Alison Stewart (3:47)

Leonie, I read that you were able to speak with a translator as part of your preparation for the role. What questions did you have for them?

Leonie Benesch (3:56)

We don't have Leonie. All right, well, let's keep going with Peter.

Alison Stewart (3:59)

Let's play this clip.

Leonie Benesch (4:00)

Rune decides right away that this is going to be an ABC sports story, and they're not going to give coverage over to the news division. Let's hear a clip from the movie. This is Roon rallying his team.

Unknown (4:13)

Okay, look, I know this isn't a responsibility that everyone wants, but does it make more sense to have a talking head from news take over from halfway across the world? Our job is to tell the stories of these individuals whose lives are at stake a hundred yards away. And our job is really straightforward. We put the camera in the right place, and we follow the story as it unfolds in real time. News can tell us what it all meant after it's over. And I'm sure they're gonna try, but this is our story, and we're keeping it.

Leonie Benesch (4:50)

That's from September 5th. Is that purely about competition, or is there something else going on?

Peter Sarsgaard (4:57)

Yeah, I mean, look, this is an event that had 900 million people tune into it. And I think that the lesson that was learned that day and that Rune was always keenly aware of, and Rune was somebody who was really in the model of, like, selling sports to people that normally didn't consume it. And I would say ultimately selling the news to people that hadn't historically been interested in it by packaging it in a story. And, you know, I would say one of the things that has really hurt news has been competition. Right. You know, if it bleeds, it leads. Kind of trying to get the most eyeballs. Category 5 hurricanes get a lot of eyeballs. Whether or not. The people who aren't in immediate danger need to see a reporter standing out in the middle of it, I think is up for debate. So, to me, that is the thing, you know, I guess it's just the way the world is. It's very difficult to put the genie back in the bottle at this point.

Leonie Benesch (6:00)

Leonie, can you hear me okay?

Ira Flatow (6:03)

Yeah. Hi.

Leonie Benesch (6:04)

Hi. I read you were able to speak with a translator as part of your preparation for the role. What questions did you have? Your translator?

Ira Flatow (6:13)

I think what I was most interested in is how the hell does she do it? Because, you know, these people, I'm sure you've seen them in press conferences, they speak while they're still listening. So it's like their brain is finding words and already saying them whilst another part of their brain is still listening. And I find that fascinating. So I think I mainly had questions about that particular frame of mind or that kind of concentration.

Leonie Benesch (6:43)

In the film, your character is the only woman in a room full of men. At one point, she's asked to go get some coffee for the men. How do Mariana's colleagues underestimate her?

Ira Flatow (6:55)

Well, I mean, I think in a way that I think most of us women, female identifying people, know or are used to being underestimated. I think obviously, it's gotten much better. But I think there's a podcast I listened to in preparation for this project that takes apart what happened that day, and it's fascinating. And they talked about how there was a policewoman who was in contact with the leader of the Palestinian group, and he sort of trusted her a bit, but she was constantly referred to in the German media and all the other. Actually, all the media as a hostess. No one took her seriously or tried to use her as a way in to try and speak to him. I think that sort of says it all.

Alison Stewart (7:47)

Do you remember the name of the podcast?

Ira Flatow (7:50)

Yeah, it's called him, which means suicide mission.

Alison Stewart (7:55)

My guests are Peter Sarsgaard and Leonie Benesh. We're talking about the movie September 5th, about ABC Sports Team who covered the hostage Crisis in the 1972 Olympics. Peter, the movie, it's really tightly controlled. It's in the control room. If you've ever been in a control room, it's that there's not a lot of space. What do you think about how that claustrophobia works for the film?

Peter Sarsgaard (8:22)

Well, what's nice is that the film creates its own sense of drama. I mean, if you've ever been in those control rooms, I'm sure you have it's not a lot of shouting and running around, right. It's a kind of very focused energy. In my experience, it's everyone is laser beam so that we actually had the real size space. He made the dimensions the same. The walls did not fly out. We had two cameras in there with three people on each camera and about eight actors. There was no need to imagine anything. You know, it was smoky, it was hot, there were long hours and. And I was really interested in that idea too, that as actors, we didn't spend a lot of time creating drama. We were just people doing their jobs. And when you see people in these crisis moments doing their jobs, I frequently see people where, like, what is that expression they say? Where like, you know, if you go slow, that's accurate, that's fast. Instead of going running around the control room, everyone is just very precise. And yeah, it was in. All that equipment was sourced by these really eccentric hobbyists who love keeping analog equipment around. And a lot of it worked, which was very, very helpful.

Alison Stewart (9:56)

Leonia, a lot of your acting is on walkie talkie, off screen, sort of. What challenges did that present to you?

Ira Flatow (10:05)

I mean, I love that. I think it's. I love when a filmmaker is brave enough to trust that you don't need a close up of the actor speaking in order to create tension. And for me, that's just a little bit more of a lazy day at work. I mean, I love it.

Alison Stewart (10:21)

Leonie, when you're talking about that moment, the first moment that Mariana and the team wonders if they're really in over their heads, what moment is that for you in the film?

Ira Flatow (10:36)

Oh, gosh, probably. I mean, for me, as if I watched the film probably from the very beginning, I think probably the moment the gunshots are heard. But I think as viewers, or, you know, as an audience member, you want to. I think that's what works so well about the film is it tickles. That kind of lust for sensationalism, I think that we all have. So I think until for me, the moment that really gets to me every time I see the film is when the cameras are being switched back on and they see someone having a gun to the head on the balcony. And there's a moment of realizing what it is that they're reporting on what the story actually means. And I think that's a moment that really sticks with me.

Alison Stewart (11:28)

Peter, so much of what you talked about is about the ethical dilemmas that are. That are presented in the film. What are some questions you would want people to ask themselves after watching September 5th.

Peter Sarsgaard (11:41)

Yeah. Well, there's this moment, actually. I'm sitting right now in my office, and right behind me on the wall is this poster from the movie Visions of Eight, which was a film that was shot during that Olympics. And eight different directors, from, like, John Fletchinger to Claude Lelouch to, you know, Milos Forman, Arthur Penn, they all shot a section. And if you watch that movie and you know about the Olympics, one of the wild things is that you're watching these beautiful images of sports, knowing that in reality there was a hostage crisis going on, and they touch on it in the end. But there was a moment when I got the script where it goes back to sport, and you see people disassociating. You see people following boxing matches. And I think it's that ability for us to, like, tune in, like. Like Leonie was talking about, like, kind of with this feeling of, you know, a lust for drama and violence. And then the way we so easily tune out and go about our days. And we all, of course, do this all the time, where we wake up in the morning and we, you know, look at our phones and see what tragedies happen in the world, and then we manage to really do nothing active about any of it for the rest of the day. Obviously, change happens in your community level and not on a worldwide level, but I think that that is something that I would love people to think more about, is addressing the situations and tragedies that are going on in their backyards.

Leonie Benesch (13:16)

Leonie, how about you? What would you want people to discuss after seeing this movie?

Ira Flatow (13:24)

Well, I mean, Peter said it beautifully. I think that's definitely. I completely agree. What I find really interesting is the notion that I think we are beginning to discuss more in society, which is how do we change an event unfolding simply by putting a camera and pointing a camera at it? How is there such a thing as a neutral perspective? And where does the responsibility lie with reporting? When is it reporting? When does reporting become exploitative?

Leonie Benesch (14:00)

September 5th is in theaters now. My guests have been Peter Sarsgaard and Leonie Benesch. Thank you so much for spending time with us on the phone.

Ira Flatow (14:09)

Thank you.

Peter Sarsgaard (14:10)

Thank you for having me.

Unknown (14:13)

This is Ira Flato, host of Science Friday. For over 30 years, the science Friday team has been reporting high quality science and technology news, making science fun for curious people by covering everything from the outer reaches of space to the rapidly changing world of AI to the tiniest microbes in our bodies. Audiences trust our show because they know we're driven by a mission to inform and serve listeners first and and foremost with important news they won't get anywhere else. And our sponsors benefit from that halo effect. For more information on becoming a sponsor, visit sponsorship.wnyc.org.