The Diddy Trial: “It Just Gets Better and Better”

Summary

Podcast Summary: Amy Robach & T.J. Holmes Present: Aubrey O’Day, Covering the Diddy Trial

Episode: The Diddy Trial: “It Just Gets Better and Better”
Release Date: June 24, 2025
Hosts: Amy Robach and Katherine Townsend
Guest: Aubrey O’Day
Platform: iHeartPodcasts

---

Introduction to the Trial’s Progress

In this episode, hosts Amy Robach and Katherine Townsend provide an in-depth update on the high-profile trial involving Sean "Diddy" Combs. The trial, which has been captivating national attention for seven weeks, is now approaching its final stages with the last witness taking the stand.

[02:48] Rob: "It's Tuesday, June 24th. We are in the seventh week of testimony in the Diddy trial and as we speak the final witness of the trial is on the stand."

---

Final Witness and Cross-Examination

The final testimony comes from a Homeland Security agent who is currently being cross-examined by Diddy's defense team. This marks the end of the prosecution's evidence, leaving the defense to present their case without introducing additional witnesses.

[03:09] Townsend: "That's right. And right now he is being cross examined by Diddy's defense attorneys... the defense says it will rest. It is not calling any witnesses to the stand."

---

Impact of Text Messages Evidence

A significant portion of the trial has hinged on text message exchanges between Diddy and Jane Doe, as well as between Jane and an escort. The defense has focused on these messages to argue that the interactions were consensual and that Jane was a willing participant.

[05:08] Rob: "There was a significant delay before we even got to some of these text messages because they had to fight over what text messages they would even be allowed to enter."

During the cross-examination, text messages revealed Jane expressing a desire for one-on-one time with Diddy, even praising her interactions with an escort. This challenges the prosecution's narrative of coercion.

[07:06] Townsend: "She was talking about having sex with Diddy... she seemed excited about it. Some of these text messages certainly are massively favorable for the defense."

---

Defense vs. Prosecution: The Battle Over Evidence

The defense successfully introduced several text messages that the prosecution had previously objected to. These messages suggested that Jane freely participated in the "freak offs" and even enjoyed them, thereby undermining claims of coercion.

[07:44] Rob: "But is that good enough? What you described there, is that good enough to say for them?"

[08:02] Townsend: "The defense has done an amazing job... showing the jurors that there is some doubt in terms of whether or not these women were forced to participate."

---

Consent and Coercion: Jurors’ Dilemma

The crux of the trial now lies in whether the jurors believe the women were willing participants or were coerced into their actions. Text messages indicating Jane's enthusiasm and desire for intimacy complicate the prosecution's case.

[13:48] Townsend: "Where was their responsibility in participating? And that is where I think a lot of jurors... can say, ugh, sounds like they were lovesick... Does that mean a crime?"

---

Comparative Analysis: O.J. Simpson Trial

Rob and Townsend draw parallels between the Diddy trial and the infamous O.J. Simpson case, particularly regarding the length and nature of closing arguments.

[27:01] Rob: "They asked for it."

[27:23] Rob: "Four days closing arguments in OJ Trial, days one through three. Wow."

They discuss how long closing arguments can influence jury deliberations and the complexities involved in such high-stakes cases.

---

Potential Outcomes and Societal Implications

The hosts contemplate the possible verdicts and their ramifications on society, especially concerning future cases related to consent and coercion.

[22:19] Townsend: "This is about the music industry... the hip hop culture... what's the gray area? What's a crime, what's not?"

[23:28] Rob: "What’s going to happen with... the possibilities that this man could walk out of there a free man... or be put in jail for the rest of his life."

They emphasize the trial's potential to influence public perception and legal standards surrounding consent and power dynamics.

---

Technological Evidence in Modern Trials

A noteworthy aspect of this trial is the extensive use of digital evidence, such as text messages and video files, which provide a closer glimpse into the interactions between the parties involved.

[20:30] Townsend: "It's all about modern technology. You can try to make it look one way, but when the defense shines a light on the other text messages, it..."

[21:21] Townsend: "This trial, there are so many ripple effects that will happen based on what the outcome is."

The hosts discuss how such evidence could have altered the course of older trials lacking digital records.

---

Conclusion and Final Thoughts

As the trial nears its conclusion, Rob and Townsend reflect on the complexities and the broader societal conversations it has sparked. They acknowledge the emotional and legal challenges jurors face in discerning consent within powerful relationships.

[25:34] Townsend: "This is, this is it. The defense might present or enter into evidence a few exhibits... a full day on Thursday... their final thoughts are."

[27:51] Townsend: "Yes. But we will continue to monitor everything happening in that Lower Manhattan courtroom."

They conclude by highlighting the trial's significance beyond celebrity gossip, touching on vital issues such as power dynamics, consent, and the influence of technology in legal proceedings.

---

Notable Quotes:

• Rob [02:48]: "It's Tuesday, June 24th... this is the last guy we're gonna hear from."
• Townsend [07:06]: "She was talking about having sex with Diddy... she seemed excited about it."
• Townsend [13:48]: "Where was their responsibility in participating? Does that mean a crime?"
• Rob [27:01]: "They asked for it."
• Townsend [22:19]: "This is about the music industry... what's the gray area? What's a crime, what's not?"

---

This episode offers a comprehensive analysis of the ongoing Diddy trial, shedding light on the intricate legal battles, the role of digital evidence, and the profound societal questions it raises. Robach and Townsend adeptly navigate the complexities of the case, providing listeners with a nuanced understanding of its developments and potential implications.

Transcript

[Michelle Williams]

This is an iHeart podcast.

[Jay Shetty]

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[Michelle Williams]

Stay informed, empowered and ahead of the curve with a BI N News this Hour podcast updated hourly to bring you the latest stories shaping the Black community. From breaking headlines to cultural milestones, the Black Information Network delivers the facts, the voices and the perspectives that matter 247 because our stories deserve to be heard. Listen to the BI N News this Hour podcast on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcast. I also want to address the Tonys. On a recent episode of Checking in with Michelle Williams, I open up about feeling snubbed by the Tony Awards. Do I? I was never mad. I was disappointed because I had high hopes to hear this and more on disappointment and protecting your peace. Listen to Checking in with Michelle Williams from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

[George M. Johnson]

This Pride Month, we are not just celebrating, we're fighting back. I'm George M. Johnson, author of the most banned book in America. On my podcast, Fighting Words, I sit down with voices that spark resistance and inspire change.

[Katherine Townsend]

This year we are showing up and showing up.

[Rob]

You need people being like, no, you're not what?

[Katherine Townsend]

You tell us what to do.

[Michelle Williams]

This regime is coming down on us and I don't want to just survive.

[Katherine Townsend]

I want to thrive.

[George M. Johnson]

Fighting Words is where courage meets conversation. Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Unknown]

Hey, I'm Jay Shetty, the host of the number one health and wellness podcast in the world. On Purpose. On On Purpose, I sit down with some of the most fascinating minds, from world class athletes to wellness experts and thought leaders to uncover their secrets to living a happier, more meaningful life. If you're looking for inspiration, tools for growth and real conversations that challenge you to think differently, listen to on purpose on the iHeartRadio app, Amazon Music or wherever you listen to podcasts.

[Rob]

Hey there folks. It's Tuesday, June 24th. We are in the seventh week of testimony in the Diddy trial and as we speak the final witness of the trial is on the stand. Welcome to this Diddy update edition of Amy and tj And Robed has been seven weeks. It's weird to say this is the last guy we're gonna hear from.

[Katherine Townsend]

That's right. And right now he is being cross examined by Diddy's defense attorneys. And once that cross examination is over, that's it. It's. It's hard to imagine, but yes, the defense says it will rest. It is not calling any witnesses to the standard. So what we're hearing from this Homeland Security agent is the end of the evidence for the jurors to consider.

[Rob]

Are they going out? I don't know. With a bang, With a thud? I don't know. Because there have been so many explosive witnesses and explosive testimony that it seems like a guy going through hotel receipts, some text messages, some travel itineraries. It seems like boring stuff, but it is important stuff.

[Katherine Townsend]

I think honestly, if you look at what the prosecution presented on Friday and yesterday, it was kind of boring. He was connecting the dots. He was saying, saying, did he paid for this? Diddy paid for that. But now with the defense cross examining him, I think it's a little bit more interesting because they are actually reading text messages between Diddy and Jane right now and also between Jane and an escort. And I found it pretty interesting how much she took control of coordinating and then also praising and talking about how much she enjoyed having sex with the escort and telling Diddy that she wanted to have some alone time with him. Some one on one time with him. She said she hadn't actually been with him. She said, selfishly, I don't know what that means. In five months. That's interesting to me that pretty much their intimacy was her having sex with other men and him watching it. But she seemed excited about it. Some of these text messages certainly are massively favorable for the defense. She said, I haven't stopped thinking about it. It just gets better and better. That's what Jane texted to Diddy and then she texted to the escort. This was one for the books. So it didn't sound like somebody who was coerced or somebody who didn't want to be there or someone who felt like they had to be there.

[Rob]

So before this guy even got on the stand today to start the day, there was a significant delay before we even got to some of these text messages because they had to fight over what text messages they would even be allowed to enter. I believe by most of the estimates, people in the courtroom, it seemed like anywhere from a 30 to 45 minute delay after 9am in getting to the stand. Does that feel about right? Yes, because the attorneys were arguing. What's the right debate?

[Katherine Townsend]

Debating.

[Rob]

They were debating.

[Katherine Townsend]

Well, they still argue too.

[Rob]

Yes, they were debating and arguing in front of the judge over text messages they wanted to have entered into testimony and entered into evidence. And there were several objections by the prosecution in particular to some of Cassie Ventura Fine's text messages to Diddy in particular. There was one that the defense wanted to submit in which she was talking about wanting to have sex, wanting to be with him, wanting. And they wanted to enter this to show, look, she was initiating this, she wanted this. The prosecution objected and the judge sustained the objection because the judge even said she was talking about one on one time.

[Katherine Townsend]

Yeah, she was talking about having sex with Diddy. And I think that's really clear. And she's made that clear. That's all she wanted. And that she was tolerating or at worst being coerced into having sex with other men just so she could try and get eventually, ultimately alone time with Diddy.

[Rob]

So she. And it makes sense she would be excited or wanting to be with her man one on one. And the judge saw that. So he said, absolutely, that objection is sustained. You're not going to be able to use that one. But then there were three others, at least that they were trying to get entered. And the prosecution objected, but he overruled those objections because she was talking about baby oil. She was talking about some other things that seem to show that she was a willing participant and initiated some of this stuff. So the defense lost on that one text message, but they won on all of these others that they are going to be able to present.

[Katherine Townsend]

And of course, this is all the defenses. I mean, this is their case. They might not be calling any witnesses of their own, but this is their case to prove to the jury. They are saying that everything that happened was consensual, that Jane and Cassie were both willing participants. And in some cases, if you look at these text messages, not just willing, but excited and anticipatory of what happened. And then even in the aftermath of some of these freak offs, they were talking about how great it was, how amazing it was. So they have certainly cast some doubt and in terms of motive or why or how this all came about, why these women were participating.

[Rob]

But is that good enough? What you described there, is that good enough to say for them? The way they explain that is just, hey, yes, of course they were saying that to Diddy because They felt this is what he wanted, this is what they had to do. That seems to be always the comeback, that none of that was authentic. They were performing for him even in the text message.

[Katherine Townsend]

But then couldn't you argue that? How would Diddy ascertain the difference between the two if he's being told this?

[Rob]

They did argue that, right?

[Katherine Townsend]

I mean, if he's being told by these women that they're excited about it and that they want it and that afterwards they were happy about it and wanted more of it, how is he supposed to know that they're just performing for him so that they can be with him? That doesn't really make a lot of sense to me. I mean, it looks to me, again, I'll reiterate, no legal expert here, but. But, man, I think the defense has done an amazing job in all of their cross examinations and certainly even today, showing the jurors that there is some doubt in terms of whether or not these women were forced to participate in these freak offs. I think that there is definitely doubt when you hear their own words in real time of when this was all going on.

[Rob]

Wasn't it a big thing earlier in the trial about whether or not I think it was Cassie Ventura Fine who was saying she needed to be on drugs for these free calls like she does? No way. She could just. She had to numb herself. But one of the objections this morning was over a text message that Cassie Ventura Fine had between with her and Diddy in which she was asked, can she do the freak off without the drugs? Her response was, yes. The judge overruled the objection to that text that is going to be able to submit into evidence. So that was a big deal for a while. This is the only way I could get through. And now the jury is being told, oh, so she could in clear conscience and right mind participate. And she's saying it here.

[Katherine Townsend]

And she texted that in real time. She texted it. So again, how is Diddy supposed to know that if it's true she was lying about it if she actually really couldn't do it without drugs? How's he supposed to know she's lying to him when she says she could do it without drugs? And yeah, those texts are incredibly damning and it undermines a lot of the testimony that we heard from both Cassie and Jane while they were on the stand.

[Rob]

And so Jane has been the heart, a lot of the heart a lot of the conversation this morning with this Homeland Security agent. I didn't expect him. He's been up there since, what Friday. Yeah.

[Katherine Townsend]

Who knew?

[Rob]

Yeah. I thought he was gonna be kind of a throwaway, and he's been up there. Incredibly important. But some of the text messages, so many of them are focused on Jane and their back and forth, and some of the. And the defense, of course, the cross examination. Now, the prosecution presented different text messages. Correct. But now these are painting a wildly different picture of a woman who was. Giddy.

[Katherine Townsend]

Yes, I think is one way to put it. That's a good word. That's a very. I was trying to find the word when I was saying excited or anticipatory. But giddy. Giddy is a very good word. And they also were just putting up messages where Jane was telling Diddy how much she loved him and that she would not take him for granted. I mean, this. That if the motivation is love, how is that coercion? I mean, that's what it seems like to me when I. When I hear even the testimony from these two women. But certainly these text messages that the defense is pointing out and having read aloud to me as a layman, it seems like these women were motivated by love and desire and maybe even some money. Maybe even some money, but that was their choice. They wanted to be able to live a different kind of lifestyle. So that all seems like of benefit to them. And how many other women have done things that they didn't want to do because they loved a man? I mean, I think that's just a common thing that has happened. Does that mean a crime was committed? Does that mean that someone needs to go to prison for the rest of their lives?

[Rob]

Well, again, I just want to make sure you're saying that as far as what the jurors might have in their heads.

[Katherine Townsend]

Correct, correct, correct.

[Rob]

I'm thinking about what robog has in her heart. Just want to make sure that's clear.

[Katherine Townsend]

No, no, no, no. I'm not saying that. I. I think. Well, I do think that most women can put themselves in that position. I actually, it'll be so interesting to see if the jurors do decide to speak or at least talk about why they made their decisions. But like, how it falls not just between black and white or race, but gender. And as a woman, you know, look, I was disgusted and appalled and hearing and seeing all of this and just feeling so badly for these women who are giving this gut wrenching testimony and putting themselves and their reputations on the line, having been forced to watch humiliating videos of sexually explicit acts that they were committing. So I was. I was definitely wanting to be team, team woman but hearing all of these other text messages, I can kind of see it in a. In a human experience. And I'm sure there's regret and I'm sure there's anger and. But where was their responsibility in participating? And that is where I think a lot of jurors, as human beings and maybe even as women can say, ugh, sounds like they were lovesick, sounds like they really just wanted to be with him and they would do anything they could to be with him. Does that mean there was a crime?

[Rob]

You're saying that their question is not a legal one, but almost an emotional one. It sounds like they're obviously emotions come into any jury deliberation, but all these jury instructions, all this legalese and the back and forth seems like, all right, let's follow the law. But this might simply come down to whether or not they believe these women, whether or not they believe that they were part time. I asked you this the other day. I think, can you be a part time victim if the other part of the time you're a willing participant?

[Jay Shetty]

Yes.

[Katherine Townsend]

I think the answer to that is yes.

[Rob]

Okay, so that's the guy. We get past that. So then let's go with the part when they were possibly a victim. Can you say, I mean, how much doubt is someone going to have in their head in that jury room? Is that what they're having to really decide whether or not these women were willing participants? What was in their heart? Was it about love? Is that yes?

[Katherine Townsend]

Or were they forced? Because coercion for. I mean, it's. It's so tough. It's so tough now. And now that you. We've heard all of the testimony and we've really seen Diddy's lawyers be excellent in terms of where they took their questioning, where they took their cross examination. It's cast a shadow of doubt from me. I mean, just as someone who's been watching it for sure.

[Jay Shetty]

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[Katherine Townsend]

Over the past six years of making my true crime podcast hell and Gone, I've learned one thing. No town is too small for murder. I'm Katherine Townsend.

[Jay Shetty]

I've received hundreds of messages from people.

[Katherine Townsend]

Across the country begging for help with unsolved murders. I was calling about the murder of my husband. It's a cold case. They've never found her. And it haunts me to this day.

[George M. Johnson]

The murderer is still out there.

[Katherine Townsend]

Every week on Hell and Gone Murder Line, I dig into a new case, bringing the skills I've learned as a journalist and private investigator to ask the questions no one else is asking. Police really didn't care to even try.

[Rob]

She was still somebody's mother.

[Katherine Townsend]

She was still somebody's daughter. She was still somebody's sister. There's so many questions that we've never gotten any kind of answers for. If you have a case you'd like me to look into, call the Helen gone Murderline at 678-744-6145. Listen to Helen gone Murderline on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[George M. Johnson]

This Pride Month, we are not just celebrating, we're fighting back. I'm George M. Johnson and my book All Boys Aren't Blue was just named the most banned book in America. If the culture wars have taught me anything, it's that pride is protest. And on my podcast, Fighting Words, we talk to people who use their voices to resist, disrupt and make our community stronger.

[Katherine Townsend]

This year we are showing up and showing out.

[Rob]

You need people being like, no, you're.

[Katherine Townsend]

Not going to tell us what to do.

[Michelle Williams]

This regime is coming down on us and I don't want to just survive.

[Katherine Townsend]

I want to thrive.

[George M. Johnson]

You'll hear from trailblazers like Bob the Drag Queen to freedom Angelica Ross.

[Katherine Townsend]

We ready to fight. I'm ready to fight.

[George M. Johnson]

And Gabrielle Union.

[Katherine Townsend]

Hi George.

[George M. Johnson]

And storytellers with wisdom to spare. Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Jay Shetty]

Foreign.

[Unknown]

Hey, I'm Jay Shetty, the host of the number one health and wellness podcast in the world. On Purpose. On On Purpose, I sit down with some of the most fascinating minds, from world class athletes to wellness experts and thought leaders to uncover their secrets to living a happier, more meaningful life. If you're looking for inspiration, tools for growth, and real conversations that challenge you to think differently, listen to on purpose on the iHeartRadio app, Amazon Music, or wherever you listen to podcasts.

[Rob]

This one's tough to our point. One of the text messages April 2022. I even wrote a note to myself here. Oh shit. When I saw this. And just that was the note. And this is What Jane wrote to Diddy in April of 2022. Baby, I want to make love to you. I haven't selfishly had you to myself for five months. I'm fine with the other stuff, but I really just need you right now. Diddy's response? Okay, whatever you want. That sounds like a couple. That sounds like a relationship. That sounds like an understanding. That even sounds like her telling him what we've been doing is cool. Can I just have this? And the follow up to this. Sure enough, they had some alone time. That's a tough exchange, man.

[Katherine Townsend]

That really is. That is incredibly damning, I would think to the prosecution's contention that this was coercion. That doesn't sound like coercion.

[Rob]

I'm fine with the other stuff, but I really just need you right now. His response was. Was okay, whatever you want. How? I don't know what the prosecution. I don't know if they're going to get up and say anything they get a chance to redirect with this witness. I don't know if they're going to try to take that on or not. But my word, that is just a totally different picture.

[Katherine Townsend]

Correct. And the one that I just mentioned, but the one that really stood out to me was when. And it's Tenny Garagos who is doing the cross examination right now, but when she had the Homeland Security agent read aloud the text messages between Diddy and Jane and an escort. So they were all there texting and Jane text combs about the freak offs about having sex with an escort that the prosecution is maintaining she was coerced to do. It just gets better and better. And she's telling did he this? You know, it's so fascinating because in before we had cell phones and text messages. Imagine how much more difficult this trial would be. But these text messages tell stories that you can't.

[Rob]

Oh my goodness.

[Katherine Townsend]

Right.

[Rob]

He would be not guilty. It's several years ago. You wouldn't have all this evidence.

[Katherine Townsend]

Right.

[Rob]

That is so weird to think about. You would not have this. It would just. He says, she said that's all the option they would have at the time, that is. I didn't. I never stopped to think about. This whole thing has been about interaction and video and surveillance and electronics and.

[Katherine Townsend]

It'S all about modern technology. And you can try to make it look one way, but then when the defense shines a light on the other text messages, it. The fuller picture is around. I mean, I do think this gives the jury the best possible vantage point other than actually Being there and witnessing it in the moment, it's kind of close because not only. Look, they. Yesterday, according to the Homeland Security agent, they found 50 video files just in a pretty short period of time. I believe that was the one.

[Rob]

The. It was like five days before Christmas.

[Katherine Townsend]

Yes, yes, that's exactly. It was December of 2021, I believe. And they showed the jurors, two of them. So, I mean, this is wild. It's. It's as close as you can get to being there in the room with them and then hearing how each party felt afterwards and beforehand with text messages accompanying these videos.

[Rob]

Can you imagine if this trial was allowed to be on camera, on tv? They couldn't think about the OJ Trial, think about even the Amber Heard Johnny Depp thing that people were locked to. If this were on camera. We could sit and watch this on TV every day.

[Katherine Townsend]

They have to blur everything out. You couldn't have that audio.

[Rob]

Some of the language.

[Katherine Townsend]

It's not for tv.

[Rob]

Oh, my God. I wouldn't miss a second of it.

[Katherine Townsend]

Maybe hbo.

[Rob]

I would have been captivated. I wouldn't have missed a moment. This is un.

[Katherine Townsend]

Whether you want to admit it or not, you. Everyone would be watching this.

[Rob]

Yeah. And I don't know how. This one doesn't feel necessarily that voyeuristic to me. I suppose it is. And there's a celebrity nature, but there's so many things having, like, real societal issues like we mentioned, of race, of class, of power, of man, of woman, of me too, of right. Relationships, of coercion versus so many fine lines and so many things that I hope we do discuss all of us after this trial. But it. It was such a. I guess it was such a cultural. A societal event versus just a celebrity one. And that's probably a good thing. Yeah, I know it's salacious and for a lot of folk and the stuff. But I don't pay attention to a lot of the stuff in the social media. We're on know people are saying some pretty nasty things about baby oil and all those jokes and all that stuff. But this is a. This is giving us all a chance to have some pretty important conversations.

[Katherine Townsend]

Yeah, this is about the music industry. This is about the hip hop culture. This is about, you know, where is the line between yes and maybe what's the gray area? What's a crime, what's not? I mean, and that will always be a. In any. In any trial, in any case, an issue of. And there's no rape charge here, but whether or not you were forced to have sex or not have sex. That has always been one of the most difficult crimes to prove ever. Because typically it is he said, she said. And how do you know who said yes, who said no, who wanted to, who didn't? It's a very, very delicate issue that, you know, this trial, there are so many ripple effects that will happen based on what the outcome is, what the jury decides, what the verdict is, could affect whether cases come forward again, whether victims come forward again, whether people feel empowered to do what they want because someone got away with something. You know, this is, this will have longstanding, a long standing impact on future, future cases.

[Rob]

Yeah. And what's going to happen with. I mean, we. Have, we considered the possibility that this man could walk out of there a free man. What that's going to look like, what that's going to mean? Have we considered what it looks like if he gets kind of a lesser charge? Have we considered what it looks like if they decide to put him in jail for the rest of his life? I don't know what scenario. No, there is no right or wrong. I just don't know how we react to all of those scenarios. Him walking out in the front of that courthouse, I can't imagine.

[Katherine Townsend]

We haven't seen him since his arrest.

[Rob]

We have not laid eyes on him.

[Katherine Townsend]

We've got court sketch artists, renderings of him.

[Rob]

I was just looking. Maybe I'm talking about this earlier. I'm so tired. I just see one of the artists drawings of the Homeland Security agent that's on the stand. They all. He looks like Reggie Miller to me from the Indiana Pacers. I'm sorry, I'm sorry. I'm exhausted, y' all.

[Katherine Townsend]

I'm court sketch artists, I have noticed and I'm sure they're phenomenal at their jobs. And I'm not trying to knock any of them. I think there were three of them, but they. All the people in the courtroom all look ghoulish to me. That's the best word I can describe.

[Rob]

Look, have you ever. I don't know who's considered a great court remark, but it's. They're doing this so quickly in the heat of the moment. So things are moving so fast. So I, I really do give them credit. They're putting together this rendition in moments, just.

[Katherine Townsend]

Yeah, you're right.

[Rob]

I think that's so impressive that they're able to do. But no, it's not supposed to be.

[Katherine Townsend]

The Mona Lisa every time or like some exact science. There is some creative license being taken place. I just the one takeaway is that Sean Combs has a lot of gray hair that I never realized he did.

[Rob]

I, we, we all do. Any dude, any black man you see over 45 with a black head of hair is gray as. Okay, I'm graying. I'm not full gray yet, but it. I'm graying. Oh God. Yeah.

[Katherine Townsend]

Yes.

[Rob]

Grow the beard out. My beard be full gray.

[Katherine Townsend]

Would it really?

[Rob]

It's insane. Oh, yes. We're all stop. He's 55. He jet black hair like stop. Love you Diddy. But come on, man.

[Katherine Townsend]

Oh my goodness. Oh my goodness. Yes. So, you know, we. This is, this is it. The defense might present or enter into evidence a few exhibits or items and then tomorrow the, the prosecution and the defense will meet with the judge to discuss jury instructions. And then it looks like we will have they said. I don't know how they know this, but I guess both the defense and the prosecution have four hours each. Or they're anticipating.

[Rob]

They asked for it.

[Katherine Townsend]

Is that what it is? Okay, so four hours each to present their case. So that will be a full day on Thursday and that will be fascinating. I actually am really anticipating what they're going to say and how they're going to leave what they're going to leave the jurors with what their final, final thoughts are. And yes, we did four hours. Is that's a lot. God for man. Do different, different attorneys take different parts of it? I imagine.

[Rob]

You know what I'm not used to, I would say no from the really cases I remember, I don't remember them tag teaming.

[Katherine Townsend]

Have you ever, have you ever witnessed a four hour closing argument?

[Rob]

I don't think so.

[Katherine Townsend]

Like, you know, I've had obviously some experiences and I feel like nothing lasted more than 30 minutes. And certainly when you watch a movie or a TV show, it's like 10 minutes. So four hours, that will be interesting if they actually do take all that time. That's why I thought maybe they might tag team. They've got a team of lawyers on both sides, so maybe each lawyer has a different section that they're going to present. Because also wouldn't that make it a little bit more interesting for the juror to be listening to?

[Rob]

They have to.

[Katherine Townsend]

You'd be like zoning out if the same person just stood up there for a four hour monologue. Even if it was fascinating, riveting stuff about baby oil and freak offs, still at a certain point you glaze over.

[Rob]

Okay, I'm okay. If this is correct. I just decided to check closing arguments. O.J. simpson, four days.

[Katherine Townsend]

What?

[Rob]

I'm. What I'm looking at. I am again. This is a quick Google search, folks.

[Katherine Townsend]

Four days for closing arguments.

[Rob]

Four days closing arguments in OJ Trial, days one through three. Wow. Recap. Length of closing arguments, four days. Length of deliberations, less than four hours. Ain't that. That was in the OJ Case.

[Katherine Townsend]

That's wild.

[Rob]

Crazy. But yeah. So we're sitting here talking about four hours.

[Katherine Townsend]

Okay, So I guess that's quick and to the point. So. Yes. But we will continue to monitor everything happening in that lower Manhattan courtroom. We appreciate you listening and coming along with us to get the latest on what's happening in the Diddy trial, but thank you for being with us and we hope you all have a wonderful Tuesday.

[Michelle Williams]

Stay informed, empowered and ahead of the curve with the BI N News. This hour podcast updated hourly to bring you the latest stories shaping the black community. From breaking headlines to cultural milestones, the Black Information Network delivers the facts, the voices and the perspectives that matter 247 because our stories deserve to be heard. Listen to the Bi NhiShour podcast on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I also wanna address the Tonys. On a recent episode of Checking in with Michelle Williams, I open up about feeling snubbed by the Tony Awards, do I? I was never mad. I was disappointed because I had high hopes to hear this. And more on disappointment and protecting your peace. Listen to Checking in with Michelle Williams from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

[George M. Johnson]

This Pride Month, we are not just celebrating, we're fighting back. I'm George M. Johnson, author of the most banned book in America. On my podcast, Fighting Words, I sit down with voices that spark resistance and inspire change.

[Katherine Townsend]

This year, we are showing up and showing out.

[Rob]

You need people being like, no, you're not going to tell us what to do.

[Michelle Williams]

This regime is coming down on us and I don't want to just survive.

[Katherine Townsend]

I want to thrive.

[George M. Johnson]

Fighting Words is where courage meets conversation. Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Unknown]

Hey, I'm Jay Shetty, the host of the number one health and wellness podcast in the world. On purpose. On on purpose, I sit down with some of the most fascinating minds, from world class athletes to wellness experts and thought leaders to uncover their secrets to living a happier, more meaningful life. If you're looking for inspiration, tools for growth and real conversations that challenge you to think differently listen to on purpose on the iHeartRadio app, Amazon Music, or wherever you listen to podcasts.

[Michelle Williams]

This is an iHeart podcast.