Podcast Summary — American Thought Leaders

Episode: “From Iran to Venezuela—How Trump Is Neutralizing Beijing’s Allies”
Guest: Gordon Chang (China Analyst, Author)
Host: Jan Jekielek (The Epoch Times Senior Editor)
Date: March 4, 2026

Episode Overview

This episode explores the ripple effects of recent US-Israel joint strikes that have eliminated dozens of Iranian leaders, shifting the global balance of power and impacting China’s network of strategic allies. China analyst Gordon Chang breaks down how President Trump’s indirect strategy of targeting Beijing’s proxies—especially in Iran and Venezuela—has put China on the back foot. The conversation ranges widely from global energy markets and regime change to Chinese subversion operations, highlighting the ideological and strategic contest between the US and the Chinese Communist Party (CCP).

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. US-Israel Strikes and China’s Influence ([00:00]–[01:46])

• Massive joint strikes have decapitated Iran’s leadership.
• China’s Response: China condemned US-Israel actions at the UN, calling them “brazen violations of sovereignty.”
• Chang’s Analysis: “China is not a superpower… It always criticizes the US but when the US is determined to do something, it cannot stop us. And that shows us the limits of Chinese power.” ([01:11]–[01:46])

2. The “Countryside Encirclement” Strategy: Trump vs. Xi ([01:46]–[02:59])

• Chang draws an analogy with Mao’s civil war strategy: Xi Jinping has treated US interests outside North America (e.g., Ukraine, Middle East) as the “countryside.”
• Trump flips this, targeting China’s “countryside” (Iran, Venezuela), weakening Beijing by isolating its partners.
• “Trump has just taken that same policy and applied it against China… Xi Jinping knows what Trump is doing, but he can't stop him.” ([02:10])

3. Energy as Leverage: Choking China’s Oil Supply ([03:09]–[04:57])

• US actions have restricted China’s access to key oil supplies, particularly from Venezuela (3-4% of China’s imports) and Iran (15-23%).
• Even if some oil flows continue, China must now pay market prices, ending bargains previously secured.
• “Chinese factories are now dependent on cheap oil… Well, they're not getting it anymore.” ([04:57])

4. Currency & Trade Setbacks for China ([06:58]–[07:23])

• Chang and Jan note that Venezuela and Iran were settled in RMB (Chinese currency), but both now face pressure to return to the US dollar.
• “Who wants a currency that is not a hard one? …Now they're going to have to start paying dollars again.” ([06:58])

5. China’s Arms Exports and Limitations ([07:23]–[09:13])

• Reports of Chinese cargo planes delivering radar to Iran.
• US countermeasures neutralized this equipment effortlessly: “Chinese export equipment isn’t very good… The stuff that the Chinese are selling to others just is not working against American countermeasures.” ([07:57])

6. The Debate on Regime Change ([09:13]–[13:04])

• Chang supports regime change in Iran for global security:
  “There won’t be peace in the Middle East… until we get rid of that regime.” ([09:24])
• He argues Americans tend to be reactive to threats, often acting only after suffering major losses (e.g., 9/11).
• “We're the Britain and France of this century. Until, of course, President Trump decided, no, we were not going to allow these threats to gather.” ([11:23])

7. CCP’s Unrestricted Warfare & Subversion Tactics ([13:21]–[22:03])

• The CCP wages “people’s war”—understood as “total war”—against the US using multiple vectors: propaganda, protests, biological threats, and more.
• Notable moment: Jan raises reports of China-fueled anti-war protests in the US, even before Iran strikes were made public.
• Chang references the Reedley, CA, illegal lab case as evidence of biowarfare potential ([18:17]–[19:45]).
• Chang:
  “You have millions… of Americans dying from a biological weapons attack launched from American soil?” ([18:17])

8. Weaponized Migration and Chinese “Birth Tourism” ([20:18])

• Discussion of the risks posed by “anchor babies”—US citizens raised in China who might return under Beijing's direction.
• “If they're a US citizen, they're basically untouchable.” ([20:44])

9. The “Mob” Analogy—Trump’s Message to Beijing ([21:13]–[22:31])

• Analyst Christopher Balding likens Trump’s removals of Iranian and Venezuelan leaders to mafia-style messaging (“putting a horse’s head in the bed”).
• Chang: “I wish the Communist Party were like the mob. Unfortunately, they're worse… their goal is the extermination of the American people.” ([22:03])

10. Chinese Strategic Malice & Organ Harvesting ([22:39]–[26:53])

• Chang references a Chinese general’s secret speech allegedly advocating the extermination of Americans.
• The reality of state-sanctioned organ harvesting as a symptom of regime evil.
• “Organ harvesting… is evil. And we have to start talking about it in those terms.” ([24:53])

11. The Ideological Confrontation: Defeating Communism, Not Coexisting ([27:20]–[29:20])

• Chang discusses the launch of a new CPAC center “to defeat communism.”
• “Communists think that they cannot coexist with us, and so we have to defeat it.” ([27:53])

12. Risks & Rewards of Regime Change in Iran ([29:20]–[31:57])

• Jan and Chang argue Iran is fundamentally different from Iraq/Afghanistan; its people overwhelmingly oppose the regime.
• Chang is optimistic: “Iran has a tradition. That tradition was interrupted for 47 years by the theocratic regime. But the Iranian people will get this right.” ([31:29])

13. China’s Global Distraction Strategy and US Responses ([31:57]–[34:27])

• China’s Belt & Road and partnerships aim to distract the US from the Pacific by keeping it bogged down elsewhere.
• Chang: “If you do something in one part of the world, it affects other parts.” US success in Iran would deter China’s ambitions elsewhere.

14. Continued Reduction of Chinese (and Russian) Global Influence ([35:11]–[37:19])

• Trump’s “reverse Kissinger” approach–systematically removing Chinese allies and infrastructure.
• "It's the Chinese retreating. China is not a superpower. We are learning that this year…" ([35:11])

15. The China-Russia “No Limits” Partnership ([37:19]–[39:13])

• Chang disputes the idea the US can split Russia and China while Putin remains.
• “The way you separate Russia and China is you defeat them.” ([37:34])

16. China’s Military Turmoil and the Taiwan Question ([39:13]–[42:10])

• Massive leadership purges have weakened the Chinese military’s capacity for action against Taiwan.
• "The military doesn't have a leadership now. That's only temporary… but at this moment… I don't think we have to worry about the Chinese military starting hostilities with deliberate aforethought." ([39:50])

17. Should Trump Visit Beijing? ([42:10]–[47:51])

• Chang argues Trump should cancel a planned China summit:
  • “He’s legitimizing the Chinese regime at a time when it is weak.”
  • Trump is “going soft” on China regarding weapons packages, tech restrictions, and trade, prioritizing optics over substance.
• He urges a “Reagan-like” approach: strong rhetoric matters to dissidents.

18. Closing Reflections ([47:51]–[48:30])

• Chang: “As Lenin said, there are decades when nothing happens, and then there are weeks when decades happen. Well, the weeks that we’re now in, decades are happening… we've got to support our president.” ([47:59])

Notable Quotes

• “China is not a superpower. …when the US is determined to do something, it cannot stop us. And that shows us the limits of Chinese power.” — Gordon Chang ([01:11])
• “Trump has just taken that same policy and applied it against China… Xi Jinping knows what Trump is doing, but he can’t stop him.” — Gordon Chang ([02:10])
• “There won’t be peace in the Middle East… until we get rid of that regime.” — Gordon Chang ([09:24])
• “We Americans don’t understand that we are in an existential struggle with the Communist Party… It has a doctrine of unrestricted warfare. It has been killing Americans. And we have doing our best to not know what’s going on.” — Gordon Chang ([13:21])
• “Their goal is the extermination of the American people and the extermination of the American form of governance.” — Gordon Chang ([22:03])
• “Organ harvesting… is evil. And we have to start talking about it in those terms.” — Gordon Chang ([24:53])
• “Communists think that they cannot coexist with us, and so we have to defeat it.” — Gordon Chang ([27:53])
• “It’s the Chinese retreating. China is not a superpower. We are learning that this year…” — Gordon Chang ([35:11])
• “The way you separate Russia and China is you defeat them.” — Gordon Chang ([37:34])
• “As Lenin said, there are decades when nothing happens, and then there are weeks when decades happen. Well, the weeks that we’re now in, decades are happening…” — Gordon Chang ([47:59])

Timestamps for Key Segments

• China’s response to Iran strikes: [00:51]–[01:46]
• Maoist encirclement analogy: [02:10]–[02:59]
• Energy leverage: [03:09]–[04:57]
• China’s arms limitations: [07:23]–[09:13]
• Supporting Iran regime change: [09:13]–[13:04]
• Biological/ideological subversion: [18:17]–[22:03]
• Organ harvesting and regime evil: [22:39]–[26:53]
• New CPAC center to defeat communism: [27:20]–[29:20]
• Regime change in Iran vs. Iraq/Afghanistan: [29:20]–[31:57]
• China’s global distraction play: [31:57]–[34:27]
• “Reverse Kissinger” and reduction of Chinese power: [35:11]–[37:19]
• China-Russia axis: [37:19]–[39:13]
• Military leadership and Taiwan: [39:13]–[42:10]
• Trump’s China summit dilemma: [42:10]–[47:51]
• Closing reflection on historical moment: [47:59]

Memorable Moments

• The “countryside encirclement” reversal: Trump applying Mao’s own playbook to isolate China.
• Stories of Chinese subversion: From bio-labs on US soil to astroturfed anti-war protests.
• Explicit, candid discussion of Chinese state intentions and moral frameworks (“extermination,” “evil”).
• The analogy of Trump “putting a horse’s head in the bed” to send a message to China.

This episode is an in-depth, lively exchange offering both policy analysis and ideological critique, illuminating the stakes of US-China confrontation and the new, indirect strategies being tested on the world stage. Whether concerned about energy security, regime change, or subversion from within, listeners will find a robust examination of America’s shifting approach to the CCP and its allies.