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- [00:00]
A
This is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human. It's an Olympics you'll never forget. Prime Time in Milan the Moments Chloe.
- [00:12]
B
Kim with the gold medal Flex the.
- [00:14]
C
Stars Ilya Malinin out of this World.
- [00:19]
A
The spectacle from beautiful northern Italy with very special guests every night of the olympics. Experience the world's biggest show primetime in Milan Ton 87 Central on NBC and.
- [00:34]
D
Peacock this is David Eagleman from the Inner Cosmos podcast. As a neuroscientist, I think a lot about how our brains shape our experience of reality and how easily we get pulled into mental habits that we don't even notice. This plays out every day in how we respond to stress and information overload and the constant demands of our attention. That's why I use the Waking up app from Sam Harris. It brings together meditation and neuroscience and philosophy to help you see what your mind is doing in real time. We can't escape our thoughts, but we can understand them to respond with more patience and clarity. The practices in the app are easy to fit into a busy routine and they support a steadier, healthier mind. If you're ready to train the mind that's behind everything you do, you can unlock Waking UP free for 30 days@wakingup.com.
- [01:29]
C
InnerCosmos support for the show comes from Public, the investing platform for those who take it seriously. On Public you can build a multi asset portfolio of stocks, bonds, options, crypto and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index. With AI. It all starts with your prompt. From renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over 20% year over year, you can literally type any prompt and put the AI to work. It screens thousands of stocks, builds a one of a kind index and lets you back test it against the S&P 500. Then you can invest in in a few clicks. Generated assets are like ETFs with infinite possibilities, completely customizable and based on your thesis, not someone else's. Go to public.com podcast and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.com podcast paid for by Public Investing Brokerage Services by Open to the Public Investing Inc. Member FINRA and SIPC Advisory Services by Public Advisors llc SEC Registered Advisor Generated Assets is an interactive analysis tool. Output is for informational purposes only and is not an investment recommendation or advice. Complete disclosures available at public.com disclosures here's.
- [02:32]
E
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- [03:09]
A
New year, new you.
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E
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B
Hey there, folks. It is Wednesday, February 18, and a highly anticipated and major update in the Guthrie case. A major update that turned out to be a major setback. Plus, the sheriff out in Arizona did a new round of media interviews yesterday and gave several interesting and even confusing updates. Welcome to this episode of Amy and TJ Robes. Major setback in that this was a highly anticipated result. We were waiting on DNA from the gloves. We got that back.
- [04:08]
A
Yes. And it did not match that DNA did not match any known suspect in this federal or I guess this national database of folks who have been processed through our judicial system. So they did not lead to any conclusive suspect.
- [04:27]
B
And again, this is in Robes. As far as leads go, as major leads go, haven't been a whole lot. At least they've shared with us. But it doesn't seem like they have a whole lot. When you sit and talk to the sheriff, he doesn't seem confident and whatnot. This was a big deal because what. The gloves, they said match the gloves that the suspect has on in that ring camera. So this could be the suspect's gloves. And. Wow, there's DNA in those gloves. It was just there were high hopes that this could lead to something.
- [04:55]
A
Correct. There were expectations that perhaps this could be the smoking gun or this could be the thing that leads us directly to Nancy Guthrie or at least find the person who took her. The other thing that was a little confusing to me. Well, we'll get into a lot of the confusion. But the DNA that was found in the gloves is not the same DNA that was found inside the Guthrie home, Correct?
- [05:20]
B
Yeah. So there's another set of DNA apparently, that was found inside the house. And that is where some confusion lies that we'll get into. A couple of updates from the sheriff, we'll get into as well. This idea of a proof of life that the family has been asking for. Well, he did bring that up in relation to also a proof of death. We'll explain that. Also, he talked about this being. Yes, this phrase came up. Cold case. Explain what he was saying there. And yes, robes, they might have to turn to, not necessarily law enforcement, but maybe commercial companies to piece this together now with this DNA, with genealogy. Get your help in explaining that when we get into that. But let's go back to this. Gloves reminding folks this was a set of gloves that were found two miles away from the house. And ropes, these stood out. And it was kind of incredible to hear that they were finding so many sets of gloves as they were canvassing the area.
- [06:18]
A
More than a dozen, I believe, maybe the number 14. I. I read that that's how many pairs of gloves were strewn about on the radius around Guthrie's house. Most of them, they acknowledged, were from searchers who were wearing gloves looking for evidence. Hard to imagine that searchers, trained investigators would just throw their gloves on the ground in this beautiful pristine land that we have. But apparently they're litterers, too. So, anyway, there were gloves everywhere, but there was one pair that they said match within two miles of Nancy Guthrie's home. That matched. Appeared to match, I believe, was the phrase they used. The gloves that were seen on the suspect on Nancy Guthrie's front porch.
- [07:03]
B
That was a big deal. Of all the gloves you found, these stood out to you. All that was relevant. But robes. They find the gloves and then we get into some kind of. I don't even know how to explain it that well. But the DNA needed to be tested. What lab is it tested at? It got sent to Florida, but then they couldn't give some result because it had to come. What was this?
- [07:24]
A
It was some sort of law, I believe that is a state law, that there had to be an Arizona lab had to actually process the DNA. And so when. And the question was, why would the sheriff's department not know that? So why would they send it all the way to this lab in Florida and then only to have the Florida lab say, we can't give you the results, have to go then retest the DNA in an Arizona lab to then get the results we got yesterday, which were a big disappointment.
- [07:55]
B
And again, he, in some of his interviews, tried to explain why he had to do the process that way. Fine. But ultimately Nothing matched. And again, the CODIS system. What's the acronym here? Combined DNA Index System. You hear it all the time. Certainly if you watch true crime or if you just watch a lot of fictional TV and crime dramas, they use codis. Codis, codis. You watch any trials, you'll hear CODIS a lot of times. But this is the Combined DNA Index System is what it stands for. And it's just a database, a national database, as you said, rogues of DNA profiles of convicted folks. So the DNA, they have it, but they don't match it to anybody. But they have somebody's DNA on a.
- [08:41]
A
Pair of gloves that may or may not be connected to the Guthrie kidnapping.
- [08:45]
B
And there's the thing. We have to remember that, Robes, these gloves might have nothing to do with this.
- [08:52]
A
Somebody could have gotten hot while driving or they fell out of their pockets when they were cold at night walking around the desert. I don't know. It could have been a lot of different reasons why there were gloves there. The bigger issue, I would think, doesn't take an investigator to realize this, that that DNA inside the house that doesn't match Nancy Guthrie or any of her family members or close friends, that DNA would seemingly be a lot more important and potentially much more likely to actually be from the suspect.
- [09:27]
B
Well, it is more important. And the sheriff, in doing these interviews and explaining, or the disappointment of the DNA and the gloves not matching anything, he almost qualified those gloves. Now, he said, I'm much more concerned about what's in the house than I would be about some gloves two miles away. Fine. And we get that. But he was a little more dismissive of the gloves after they didn't have a hit.
- [09:49]
A
But makes sense.
- [09:50]
B
He was saying, the DNA in the house is critical. And this is where some confusion came in. I turn to you even listening to his interviews and saying, did they test the DNA? Did they tell us that they put that through codis? Because sure enough, in one of the interviews he did with someone, will you hear him clearly say that the DNA in the house, we may need to put that through CODIS later.
- [10:14]
A
Say what?
- [10:15]
B
He clearly says the DNA in the house has not been put into this DNA database to see if they get a match. But Robes, then we turn to another.
- [10:26]
A
Interview he did, and he said that it had been tested and that it was an unknown person. Correct.
- [10:35]
B
No match from the DNA in the house either. But again, he said something different to another reporter, so I'm sure they'll clear that up. Again, he has a lie coming at him. And Maybe he got an update in between interviews. Who knows? But he gave two different answers to that.
- [10:50]
A
My thought was that maybe he just misunderstood or he misspoke in terms of how he characterized the DNA from the house. Because you and I both looked at each other and said it wouldn't make any sense that investigators would have the DNA from the gloves tested, but not yet the DNA in the house tested, which they had before they even knew of the gloves. So they've had this DNA from the home almost from day one, it seems. They said within the first few days at least, of her disappearance. They said they, they had this DNA that was not Nancy Guthrie's inside the home. So we have known about this DNA for much longer than anything in the glove. So it would make zero sense that they hadn't tested that yet or hadn't processed that yet.
- [11:35]
B
So, yes, to your point, it may, may have just bespoke a little bit in that moment, but the DNA at this point has led to nothing. We will mention as well, Robes and a couple of reporters asked and the idea of this being a cold case, they don't seem to, in his interviews have a major lead right now that they're following. That video is key, and they're analyzing and whatnot. But they, it hasn't sent them in a particular direction. But the word, the phrase cold case, you don't want to hear, he explained, at least robes. And it makes sense. This case is not cold. It's only cold if you don't have a lead to follow. And they have literally thousands of leads to follow. They just don't have the one.
- [12:19]
A
Yes. And in spite of the fact that they had, I believe they said, was it 30, 40, 50,000, like, like crazy numbers of leads coming in. You still hear him on these rounds he made throughout the day yesterday with all of these reporters still asking for the public's help, still saying, hey, even if you think it's nothing, even if you think I don't want to bother them, even if you think, oh, they already have too many tips, I don't want flood their tip line, call us anyway. That's our job.
- [12:50]
B
That was funny you're bringing up making me at least remember he used a bizarre almost reference. He said, yeah, this person might call, and that's a tier one lead. And then there's somebody else who might have just had a dream last night about aliens abducting Nancy Guthrie. That's a level four lead. But if I tell you not to call, then somebody else who has a very important lead. Might call. He used a weird reference but he was saying we need everybody to call in and keep calling in. But Rose, that's the suggest they seem to not have a whole lot in this case, but we heard a few other updates from him that were they kind of make your ears perk up. Stay here. We'll tell you what he said about clearing the family and why he is still still convinced this was a kidnapping.
- [13:45]
A
It's a new year and time to get back to feeling like yourself. If losing weight is one of your 2026 goals and you're ready to make progress you can count on, then weight loss by hers might be the right fit for you. Through hers, you're connected with a medical provider who determines if treatment is right for you. If prescribed, your treatment plan is personalized to support you in reaching your goals. Plus you can access a range of treatment options like oral medication kits or or GLP1 injectables. Hers goes beyond medication by offering access to ongoing care, dosage and medication adjustments, lifestyle and nutrition tips and 247 support with no hidden costs or membership fees and with options Starting at just $69 per month with a 10 month plan when paid up front in full, hers provides access to options that fit your goals and your budget. Feel like your best self again? Visit forhers.com amy to get a personalized, affordable plan that gets you that's F O R h e r s.com amy fourhers.com Amy Weight loss by hers is not available everywhere. Compounded drug products are not approved or evaluated for safety, effectiveness or quality by the fda. Prescription required. See website for full details, important safety information and restrictions and actual price depends on product and plan purchased. It's an Olympics you'll never forget. Prime Time in Milan the Moments Chloe.
- [15:19]
B
Kim with the gold medal Flex the.
- [15:21]
C
Stars Ilya Malinin out of this World.
- [15:26]
A
The spectacle from beautiful northern Italy with very special guests Every night of the olympics, experience the world's biggest show, Prime Time in Milan tonight, 87 Central on NBC and Peacock.
- [15:42]
D
This is David Eagleman from the Inner Cosmos podcast. As a neuroscientist, I think a lot about how our brains shape our experience of reality and how easily we get pulled into mental habits that we don't even notice. This plays out every day in how we respond to stress and information overload and the constant demands of our attention. That's why I use the Waking up app from Sam Harris. It brings together meditation and neuroscience and philosophy to help you see what your mind is doing in real time. We can't escape our thoughts, but we can understand them to respond with more patience and clarity. The practices in the app are easy to fit into a busy routine, and they support a steadier, healthier mind. If you're ready to train the mind that's behind everything you do, you can unlock waking up through free for 30 days at wakingup.com innercosmos Support for the.
- [16:38]
C
Show comes from Public, the investing platform for those who take it seriously. On Public, you can build a multi asset portfolio of stocks, bonds, options, crypto and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index with AI. It all starts with your prompt. From renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over 20% year over year, you can literally type any prompt and put the AI to work. It screens thousands of stocks, builds a of a kind index and lets you back test it against the S&P 500. Then you can invest in a few clicks. Generated assets are like ETFs with infinite possibilities, completely customizable and based on your thesis, not someone else's. Go to public.com podcast and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.com podcast paid for by Public Investing Brokerage Services by Open to the Public Investing Inc. Member FINRA and SIPC Advisory Services by Public Advisors llc SEC Registered Advisor Generated Assets is an interactive analysis tool. Output is for informational purposes only and is not an investment recommendation or advice. Complete disclosures available at Public Disclosures.
- [17:44]
B
We continue here on this Wednesday morning here on Amy and TJ Robes. It's in some of the interviews we did yesterday and listening to the sheriff here talking about the Guthrie case. I don't know. I try not to interpret body language and the words being used sometimes but it he almost lacked a confidence to a certain degree when asked very specifically about it being an abduction very specifically about being a kidnapping. Do you still stand by and he used some words sometimes. Well I do. I, I that's. That's what I still believe. I I don't know what's going on here but he's giving us and you and I have had to make this decision on our podcast doing non update updates like he sits down for all these interviews for updates and you don't get really updates but this was a it was weird to listen to him doesn't he didn't sound that sure.
- [18:38]
A
I don't think he's ever sounded sure.
- [18:40]
B
Okay, well there you go.
- [18:41]
A
From the beginning I feel like that's Been a complaint you don't like. It's not as if he isn't. Let me put this the right way. No one is saying he isn't competent, but it's just that he makes it very clear that he is just as baffled as the rest of us.
- [19:03]
B
Damn. There it is. And I don't want that from my sheriff. Maybe that's what it is. Okay, that. That's a good. There you go. That's what I was looking for.
- [19:10]
A
You're like, dang. If he's that unsure, then, wow. What I'm feeling is absolutely fair. Like, you just want to think that they're at least going down the right path, and you're not sure that's the case when you're listening to him.
- [19:24]
B
You know what? Hot pursuit. That's what you want. They don't feel like they're in hot pursuit of this lady. And it's very important. I forgot to put this in our note there, Rose. But this is a very important note because of tmz. He did address at least the idea of what we're hearing about TMZ getting all these notes from someone who says they know who the kidnapper or kidnappers are. Said be prepared to go international and said they saw something south of the border.
- [19:50]
A
Yes.
- [19:51]
B
Well, he addressed this idea. He said they're. They have no reason to believe they're still doing in what they're doing in their search area. Said authorities are aware of those notes, but he suggested they're not actively pursuing anything south of the border.
- [20:07]
A
Yes. He didn't seem like Mexico was on the table. It didn't seem as though there was any active investigation into the credibility of whether or not Nancy Guthrie could be with an abductor or abductors in Mexico. He didn't acknowledge that at all. And you would think, unless they're protecting the investigation in some way, which could always be the case, but he absolutely, by what he said, did completely seem to dismiss that concept.
- [20:36]
B
What do you make of that? What do you. If that is the case, what do you. Then that means they are lending not a whole lot of credibility to these notes being sent to tmz.
- [20:44]
A
Yeah. And I'm curious why. Some. Just from the reporters that. That we watched and we saw, it didn't seem like they got specific about some of those things. Like the questions that I wanted to ask him. I didn't hear being asked by reporters specifically about the TMZ and the credibility and how seriously they're taking it. And have they actually been pursuing what this person who has written four emails.
- [21:08]
B
Now has claimed, sweetheart, okay, maybe we missed, maybe we didn't watch all the interviews and maybe haven't read every single article. But that, that's got to, that's a significant. Are we talking to legitimate players or not? That's a big deal. It seems like that's the biggest lead.
- [21:27]
A
It's the only thing that we know about, at least that has seemed to offer a direction for the investigation. And whether or not this person is just full of it or not would seem to be very important that you could decide pretty quickly. I saw someone online asking, with it being 2026 and all, how is it that we aren't able to trace these people sending these emails? How do we even getting bitcoin addresses and we know how to give them money, but we don't know who they are. That is shocking to a lot of folks with the technology we have that we are now like two weeks into it. We don't know who is sending emails repeatedly. Yes. Not even like letters with strange postmarks? No, these are emails that have IP addresses. So it's confusing.
- [22:15]
B
That is confusing to me. They can track down anybody, anywhere, it seems. That's a very good point, Robes. But if this swarth, that has got to be your biggest lead. Unless you have a reason for knowing it's not. You have somebody telling you they know who the kidnapper is. I saw them. I saw her. And that's not the biggest lead you have. He didn't. Wouldn't you even come out in front? No, no, I'm not going to speculate on that. But it doesn't seem like they are chasing that down publicly.
- [22:49]
A
Right. Or they don't want us to know they are. I mean, I always hold that to be possible as well. You never know. I thought it was really interesting when he was asked and I saw a very detailed, a very detailed report about how they cleared the Guthries. I thought this was interesting what was going on behind the scenes that didn't know as all of this speculation was going on about whether or not the brother in law and the sister who last saw Nancy Guthrie had anything to do with her disappearance. He talked about how all of the family members and their spouses had their home searched, had their vehicles searched, had their, their DNA extracted. They went through interrogations. He said these family members were treated as suspects basically and they now have been completely cleared and are deemed victims. But he was like just kind of going through the process of getting cleared. It's not an easy or a Comfortable situation, especially when speculation is swirling around you. So I just thought that was interesting people for people to take a step back and think about. While you're grieving the loss of your mother, not knowing where she is and fearing the worst, you now are also going through a fairly rigorous, rigorous process where you have to be cleared from actually being considered a suspect.
- [24:07]
B
And they did that immediately. And we all know that. And they did. I say we know that. Obviously That's Detective Work 101. They were all treated as suspects. I always great that he. Sorry for him to come out and say so definitively. He. I think he used the phrase 100%.
- [24:23]
A
Yes, he did.
- [24:24]
B
100% cleared. And just I, I did appreciate that. Hey, this is the timing of. He didn't have to do this. He chose to put that statement out to say get off the backs of the family. Did we ever hear from Ashley Banfield? Did you say anything I. Regarding this? I did not.
- [24:40]
A
I did not in any major way.
- [24:43]
B
Okay, we can do that at another time. The last thing here, the genealogy robes what other case. We were watching something or. But they're able to now the 23andMe type folks can take DNA. Actually, everybody's familiar with this.
- [24:57]
A
Yes.
- [24:57]
B
At this point, you put your DNA in there and all of a sudden you start finding relatives with DNA match. That's what they're trying to possibly do now.
- [25:04]
A
Yeah. I got a new second cousin just yesterday in an email alert. So look this. Yes, we all. Anyone who has gone on. No, I didn't see that. No. But yes. So you. If they. Even if the person, the suspect didn't join 23andMe or whatever genealogy website you prefer, one of his relatives likely has. So you're talking. It could be anything from a, you know, a random cousin to a direct descendant to a sibling. But they can find someone who is related to this DNA and literally go through a family tree and figure out who the suspect or at least narrow it down quite significantly as to who this possibly could be. And there have been plenty of cases. We were just talking, I believe yesterday about a true crime story. We were watching. This is happening more and more and more folks go on to 23andMe. And even if you didn't, one of your relatives did, you can and will be likely found.
- [26:02]
B
I've seen true crime episodes about this where they could narrow it down. Okay, the killer is one of these five guys. And they just went and found those five guys and started narrowing it down. So it could be helpful. We'll keep an eye. Again, no press briefings per usual with this case. So he said you won't do another press conference unless there was a major update. He decided to do a round of interviews in which we got little nuggets rolled. So we haven't gotten the big break yet.
- [26:28]
A
Yet we have not. But we will continue, of course, to follow this story closely. It's just shocking that we're now in the middle of week three and still doesn't seem like we're any closer than we were on February 1st. But my goodness, we can only hope that investigators get that break they're looking for and you can make sure we will be on top of it for you. In the meantime, though, everybody, thank you for listening as always. I'm Amy Robach alongside T.J. holmes. We will talk to you soon.
- [26:59]
B
Foreign.
- [27:07]
D
This is David Eagleman with Inner Cosmos. I've spent my life studying the brain and one thing is obvious. Most of us surf along on our stream of thoughts and we never think to examine the waters. That's what I appreciate about the Waking up app from Sam Harris. You may know that it'll teach you meditation, but it's bigger than that. It's structured mental training that'll help you understand things like your attention and your emotions and the patterns that drive your reactions. We all spend a lot of time trying to explain everything around us, but we don't spend as much time trying to understand ourselves. Let's take some moments to turn the camera inward. You'll be surprised by what you find. Try the full app free for 30 days@wakingup.com innercosmos this is Bethenny Frankel from.
- [27:56]
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