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- [00:00]
Scott Wilkinson
In this episode of Home Theater Geeks, I continue my conversation with industry journalist and consultant Mike Heiss about CEDIA 2025. So stay tuned.
- [00:12]
Will
Let's map out this week's amazing destinations and travel tips.
- [00:16]
T Mobile Spokesperson
Honestly, Will, I didn't plan any trips, but I did switch to T Mobile with their new Family Freedom offer.
- [00:24]
Will
That's not the itinerary we're following.
- [00:27]
T Mobile Spokesperson
Well, I'm departing from AT&T and embarking on a new journ with T Mobile. They paid off my family's four phones up to $3200 and gave us four new phones on the house.
- [00:40]
Michael Heiss
Bon voyage.
- [00:42]
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- [01:07]
T Mobile Spokesperson
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- [01:40]
Michael Heiss
Podcasts you love from people you trust. This is Twit.
- [01:56]
Scott Wilkinson
Hey there, Scott Wilkinson here, the home theater geek. In this episode I continue my conversation with Michael Heiss, industry consultant, journalist and jolly good Cedia fellow about the Cedia trade show that he just returned from. Hey Mike, welcome back.
- [02:16]
Michael Heiss
Oh, thanks Scott. Yeah, boy, I tell you, just flew in, boy, and my arms and everything.
- [02:20]
Scott Wilkinson
Your arms tired.
- [02:24]
Michael Heiss
You know, it's the mile high city, let me tell you.
- [02:27]
Scott Wilkinson
Yeah, it's one reason I don't go there anymore.
- [02:30]
Michael Heiss
But people miss you people. I said, you know, I'm representing Scott and they go, say hi to Scott. Celia says hi to Scott.
- [02:37]
Scott Wilkinson
That's so nice to hear. I'm glad my name is totally Forgotten?
- [02:41]
Michael Heiss
Nope, not at all.
- [02:43]
Scott Wilkinson
That's great. That's great. I also want to make special note of the fact that you and I today are celebrating the 500th episode of Home Theater Geeks.
- [02:55]
Michael Heiss
Happy birthday to you.
- [02:59]
Scott Wilkinson
Thank you. I'm really excited about that. Really happy that we've made it this far. And here's to another 500. Eh.
- [03:08]
Michael Heiss
Mazel tov.
- [03:09]
Scott Wilkinson
Thank you. Thank you. So the Cedia Expo, as it's called, has been going for a very long time and it's all about higher end, generally custom installation, not only of home theater stuff, but all sorts of smart home things. And, and you know, just anything that you might install into a, into a modern home. We're going to focus. What's that?
- [03:37]
Michael Heiss
Or around the home. Not just. I mean, I know. Oh, that's a figure of speech. But especially to this point. And I, I forgot to mention to that this in your. In our notes that in and around the home, because I was tripping over those subwoofer bollards all over the place.
- [03:54]
Scott Wilkinson
The outdoor ones. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. Well, we're going to talk mostly about audio in this show, at least to start with. And I want to focus on the audio news and some of the big demos also. And in this case there were a few new products that were introduced. You made mention of the fact that there were a lot of two channel audio things. Amps, preamps, integrated amps.
- [04:21]
Michael Heiss
Yeah. Something that you wouldn't expect for people that think of Cedia as a home theater group.
- [04:28]
Scott Wilkinson
Yeah.
- [04:29]
Michael Heiss
But there was a lot of. Not very, not any of it that I can think of that was actually demoed like you used to do up in the Venetian during ces.
- [04:38]
Scott Wilkinson
Right.
- [04:39]
Michael Heiss
But it was there. And the interesting thing that is changing that industry. And sorry for jumping ahead, but a lot of these newer devices, including the more expensive ones, had five or, you know, slightly larger really nice resolution color TFT displays on the front panel. So even though I couldn't hear what was being played, you could see what was being played because they're streaming centric. Right.
- [05:07]
Scott Wilkinson
And they have album art on these. On these front panels.
- [05:09]
Michael Heiss
Exactly.
- [05:10]
Scott Wilkinson
Yeah. There was a, There was a pair of products from Anthem, which I believe was a preamp and a power amp. And we have a picture of that here. And notice the VU meters. Yeah.
- [05:27]
Michael Heiss
Virtual views.
- [05:28]
Scott Wilkinson
Yeah. Those are actually not physical meters, but. But rather pictures of meters.
- [05:35]
Michael Heiss
Exactly.
- [05:36]
Scott Wilkinson
That work. And a preamp there on top of them.
- [05:39]
Michael Heiss
Right.
- [05:40]
Scott Wilkinson
ARCAM also had a number of cool things. The SA45 integrated two channel amp with integrated streaming. And this is an example of what you were just talking about.
- [05:52]
Michael Heiss
And the industrial design was just really beautiful.
- [05:57]
Scott Wilkinson
And that's new at the show, new at CD along with the SA35 which I assume just had a little less power.
- [06:04]
Michael Heiss
A little less power. And I think there was one step down that did just have a standard two line display. But this is in the. If they have to ask, you can't afford it or if you have to ask, don't ask, just buy the better one.
- [06:16]
Scott Wilkinson
Yeah, right. Another thing from our cam was the ST25 and a 25 streamer integrated amp combo.
- [06:26]
Michael Heiss
There you go.
- [06:27]
Scott Wilkinson
Which you got a picture here. And these were also new at the show, also from Onkyo, revered old brand, the Icon P80 network preamp and M80 power amp. Again two channel. And look.
- [06:48]
Michael Heiss
If I can interject there the interesting thing, I mean I used to make my living not electronically designing but you know, running a part of a division of Harmon that made those things. And I would say I can't have that. Where are the damn buttons? And there ain't no buttons. But that's goes to where the market is and it's not the old things or I used to get yelled at by putting too many buttons on a remote. But, but you know, it's the difference between here's a remote with a lot of buttons.
- [07:20]
Scott Wilkinson
Yep.
- [07:20]
Michael Heiss
Here's a remote with not a lot of buttons.
- [07:23]
Scott Wilkinson
Right.
- [07:24]
Michael Heiss
But that's where the market is.
- [07:27]
Scott Wilkinson
The market is going for fewer buttons, buttons, buttons.
- [07:31]
Michael Heiss
Who's got the buttons?
- [07:33]
Scott Wilkinson
And interestingly, Technics had a turntable.
- [07:37]
Michael Heiss
They had a whole suite of products and they were not on the floor and so they were playing it. But you know, they're, they're keen to sense that the market is just not about home theater.
- [07:51]
Scott Wilkinson
Right.
- [07:52]
Michael Heiss
And there are other and especially in the type of houses that some of the CEDIA installers do. There is a music room or there is an office where you know, I, I actually have the speakers here. But I don't have a sound system hooked up in my, in my office. Even though I've got the speakers, I've got a stereo receiver down there and that's, you know, where the music comes from. And it's a streamer.
- [08:17]
Scott Wilkinson
Right. Turning, turning now to multichannel. There were a number of high end processors that we've seen for years, but a couple of new, new models and a new technology in those models that is very cool. Trinov for example, had the Altitude CI CI for custom integrator or custom installer, up to 32 channels. We have a picture of it. Here it is. And the really interesting thing here it's with, here it is the altitude 16 or CI rather with the amplitude 16, which is their power amp. 16 channel power amp. And the interesting thing about it is how do you connect the preamp or the processor? Where the outputs, where are the outputs? In the next picture we can see there's one cable, it's an ethernet cable connecting those two units. It's using a technology called AOIP audio over IP, sometimes called AES67 or Dante. And all of the audio, all 16 channels are up to 32 channels are going through that one Ethernet cable, which.
- [09:35]
Michael Heiss
Is really cool and it sounded good. It makes it smaller and you know, that also goes to the application question. If you were to put that in a home theater. The only other inputs, it's kind of hard to see perhaps in the picture but. But there's a row of HDMI inputs across the top.
- [09:52]
Scott Wilkinson
Yep.
- [09:53]
Michael Heiss
But there's no hooking like you would with a traditional surround sound processor. There's no hooking up a CD player or a turntable preamp.
- [10:03]
Scott Wilkinson
No analog input.
- [10:05]
Michael Heiss
Any analog inputs. Exactly. And, but this is, you know, sort of purpose specific. But that's where the market is going, particularly for the higher end theaters. Know where you'll have kind of a Trinov, a Storm or a Synthesis or some others or in some of the lower price bands. There were some very impressive large AVRs and you wouldn't. And that's where the analog inputs you know, are. But you know, you don't typically think of a high end home theater with an avr, but there they were.
- [10:42]
Scott Wilkinson
There they were.
- [10:44]
Will
Let's map out this week's amazing destinations and travel tips.
- [10:48]
T Mobile Spokesperson
Honestly Will, I didn't plan any trips but I did switch to T Mobile with their new Family Freedom offer.
- [10:56]
Will
That's not the itinerary we're following.
- [10:59]
T Mobile Spokesperson
Well, I'm departing from AT&T and embarking on a new journey with T Mobile. They paid off my family's four phones up to $3200 and gave us four new phones on the house.
- [11:12]
Michael Heiss
Bon voyage.
- [11:14]
T Mobile Advertiser
Introducing Family Freedom. Our lowest cost will switch our biggest family savings all on America's largest 5G network. Visit your local T Mobile location or learn more@t mobile.com familyfreedom. Up to $800 per line via virtual prepaid card typically takes 15 days. Free phones via 24 monthly bill credits with finance agreement eg. Apple iPhone 16, 128 gigabyte $829.99 eligible trade in eg iPhone 11 Pro for well qualified credits end and balance due if you pay off early or cancel contact T Mobile.
- [11:40]
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- [12:09]
Michael Heiss
Now.
- [12:11]
Scott Wilkinson
Trinov also announced integration with a commercial cinema product, the Dolby IMS 3000, which is their Atmos processor. And here's a picture you took of, of them connecting to a Trinoff processor as well, right?
- [12:30]
Michael Heiss
Yeah.
- [12:30]
Scott Wilkinson
And.
- [12:30]
Michael Heiss
And that's the kind of thing the, the origin, the synthesis. The synthesis of the synthesis. Oh man, my die. The synthesis. And back in the days when I was. Sorry, back in the days when I worked at Harman, I was there when that was was started. And part of the conceit of synthesis was it was designed for large scale theaters on what's called the Bel Air Circuit and their processors. And within reason you can hook an IMS 3000 up to a processor. But they really do want it to be a 67. And the answer, the way, the reason for that is to avoid piracy.
- [13:13]
Scott Wilkinson
Right? Right. The Bel Air Circuit. The Bel Air Circuit by the way, is private homes in the Bel Air area mostly of where but or anywhere. But you had to have basically a commercial grade cinema system in your home and they would send you hard disks with the movie current movies to watch on your system.
- [13:40]
Michael Heiss
Or in the old days, I mean the genesis again of that part of the market, these are the people that used to have big enough stars or directors or studio executives that they'd have a full dual simplex projectors and they'd have to get a union projectionist if they wanted to have a movie night.
- [13:57]
Scott Wilkinson
Right.
- [13:58]
Michael Heiss
Or to run the rushes or the dailies or whatever.
- [14:00]
Scott Wilkinson
Right.
- [14:01]
Michael Heiss
And now just as cinema has moved all digital in almost all cases, so has home theater. So that's the origin of that.
- [14:11]
Scott Wilkinson
Right. Okay. Storm Audio also had a new processor using this AOIP, the Elite 32, as well as a receiver. Talk about expensive receivers. The ISR Fusion uses aiop.
- [14:27]
Michael Heiss
Where the buttons. The same thing. Where are the buttons?
- [14:29]
Scott Wilkinson
Where the buttons.
- [14:31]
Michael Heiss
Because they all have. The trend is they don't have the little two line displays that I used to use. They just all have these five inch displays. But most of these are run remotely by a Crestron or a Control 4 or Survant or Josh AI, which is the whole other part of Cedia. Right, those folk. Right, but that's why there are no more buttons anywhere.
- [14:54]
Scott Wilkinson
Yeah, yeah, exactly. JBL synthesis, you mentioned those earlier. They had the SDP 80 and SMA series power amps that were new at the show. And this is the SDR38AV receiver. Yet another receiver.
- [15:14]
Michael Heiss
Masquerading is a high end theater and it does a good job.
- [15:18]
Scott Wilkinson
Yeah, yeah, exactly.
- [15:20]
Michael Heiss
It was interesting. If I can jump ahead, that with one or two exceptions like those, although the synthesis one is not new, there were no new AVRs then and not everybody was there. Sony was on the floor with last year's aviars. Yamaha was on the floor with last year's avrs. Denon Marantz, which are soon to be acquired by Harman, were on the floor, but also had a floor in the Meridian Hotel. Onkyo was not on the floor and did not show AVRs. But all of the major traditional legacy AVR manufacturers did not introduce new models as CES, nor is CD, nor might they even at CES in 26. And there are a lot of complex supply chain and the T word which you didn't want to mention at this show, but tariff issues and economic and supply chain issues and some technology issues that there were no new AVRs. But then you could say, and again, when you're dealing with people who are selling this stuff, you can say to the consumer, to the client, this is good. It's last year's. No, it's this year's. And, and it's so good that it'll be good for the next few years because there really isn't anything that you can think of coming down the road that would make your AVR obsolete. And so that's to me for the consumer, for the folks that are watching this, that's great news.
- [16:59]
Scott Wilkinson
Yeah, absolutely. Couldn't agree more. Okay, moving on to speakers. I wanted to start with Grimani Systems, one of my favorite brands because that's what I use in my home.
- [17:11]
Michael Heiss
One of my favorite guys and one.
- [17:13]
Scott Wilkinson
Of my favorite guys, Anthony Grimani, he had a new speaker there, the MP84, which is a biamped in ceiling speaker. So he's aware of how many people like having some speakers in the ceiling. But more interesting is that he received a CEDIA Lifetime Achievement award. So congratulations to Anthony Grimani. Here's a picture of four.
- [17:40]
Michael Heiss
Who are those guys?
- [17:41]
Scott Wilkinson
Who are those guys? Four lifetime Achievement award winners, starting with you.
- [17:48]
Michael Heiss
Yeah. Wearing my jacket.
- [17:49]
Scott Wilkinson
I love that jacket, man.
- [17:52]
Michael Heiss
My ability to make a fool out of myself knows no bounds. It's my trademark.
- [17:58]
Scott Wilkinson
You got your Lifetime achievement award in 2020, I believe.
- [18:01]
Michael Heiss
Yeah. During COVID And I didn't like, get to stand up and give a speech and have a nice video made, but it's sitting in the other room in.
- [18:10]
Scott Wilkinson
That photo we want to point out. Also, Rich Green is next to you next.
- [18:15]
Michael Heiss
The guy with the ribbons.
- [18:16]
Scott Wilkinson
The guy with the ribbons. He has a lot of them. He got his last year. And next to him is Anthony Grimani, who got.
- [18:22]
Michael Heiss
You almost said it.
- [18:23]
Scott Wilkinson
I almost did. Yes. And. And finally, Bill Scare, who's a cd.
- [18:31]
Michael Heiss
Longtime CD installer and was really instrumental in a lot of the inner workings of Cedia and, and, and. Or Bail from Texas. And he's a great guy. And it, you know, it's like the Saturday Night Live Five Timers Club. I kept kidding. I kept kidding. Mr. Grimani, teach him the secret handshake.
- [18:56]
Scott Wilkinson
Right, Right. Exactly. Other speakers that I read about were interesting from Paradigm and a force canceling vibration canceling in wall subwoofer. The FSC12SW, which I think is a great idea. Send sound into the room, but cancels the vibration. So, you know, your drywall doesn't shake apart. Procella had a couple of interesting things. Some new UNO subwoofers and a P5O C W on wall on ceiling speaker. Here's a. This is a graphic that they provided. I'm a big fan actually of on wall and on ceiling speakers.
- [19:42]
Michael Heiss
That's what I a lot of people, because there were a boatload of them. That was a. You know, in fact, now that you mention it, there were very few what we'd call in the old days, box speakers. There were some, but the in ceiling, on wall, in wall type of arrangement was very prevalent. And I know you're going to talk about it, but the best demo I heard. Well, if not the best, clearly the best or second best demo that I heard at CEDIA was using that type of speaker.
- [20:21]
Scott Wilkinson
Right. And we're going to get to that in a minute. I also wanted to point out Procella's P628 above screen speaker. Four LED screens for these DV LED screens that we talked about in. In part one. It goes over the screen and points down toward the listening area. And there were at least a couple of demos that use that kind of speaker.
- [20:50]
Michael Heiss
One.
- [20:50]
Scott Wilkinson
One that used that very speaker. We'll talk about that in a minute. Wisdom Audio.
- [20:56]
Michael Heiss
That's the problem. That's the biggest problem. You can't drill holes in those screens.
- [21:00]
Scott Wilkinson
That's right.
- [21:01]
Michael Heiss
You can do it, but it doesn't.
- [21:03]
Scott Wilkinson
Yeah. Void the warranty. For sure.
- [21:05]
Michael Heiss
Yeah, for sure. And that is a problem that the brightest minds in the speaker world have been trying to solve since the start of DV LEDs and including the first one up in. Was it Chatsworth in Winnetka? I don't know why I keep confusing them that.
- [21:25]
Scott Wilkinson
Because they're next door to each other, probably that.
- [21:28]
Michael Heiss
And jbl, you know, had all sorts of different arrangements, and it was either speakers on the side or speakers on the top and different brands. But using the sort of technique that you just showed is sort of the way these things are going. And, you know, the Nobel Prize is waiting for the folk who can figure out a way to do this. JBL used to do bouncy, bouncy speakers where they would reflect the sound off the screen. And it just. The imaging just wasn't there. And everybody found that it was better just to, you know, to put them on top and below the screen.
- [22:04]
Scott Wilkinson
Yeah, yeah. Wisdom Audio was there. They're one of my favorite speaker brands. Guys do their stuff. They had some Sage series all weather speakers and some more on walls, including the L75 here. They're. They're very well known for these line arrays, which are long, tall, skinny arrays of speakers that give you really nice imaging horizontally.
- [22:33]
Michael Heiss
And K array and L Acoustics also were in that similar vein.
- [22:37]
Scott Wilkinson
Right? Yeah, exactly. Bluesound, Canadian company had their Pulse Cinema sound bar 3.2.2 Atmos with 16 drivers and a mini version of that. A number of companies had what I'm calling invisible speakers. JBL has done that for a while. They've. They have the conceal line, which actually can be mounted behind drywall. Anthem does it. Paradigm does it.
- [23:09]
Michael Heiss
There was another one from Sweetwater called Edge Sound.
- [23:13]
Scott Wilkinson
Oh, yes, yes.
- [23:15]
Michael Heiss
Which I. Which I went to see.
- [23:17]
Scott Wilkinson
And what, you think.
- [23:25]
Michael Heiss
There'S an application for that kind of approach? As I believe. Are you. I'm not a fan of what some of us might call butt kickers.
- [23:36]
Scott Wilkinson
Right.
- [23:36]
Michael Heiss
But this was not a butt kicker.
- [23:38]
Scott Wilkinson
This was not. Not transducers in the seat.
- [23:41]
Michael Heiss
Well, no, below the seat. And. And. And that's where to call this a butt kicker is not fair. Mounted behind the wall with a little transducer. And there, there you see it.
- [23:58]
Scott Wilkinson
It's mounted behind the drywall.
- [24:00]
Michael Heiss
Behind the drywall or in one case wood paneling. And there are clearly applications where that is is a valid approach and an audio file solution. It was not to my ears.
- [24:15]
Scott Wilkinson
No.
- [24:16]
Michael Heiss
However, this was originally designed by Sweetwater, which is a big commercial contractor group. And let me see. It is. It's in the sphere. It's NFL.
- [24:29]
Scott Wilkinson
You know, it's in the sphere in Vegas. Really?
- [24:31]
Michael Heiss
Yep, it's in the sphere in Vegas. And this is called embodied sound. And again it is something built to meet a demand. So it is very unfair to compare them to a traditional speaker. And I think they'd be the first to say that's not what this is for. But that's the whole point of Cedia Expo is that the CDFO are looking for solutions and what works for one doesn't work for everybody else. I, I wouldn't have Joe Kane adjust my 32 inch Insignia TV in the kitchen. Yeah, but that's not, it's not meant for that.
- [25:13]
Scott Wilkinson
Yeah.
- [25:14]
Michael Heiss
And, and it's the same thing here.
- [25:16]
Scott Wilkinson
Yeah, yeah. Okay. Still it's interesting.
- [25:19]
Michael Heiss
And it, and it served. And again it served the purpose very well. The trick is for that the people who install it have to make sure that it's the right stuff for the right job.
- [25:31]
Scott Wilkinson
Yeah, yeah, exactly. A couple other quick things. One is KaleidoScape introduced an AI powered discovery recommendation feature. I'm surprised they didn't have it up till now. But Kai will now recommend stuff maybe better than some other recommendation engines. The thing though that you sent me a picture of that I, that I went oh man, that takes me back to the 70s is the egg chair is back. Look at that thing.
- [26:08]
Michael Heiss
Man, if I didn't have my backpack and a lot of junk with me I would have gone and sit in it. But yeah, that's very. The prisoner. I am the new number two. Number one.
- [26:20]
Scott Wilkinson
Yes, I am number two.
- [26:21]
Michael Heiss
Don't worry about number one.
- [26:23]
Scott Wilkinson
Exactly.
- [26:24]
Michael Heiss
And that's what that's for. And that's that one that you're seeing now is available as 5.1, 7.1 or 11.1. I was going to ask the fellow on the booth what the price was, but it's a very high end Japanese kind of thing and the fellows English wasn't that good. But I don't know if you remember when you used to go to nab the nhk the Nash, the Japanese public.
- [26:51]
Scott Wilkinson
Public broadcaster. Yeah.
- [26:52]
Michael Heiss
Right. They used to have a 22.2 system.
- [26:56]
Scott Wilkinson
Yep.
- [26:57]
Michael Heiss
Which was a little bizarro. But another group working with the folks that make that egg, have a version of that. That's 22.2.
- [27:09]
Scott Wilkinson
Wow. Now that thing is meant for two people.
- [27:12]
Michael Heiss
Yeah. Who are very close to each other.
- [27:15]
Scott Wilkinson
Yes. Who are very friendly. It also comes in a single seat version.
- [27:19]
Michael Heiss
But that's no fun.
- [27:20]
Scott Wilkinson
That's no fun, that. But this one is meant for two. So I just, I had to say that that was, that got the, the, the, the weird product of the show award for me.
- [27:30]
Michael Heiss
But Laundry Jet was still there.
- [27:32]
Scott Wilkinson
Laundry Jet was still there. Okay, so that's good. All right, let's talk about a couple of the big demos you went to. Some of them, not all of them. I know, because you were really busy. Did you go to the, the Seymour Screen Excellence Christie?
- [27:47]
Michael Heiss
I did.
- [27:48]
Scott Wilkinson
And that was over a million dollars.
- [27:51]
Michael Heiss
They said 1.3 mil at.
- [27:54]
Scott Wilkinson
At 14 point, 18.10. Sound system. That's 14 speakers around 18 overhead and 10 subwoofers.
- [28:05]
Michael Heiss
And I don't want to get in trouble, but to my ears, it was too loud.
- [28:11]
Scott Wilkinson
I'm not surprised.
- [28:12]
Michael Heiss
And if you were there, you'd, you know, have your, you know, I'd have my.
- [28:17]
Scott Wilkinson
I would be measuring it and I would be going, it's too damn loud.
- [28:21]
Michael Heiss
That's right. And it sounded good. It was. And again, you know, I'm not a golden ears guy. And after that demo, my ears are a little bit less than golden. It. It was good. And they will sell a lot of them and good for them.
- [28:39]
Scott Wilkinson
Yeah.
- [28:39]
Michael Heiss
Not to my taste.
- [28:40]
Scott Wilkinson
Yeah.
- [28:42]
Michael Heiss
But, you know, and you know, it was an interesting collection of gear.
- [28:48]
Scott Wilkinson
Seymour Screen Excellence Multi format retractable screen.
- [28:51]
Michael Heiss
They were doing some interesting things that the screen itself, actually, to my hats off to Seymour. That was my father's name. But the hats off to Seymour was. It was a very interesting screen that had some unique tensioning rods on the side.
- [29:06]
Scott Wilkinson
Right.
- [29:07]
Michael Heiss
Lift it up and masking things that came down the screen for me was the best part of that demo.
- [29:14]
Scott Wilkinson
Now, Christie Eclipse Projector, $400,000 projector. Don't look at the projector. Panamorph lens. Anamorphic lens for 20 grand. A MADVR NV extreme processor for 16 grand. Storm Elite 32 AOIP processor.
- [29:33]
Will
Today's show is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. Do you ever find yourself playing the budgeting game? Well, with the name your price tool from Progressive, you can find options that fit your budget and Potentially lower your your bills. Try it@progressive.com Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates Price and coverage match limited by state law. Not available in all states. Let's map out this week's amazing destinations and travel tips.
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That's not the itinerary we're following.
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Michael Heiss
Bon voyage.
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- [31:25]
Scott Wilkinson
Ascendo Halo speakers. Oh, we got to look at these. You got some pictures of these?
- [31:30]
Michael Heiss
Yeah, yeah.
- [31:30]
Scott Wilkinson
Check this.
- [31:31]
Michael Heiss
Now that picture is. It's a little fuzzy and I apologize. But they had the room dark, which is what they would typically do for these. Sure, I had a really, you know, monkey a little bit with the, with the picture. But. But that's sort of an unusual, that sort of donut thing with the six drivers around the edge and in the middle. It's not a donut hole. There's another driver. Yeah, that guy. There you go. Thank you. And you can see that they still had the projector on, but they lifted the screen. That's why it looks a little funky. And, and again it, you know, I don't want to say. Not for me to say. But I'm sure that there are people who like it and there are people that, you know, weren't that impressed with it, but it made a point. This is a demonstration system in more ways than one. It is a demonstration and it proved the point that things can be. Can be good when they're expensive and. And, you know, maybe not necessarily so well. And again, I'm not putting them down. It's, you know, my personal opinion.
- [32:44]
Scott Wilkinson
Yeah, yeah, yeah. By the way, what. Not. What we didn't see in that picture was two 64 inch subwoofers.
- [32:50]
Michael Heiss
Oh, yeah, yeah. I've. I. My camera was wonked out and I took some pictures and they were too fuzzy. Don't look at the projector and don't stand next to the subwoofer. You'll literally be blown away. Yeah, let me. I will say the bass in that room was really, really good.
- [33:10]
Scott Wilkinson
Yeah, I'm sure. Okay, then probably, I think your favorite, as you, as I recall you telling me, demo was the Quantum Media Systems.
- [33:22]
Michael Heiss
Well, Quantum Media Systems. And Theory.
- [33:26]
Scott Wilkinson
And theory, yeah.
- [33:27]
Michael Heiss
In fact, Theory, which a lot of people have always said, mike, go to Theory. And they coincidentally are in the same hallway in the exhibit area where Quantum has their booth and Epson and techniques, and I call those Theory guys. And so he said, oh, Mike, you really got to go and see it. And I did. And I was totally blown away with the quality of Paul Hales, who is the designer and I guess the guy who runs the thing.
- [33:56]
Scott Wilkinson
I'm very impressed with him. I've enjoyed my times with him very much.
- [34:00]
Michael Heiss
He not only gave a master class in audio, he gave a master class in presentation, because that was. And I do a lot of them. That was one of the best presentations I have ever seen. Even before he started playing stuff to choreograph the things that were in the room and the message that he was trying to convey. And the interesting part is you just Talked about the $1.3 million system, the synthesis demo, which was very good that I saw, I think they said was like near 3, 4, or $500,000. Now what's. What's a couple hundred thousand dollars between friends?
- [34:38]
Scott Wilkinson
Yeah.
- [34:41]
Michael Heiss
Paul said after demoing this stuff, said, here's what $1 million home, home theater is with theory. The total price of this system that you just heard, which was really damn good with his speakers, which require his DSP and his amplifiers, was $83,000 then to make it a $1.3 million system, buy a big house. And he had that on the screen. And I think that that's kind of his shtick, but it was done so well. And people. You could see people going, that makes sense. And he doesn't. Didn't have that many SKUs, didn't have many products. But the stuff. That's somebody who knows their stuff.
- [35:35]
Scott Wilkinson
Yeah.
- [35:35]
Michael Heiss
And just like everything else, is it for everybody. And the answer is no. And he comes out of the pro world, so, you know, you have to figure that into it. He took the drivers that were in the front for the cinema demo, and they were in pendants above you. And so it was not just for what they call voice of God or heist speakers, but he turned off the front speakers and just had these four pendants, you know, two front and two rear. And the imaging was. Was pretty damn good for nothing. That was up front.
- [36:12]
Scott Wilkinson
Yeah.
- [36:13]
Michael Heiss
So that was one where I have to say I was really, really impressed with something that shame on me, had never seen before or heard.
- [36:25]
Scott Wilkinson
Well, I'm sure you'll go see him again. I've seen. I've visited with him a number of times over the years, and I agree with you 100%. He knows his stuff. He knows what he's talking about. There's a. I think I've got a graphic of the Quantum media system diagram. There it is.
- [36:45]
Michael Heiss
Yeah. Because that. That's using a speaker line called tpi, which is not well known, but to the point that you made in the first part of this presentation, you could see there's the different modules making up that screen, and he's got three speakers above, three speakers below. You got good imaging. The. And then there were speakers at the. Actually rather large speaker systems at the rear, left and right, and front left and right. So they were also. This was just in a big meeting room. No acoustic treatment. It's not like the other big demos where they make a big point of showing what the work that was done. They didn't. They're not doing it anymore. But what. Chernobyl and Perlison used to do an acoustica Athena, the big demo for the last two or three years, which, I mean, that thing was amazing. They really built. Not a home theater, they built a theater theater on the floor. And it's a little expensive, which is why they're not doing it this year.
- [37:51]
Scott Wilkinson
Right.
- [37:52]
Michael Heiss
What. What they did with Quantum just in a hotel, big meeting room. Sounded wonderful, but it was hard to judge because the picture was so good you couldn't listen to the sound.
- [38:05]
Scott Wilkinson
You got to.
- [38:06]
Michael Heiss
Do you know where to send it? No, I can't do that.
- [38:11]
Scott Wilkinson
What do you think of the Samsung Harman JBL synthesis demo?
- [38:16]
Michael Heiss
I was. I was very impressed. And again, I don't know how many of the people who are listening and watching the show, and maybe you're not in the business of selling things to people, but if you want to demo now, maybe you are selling things. If you want to demo, whether it's to your significant other to explain to the other significant person why you spent all that money on this thing or you want to impress your neighbor. The key is curationing of the curation of the material, given that the thing has to be set up. Right. I mean, that goes without saying, but I think that that was pretty much the best demo. It had an Epson, the $30,000 projector, and of course, the audio and the speakers are all synthesis. And the fact that they use the right demo material in a properly calibrated system. And that's part of the. The whole thing about synthesis. Yes. I presume you can buy the components, but they really don't want you to. They want to have a CD or. Or a certified person install it, and that's what makes the difference.
- [39:25]
Scott Wilkinson
Yeah.
- [39:25]
Michael Heiss
And it sounded really, really good.
- [39:27]
Scott Wilkinson
Really good. I think. You didn't get to see the Procella demo.
- [39:31]
Michael Heiss
Is that. No. Damn it. And Chuck. Well, Chuck back, who's a, you know, longtime.
- [39:37]
Scott Wilkinson
He's a friend. Oh, yeah. Fellow traveler. Yes.
- [39:40]
Michael Heiss
And we'll have to say that I don't know.
- [39:42]
Scott Wilkinson
Yeah.
- [39:43]
Michael Heiss
The door. What do you call it? I apologize to Chuck that I didn't see it, but I heard that it was very good. And I also. I'm embarrassed to say I palled around with Mr. Grimani, but I didn't see his demo this year.
- [39:59]
Scott Wilkinson
Oh, that's too bad, because he's another one. He's another one like Paul Hales, that is just phenomenal. Knows his stuff inside and out and well, because he.
- [40:10]
Michael Heiss
As do I. I was going to say, regrettably, he goes back to the origins of when, in conjunction with Roger Dressler and John Kellogg and a little bit of yo and Allen at Dolby when. When he worked at Dolby, he was in the forefront of getting Matrix home theater out to the market. And then I first ran into him at THX in the Carriage House when I was a THX licensee. But the speakers that he sells, he designs.
- [40:43]
Scott Wilkinson
Yes.
- [40:43]
Michael Heiss
Speakers that he sells, he installs and commissions. And that's the key. And again, to people, you don't have to be a CD person, but as much as Anything. It's not the gear, and I know you're a big proponent of this, it's how it's put together and how things, you know, that's why things like the Rack have become very popular, because that's a shortcut way to do this or the other technologies that are similar and that makes all the difference in the world.
- [41:14]
Scott Wilkinson
Yep. Same as what Samsung and Armen do. The Priscilla demo we had, I have a graphic, sort of a diagram of what that looked like, and that was pretty amazing. 135 inch DV LED screen with these P628 speakers above the screen with a bunch of surrounds and subs and. And amps. I. I'm sorry you missed that one, I'm sure.
- [41:41]
Michael Heiss
No, and, and, but that's typical of those big demos. And if you look at that slide, the other big demos have speaker arrays that are not unlike that. Yeah, and, and whether. Except, of course, if it's a projection system, you put the speakers behind the screen.
- [42:00]
Scott Wilkinson
The screen, you know, which is acoustically transparent.
- [42:03]
Michael Heiss
And. But then the trick is to make. To get the imaging right. And it's all about the imaging.
- [42:07]
Scott Wilkinson
Yep, Yep. Exactly right. Well, tell us if you have any final thoughts about this year's CD Expo.
- [42:18]
Michael Heiss
I was pleasantly surprised at the attendance. There were a lot of people there, which is good for the association, but it's a good sign for the economy that there are a lot of people from all over the world that. And all over the country, places that you wouldn't think would be hotbeds of home theater or, you know, smart home. Smart home that were doing things there. You know, again, it's sort of off topic for home theater geeks, but things like Josh AI and Control4 and Crestron with the, you know, the digital distribution was there. So I think that, you know, with any luck, it'll be a good year. I hope it'll be a good year for everybody.
- [43:00]
Scott Wilkinson
Yeah. Yeah. Well, me too. Me too.
- [43:03]
Michael Heiss
We can use it.
- [43:04]
Scott Wilkinson
Yeah. Well, thanks so much for sharing your experience with us over these two episodes. It's always great to talk to you. Thanks so much.
- [43:12]
Michael Heiss
See you after ces.
- [43:13]
Scott Wilkinson
See you after ces. And before you go, tell us where we. Where anybody can find you online.
- [43:19]
Michael Heiss
You can find me online and occasionally in print at Residential tech today restech, today.com or hidden wires. Hidden wires with an s.co.uk or you can find my crazy website where you can find out how to. If you live in the neighborhood, I'll come and notarize stuff for you. Michaelheist.com so can I do one last story?
- [43:44]
Scott Wilkinson
Sure.
- [43:45]
Michael Heiss
As you know, my people don't know, my wife. Leslie Nathan is a retired licensed New York and California architect. And when she finally, right before we got married and moved to la, she got her New York architect's license. And in those days you had to stamp a document. So bloody jealous. She could stamp things. And for years and years. And I said, what do I do? He says, you can't touch that. It's against the law. I said, you know what? I'm going to become a notary public so I can stamp stuff.
- [44:19]
Scott Wilkinson
And so you did.
- [44:22]
Michael Heiss
So yeah, there. There you go. Free notarization with every home theater.
- [44:32]
Scott Wilkinson
Well, thank you. Thank you, Mike, for being here. That's Michael Heiss, industry consultant, journalist, and a jolly good CDFello to boot.
- [44:42]
Michael Heiss
Thanks, Scott. Take care.
- [44:43]
Scott Wilkinson
You bet. You too. Now, if you have a question for me, please send it along to htgwit TV and I'll answer as many as I can right here on the show. And as you know, all of TWIT's shows are available on YouTube for free, but with ads. If you want to go ad free, join the club, go to Twit TV Club Twit and join today. Until next time, geek out.
- [45:13]
Will
Hey, thanks for tuning in to TWiT, your tech hub for intelligent, thoughtful conversations. If you want to take your experience to the next level and support what we do here at TWiT, say goodbye to ads and say hello to Club Twit. With Club Twit, you unlock all our shows ad free. You also get exclusive members only content. We do a lot of great programming just for the club members. You also get behind the scenes access with our Twit plus bonus feed and live video streams while we're recording. And don't forget the fantastic members only discord. It's where passionate tech fans like you and me hang out, swap ideas and connect directly with all of our hosts. It's my favorite social network. I think you'll like it too. Club Twit. It's not just a subscription, it's how you support support what we do and become part of the Twit family. Your membership directly supports the network, helping us stay independent and keep making the shows you love. If you're ready to upgrade your tech podcast experience, head to Twit TV Club Twit and join us today. Thanks for being here and I'll see you in the club.