American Thought Leaders | The Epoch Times Episode: He Ran the World’s Biggest Payment Processor; Now He’s Taking on Social Security | Frank Bisignano Release Date: March 28, 2026

Episode Overview

This episode features an in-depth interview with Frank Bisignano, Commissioner and CEO of both the Social Security Administration (SSA) and the Internal Revenue Service (IRS). Host Jan Jekielek explores Bisignano’s sweeping reforms, operational philosophy, approach to fraud, and the future of Social Security. Drawing on Bisignano’s background running some of the world’s largest financial institutions, the discussion highlights the translation of private-sector efficiencies and technological advances into critical federal agencies that impact every American.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Tackling Fraud, Waste, and Abuse ([01:15]–[05:11])

• Initial Shocks & Changes

  • Bisignano describes confronting astounding figures: $1.7 trillion outlays at SSA and $5.6 trillion inflows at IRS.
  • He recounts discovering that SSA’s digital account system was deliberately down nearly 20% of the time due to outdated batch processing, limiting public access and contributing to inefficiency.
    • “It was down almost 20% of the time, by design, 29 hours a week ... In a couple weeks, really, with testing and everything, we changed that. And it was up ... every hour of the day.” (Frank Bisignano, [02:04])
  • Asserts that modern technology (store-and-forward, mirrored data) solved long-standing IT obstacles in weeks.

• Improving Data Accuracy

  • Bisignano stresses the importance of “pristine control environment” and claims the agency has saved tens of billions by correcting control-related issues.
  • On data discrepancies (e.g., claims about 12.4 million Social Security recipients aged 120+), Bisignano clarifies these were not living beneficiaries but inactive numbers enabling fraud.
    • “It wasn't that people who weren't alive any longer were getting paid Social Security. It was that there was a live Social Security number which could be used throughout the whole system.” (Frank Bisignano, [00:00]; [05:27])

• Organizational Restructuring

  • Introduced Chief Risk Management and Chief Cybersecurity roles reporting directly to him to prioritize data integrity and fraud prevention.
    • “I created two positions ahead of risk management and head of cyber and resiliency or security and resiliency that did not exist.” (Frank Bisignano, [06:13])

2. Protecting the Most Vulnerable: SSI Focus ([08:56]–[12:37])

• What is SSI?
  • The Supplemental Security Income (SSI) program provides payments to the most vulnerable Americans, requiring monthly eligibility validation—a labor- and resource-intensive task.
  • Previously, SSI was bureaucratically neglected. Bisignano assigned an executive to oversee and streamline the program, aiming to save money and improve service:
    • “What I decided to do was put somebody in charge of it ... have responsibility for SSI as opposed to have it completely diffused ... So we're streamlining it. We're using data feeds to help the decision making criteria ... It's equally as important [as other SSA programs].” (Frank Bisignano, [09:06])

3. Ensuring Benefits Only Go To Those Who Qualify ([12:37]–[14:17])

• Illegal Payments and File Reconciliation
  • Emphasizes ongoing efforts to ensure only eligible recipients (i.e., citizens with proof) are on SSA rolls.
    • “Ensuring that people are on file are citizens, valid citizens, that we have proof of ... We've made a large dent in it.” (Frank Bisignano, [12:48])

4. Bisignano’s Background and Private-Sector Mentality ([14:17]–[17:13])

• Experience
  • Traces career from American Express to CEO roles in massive payment firms and Citigroup during 9/11.
  • Operational focus, technological savvy, and focus on accurate, efficient service are central themes.
    • “I've always run on a platform of we're going to serve clients where they want to be served, right?” (Frank Bisignano, [18:04])

5. Digitization: Pros, Cons, and Execution ([17:13]–[20:44])

• Push for Digital Transformation

  • Details expansion of omnichannel service, highlighting 100+ million digital SSA users, voluntary adoption, and launch of a mobile app.
    • “I love saying we haven't shut a field office ... Omnichannel presence matters a lot ... we have more than 100 million digital users.” (Frank Bisignano, [18:04])

• Security Measures

  • Reaffirms commitment to cybersecurity, with elevated roles reporting to him and constant oversight.
    • “Job one for everybody is to protect the information. That's job one.” (Frank Bisignano, [21:44])

6. Public-Private Tensions & Employee Morale ([20:44]–[26:16])

• Navigating Institutional vs. Public Loyalties
  • Balances federal institutional duties with accountability to citizens; believes both goals are compatible through client-centered efficiency.
  • Boosted SSA staff morale by encouraging overtime volunteering during holidays—66% staff participation.
    • “We went from ... the lowest morale, to people who want to come in ... and serve the American public on days they could have stayed home.” (Frank Bisignano, [24:13])

7. Trump Accounts: New Savings Initiatives for Children ([26:16]–[28:12])

• What are Trump Accounts?
  • Savings accounts for children; ~$1,000 automatically deposited for each newborn, with parents and others able to contribute until age 18.
  • Over three million opened; initiative still being publicized and expanded.
    • “We’re about to pierce a million babies born that are going to get the thousand dollars ... We have over 3 million trump accounts opened ... I think it's fabulous.” (Frank Bisignano, [26:28])

8. Recent Tax Changes and IRS Operations ([28:12]–[32:27])

• Increased Tax Refunds

  • Due to O triple B legislation, average tax benefit is now over $780 per household, benefiting 45% of returns filed.
    • “The average tax benefit is up over $780 ... that's real money ... 45% ... getting some benefit other than the fact we kept permanent what was going to go away.” (Frank Bisignano, [30:00], [30:53])

• Digitization at IRS

  • New online tools reduce the need for phone support, improve service speed, and enable better compliance.
    • “We're getting less phone calls this year than last year because people have online capabilities that we built in the past.” (Frank Bisignano, [31:49])

9. Neutralizing Political Influence & Use of Technology ([32:27]–[35:44])

• Ensuring IRS Impartiality

  • Technologies and clear audit trails are key to eliminating human bias, favoritism, or targeting—especially for nonprofits.
    • “Technology can cover a lot of ground and present the cases appropriately ... you're going to get solid decision making and ... better information.” (Frank Bisignano, [34:39])

• AI and Automation

  • Sees technology (including AI) as an enabler, not a threat. Technology can bolster compliance and workforce effectiveness.
    • “Let's just talk about technology as a great enabler ... it'll make our workforce better.” (Frank Bisignano, [35:06])

10. The Reality of Social Security’s Financial Future ([35:44]–[39:08])

• Insolvency Timeline

  • Clarifies that, per latest actuarial report, payments would be reduced to 83% (not zero) in about seven years if nothing changes.
    • “In seven years if nothing is done, people get paid out at 83%, not 100%. ... There is no vision of zero occurring here.” (Frank Bisignano, [36:14])
  • Main task is ensuring accuracy and efficiency while lawmakers debate structure.

• Billions Saved through Accuracy

  • Emphasizes billions saved through rooting out improper payments and boosting payment accuracy.
    • “When people would say it's ... 99% accurate ... it's supposed to be 99.99999. That's the place I came from ... Billions come out of that.” (Frank Bisignano, [38:14])

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “It wasn't that people who weren't alive any longer were getting paid Social Security. It was that there was a live Social Security number which could be used throughout the whole system.” — Frank Bisignano ([00:00])
• “Job one for everybody is to protect the information. That's job one.” — Frank Bisignano ([21:44])
• “66% of our people volunteered to come in [on holidays] … We went from … the lowest morale, to people who want to come in … and serve the American public.” — Frank Bisignano ([24:13])
• “Let's just talk about technology as a great enabler and it'll make our workforce better.” — Frank Bisignano ([35:06])
• “In seven years if nothing is done, people get paid out at 83%, not 100% ... There is no vision of zero occurring here.” — Frank Bisignano ([36:14])

Timestamped Highlights

• [00:00] Social Security number misuse clarified
• [02:04] Digital transformation at SSA; solving legacy system issues
• [05:27] Data reconciliation on Social Security rolls
• [09:06] SSI explained, operational overhaul
• [12:48] File cleanup targets ineligible beneficiaries
• [14:41] Bisignano’s career and operational approach
• [18:04] Omnichannel service, digital users surpassing 100 million
• [21:44] Dual responsibility: serving both public and government with focus on data security
• [24:13] Morale turnaround at SSA through volunteer overtime
• [26:28] Trump accounts for children explained
• [30:00] IRS refund benefits quantified
• [34:39] Using technology to reduce bias and human error at IRS
• [36:14] Social Security solvency reality check
• [38:14] Billions saved via focus on accuracy

Final Takeaways

Frank Bisignano brings a relentless emphasis on operational efficiency and accuracy—rooted in his private-sector background—to overhaul the SSA and IRS. He champions digital transformation, robust cyber protections, and an ethos of serving Americans “where they want to be served,” all the while explicitly addressing concerns of fraud, fairness, and technological risk. While Social Security faces daunting actuarial projections, Bisignano remains optimistic—pointing to technological progress, significant cost savings, and a renewed focus on data integrity as evidence that these public institutions can evolve and thrive.

For more insights, visit the official SSA and IRS websites for digital account registration and the latest policy updates discussed in this episode.