Podcast Summary: All Of It with Alison Stewart
Episode: The Alleged Murderer Known as 'The Witch of New York' (Women Behaving Badly)
Air Date: August 16, 2024

Main Theme & Purpose

In this episode, host Alison Stewart continues the "Women Behaving Badly" series, exploring infamous and unruly women from New York’s history. This installment centers on Polly Bodine, dubbed "The Witch of New York," who was accused of murdering her sister-in-law and niece on Staten Island in 1843. Author and constitutional lawyer Alex Hortas joins to discuss his new book, The Witch of New York: The Trials of Polly Bodine and the Cursed Birth of Tabloid Justice, shedding light on the sensationalized trial, rampant tabloid culture, and the birth of America’s true crime obsession.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

The Crime and Its Context

• The 1843 Christmas Murders (02:00–03:28)

  • Emmaline Houseman and her infant daughter were found bludgeoned and burned in Staten Island.
  • Polly Bodine, Emmaline’s sister-in-law, was the last person to see them alive—and heavily pregnant by her lover.
  • The resulting panic and fascination were amplified by media, attracting attention from figures like Edgar Allan Poe and Walt Whitman.

• Historical and Social Context (05:00–06:06)

  • Staten Island in the mid-1800s was insular, primarily home to Dutch, French, and English Protestant clans.
  • A tight-knit community where gossip traveled quickly and deviation from norms was harshly judged.

The Principal Characters

• Polly Bodine’s Background (06:06–08:48)

  • Polly came from wealth: her family, the Housmans, were affluent oystermen, their land later valued at over $1.2 million.
  • She married Andrew Bodine, a violent, alcoholic sailor, at age 16. Divorce was nearly impossible.
  • Known for her independence, bold personality, and alleged affair with George Waite, a Manhattan apothecary.
  • "She was very independent. She could be seen going around the island... She would drink gin alone. She then starts up an affair with an apothecary in Manhattan named George Waite." — Alex Hortas (07:36)

• Emmaline Houseman (08:48–09:59)

  • Described as timid and warm, Emmaline was Polly’s sister-in-law and friend.
  • Polly even helped deliver Emmaline’s baby, Ann Eliza.
  • By all accounts, the women had a close, caring relationship.

The Murders and Their Aftermath

• Details of the Murders (10:06–11:28)

  • Emmaline and Ann Eliza found bludgeoned, with signs of a violent struggle.
  • Intense forensic debate, but consensus that both were murdered before the fire.
  • Infant's skull was separated before the fire; Emmaline had severe defensive wounds.

• Immediate Suspicion and Scapegoating of Polly (11:28–13:39)

  • Polly became an instant suspect due to her "bad character," rumored affairs, and concealed pregnancy.
  • The grief-stricken grandfather accused her at the funeral, fueling public suspicion.
  • "On the Friday after the bodies were discovered... her brother-in-law... says, 'Paulie, everybody in the village thinks you did it.'" — Alex Hortas (12:34)
  • Polly fled Staten Island, walking a virtual marathon in sleet at 8 months pregnant, pursued by press and police.

Tabloid Justice and Media Frenzy

• Role of Tabloid Press (The Penny Press) (13:39–15:37)
  • Competing newspapers fabricated and sensationalized details, trading accuracy for sales.
  • "It almost is closer to social media than it is today... There is no such thing as innocent until proven guilty. He just didn't believe it. He said his famous quote was that the press is the living jury of the nation." — Alex Hortas (14:53)
  • P.T. Barnum even exhibited a wax figure of Polly, grossly prejudicing her trial.

The Trials

• Trial #1: Staten Island (16:01–19:24)

  • Case against Polly was circumstantial but robust.
    • Alleged last seen with the victims.
    • Pawned the victims’ belongings (although identification by pawnbrokers was manipulated).
    • Glaringly inconsistent alibis; behavior post-crime was suspicious.
    • “She orders gin at 6:20 in the morning... that puts her then on Staten Island in the early morning hours after the fire.” — Alex Hortas (18:37)
  • Notable quote: “Why in the world would you tell your brother not to post a reward?” — Alex Hortas (19:18)

• Jury Struggles and Mistrial (20:36–22:11)

  • James Decker, eccentric and wealthy juror, refused to convict on circumstantial evidence, requiring "four eyewitnesses."
  • Decker escaped deliberations by leaping out a window—a literal runaway juror!
  • "He literally becomes a runaway juror... he leaps out of the window and runs away until the sheriff comes and hunts him down." — Alex Hortas (21:10)

• Trial #2: Manhattan (22:11–24:46)

  • Held in City Hall, became high society spectacle.
  • P.T. Barnum’s wax figure exhibit drew thousands during the proceedings.
  • Polly found guilty, but jury recommended mercy—a compromise verdict, essentially "don’t hang her" due to squeamishness about executing women.

• Trial #3: Newburgh, NY (24:46–26:01)

  • Relocated due to impossible bias in NYC; outcome left to be discovered by readers.
  • Polly herself was passive, described by observers as haughty and catatonic after years of incarceration.

Theories and Reflections on Guilt

• Hortas’s Theory (26:06–28:20)
  • Suggests a confrontation—possibly over Polly’s pregnancy or theft—turned deadly; in panic, Polly killed the child fearing exposure.
  • "People are always looking for a rational reason for murder because it's too scary to think that people just kind of lose their mind. They have passions, they have angers and they kill their family members. Now, can I prove that? No, I cannot." — Alex Hortas (27:31)
  • He remains careful to note this is speculation, not proven fact.

The Birth of True Crime Culture

• Connecting 1840s Media to Modern True Crime (28:20–31:24)
  • Hortas draws a direct line from Bodine’s trial coverage to today’s true crime industry.
  • "To me, it's the birth of true crime... People also project all of these beliefs and morals and ideas onto cases... it's really entertainment, and that's fine. But don't view it as more than entertainment." — Alex Hortas (28:37, 30:00)
  • He cautions that true crime rarely achieves justice, and its portrayal of law and trials is often deeply distorted.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "I just couldn't believe that no one had written a full length nonfiction history of it. And it also just felt so fresh... So I thought I could use it to critique tabloid justice of today." — Alex Hortas (03:28)
• "They devoted wall-to-wall coverage... I had this amazing primary source material. And then fortunately, these famous people wrote about it and talked about it." — Alex Hortas (04:10)
• “She was very independent... She would drink gin alone. She then starts up an affair with an apothecary in Manhattan named George Waite.” — Alex Hortas (07:36)
• "There was a fire... They find the bludgeoned bodies. Emmeline had defensive wounds that cut down to the bone on her left arm." — Alex Hortas (10:06)
• "The press is the living jury of the nation." — Alex Hortas, quoting James Gordon Bennett (14:55)
• "He [Decker] leaps out of the window and runs away until the sheriff comes and hunts him down." — Alex Hortas (21:15)
• "To me, it's the birth of true crime... In my opinion, the true crime is really entertainment, and that's fine. But don't view it as more than entertainment." — Alex Hortas (28:37, 30:00)

Timestamps for Key Segments

• [02:00] — Introduction to the "Women Behaving Badly" series, the Christmas murder, Polly Bodine’s profile
• [03:28] — How Alex Hortas discovered the case and his research methods
• [05:00] — Description of 1840s Staten Island
• [06:06] — Polly Bodine’s family and her stormy marriage
• [07:36] — Polly’s independence, reputation, and affair
• [08:48] — Emmaline Houseman’s character and her relationship with Polly
• [10:06] — Details and forensics of the murders
• [11:28] — How quickly and why Polly became a suspect
• [13:39] — The penny press and tabloid justice
• [16:01] — Summary of the prosecution’s case and trial evidence
• [20:36] — The first jury's deliberation and James Decker’s memorable behavior
• [22:30] — The spectacle of the Manhattan trial, PT Barnum’s wax figure, verdict
• [24:46] — The third trial and Polly’s demeanor
• [26:06] — Hortas’s theory on what happened
• [28:20] — Birth of true crime and its legacy
• [31:24] — Closing and thanks

Conclusion

This episode offers a captivating deep dive into how one sensational 19th-century murder trial both reflected and shaped America’s hunger for lurid true crime stories. Through vivid storytelling and legal insight, Alex Hortas and Alison Stewart illustrate how Polly Bodine’s trials ignited the tabloid culture that reverberates to this day, raising thought-provoking questions about justice, media responsibility, and the stories we choose to tell—and consume.