“I’m Afraid” Kouri Richins’ Sons Ask Judge To Send Mom To Prison For Life

Summary

Podcast Summary:

Amy Robach & T.J. Holmes Present
Episode: “I’m Afraid” – Kouri Richins’ Sons Ask Judge To Send Mom To Prison For Life
Date: May 13, 2026
Network: iHeartPodcasts

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Episode Overview

This episode deeply examines the shocking and emotional sentencing phase for Kouri Richins, a mother convicted of murdering her husband, Eric Richins, in 2022 by poisoning him. Hosts Amy Robach and T.J. Holmes break down the prosecution’s chilling 15-page sentencing memo, which includes statements from Kouri’s three sons pleading with the judge to keep their mother behind bars for life—reflecting their fear and trauma. The hosts analyze the profound psychological and emotional impact of the crime, the extraordinary conduct of Kouri before and after the murder, and the broader societal fascination with cases like this.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Prosecution’s Sentencing Memo & Its Tone

• The memo, given to the judge ahead of sentencing, is described by the hosts as reading “like a horror movie” (02:48).
• Prosecutors open the memo with a narrative emphasizing premeditation: Kouri not only attempted to kill her husband but, after failing the first time, tried again.
• “[It reads] like this is the worst woman you have ever met.” – Co-host (03:20)
• Crucially, the memo includes the voices of Kouri’s children, who explicitly state their fear and desire for their mother to be imprisoned for life.

2. The Children’s Devastating Statements

• The boys, now 13, 11, and 9, were 9, 7, and 5 at the time of their father's murder.
• The children's words are highlighted as raw, articulate, and devastating, showing a clarity of fear and lasting trauma:
  • Oldest son (13):
    • “I’m afraid if she gets out, she will come after me and my brothers, my whole family. … I do not miss Corey.” (09:30)
    • Hosts note the child calls his mother by her first name, a telling and deliberate choice.
  • Middle son (11):
    • Refutes Kouri’s claim that she slept in his room the night of the murder, adding details about being locked out and the abnormal circumstances.
    • Reveals how the murder has changed his life and articulates his relief at his mother being in jail:
      • “With her in jail, I will be able to continue to feel safe and live a happy and successful life without fear of her hurting me or anyone I love.” (12:42)
  • Youngest son (9):
    • Even with fewer memories of his father, quotes show a sense of loss and fear:
      • “Once she is gone, I will feel happy and I will feel safer and relaxed and trust people more.” (13:43)

3. Kouri Richins’ Actions and Lack of Remorse

• Hosts detail Kouri’s repeated attempts to kill her husband, her post-murder actions (including writing and promoting a book about helping children grieve), and her absence of responsibility or apology.
• “She has never once accepted responsibility. She has never once apologized. She has never once even acknowledged any wrongdoing.” – T.J. (05:34)
• Public fascination is attributed to not just the shocking nature of the crime, but Kouri’s brazen efforts to profit from it and control the narrative.

4. Sociopathic Behaviors & Manipulation

• The hosts repeatedly reference Kouri’s “sociopathic” tendencies, not just in committing murder but in orchestrating campaigns to damage reputations, manipulate her own family, and even threaten officials.
• “It almost feels like mob-like tactics, like threatening and then even threatening after the conviction.” – T.J. (24:02)

5. Sentencing Recommendations and Rationale

• Prosecutors argue that a sentence should not only reflect the loss of Eric Richins, but also protect his sons for the duration of their lives.
• “She needs to serve the rest of her sons’ lives.” (25:19)
• The memo makes clear that if given the minimum, Kouri could be released while her sons are still young adults with families of their own, a prospect the boys themselves dread.

6. Notable Quotes and Memorable Moments

The Children’s Voices

• “I’m afraid if she gets out, she will come after me and my brothers, my whole family. … I do not miss Corey.” – Oldest son, read by T.J. (09:30)
• “With her in jail, I will be able to continue to feel safe and live a happy and successful life without fear of her hurting me or anyone I love.” – Middle son, 11 (12:42)
• “Once she is gone, I will feel happy and I will feel safer and relaxed and trust people more.” – Youngest son, 9 (13:43)

On Lack of Remorse

• “She has never once accepted responsibility. She has never once apologized. She has never once even acknowledged any wrongdoing.” – T.J. (05:34)

On Manipulation and Threats

• Kouri’s post-verdict text to an admirer:
  • “I will expose this county, the prosecution, the judge, the Richins, the investigation, all of it. … I am going to expose them all for what they have done to me. My kids, my family, this injustice. They picked the wrong one. They think sentencing is the end. Closure. It’s just the beginning. They haven’t seen anything yet.” – Read by T.J. (21:27)

On the Memo’s Impact

• “She needs to serve the rest of her sons’ lives.” – Co-host (25:19)
• “Why should they have to go to another court hearing to make sure she doesn’t get parole? Why do they have to go keep doing this their whole lives? That was compelling.” – T.J. (26:17)

On the Public and Media Fascination

• “When you add that extra element, you actually wonder who is this person who is capable of killing the husband with poison, then writing a book trying to help your kids and other kids deal with the grief of losing a parent. That’s just twisted.” – Co-host (06:30)

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Major Segment Timestamps

• [02:05] – Reading of sentencing memo’s opening and context for Kouri Richins case
• [04:03] – [05:34] – Discussion of the children’s statements and emotional impact
• [06:30] – [07:06] – Exploration of the public’s fascination and Kouri’s sociopathic behavior
• [09:18] – [13:43] – In-depth reading and analysis of the sons’ statements
• [14:21] – [15:47] – Additional examples of Kouri’s manipulations and aggressive tactics
• [19:12] – [23:49] – Reading and dissection of Kouri’s threatening messages from jail
• [24:33] – [26:17] – Final thoughts on sentencing and the lifelong impact on the boys

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Tone and Style

The discussion is unflinchingly direct, emotional, and analytical—balancing legal insight with visceral reactions to the children’s trauma and Kouri’s unrepentant conduct. Both hosts voice personal reactions of disbelief, anger, and sorrow, particularly when reading the children’s words.

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Summary

This episode provides a harrowing look at the effects of true crime extending beyond the victim to the surviving children, showcasing how legal documents and victim impact statements influence sentencing in a high-profile case. Ultimately, the most powerful point emerges from the children’s pleas: their ongoing safety and healing depend on their mother being kept behind bars—not just as punishment, but as protection. The episode closes with the hosts emphasizing the unprecedented and chilling nature of the case, and pointing to the judge’s monumental decision as a moment of justice not just for Eric Richins, but for his sons’ futures.

Transcript

[Amy Robach]

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[T.J. Holmes]

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[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

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[T.J. Holmes]

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[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

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[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

Hey there folks. It is Wednesday, May 13, and Corey Richards murdered her husband in the presence of their children, using poison and for money. Such a person should never again lurk among the rest of us. Her children should never worry that they may one day encounter her. The the court should impose a sentence of life in prison without parole. Corey Richards has earned it. Her children deserve it. And with that, welcome to this episode of Amy and TJ Rose. Just reading an excerpt from the sentencing memo of prosecutors who want Corey Richards, this now convicted mom, to go to prison for the rest of her life in robes. They were just getting Started with that.

[T.J. Holmes]

Yeah. This is a 15 page memo that was given to the judge ahead of Corey Richen's sentencing which is scheduled for later this afternoon. It's 9:30 Mountain Time, 11:30 Eastern Time. And it reads like a horror movie to be honest. We obviously watched and so many of you listened along with us to the evidence that was presented during trial and it was incredibly damning. But when you actually read what prosecutors lay out for the judge for sentencing, it takes it to a whole other level.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

Rose, they said they started out like this, almost felt personal to a certain and it wasn't. But they were just making more of a narrative and a point here than I think even so during the trial. But they start out at the top about the attempt. Right. She attempted to kill him. And you know what? She didn't go back and give some thought. She went and said, you know what? How can I do better? They started out the whole briefing that way and it reads absolutely like this is the worst woman you have ever met. And robes I guess what will jump out as maybe the most damning and damaging and it has to be hurtful to her. Her young sons contributed to this memo. They don't want to see their mom, it sounds like ever again.

[T.J. Holmes]

You know what that was to me? Look, anyone listening who's a mom? We the no matter who you are. I feel like most moms, no matter what you've done wrong, right, whatever. You never want your kids to think poorly of you. And certainly the idea that these three kids in unison not only think poorly of their mom, they're afraid of their mom. They are begging the judge not to ever let her out during their lifetime. This is significant. And they're young to think that these young boys are able to articulate what they said to the judge the way they did. They're now 13, 11 and 9. And to to read and hear their words, it is beyond impactful. And frankly I was just, I was impressed with how they put things and where they, how they express their feelings.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

What did you say? 13, 11, 9. So that put them at 9, 7 and 5 when their dad was dead, was killed. And one of them, the little one, they even made a point in there that he doesn't have the same memories of mom and dad at the older two will have. But still he had comments. We'll let you hear those. But Rhodes, they make a point. Corey Richards took the dad and the mom away from these kids. That's something we always talk about Rhodes in these cases and we've seen Some cases where sometimes it's a little older kids, but they will beg the judge, yep, he killed my mom or whatever it may be, but please, this is the only parent I got left. Can you spare the life? This ain't that.

[T.J. Holmes]

That's not the case in this situation at all. And look, oftentimes, not that there's ever a justification for murder a spouse or taking a child's parent away from them, but a lot of times they are motivated by love or by wanting to have the kids away from the other parent. This was purely greed, it sounds like. And to use your children even in the way she did, by writing a book to make her look sympathetic, to care for her children who are grieving their father, knowing all, well, all the time that she was the reason why her children were grieving their father, she was the reason why they were in pain. That just shows you a little insight into her psyche and where her lack of empathy, her lack of responsibility. And they talked about that. She has never once accepted responsibility. She has never once apologized. She has never once even acknowledged any wrongdoing.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

It's twisted robes. And that was the thing that one of the reasons that this did make such headlines, when you talk about a spouse killing another over money and she had a boyfriend, right. All those things come together for and make, look, we've seen that snapped episode before kind of a thing. But when you add that extra element, you actually wonder who is this person who is capable of killing the husband with poison, then writing a book trying to help your kids and other kids deal with the grief of losing a parent. That's just twisted robes. And it's not something we can understand. And I think that's. No, that is a big part of the reason this was such a public fascination.

[T.J. Holmes]

Yeah, this is sociopathic. There's no other way to put it. And we know from science, from psychologists that they exist and they walk among us and they look like us and they could be our neighbors and you could be sleeping next to one. And it's really scary the moment they don't get what they want or they want something that they think they can only have and they'll do whatever it takes to get it without any guilt, without any compassion, without any empathy, without suffering.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

And they absolutely made that point throughout this 15 page memo. Get you caught up. We are a couple of hours away as of this recording of seeing her in court today. Corey Richards for the 2022 killing of her husband, Eric Richards. He poisoned his drink, Moscow Mule with Fentanyl. Now she had tried what was a week, couple weeks ahead of before this.

[T.J. Holmes]

It was Valentine's Day. So a couple weeks before with the sandwich. And in this sentencing memo, they acknowledged there was a time in Greece, they believe, where she tried to poison him there again in 2019. So they're talking about repeated attempts of trying to kill her husband.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

So this was a few months ago. We watched this trial. It was expected to go a little long, but it was shortened because she did not testify. Not only that, that's expected for the most part with a defendant. But, Rose, we were. We might have actually had popcorn and drinks ready. We were waiting for the defense to put on their case, and then, lo and behold, they shocked the hell out of all of us.

[T.J. Holmes]

Yeah. They decided that the prosecution, or at least in their guesstimation, they chose to put not one single witness up in her defense as a way to say to the world, and maybe to the jury that, hey, yeah, the prosecution didn't prove its case. We don't need to say a word.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

That might not have been the right call. Given that she was found guilty on all accounts, I do believe all counts that were against her, including the murder charge. So this moves us now to today. What's on the table. There are smaller charges. I don't know how deep you want to get into those, but of course, the murder is the one we're talking about. This is the one. 25 to life. And the prosecution is asking for her to spend life in prison. They do get into why. Where do you want to start? With the kids. Because they only refer to them with initials. But they have comments, direct quotes from the kids in there making a plea to the judge about how they feel about what he should do with sentences.

[T.J. Holmes]

Yeah. We can start with the oldest, who's 13 now, who is 9 at the time of the murder. And yes, we just get their initials, but they made note that he wears his father's clothes to school.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

That was a tough thing to read. That was a tough one to read.

[T.J. Holmes]

It stood out to me for certain, for sure. And then they wanted the judge to know that he does not miss his mom. I think this is so interesting. The quote is, I'm afraid if she gets out, she will come after me and my brothers, my whole family. I think she would come and take us and not do good things to us, like hurt us. I miss my dad, but I do not miss the way my life used to be. I don't miss Corey. I will tell you that his was.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

Of the three, we're gonna Let you hear what all kids said. But ropes that to call his mom Corey was, it was deliberate. That's a big deal.

[T.J. Holmes]

And just. Yes. And you know you have a 13 year old. This is a fully formed human who knows exactly what he thinks, what he feels he remembers the most out of any of them. And so that was telling.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

That's gutting. Robes to think I, I'm fearful of my mother. The person that raised me. I don't know what their relationship was ahead of this but the murder was back in 2022. So these kids have been sitting, been sitting with it for years.

[T.J. Holmes]

Yeah.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

Now. And they've been watching all this stuff and they've been going to school and being around people and Ropes their life's been hell.

[T.J. Holmes]

It's. It's on. Is unthinkable. I, I don't know how you felt. We haven't discussed this because we read the, the memos separately. But the one that stood out the most to me was from the 11, the now 11 year old who was 7 at the time of the murder. He was the middle child. He gave a lot of context and did a lot of refuting of Corey Richardson's version of what happened the night his father died. I thought it was fascinating because he was the one that she claimed she slept with that night. The night Eric Richards died.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

And this did not become a big part of the trial. The comment you made did. But they didn't go examine it because they would have had to call the kid to the stand and they didn't want to do that. And they mentioned this in the memo Robes like just to show the viciousness, viciousness of this woman. You put your son in a position, you're going to lie and put him in a position to have to come be a part of all this foolishness. And yeah this, his comments were one thing but the prosecution explaining that whole story of that night. If I'd have heard that during trial I. Wow.

[T.J. Holmes]

Yeah. And they didn't put it out in trial. I think that's such a good point to not put him in the middle of it. But no, in this sentencing memo they put it very clearly that the 11 year old, seven at the time refuted his mom's claim that she slept in his bedroom with him that night and said actually he remembers it because it was so unusual. He didn't get a bath like he usually does. His parents bedroom was locked. He said there was loud music or a television blaring from inside which was unusual. And she said he said that his mother yelled at him to go away when he was using a broom to try and reach a key to their bedroom because he wanted to get inside.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

So the key was up high so the kids couldn't reach it. So seven year old, hey, smart enough. He knew how to do this. Robes. Those two things are crazy to me as a parent. Locking the kid out is a little odd to me, is it not? Yes, folks don't do that. And what parents sends a seven year old boy to bed without a bath?

[T.J. Holmes]

Yeah. Ooh, that's something. I didn't even consider it in that way. Yes. And he even said his five year old brother who almost always ended up sleeping in the bed with his parents ended up having to crawl into bed with him because he, he couldn't get into his parents room because it was locked. But I thought of what he said about his dad. It literally I started to cr. Cry. He said this to the judge. My dad can't be my coach anymore and can't be at any of my games. He won't be at my birthdays. He can't teach me how to drive. He won't be at my graduation. Oh, and he said that he would feel unsafe if his mom wasn't in prison. He said with her in jail, I will be able to continue to feel safe and live a happy and successful life without fear of her hurting me or anyone I love.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

You know, just be direct. They, they kids don't have as, as big of a vocabulary but they can tell you exactly. We talk about kids all the time speaking bluntly like they have no filter. This is just direct. And this sounds like it came directly from this kid and nobody had to write it for him.

[T.J. Holmes]

Yeah. And then look the, the nine year old now who was five at the time of the murder. We said he doesn't remember a lot of things but I was impressed with even how he expressed himself. He says he feels hateful and ashamed when people talk about his mom because she took away his dad. And he said he would be so scared if his mother got out of prison. And his quote was, once she is gone, I will feel happy and I will feel safer and relaxed and trust people more. My God, the damage that was done to these poor kids is just, it's immeasurable.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

Man robes and the thing goes through and it, there is example after example after example of how she has gone about behind the scenes and done damage to the Richens family. How she has sued, how she even one point physically attacked someone, throat punched Eric's sister.

[T.J. Holmes]

Two days after his murder because of issue over money.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

Right. She found out about the trust, something she didn't like. Rose, they have more. I learned more and more in this thing. I came out of this with a more negative feeling about her than I did in the damn trial.

[T.J. Holmes]

It's hard to even look at her now after reading all of this.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

It's tough to read and to think about some of the smirking and the laughing she was doing in court to add this to what this thing is, oh, we don't know this woman. And God bless. I don't know what's going on with her and her soul and her life and I don't know. But this is just, this is one of the toughest, I think, because of the kids, because of the manipulation and the way she was able to find function in society. You keep using that word, sociopath. How was she able to do?

[T.J. Holmes]

She wrote a book and profited off

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

of it, promoted it, got on TV and sat and talked. And yes, my book. Who can do that?

[T.J. Holmes]

Ro yeah, apparently Corey Richards. But when we come back, wait until you hear as a part of this memo, the sentencing memo prosecutors put in for the judge to read Corey Rich and text to an admirer where she threatens everybody from the judge himself to the prosecution to the Richens family. You'll understand beyond just this murder conviction why Corey Richards sons are so scared of her. If you're always on the lookout for a great audiobook or just want help figuring out what to listen to next, there's a podcast you should know about.

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[T.J. Holmes]

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[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

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[T.J. Holmes]

Welcome back everyone to this episode of Amy and tj. We are talking about what is likely to be some compelling, compelling, I don't know if it's testimony, but just victim impact statements that we're expecting later today in the Corey Rich and sentencing hearing. But before we even get to court later on today, we have been able, able to read what prosecutors have handed over to the judge to consider before making his sentencing ruling. And among what we got in this 15 page sentencing memo is a text that Corey Rich Richards sent to an admirer. That's all they say what they're calling

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

it, but that's all they're suggesting. There's no name. So this might just be a random person who was texting or somebody she actually knew. A fan, if you will, from. We know that happens a lot.

[T.J. Holmes]

Look, it's weird, but a lot of times people who get basically they become famous because their trial has been televised and people take sides and there are always people who believe the convicted are innocent and rally to their side. And help people get married after they've been convicted of heinous things.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

What's the one? The United Health Care shooter guy that everybody's swooning over.

[T.J. Holmes]

They think he's just. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Luigi Mangione. He's got. I'm sure, however many done stories on that.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

Yeah. People think he's. Because he's young, seemingly good looking guy. And they're rallying around him because of that. And he is getting courted. So anyway, we've seen this happen. So this might be one of those situations that the only way they put it. An admirer. Now ropes. We're gonna let everybody hear this. I'm gonna read this to you, Robes. I don't know what she was thinking, but I mean, the judge isn't supposed to take any of this personally. But he might take this personally.

[T.J. Holmes]

It's hard not to take it personally. And she has to know. She obviously know. Text messages, any correspondence she has, any phone calls, they're all recorded and documented.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

Well, why in the world would she write this down? I don't know.

[T.J. Holmes]

All right, here's her text from Corey Richards. After she was convicted. I believe this was when she put this out.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

What they say. How, oh, for. When was this? How long after the conviction? They said six weeks.

[T.J. Holmes]

Six weeks after she was convicted.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

Six weeks after the guilty verdict, she sent this text message.

[T.J. Holmes]

I will. And will is in all caps. I will expose this county, the prosecution, the judge, the Richens, the investigation, all of it. So they can lock me away? For now, that's fine. It's going to come back on them. It will come to an end. Not this year or next. But I'm not going away. I won't be silent. I am going to expose them all for what they have done to me. My kids, my family, this injustice. They picked the wrong one. They think sentencing is the end. Closure. It's just the beginning. They haven't seen anything yet.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

Okay, I'm reading it differently now. Does she want that to get out?

[T.J. Holmes]

Yes, you're right. Of course she did.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

I'm looking and seeing it differently.

[T.J. Holmes]

Of course she did. Right, of course. I didn't even think about it like that. But that is. Yes. She wants them to be afraid of her because it's worked for her up until now.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

Power has worked, a facade has worked. She always wants to exude strength or success. Is that mean? They laid that out in court, but here, once again, she wants to be in control.

[Stefano Pallard]

Yes.

[T.J. Holmes]

And living beyond her means was part of the reason why she got into financial trouble because she was putting on this show of wealth and power and success as a real estate agent. I just, I was actually. I know you were probably sickened by some of the other bits that prosecutors added in that. Just looking at some of her correspondence with her family as she was awaiting trial, calling it open season on Eric the dead. And this was like a campaign to damage his reputation. They just talked about how not only did she murder him, but then in the COVID up or at least in preparing for trial, she was getting her family members and people to talk about an affair he didn't have, but she claimed he did. A homosexual relationship he didn't have with his best friend. The throat punch to Eric's sister. The walk the dog letter where she wrote to her mom, bring me home and then we'll get those damn bitches.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

Yes.

[T.J. Holmes]

Referring to family members of Eric, she said she got family members to file unfounded complaints against the Summit county attorney, the chief prosecutor.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

She tried to get them disbarred. This was for real.

[T.J. Holmes]

And even posted a gay dating profile of the leading detective to try and humiliate him.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

Hell, some people say it's. You got to do it in prison. Right? Diddy was all over that before his trial and during the trial trying to handle the public messaging. Guess that's what she was trying to do. But Robes, to see it all laid out here in one 15 page document, it's a hell of a read.

[T.J. Holmes]

It almost feels like mob like tactics like threatening and then even threatening after the conviction. I just, I mean, I guess she's prepared for prison life because she's acting like, you know, she's the. She's the boss. She's the one in charge. Maybe I. It's scary, scary behavior. It's the opposite of someone who is repentive or even has any concept of what she's actually up against. It's delusional.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

The defendant cannot check her ambition.

[T.J. Holmes]

Wow.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

Or her sense of entitlement when confronted. She lies. When she feels aggravated, she attacks. And she certainly feels aggravated. She always has. They wrote that. I mean that's a calm not so personal. But if you stack up, that's the conclusion you come to. If once you read all these things about her. No, we don't know her personally but Robes, these things are stacking up that make it hard to argue with what they are saying. I thought I. Look, Robes, I don't know. Look, the judge is going to do his thing. 25 day life is what he's considering. The argument the prosecutors made. I know you saw in there that she shouldn't just serve the rest of her life, she needs to serve the rest of her son's lives.

[T.J. Holmes]

I thought that was so compelling.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

Robes.

[Geico Ad Voice (continuation)]

Damn.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

That. That was well said. I've never, I've seen some sentencing memos, plenty. That was laid out in such a way that I thought was incredible. That that hit me and I was like, wow, damn. Okay, I'm on board.

[T.J. Holmes]

They made the point that if she were only given 25 years, she would be out at 57. I think they did the math and they were saying the boys ages would be. They'd be in their 30s.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

Sweet spot for families and marriage and all this stuff, right?

[T.J. Holmes]

Yep. With likely with families of their own. How safe would they feel? How safe would they feel for their wives, their children? They wouldn't. And that's why they wanted to make this point. She cannot get out while her sons are still alive.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

That was compelling. I don't know what Joe. I mean, he's a judge. He actually has some leeway. Robes. He has to follow certain guidelines, but he absolutely can do what he wants to think something like that. That was the. As a judge, if I was. That is the most compelling thing I heard in the 15 pages.

[T.J. Holmes]

Agreed.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

Hey, damn. Why should they have to go to another court hearing to make sure she doesn't get parole? Why do they have to go keep doing this their whole lives? That was compelling.

[T.J. Holmes]

It really was. And so obviously we're expecting more compelling words to come from the family members of Eric Richards. By the way, today would have been his 44th birthday. And so you can only imagine the emotions that adds to an already emotional day today in court. So we will of course bring you all the latest that happens from that Utah courtroom. But in the meantime, we always appreciate you listening to us. Everyone, I'm Amy Robach alongside T.J. holmes. We will talk to you soon. If audiobooks are your thing or you've been meaning to listen to more of them, you should check out a podcast called Earsay, the Audible and iHeart Audiobook Club.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

Hosted by Cal Penn, each episode spotlights standout audiobooks on Audible across all kinds of genres. Sci fi, comedy, romance, thrillers and more. With Cal talking to guests who help break down what makes each story worth listening to.

[T.J. Holmes]

It's a fun, easy way to discover your next great audiobook.

[Co-host (possibly a legal analyst or commentator)]

Check out Earsay on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

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