← Amy Robach & T.J. Holmes Present
Amy Robach & T.J. Holmes Present
Au Pair Affair Murders Trial: Legal Analyst Says Au Pair Isn’t Likable, BUT She’s Believable
00:23:20
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- [00:00]
A
This is an I heart podcast. Guaranteed human. Welcome, everyone, to this episode of Amy and TJ Presents. We have been obsessed with this au pair affair. Murders trial. That's what it's been dubbed. But to catch up, Brendan Banfield, a former IRS agent, is on trial now, and he is accused of conspiring with his au pair, who he was having an affair with, to not only kill his wife, but to pin it on someone else. And in order to do that, according to the prosecution, he and the au pair went on to a fetish website to find someone who unknowingly agreed to be a part of their plan. He thought that he was going to have a sexual encounter with Brendan Banfield's wife, Christine, in which he was told she wanted to simulate a rape scene. And the idea, according to prosecutors, was that Brendan would walk in on this and kill Joseph Ryan and then stab his wife to death, but make it look as though Joseph Ryan was stabbing his wife to death so that he is the hero now, not the murderer. That is basically the essence of the prosecution's case. And tj, we have not been able to stop watching this.
- [01:37]
B
I mean, this is. And look, it's a. It's a little cute, I guess Au pair affair is what it's being called. But these are the types of stories that even in Hollywood, they have a difficult time scripting. So let's bring in Allison Treason, our expert, our legal expert defense attorney who's been helping us through a number of high profile cases. And Allison, you're never shy as a defense attorney about telling us in some of these cases. Man, that defense attorney, he really took a stinker of a case. Now tell me, how much of an uphill climb is it for a defense attorney for the defense attorney who took this case?
- [02:11]
C
Okay, first of all, I'm just going to geek out for one second because, you know, I've been practicing criminal defense forever and I talk about cases all the time and then I watch criminal cases. So, like, you know, true crime junkie obsessed is an understatement. Amy. My goodness, this one is. You're right. I mean, no one could script a story like this. And for us to watch it and believe it if it wasn't in fact happening in front of our eyes as we watch witness after witness, I mean, my house could have been on fire. And I was not going to turn away from Julianne's testimony. Right? I mean, I was, I, I was going to watch Gave Gavel because I wanted to know who the prosecution, who, in my opinion, made A deal with the devil to hear what she had to say because she may be walking out of here scot free, which is incredible because in her testimony she admits to shooting a man and it was probably the fatal blow. But her testimony, in my opinion, is the lynch mark of the case. It is the most important thing that comes out of this entire case. And if she is to be believed by the jury, this man is going to get convicted and he's going to spend the rest of his life in prison. That how I feel about the case.
- [03:41]
B
Do you think she, she came off as believable, her story?
- [03:44]
C
You know, I'm troubled by her testimony. I do believe her story to be true. I did not like her affect, I did not like her denials. I didn't. I thought that she should have, she already has the sweetheart deal, owned up to her actual role and involvement in this. And I didn't think that she did that honestly enough. I think that in many ways this relationship speaks for itself in terms of the power dynamic. She is a young, 21 year old Brazilian gal who comes to this country not knowing anybody. He is a successful, you know, decades older man who she falls in love with, as we know from the, the social media, where she describes him, you know, as just sort of this godlike person who has swept her off her feet. And so I think there was a real power dynamic there where she was the inferior in this relationship, but she was all in. She was all in. If this is, if this is to be believed. She was all in on the plan which she called what she called it a plan. She was very active in setting up those social media posts which she wrote or the, the exchanges on the Fed Life site that she wrote some of them. And she kept saying, Brandon made me this and Brandon told me to do that. And, and I, I didn't think that was necessary. I didn't think it was necessary and I think that it did diminish her credibility because she was there step by step and you know, that picture of her at a shooting range, you know, Brandon told me to get the gun. Brandon told me to do this. Brandon told me to do that. Well, she was all on board for it. And one of the things that I think that the prosecution should have done better is walk through her rationale and had her cry. They should have brought her to tears. They should have brought her to tears and showed that she actually had remorse. The only time I saw that she cried at all was when she was talking about the little girl, Victoria. The couple's daughter. But she, she brutally killed and not at Brandon's direction because she said, apparently in her testimony, she said, well, Brandon, he's still moving. And Brandon didn't respond. And so she pulls out the weapon that's in her sweater and shoots him and shoots the guy dead. And you know, at some point she says she covered her ears, she covered her eyes, but she walks upstairs, leaving the four year old with an iPad in the basement. Okay. Which by the way, doesn't make sense to anybody who would believe the story that this, this guy is in the house. And she doesn't stay with this, with this toddler while the law enforcement husband goes to figure out what's going on. That doesn't make sense to me. So I wanted to see, I wanted to see a little bit more contrition and remorse and sadness from her. And I didn't see it. Now that said, is she to be disbelieved? Did the prosecution need her? Did they have to give her this kind of deal because she is in fact, the backbone of their case. And my answer is yes.
- [07:52]
A
Okay. So yes, we feel validated because we thought that same thing. Like if you don't have the au pair, you don't actually have a case. However, you mentioned her lack of attrition. I would also say what she did after the fact, she moved right into the master bedroom, put a picture of her and Brandon up where a picture of that used to be there with Christine and Brendan. She moved her clothes into what was Christine's closet. Just, she just moved in and became, and assumed, yeah, assumed the role when.
- [08:30]
C
I saw the Brazilian jersey move from the guest room into the master bedroom. And then I saw the picture of the two of them and sitting on the nightstand right next to the part of the bed where Christine used to sleep. It is disgusting.
- [08:52]
A
I have chills just thinking about that. So as a juror, I am wondering.
- [08:57]
C
Should have addressed it, should have addressed it and said, do you feel badly now for that? Do you feel badly what?
- [09:05]
A
Because as a juror I'm watching and seeing this woman do all say, Brandon made me do it, Brandon made me do it, and yet move right in, assume the role of mom and wife and start living this life that she basically took from or contributed to taking from Christine by her own admission, and now she turns the table and throws it all at Brendan. That puts credibility at issue. Just for me, I think as a, as a juror, I'm wondering, wow. And then to know that she is going to walk away after this testimony for free, living in Brazil, possibly with Netflix deals, making money and profiting off of this crime and saying that she deserves it, that. How much of an impact does that have?
- [09:49]
B
Alison, simply put, does the jury have to believe her in order to convict him?
- [09:57]
C
So let me tell you an interesting thing. And this is. This is where my lawyering comes in, okay? Because we're all having this wonderful fodder. But here's the interesting thing, right? He's in a bad spot. Because even if he tries and we really don't know, and I'm listening for it. I'm listening for it. I'm listening for it in the opening. I'm listening for it in the questioning by the defense attorney. We don't know what his defense is yet. We really don't. And I'm sort of befuddled by that because here's the legal problem they have. They can't point the finger at her and say, well, no, no, she was the mastermind. Because in a crime like this, both of them can get convicted of murder. So even if she planned it, he participated in it, and even if she was the one that sent the majority of those FetLife, you know, email exchanges, that doesn't take away the fact that he participated in the killing of his wife. In the setup of this poor schlub coming there, going to their house, he's sitting at McDonald's, there's a lot of pre planning involved. He goes upstairs. How are they going. Even if they are able to turn the tables on Christine, are they going to say he had no idea this was happening, he had no idea that this is what she had planned. That's not believable to me either. Is their defense then going to be so. So even if that is, even if a juror says, well, you know what, she was more culpable than she led us to believe. He's still culpable. He's still culpable. So legally, the prosecutions got him against the wall on that because just because Amy and I, they can prove that I was more involved or I was the mastermind of this crime, it doesn't mean that Amy is not guilty, too. So legally, they've got a problem. And then TJ you're looking at me with like. Kind of like that. That I. That I. But then is defense going to be that, no, it was Mr. Ryan. She actually was the one that engaged him in the FetLife side. It was Christine. It was Christine that planned this. And her husband is a hero. He did shoot him because this man was raping his wife.
- [12:47]
B
But then, Allison, you gotta prove that this 21 year old Brazilian has now made up this whole story and lie to get herself back to Brazil and free. Is that what we're talking about? I would have a hard time believing that as a juror as well.
- [13:03]
C
The thing is, the defense needed to much better than it did in my opinion. In my opinion. Hammer home the sweetheart. Unbelievable unheard of deal that this girl who admittedly kills somebody is, lands the fatal gunshot is going to go home. That she would have said anything. She.
- [13:28]
A
How rare, how rare is a deal like that?
- [13:30]
C
If they told her that, that this, that she was purple and that the sky was yellow and she would have said any single thing on the planet to go home. And, and, and I would have, I would have really gone after the fact that this Netflix film, I mean not only, not only is she envisioning a sweet life after the fact, but, but I, that, that she's getting her commissary and her phone calls paid by movie and TV producers. Oh my. Would I have gone after that?
- [14:10]
A
Yeah, I mean it definitely, obviously affects her credibility. I was curious about what impact you think it had for her not to remember almost anything in terms of the planning. She got combative even at times with the defense attorney saying she didn't know something that significant, something that important to what she was testifying to and she couldn't remember where she was, where the computer was, who wrote the email. She couldn't remember any of the details.
- [14:39]
C
But on direct she said Brandon. Brandon. Brandon. Brandon did this. That was Brandon. That was Brandon. But the weird part about that is her deal's already done. So there really was no reason for her to be so evasive. There was really no reason for her to be so combative because her deal is already done. And, and the only thing it's predicated on is her telling the truth. So why not own some of it? Why not own some of it? I think it would have made her more credible if she would have owned it. But at the end of the day the jury says to itself, well, well, does do the pieces fit? Does the story that she has told us make more sense than whatever, whatever story the defense is going to present? Okay, here is this compassionate, devoted mother and nurse, no history of having these odd sexual fetishes. Okay, all of a sudden were to believe that she's super in to this fetish lifestyle that she has arranged. And I'm going to find it because it's such an unbelievable quote. What mother? What Mother. And what nurse is going to ask that? Look, I'll be asleep in bed, come straight upstairs, cut off the clothing, tie me, rape me. Simple and fun. What? What?
- [16:21]
A
And the more I cry. If I cry. If I tell you to stop, keep going.
- [16:25]
C
I mean, what.
- [16:35]
A
And what do you. I was actually shocked to hear, in terms of the au pairs testimony, her talking about how they had to go through several different potential men to come over because, shockingly, they wanted to meet ahead of time. If you're going to do something this dramatic and this. No, I'm saying that is credible. I'm shocked that someone was willing to agree to do this without having met the person first to say, let's just establish trust here, that this is something that we both are okay with.
- [17:07]
C
Well, by the way, that's one of the things that if I'm the defense, I'm going to. I'm going to attack him. I mean, what kind of person. Person is like, yeah, I'm all the way. I'm totally down with, like, this. This, like, rape fantasy and bringing a knife and bringing zip ties and break. I mean, this is. So I'm going after him. I mean, if you're going to talk about whatever defense they have, you're going after someone like that. And, and let me say something about the bd, BDSM lifestyle. I, you know, I've had cases involving. Involving that. And it is. There's a code. I mean, there's an actual code where you do establish a relationship and you do have safe words and you do meet in public and in person. And so it was unusual that this person was automatically willing. Either it shows some real depravity on his part or. Or that he wasn't really familiar with the. The code and lifestyle of. Of people that do this because it is not unusual that they build a rapport, that they meet in person, that they meet in public, that they establish.
- [18:17]
A
Well, that would make total sense.
- [18:19]
C
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I see. Tj, look at that.
- [18:23]
B
I learned something.
- [18:24]
C
I've been on any of your listeners to say, well, how does she know so much about it? No, no, you know what? No, no, no, wait.
- [18:31]
B
Talking about you or talking about robot?
- [18:33]
A
No, talking about Alison. I don't know anything.
- [18:36]
C
Both of us. Talking about.
- [18:38]
B
All right, Allison, my last thing here. You tell me. Obviously, normally, naturally, you do not want your client, a defense client, to get up on the stand, but in this case, just give me any ways he could possibly help himself if he were to testify in his own defense.
- [18:58]
C
So he's got to own up to the affair. He's got to own to the affair. He has. He's got to deny, deny, deny. He's got to deny that he plotted to kill his wife. He's got to deny that he went on these fetishes websites and set up those accounts. He's got to deny, deny, deny. And a jury has to believe him over Juliana. And he's got to say, look, the only time that she turned against me because they were communicating and she was saying to his mother, I will never testify against him. I'll take the blame for both of us. Okay? I mean, that. That came out. That came out. I'll take the blame for both of us. I will never turn against him. He has to say that the only reason that she has turned on me and has blamed me for this is because she was looking at spending the rest of her life in prison if she didn't get up on the stand and lie and say, I did this.
- [20:17]
A
Yep. That makes total sense. And, Allison, I. I have one last question for you, because the other part of this case are the detectives, or at least specifically one who said. And when it was peer reviewed at the University of Alabama, they agreed that they, from a digital forensic standpoint, do not believe that Brendan and Juliana were behind the FetLife account. They don't believe that you can tie it to them forensically.
- [20:50]
C
Right. So. And then there's also the thing about the knife that didn't have Brandon's DNA on it. So. Yes. Right. Okay.
- [20:58]
A
So how big is that going to be?
- [20:59]
C
It is. And that's not something you get through Brendan anyway. So to answer both of your questions, tj, you're not putting him on for that. You're not putting him on for those things, but you are going after. I absolutely would call those officers that said, we didn't think there was enough. We didn't think that it was them, and have them walk through it to prove some reasonable doubt. I want to say something about that that I found to be really interesting. And that was, you know, it took a long time. So, you know, Juliana is charged October 19th in 2023, and then he's not charged till September 16th, 2024. That's a long time that goes by. And what changed there? What changed? I mean, it took them a long time to arrest him. I would focus in on that, and I would tie in that veteran law enforcement officers did not believe that they were behind that account. Veteran law enforcement officers. It took them. It took them a really long time to figure out a way to connect him to this murder. That's what I would go after at the end of the day. And because I'm going to finish, I'm going to finish strong here. I'm going to feel strong. I didn't love her on the stand, but I believed her.
- [22:23]
A
Yeah, it would be hard to imagine, just from a logical standpoint that this young Brazilian girl could come up with all of this. And I guess the argument from the defense is that the prosecution told her what to say. But it does seem so far fetched that we all know truth is stranger than fiction. And this is kind of exactly a case in point.
- [22:45]
C
Yeah, yeah. That's where we are is that this is a crazy story. We all should be watching. Obvious, obviously. I mean, you know, take sick leave, I don't know from work, but it's that good. And I can't wait to see how it turns out.
- [23:04]
A
Yeah, it's appointment television for us for sure.
- [23:06]
B
Alison, we love you, girl. Thank you so much. We appreciate you. We are obsessed as well. We know. We'll be talking to you again because there are several high profile cases ongoing and coming up. Thank you, Alison. So good to see you.
- [23:19]
C
My pleasure. Nice to see the both of you.
- [23:25]
A
This is an I heart podcast. Guaranteed human.