Police Looking For A Second Person In Brown University Mass Shooting… But He’s NOT A Suspect!

Summary

Podcast Summary: Amy Robach & T.J. Holmes Present

Episode: Police Looking For A Second Person In Brown University Mass Shooting… But He’s NOT A Suspect!

Release Date: December 18, 2025
Hosts: Amy Robach & T.J. Holmes

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Main Theme

This episode offers a breaking update on the ongoing investigation into the Brown University mass shooting. Amy and T.J. analyze a recent press conference by Providence authorities, highlighting the unusual nature of their search for a second individual who is not a suspect but may have interacted with the actual shooter. The hosts explore the desperation behind the investigation, the challenges posed by misinformation, and the palpable community anxiety resulting from the lack of progress in the case.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Unusual Turn in the Investigation

• Police now seek two people:
  Police are still searching for the actual shooter, but they're also looking for someone who merely crossed paths or may have interacted with the suspect.
• Comical but telling press coverage:
  Amy and T.J. note the absurdity of a TV chyron reading: “Police search for person who may have crossed paths with person of interest.”
  • Amy Robach (03:22): “It seemed nonsensical and almost ridiculous. Lower third or chyron on the bottom of the screen … pretty much sums up what we got from the actual press conference itself.”
  • TJ Holmes (03:44): “I’ve never quite seen anything like this.”

2. Press Conference Analysis

• Police Face Desperation:
  The authorities lack useful information, having erroneously identified and released two prior persons of interest.
  • Amy Robach (04:19): "It's telling in that it seems as though they have nothing and they're desperate to even find somebody who crossed paths with their person of interest."
• Heavily Reliant on Public’s Help:
  Police call for the public’s help to identify the bystander captured on video, hoping he might recall a detail about the suspect.
  • Social media confusion: Police caution the public about fake, AI-generated images circulating online, adding to investigation confusion.
• Details Released About the Suspect:
  • Suspect described as “stocky,” with a "strange walking gait," seen wearing all black and a black Covid-style mask covering his face, making visual identification difficult.
    • Amy Robach (06:04): “The shooter had a mask over his face … you cannot tell what his face looks like. You just can't.”
    • TJ Holmes (17:51): “What's the one thing we know about them?”
    • Amy Robach (17:51): “Stocky.”
  • Video coverage pieced together the suspect’s presence in the area from 10 AM until the 4 PM shooting, suggesting he may have been casing the campus.

3. Investigation Setbacks

• Wasted Initial 24 Hours:
  Misidentification in early hours—investigators believed they had the shooter in custody and focused resources in the wrong direction.
  • TJ Holmes (06:55): “They lost 24 hours. They had somebody in custody … So in all of this time, you're looking in the wrong direction.”
• Repeated Mistakes by Officials:
  Cash Patel, mentioned as an FBI official, already made a similar error during a previous case, hastily announcing a suspect in custody.
  • Amy Robach (18:25): “There's a rush to say we got him, we got our guy, we want the one ... but also we want to say we did our job.”
  • Rhode Island’s Attorney General publicly criticized Patel for spreading inaccurate information and lacking investigative experience.
    • Amy Robach (19:08): “The attorney general … basically saying that Cash Patel does not have any sort of experience in policing and investigations.”

4. Impact on Community & Student Safety

• Widespread Fear and Distrust:
  The community is shaken, with parents questioning whether to send their children back to Brown University amid an ongoing manhunt.
  • Amy Robach (12:54): “No way I would [send my child back]. ... If there was an active shooter on the run, a manhunt underway—you think I want to send my kid back to that campus? Absolutely not.”
• Broken Confidence in Authorities:
  Early, incorrect reassurances and current uncertainty have eroded community trust.
  • Amy Robach (11:44): “So now that trust has been completely eroded. And so you cannot tell me that I'm safe.”
• Comparison to DC Sniper Case:
  Amy draws parallels with the fear during the DC sniper shootings.
  • Amy Robach (22:26): “I was living in Washington, D.C. … when the serial snipers were out. Let me tell you, we lived in fear for three weeks.”

5. Misinformation and Inter-Agency Tensions

• Authenticity and Trust Issues:
  Public figures disseminating unverified claims—especially via social media—compound confusion.
  • TJ Holmes (21:00): “If you can't trust … the head of the FBI … who am I supposed to go check with? These are the ultimate sources.”
• Need for Unity:
  T.J. and Amy argue that public squabbles between agencies harm the investigation and public confidence.
  • TJ Holmes (20:10): “We don't need that right now. We have got to see them … standing next to each other in a press conference very soon.”
  • Amy Robach (20:26): “…you can't unsay it. And he said it publicly … when you need to have all the help you can get trying to catch this guy.”

6. Condition of Shooting Victims

• Positive Update:
  Most hospitalized victims have been upgraded to stable condition, with three already discharged. One remains in critical but stable condition.
  • Amy Robach (24:15): “They only now have one survivor who's still in critical but stable condition. Five others … have been upgraded to stable condition … the other three have already been released from the hospital.”

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Desperation of Investigation:
  • "It's telling in that it seems as though they have nothing and they're desperate to even find somebody who crossed paths with their person of interest."
    — Amy Robach, 04:19
• On the Press Conference:
  • "It was a reverse press conference. Can you give us information? Because we have none to give to you."
    — Amy Robach, 09:08
• On Public Confidence:
  • "Nothing about it today made you feel good."
    — TJ Holmes, 11:44
• On Sending Kids Back to Campus:
  • "No way I would [send my child]."
    — Amy Robach, 12:54
• On Inter-Agency Conflict:
  • "But when he said it, he came all, he's pissed."
    — TJ Holmes, 19:45
• On Community Fear:
  • "It's really scary when you know someone who's been willing to kill at random and is still on the run, that is scary."
    — Amy Robach, 22:26

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• [02:46] Start of Brown University shooting discussion
• [03:22] Media’s handling of the press conference
• [06:03] Physical description of the shooter
• [06:55] Analysis of lost investigative time
• [08:15] Surveillance footage and appeal for video evidence
• [09:08] “Reverse press conference” - police plea for public info
• [12:40] Community anxiety and school closure discussion
• [13:16] Comparison to previous mass shooting investigations
• [17:14] Reiteration of police seeking a non-suspect witness
• [18:25] Critique of Cash Patel and official information mishandling
• [19:08] Attorney General’s public criticism of Patel
• [21:00] Hosts discuss the implications of misinformation from authorities
• [24:15] Health updates on the mass shooting victims

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Tone and Language

• Conversational and candid, often direct in expressing frustrations about official communication and investigative shortcomings.
• Mix of empathy (for students and community), professional skepticism towards official sources, and dark humor about the “absurdity” of certain media coverage or statements.

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Summary

Amy and T.J. provide a vivid, critical, and empathetic view into the spiraling Brown University shooting investigation. They highlight the sense of desperation among authorities, the confusion sown by misinformation (especially from high-profile figures), and the community’s deepening anxiety. Despite the grim state of the hunt for the suspect, they close with the hopeful news that most victims are recovering, stressing their commitment to ongoing updates as the story develops.

Transcript

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[TJ Holmes]

Hey there folks. It is Wednesday, December 17th. A breaking update about the Brown University shooting. Police are now not looking for one, but two people, but only one of them is involved in the shooting. We'll explain. All right, so welcome to this episode of Amy and TJ Robes. We just watched a press conference that was. You know what? We don't live in Providence. And this made us uncomfortable. They are really have to be unnerved there now. But, yes, police are looking for somebody who might have talked to the. Somebody they ultimately want to arrest.

[Amy Robach]

Yes. This news conference came after we actually were walking by the TV and saw. I don't know if we want to call out the network with one of the most hilarious. I say hilarious because it seemed nonsensical and almost ridiculous. Lower third or chiron on the bottom of the screen. And it pretty much sums up what we got from. From the actual press conference itself. I know you took a picture of it.

[TJ Holmes]

Yeah, because we. We've been in this business a long time, and I've never quite seen anything like this. The. And it said, police. Police search for person who may have crossed paths with person of interest. I have not seen that before. And that is what we're talking about, folks. And, sweetheart, this gives us. Sorry I threw in, sweetheart, for some reason. I'm sorry, this is not where we are. We're talking to you here in our home and recording. I guess I got a little comfortable. What I'm saying. This says so much, does it not, about where they are in this investigation. And it might not be very far along.

[Amy Robach]

It's. It's telling in that it seems as though they have nothing and they're desperate to even find somebody who crossed paths with their person of interest. And so they actually have this guy's face up. They zoomed in on his face. They had him on several screens. They also had to tell people, please don't go by what you're seeing on social media because people are making up fake AI versions of persons of interest, of people and faces. So it's super confusing. So very important. Yeah. And they want the public's help. They need the public's help. And so they're asking people to take a look at this photo. Maybe the person recognizes himself. Maybe someone says, hey, that's my brother, my boyfriend, my son, whatever, so that they can talk to him to see if he remembers anything distinguishing about the person of interest. They think he may have even had a small conversation with the person of interest. They don't know. But it's at that point now where they're begging to find somebody who might know something about the person they're actually looking for.

[TJ Holmes]

The shooter may be the most wanted man in America right now. This other person might be the second most wanted. Not for a crime. Let's Be clear here. They do not believe this other person is any way connected to the shooting. At least that's what they're telling us right now. But they say there is some interaction that they believe took place between the shooter and this person to where they're putting out this alert. Robes. I've never quite seen anything like this. They focused more in this press conference on this bystander than they did on.

[Amy Robach]

The actual shooter because they don't have any information on. On the shooter. The shooter was wearing all black.

[TJ Holmes]

A mask?

[Amy Robach]

Yeah, the shooter had a mask over his face, like a black Covid like mask. You cannot tell what his face looks like. You just can't. So they have been forced to say he's stocky, he has a strange walking gait. But other than that, that depicts so many people that there's no way you could even narrow down your search with the limited information they have on this person of interest. And it was very clear in this press conference that they're desperate. This is day five. This is the fifth day of the manhunt for this Brown University shooter, and they have already brought in two persons of interest and released them. They errantly said they had the guy twice now and have had to take it back. And now it seems as though they're back to square one. Like they're literally saying, what else can we do?

[TJ Holmes]

And every investigator and analyst you will see on TV are giving you any. Any opinion will tell you that first they lost 24 hours. They had somebody in custody. That means we think we got our guy. So we're not out there searching for any. So in all of this time, you're looking in the wrong direction. All your resources went to the wrong place. So in losing that time, you remember when the mayor came out, this was one of the most chilling things I've still heard in this investigation. We don't know if he's left the state. We don't even know if he's in the state or not. Now, I don't know if that's still the case, but it certainly seems like it. Robes. They are desperate to find this individual. Did they? I didn't hear a description necessarily. They have the picture up there, but you can't tell that much.

[Amy Robach]

But you could at least see his face. If you know him, you would recognize him. Obviously, he looks like any other guy. Brown hair, you know what, in his 20s or 30s, kind of indistinguishable. But obviously, if that's someone who you know or who you love, you will recognize Recognize him. But it is very telling that that's where they are in this investigation on day five. There's a reason why that show, that investigative show, I think it's on CBS, is called 48 hours because they say the first 48, it's everything. We're on day five. They're asking for help to recognize a guy on a street who might have seen the guy on the street.

[TJ Holmes]

And the other thing, they're desperate in asking for the public's help. Now they put out some other video. There was an initial video. You just saw him in the back walking around this sidewalk. That was the first one they put out. But in recent days, yesterday for sure, they put out more videos that they had collected from people's homes. You know, everybody has those ring cams or whatever. Yes, there's surveillance everywhere. And they pieced together that this guy had actually been in the area from 10am the shooting was at 4. So he was casing the area. Robes, again, another telling piece here. They're asking people in a particular area, they put up a map, right, showing the neighborhood in this certain square, block area. If you live here, we are asking you to go check every camera you might have. And they even say, robes, if you don't know how to work it, call us. We will send an officer over to help.

[Amy Robach]

He actually said that it was a press conference of asking for help and then explaining that they don't know anything. I mean, they weren't even in a position to say whether or not the weapon used in this mass shooting was a long gun or not. They didn't want people to get that in their heads if they know somebody and thought, oh, well, he doesn't have a long gun, he has a different gun, whatever they were. But it was, it almost became. It was. You just thought these poor folks standing out there trying to give information, and they're literally telling us they have no information and begging us for information. It was a reverse press conference. Can you give us information? Because we have none to give to you.

[TJ Holmes]

And again, that's what, that's an important investigative tool, is it not? You ask for the public's health. So something that's, that helped this high profile. Surely I don't. It might not be long. Somebody's gonna recognize this guy and then we'll, we'll see what happens. But robes, these high, high, high profile cases, you know, they are absolutely freaking out right now. They have a whole community in fear. We don't know who this guy was or what the motivation was. So you can't tell me for sure he's not gonna go do more harm somewhere. You can't see that.

[Amy Robach]

You can't say that at all. You don't even know why he walked into that. They know he was there for a while now, the campus, trying to figure out how, when, where, and who he was going to shoot. But they don't know why he did it. They don't know where he's headed next. They don't know if he still has some sort of an ax to grind with anyone else, if he's planning more mayhem. They literally have no idea. Now, it's interesting, with all of that non information, you had a very positive Rhode Island Attorney General. He was being very optimistic. He was like, we're gonna crack this case. When we crack it, it's gonna open really quickly. So it's almost like he was convincing himself that they were gonna crack the case.

[TJ Holmes]

That's what. But this is the guy who's been very frustrated.

[Amy Robach]

Yes.

[TJ Holmes]

With answers. Excuse me, with questions that have come his way that they simply cannot answer. And look, I know the scrutiny right now, but this is one you have got to be. What do you say? Even if you cannot solve all the problems, the leader of that community, the mayor, somebody needs to step out and exude confidence and comfort. And when they come out and yeah, guys, like, even the way they start to speak, I am not. And I'm sorry if this sounds critical, but what's happened now does not make a frightened community feel better. We watched this press conference today, and you did not feel confidence in what's happening. Not. Not to say they're doing a bad job, but for where the investigation is. Nothing about it today made you feel good.

[Amy Robach]

And the problem is the misinformation that was released immediately following the shooting, where people actually were breathing that sigh of relief, did feel like they were safe. So now that trust has been complet eroded. And so you cannot tell me that I'm safe. He was actually the mayor. Brett Smiley is his name. He was urging members of his community and his city to continue to go about their business, to go to work, to take your kids to school, to go holiday shopping. I actually hadn't even considered that there's a gunman on the loose. Do you really feel comfortable sending your kids to school? I didn't even realize. I bet you a lot of parents have kept their kids home from school. I bet a lot of parents have decided not to go to work until this is figured out. And he's asking members of his community to trust them, that they've got this, that they're on it, that all resources are being dedicated to it, to please not let fear cripple this community.

[TJ Holmes]

But what happened? You said not sending their kids to school. You talk about community, that the local community. What. What if he's not caught? What. What do parents think about sending their kids back to Brown? Ingenuous.

[Amy Robach]

There's absolutely.

[TJ Holmes]

Right.

[Amy Robach]

No way I would. Because I'm actually, I'm imagining myself as, you know, I have a college student and she is. I've been concerned. There have been issues at Boulder. Not while she was there, not while she was on campus. But if there was an active shooter on the run, a manhunt underway. You think I want to send my kid back to that campus? Absolutely not.

[TJ Holmes]

Wow. I didn't think about that. And again, that seems like a long ways away. And we say surely he's going to be caught. And I was thinking about the other one to make comparison because it felt like forever to catch the suspect in the Charlie Kirk shooting. That was 33 hours.

[Amy Robach]

Yeah. This is the fifth day.

[TJ Holmes]

That was a day and a half top. And that felt like for.

[Amy Robach]

It did. You're right. It did feel like a long time.

[TJ Holmes]

And somebody was in custody and then got released. This kind of a thing. That was Cash Patel. Well, stay with us here folks because Cash Patel is in the middle of this one again and the investigators in Rhode island are saying he is is not helping at all. Plus, we have an update. We got one today about how the victims in the hospital are doing and it is a positive one. Stay here.

[Amy Robach]

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[TJ Holmes]

All right folks, we continue here on Amy and tj Breaking developments today in the Brown University shooting. The breaking development is that they are searching for somebody else. That somebody else just happens to not be a suspect, but someone they believe may have interacted with the suspect. And again, robes, the point here is that they are desperate for leads.

[Amy Robach]

They're looking for anything to point them in the direction of who this shooter may be. They don't have a description. They don't have any facial details. They have nothing to go on.

[TJ Holmes]

You say no description. But I'm not putting you on the stocky. I'm about to say, what's the one thing we know about them?

[Amy Robach]

Stocky.

[TJ Holmes]

They keep telling us.

[Amy Robach]

And you just described most men in America.

[TJ Holmes]

Middle aged men would be a little stocky, would they not? Look up on tv. Just somebody happened to be up is stocky fella. Like to your point, that's a stocky. Okay, we move forward here, folks, that with the case here. Rose. We were saying Cash Patel. I mentioned a moment ago, we all know what happened with the shooting of Charlie Kirk. He flat out made an announcement that they had to shoot her in custody. Right. You remember all this?

[Amy Robach]

Yeah. And I understand there's a rush to say we got him, we got our guy, we want the one. Not only do we want the public to be breathe a sigh of relief and not be worried about it, but also we want to say we did our job.

[TJ Holmes]

You got to be right, though.

[Amy Robach]

You think he would have learned from his past mistake?

[TJ Holmes]

When you say it like that. And this isn't us, but the Rhode Island. It was the attorney general who was very critical in an interview of Cash Patel putting out a tweet in which he was Talking about the FBI's role in capturing this suspect. But yes, announcing suspect was in custody. And the FBI helped in this, but I did it essentially celebrating their role. He said that. And they knew immediately, at least the investigators on the ground that this was not the case.

[Amy Robach]

And like, oh, my God, what is he doing? And he made a point, the attorney general, to take a couple shots saying. Basically saying that Cash Patel does not have any sort of experience in policing and investigations. And it's. If you had experience, you would never have put out a tweet like that.

[TJ Holmes]

And as soon as it was a dig, it was and it was unnecessary. And you don't. We don't need that right now.

[Amy Robach]

I would think they wouldn't want that right now. You don't want to be at war or start a fight or pick a fight with the FBI director when you are a little busy right now and you kind of need their help, let's be honest, to find this guy.

[TJ Holmes]

But when he came, when he said it, he came all, he's pissed.

[Amy Robach]

He was angry.

[TJ Holmes]

Like, there is so much scrutiny and intense scrutiny and attention on these folks. The mayor, that police chief, the attorney general now, and now the FBI, everybody. And to think. And again, as soon as he said it, we were watching him at that clip. I said, oh yeah, he's a Democrat. Sure enough, I'm looking at him.

[Amy Robach]

He's a Democrat. I mean, obviously that was pretty obvious.

[TJ Holmes]

But we don't need that right now. We have got to see them, and I hope we see them standing next to each other in a press conference very soon. And quite frankly, I would love if literally their arms were around each other. Because this is an awful story and we need these folks who are leading an investigation. We need to feel like they're getting.

[Amy Robach]

Along and they just need to work together. And if you ratchet up the tension like that because you're angry in the moment. I wonder if he regrets that because you can't unsay it. And he said it publicly. It's one thing to say it to his face. It's one thing to say it to him even in private, but to put it out there on national television and absolutely deliberately take a shot at Cash Patel. Not that he wasn't right. And you can be right and you can be correct, but. But it still might not be your best move when you need to have all the help you can get trying to catch this guy.

[TJ Holmes]

So now to that ropes. Here we are. What happens now when word leaks out and sources say. Or Cash Patel can put out another tweet and we would go get another source. That's a problem of his making. Nobody else's. But if you can't trust. They talk all the time about who you can trust and fake news and trusting what's put out. The head of the FBI on two now of potentially highest profile murder cases in this country this year has told us something that was 100% wrong.

[Amy Robach]

That's a problem. And we've talked about this. Look, and again, this has nothing to do with politics. We're just looking at this from a journalism standpoint. I've never. Have you ever felt the need to get a second source or to verify something that came from the White House, from whoever, whomever in the administration. And that has been the case.

[TJ Holmes]

But these are. This is not a fact check. Oh, the president said this. But if you go back in history, if you look at this and da, da, da. He was wrong. No, no, no. These are our. They are the source. We. If the FBI director tells me somebody's arrested, who am I supposed to go check with? Yeah, I'm saying these are the ultimate sources. And you have to pause. This is a. For that community robes. Where is this guy? If you live.

[Amy Robach]

Who is this guy?

[TJ Holmes]

How about right now? How would you be feeling?

[Amy Robach]

I would feel very concerned. Look, the only thing I can relate to is I was living in Washington, D.C. and was a reporter when the serial snipers were out. Let me tell you, we lived in fear for three weeks. People zigzagged to the grocery store. People crouched down when gassing their car. It's really scary when you know someone who's been willing to kill at random and is still on the run, that is scary.

[TJ Holmes]

But doing that right, we knew that DC Killer was out there picking people off and wow, where is going to be the next one? We don't necessarily have that feeling here, but to a degree it's scarier because we have zero clue what this person's up to.

[Amy Robach]

Is he going to strike again? Is he going to walk into a movie theater? Is he going to walk into a school? Is he going to walk into any holiday event where you think you can go with your family safely and enjoy this time of year? All of that is now scary.

[TJ Holmes]

And was there a target? Why Brown? Why that classroom? If he was there for that long, it looked like he was looking for an opportunity instead of looking for that classroom, who would? Who knows?

[Amy Robach]

And if he got away with it, if he gets away with it, will he feel emboldened to do it again?

[TJ Holmes]

And we're looking up on the screen here, it's still at this point, it is really scary to think that somebody was floating around, walking around for six hours, looking for possibly an opportunity to kill. Folks, we jumped on here today. Look, this has been a fast moving, a breaking news day on a lot of fronts. We remind you again, top right corner of that Apple podcast app where you see our show has a button there that says follow click that you can continue to get our updates. The one positive update we saved here for the inrobes is at least to hear it sounds like just about everybody in the hospital is doing better.

[Amy Robach]

Exactly. So we heard from the mayor that they only now have one survivor who's still in critical but stable condition. Five others are now have been upgraded to stable condition and that means the other three have already been released from the hospital. So the mayor said he actually directly spoke to the parents of these students and they all sounded upbeat and optimistic that their kids were going to pull through and be okay. And that, of course, is the best news of all. Of course, the two students who died, they recognized them. There were memorials for these two students. We've seen their pictures, their faces. It is incredibly sad and heartbreaking. But it is good to hear that the others who were injured are all looking like they are going to survive and hopefully be out of the hospital sooner rather than later. We will continue to follow any developments in this story and certainly there have been quite a few. So we appreciate you for listening. I'm Amy Robach alongside TJ Holmes. We'll talk to you soon. Weight loss doesn't have to be complicated. Gimme.care gives you access to physician prescribed GLP1 treatments for just $130 per month, one flat price at all doses.

[TJ Holmes]

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[Amy Robach]

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[TJ Holmes]

Eligibility required Results vary.

[Sophie Cunningham]

This is Sophie Cunningham from Show Me Something. Do you know the symptoms of moderate to severe obstructive sleep apnea, or OSA in adults with obesity? They may be happening to you without you knowing. If anyone has ever said you snored loudly, or if you spend your days fighting off excessive tiredness, irritability and concentration issues, it may be due to osa. OSA is a serious condition where your airway partially or completely collapses during sleep, which may cause breathing interruptions and oxygen deprivation. Learn more at. Don't sleep on osa.com this information is provided by Lilly, A medicine company.

[Kalpen Modi]

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[Ed Helms]

I'm Ed Helms.

[Kalpen Modi]

Ed and I are inviting you to join the best sounding book club you've ever heard with our new podcast, Hearsay. The Audible and iHeart Audiobook Club.

[Ed Helms]

Each week we sit down with your favorite iHeart podcast hosts and some very special guests to discuss the latest and greatest audiobooks from Audible.

[Kalpen Modi]

Listen to HearSay on America's number one podcast network, iHeart Followersay, and start listening on the free iHeartRadio app today.

[Ed Helms]

Honestly, Honestly, Honestly, no one wants to think about hiv, but there are things that everyone can do to help prevent it. Things like prep. PREP stands for Pre Exposure Prophylaxis, and it means routinely taking prescription medicine before you're exposed to HIV to help reduce your chances of getting it. Prep can be about 99% effective when taken as prescribed. It doesn't protect against other STIs, though, so be sure to use condoms and other healthy sex practices. Ask a healthcare provider about all your prevention Options and visit findoutaboutprep.com to learn more.

[Amy Robach]

Sponsored by Gilead okay, only 10 more presents to wrap. You're almost at the finish line, but first. Ah, there, the last one. Enjoy a Coca Cola for a pause that refreshes. This is an I Heart Podcast. Guaranteed human.