New Forensic Details From the Idaho Student Murders - Part 2

Summary

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America's Crime Lab: "The Idaho Student Murders: DNA in Real Time Part 2"

Podcast: America's Crime Lab
Episode Date: September 17, 2025
Main Focus: The complex investigation into the 2022 University of Idaho student murders, highlighting the trauma of surviving roommates, the painstaking collection and analysis of forensic evidence, and the real-time application of advanced DNA technology in an active case.

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Episode Overview

This episode continues the in-depth examination of the shocking murders of four college students in Moscow, Idaho. The hosts and guests recount the survivors' experience, the harrowing discovery of the crime, the crucial but initially unhelpful DNA evidence, the onslaught of misinformation and public speculation, and a behind-the-scenes look at how forensic genetic genealogy—typically used in cold cases—was deployed in real time to catch a killer.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Survivors’ Trauma and the Discovery of the Crime

• Bethany, one of the surviving roommates, describes the terror and confusion upon discovering something was terribly wrong that morning.

  • “I was so frantic that morning and scared to death not knowing what had happened. And when I made the 911 call I couldn't even get out the words.” (Bethany, 02:51, 16:26)

• The initial call to 911 reported an “unresponsive roommate,” not a murder—reflecting the total confusion of the moment (05:12).

• Inside the house:

  • Police expected a party-related emergency but encountered a gruesome crime scene (05:43–06:54).
  • The bodycam footage, recently released, is described as “absolutely heartbreaking” and exposes the chaos and distress of the first responders (04:31).

2. Reconstructing the Night: Timeline and Events

• Surviving roommates’ recollections:

  • Bethany and Dylan were up watching TV when the murdered roommates returned home from a bar, hung out, and ate (09:02).
  • Both survivors heard unexplained noises late at night but, in a noisy, crowded college house, dismissed the disturbances (10:09).
  • Dylan later hears someone say, “someone’s here,” and sees a man in a ski mask with bushy eyebrows—she freezes in terror as he passes her (11:18–13:10).
    • “She sees a man dressed in all black with a black ski mask covering his face. All she can see is just the eyes and nose area with what she describes as kind of bushy eyebrows.” (Ashley Jennings, 13:03)
  • The two believe, at first, that everything must be a prank or misunderstanding, not a massacre (13:39–16:16).

• Key Quote:

  • “I thought that we were going to wake up and go upstairs, see them and tell them how they had scared us and that they were going to tease us about how we are constantly scaredy cats.” (Bethany, 15:57)

3. The Evidence: DNA and More

• Crucial Evidence:
  • A leather knife sheath found next to the victims contained DNA, but no matches were found in CODIS—a national database (19:38–19:47).
    • “We know that the Idaho State crime lab is able to pull DNA off of that knife sheath and very quickly develop a DNA profile. And it’s done in just a matter of days. But when they upload the DNA profile to CODIS, there are no hits.” (Host/Narrator, 19:47)
  • Surveillance video of a white Hyundai Elantra moving suspiciously in the area becomes another critical lead (21:24–21:54).

4. Media Frenzy, Online Speculation, and the Impact on Survivors

• Misinformation and Harassment:
  • Innocent bystanders, including a “guy in a white hoodie,” are falsely accused online (25:26).
  • Surviving roommates and other students are inundated with suspicion, harassment, and invasive speculation (26:05; 40:17–40:43).
    • “At the same time, I was getting flooded with death threats and hateful messages from people who did not know me at all or know the dynamic of our friendship. ... The media harassed not just me, but also my family.” (Bethany, 40:43)
  • Families are further traumatized by aggressive media requests for private information, such as autopsies and academic records (41:18–42:02).

5. Forensic Genetic Genealogy: A New Tool in Real Time

• Turning Point for the Case:
  • With no leads, Idaho State Police suggest sending the knife sheath DNA for forensic genetic genealogy (28:28–28:42).
  • Othram, a specialized lab, is contacted for help—something they typically do for cold cases, not ongoing investigations (29:12, 29:48).
    • “We weren't having any luck up to that point. ... Send the DNA sequencing out and see if we can't find some distant relative match that we could then start tracing down that family tree.” (David Mittleman, Othram, 28:42)
  • Chain of custody is paramount: Police captain personally escorts the evidence from Idaho to Texas, ensuring its security (31:21–32:21).
    • “I left Boise around 6 o’clock that morning, flew straight to Houston with the DNA sample with me. Then I was extremely nervous that I was going to screw the whole thing up.” (David Mittleman, 31:59)
  • Othram’s team works through Thanksgiving, running DNA profiles and keeping all details under strict confidentiality (37:24).

6. Breakthroughs through DNA Analysis

• Preliminary Results:
  • The DNA indicates a male of primarily European and specifically Italian biogeographical ancestry, eventually pointing to a multigenerational American family from Pennsylvania (38:20–38:42).
    • “We learn the person we're looking for has a largely European background and also has this unique biogeographical ancestry tied to Italy. And this eventually leads us to a multi-generational American family in Pennsylvania.” (Emily Maitlis, 38:21)
  • Investigators match the clue of the missing front license plate (legal in Pennsylvania) with the Hyundai Elantra, narrowing the search to only a handful of vehicles (39:05–39:14; 43:35).
    • “They were able to narrow their search of white Hyundai Elantras with Pennsylvania plates. And believe it or not, there were only a couple cars that had Pennsylvania plates that actually matched the description of the car seen at the crime scene.” (Kristen Mittleman, 43:35)

7. Personal Cost and Ongoing Struggles

• Family Grief:
  • Heartfelt accounts from Ethan Chapin’s family, describing empty seats at Thanksgiving and their struggle to grieve amid public scrutiny (36:21–37:10).
    • “You sit down at a place that you spend a lot of time with as a family and you sit at ... that table and you have an empty chair. ... We're a four person family now, but it's tough.” (David Mittleman & Kristen Mittleman, 36:47–37:10)
• Ethical Questions:
  • Both hosts and participants reflect on the toll that true crime attention and social media speculation take on real victims and families (42:10–42:27).

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “She hears someone crying. And then she hears a man's voice that she doesn't recognize, say, ‘you're gonna be okay. I'm going to help you.’ ... She says, the guy's voice, he didn't say that in, like, a nice way. It's more in—she says, a weird tone, spooky.”
  (Host/Narrator & Ashley Jennings, 12:05)
• “It's like the truth is there, but they have to essentially crack the code.”
  (Bethany, 28:23)
• “Every day since November 13, 2022, every single day, there has been something. ... I don't want to call it a battle, just something that you are fighting.”
  (Host/Narrator, 42:27)
• “There are four kids that are dead and a perpetrator out there. And this is what we do. So why would we ever turn this case away if the evidence is suitable?”
  (Kristen Mittleman, Othram, 30:31)
• “We're not just here to tell you what's happening, but why.”
  (Host/Narrator, recurring motif)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Survivor’s Account & Initial Discovery: 02:51–16:26
• Bodycam and First Responder Reactions: 04:31–07:01
• Timeline of Night’s Events: 09:02–16:16
• Evidence Overview & DNA Limbo: 19:38–21:12
• Hyundai Elantra Lead: 21:24–23:08
• Public Harassment & Media Ethics: 25:26–27:49, 40:17–42:10
• Introduction of Forensic Genetic Genealogy: 28:28–31:02
• Chain of Custody & Lab Story: 31:21–32:21, 35:08–37:24
• Breakthrough in DNA Analysis: 38:02–39:14, 43:35
• Family Impact & Ethical Reflections: 36:21–37:10, 41:18–42:27

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Episode Structure

• [02:51] Survivor testimony and emotional aftermath.
• [09:02] Reconstruction of events leading up to the crime.
• [19:38] Review of major evidence and DNA dead ends.
• [21:24] Identification and pursuit of the suspicious vehicle.
• [25:26] Social media blitz, misinformation, and the hunt for suspects.
• [28:28] Introduction and adoption of advanced DNA technology.
• [31:21] Chain of custody concerns and the journey to Othram.
• [37:24] Othram’s 24/7 lab efforts and breakthroughs.
• [40:17] The toll on survivors, victims’ families, and media scrutiny.
• [43:35] DNA breakthrough zeroes in on suspect’s location and car.

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Tone & Style

The episode is factual, emotionally grounded, and driven by personal testimony, while also giving listeners a gripping, step-by-step look at how investigators utilize state-of-the-art science under immense pressure. The hosts maintain empathy and ask critical questions about privacy, trauma, and the role of the public in high-profile criminal cases.

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Next Episode Tease:
A hint at the killer’s subsequent attempts to evade capture and the final forensic steps to unmask the suspect, promising a deeper dive into the intersection of law enforcement, science, and justice.

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Transcript

[Host/Narrator]

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[Emily Maitlis]

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[Host/Narrator]

To tell you what's happening, but why?

[Emily Maitlis]

From me, Emily Maitlis and me, John Sopel with Global's award winning podcast the News Agents Dropping daily covering everything you need to know about politics and current affairs and The News Agents USA listening to the News Agents on America's number.

[Host/Narrator]

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[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

I was so frantic that morning and scared death not knowing what had happened. And when I made the 911 call I couldn't even get out the words. And from Then on, I don't remember a thing. It was like my brain wiped that whole memory. That was the worst day of my life. And I know it always will be. The murders of four college students in Moscow, Idaho, shocked the community and set off a desperate manhunt for the killer. It was a brutal crime, and investigators found surprisingly little evidence at the scene. Authorities didn't know who they were searching for or why the lives of the two surviving roommates had been spared. But there was one big clue left behind. Police found a key piece of evidence with the killer's DNA, but it wasn't leading them to a suspect. Meanwhile, it seemed like whoever did this was trying to stay one step ahead of investigators. This is America's crime Lab. I'm Aylin Lance Lesser. This is part two of the Idaho student murder case. If you missed part one, please go back and listen. I'm here with producer Catherine Fenollosa. And listening to the words of Bethany, one of the surviving roommates, just now. You can feel the pain.

[Host/Narrator]

Yeah, you really can. And police recently released body cam footage of the first responding officer. I watched it a few days ago, and, Aylin, I'm not even sure how to describe it. It's just absolutely heartbreaking. And honestly, it's painful to watch, but. But I think it also helped me understand the complete confusion of that day. I mean, it's easy for someone to hear about the murders on the news or read about them and walk away with completely wrong assumptions.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

Yeah, I can imagine that day. You just feel like, is this even real? And they're just college kids. They don't know what's going on.

[Host/Narrator]

When the surviving roommates, Bethany and Dylan and their friends call 911, I mean, they're calling to say that one of their roommates is unresponsive, and they're talking about Zanna.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

Right.

[Host/Narrator]

And so when the officer is responding to this call, that's really what he thinks he's going for. You know, maybe, like, college students have partied too much. I don't know, maybe someone needs to be taken to the hospital to, like, get their stomach pumped. You know what I mean?

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

Mm. Yeah.

[Host/Narrator]

So he's driving there, and he's listening to country music. He pulls up to the house by himself, and he sees this circle of friends standing outside in the cold. It's November 13, 2022. There are little patches of snow around. Dylan, the roommate, is standing barefoot. She's got. It looks like either pajama pants or sweatpants on and a T shirt and some of the friends standing there are in shorts. The officer pulls up and he is like, what's going on? Where's the unresponsive person? They say inside. So he goes inside and he climbs to the second floor where the kitchen and living room are and two bedrooms. And as he gets to the top of the stairs, he sees Zanna lying on the floor of her bedroom. Ethan's in the bed. And it's clear by the amount of blood that's around both of them that there's been a horrible crime.

[Emily Maitlis]

Oh man.

[Host/Narrator]

You can hear the officer, like his breathing starts to become kind of choppy. You can almost like feel his, his heartbeat like just thumping. Another officer arrives and he's climbing the stairs to the second floor and they're speaking to each other almost in half sentences. You know, the first officer is basically like, dude, slow down, we've got something. I think two fatalities now. Officers start coming in and it's pretty quiet. They go through the home with their weapons drawn and their essentially trying to make sure no one else is there. They climb the stairs to the third floor where Maddie and Kaylee's rooms are. And the first officer who arrived at the scene, as he gets to the top of the stairs, he's speechless. I mean it's like you can feel the horror of what he's seeing. The first officer goes back outside to interview Dylan, the roommate. And she's trying to recount what happened last night. You'll remember that Dylan and Bethany are 19, they're the youngest of this group and they're self proclaimed scaredy cats. Like they're known to get freaked out over small things. But this time it's real and they're just completely disoriented. And Dylan says, you know, I'm not really sure what's real and maybe what was a dream.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

Yeah, I can see how she's just terrified and in total shock.

[Host/Narrator]

But this is where we get some key new information about what actually happened that night. And it's really some of our first clues as to who murdered these four students. So Dylan tells the officer she and Bethany were up watching Vampire Diaries when Maddie and Kaylee came home from the bar. You know, they were at the corner club and they all hang out, they eat some Mac and cheese, take some selfies. And then Maddie and Bethany take Kaylee's dog Murphy out back to pee before bed. Bethany comes back in and she goes down to her room. Her bedroom's on the first floor. And then at some point Maddie asks Bethany if she brought Murphy in because she can't find the dog. Bethany's like, no, I don't have him. And she goes to bed. Dylan also goes to bedrooms on the second floor. And at some point, both Dylan and Bethany hear a loud noise. But Ashley Jennings, who's a senior deputy in the Lato County Prosecutor's office, says this also wasn't unusual.

[Ashley Jennings (Senior Deputy Prosecutor)]

This is a house. The walls are pretty thin. There's a lot of noise. There's, you know, five, six people in the house, if not more at any time, arriving at different hours. Always a lot of noise. And it's in a pretty nois the area of town now.

[Host/Narrator]

It kind of sounds like maybe Kaylee and Mattie have gone up to their bedrooms on the third floor, and they're dancing or they're playing with their dog.

[Ashley Jennings (Senior Deputy Prosecutor)]

Dylan falls back asleep, but she was woken by something. I don't know that she's able to fully articulate what the noise was. She hears a voice, but she believes she hears someone say, someone's here.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

Oh, my God.

[Ashley Jennings (Senior Deputy Prosecutor)]

She calls out, asking, you know, Kaylee, Maddie, something. Doesn't hear anything.

[Host/Narrator]

And she looks out in the hallway and she doesn't see anyone.

[Ashley Jennings (Senior Deputy Prosecutor)]

So she immediately goes back behind her bedroom door, locks it, continues to kind of stand there and listen, and at some point hears a noise like someone coming down the stairway, which is right outside her bedroom.

[Host/Narrator]

Now, the roommates, they all wear Doc Martens, you know, those, like, heavy soled shoes. And so she's not sure who it is, but she thinks it's one of her roommates running down the stairs in Doc Martens. Then she hears Murphy, Kaylee's dog, barking, which is a little weird because he's not typically a barker.

[Ashley Jennings (Senior Deputy Prosecutor)]

So Dylan, of course, thinks this is just like all the other times that, you know, she's heard something and kind of, you know, freaks herself out. And so she's just standing there and listening, tries to figure out what's going on. At some point, she hears some movement on the stairway right outside her door. Loud movement. She hears some more voices.

[Host/Narrator]

She hears someone crying. And then she hears a man's voice that she doesn't recognize, say, you're gonna be okay. I'm going to help you. And she thinks maybe the crying is coming from the bathroom in the hallway, but she's not quite sure. Dylan says, the guy's voice, he didn't say that in, like, a nice way. It's more in. She says, a weird tone, spooky. So now she's really kind of freaked out. Yeah. And she starts calling all of her roommates. She's calling Kaylee. She's calling Maddie, Zanna. No one's answering. She opens her door again. She sees a man dressed in all black with a black ski mask covering his face.

[Ashley Jennings (Senior Deputy Prosecutor)]

All she can see is just the eyes and nose area with what she describes as kind of bushy eyebrows.

[Host/Narrator]

And he walks right past her, and she freezes. And he looks at her. She thinks he's maybe like 5, 10, 6ft tall. And she describes him built like a basketball player. Like, he's athletic, but skinny.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

What a terrifying moment. I mean, this is out of an actual horror movie. I would wonder if I was having a dream or something.

[Host/Narrator]

And the other thing I should say that's running through her mind is that maybe this is a prank.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

Yeah, I mean, if you're living near the frats, that would probably make a lot more sense.

[Ashley Jennings (Senior Deputy Prosecutor)]

And the person walks past her bedroom and exits out that back slider kitchen area, which is right outside her bedroom.

[Host/Narrator]

She ducks back in her room, locks the door. She calls Bethany, her roommate, who answers the phone.

[Ashley Jennings (Senior Deputy Prosecutor)]

They're kind of discussing, like, did you hear that? What do you think's going on? We live in Moscow. We live in a safe community. Their mind does not go to something as tragic as what occurred.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

Yeah, also because I feel like the media has picked up on this idea that quite often it's someone you know or it's someone close to you. If you see someone walking through this guy in a ski mask, I mean, definitely I would be scared. But also, I wouldn't necessarily jump to, he's murdered a bunch of people in my house and he's leaving.

[Ashley Jennings (Senior Deputy Prosecutor)]

But as had occurred in the past, you know, they kind of talk to each other. They calm each other down, and then they go, okay, well, let's be together.

[Host/Narrator]

Bethany says, well, look, come down to my room. You know, it's better than being. Being up there alone. So Dylan runs out of her room, and as she leaves her room, she can see Zanna lying on the floor. Now, you know, they had all been partying that night. She's thinking maybe Zanna just, like, passed out on the floor. She's sort of, like, sleeping off the night.

[Ashley Jennings (Senior Deputy Prosecutor)]

Yeah, your mind, thankfully, wouldn't go there to the worst case scenario. So their mind didn't.

[Host/Narrator]

Aylin, I'm gonna play you a statement from Bethany at the killer sentencing hearing. She was too emotional to read it, so one of her friends did. She explains what she was thinking the morning after the murders.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

I thought that we were going to wake up and go upstairs, see them and tell them how they had scared us and that they were going to tease us about how we are constantly scaredy cats. I make jokes about it as we would go to Taco Bell like always.

[Host/Narrator]

But that's not what happened. The next morning, Bethany and Dylan realized maybe it wasn't a prank. Maybe something is very, very wrong.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

I was so frantic that morning and scared death not knowing what had happened. And when I made the 911 call I couldn't even get out the words. And from then on I don't remember a thing. It was like my brain wiped that whole memory. That was the worst day of my life and I know it always will be.

[Emily Maitlis]

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[Emily Maitlis]

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[Host/Narrator]

We're not just here to tell you what's happening, but why?

[Emily Maitlis]

From me, Emily Maitlis and me, John Sopel with Global's award winning podcast, the News Agents dropping daily, covering everything you.

[Host/Narrator]

Need to know about politics and current affairs.

[Emily Maitlis]

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[Host/Narrator]

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[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

Where are we on evidence? I mean, I know the crucial piece of evidence is the leather knife sheath which was found in the bed next to Maddie and Kaylee.

[Host/Narrator]

So we know that the Idaho State crime lab is able to pull DNA off of that knife sheath and very quickly develop a DNA profile. And it's done in just a matter of days. But when they upload the DNA profile to codis, there are no hits. But it did reveal some important clues. So they know that the DNA belongs to just one person and it's a man. And Aylin, I can't express how chaotic and fast moving this case was right from the start. Moscow police immediately start getting flooded with tips. The FBI is brought in to help and they actually set up a command post in the police parking lot. David Mittleman from Othram says this is all unfolding in the days leading up to Thanksgiving in 2022.

[Emily Maitlis]

And there's just this tremendous pressure from the urgency that, you know, a bunch of kids were going home and potentially coming back to an unsafe environment. They were struggling to identify a direction, a person of interest. A very scary situation.

[Host/Narrator]

There's also the problem that since the campus is emptying out as students head home for the holiday, this includes people who might have key knowledge of the murders and it might also include the actual killer. You know, I mean, with the excuse of leaving town to go somewhere else across the country for Thanksgiving.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

Do they have any other evidence at this point?

[Host/Narrator]

They do. Prosecutor Bill Thompson says police canvassed the neighborhood and they find surveillance video from surrounding houses and apartment buildings.

[Emily Maitlis]

That footage showed a white sedan coming and going several times earlier that early morning. The camera also showed that sedan that was identified as a Hyundai Elantra leaving the area at a high rate of speed around 4:20 or so that morning on November 13th of 2022.

[Host/Narrator]

And Moscow Police Captain Roger Linear says they start to focus in on that white Hyundai Elantra and he makes a plea to the public for help.

[Emily Maitlis]

We are confident that the occupant or occupants of that vehicle have information that's critical to this investigation. Hey, maybe your neighbor has one in the garage that they don't drive very often. Let us know. So far we have a list of approximately 22,000 registered white Hyundai Elantras that fit into our criteria that we're sorting through. That's an awful lot of information so the public can help us with that.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

Okay, this is a college neighborhood. So how do we know it doesn't belong to a neighbor or even like a car share driver?

[Host/Narrator]

Well, it's driving up and down King road starting around 3:30 that morning. And it's odd. I mean it never stops to pick anyone up or drop someone off. At one point it drives past the apartment building next door, turns around and goes back by the King Road house. Then it almost looks like it's looking for parking. But then it turns around again, drives back by the house, it makes a three point turn. It's just its movements are really strange. And then it passes by the house for a few. Fourth time at 4:04 in the morning.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

That's sketchy.

[Host/Narrator]

While police are trying to hunt down that Hyundai Elantra, prosecutor Ashley Jennings says they also learned that before Zanna was attacked, she had ordered food from Jack in the Box and it was delivered around 4am Investigators.

[Ashley Jennings (Senior Deputy Prosecutor)]

Have a theory that she was up during the same time. And it's possible while he was in the residence they made contact at some point, which is what ultimately led to him pursuing Zanna into her bedroom.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

You mentioned that Zanna had defensive wounds on her hands. So it would make sense if maybe she heard something on the third floor and went to investigate it or something.

[Host/Narrator]

Yeah, and the killer could have chased her down to her bedroom where he attacks her and her boyfriend Ethan, who was sleeping. Police also find that at 4:17 a security camera on a neighbor's house records some voices and a loud thud and then the sound of a dog barking. The surveillance footage shows that that white Hyundai Elantra, which had been going up and down the street, now is speeding away from the King Road house for the last time at 4:20. Oh wow.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

So assuming that these murders happened somewhere in that window. Again, we don't know for sure if the car is related to what happened, but Zanna had just eaten, so she was probably awake.

[Host/Narrator]

They think it's anywhere between 4:04 and 4:20.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

That's just 16 minutes.

[Host/Narrator]

There's another piece of video that police find. So remember, Kaylee and Maddie had gone to a local bar that night called the Corner Club. And after they leave the bar, they're hungry. So they go find food, and pretty much the only place that's open is a food truck called the grub truck. Now, the food truck has a live stream, you know, video of people standing in line waiting to order or pick up their food. And on this video, you can see Kaylee and Maddie just hours before they were killed. You can also see a guy in a white hoodie, and he's standing a few feet behind the girls, sort of looking at them. And as they get their food and leave, he trails off out of the view of the video camera. Now, I mean, you can see how this could seem suspicious given what happens a few hours later. And pretty quickly, random strangers are convinced that he is the killer. They publish his name and address online. But it turns out this guy had absolutely nothing to do with it. I mean, he's just some random college student who's also looking for a late night snack.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

You can see how an innocent person gets swept up in misinformation that is so dangerous.

[Host/Narrator]

And literally, like, people are trying to investigate this case on their own. So there's YouTubers pretending to be students to get on campus. People are driving by the King Road house and, like, videoing and speculating on the spot where they think the killer entered the home.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

Oh, wow.

[Host/Narrator]

They're fake Instagram accounts that pop up.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

Oh, my gosh.

[Host/Narrator]

And they start targeting other students on campus, saying, watch out. Like, you're next.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

Oh, my God, that's scary. And I feel like because we're so connected with cameras and social media and everything, it's like it's both a gift and a curse. We get all this good information, we can fill out what happened that night and information about the crime. But then also, people's lives could be ruined if their names are dragged through the mud and they have nothing to do with it. It's like, at least can we respect some privacy of the victims? God, that pisses me off.

[Host/Narrator]

Yeah, and also think about all of those people. Like, you know, the guy at the grub truck, ex boyfriends. I mean, everyone who's put under the microscope and sort of considered possible suspects, right or wrong. But that's also what's so interesting about this new DNA technology. I mean, if it can locate whoever actually did this faster. You're potentially saving so many people from being put under that microscope. Unfairly.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

So now police have some clues. We know they're looking for a man, someone around 6ft tall, skinny, with bushy eyebrows. The guy in the ski mask. And we know that there was this white Hyundai Elantra that was driving in the area right around the time of the murders.

[Host/Narrator]

And police are pretty confident that the leather knife sheath belongs to the killer. But so far that DNA evidence is a total dead end. But they also know that DNA is their best chance to find out who did this. So it's incredibly frustrating.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

It's like the truth is there, but they have to essentially crack the code.

[Host/Narrator]

And then just days before the Thanksgiving holiday, the Idaho State Police forensic services suggests that they try forensic genetic genealogy, maybe that would identify the male suspect from his DNA on the knife sheath.

[David Mittleman (Othram)]

We weren't having any luck up to that point. On that Sunday night is when we first got the thought process of, of send the DNA sequencing out and see if we can't find some distant relative match that we could then start tracing down that family tree and see if we can't find somebody attached more closely to that DNA at that point in time.

[Host/Narrator]

Moscow police Captain Dustin Blaker was familiar with the basic idea of genetic genealogy. He and his wife had recently done their own family tree. And he knew that the state crime lab worked with Othram using forensic genetic genealogy to help solve cold cases.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

Yeah, but on an active homicide investigation, that seems like a whole different thing.

[David Mittleman (Othram)]

For myself, some of the other investigators, that was all kind of new to us. I think we were kind of like, okay, legally, how is this supposed to work and how is all this going to play out in court?

[Host/Narrator]

Meanwhile, Kristen Mittleman of Othram says she and her husband David are at home watching the news.

[Kristen Mittleman (Othram)]

The case was discussed on the news and David and I got a phone call and they asked if we were willing to work a high profile case in real time. David said, let me think about it and let me call you back. And so he got off the phone and I said, why wouldn't we work this case?

[Host/Narrator]

David is nervous. I mean, these murders are being splashed all over the news. Othram has been working on cold cases, but this would be one of the highest profile cases yet.

[Kristen Mittleman (Othram)]

And I said, it doesn't really matter, right? There are four kids that are dead and a perpetrator out there. And this is what we do. So why would we ever turn this case away if the evidence is suitable? And our daughter was a sophomore. She just started her sophomore year in college when this happened. And so she was literally the age of those children. We knew immediately how terrifying this must have been. And I think that's when we really knew that we had to identify this guy.

[Host/Narrator]

Now, the Moscow police have never done this before. And Captain Blaker is also nervous. I mean, he knows how important this case is to his community. So his colleague at the state police says, look, why don't you go visit Othram's lab for yourself and then decide if you want to give them the evidence.

[David Mittleman (Othram)]

He strongly suggested that we should take the sample ourself to Houston to the lab and make sure that we are comfortable with the way the lab was set up. We felt that it needed to meet as far as normal standard testing in law enforcement. So the chain of custody is all there. It's going to be protected, it's going to be locked up, they're going to document the genome sequencing and everything like that. So my agency, along with the prosecutors, we talked about it, we decided that yes, this was worth it.

[Host/Narrator]

And before Captain Blaker knew it, he was on a plane from Idaho to Texas.

[David Mittleman (Othram)]

I left Boise around 6 o' clock that morning, flew straight to Houston with the DNA sample with me. Then I was extremely nervous that I was going to screw the whole thing up.

[Emily Maitlis]

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[Emily Maitlis]

Looking for entertainment everyone will love TiVo plus has you covered with over 300 free channels from movies for family night to kids shows, live news, sports and your favorite TV series all in one place. No signups, no credit card required, just turn on and enjoy. And with new channels and fresh content added all the time, there's always something to watch. TiVo plus free, binge worthy and always on. Check us [e-mail] take a deep dive into the stories making the news headlines across the world. The News Agents.

[Host/Narrator]

We're not just here to tell you what's happening, but why?

[Emily Maitlis]

From me, Emily Maitlis and me, John Sopel with Global's award winning podcast the News Agents Dropping daily, covering everything you.

[Host/Narrator]

Need to know about politics and current affairs.

[Emily Maitlis]

And The News Agents USA listening to the News Agents on America's number one podcast network, iHeart.

[Host/Narrator]

Open your free iHeart app and search the news agents to start listening just before Thanksgiving. Captain Blaker with the Moscow Police Department is on his way to Othram with the key piece of DNA evidence.

[David Mittleman (Othram)]

I just carried it in just a very basic backpack with me so I could keep track of where it was at all times. I'm nervous in the process of don't lose this, don't let this out of my sight and then trying to make sure that I keep it intact. So I want to make sure it's very protected. I mean, we were kind of banking on this. We knew that that sheath was very vital to this case and anything that we got off of it, we all felt had to be our suspect.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

I've always been curious how a really high profile case like this unfolds. I mean, everything is riding on the DNA evidence he's carrying and they can't do anything to tip off the killer because what if he's still in the community?

[Host/Narrator]

The whole thing is wrapped in secrecy. David and Kristen can't tell anyone they're involved. I mean, they can't even tell the lab technicians what case this is. And they're even in the dark on the timing.

[Kristen Mittleman (Othram)]

We didn't know when they would be arriving at the lab, so we were taking our holiday card photos. We had all five kids with us. We were all color coordinated. So when we got the call that they had landed in Houston and were about to arrive at the lab, I told a photographer, we have to go.

[Host/Narrator]

Meanwhile, Ethan Chapin, the young man killed in the King Road house, his family is trying to figure out how to get through the holiday. Ethan was a triplet and his siblings, Maisie and Hunter left campus immediately after the Murders his mom, Stacey and his dad Jim are obviously still in shock because it is tough. You know, oh, boy.

[Emily Maitlis]

You sit down at a place that.

[David Mittleman (Othram)]

You spend a lot of time with as a family and you sit at.

[Emily Maitlis]

That table and you have an empty chair.

[Host/Narrator]

You know, we were eating tacos and not giving thanks because it didn't feel right.

[Emily Maitlis]

Those are some tough times to get through.

[David Mittleman (Othram)]

We're a four person family now, but it's tough.

[Kristen Mittleman (Othram)]

Yeah.

[Host/Narrator]

While Ethan's family is struggling, Othram gets the green light to work the case. And they call pretty much everyone into the lab.

[Kristen Mittleman (Othram)]

It was Thanksgiving Day and the profile was still running and many of us had to cancel our plans and be here so that we could immediately start working on this data, immediately start the next step. And so I remember we couldn't talk about the case. Obviously that includes our families. And we had to say, sorry, we can't host Thanksgiving, we have to move it to the weekend.

[Host/Narrator]

But here's where the case really starts to move because DNA from the knife sheath starts to reveal some clues.

[Emily Maitlis]

Even before we start the forensic genetic genealogy process. We can learn a lot by just looking at the DNA markers. This could be essentially the geographical localization of where their family is from or the origins to their family in Europe, in Asia, in Africa.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

And what are they learning?

[Emily Maitlis]

We learn the person we're looking for has a largely European background and also has this unique biogeographical ancestry tied to Italy. And this eventually leads us to a multi generational American family in Pennsylvania.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

That's a big break. I mean, to go from a totally unknown perpetrator to knowing this is someone with family in Pennsylvania and with Italian ancestry.

[Host/Narrator]

And police in Idaho are working to track down the white Hyundai, Elantra and Aylin. They notice something interesting. From the surveillance footage, they can see that the car doesn't have a front license plate.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

Okay.

[Host/Narrator]

And it turns out that Pennsylvania doesn't require a front license plate.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

Interesting.

[Host/Narrator]

Now detectives are chasing down all of these clues. They've gone to the local stores that sell K Bar knives and they get a list of who's bought one recently, but that leads nowhere. They're also trying to contain just an absolute tornado of conspiracy theories and rumors. So police start holding a number of briefings. This is Moscow Police Captain Roger Linear.

[Emily Maitlis]

I want to address several areas of speculation, conjecture and misinformation that has circulated on social media platforms and otherwise. We do not believe the following individuals are involved in this crime. The two surviving roommates, a male seen at the Grub Truck food vendor downtown, specifically wearing a white hoodie. A private party who provided rides home to Kaylee and Madison in the early morning hour of November 13th.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

People think the surviving roommates are involved.

[Host/Narrator]

I mean, it's horrible. The roommates come under just incredible scrutiny. People attack them for not doing anything, like, how could you not know there was a murderer in the house? And some people suggest they're somehow complicit. This is what Bethany shared at the sentencing, and it's read by one of her friends.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

I was grieving, numb and unsure what had happened was even real. And at the same time, I was getting flooded with death threats and hateful messages from people who did not know me at all or know the dynamic of our friendship. Social media made it so much worse. The media harassed not just me, but also my family. People showed up at our house, they called my phone, my parents phones, and we were chased. I honestly don't even know what to say. It's like people forget that Bethany and Dylan are real people.

[Host/Narrator]

And it doesn't stop with the conspiracy theories. I mean, the media wants the autopsies of the four students. Ethan Chapin's mom, Stacey, says it feels like nothing is off limits. We just got a call from the university that they're going after the transcripts of the kids and any infractions that they had at the university. And we're like, you can, as a parent of a college kid, call the university and get your child's transcripts. We don't have Ethan's transcripts. Why does the media get to go after his transcripts? I mean, yeah, you failed math. Oh, well, what they think should be their right to the information, it is shocking.

[Emily Maitlis]

Why do you need it?

[Host/Narrator]

Yeah, why does anybody need to know it now?

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

I don't think anyone who hasn't lost a loved one in a horrific crime like this or in such a public way can really understand what they're going through. I know we've talked about this privately, but I don't want to be part of the problem either. And it makes you wonder where the line is.

[Host/Narrator]

Yeah, I mean, there's the hope that by talking about what happened and how it affects people and, you know, obviously how this case is solved, it'll prevent it from happening again. But also, we don't want to re traumatize these families. I will tell you that every day since November 13, 2022, every single day, there has been something. I don't want to call it a battle, just something that you are fighting. Something, you know, call from the FBI. I had to photograph what was in his wallet. I mean, I don't feel. Feel like it's anybody's business, but that feels like what's coming next. And Othram's really working around the clock. I mean, David, he basically moves into the lab to make sure that this is going as fast and efficiently as possible. They're running their forensic genetic genealogy, and as soon as they're getting information, they're relaying it back to detectives.

[Kristen Mittleman (Othram)]

We were able to tell the detectives that we believe that the family came from Pennsylvania. They were able to narrow their search of white Hyundai Elantras with Pennsylvania plates. And believe it or not, there were only a couple cars that had Pennsylvania plates that actually matched the description of the car seen at the crime scene.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

That's pretty narrowed down.

[Host/Narrator]

But a few days after the murders, the killer does something to try and throw police off his tail.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

Next time on America's Crime Lab.

[Emily Maitlis]

They wanted to point the finger at other people as being responsible for this, to try to point the finger at innocent third parties.

[David Mittleman (Othram)]

Is this real? Are they really telling us the truth? Or do we finally have a name and someone to look at?

[Ashley Jennings (Senior Deputy Prosecutor)]

I will call you what you are.

[Host/Narrator]

Sociopath. Psychopath.

[Kristen Mittleman (Othram)]

Murderer.

[Advertisement Voice]

And when those prison doors slam shut.

[Host/Narrator]

Behind you, I hope that sound echoes.

[Advertisement Voice]

In your heart for the rest of your meaningless days.

[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

America's Crime Lab is produced by Rococo Punch for Kaleidoscope. Erica Lance is our story editor and sound design is by David Woje. Our producing team is Catherine Fenollosa, Emily Forman, and Jessica Alpert. Our executive producers are Kate Osborne, Mangesh Hadi Gadour, and David and Kristen Mittleman. And from iHeart, Katrina Norville and Ally Perry. Special thanks to Connell Byrne, Will Pearson, Kerry Lieberman, Nikki Etor, Nathan Itoske, John Burbank, and the entire team at Othram. I'm Aelin Lance Lesser. Thanks for listening.

[Emily Maitlis]

Stop settling for weak sound. It's time to level up your game and bring the boom. Hit the town with the ultra durable LG X Boom portables speaker and enjoy vibrant sound wherever you go. Elevate your listening experience to new heights because, let's be real, your music deserves it. The future of sound is now with LG XBoom. And for a limited time, save [e-mail] with code fall25. Bring the boom. Xboom.

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[Emily Maitlis]

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[Bethany (Surviving Roommate)]

This is an iHeart podcast.