Title: Where Have All The Third Spaces Gone?

Podcast: All Of It

Host: Alison Stewart

Release Date: December 27, 2024

Introduction

In the December 27, 2024 episode of WNYC’s "All Of It," host Alison Stewart explores the compelling topic of "third spaces"—the communal areas that exist outside of home and work where individuals can gather, socialize, and build community connections. Due to Alison Stewart's temporary absence, this episode features an encore presentation of conversations originally hosted by Kusha Navadar, offering listeners a deep dive into the significance, challenges, and evolving nature of third places in today’s society.

Defining Third Places

The episode begins with Kusha Navadar introducing the concept of third places (00:17), emphasizing their role as essential communal spaces separate from home and work. She describes third places as environments like libraries, bookstores, parks, cafes, barbershops, and dog parks (00:53), where individuals can engage in community life without the pressures of personal or professional obligations. Kusha highlights the increasing scarcity of these spaces, referencing Robert Putnam’s influential book, "Bowling Alone," which discusses the decline in American social interactions and community involvement over the past two decades.

Expert Insight: Ali Volpe on Third Places

Ali Volpe, a senior reporter at Vox, joins the conversation (02:21) to elaborate on the importance of third places. She discusses her motivation for writing about them, particularly in the context of the COVID-19 pandemic. Volpe notes that during the pandemic, people turned to outdoor third places due to indoor social distancing measures, leading to a heightened awareness of the need for community spaces (02:37). She expresses concern that many third places have not fully recovered post-pandemic, especially in low-income communities where disinvestment has led to the closure of vital communal hubs (03:52).

Impact of COVID-19 on Third Places

Kusha Navadar probes further into the lasting impacts of COVID-19 on third places beyond reduced operating hours and fewer establishments (03:32). Volpe references ongoing research indicating that third places were already in decline before the pandemic, and the crisis has exacerbated this trend, particularly in underserved areas. She underscores the critical need for these spaces in combating loneliness and fostering community, as highlighted by the US Surgeon General’s report on loneliness and isolation (04:25).

Listener Input and Personal Experiences

Volpe shares her personal approach to maintaining multiple third places—a rotation of coffee shops across different neighborhoods—to nurture a sense of community and foster diverse interactions (05:35). She recounts positive, serendipitous conversations with baristas and regular patrons that enhance her feeling of belonging and connectedness (05:35).

Changing Nature of Third Places

Kusha introduces feedback from listeners, including a text message noting that many third places have lost their social dynamic as patrons use them primarily for remote work, thereby reducing opportunities for personal interaction (06:14). Volpe addresses this concern by advocating for a shift in personal expectations and behaviors within these spaces. She encourages individuals to initiate conversations and embrace openness, suggesting that small efforts to engage can revitalize the social fabric of third places (06:49). Volpe emphasizes that fostering a welcoming environment requires collective responsibility and individual initiative (06:49).

Callers’ Perspectives on Third Places

Several listeners contribute their unique perspectives and experiences, enriching the discussion:

1. Joey from the Lower East Side (09:57–11:10): Joey highlights movie theaters as unconventional yet meaningful third places. He explains how pre- and post-screening interactions create opportunities for community engagement and meaningful conversations. Joey mentions theaters like Metrograph and Regal Essex as hubs where regular patrons foster a sense of familiarity and camaraderie.

2. Amy, Gym Owner in Brooklyn (12:02–12:53): Amy, owner of Bikeland Studios, describes her gym as a vital third place that cultivates a strong sense of community. She shares how her gym serves as a social anchor for remote workers, providing a space where members can form friendships and support each other’s fitness journeys (12:07).

3. Julia from Ridgewood, Queens (17:05–17:41): Julia discusses her experience managing a TikTok food page that features restaurants as third places. She notes that rather than relying on a single third space, she engages with multiple establishments in her neighborhood, spreading her social interactions across various venues.

4. David from Suffern, New York (17:48–18:39): David shares how his synagogue became his primary third place after moving to Suffern. He emphasizes the role of his place of worship in providing community support, fostering friendships, and offering emotional solace during both challenging and joyous times.

5. Heather from Greenpoint (Text Message) (18:39–19:12): Heather highlights dog runs as ideal third places for non-drinkers to connect. She points out that shared interests, such as dog ownership, facilitate interactions across diverse economic and ethnic backgrounds, creating inclusive social environments.

6. Paul from Washington Heights (20:41–21:07): Paul introduces pickleball courts as dynamic third places where he and his wife engage with a varied community. He appreciates the social aspect of the game and the opportunity to meet and interact with new people.

7. Another Paul from Washington Heights (21:26–21:58): This Paul discusses English country dancing and contra dancing as vibrant third places. He highlights the welcoming atmosphere, live music, and the practice of changing partners after each dance as factors that foster community and continuous social interaction.

8. Michael from the East Village (22:17–22:32): Michael reflects on his long-term involvement in dance as a third place, sharing how decades of participation have led to enduring friendships and a strong sense of belonging within his dance community.

9. Heidi from Huntington (22:41–23:18): Heidi describes how horseback riding became her third place during the pandemic, providing a safe way to connect with others and build a supportive community centered around equestrian activities.

Insights on Third Places

Towards the end of the episode, Volpe (23:43–24:28) discusses the inherent challenges adults face in making new friends compared to childhood. She stresses that third places offer low-pressure environments where regular interactions can naturally lead to meaningful connections. Volpe encourages listeners to actively engage with third places to foster community bonds and alleviate feelings of isolation.

Conclusion

Kusha and Alison summarize the diverse array of third spaces mentioned by the callers, including Central Park, YMCAs, churches, community gardens, and more (24:28–24:50). They invite listeners to share their favorite third places via social media platforms such as Instagram and X (formerly Twitter), reinforcing the podcast’s community-centric ethos.

Alison Stewart closes the episode by teasing upcoming topics and segments, maintaining listener engagement and anticipation for future discussions.

Notable Quotes

• Kusha Navadar (00:53): “A place where everyone may not know your name, but you can connect with people.”

• Ali Volpe (02:37): “There was a real hunger for community that I know many people have felt, myself included, during that time.”

• Ali Volpe (06:49): “Be the change you want to see.”

• Amy (12:07): “People know when you come back from vacation.”

• David (17:48): “That's where I could share that and get the support.”

• Ali Volpe (16:58): “These areas can really provide resources for people.”

Final Thoughts

The episode of "All Of It" offers a comprehensive exploration of third places, underscoring their vital role in fostering community, combating isolation, and enhancing individual well-being. Through expert insights, personal anecdotes, and active listener participation, the podcast paints a vivid picture of the current state of third spaces and the collective effort needed to preserve and rejuvenate these essential communal hubs. Listeners are left with a deep appreciation for the value of third places and inspired to actively seek out and contribute to their local communities.