Windows Weekly 938: When Will Then Be Now?
Release Date: June 26, 2025
Host: Leo Laporte, Paul Thurrott, Richard Campbell

1. Windows 10 End of Support and Extended Security Updates

Overview:
The episode kicks off with a critical discussion on the impending end of support for Windows 10, scheduled for October 2025. Paul Thurrott delves into Microsoft's newly announced Extended Security Updates (ESU) program, which allows users to receive security patches beyond the official end-of-life date.

Key Points:

• Extended Security Updates (ESU):
  Microsoft is offering ESUs for Windows 10, branded as the "Extended Security Updates" program. This program is not an indefinite extension but provides additional support for a limited period.

• Cost Structure:

  • Businesses: Charged a premium for ESUs, with costs escalating annually. Paul remarks, “Businesses are going to pay through the nose and then through other orifices as time goes on because it’s going to double each year” ([02:24]).
  • Consumers: Initially priced at $30 per year, Microsoft introduced two free options for individuals to access ESUs:
    1. Microsoft Rewards Points: Users can redeem 1,000 Bing rewards points to obtain an extra year of security updates, eliminating the need to pay the $30 fee ([04:03]).
    2. Windows Backup App: Utilizing the Windows Backup app allows users to synchronize their settings to the cloud, facilitating an easy transition to a new system without incurring additional costs ([04:16]).

• Hosts' Perspective:
  Paul criticizes Microsoft's approach, suggesting it's a strategy to retain users without genuinely addressing the need to upgrade. He states, “This is just that little bone they’re going to throw people. You know, it’s a way to get around the 30 bucks” ([05:24]).

Notable Quotes:

• Paul Thurrott: “You don’t have to stay here. So yeah. So we know.” ([02:27])
• Paul Thurrott: “Doesn’t cost anything. Right.” ([05:25])

2. Experiences with Upgrading from Windows 10 to Windows 11

Overview:
The discussion transitions to personal experiences regarding the upgrade process from Windows 10 to Windows 11, highlighting the inconsistencies and challenges faced by users.

Key Points:

• Upgrade Prompts:
  Richard Campbell describes encountering persistent Windows 11 upgrade prompts on a non-domain-joined Windows 10 machine, while a domain-joined machine remains unaffected. He remarks, “Neither one is now continuously offering me Windows 11” ([06:19]).

• Hosts' Solutions and Workarounds:

  • Using Utilities: References to utilities like Steve Gibson's "Never 10" for suppressing upgrade notifications.
  • Organizational Impact: Paul and Richard discuss how domain-joined enterprise machines handle upgrade prompts differently, often defaulting to prompts only for personal machines ([06:37], [06:41]).

Notable Quotes:

• Paul Thurrott: “Richard, you are an enterprise machine.” ([06:43])
• Richard Campbell: “I want to be the guinea pig.” ([08:57])

3. Local AI Models and Hardware Requirements

Overview:
The conversation shifts to the burgeoning field of local AI models, emphasizing the hardware requirements and current limitations that prevent widespread adoption among average consumers.

Key Points:

• Running AI Locally vs. Cloud-Based AI:
  Hosts discuss the potential and challenges of running AI models locally on personal devices. Leo Laporte expresses interest in having a personal AI agent that doesn't rely on cloud services, adding, “I would love a local personal assistant” ([09:22]).

• Hardware Considerations:

  • Processing Power: Emphasis on the need for robust GPUs and sufficient RAM to handle local AI tasks. Paul refers to Intel's Meteor Lake as a noteworthy development in AI-capable CPUs ([11:26]).
  • Cost Implications: The high cost of AI-capable hardware is a barrier, with Leo mentioning models like the Framework desktop priced around $2,000 ([14:00]).

• Future Prospects:
  The hosts speculate on the future advancements in local AI, anticipating more efficient and affordable hardware that could make local AI agents commonplace.

Notable Quotes:

• Leo Laporte: “It's going to be a thing.” ([09:22])
• Paul Thurrott: “Local AI is still very kind of new, even for developers.” ([18:55])

4. Windows Insider Builds and New Features

Overview:
Paul Thurrott provides an update on the latest Windows Insider builds, highlighting new features being tested in the Dev and Beta channels.

Key Points:

• New Homepage for Recall:
  The Recall feature, incorporating AI functionalities, is receiving a significant UI overhaul. Paul describes it as “pleasant looking, kind of like the new Copilot” ([31:04]).

• Hardware Indicators Customization:
  Introduction of customizable hardware indicators (brightness, volume, etc.), allowing users to position these overlays in different screen areas ([32:00]).

• AI Integration in Settings:
  Microsoft is experimenting with an AI agent within Windows 11 settings, enabling users to interact with system settings using natural language. This feature is currently limited to Copilot PCs, utilizing a specialized small language model optimized for the device's MPU ([33:52]).

Notable Quotes:

• Paul Thurrott: “These are the types of things we used to get just as part of the subscription.” ([26:37])
• Paul Thurrott: “The small language model that they made for the settings AI agent... is completely worthless, but is amazing.” ([34:25])

5. Developer Tools and AI Integration

Overview:
The integration of AI into developer tools, particularly GitHub Copilot, is examined, showcasing how AI assists in coding and project management.

Key Points:

• GitHub Copilot:
  Richard Campbell highlights how GitHub Copilot aids developers by suggesting code snippets, identifying bugs across multiple files, and enhancing productivity. He shares personal experiences of Copilot detecting issues in different parts of a project that manual checks might miss ([65:29]).

• Interoperability of AI Models:
  Discussion on the evolving standards in AI interoperability, allowing different AI models to work seamlessly within development environments. Paul notes, “These are going to work and that's a problem” regarding the dominance of specific AI services like Microsoft's ([66:15]).

• Future of AI in Development:
  The hosts anticipate further integration of AI into various IDEs (Integrated Development Environments), improving workflows and reducing manual errors.

Notable Quotes:

• Richard Campbell: “Developers will target that kind of MPU and that might benefit all of us ultimately.” ([12:22])
• Paul Thurrott: “It's a score. And that's the difference between you like the Mac, which doesn't have as powerful MPUs.” ([12:40])

6. Microsoft’s Xbox Division Layoffs

Overview:
A somber segment covers recent layoffs within Microsoft's Xbox division, analyzing potential causes and implications for the company.

Key Points:

• Scope of Layoffs:
  Paul Thurrott reports that Microsoft's Xbox division is undergoing significant layoffs, with the process expected to extend beyond just the Xbox team into sales and other departments ([74:30], [75:05]).

• Possible Reasons:
  Speculation surrounds the layoffs, with Paul suggesting they might be related to changes in tax deductions (Section 174), forcing companies to reduce R&D write-offs by amortizing them over five years instead of immediate deductions. This financial shift could be prompting cost-cutting measures such as workforce reductions ([107:32]).

• Impact on Product Development:
  Despite layoffs, Microsoft continues to invest in new hardware and software initiatives, including the integration of AMD's next-gen silicon and the launch of new gaming handhelds like the Rog Ally ([95:23]).

Notable Quotes:

• Paul Thurrott: “So yeah, initially the Xbox layoffs were going to be announced last week, but they decided to delay them until after July 1st.” ([75:30])
• Richard Campbell: “Well, the thing about Microsoft owning the Xbox platform is that..." ([74:36])

7. Club Twit Membership Support

Overview:
Leo Laporte introduces "Club Twit," a membership-based support system designed to help sustain the Windows Weekly show amid changing advertising landscapes.

Key Points:

• Membership Benefits:
  Club Twit members receive ad-free access to all shows, exclusive content, and participation in special programming such as Q&A sessions and specialized segments like "Micah's Crafting Corner" and "Campdray’s Photography Session."

• Impact on Operations:
  Approximately 25% of Windows Weekly's operating costs are covered by Club Twit memberships, providing financial stability and preventing layoffs within the team.

• Encouragement to Join:
  Leo emphasizes the importance of community support, urging listeners to join Club Twit to ensure the show's continuity and expansion.

Notable Quotes:

• Leo Laporte: “Club Twit members are covering about 25% of our operating costs with membership.” ([160:29])
• Leo Laporte: “We love their lag-free video loading, their hyper-fast downloads, their friction-free site interactions.” ([00:33])

Conclusion

The episode of Windows Weekly 938 offers a comprehensive dive into the current state and future prospects of Windows 10 and its transition to Windows 11, the integration and challenges of local AI models, updates from the Windows Insider program, and significant organizational changes within Microsoft's Xbox division. Additionally, the introduction of Club Twit underscores the show's adaptive strategies in a shifting digital advertising landscape.

Final Thoughts:

The hosts provide candid insights into Microsoft's strategies, the practical implications for users and developers, and the broader technological trends shaping the industry. Their discussions are enriched with personal anecdotes, expert opinions, and forward-looking perspectives, making the episode a valuable resource for anyone invested in Windows and technology.

Notable Quotes:

• Paul Thurrott: “If you wanted to go to 11, they could.” ([08:37])
• Richard Campbell: “Just say, tell me how to turn on dark mode and be like, here's how you do it.” ([35:00])
• Paul Thurrott: “Listen, if somehow I could get paid for all of the updates and upgrades and whatever I do, I would be rich.” ([25:00])
• Leo Laporte: “It's a step. It's not the whole trip, but it's a kind of a step in that direction.” ([42:25])

Timestamps:

• [02:24] - Introduction to Extended Security Updates
• [04:03] - Free options for consumers
• [05:25] - Critique of Microsoft's ESU strategy
• [06:19] - Personal experience with Windows upgrade prompts
• [09:22] - Interest in local AI assistants
• [11:26] - Hardware advancements for AI
• [31:04] - New features in Windows Insider builds
• [34:25] - Concerns about small language models
• [65:29] - GitHub Copilot aiding developers
• [74:30] - Announcement of Xbox division layoffs
• [107:32] - Discussion on tax deductions impacting layoffs
• [160:29] - Introduction to Club Twit membership benefits

This summary provides a structured and detailed overview of the episode, highlighting the key discussions and insights shared by the hosts. For a deeper dive into specific segments, refer to the corresponding timestamps.