of course, arson was involved in some of the smaller fires, as far as we know, not the big fires here in la. And it is about this incredibly fascinating field of arson science, which at that point, when he wrote it, was not a science at all. It's better now. Wish I could remember the name, but it is very easy to find if you search David Grann with two N's, unlike me.

[Listener]

Arson New Yorker thanks to everybody who called and texted. We got so many. We're gonna do this again. And thank you to Sarah Grann, the author of Little Nine Miniature Puzzles to Confuse, Enthrall and Delight. It is out today. Sarah, thank you so much for your time.

[Sarah Gran]

Thank you so much. This was so much fun for me and what a great way to start my publication day.

[Listener]

Coming up, My Half Latinx Kitchen is both a cookbook and a memoir. Author Kyra Wright Ruiz joins us next in studio that happens after the news.

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