Attack in Paradise: Maui Doc Testifies Self-Defense, Bloodied Pics of Wife Tell Different Story

Summary

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Podcast Summary

Overview of the Episode

Episode Title: Attack in Paradise: Maui Doc Testifies Self-Defense, Bloodied Pics of Wife Tell Different Story
Hosts: Amy Robach & T.J. Holmes
Date: April 3, 2026

In this gripping episode, Amy Robach and T.J. Holmes delve into the sensational ongoing trial of Dr. Gerhard Koenig, an anesthesiologist in Maui charged with second-degree attempted murder. The alleged crime: pushing his wife, Ari, off a cliff during a birthday hike, followed by a violent attack. Both spouses survived and testified, alongside the doctor’s son, making this a rare "he said, she said, they said" courtroom drama. The hosts break down the testimony, evidence, and emotional moments that have captivated viewers.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

The Incident: Paradise Turns Into a Crime Scene

• Setting the scene: A "he said, she said" trial unfolds in Hawaii, centering on the accusation that Dr. Koenig tried to kill his wife, while he counters that she attacked him (03:02–04:03).
• Notable dynamic: "In these cases, oftentimes ... one person's dead and can't tell their story. This is not the case." – T.J. Holmes (04:03)
• Both survived: Unusually, both husband and wife testified, joined by the husband’s son, who claims his father confessed.

Profile of the Accused

• Dr. Gerhard Koenig: An intelligent, clinical, unassuming anesthesiologist—"not your typical attempted murder suspect" (05:15).
• Public perception: "He doesn't seem like someone who would be quick to anger ... He seems very in control of his thoughts and emotions." – Amy Robach (05:15)
• A 'nerdy Justin Timberlake': Memorable visual description from Amy, noted by T.J. (06:02–06:10).

Marriage, Motive, and the Birthday Hike

• Background: The couple met on eHarmony in 2016—both in their second marriages, with kids from previous relationships (06:30).
• Recent move to Maui (2023): The pair sought a “second chance” and a fresh start.
• Birthday gone awry: The hike was intended as a reconciliation and birthday celebration, but the marriage had already seen trouble—namely, Ari’s admitted emotional affair with a coworker, Jeff Miller (08:03).

Evidence and Allegations

• The affair: Koenig’s obsession with the emotional affair lies at the heart of motive, as he regularly checked his wife’s emails and texts, and even contacted the coworker’s wife through LinkedIn (08:42, 17:11–17:57).
• Location details: Hike took place at Paley Lookout, a notoriously steep and dangerous cliffside (08:42–09:46).
  • "When you’re at that height, there aren’t guardrails, there aren’t protectants. It’s basically hike at your own risk." – Amy Robach (09:15)

Competing Versions of the Attack

Dr. Koenig's Story (10:28–11:54)

• Claims Ari made a provocative announcement about ongoing contact with Jeff Miller during the hike.
• Claims Ari became agitated, pushed him from behind, then pulled him on top of her, immobilized him with her legs, and grabbed his testicles.
• Admitted to hitting her twice with a rock in “self-defense.”

Ari’s Story (11:54–13:36)

• Says she was already uncomfortable and cautious about the dangerous hike.
• Describes Koenig behaving “oddly” and the ambiance as “off.”
• Testifies he pushed her towards the edge; she dropped to the ground to avoid being pushed off.
• Claims Koenig attempted to use a syringe, which she knocked away.
• Details a brutal attack: "Shut the F up. Nobody's going to hear you out here. Nobody's coming to save you." – Koenig allegedly, per Ari’s testimony (12:49)
• States Koenig hit her with a rock up to 10 times.

Hosts' Skepticism and Observations

• Amy expresses strong doubt about Koenig’s version, calling it implausible from a common-sense perspective, especially concerning physical dynamics (13:36–14:28).
  • "You're not going to pull [a man] on top of you. That's the last thing you want." – Amy Robach (14:06)
• Injury photos reveal stark contrast: Dr. Koenig had barely visible marks, while Ari’s injuries were gruesome and permanent (14:28–15:46).

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On suspicion of the doctor's story:
  • Amy (13:36): "How in the hell is she attacking him and then pulls him down? ... That story did not fly."
• On the extent of Ari’s injuries:
  • T.J. (15:00): "There is such a thick amount of blood pouring down her head and face that it looks like somebody dumped something on her head."
• On the emotional torment for the son:
  • T.J. (24:22): "[His son] said two things to him. 'I'm not coming back. And I just tried to kill my wife.'"

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Son’s Damning Testimony (23:56–25:47)

• 19-year-old Emil Koenig: Testified his father FaceTimed him twice after the incident, confessing, “I just tried to kill my wife.”
  • Amy described the moment: “You can see the weight of it. ... To have to say, 'Yes, my father fully admitted to me ... that he tried to kill my stepmom.'” (24:22)
• Dr. Koenig’s defense: Claimed his son misunderstood—that he was only relaying Ari’s own accusations—but the son was clear and specific.
  • Amy: "That is not at all ... his son was definitive. ... He just plain as day said ... he tried to kill her." (25:05)

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The Role of Obsession and Pre-meditation

• Koenig was deeply preoccupied with the emotional affair, escalating to intrusive behaviors like digital sleuthing and contacting Jeff Miller’s wife (16:27–17:57).
  • "You wanted [Jeff Miller's wife] to confront your wife ... and he said no, which also was so unbelievable." – Amy (17:30)
• Evidence suggested pre-planning, as Koenig skipped safer, more scenic trails in favor of the most dangerous available on the All Trails app (26:30–27:28).

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Hosts’ Final Reflections and Jury Speculation

• Media dynamics: Hawaii’s time zone and location may have reduced national attention, but Amy and T.J. consider the story “made for TV and tabloids” (22:26–22:52).
• Issues at stake: Dr. Koenig faces life in prison if convicted (27:58).
• Uncertainty about jury verdicts: “I will never, ever be able to guess what a jury is going to do” – T.J. Holmes (27:28).

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Episode Timestamps for Important Segments

• [03:02] — Introduces the case and outlines what’s at stake
• [05:15] — Profile of Dr. Koenig and his demeanor in court
• [06:30] — History of the couple and background leading to the incident
• [08:03] — Emotional affair as a possible motive
• [09:46]–[13:36] — Step-by-step breakdown of both Dr. Koenig and Ari’s testimonies
• [14:28]–[15:46] — Graphic descriptions and comparison of injuries
• [17:11]–[17:57] — Koenig’s escalating obsession and incriminating behavior
• [23:56]–[25:47] — Son’s testimony and its impact on the case
• [26:30]–[27:28] — Suspected premeditation via hiking app evidence
• [27:58] — Stakes of the trial and speculation on the verdict

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Summary Table

| Segment | Topic | Timestamp | |--------------------------|----------------------------------------------------------|------------------| | Opening/Case Intro | Overview and unique dynamics of the trial | 03:02–04:03 | | Defendant Profile | Dr. Koenig’s background, demeanor, and marriage history | 05:15–06:30 | | The Hike Details | The couple’s relationship, affair, and hike setup | 06:30–09:46 | | Competing Testimonies | Step-by-step breakdown of each spouse’s story | 10:28–13:36 | | Evidence Presented | Injury photos, behavioral evidence, physical contrasts | 14:28–15:46 | | Son’s Testimony | Emil Koenig’s statements and implications | 23:56–25:47 | | Pre-meditation | Hiking app choices and digital sleuthing | 16:27–17:57, 26:30–27:28 | | Verdict Speculation | Stakes, reflections on jury difficulty | 27:28–end |

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Conclusion:
Amy Robach and T.J. Holmes deliver a riveting, detailed account of a jaw-dropping case that unpacks not only the facts but also the emotional and psychological layers underneath. The trial’s central question—what really happened on that Maui cliff?—remains with the jury, but listeners are left with a nuanced understanding of the drama, the evidence, and the very human toll behind the headlines.

Transcript

[Amy Robach]

This is an iHeart podcast.

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[T.J. Holmes]

Avocados from Mexico, always good. Hey there folks. It is Friday, April 3rd and a high stakes he said she said is playing out in of all places Hawaii. She said her husband tried to kill her by pushing her off a cliff. He says, oh no, it's the other way around. His wife tried to push him off the cliff. And both of them got to tell their stories on a witness stand this weekend. With that welcome to this episode of Amy and tj. And to be clear, that he said she said is playing out, it's him that's on trial for attempted murder.

[Amy Robach]

Yeah. And I think feel like after what we've witnessed in court, it's kind of a he said they said situation because he has multiple folks who disagree with his version of events.

[T.J. Holmes]

And the wild thing right in these cases, oftentimes you said this plenty of times the last couple days that he said she said oftentimes one person's dead in the scenario and can't tell their story. This is not the case. Have you all been seeing these headlines, this story, this, this trial has been going on the past couple of weeks, but the doctor in particular took the over the past couple days in his trial. Yes. Out there in Maui, we're talking about a guy by the name of Dr. Gerhard Koenig. He is an anesthesiologist in Maui and he is facing a second degree attempted murder charge. Accused of trying to push his wife off a steep cliff on a hike in beautiful Maui. The wife survived, took the stand in his trial and the man's son also testified that his dad confessed to trying to kill his wife. As you said is a he said they said robes and the doctor took the stand in his own defense. We watched this testimony over the past couple days. It wrapped with a fascinating and a pretty wild cross examination yesterday. Robes, I want to start with that. I say kind of wild but it the scene that's described, the violence that's described is really, it really belies the appearance and almost the demeanor and tone of the defendant.

[Amy Robach]

Yes. This is not your typical attempted murder suspect. This is a esteemed anesthesiologist who is practicing in Maui. He's measured, obviously. He's intelligent. He's clinical. He doesn't seem like someone who would be quick to anger. He seems very in control of his thoughts and emotions. Yes. He is not somebody who seems like he would just get some wild hair up his butt and decide to push his wife and when that didn't work, just to start hitting her as hard as he could with a rock he found nearby. But my goodness, some of the visuals we're even seeing in court in terms of her injuries, it's hard to see the guy on the stand and then look at what the aftermath was in this incident.

[T.J. Holmes]

And this is no offense to Justin Timberlake, but I thought it was apt in your description yesterday. You said he's like a nerdy Justin Timberlake.

[Amy Robach]

That is what he looks like to me.

[T.J. Holmes]

Yeah. That was really good description of the guy. It kind of is. So that's the guy who's been on the stand. This is a guy from South Africa originally. He moved to the US when he was 14. But these two met ropes. I didn't catch this detail, and I'm sure E. Harmony doesn't want to advertise this, but these two met in 2016 on that dating app. It's still a dating app.

[Amy Robach]

Yes, it's a dating app that actually really prides itself on resulting in marriages. And these were second marriages, I believe, for both of them. They both had children from other marriages. Interestingly enough, you mentioned his son who testified against him. It wasn't even their son. She. Ariel was his stepmother. So I thought that maybe perhaps made his testimony even all the more compelling. But, yeah, they moved to Maui in 2023. They're in paradise. So what could possibly go wrong? You've got a second chance at love. They found each other on a dating app. They moved to Maui, and yet it ended the way it did in a courtroom now. And it is disturbing when you hear about how their marriage unraveled. But what led up to. By the way, it was her birthday. It was a birthday celebration hike. When this all has celebration, a celebratory hike. That's what she thought.

[T.J. Holmes]

Just a side personal note, do not plan a hiking trip for me on my birthday. Not because of this. It's just I don't hike. And it turns out it's not what she wanted to do either. We'll explain how this all went down, but this happened. We're just talking a year out from the actual incident. It was March 24th of last year, again, her birthday. The couple lives on Oahu, but they had moved or traveled over to Maui for a celebration. And Rose, like we said, this was supposed to be a celebratory trip, not just for her birthday, but for them to try to reconcile and kind of turn a new leaf on their relationship, which had seen some issues. And those issues, according to prosecutors, are what led to this guy wanting to kill his wife.

[Amy Robach]

Yes, she admitted to having an emotional affair with a coworker. And so he found out about it. And we hear him on the stand describe himself as not mad, but upset. Some of that stuff was a little ridiculous because obviously prosecutors were trying to build up the point, saying, hey, you were so upset about your wife's emotional affair. Talked about all the books he was reading and the counseling they went to, but his online searches in the middle of the night, all of these things saying, hey, you were up, you were mad. No, I was upset. Don't know what the distinction between those two things were, but I thought that was an interesting response from him.

[T.J. Holmes]

Upset. But they were also able to rope, I guess, describe some of his behavior and they have evidence of it that he was obsessed with this idea of this affair. We'll explain that in just a moment as well. I never heard of this Paley Lookout, but apparently a very popular place there in Maui. Picturesque, but also dangerous robes, from what I've seen at least several hundred feet, almost minimum in this cliff on this hike. So this is, again, I don't hike, but this is something that is talked about. They give you a heads up. You need to be careful if you're going to be taking this hike.

[Amy Robach]

Yes, I obviously love to hike and that is something almost everyone does. He even admitted on the stand that he did as well. You look up to see what the terrain is like. You get different. Either it's easy, moderate, or difficult. And a lot of it is whether or not it is dangerous, so to speak. And so, yes, I have done plenty of dangerous hikes, but I knew what I was getting into. And you, it, it's, it's a little nerve wracking. And it's not for everybody, certainly, because when you're at that height, there aren't guardrails, there aren't protectants. It's basically hike at your own risk. And that was this trail.

[T.J. Holmes]

And so he wanted to do this hike. He put it all together. She had some concerns about it, but we haven't said already. His wife's name is Ariel. Ari called her Ari. Ari throughout is what she's been referred to as. So they go on this hike. Now, before we get into his side and her side, what we do know is that something happened. They went out on this hike. Some scuffle, some attack, some fight did take place. Both of them ended up with injuries. The pictures we saw, obviously hers were much more severe than his. But something happens on this cliff. They get into a fight. Nobody goes off the side. So that is where we are. So let's take his side of the events. Robes. He claims she attacked him.

[Amy Robach]

Yes. He said that she made this big announcement that she was going to continue working and actually wanted to travel again with. With the man who she had an emotional affair with. His name was Jeff Miller. So he said that she just decided to make this announcement while they're hiking on her birthday. And when she said that and they got into a huge fight, she pushed him from behind. And this is where it gets very hard to imagine, but he claims that she pulls him on top of her. Why any woman would want a man on top of her if she's fighting him? I'm sorry, that doesn't make any sense.

[T.J. Holmes]

Let's just give the story without the sarcasm. I will come back and get your commentary.

[Amy Robach]

All right, then you take it, because I don't think I can do it without sarcasm.

[T.J. Holmes]

Well, going straight through. That's how he explained that. Yes, she pushed him. Then after she pushed him, he collected himself and went towards her, is his claim. At that point, she grabs his wrist, grabs his arms, pulls him down on top of her. Says she locks him in essentially with her legs even around him. He couldn't get free. Says at one point she grabs him by his testicles and would not let go. He says he was eventually able to pick up a rock, hit her in the head a couple times. She was screaming this whole time. Says he hit her twice. His claim he said it several times. He hit her with a rock twice. And that is his version of events. Her version much different?

[Amy Robach]

Uh, yes. She very much says she was uncomfortable with the hike. And look, I. You can see from those pictures, and you have to read the temperature of everyone when you're doing a hike like this, when it's that high and that steep, that is concerning. And so, yes, she had mentioned she was uncomfortable. And then she said that his behavior was odd, and she just noticed he was odd from the very beginning and that that Would read. But she said she was always aware of her position on the clip because she was nervous, so that makes sense, too. But she then said, yes, he tried to. She lowered herself to the ground. Smart, right? So someone's trying to push you off a cliff. She immediately drops to the ground. And then a scuffle is on the ground. She claims he had a syringe in his hand, and she was able to brush it out of his hand, so he wasn't able to use it. But I told you, the thing that scared me or just sent chills up and down my spine was what she testified to, what he said to her when she was on the ground and he was beating her with a rock. Shut the F up. Nobody's going to hear you out here. Nobody's coming to save you. That's like the title of a horror movie.

[T.J. Holmes]

And she said she was able to. I was amazed. Rope. She said she, during the. In the midst of this attack, was almost able to reason with him and get him to calm down and get him to stop. And she thought she was going to be able to get away. And no, he starts up again and hits her in the head with a rock some 10 times, she estimates. Now, we did get to see her injuries from the hospital. They are horrific. The blood that was pouring down her face while she was out there being treated, we've seen all that. Go back now, Robes, to his story. You certainly took issue what in there seems, I mean, just on the face of it, unbelievable.

[Amy Robach]

Well, first of all, and the prosecution was very good during cross examination to point this out. He's bigger than her, he's stronger than her, he weighs more than her. How in the hell is she attacking him and then pulls him down? And if you're a fighting, if you're a woman, come on, ladies out there listening. You're fighting with the man your life, okay? You are not going to pull him on top of you. That's the last thing you want. You're going to get on top of him. You're going to do. You're not going to have him on top of you.

[Bowen Yang]

You.

[Amy Robach]

Then you are completely at his mercy. There's no way you're able to then wield a. A rock in your hand from that position up at him. That makes no sense like just common sense that that story did not fly. I can't imagine any juror, especially any female jurors, would buy any version of his events.

[T.J. Holmes]

And to that point, Robes, in addition to you, you said her being able to hit him With a rock. He described such a violent way he was attacked. They did show pictures of his injuries. It was the day of. And then the next day they showed the day of. Saw a little bruise the next day. You wouldn't even say this guy had been in a scuffle of any kind.

[Amy Robach]

Meantime, she's got blood pouring from her head, bandages all around. They. It was very smart of the prosecution to put the two pictures side by side. And it was. They didn't even need to say anything. The pictures spoke volumes.

[T.J. Holmes]

And it's hard kind of to describe. And this is a Friday morning as we're recording this and telling you about it. But it is. Robes does. It's almost. You can't see hair and you can't see her face. There is such a thick amount of blood pouring down her head and face that it looks like somebody dumped something on her head. It is. It is stunning to see. And then once the. They got the pictures from the hospital robe, she is cut up terribly and needed all kinds of stitches. This was obviously a really violent attack.

[Amy Robach]

Yes. And now she has to wear her hair a certain way because she is actually you. You said you saw the. The injury like still there forever permanent. She's missing hair.

[T.J. Holmes]

That was effective. The prosecutor had her move her bangs to where they showed a part of her hair. She said, can't grow hair there anymore. And he was covered up. So that was effective. Now, he did wrap up robe. His. His cross examination yesterday. We'll give a couple of details of that. But we keep talking about this guy, Jeff Miller. This emotional affair is at the center of this because the prosecution claims, and even the Koenig says this infuriated him, this idea of this emotional affair to where Robes. He found out that she started. Well, she started using her phone a lot more. He got suspicious, said he went into detective mode. He was checking her emails and her text messages every single day. And it took me a while to realize this robe's an emotional affair. This is guy she never physically spent any time with.

[Amy Robach]

Right. So this was, you know, a lot of people will kind of joke and go, okay, it was just an emotional affair. No, it actually was an emotional affair. She wasn't physically with him. And so that does make a lot of sense. But certainly he. We heard him talk about not just being obsessed with Jeff Miller, but with Jeff Miller's wife. So he started reaching out to her on LinkedIn. Correct. And started to try to get her involved and say, I've got basically receipts of their texts and interestingly enough, Jeff Miller's wife never responded to him, never reached out to him, never got involved in any of it. But you could see his obsession and that was what prosecutors were laying out in cross examination. Certainly this was a guy who was, as you say, obsessed with his wife's emotional affair.

[T.J. Holmes]

And a one why this detail stood out so much. He reached out to a woman on LinkedIn that he had no idea about, know who she was, essentially to say, hey, your husband has been doing this with my wife, whatever the messages are, said he actually sent this woman he didn't know via LinkedIn, his wife's contact.

[Amy Robach]

Yes. And, and yes, that was so interesting. The prosecution said you wanted her to confront your wife, you wanted her to curse out your wife, didn't you? And he said no, which also was so unbelievable. Of course that's why he did it. Of course that's why he gave the J.E. miller's wife his wife's personal contact information. So just admit that. Yes. So him saying no, that's not why I did that. That no jury is, no juror is buying that.

[T.J. Holmes]

I just thought that was. They were trying to make a point. And this wasn't a contentious. We've seen contentious sometime across examinations. He was calm the entire time. The, I mean, look, the prosecutor did his job, but he wasn't necessarily being combative, but held his feet to the fire and he goes kind of rapid fire with a lot of his questions in a way that I did find effective and threw the doctor off at times. He had to stop, he had to think, he had to second guess and. But the doctor never got worked up. He was very calm.

[Amy Robach]

You're right, you make a good point. This was a very calm exchange. Talking about something incredibly emotional and at times violent. And yet, interestingly enough, the back and forth was very calm. It, as you said, belied what they were talking about. The demeanor of everybody was, was very.

[T.J. Holmes]

Yeah, it was eerie, almost eerie to have a man sitting at the defense table while on the witness stand the woman he's accused of trying to kill his wife. That was an eerie moment in this trial, but it might not have been the most eerie or frankly, robes, the most uncomfortable. Stay here, we'll tell you when. Now this man on trial for attempted murder had to sit and listen to his son tell the jury that. Yep, my daddy told me he did it.

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[Sophia Bush]

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[T.J. Holmes]

All right, we continue here on Amy and tj. A fascinating trial taking place in Rhoad. We've seen some headlines about it. I wonder if it wasn't happening in Hawaii if we it might get more coverage. The time has really thrown us off. Some of the testimony in the trial doesn't get started until three plus in the afternoon on the east coast. So I wonder if that has anything to do with it. But the details on this one are just mind blowing and frankly are made for TV and tabloids.

[Amy Robach]

It's true. I totally agree that if this, this weren't happening in Hawaii's time zone, this would be a much bigger story here in the states. Or at least I know it's the states, but in the, what do they call continental U.S. contingent

[T.J. Holmes]

states, we have 48 of those.

[Amy Robach]

Thank you.

[T.J. Holmes]

We have the outliers.

[Amy Robach]

Okay. Anyway, I digress but yes, we were listening to it. I actually had a, an errand to run, came home, you were making dinner. The trial was on finally like at 9pm I was like babe, I gotta go to bed, I'm tired. But the trial was still in full swing because yes, we're in a very different time zone own but it is like you, once you start watching it and listening to it, you cannot stop. It's, it's a surreal scenario just who's involved, what the allegations are and the fact that everyone testified. Not only the wife who prosecutors say he tried to kill, but his own son who testified against him. In such an uncomfortable exchange. I, I think everyone puts themselves in, in those shoes. And what a surreal experience to be testifying against your own father.

[T.J. Holmes]

Well, his son. Well, his dad put him in that position. Yes, that's awful. But as we wrap up, the last thing we do want to get in is the son. 19 year old Emil Koenig did get called to the stands that his dad called him twice. Two FaceTime calls on that day robes after this incident took place. And actually rose, this is as close to a confession as you're going to get. Said two things to him. I'm not coming back. And I just tried to kill my wife.

[Amy Robach]

Yes. So, in fact, his exact testimony was that he, Emile, said his father told him that he would not be making it back to Maui and to take care of the younger kids that he had and that Ari, my stepmom, had been cheating on him and that he tried to kill her. I mean, that is as plain as it is. And when you watch this young kid look at that prosecutor and say that, you can see the weight of it. You can feel the weight of it. And just to have to say, yes, my father fully admitted to me in the moments after the event on the mountain that he tried to kill my stepmom.

[T.J. Holmes]

That is, as a juror, that is as convincing of testimony as you're going to get. He doesn't want to be there.

[Amy Robach]

Yeah. And the explanation by Koenig was weak to say. Well, I think he got confused. I'm sorry. I put. He was very emotional when he was talking about the position he put his son in to have to testify against him. But he said that he must have gotten confused because he was saying, she said I tried to kill her. So he said he was repeating what his wife was telling the other hikers and telling folks. So he was like, I was just explaining what Arie was saying, that I tried to kill her. But that. That is not at all his son was definitive. It was not, I think he tried to say, or it was a little confusing how he was saying it. No, he just plain as day said, and he said he tried to kill her.

[T.J. Holmes]

This was a terrifying incident. And robe, we said the time zone might. Might have an impact on how it's being covered. But this, I think the scene, the setting adds to some of the intrigue in this story. The pictures of her, the violence, that this was happening in a place I can't wait to go visit, you know, in the most picturesque, gorgeous place you could imagine. A couple trying to work things out. It's a birthday, like all of those things around it. And they say he had a different mindset, he had a different mission that day. And Rose, you, you. They mentioned all trails and as soon as they said alltrails.com you said, I use that.

[Amy Robach]

I love all trails.

[T.J. Holmes]

But they talked about he went through and was looking for the best hikes and all these searches he had, and he skipped over some of the best ones. He went to the steep ones and the ones that looked a little more difficult.

[Amy Robach]

That was very interesting to me because, yes, anyone who's a hiker probably is very familiar with the All Trails app. And so wherever I am, I'll go on it and see what the trails are. Which ones has water, which ones have waterfalls, which one ones, you know, have a steep incline, which ones have picturesque views. And yes, they're all rated and you get to see and hear people give raid them. They tell you why they're dangerous or not. And to skip over the, you're in, you're in Maui. You've got unbelievable nature all around you. So, yeah, to skip over what the top 10 best hikes were in your area and just simply go straight for the steepest, most dangerous hike. Yeah, I mean, that, that doesn't look good for him. I. From what we've watched and witnessed here in this trial, none of it looks very good for him.

[T.J. Holmes]

Well, they did wrap up yesterday with cross examination of Koenig, so he's done. The judge gave this schedule, they're off today, robes, they're off on Monday. He told the jury, when you come back in here on Tuesday, you're going to get this case. So the defense has a few things I think they need to wrap up as far as major witnesses. That's for the most part done. They will rest their case and this jury will figure it out. Always fascinating. Jury watches. I will never, ever be able to guess what a jury is going to

[Amy Robach]

do every time we try. We've failed miserably. But the interesting thing about this, it's attempted murder, second degree attempted murder. And yet he is still facing life in prison. Correct. For the rest of his life. So his life is at stake as this jury decides his fate come Tuesday. So we appreciate you listening to us, everyone. Thank you as always. I'm Amy Robach alongside T.J. holmes. Morning Run is coming up next.

[T.J. Holmes]

This is Julian Edelman from Games With Names. I want to take a second to talk about something that's personal to me. I've had the privilege of working closely with with Robert Kraft for a long time. And one thing I've always respected is how seriously he takes up standing up to hate. As a Jewish athlete, my identity is something I am proud of. But I also know what it feels like to be singled out for it. That's why this new commercial for the Blue Square Alliance Against Hate that aired during the big game really hit home. It's about showing up for someone when they're targeted, even if you don't have the perfect words. And sometimes standing next to someone is enough. And you can show support by sharing the blue square.

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[T.J. Holmes]

Avocados from Mexico. Always good.

[Amy Robach]

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