Mentalist Oz Pearlman Reads Minds and Breaks Flagrant

Summary

Podcast Summary: Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Episode: Mentalist Oz Pearlman Reads Minds and Breaks Flagrant
Release Date: June 11, 2025

---

Introduction

In this electrifying episode of Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh, mentalist Oz Pearlman takes center stage, captivating hosts Andrew Schulz, Akaash Singh, and guests Mark Agnon and Kiana with his extraordinary mind-reading abilities. True to Flagrant's unapologetic and unruly style, the conversation dives deep into the art of mentalism, exploring the fine line between illusion and reality.

---

Oz Pearlman's Mentalism Demonstrations

Oz Pearlman opens the show with a series of impressive mind-reading feats that leave the hosts both amazed and skeptical.

Initial Mind-Reading Trick

At [00:24], Oz begins by challenging Kiana to think of a letter and a person she admires. Through a combination of cold reading and psychological techniques, Oz accurately guesses that Kiana was thinking of Jay-Z, as revealed at [03:35]. This early success sets the tone for the episode, showcasing Oz's ability to dissect thought patterns without any props.

Oz Pearlman [00:37]: "Means conspicuously offensive. Is that not that it's the..."
Andrew Schulz [00:40]: "It's not the definition."

The Obama Moment

One of the most memorable moments occurs at [05:00] when Oz recounts his encounter with President Obama. Using mentalism techniques, Oz accurately predicts Obama's response during an impromptu meet-and-greet, astonishing both Obama and the hosts.

Oz Pearlman [05:23]: "What gift? That's exactly what he said to me. Human psychology."

Challenging the Coincidence

Throughout the episode, Andrew Schulz persistently questions whether Oz's feats are genuine or orchestrated. At [02:44], Oz clarifies that his abilities stem from understanding human behavior rather than supernatural powers.

Oz Pearlman [02:44]: "This is a magician's tricks. Yeah, but done without the props."

Deep Dive into Mentalism Techniques

Oz Pearlman elucidates the foundational skills of mentalism, emphasizing cold reading, pattern recognition, and psychological manipulation.

Cold Reading and Psychological Assessment

At [10:17], Oz explains how cold reading blends with memory and awareness to create seemingly impossible effects. He highlights that mentalism is not about paranormal abilities but about mastering human psychology.

Oz Pearlman [10:27]: "There's a ton of cold reading mixed in. But here's the secret sauce."

The Challenge of Live Performances

Oz discusses the unpredictability of live performances, sharing anecdotes where despite meticulous planning, some tricks don't unfold as intended. An example at [12:34] involves a high-stakes moment with host Joe Rogan, where Oz successfully guesses an ATM pin code, leaving Rogan bewildered.

Oz Pearlman [13:22]: "And everyone thinks I'm a Mossad agent. So that was quite funny in the comments."

Interactive Demonstrations and Audience Engagement

Throughout the podcast, Oz engages the hosts in interactive mentalism demonstrations, seamlessly blending entertainment with insightful discussions on the mechanics behind his tricks.

Book-Based Mind Reading

At [07:31], Oz attempts a mind-reading trick involving a book that doesn't exist yet, perplexing the hosts when he accurately guesses a word ("Manhattan") despite the book's unavailability.

Oz Pearlman [79:26]: "You think I didn't know you were about to do that? Come on. You wanted to go full circle from Martin Luther King all in one episode."

This segment showcases Oz's ability to manipulate perception and guide thought processes without tangible aids.

Philosophy Behind Mentalism

Oz emphasizes that mentalism is about creating memories and influencing how experiences are remembered. He differentiates between performers and creators within the mentalism community, highlighting the rarity of individuals who can both devise and execute complex mentalism effects.

Oz Pearlman [27:57]: "So if you could say if you could go back in time to when you were 7 years old, what would you tell yourself? Now that's wow, I never thought of that."

Personal Insights and Professional Journey

Oz Pearlman shares personal anecdotes, revealing the challenges and triumphs of his career as a mentalist.

Overcoming Rejection and Building Confidence

At [25:01], Oz recounts his early days performing magic in restaurants at the age of 14, learning resilience through repeated rejection and honing his ability to win over skeptical audiences.

Oz Pearlman [25:23]: "So you have to learn school of hard knocks. How to win people over."

Developing Mentalism Skills

Oz elaborates on the evolution of his craft, transitioning from traditional magic with props to the sophisticated, props-free mentalism he practices today. He credits his extensive practice and dedication to mastering the nuances of human behavior.

Oz Pearlman [24:44]: "Develop? I think it was skill developed. Like, I've been doing this. I was a teenager, but I did magic at restaurants when I was a kid."

Challenges and Ethical Considerations

Oz addresses the ethical boundaries of mentalism, particularly concerning the replication of psychic phenomena and the potential for misuse in manipulative scenarios.

Oz Pearlman [96:42]: "Some of the videos on the gram. Yes, I can tell you right now who's picking what."

He maintains a stance that while mentalism can create powerful illusions, it should be used responsibly, avoiding deceit that harms others.

Future Endeavors and Closing Remarks

As the episode wraps up, Oz Pearlman teases his upcoming book, Proven Habits for Success, scheduled for release on October 28th. He highlights that the book focuses on practical applications of mentalism techniques for personal and professional development.

Oz Pearlman [130:38]: "This is if you were to take that book, how to win friends and influence people, which is honestly one of the best books I've ever read in my life."

Oz thanks the hosts and expresses enthusiasm for future collaborations, promising more mind-blowing content.

Andrew Schulz [139:18]: "Thank you so much, bro."

---

Notable Quotes

• Oz Pearlman [02:44]: "This is a magician's tricks. Yeah, but done without the props."
• Oz Pearlman [05:23]: "What gift? That's exactly what he said to me. Human psychology."
• Oz Pearlman [27:57]: "I've done for Howard Stern, something that I assure you, nobody in my field can understand how I did it."
• Oz Pearlman [130:38]: "This is if you were to take that book, how to win friends and influence people... But if you have the same skills to read people and know exactly, like I said, what they're thinking, how do you improve your sales by huge."

---

Insights and Conclusions

This episode offers a profound exploration of mentalism, demystifying the art by breaking down the techniques that make Oz Pearlman's performances so compelling. Listeners gain valuable insights into:

• The Distinction Between Magic and Mentalism: Understanding that mentalism relies heavily on psychological manipulation and cold reading rather than traditional magical props.

• The Importance of Cold Reading: Mastery of observing and interpreting subtle cues from individuals to create believable mind-reading effects.

• Ethical Use of Mentalism: Oz emphasizes responsible use of his skills, discouraging manipulative or deceptive practices that could harm others.

• Personal Development Through Mentalism Techniques: Oz highlights how skills developed in mentalism can enhance personal and professional relationships, sales, and effective communication.

Overall, Oz Pearlman's appearance on Flagrant not only entertains but also educates listeners on the intricate balance between illusion and genuine psychological insight, reaffirming Flagrant's commitment to delivering unfiltered and thought-provoking content.

Transcript

[Oz Perlman]

Let's make it rainy in here. How's that sound? Hold up. I want to show you one thing. Are you ready for this?

[Andrew Schulz]

How.

[Oz Perlman]

Hold on. I want you to see something. You could have picked anything. You picked any three letters for L.

[Akash Singh]

G. Out of here, dude.

[Oz Perlman]

Seriously offensive. Everything out of here. Done has brought us to this moment.

[Akash Singh]

That is the craziest I ever seen in my life.

[Andrew Schulz]

Welcome to the show. Miles, you want to hit producer tag or not? Okay. Today we are joined by. Oh, the Mentalist is in the building. Flagrants. Yes. Finally.

[Oz Perlman]

Means conspicuously offensive. Is that not that it's the.

[Andrew Schulz]

It's not the definition.

[Oz Perlman]

Eight letter word flagrant. Looked it up.

[Mark Agnon]

Wow.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, we didn't know that. That's. Maybe we should. Maybe we understand why people think we are that.

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah, I think we're spot on.

[Mark Agnon]

What does conspicuous mean?

[Oz Perlman]

I don't know.

[Andrew Schulz]

Dude, I'm so stoked that you're here. This is a long time coming. Obviously you broke the Internet. White. Guessing Joe's ATM pin.

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

We were joking around about, like, how many things Joe does believe that are conspiratorial. And he was looking at you. He's like, there's no that this is real.

[Oz Perlman]

He was less skeptical of Bob Lazar saying he was reverse engineering alien technology than me. Dumpster diving.

[Andrew Schulz]

I wish.

[Oz Perlman]

Like, where you been?

[Andrew Schulz]

I went to dinner with him and Bob.

[Oz Perlman]

Did you?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, before that episode. That was wild. And I.

[Oz Perlman]

You brought me in. I would have told you if he was.

[Andrew Schulz]

Oh, that's what I was going to say. I was like, we got to get to. If you are able. If we're subscribing to the Mentalism, you should really know what's going on in the world, what's going to happen.

[Oz Perlman]

So it's not a supernatural power. Yeah. People come up to you can't believe how many people wrote to me and they're like, what's my bitcoin password? I'm like, bro, if I knew that that you wouldn't have your bitcoin right now. But I assess people.

[Andrew Schulz]

Right?

[Oz Perlman]

It's. This is a magician's tricks. Yeah, but done without the props.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yes.

[Oz Perlman]

I brought some fun stuff. I brought some show and tell, baby. I brought some cars.

[Andrew Schulz]

Okay, good. I want to get into it right away. I have so many different questions.

[Akash Singh]

You just got into magician territory with the props now.

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah, well, you know, I want to do something fun, but I want to show you the difference between magic and mentalism. Because I started a magician.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yes.

[Oz Perlman]

Most mentalists start as magicians. That's kind of the. You gotta crawl before you can walk, before you can run. And so a lot of the same tactics, foundational skills come from magic because you learn how to fool people, you learn how people think, it's the same way. My favorite art form by far, stand up Comedy.

[Andrew Schulz]

Respect.

[Oz Perlman]

Forget magic and mentalism. I watch comedians.

[Andrew Schulz]

Really?

[Oz Perlman]

Oh, my God.

[Andrew Schulz]

Are we fooling and tricking?

[Oz Perlman]

Am I, should I, should I fluff this guy? I've seen life like five or six times.

[Andrew Schulz]

Thank you, bro.

[Oz Perlman]

Am I right? He does his research, but I mean, that's the real mark is how do you take a subject that's not funny and make it funny? The same thing applies to mentalism is I will know not only what you think, but I know how you think.

[Andrew Schulz]

And are you pushing?

[Oz Perlman]

That's the way I'm doing it.

[Andrew Schulz]

But are you pushing us in a direction to think certain things?

[Oz Perlman]

Well, let's watch. When I walked in here, full transparency, People watch us. They always go, he set this up. He told you. He whispered to Alex, do this or do that. I tell you what, I walked in here and we were just about to go on air and I said, if you could think of the number one person you would want to interview. Right. You didn't write this. You didn't say this, you didn't nothing. You thought of someone in your head and I asked you, would they know who you thought of? And what was your answer to that?

[Kiana]

Yes.

[Oz Perlman]

Right. That's what they said.

[Akash Singh]

Jeffree star.

[Oz Perlman]

I think it would be an obvious choice for you. The number one.

[Kiana]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

Okay, let me ask you don't say, because I'm probably not gonna guess it because it's that obvious. The Internet knows.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

What do you think is the first letter of the name of the person he's thinking of?

[Andrew Schulz]

H. Well, it depends how you spell the person's name. J would be the first letter.

[Oz Perlman]

Is that right? Yeah. So who did you go with?

[Kiana]

Jay z. Yeah, Jay Z.

[Oz Perlman]

Okay. Number one.

[Andrew Schulz]

H was hov is what I was gonna say.

[Oz Perlman]

There you go. There you go. So that was number one. And they all know that.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yes.

[Oz Perlman]

So right away, that's easy. Like if I did that, nobody cares.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

So if I say to you, jump down to who would be number two on the list? Now your brain starts to go, I did Jay Z goaded. Who do we go to next? Now I think right away his body language didn't change. I might have gone to a female at that point.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yes.

[Oz Perlman]

But my man went to another guy. Is it Another guy.

[Kiana]

It is.

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah. I would have been more excited. Look at this mark. Thinking of females the whole time. Think of one dude, chicks. Tell us the name of who's number two on the list. Who was number two on the list?

[Andrew Schulz]

Get a cam on Brandon.

[Oz Perlman]

Just.

[Andrew Schulz]

Get some light shining Brandon Brandon David.

[Kiana]

Two on the list. Obama.

[Oz Perlman]

Obama.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, I could.

[Oz Perlman]

Now I'm seeing a thread.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

Now you jump from. Okay. He right away.

[Andrew Schulz]

What thread are you seeing? I'm seeing a thread. Very easy. I don't see caller Andrew, you know.

[Oz Perlman]

Have you met Obama? No, dude over delivered. You met Obama? No, no, no. Oh, man. I. Should I tell the Obama story? Yeah, Obama was on. I did event. This exclusive sports event. Whatever he was on before me. I made buddy buddy with Secret Service in the afternoon when they did the sound check read, one of the dudes minds told him his security pin code. He was not having it, but he liked me. I'm like, get me.

[Akash Singh]

And it's the Obama.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

And this is my book. And then I go, later that night, they don't know if we're going to have an Obama meet and greet. He speaks before me. Ken Burns interviews him. No cameras, very like off the record. And then he does an impromptu meet and greet. And I'm five foot, nothing like slightly above average for a Jew. And. And I keep trying to get into this, but it's all sports people. So I'm not, you know, he. Right when he goes to shake one hand, you don't know if he's going right or left. I'm trying to watch Mentalist skills. After about 15 people, he turns to me and this is. It's my moment. And I know exactly what I'm going to say to him. I've been thinking about this for two months. What. Ready for this? What would you say if somebody shook your hand and go, thank you so much for the gift? What would you say to that?

[Kiana]

What gift?

[Oz Perlman]

Boom. What gift? That's exactly what he said to me. Human psychology. And I go, president Obama, you just went on. And I'm on stage in 10 minutes. So I forever get to tell people that President Obama opened for me. I love it, loved it. I was waiting for him to say, what are you performing? And that's when he goes, I saw you on Hard Knocks and I'm losing my mind. You and Aaron Rodgers. He's fanboying over me. My wife's behind me. Like, are you getting this? Are you getting this? And so he was awesome, man. I read his mind. It's kind of full circle.

[Andrew Schulz]

What was he thinking about?

[Oz Perlman]

He was thinking about a buddy of his in Chicago, and I told him his name and I told him where they met, and he. There's a. There's. There's literally.

[Akash Singh]

What was the name?

[Andrew Schulz]

Oh, geez.

[Akash Singh]

What was his name?

[Oz Perlman]

Just tell you. Illuminati. Illuminati. Brings it in, hugs it out. A great, great moment. Number two. Is Obama ready?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

This becomes impossible, because how could I know something he didn't even know? Right.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

Gold medal, silver medal, bronze medal.

[Andrew Schulz]

Mark is so excited right now.

[Oz Perlman]

I have you right now. I put you on the spot.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

Because I saw you when I asked.

[Akash Singh]

You're his Jay Z.

[Oz Perlman]

When I asked about the number two. Mark's waiting for Jason.

[Mark Agnon]

I love magic.

[Andrew Schulz]

He hasn't done any magic yet.

[Oz Perlman]

Nothing. Mar.

[Mark Agnon]

I'm sorry.

[Oz Perlman]

Got 99 problems, and Mark is all of them.

[Andrew Schulz]

Could you tell? Mark grew up in a big family, didn't get a lot of attention.

[Oz Perlman]

They were both alive. They were both alive. JC that's when you switch. And when I said to you just now, think of your third person. I saw you look up and you struggled. Swear to God, before I arrived here today at this studio, you did not know what I was going to do. There is nothing staged, nothing set up. Swear to God. Is that true? You did not know I'd be answering this question. Close your eyes.

[Andrew Schulz]

Oh, my God.

[Oz Perlman]

Folks, you asked me, how do I do it? And I explained to you, you know, how people think. I can figure out what they think. And I saw a pattern. I saw a trick. This is some ChatGPT, right? ChatGPT tells you the next word in a phrase. Open your eyes. Anyone sitting here that's ever lived, dead or alive, they're sitting next to you. Jay Z's got that seat. Obama's got this seat. You interviewed them both. Last person who popped your hair, tell us, what's their name?

[Kiana]

Martin Luther King Jr. Martin Luther King Jr.

[Akash Singh]

Brandon.

[Andrew Schulz]

You understand?

[Mark Agnon]

Brandon's family is from, Iet. He's Haitian, so he believes.

[Andrew Schulz]

So he believes this voodoo is real.

[Mark Agnon]

So, yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, the.

[Oz Perlman]

Get the.

[Akash Singh]

That's crazy.

[Andrew Schulz]

Okay.

[Kiana]

That's nuts.

[Andrew Schulz]

All right, Keep going. Keep going.

[Akash Singh]

At what point did you figure it out? Did you figure it out when you were standing up or just now? I'm just curious.

[Oz Perlman]

I'm not like, oh, no, no.

[Akash Singh]

Just now. Okay.

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

My brain is.

[Oz Perlman]

I'm sor.

[Andrew Schulz]

Cynical. I'm, like, trying to find how you led him down that path. Yeah.

[Mark Agnon]

Is it okay if we ask you about the effects.

[Andrew Schulz]

Okay, this is what I'm thinking about right now. At this time, I'm like, I just want you to do this, and I want to fully just indulge in it and not think about the way that you did it. And then there's this other part of me that's like, I want to know. I want to know. And I have ideas about how maybe you've, like, used certain words to prime him in a certain direction and then.

[Akash Singh]

Create that outcome back of his fucking head.

[Andrew Schulz]

I know he did. I don't know if you rolled your eyes like I was being an idiot or like, you've heard this a million times.

[Oz Perlman]

Never heard it. Never heard.

[Mark Agnon]

You hug.

[Oz Perlman]

The line of the best kind of engagement, which is you're both angry and happy at the same time.

[Andrew Schulz]

I just want indulge because I just wanted to have the most fun. But there is this part of me that goes, oh, I see how he pushed him in that direction.

[Oz Perlman]

Well, it's funny. Is. It's. It's jazz. So it's. It's. Again, I paraphrase with comedy because comedy.

[Andrew Schulz]

So good is you're reacting to the stimulus that you have in front of you.

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah. Everything's happening in real time, and there's different people. Listen, there's a handful of us that do this stuff. That's the funny thing. You asked me. Magicians, tons of magicians.

[Andrew Schulz]

You said dead or alive, multiple times.

[Oz Perlman]

Right, Right.

[Andrew Schulz]

And then you switch the order.

[Oz Perlman]

Right.

[Andrew Schulz]

And I'm wondering if you're. If you're priming him to give a dead person. And that's just where my brain was going. I also.

[Mark Agnon]

He.

[Andrew Schulz]

You know, he's got him on his arm.

[Kiana]

Like, that's what I thought.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

Maybe he just hedged on a tattoo. I only go to black guys with tattoos on. This is a very specific Sticking to football teams, primarily. Would this be a skill. Where are your tattoos? Nothing. Nothing. All right.

[Mark Agnon]

Nothing. Not yet. Would this be a skill that you would touch.

[Oz Perlman]

You mark. You don't even know what I just planted on him. Microchip embedded. I got everything.

[Mark Agnon]

What'd you call this? Applied cold reading.

[Oz Perlman]

There's a ton of cold reading mixed in. But here's the secret sauce. Okay. There's a lot of secret sauces, but I can tell you that mine is that there's so many methods going on at once that I will lead you in a maze, and when you get to this one, and you're really. Here's the cheese. And you got. Right there. You could smell it. Boom. You hit a wall. You have to go all the way around. Because I typically, like, in a day like today, there will be 8, 9, 10 different methods that I do the same thing. So that even my peers, even the people who do what I do, again, they don't humble, brag. They do not know. There's. I did for Howard Stern, something that I assure you, nobody in my field can understand how I did it. Because he will go to his grave. This is one thing of guessing a person. He will go to his grave saying, I never shared that with anybody. I never wrote it. I never put it any. I didn't have my phone. I didn't whisper it. My wife didn't even know this. Somebody died and then told me it before they died. He did a bit with Valerie Harper. Do you know about this? Valerie Harper was a big sitcom star in the 70s and 80s. She was Rhoda. And so she had terminal cancer. She told him a word. Because they wanted to check the Houdini test. You know, the Houdini test, which is Houdini told his wife before he died. If psychics are a real thing and it's not B.S. i'm going to tell you a word. Never write it down. Ever. Never write it. Because that's what psych is. You write it. Maybe we could see it, right? You whisper it. Somebody can hear it. Yeah, right. You. You put on your phone. Nothing. I want nothing. I want it to stay in my mind forever. And if somebody can guess it, then that means you told it them from past, from out of the grave. And so I told Howard. He's had psychics on every year for a decade trying to guess this word. No one's ever gotten it.

[Andrew Schulz]

Holy.

[Oz Perlman]

And so we went out and I told him flat out. I go, howard, I'm not a psychic. This is not. There's no. There's nobody telling me from the dead. Yeah, I'm gonna figure it out. I'm gonna figure it out the same way somebody looks at Wheel of Fortune, sees all the letters, and starts to piece together that puzzle. Only I do Wheel of Fortune without Vanna White. You see what I'm saying? I just go right to it. So here's what. It's good. I figured out how many letters it was, and then I. He goes, did you know that you were going to get it right before? I'm like, are you kidding me? I've been driving my wife crazy the last month. She's like, what if you do. If you get it wrong?

[Andrew Schulz]

I'm like, that's the next swings, baby. So has there ever been a situation where you're in a high stakes moment and it didn't go well?

[Oz Perlman]

And dude, that was as high stakes as it gets. Like, there was no, but that went well. Oh, he went great. Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

So as like, like, has there been a situation where, okay, this is a high stakes moment. It's not going the way you want. Do you plan another thing in the event? Got it. So you have fail. Say fail. Say fail.

[Oz Perlman]

Say big time. Like I did Rogan. This is going to air after Rogan. So Rogan. I had so many things going in there, but I don't want to. I love Joe. Yeah, that's Lion's Den. He goes. Yeah, he is skeptical. Yep, he is. There was, I don't want to call it combative, but when I walked in the door, there was no jokey humor. It was not like, what's up? This wasn't like, here it. He was serious.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

And he did not know I was gonna guess his pin code on air.

[Andrew Schulz]

That was unbelievable.

[Oz Perlman]

There was no mention of a pin code before that moment to him and that. And so he, he's, he doesn't. He thinks that I somehow stole his identity.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

And everyone thinks I'm a Mossad agent. So that was quite funny in the comments.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, you did guess you guessed the bank code. I don't know if you're leaning into stereotypes, but if you know somebody at the bank, that might be an easy thing.

[Akash Singh]

That is like your go to thing. Now that I. Now that you mentioned it, it's always bank related.

[Andrew Schulz]

I asked him, I asked him. I was like, how do you pronounce name? He's like, it's O. Like owes you money or something.

[Akash Singh]

Also, guys, show dates. I'm not doing as many dates this summer, but we got a lot coming in the fall and winter. But next week, one of the best comedy clubs in the country, wise guys. June 19th through the 21st. I'm there. Get your tickets@akash singh.com. also July in Oklahoma. Probably going to have to get moved. I think you might have got an email already. I'm going to be in August. I'm going to be in Kansas City and Ohio. Check all these dates out and more at Akash Singh. Now let's get back to the show.

[Mark Agnon]

What's up, guys? Schultz isn't on the road. Akash is taking the summer off. What's the next best thing? A bunch of comics and then me. So come see me in Poughkeepsie Portland.

[Akash Singh]

Put your mother on that thing.

[Mark Agnon]

Fort Worth, Austin, Texas, and many more dates. I also am doing a show at Mary Lou in New York City at the last week of every single month. I would love to see you guys there. Mary Lou, an amazing show, and everyone on the tour so far has been amazing. Raleigh, Indianapolis. You guys are the best.

[Akash Singh]

Your name is Mary Lou.

[Mark Agnon]

The shows keep on free if you suck his dick on coming. So I'll see you guys there.

[Akash Singh]

I love you speaking of coming so much.

[Andrew Schulz]

Okay, okay, okay, okay. Next, Next. The trick is like, I want to ask you so many questions, but I also know that you have other things set up. So this is a weird interview where it's like, you're the one that's really at the wheel here. Yeah. Do you feel that every time you're in one of these positions?

[Oz Perlman]

I take charge when I want to.

[Andrew Schulz]

Thank you.

[Mark Agnon]

Yeah.

[Akash Singh]

That was hot.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

All right, how about this spontaneous. Think of your best friend.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, you're about to hurt somebody's feelings right now. Oh, my God. Somebody's feeling. This is great. Justin is.

[Oz Perlman]

See you see him?

[Andrew Schulz]

He's like, hello, Mark. How are you?

[Oz Perlman]

Okay, if I told you right now, think of your best friend.

[Mark Agnon]

Okay.

[Oz Perlman]

Chat. GPT, man. We just go in there. What if we take. Pronounce. Is it ganyon?

[Mark Agnon]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

How do you say it?

[Mark Agnon]

I say Gagnon just because we're in America, but is the French.

[Oz Perlman]

Do you speak French?

[Mark Agnon]

No.

[Oz Perlman]

Okay. Okay. Gagnon. Okay. So Gagnon. Didn't expect you to say it that way. That sounded weird. So if we were to analyze. I said, right now, think. Your best friend.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

First off, he cycled because he was debating. He looked at you, but then he. More business. It's the high water, Mark, just getting you to laugh.

[Andrew Schulz]

I didn't even put go, go.

[Oz Perlman]

I would do that. And I always go to the devil's advocate. The people watching this who are gonna be like, dude, he knew who you were. Me, pretending I don't. Your name. All this is an act. It's all fake. I could have looked everything up about you. I could have processed all of his Instagram photos. Yep. Statistical analysis. Who's he tagged the most? Where's he been? He's like, I was thinking of him, but he's. We've been. We go further, deeper. How about this? Let's go back in time. Did you play sports as a kid?

[Mark Agnon]

Yes.

[Oz Perlman]

What was your top sport?

[Mark Agnon]

Soccer.

[Oz Perlman]

Your soccer?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

Until what age?

[Mark Agnon]

So I was like, 18.

[Oz Perlman]

Oh, so you're Like a legit soccer player.

[Mark Agnon]

I played for a while.

[Oz Perlman]

He's not a hater.

[Andrew Schulz]

He's a hater. Mark was a very good soccer player.

[Akash Singh]

Guess what Al did when he was in high school.

[Andrew Schulz]

Based on his hair and dentist and.

[Oz Perlman]

The double X in media, back on Mark. You go. Soccer.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

Think of a player you played soccer with.

[Mark Agnon]

Okay. Can I have a second? Sometimes I get too nervous.

[Oz Perlman]

No, change it right now. See, that's what I want. I want nervous energy. I want spontaneous in the moment.

[Kiana]

Okay.

[Mark Agnon]

I can think of it.

[Andrew Schulz]

Are you married?

[Mark Agnon]

I am married.

[Oz Perlman]

He's like, how did you know that? How did you know that?

[Akash Singh]

He'll take it off for you.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yes.

[Oz Perlman]

Slid right off so easily.

[Mark Agnon]

I'm thinking of the person.

[Oz Perlman]

How long you been married?

[Mark Agnon]

Five years.

[Oz Perlman]

You passed the test. All right, let's keep going. Let's keep going. I'm gonna see where this gets interesting. How long did you know your wife before you got married?

[Mark Agnon]

About like six years.

[Oz Perlman]

Okay. Took your time. No problem. Go back in time. Soccer. 18 was too old. I want formative years. I'm gonna put you on the spot. Close your eyes.

[Mark Agnon]

Okay.

[Oz Perlman]

I want you to go back in time and I want you to picture the face of the first girl you ever had a big crush on. A lot of tongue motion underneath the mouth. They've seen that. Open your eyes. Yeah. Watch this without using your fingers, because I can see your fingers. People don't realize they do this in front of me. Count how many letters are in this person's name. Your first crush. Count the number of letters to yourself. Don't say it. See? Guess right now, that wasn't an instant name. Right. If that name is three or four letters, you don't count, you know? Do you understand what that is? It's called a sight word for, like first graders. You learn the word because you don't read it. You know what it looks like? If that name was like. Like Alexandra.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

He'd be struggling. He'd be like, yeah, that was a middle sized name. That name is 5, 6, 7 letters. Watching. 5, 6, 7. Look how he nodded when I said 7. He was trying to rush me along. Yeah, because I already said six. It's six letters long, isn't it? That's correct.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yes. Brandon. Brandon. Brandon's about to rhino charge Austin.

[Oz Perlman]

I like the Haitian energy in this room.

[Andrew Schulz]

Witchcraft. I don't.

[Oz Perlman]

Six letters. That wasn't that hard. That was. Come on. That's not that hard. It's pretty hard. The two A's in the middle. That's hard. I'm hard here. He's actually hard. That got weird. All right, six letters before today, when was the last time before me asking you to think of this person, when was the last time she had even entered your mind? Be honest. Would it have been days, months or years?

[Mark Agnon]

Probably like a year and a half.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

It doesn't match up with the six year marriage, but okay, that's five year.

[Andrew Schulz]

Marriage plus six years before that.

[Oz Perlman]

All right, year and a half since he thought of this person before today when I asked him, think of the letters. Mix them up. Mix them up.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

Grab one. Don't say it. Grab one.

[Mark Agnon]

Okay.

[Oz Perlman]

I got a scrabble towel. I'm gonna do some Scrabble tiles later, but I want you to imagine. Just grab one of these letters.

[Mark Agnon]

Okay?

[Oz Perlman]

Out right now. Right now in your head. You gotta open your eyes.

[Mark Agnon]

Yes.

[Oz Perlman]

Look at the word. And you didn't go to the end. You didn't do the last letter, did you?

[Mark Agnon]

No.

[Oz Perlman]

Didn't feel like it. It went like a back and forth and you debated between two and then you jumped to the later one. D. Are you thinking of a D? Don't say anything. He thought of the D and he switched the one right before it. Bam. Totally knew that. You freaking liar. I knew you did. The D.

[Mark Agnon]

About you.

[Andrew Schulz]

Another D. Here's the thing.

[Oz Perlman]

Everybody who's a podcast listener, I wrote it down. I've showed it to Alex, Akash and Andrew. Is that correct? Hasn't thought of this person a year and a half. What? Would you peg the percentages that I could have found this from social media somewhere? Is it like half a percent? Little percentage is zero. There's no way you've ever posted this, Ever talked about this, ever. Is that a fair assessment?

[Mark Agnon]

Yeah, probably never talked about it. Maybe a follow? Maybe a follow on Instagram.

[Oz Perlman]

Okay. How many followers you got?

[Mark Agnon]

85. 14,000 or something.

[Oz Perlman]

That's not bad. Dinko. 384,000. What's her name?

[Mark Agnon]

The name is Jordan.

[Oz Perlman]

Jordan is the name of the first one. Jordan is the name of this first one.

[Andrew Schulz]

Holy. Can we pull up the Instagram to just see?

[Oz Perlman]

It's mostly dudes named Jordan. Yeah, Jordan 4389. Not a good person. No, no, we agreed. I. You don't have to.

[Andrew Schulz]

Why do you seem unimpressed by that? Like, that was unbelievable.

[Akash Singh]

I think he's a little thrown off. He's a little rattled.

[Andrew Schulz]

Unsettled.

[Akash Singh]

He's unsettled.

[Andrew Schulz]

Are you gonna be dealing with something at home? Is that the Concern. What are you processing right now?

[Oz Perlman]

A man didn't mean to bring this up.

[Mark Agnon]

By now, this is a fifth grade girl that I dated for two days.

[Oz Perlman]

Fourth grade. Check later. It was exactly fourth grade.

[Akash Singh]

No fucking chance. No fucking chance.

[Mark Agnon]

No, no, no, no, no, no, no. It was fifth grade. You almost got me. I was homeschooled to fifth grade, so.

[Oz Perlman]

It's actually his sister, for the record.

[Mark Agnon]

How'd you know that?

[Andrew Schulz]

Wait, why would you check in fourth grade? What would you think?

[Oz Perlman]

I don't know. He's gonna check later. It. See the holy. You were right. It was fourth grade.

[Andrew Schulz]

Wait, why would it be fourth grade?

[Oz Perlman]

I don't check later. He was. He was home.

[Akash Singh]

He's homeschool till fifth grade.

[Oz Perlman]

Maybe she was in fourth grade.

[Mark Agnon]

No, no, no. We were same grade. We were same grade.

[Oz Perlman]

All right.

[Mark Agnon]

I'm not.

[Oz Perlman]

I'm not like, can't get. Every time. Younger woman, one year. It's age appropriate, to be honest.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yo, we got a. Oh, my goodness. Okay.

[Oz Perlman]

All right.

[Andrew Schulz]

Do me now. Go.

[Oz Perlman]

There's going to be no interview.

[Andrew Schulz]

Nothing is more interesting than magic. Like, I could. Okay, you run the interview. No, I know about it. I know about it. But there's nothing more interesting than what you're doing right now. So I can ask you about the ultramarathons.

[Oz Perlman]

I look looked up that you won.

[Andrew Schulz]

The New Jersey marathon four times.

[Oz Perlman]

That's true.

[Andrew Schulz]

I thought that in the notes that it was like a typo. I thought it was run and. Oh, it was supposed to be run, but it was.

[Oz Perlman]

What?

[Andrew Schulz]

No, you actually won it for.

[Oz Perlman]

Won it? Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Did they not allow the Africa?

[Oz Perlman]

I think so.

[Andrew Schulz]

How did you. Did you beat them?

[Oz Perlman]

Just put a mind sp. There's no money in it, so there's no prize money, so they don't run it. So. Yeah, they only weekend warriors.

[Andrew Schulz]

Got it.

[Oz Perlman]

It was still pretty fast back.

[Akash Singh]

You ran two marathons in a week.

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah, but you run them every day. Crazy story is I won two marathons back to back days, so I did the Hamptons marathon on a Saturday and Yonkers marathon on a Sunday. I won them both.

[Andrew Schulz]

Wow.

[Oz Perlman]

Wow.

[Andrew Schulz]

Those are winnable.

[Oz Perlman]

Those are winnable.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Those you could win back to back.

[Oz Perlman]

It's an interesting dynamic change from the Hamptons to Yonkers.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah. If you win like nairob, then maybe.

[Oz Perlman]

And for real. Yeah.

[Mark Agnon]

But they wouldn't let a witch run it, though.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, that's true. Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

It wouldn't make it there. Holy shit.

[Andrew Schulz]

Okay.

[Mark Agnon]

Is there a peer that has done an effect to you? That's that you're unable to explain how.

[Oz Perlman]

That'S the best thing. That's the best feeling ever. When somebody just. Just rattles you and you go, oh, my God. How did you do that? And the problem is, I go right into Andrew mode, which is I want to know how.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yes.

[Oz Perlman]

Right. Because that's my default setting. But then I also want to be like, enjoy this.

[Andrew Schulz]

Will they share it with you? Is there, like a code among.

[Oz Perlman]

Typically. Yes. Also in this kind of situation. Here's the thing. There's people that write or there's people that are creators, and there's performers, and there's very few. Both. There's so few in what I do. Because to be creative is one thing, but to actually execute.

[Andrew Schulz]

So are there certain guys that can create the. What do you call them? I don't want to belittle them by calling them tricks. Let's call them tricks. Okay.

[Oz Perlman]

So there's certain people when somebody calls it a vaudevillian, like, do your skit. Do your skit.

[Andrew Schulz]

This is with us.

[Oz Perlman]

Do that skit again.

[Akash Singh]

I love your skit.

[Mark Agnon]

We call them effects within the. Within the industry.

[Andrew Schulz]

Oh, within the community. Got it.

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah. Yeah. That's what he said he told Jordan in fifth grade. You know what I'm saying? This is going to be an effect.

[Andrew Schulz]

So. So there are guys that maybe come up with the effects, but they don't have the skills to actually execute them.

[Oz Perlman]

I would say the skills is one way to put it, but a lot of them are just not performers. So just, it's. It's, you know, snl. How many. How many writers are there? I'm not saying they're not talented, but getting on muscle, execution is the difficult part in this profession.

[Andrew Schulz]

And did you. Were you always good at that, or is that a skill that you had to develop?

[Oz Perlman]

Develop? I think it was skill developed. Like, I've been doing this. I was a teenager, but I did magic at restaurants when I was a kid.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

And that was really what got me good. That's where the 10,000, 20,000 hours were put in. Because I got my first restaurant gig when I was 14.

[Andrew Schulz]

Do you remember where it was?

[Oz Perlman]

100. Where a big part of my book. It's called Zias. It's in Michigan.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yep.

[Oz Perlman]

I walk there half a mile from my house. Don't know how I had the confidence, good sales tactics. Talked my way into this thing Tuesday nights. That was my night. I did three hours table to table. Dude, imagine you're at a restaurant. You got a babysitter the kids are at home and some 14 year old kid comes up to the table wanting to do card tricks. Like, dude, get out of here. You kidding me?

[Andrew Schulz]

Okay, go on.

[Oz Perlman]

Some people would, some people wouldn't, but some people. So you have to learn school of hard knocks. How to win people over.

[Andrew Schulz]

Quick.

[Oz Perlman]

Quick is the name of the game. That's exactly it. What is your body language? Like what you iterate. When I turn this way, it's different than if I go head on. The same way that animals, when they go eye to eye, they feel. Feel imposing.

[Andrew Schulz]

So you're like looking over your shoulder almost. You're not giving them too much time constraint.

[Oz Perlman]

There's a million things that I learned how to approach a table in less than 10 seconds. Typically 5 seconds answer every question that was in their mind that was unanswered, which is right when they see me, automatically they go, who is this? Do I have to give this person money? Do I have cash? What are they doing here? Are they any good? Did the restaurant know they're here? All of those questions I try to answer in the least amount of words possible.

[Andrew Schulz]

Can you, can you give us that breakdown? I imagine you haven't done this in decades. So like what was your 5 second? What was your 5 second? I'm going to break the table. They're having a big dinner. It's a family dinner. Somebody's just got engaged as a celebration. You're going to interrupt it. How do you stop them?

[Oz Perlman]

Five seconds. First off, you find the right moment. So people like husband and wife is crying and they're like having a.

[Andrew Schulz]

You're in there.

[Oz Perlman]

So I hear you've been cheating on her. Well, I've got something amazing as well.

[Akash Singh]

Yeah. Can you make this disappear?

[Oz Perlman]

Okay, Keep that in his pants. I'm like, I can only make things up here. Not dis. So you walk up and the first thing I say is, you guys are in luck. Like right away. That's a great way at an angle. You guys are in luck. The owner brought me in as a special treat to you tonight. But I only have two minutes. So it's like right away.

[Andrew Schulz]

This is great.

[Mark Agnon]

You only have two minutes.

[Oz Perlman]

I only have two.

[Andrew Schulz]

You're leaving?

[Oz Perlman]

I'm leaving.

[Andrew Schulz]

They're getting something. They don't know what they're getting. So curiosity is.

[Oz Perlman]

The owner has me here as a treat, immediately takes away the first thing which to me is like, yo, guys coming up to me. Do I have to have some cash right now? Awkwardness. I'm taking away that I'm taking away all of the resistance.

[Mark Agnon]

And if you say no, you're being disrespectful to the person that gave you as the gift.

[Oz Perlman]

Of course, the owner brought me in special.

[Andrew Schulz]

You clean windshields on the street. You should be paying attention to this right now.

[Mark Agnon]

If you sell anything.

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah, yeah, you're cleaning windshields. You're moving up. But that's literally what I've done is sales training, is understand how to think like a mentalist. Because most of what I do is selling an item, which is amazement. Right. That's what I sell. You sell laughter, I sell amazement. I sell wonder. Moments that are memorable, that you go, how did he know that? Right. And that feeling you had at that moment when you felt it. But everyone knows it's not real. And I know it's not real. I'm not really reading your mind. I've explained that through and through. I've learned how people think, the core skills of what I do. If you can distill them from the performance, because guessing Martin Luther King or guessing a name is not effective in your life. But if you have the same skills to read people and know exactly, like I said, what they're thinking, how do you improve your sales by huge.

[Andrew Schulz]

How is that not reading their mind, though? Like, what is the difference?

[Oz Perlman]

Was that reading minds by. When I walk up, know what they're going to think in that moment? Moment. Like, that's what a great salesperson does, I guess.

[Andrew Schulz]

But I would say that those things are the same in a lot of ways. Like, even if you push them down a direction to think a certain thing, like, you are still, at the end of the day, you have to figure out Jordan.

[Oz Perlman]

Right.

[Andrew Schulz]

And that is, I would say, reading his mind to a certain extent.

[Oz Perlman]

Oh, absolutely. Well, again, I got the letter because you did. What was the letter you thought of? Which letter did you go with when you. When I said pick a letter.

[Mark Agnon]

So I was thinking a. Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

So he did, I told you, switch the one before. I said, I knew it. So. Because I had told him, don't do a vowel. And so he did. He said, oh, I'm a screw more do a vowel instead. Because I mentioned the Scrabble tiles. I said there'd be no vowels. And so he went to the A. And I said, I knew that he would do the D. And then he jumped over. I. I could show you how I put the whole thing together.

[Andrew Schulz]

Right.

[Oz Perlman]

But that's the interesting part.

[Andrew Schulz]

Okay, so you're 14 years old. You. Do you ever, in your Life. I remember reading somewhere that you, you. You broke your fear of rejection at a young age. Was there ever a time in your life had to.

[Oz Perlman]

Because, man, people just shot you down at a restaurant. And if you go to five tables in a row where they get out of here, they're like, oh, dude, I don't, I don't have time for this. Like dismissive, rude people that don't have thick skin. That's done.

[Andrew Schulz]

So what did you do with dismissive rude?

[Oz Perlman]

So I think what I learned, I had some sort of weird schizophrenic break in my mind, which I've used for the rest of my life. That's saved me. Rejection is I silo. I literally created two people the same way. You have an agent. Your agent negotiates your deals.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

They do bad cop. Do this gig. You tell them that, Right. You don't want to get on the phone. You're Andrew. You're the nice guy. So if you can create a disconnect that you just somehow slice in my brain where I decide, they aren't insulting me. They don't know me.

[Andrew Schulz]

They're insulting the circumstances.

[Oz Perlman]

They're insulting. Nope. I had like, in my mind, there's Oz, the entertainer, there's Oz Perlman. These are two different people. You know, it's like a Sia and like the. It's like the Daft Punk guy. One's got the helmet, one takes it off. He takes his kids to school. Nobody knows who he is. I just somehow took the sting away. Cause I realized this is not gonna sit well. Cause after two tables reject me, I go to the next table with negative energy.

[Andrew Schulz]

Right? And they can feel it. They can sense. Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

But I'm also rude and mean, and I gotta take that away. So I had to figure out a way for my own self preservation to be. Be like, okay, I'm gonna put it all on on me. They had a bad night. They might have just been home with their kids. Their kid might have puked. I don't know. I had like some sort of maturity level where I'm like, they have issues. It's not my fault. So I'm gonna let that go. They don't know the real me. This didn't hurt at all. And I think that's good. I, you know, I learned it from buddies who were good with girls.

[Akash Singh]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

Who just had numbers game where I look at them and I'm like, I couldn't do this in my real life. She rejects me. She's like, you gotta be kidding, right? Now I'm like, oh. Because there was no. It was the entertainer. She didn't want me.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

But when I was performing, I could separate myself, and so I had to learn. And I think it's useful in life. Anything you're doing, you don't realize it. You're selling. Everyone's selling something.

[Andrew Schulz]

What is your best opener? Now you're walking up to a complete stranger in the street. What is your best go to opener for?

[Oz Perlman]

For a professional thing or for what reason?

[Andrew Schulz]

It could be anything. You want to stop that person in the street because you want to deliver a trick. You want to talk to them. But, like, what is the one sentence in your life right now that if you need somebody's attention for 15 seconds uninterrupted, that you open with?

[Oz Perlman]

Well, if it's for me performing, like, I have a very different thing than if it's actually talk to somebody. But I also like the situation.

[Andrew Schulz]

What if it's you just want to talk to somebody?

[Oz Perlman]

If I want to talk to somebody?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah. You want to talk to Obama. You came up to and you had a line.

[Akash Singh]

He's asking about your sales technique. Yeah, generally, yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

Oh. So right away, you create a dopamine hit. Right. So people want excitement. People like, when you know why your phone's so addictive? Because whenever it buzzes, you don't know what's at the end of that. It's the lottery. You might just won the lottery. Who just texted me. I got to see it. Who just liked my photo, who just commented, who just followed me. Right. Like, you don't know the limitless opportunities. So you never want to pigeonhole yourself. So I like to do things that are hanging threads. If I. If I meet somebody, I've done this a million times, meet somebody super famous, and we've had a real connection. And in that moment, I want to set us up as equals. Power dynamic.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

I don't want to be like, oh, let me get the selfie. Let me do this. I'm like, what do we do, man? How do we keep in touch? I like that phrase. Oh.

[Andrew Schulz]

Because it puts the ball in their court.

[Oz Perlman]

It puts the ball in their court, but it assesses where we are versus if I have to ask you, hey, can I get your number? Number? Maybe they're gonna say no. I've also given you a no question. Always have questions that can be continued. The best lines are ones that don't have a hard answer. They allow people to open up and that they're questions. People haven't been Asked before. Like you've been asked the same 20 questions about comedy your whole life. Sure. And I could go down the list the same as me, how'd you get in this? Did someone in your family. There's like a whole list because we have unique professions.

[Andrew Schulz]

Right?

[Oz Perlman]

Right. You never ask an insurance salesman, was your dad insured? Sale. I don't give a. Yeah, no offense. If you're insurance salesman, they book me a lot. I love insurance. But I'm saying that in that situation, if you could say if you could go back in time to when you were 7 years old, what would you tell yourself? Now that's wow, I never thought of that. Right. Like a question that's fascinating.

[Andrew Schulz]

So give me an example of that. Like a fascinating question. You're at a grocery store, there's so.

[Oz Perlman]

Many that do it based on reading the person you're asking me like, how would I play little leagues? Too open ended when I'm in MLB, like I would know. I know 20 things about that person.

[Andrew Schulz]

What if you don't seeing them? What if it. Oh, you're saying that you're already reading them by observing them. And then based on what you're getting from them, you'll formulate the question that.

[Oz Perlman]

Will be the When I'm negotiating real estate and like my transactions be like, oh, what if he won't take lower? I'm like, I know he'll take lower.

[Andrew Schulz]

So it's a useful skill in life. Outside of that, like do people use it? Interrogations do.

[Oz Perlman]

I personally have never done anything like that. I've been offered considerable money time and again by like law firms, various firms to can you do this for us as a skill that's outside of the guise of entertainment, why don't you do it? So I haven't done it yet and I'm going to tell you why. There's two reasons. One is it's hard for me to quantify the number of the tactical advantage I would give give you. Right. I don't want to right now. I know that if I go do a show, I know how well I'm going to do. Like I know that I can deliver. I never want to be a guy who doesn't exceed and vastly exceed expectations. So if I do that, I'm going to do something where you do a deal and you go, oh my God, this guy just knocked out of the park for me and that's going to be word of mouth. Also this is doing very well right now. So I'm not expanding beyond the book's coming out. But like I don't. I'll keynote speak, but picking juries is not what I like decided would be my life's mission.

[Andrew Schulz]

But do you think some successful lawyers are using some of these school skills?

[Oz Perlman]

I'd be very curious if anyone's using. For sure they are. I've spoken to them.

[Andrew Schulz]

Oh really?

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

So are they aware that they're doing it? Have they studied it like you or is it just part of their communication technique that they've developed throughout their life and it is successful?

[Oz Perlman]

I think there's a Venn diagram overlap because people have noted like when I did the Rogan that I'm speaking fast, I'm doing stuff because I can control based on my pacing. See how we slowed down? See where you moved?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

What happens in the moment.

[Andrew Schulz]

So if there's not everybody is comfortable at a high speed and when they're uncomfortable, you have way more control of the interaction, bringing the speed to a level of their comfort. You lose control of the interaction potentially.

[Oz Perlman]

They can also intercept. So when people want to speak, what they do, I can normally speak at this pace, but when I'm going fast and I'm doing something performance wise, I know where I'm going to guide you. The speed, my voice.

[Andrew Schulz]

And they're thinking, they're thinking less, they're not.

[Oz Perlman]

I. I'm moving your mind in the direction I want based on the speed, the words, what I'm doing and I'm watching your reactions to know when you're going to where I want. All right.

[Andrew Schulz]

At what age do you start developing these ancillary tools to make the art, to take the art to the next level?

[Oz Perlman]

I think I started. So I started doing mentalism more and more in like the. I hated mentalism when I was a kid. Why boring? Cuz I wanted tricks. Like the fun thing about magic is you can buy a trick, you can practice it and then it works and then you get that reaction.

[Andrew Schulz]

I did it as a kid. Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

It's so fun.

[Andrew Schulz]

I bought that there was like some magic. It was like a VHS tape they would send you to break down all the tricks and it was fucking incredible. Like somebody's name would write on a coin and it would end up being in like a piece of bread at the table and they're like how the fuck did you do it? And like learning how it happens, it's kind of, it's almost, almost boring for the magician. So boring because it's this one little sleight of hand move and then all this other yeah.

[Akash Singh]

Once you find out how magic trick is done, you're so disappointed.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah. It's almost like we should never divulge that. Because the people that get to witness the magic lose their joy and wonder.

[Akash Singh]

You take away the magic.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Mark Agnon]

I almost feel shame because it's like, how did I get tricked by something so simple?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yes. Yeah. So he's just using the bathroom. We're not doing or setting up any trick.

[Oz Perlman]

It's a number one, it's not a two.

[Akash Singh]

Everybody knew that.

[Andrew Schulz]

Okay. Okay. Can we do another thing is.

[Oz Perlman]

No.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yes.

[Kiana]

Is this. Does it make it hard for, like, human connection? Because you can pretty much read people and tell if they're lying to you or trying to mislead you or can you.

[Oz Perlman]

So. No, people definitely can. Like, there's no. It's not a. The problem is, it's the reason you can't just do this in every life. Like, because people are like, why don't you take over the world? Right. Why is it not a superpower? Because it's done under a certain guise. So people allow themselves the same way a hypnotist. When a hypnotist hypnotizes you, you can't be hypnotized against your will. You can't.

[Andrew Schulz]

You have to submit to it a little bit.

[Oz Perlman]

You have to. There has to be some level suggestibility. When a hypnotist does a show in a stage setting, they do what's known as compliance testing. Everyone in the room put your hands together. They have different ways to see who is acquiescing. And it doesn't mean that they're faking it. It's really important to understand it's not faking it. Suggestibility is not faking. When those people do those things, like, you see some dude start walking in high heels, clucking like a chicken, and then a post hypnotic suggestion, they forgot it. That's real. There's no question. But they're allowing that hypnosis is real. They don't think it's a hard.

[Andrew Schulz]

That's not true. Like, I thought that they've calculated this. And then certain people are more hypnotizable than others.

[Oz Perlman]

Right. That's. That couldn't be more true.

[Andrew Schulz]

Okay. And that's what you're talking about, suggestibility and compliance testing. Like, some people really comply and they go, okay, you get up here.

[Oz Perlman]

So to answer your question, I. You can't. Those people can't just hypnotize you. You think like, oh, if you could do that, why can't you just Hypnotize this guy to go kill this guy. Like, give me your money. Like, you can't. You can't do it in your day to day life because people won't acquiesce to all the demands. So right now, if I'm in a setting and let's just make it simple, everyone said to me, why don't you just go to poker and just like, win poker every single time. Because if somebody has cards, I now know there's 52 cards. There's all different combinations. I have to watch you and say, look at those cards. Look at me. Think hearts, think diamonds. Like, they're not going to do all that. I can't do you understand? I have to guide them through.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

If it, if I claim to be such a psychic, then I'd be full of. I'm like, yeah, why can't you just guess? But I'm telling you, literally, I'm not psychic. I have a set of procedures that I'm putting you through to get to what the answer is.

[Andrew Schulz]

And that's probably why Specific sales. This is a huge advantage because you are one on one with them.

[Mark Agnon]

It requires some control.

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah, I think it requires a tremendous.

[Mark Agnon]

Amount of control in a poker game. You can't control what they do.

[Oz Perlman]

No. And it's a grind. And like, even if I have some success when I'm one on one with certain people playing Pokemon poker, but it's just like, you have to have such patience to just go through it and go through it. It's just not my nature. Super ADD of, like, I don't want to sit there and play poker for eight hours.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Akash Singh]

What's up, you noodle dicks? You see the blue lights? You know what time it is? It's time for Blue Chew. Hey, it's time for you to step up your sex game. There are legal steroids for sex, and it's called Blue Chew. Same active ingredients as all those other drugs. But it's the chew the guys have been rocking with us, pardon the pun, since very early on in this podcast. Let me explain to you something. Guys, guys. You think you're good at sex? You're not. You might be effective at cunnilingus. Your dick probably ain't shit. Probably is a lot to be desired. Al's dick is apparently huge. I don't think he knows how to use it. But with Blue Chew, he can last a lot longer, get harder, faster. This guy's old as shit, you know. He's a black guy, looks like he's 30. 5. That means he's 104 years old. Anyway, he needs all the help he can get and so do the rest of us. So all you gotta do, go to bluetooth.com and use the promo code flagrant and you can get your first month for free. You just gotta pay $5 for shipping. Shipping. That's it. Promo code flagrant. When you go to bluechew.com also make sure you check out all the details and safety information. But bluechew.com promo code flagrant first order for free. Just $5 for shipping. Let's get back to the show.

[Andrew Schulz]

All right, guys, take a break for a second. Listen, here's a dirty little secret that the insurance industry may want to keep under wraps. Insurance companies profit by holding on to your money for as long as possible. So after an accident, they might do whatever they can to delay or deny your claim. This. This way they can keep those profits growing. Morgan and Morgan fights hard against these corporations to fight to make sure you get every dollar you deserve if you're in court for an accident that is someone else's fault. The insurance companies just want jurors to think the at fault driver is the one paying the verdict amount so that they award a smaller settlement. Nobody wants to make one guy pay millions of dollars he can't afford to pay. But it's really the insurance companies who are covering the cost and doing anything they can to make the settlement as possible. When Morgan and Morgan takes on a case, they are almost always going after the big insurance companies and not the individuals that fault. Morgan and Morgan fights hard for their clients and these corporations know that. A recent client in Pennsylvania just received $29 million. Insurers best offer before that was 500 grand. Another recent client in Florida received 20 million. The last offer before that was zero. There's a reason why Morgan. Morgan is America's largest injury firm. Hiring the wrong firm can be disastrous. Hiring the right firm could substantially increase your settlement. With Morgan and Morgan it's easy to get started and their fee is free. Unless they win. Just visit forthepeople.com flagrant or dial pound law. That is pound 529. That is F O R the people.com flagrant or pound law. Pound 529. This is a paid advertisement. Now let's get back to the show.

[Oz Perlman]

Hold on. You wanted to do something fun?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

I walked in here.

[Andrew Schulz]

Let's.

[Oz Perlman]

Let's explain what happened. I got in here. I was soaking wet. Kash was wet too. And I asked you and we have one of the bookers, our. Who came in here, who does not believe any of this crap. Who said, like, there's just no way. And I said, do you have books here? Is that what was assessed? I asked, were you here with this question?

[Andrew Schulz]

I wasn't.

[Akash Singh]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

And so I told them to go get any books. I said, ideally, get two or three books that. These are forgetting my books. I don't even think they're your books. They went and picked them up and they brought them in. It was not Dove who. It was another young woman.

[Akash Singh]

Don't let him change books right now.

[Oz Perlman]

Tanya. Tanya, where are the books brought in? These are not my books. I. It's like. I don't know whose books these are. Do you guys even know? Were these given to you by someone on the show? Are they? I don't know who they are.

[Mark Agnon]

Okay. Yeah, those. Those are our.

[Andrew Schulz]

Oh, super plug right here. Okay. Yeah. We have our CIA handler, Andrew Bustamante.

[Oz Perlman]

He was awesome.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, yeah, he's great. And he has a book coming out, so that's shot. This sounds like a big plug. It's not a big plug. And then we also have a Roar in Harlem based on true events and.

[Oz Perlman]

Producers here to explain that. I have never set eyes upon these.

[Akash Singh]

You haven't met a Harlem.

[Oz Perlman]

What's that?

[Andrew Schulz]

I don't think this is even out yet. So I don't know if there's a way you could.

[Oz Perlman]

You know what? That's even better. Give that to anyone you want right now. Hand that to somebody. Or you can take it.

[Andrew Schulz]

I will take it. I would like to be part of this magic.

[Oz Perlman]

Perfect. Take that book. And is it okay if I take that one for the first time?

[Andrew Schulz]

Do you want it?

[Oz Perlman]

Is that okay?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, do whatever.

[Oz Perlman]

All right, here's what I'm gonna do. Let's get. Let's get teamwork. Teamwork makes the dream work. I'm gonna hold this up.

[Mark Agnon]

Okay.

[Oz Perlman]

And is there. Wait before. I don't want to look at it. Are there pictures on any of the pages? If so. I just don't like if it's. Is there a lot of pictures?

[Mark Agnon]

One picture.

[Oz Perlman]

But there's not like a. A ton of pictures that are.

[Andrew Schulz]

Right.

[Oz Perlman]

So here's what I'm doing. I'm going to flip through this book like this. Whenever you want, Mark, you're going to say stop right at that moment. Stop me. If I go one page past you. Let me know. Me and Akash. Hard eye contact. Look at those beautiful eyes. This guy either is freezing or angry. The Whole show. All right. I'm looking over at you. Make sure I'm going nice and slow, like steady, whenever I want. And I'm going to go through whenever you stop. Is it right there? I want you to take a look at the first word or two on the page. Is there any way in the world that I influence where he would stop?

[Andrew Schulz]

No. Which page? Because there's two pages.

[Oz Perlman]

I don't care. Did you look at something?

[Mark Agnon]

Yes.

[Oz Perlman]

Perfect. Did you each look at a word?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

I wonder. Okay. Grab it. Okay. I said first word or two. Because if you start reading, then you start looking for words you like.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

I didn't. I want this to be random. If I was going to tell you to pick a word you like, I say pick any page. You were quick on it. Did you do the first word?

[Andrew Schulz]

Word?

[Mark Agnon]

Correct.

[Oz Perlman]

Did you also do the first word?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yes.

[Oz Perlman]

Interesting. Because I. I offered it to you. I wonder what that means. They both like the word. Probably means it's not. And the He. She. If. Take this. I'm going to go nice and slow. Bring your book close to you. As I'm going, yell out, stop, stop. Tell us what page we're on. Either side, either direction you want. Tell us which page.

[Mark Agnon]

355.

[Oz Perlman]

Go to 3, 5. 5. Go to 3. 5, 5. Tell me when you're there. More pages.

[Andrew Schulz]

We don't have. 355.

[Oz Perlman]

Do it again. Do it again. Say stop.

[Kiana]

Stop.

[Oz Perlman]

Okay. Tell us what page?

[Mark Agnon]

138.

[Oz Perlman]

Open it up. Do you have that much? How short? This guy's book.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yes, we have. Yes, we do.

[Oz Perlman]

Bring it close to you. Look at the first word on the page. If it's. And she. He. The. If. If it's any of those five words, we do a different one. Did you look at the first word?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yep.

[Oz Perlman]

Close it. Okay. Now Andrew's going through his head thinking how. How could this be? Right?

[Andrew Schulz]

I mean, sure. Just. He's so handsome.

[Oz Perlman]

I want you each to do this. Imagine. Is your word something you could draw? Don't say anything. That's a no. That's a no. Because sometimes I do. If it's an object, they'll do it.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

If it's like a concept, it's different. If I had you describe this word without saying the word. Like, let's say the word was flagrant. Remember the first thing I said to you? Conspicuously offensive. Eight letter word. I want you to think of how you would describe this person. Would it be more visual? Would it be more of like a concept? Would it be More. Hmm. What was that book? Book. A Roar in Harlem. I'm getting it from you. I think I know it from you. Can I ask you a question? Sure.

[Kiana]

I'm scared.

[Akash Singh]

How's breathing?

[Oz Perlman]

Starting. Your lips, your lips. He's. He's been doing this. He's in word. Starts with an M, doesn't it?

[Kiana]

Holy shit.

[Andrew Schulz]

This is crazy.

[Akash Singh]

This is.

[Oz Perlman]

And then we're in. It's Harlem. We're in Manhattan. Is the word Manhattan.

[Mark Agnon]

That is Manhattan.

[Andrew Schulz]

That's crazy. What the.

[Oz Perlman]

Why'd you pick my words? Any two books? Look this way at me, at yours. Think of the first letter.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

Keep going all the way till you get to the last letter.

[Andrew Schulz]

Okay?

[Oz Perlman]

That's that. So. So this is. You always ask me, how does it work? Always. The last letter is helpful with a lot of words because a lot of words have the same last letter. They always do plurals, right? The air hissing little. The way you did that last letter is an S, isn't it? There's more than one of this books about the CIA. Something to do with food. Something to do with food. Hold on. Don't look. I'm going with this. I would have thought a cooking book. I'm done. I wrote it. Open your eyes. Oh, no. Look at us.

[Andrew Schulz]

Hold on, hold on. Let me just. You forgot the word. No, no, I got it. I got it. Yeah, yeah, I got it.

[Oz Perlman]

That. It's not a package food item, is it? Tell us, what's the word?

[Andrew Schulz]

Tourists.

[Oz Perlman]

Tourists, everybody. Yeah, yeah. Tourists is what I wrote down.

[Akash Singh]

Yo, that's crazy.

[Mark Agnon]

That's really good.

[Akash Singh]

That's crazy.

[Oz Perlman]

Those who simply listening. Andrew's melting down. He may bring back the Kim Jong Un haircut after the just in protest.

[Mark Agnon]

That's really good.

[Kiana]

How do I do this with my girl? When we ask what we're going to eat tonight, that's what I need, folks.

[Oz Perlman]

There's power. Limits to my powers. There's. I did the same thing yesterday. I'm like, are we doing Thai food? Are we doing sushi? She's like, no, no. Eight other things were listed. Then we went back to sushi an hour later.

[Mark Agnon]

I'm curious, in your show, I imagine there is a bunch of different things happening. You're doing all different types of effects and mag, magic and illusions. Right? So there's like cold reading and. And you know, stage, you know, effects and things like that. I'm curious, is there any like straight up gimmicks or trickery that exist in like the stage production?

[Oz Perlman]

Not really. For me, I like to be bulletproof. I can show up to your house with nothing. With like, I. I've literally done it. I'm in a bathing suit. It's a fourth of July party. And I'm like, you got a phone, you got books? You got this? You got that? Give me a Sharpie. I write something on someone's hand. Like, I've tried to get to the MacGyver State page of. What do you got? I got bubble gum, I got a hair clip. And I got this. Bam. I got an hour show. Because the. The highest level of purity in entertainment is a stand up comedian. Stand up comedian can stand in front of tens of thousands of people. Madison Square Garden. Right? You've done it. And just speak. Only your words are all you need. Wow. Did they get it? Nice. Left at espn. I was just on ESPN before this. Can I see? We got in there. Oh, we'll grab in a second. We'll grab in a second. It's a dry erase board and there should be. Are there inside. Open up. Letters. Alphabet letters. Bam. We got this. All right. We're gonna use this in a second. Left this at espn. Like, Alex, look. You're that good, why didn't you remember to bring it? I know my assistant on that one. All right, so I gotta stop. Mentalism is. No props are required. Magic. You still need the cards. Even though I love carts. Don't get me wrong, I want to sell to.

[Andrew Schulz]

Can we do some fun?

[Oz Perlman]

Let's do something. Are we ready?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah, let's do something. So who's good with cards?

[Andrew Schulz]

How did. Hold on. With the books. How did. So you guys just chose the books?

[Oz Perlman]

I need to be clear. I said to them to buy books.

[Akash Singh]

Yeah, I already chose the books at random. He wanted to go to Barnes and Noble first.

[Oz Perlman]

I told him, go buy books. I don't know what books he brought. These are not. I gotta be like 100% clear. I said go get any books.

[Andrew Schulz]

And you don't even get to look at the books or anything like that.

[Oz Perlman]

I told him to buy new ones from Barnes and Noble Nobles. I'll go to someone's house and say, go upstairs, get any book you want. That's of course.

[Andrew Schulz]

And you don't get to sit with.

[Akash Singh]

The book and then went to your 138.

[Andrew Schulz]

It doesn't matter the books.

[Akash Singh]

How would he have controlled that?

[Kiana]

He can't know the whole book.

[Andrew Schulz]

I mean, whatever. Okay, yeah, that's crazy.

[Akash Singh]

He's reading you in the moment.

[Kiana]

If I try to be like still and not give you anything. Is that gonna make your job harder?

[Oz Perlman]

No, because all it's a toys, make your own adventure.

[Andrew Schulz]

Hey.

[Oz Perlman]

We'Ll get to the bottom of it. Like, oh, you'll do that?

[Andrew Schulz]

So you have no time with the books. Like, if you have time with the books, I could probably reverse engineer how that happened. But if you have no time with the books, then it's like, no time with the book.

[Akash Singh]

I know, I know.

[Oz Perlman]

I can figure it out. I like how Mark just looked to see if every word in the whole book is Manhattan. He's like, no, I got it. I got it.

[Andrew Schulz]

Okay. This is my, like, fucking dumbass brain that is always trying to deconstruct, but I would just be like, okay, so annoying. You've looked at both the books. You. What page? You chose the page that I had on here.

[Oz Perlman]

I didn't choose the page. Did you not choose it?

[Andrew Schulz]

No, I didn't choose that page. Somebody else chose the page.

[Oz Perlman]

I said stop.

[Andrew Schulz]

I said stop.

[Kiana]

So wherever we stopped on that page, he just told you.

[Andrew Schulz]

And then the second time, you said.

[Oz Perlman]

To me, can I pick either page? That's your words. There are two pages. Are they the same word on both pages?

[Andrew Schulz]

But the second time you stopped, so there was. What is he.

[Kiana]

I know.

[Oz Perlman]

Keep going.

[Akash Singh]

Go, go, go.

[Andrew Schulz]

Can I just get there? Can I just get there? Okay, so the second time you stopped, the first time there wasn't enough pages. The second time you let me stop, the word on your page was. You guessed. You just guessed.

[Oz Perlman]

No, I thought you guys opened it somewhere in the middle and looked at a book that was totally separate.

[Andrew Schulz]

Ah, so you started that one. And then the next time you went through. We looked on my page.

[Oz Perlman]

Yep.

[Andrew Schulz]

Right. So maybe there's a version where you could. You already knew what? The word on 138 was here, and you forced Mark to stop at page 138. Because you're so good.

[Oz Perlman]

I don't.

[Andrew Schulz]

That's what I would do if I was a magician.

[Oz Perlman]

That's what I would do, too. But pick a new page. Pick a new page.

[Akash Singh]

That's why you're not a magician.

[Kiana]

Yeah, I know.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm a big skeptic. But that book's not even out. You can pre order it on Amazon.

[Mark Agnon]

Wait, which one? Bustamante gave that to us and dropped it off.

[Andrew Schulz]

It's been at the studio for, like, a month and he doesn't even look at the book. That's unbelievable. That is Alex.

[Oz Perlman]

What are we messing around with? Go out. Get any book you want. Anywhere in this place. Flip to any page and look at any word. I don't want the first word. I want any word. Go, go, go, go, go.

[Andrew Schulz]

Assistant.

[Oz Perlman]

Read a little something.

[Andrew Schulz]

Read a little something. Do something with your life.

[Akash Singh]

Yo. Mark is so tight that you're not making him the assistant.

[Andrew Schulz]

All right? You're in pissing this off of this.

[Oz Perlman]

Full transparency.

[Andrew Schulz]

There's no trick.

[Oz Perlman]

I just want him out of here.

[Mark Agnon]

The black magic assistant just runs away every trick.

[Andrew Schulz]

Are you going to do. Are you going to do. Are you going to do card or.

[Oz Perlman]

We need him back for that, though. We need back for the cards because it's four people.

[Andrew Schulz]

I'm sorry if I'm being cynical. Is there not a card in all of you that, like, is trying to deconstruct? But this is just.

[Oz Perlman]

What.

[Andrew Schulz]

I don't want to seem like a hater at all. You're not. I'm trying to make sense of something that is truly unbelievable. So I'm. I hope you don't feel like I don't appreciate what you've done. No.

[Akash Singh]

You're showing a lot of.

[Oz Perlman]

Oh, come on. Now. He's going to think I saw it.

[Andrew Schulz]

Chat the glasses. No, that was. That's unbelievable. The book's not out. The book is not out.

[Akash Singh]

Wait, wait.

[Andrew Schulz]

It's not out. It's not available.

[Oz Perlman]

How do you find and pick a word? I don't know, like, pick a word, like, somewhere in there. Interesting. You know what? Don't even let me say interesting. Because now that. That leads the way. Witness. Open any page you want. Remember what page number you picked.

[Kiana]

And what if I did that already?

[Oz Perlman]

Oh, you already did all that?

[Kiana]

Yeah, yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

Oh, beautiful. Leave the book outside.

[Andrew Schulz]

Al just threw that book. Look at his face. Get this on camera.

[Oz Perlman]

Small walk, but just scared out.

[Mark Agnon]

The Botox is helping.

[Oz Perlman]

Look at that.

[Andrew Schulz]

That was unbelievable. The book's not available. It's not available. Like, it would be different if you pick, like, Huckleberry Finn. But that's not available.

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

There's no way you can get the book.

[Akash Singh]

He also called out the number. The page number. So how could he have known?

[Andrew Schulz]

138. Alex's not gonna be able to keep this posture. So let's get through this.

[Mark Agnon]

He's not gonna remember the word.

[Oz Perlman]

No, no. We're gonna let this marinade. We're gonna let this marinade.

[Andrew Schulz]

I gotta do this. The whole fucking episode.

[Oz Perlman]

He's still flexing the whole time. All right.

[Andrew Schulz]

That is unbelievable. Possible. Okay. Yeah. I want to let Mark it in.

[Oz Perlman]

He really is A magician. Shuffle those up. Check him, check him out. Are those. Is that.

[Andrew Schulz]

The book's not available. It's not. It's not available. I don't. That's the thing, dude.

[Oz Perlman]

Dude, shuffle, make sure. Are they. Are they in some sort of order?

[Mark Agnon]

Are they mixed up with the jokers or is this.

[Oz Perlman]

I don't care, man. Leave the jokers, whatever. You want to take the jokers out, throw them away.

[Andrew Schulz]

Damn, Mark, you are killing that.

[Mark Agnon]

Okay. It's on my thigh.

[Oz Perlman]

What?

[Mark Agnon]

Can I not have a break? Dude? I'm not.

[Akash Singh]

I mean, for a magician, this is really not.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, this is.

[Mark Agnon]

I did more stage illusion. I was doing like bigger picture stuff. You know, Tigers, lions.

[Oz Perlman]

This is br.

[Mark Agnon]

I'm a Copperfield guy.

[Akash Singh]

This looks like he didn't have any male friends. Like, I never just play cards.

[Andrew Schulz]

My sisters.

[Oz Perlman]

Are they mixed up?

[Mark Agnon]

I think so.

[Oz Perlman]

All right, here's the thing here. I won't touch them. You hold them out. And Alex, I want you to lift off and you're going to put a pile in front. A pile in front. Lift off. You can't take the whole deck because you got to live. You got to leave a little for a cash.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

So take off anywhere between, let's say. Stop it.

[Andrew Schulz]

Stop it. Guys, he's gonna make it crack and.

[Kiana]

He'S gonna guess it.

[Andrew Schulz]

We broke him.

[Oz Perlman]

Chunk. It could be a little, could be a lot. Don't take the whole deck because you gotta leave a little for Akash to work with. Lift off a chunk, put on the table. I don't want to touch anything. You do. Are these shows shuffled?

[Akash Singh]

Are you showing so sassy.

[Oz Perlman]

Put him down. Ba. Bam. All right, Mark, same deal. Are you Akash, your turn. Lift off a chunk. But you got to take. You can take more than him, less than him, whatever you want. Put him down like in front of you, but kind of turn him this way right here. So no. Three piles right here.

[Akash Singh]

Okay, my bad, my bad.

[Kiana]

It's all good now you're doing too.

[Oz Perlman]

Much over next to it. On the side.

[Mark Agnon]

On this side.

[Andrew Schulz]

Sure.

[Oz Perlman]

Fair was that. Come on. Is there any way we can done something?

[Andrew Schulz]

No, no.

[Oz Perlman]

We gotta. We gotta make this exciting.

[Andrew Schulz]

Okay?

[Oz Perlman]

We need some skin in the game.

[Andrew Schulz]

Okay.

[Oz Perlman]

You know what? Let's make this fun. Let's make it rain in here.

[Andrew Schulz]

How's that?

[Oz Perlman]

Wait, hold on. I don't want to touch. I don't want to touch any of the cards. So take those bills and I don't want to touch anything. Throw those on the table. Throw those to Move the bills away. Just take the bills away just so we can still see the cards. I like how Akash got lightly aroused when I just.

[Akash Singh]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

He's like, we going to the club, baby? You going to the club?

[Akash Singh]

Hindu is not supposed to disrespect money. This is really making me feel.

[Oz Perlman]

I got this up any one of these bills. Gosh, I want you to. Or. Or pick up anyone. Walk around. Walk around and pick up any one of those bills.

[Akash Singh]

All right?

[Oz Perlman]

And fold it in half so the president on the inside give a nice good crease. Okay? Hold it one more time. Precision, precision, baby. Don't you do this and sit on it.

[Andrew Schulz]

Don't you do this.

[Oz Perlman]

You ever have this sensation? Let me ask you where your phone rings. Your phone rings and you don't. You vibrate and you're not expecting a call from this person. This isn't like your wife told you, but you somehow know who it is. Have you had that distinct feeling or never?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

You have not. Is that right? You said you have not had that feeling. Because I've had that before. I know who it is, but that's my job. Job. But you say, what a weird thing like intuition, instincts. How did I know this person was going to call?

[Akash Singh]

Anytime I'm annoyed by a call, I know it's my wife.

[Oz Perlman]

Okay?

[Akash Singh]

I get. My phone vibrates and I'm like, this is annoying. I know it's my wife.

[Andrew Schulz]

Maybe I have that had that feeling. I don't know. I don't know.

[Oz Perlman]

I said. And you said, I'm going to figure this out. And I don't mind that. And I said, imagine a deja vu moment where you somehow get a call and you feel it you didn't expect to have vibrate and you pick somebody at random and the phone's calling right now. Grab out your phone.

[Andrew Schulz]

Grab your.

[Oz Perlman]

Okay, yeah, yeah. Go to your contacts, please.

[Andrew Schulz]

Okay, yeah. Yep.

[Oz Perlman]

Where are you right now? At the front. At the back.

[Andrew Schulz]

Very top. Very top.

[Oz Perlman]

So I said to you to imagine as if you were getting a call from one person.

[Andrew Schulz]

Okay.

[Oz Perlman]

Is that right?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

Go to that person, scroll through, find them and hide it close to you.

[Andrew Schulz]

Okay.

[Oz Perlman]

This was picked completely at random.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yep.

[Oz Perlman]

This is totally random. Person, scroll through.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yep.

[Oz Perlman]

And I want you to find them. But before you open it up, do you know this person's phone number by heart?

[Andrew Schulz]

Not by heart.

[Oz Perlman]

Nobody knows anybody's phone number. Am I right? How many people's phone numbers do you know?

[Andrew Schulz]

Oh, wow.

[Oz Perlman]

Say it one more time. Mark. Pick up any one of those piles. Pick up any one of those piles. Put it in your hand, and I want you to put your fingers on the back where nothing can touch it. All right, here's this crazy. You could have picked anybody in your whole family phone. You could have picked anybody. I did not say to you who it was. You went through scrolled. You're like. Imagine this person calling you. Don't give us the area code because then we'll know who did. I. I don't want. I'm getting blown up. But tell us one digit at a time. You shuffle these cards up. I have not touched anything. Tell us all, one digit at a time. Their phone number. Start with the first digit. Not the area code. The first digit of this person's phone number.

[Akash Singh]

Believe this, too.

[Oz Perlman]

Okay, you know you could do it because we're not going to say the area code. What's the first number of their phone number? Lift up your finger, please. What's the next number?

[Kiana]

This is crazy.

[Oz Perlman]

Keep going.

[Andrew Schulz]

One.

[Oz Perlman]

There's no one. So how about an ace? Keep going fast. What else we got?

[Andrew Schulz]

Six.

[Oz Perlman]

Six.

[Andrew Schulz]

Seven. Seven, seven, eight.

[Oz Perlman]

Eight. There are $200. There are $200 littered around here. $200 littered around here. And I want to see. Every single one of them was printed somewhere. And how do we know they're real? Because the government puts serial numbers on them. You're sitting on one. You picked anyone out. Do me a favor and I want you to read us one digit at a time the serial number of the bill you picked up. One digit at a time, please. Go for me.

[Andrew Schulz]

One.

[Oz Perlman]

One, six, six, seven, eight. Hey, wait, wait.

[Andrew Schulz]

Tell us all.

[Oz Perlman]

Tell us all. This person, this person who you thought of out of your whole phone. What are their initials? What are their initials? First and last initials. Oh, what are the. What are the two letters on the bill?

[Andrew Schulz]

Phone.

[Oz Perlman]

Dude.

[Akash Singh]

That's the craziest I ever seen in my life. That's the craziest I ever seen in my life.

[Oz Perlman]

Holy.

[Akash Singh]

That's crazy. This the craziest I ever seen in my life.

[Andrew Schulz]

No way.

[Kiana]

You see why he ain't use me part of this? Can't read me, bro. Just saying.

[Akash Singh]

That's crazy. He threw the money in the air. How the. Do you know how to grab that bill?

[Kiana]

Where's the other one?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold.

[Oz Perlman]

Hold on.

[Andrew Schulz]

Threw the money in the air. Wow.

[Mark Agnon]

I don't.

[Kiana]

I don't want to read you outside. You easily Read. You're easy.

[Mark Agnon]

Is it rude if. If there's a deliberate effort to try to guess it?

[Akash Singh]

No, I don't think he minds. It's like everyone.

[Andrew Schulz]

That's what I'm conflicted by. It's like I don't.

[Oz Perlman]

Because you still usually do it. Not when I'm present.

[Akash Singh]

I think the is the one who doesn't act impressing.

[Oz Perlman]

This was kind of small, right? But you can go for it. I'm.

[Andrew Schulz]

That was unbelievable.

[Mark Agnon]

That's really impressive.

[Oz Perlman]

Impressive.

[Mark Agnon]

I'm curious if you were to do a trick to another mentalist or another magician, would. Is there like an anti trick? I sometimes watch like Penn and Teller fool us.

[Oz Perlman]

Yep.

[Mark Agnon]

And sometimes they'll do a trick.

[Oz Perlman]

Well, they try to. They. They use you against you. They use what you know against because.

[Mark Agnon]

They know that you will try to subvert it based off of understanding the methods.

[Oz Perlman]

That's what we do. It's like a. It's like a. When my kids jinx each other and they go jinx. And you. Oh, jinx. Like they. You know every single thing as you go and you try to move people in the direction that they think you're going with it, and they don't know where it's going. Go to go.

[Akash Singh]

What the did you just say?

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah, well, it's. We know each other's method.

[Akash Singh]

What you do to me. What you do to me. How you know I was gonna grab that dollar bill.

[Oz Perlman]

You still have the book. We're gonna come back to this because I'm gonna have you do one more choice. Look.

[Akash Singh]

You gave it away.

[Oz Perlman]

That was the moment.

[Andrew Schulz]

He's the Sphinx.

[Oz Perlman]

He gave it away.

[Akash Singh]

Put down your guard, Cavianis. You look gay as right now, dog. You look gay.

[Andrew Schulz]

This activated is awesome.

[Kiana]

If I crack, he's gonna read me.

[Andrew Schulz]

Guys.

[Mark Agnon]

I don't get how s.

[Kiana]

He read my lips before. I don't know what the he's looking at, bro.

[Oz Perlman]

Come on. Wait, Here we go. Here we go. All right. We had. We had. I want to get your staff involved. We had a lot of people in here who were here when we got here. And you said you've known who the most. I was do do, do 22 years. But there's other people.

[Andrew Schulz]

Who else.

[Oz Perlman]

Who has never gotten to shine. But. But. But let's try something. Who was there was. I don't know who else I talked to. There's somebody the tell me really nice. Who else was there? Ever been on air? Yes.

[Andrew Schulz]

Briefly. Yes.

[Akash Singh]

Get her in here.

[Oz Perlman]

Let's do it.

[Andrew Schulz]

Kiana. Please come here.

[Oz Perlman]

I like the way Akash is stealing my money right now.

[Akash Singh]

It's a Hindu thing. We can't just leave it on the ground.

[Oz Perlman]

I'm making you go outside before Kiana comes in.

[Akash Singh]

Disrespectful.

[Oz Perlman]

We're swapping. Do this. Alex, come on over. I want you to grab one more thing for me. Can I wait? Can I come right back in a sec?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, you do it.

[Oz Perlman]

You want Kiana? Come on in.

[Andrew Schulz]

Follow him with the camera.

[Oz Perlman]

So I want you jot down the page number.

[Andrew Schulz]

Got it.

[Oz Perlman]

Wait till I'm going. Go fast. You got 10 seconds.

[Andrew Schulz]

All right, guys, let's take a break from this mind bending interview with O. The Mentalist. And. And we. We got to talk about some deportes, guys. We have an unbelievable French Open.

[Akash Singh]

It was the best tennis I've ever seen in my life.

[Andrew Schulz]

Crazy.

[Akash Singh]

Yeah. And I. Like I said to y' all, I've kind of fallen out with tennis as I got busier. But then I'm watching this and I'm like, I gotta get back in.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Akash Singh]

I don't know if these are the best players ever, like, in terms of greatness, but the level of tennis that is being played on the men's side, top. I've never seen shots hit like this. I've never seen players who have this few weaknesses. Have you seen any of the highlights? Yeah, I mean, the points are insane. It was Carlos Alcaraz, who is a. Like a Spanish phenom. He's got four grand slams, now five going up against Yannick Sinner, who's the best player in the world, but for whatever reason cannot beat Alcaraz.

[Oz Perlman]

It's.

[Akash Singh]

He's 0 and 5 against Alcaraz, and then the last three years, like 82 and 3 against everybody else.

[Oz Perlman]

Wow.

[Akash Singh]

Some like that. I. It's insane.

[Kiana]

Come get this work, man. They say my game is like a mix of Alcaraz and sinner.

[Oz Perlman]

That's what they say.

[Kiana]

That's what they say.

[Akash Singh]

You are as.

[Andrew Schulz]

You think you would beat him the first time you played tennis again in.

[Akash Singh]

Like, it's been like 20 years.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah. Do you think you would be the first?

[Mark Agnon]

Yes.

[Akash Singh]

And can't tell you something. I wasn't even that good. I couldn't serve. I was too short. I'm five seven. Every serve is dog. I still think I'd beat him.

[Kiana]

Come on, man.

[Akash Singh]

But he's 5 4, so his serve can't be good.

[Oz Perlman]

Come on.

[Akash Singh]

You know what I mean? It's horrible.

[Kiana]

I'm get this work put Some money on it.

[Mark Agnon]

That would be worth watching. I would. I would watch.

[Kiana]

Let's bet on it.

[Andrew Schulz]

All right.

[Mark Agnon]

I put money on it.

[Akash Singh]

I got 100.

[Andrew Schulz]

Put a little stake bet. We need to talk to. Oh, we have an agreement.

[Oz Perlman]

It's going down.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So listen, we also have NBA Finals, right?

[Akash Singh]

Oh, yeah. NBA Finals. That's 1:1 right now, tied up.

[Andrew Schulz]

I guess when this comes out, it will be.

[Akash Singh]

Game three will be coming on that night, Wednesday.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah. Okay, so what are we thinking for that?

[Akash Singh]

Man, I hope the Pacers win. I love the pacers.

[Andrew Schulz]

I think OKC's got it.

[Akash Singh]

I think OKC is just. Yeah. I'm amazed they lost Game one, but again, I didn't think the Pacers would win the last round.

[Andrew Schulz]

The Pacers are a weird team. They either beat you or get blown. Blown out.

[Akash Singh]

Yeah.

[Mark Agnon]

It seems like you can also rally.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Akash Singh]

Every time they lose, they seem to get blown out, and you're like, yeah, this is. Now we're coming back to reality.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Akash Singh]

And I don't know if it's Rick Carlile or what. The adjustments are crazy.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Akash Singh]

I mean, just like. Yeah. I think he's one of the best coaches of all time.

[Andrew Schulz]

So who do you think? So what do you think happens?

[Akash Singh]

I think, okay, he wins, but I don't think it's. I doubt myself as I say that, because I'm like, dude, I don't know. The Pacers just keep proving me wrong.

[Andrew Schulz]

We got to see what the Pacers do at home. That's for sure. We got to see what they do at home. But I wouldn't be surprised. I won't be surprised.

[Akash Singh]

And this kid Shea is nice to. People hate on him, but he's.

[Andrew Schulz]

Don't. Hey, he's nice. I get. I get, like. You're like. What is it called? Milking calls or whatever.

[Akash Singh]

Free throw merchant is what they call him.

[Andrew Schulz]

But still, even without that, he's filthy.

[Akash Singh]

And I find it less annoying than what I went. From what I've seen, I haven't watched as much this year, but what Harden used to do is so floppy and all over the place. I don't think Shea's that bad.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Akash Singh]

He seems to go to the rim a lot. He'll still put it up. He'll try to draw the foul, but not, like, to an insane degree.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Akash Singh]

Not on that Euro.

[Andrew Schulz]

No, his. His game is awesome.

[Akash Singh]

Yeah. I don't know why I really root against okc, but they're so good.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah. They give it up to that organization. Like, they've done an amazing job of building up rebuilding. Rebuilding like this is all while being cheap.

[Akash Singh]

That's the reason they traded was it harden the first time? Yeah, they just didn't want to pay for one year. Basically of maybe being on the luxury tax.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Akash Singh]

And they still keep doing it.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, no, they gotta. We gotta look at into that. Who runs that team?

[Akash Singh]

Sam Presy.

[Andrew Schulz]

Presy, right.

[Akash Singh]

Came from the Spurs.

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

He needs some flowers bro. Cuz they've done a phenomenal job. Anyway, Stake is the leader in global betting and a US social casinos bet on top sports and political events. Use promo code flagrant for your welcome bonus. Let's get back to our boy O.

[Kiana]

All right. I got it.

[Oz Perlman]

All right. Come back. Have a seat for me. Hiding, hiding, hiding.

[Andrew Schulz]

Just knocking.

[Oz Perlman]

Alex told to think of to write down. I said write down what page you went to in the book. Is that correct?

[Kiana]

Yes.

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah. Hold on. You had picked the page number earlier was 138. But you said maybe I've gone through the book. But we know it's pre release. So I couldn't know what book this is. But you've written down the page number. So if you gave that note to him, he could go to that page and what are the odds he picks the same word? What do you think are the odds he picks the same word? If he even knew the page, it's probably high. Really? Really. How could that be? Aren't there a ton of words you know? Take the note. Forget it.

[Andrew Schulz]

You're not dumbass. You kiss one word on it.

[Mark Agnon]

Take the COVID.

[Oz Perlman]

Alex, come on. I was going to let you show it to take. Take the note. Rip it into shreds.

[Kiana]

Rip the.

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah, cuz I was going to let you show it to him but I thought you say no way would he pick the same word. Rip it up. Rip it up. And full transparency. I said make up a word out of your mind that wasn't in the book that just came to you. Is that correct? Yes, that's written up there too. Throw it away. So now we're done. Now I, I, I thought we'd let you go to the same page and see if somehow I can get your mind's connected. But no. Now they said freaking only word on the page. All right. Look behind you at how many pages are in the book. I won't look. Look at how many pages are in the book.

[Andrew Schulz]

This book.

[Oz Perlman]

You did it.

[Kiana]

Wait, wait, wait.

[Oz Perlman]

Most books are between 280 and 350.

[Kiana]

Okay.

[Oz Perlman]

Is it between 280 and 350.

[Kiana]

No.

[Oz Perlman]

Oh, good. Outlier. Probably went with less. Probably went with less. Hide the book. Hide the book.

[Akash Singh]

Why you say hidden? He would choose that book cuz he.

[Oz Perlman]

I think he probably did a smaller book. Try to screw with me.

[Akash Singh]

Thank you, Chips.

[Oz Perlman]

She knows this person who wrote it. Look at that familiarity. You picked any book. You challenged me. You ain't got any book. Is that correct?

[Kiana]

Yes.

[Oz Perlman]

You went to any page, you picked any word and you look stiff AF right now and you thought of a word. I'm never going to get the word that was in the book. That's impossible. We know that. Andrew's already figured it out. But how could I get all this other stuff? Stuff? Are your nails painted? I just noticed that he's calling you gay. Book was less than 280, wasn't it?

[Mark Agnon]

Yes.

[Oz Perlman]

Person. Person. You keep trying to look at him. They watch the podcast together. Charlemagne the God. Is that who the person wrote the book?

[Kiana]

Yes.

[Akash Singh]

You picked the easiest in the world. Yo, the are you doing?

[Oz Perlman]

Think of the page. Think 150, 160, 100, 780 was just around 200 words and blah, blah, blah. And you flipped in the middle and you went back three pages. 91. Is it page 91?

[Kiana]

Yes.

[Oz Perlman]

And then. Do you know what he looks like to me? You know what he looks like to me? He looks like somebody who's thinking of a word. Yeah, but he also looks like he's trying to hold something. He's trying to hold in a fart. What do you think? The word fart.

[Andrew Schulz]

Get the.

[Oz Perlman]

Oh, wow. Wow. Yo, what the.

[Akash Singh]

Yo, you readable.

[Andrew Schulz]

You so readable, yo.

[Oz Perlman]

And then the ultimate. You ready? We go through his eyes. Imagine I go through his eyes. We could see him walking out there picking any book out of the shelf. Nothing written, nothing, nothing. Just taking a book, flipping it over. And you said, well, maybe I saw that book before. Boom. Step one. I couldn't have seen this book before. You just picked any one. Is that right? Was anything set up before this moment? I didn't pick the page. You picked page 91. I just figured it out. And now even if we went to page 91, there's a ton of words. So think of all the letters in the words. Count the number of letters to yourself. Just did what you did. Watch. He's quick though. He's quicker than you. For the record, this guy's a businessman. You counted quick. Same way he did it. Three drums like three. Three beats. Do you know what I mean? Two. Three beats. Six letters. Six letters. Yes. Yeah, he did exactly what he did when he. Jordan. He's still thinking about Jordan, by the way.

[Andrew Schulz]

Stop breaking out.

[Oz Perlman]

I told him he thought of the letter D earlier. Remember? And he said, no, I thought of the A. And I said, I could tell when you switch from the D to the A. Think of a letter in your word. See, you just did the same thing. I said D. So you thought of a D. You went to R. Older people. Elders was the word you picked.

[Kiana]

Yeah, yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Where'd you pick that word from?

[Kiana]

No, it was on the page.

[Oz Perlman]

Show them the book. Call the Breakfast Club. Tell them I'm on. I'm on there next, baby.

[Akash Singh]

Oh, that's your target demo. Dude, you got no clue that he.

[Andrew Schulz]

Is like, three or four bucks. There's also 400 books that are older than 19. 20 in Brilliant Idiots. And you pick Charl.

[Kiana]

Shut up. Page 91.

[Oz Perlman]

Listen to elders, bro.

[Mark Agnon]

Wild.

[Oz Perlman]

Right?

[Mark Agnon]

So where did Forge come from?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, where's for.

[Kiana]

No, he told me to pick a random word outside. Just a random word.

[Oz Perlman]

Where's. Where's. Where's.

[Andrew Schulz]

I was going to write the N.

[Kiana]

Word, but I didn't want to get you canceled.

[Andrew Schulz]

I was going. I was going to.

[Kiana]

To do it.

[Oz Perlman]

You think I didn't know you were about to do that? Come on. You wanted to go full circle from Martin Luther King all in one episode.

[Mark Agnon]

Six letters.

[Oz Perlman]

You getting canceled, Pearl.

[Andrew Schulz]

Minutes, dude. Wow. As Alex. Alex is good at complying.

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Maybe we should teach the cops mentalism.

[Kiana]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

Going to LA next, boys.

[Akash Singh]

When's this going to drop under your feet?

[Oz Perlman]

You can came in. Yeah. All right.

[Andrew Schulz]

Go over. Can she go over here?

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah. All right. Kiana, here. Here's the. Here's the game. It's. It's a deja vu. It's like an exercise where you walk out of here, okay? Bring the mic up. And this is how I want you to visualize. You're going to play this through in your head. You've done this before. I know you have. In fact, if we're being legit, you've probably done this 100 times. You walk into a bodega, right? You walk up and down the aisles, and you look over here. Snacks, right? We got probably salty snacks. We got candy, we got beverages. And you're going back and forth. You're letting your fingers graze stuff. And this is when you reach up and this is really important. You open up or you reach down, you grab. And you grab one thing, you bring it to the counter, and you get ready to swipe Your card. Close your eyes. Can you see this playing out in your mind? Can you act this out and see yourself doing it? Okay. Are you sitting? I want you to be comfortable under oath in court. You could swear to God this was a random choice. Yeah. Is that right? Now watch. Also for you gentlemen, I like to have a visual. I wanted to bring Scrabble. Scrabble. Like tiles. I forgot them at home. It's not part of the show. I literally. My kids have them. So each of you gentlemen, you're going to reach in your right pocket right now. Feel what's in your pocket. Nothing right now, Andrew, you're good. You're good, but I had you pretend. The pretend is that you reach in and you grab out and you have one Scrabble towel in your pocket, grabbing it out, and I want you to hold it in your hand as if you could see it. As if you could see it. Ready? Here's where this gets good. I'm going to give you each a marker, and I don't want to see what you write, but I want you. Is it okay if you write something with a marker on your. On your. On your hand?

[Kiana]

Sure.

[Oz Perlman]

I want you to write down that Scrabble towel. And just for the record, these are consonants. I want to make sure they're consonant, not vowels. Is that your consonant? It should be, yeah. It's consonant. Vowels cost you motherfucker.

[Andrew Schulz]

Just read me. You thought Al would.

[Mark Agnon]

No, no, he just read me.

[Andrew Schulz]

I was going to write Europe, Australia.

[Oz Perlman]

I'm not judging you based on you thinking of the word fart out of.

[Andrew Schulz]

The whole English language.

[Oz Perlman]

All right? I don't want to see it. Write down your letter in your hand and hold it close. Hold it close.

[Akash Singh]

Okay.

[Oz Perlman]

Is this marker too thick for you?

[Akash Singh]

No.

[Andrew Schulz]

You like the thick?

[Oz Perlman]

You like.

[Andrew Schulz]

And I can't see. Or can I see at the end? You're going to make a word.

[Oz Perlman]

This is why I told you at the beginning, remember? Full circle. I said the best comedians can take a subject, infertility, and make it hilarious.

[Andrew Schulz]

Okay?

[Oz Perlman]

That's a gift.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

And I don't want to see it. Right, yours in your left palm. So I don't see it. And now it's right, yours. This thing's never coming off, by the way. They're going to get a buzz just from this soaking through there.

[Kiana]

Okay.

[Oz Perlman]

This been dipped in lsd, boys. About to be a fun night.

[Mark Agnon]

Oh, hell yeah.

[Akash Singh]

Oh, that'd be fire.

[Oz Perlman]

Okay.

[Kiana]

Okay. Done.

[Oz Perlman]

Okay, you did it close to your heart. Start here is where it gets good. You're going to fill in the blanks. Can't really form a word without vowels unless it's like Polish. So they're going to show you from left to right. They're going to show you their hands, and you're going to form a word. You get to put in vowels in the middle. I don't know how many vowels you're going to use, but form a word based on these three letters that they picked at random. Wait, wait, wait till I'm gone. Starting with the kash. Getting close to a mark. And then last, go ahead and show them your hand in as well. Show them your hand. You get. You guys get it. From left to right, I want you to see the same way you would read from left to right. Look at those three letters. Did you see Akashes? Did you see marks and.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

Have you done that?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

I'm praying because most of the time you can make some sort of word out of. Do you have a word that you made out of that?

[Andrew Schulz]

I. I can add vowels in the middle. I got one.

[Oz Perlman]

Oh, I don't care what. I got one.

[Andrew Schulz]

I got. Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

If not, there might be different ones. There's like, you know, it's like Boggle. Yeah. All right, here's where this gets good.

[Andrew Schulz]

Just extra word. Hold on.

[Oz Perlman]

Kiana. A Deli has over 500 things, usually like a bodega. Are you good?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah. I just want to make sure it was a word.

[Oz Perlman]

Is it not a word?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, it's a word. Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

Did you see how when I was talking about the choices, I said salty, I said sweet. I said beverages. I do all things, and I rushed through one of them. You asked me how I do it, and I rushed. And I knew, noticed, be honest, that I saw you micro nod beverage. You thought of a beverage, didn't you? Am I right? Yes. Because I put beverage in all your minds. You didn't even realize it. Tell us all. I'm pulling it out. I got one thing in here. What did you pick? What did you buy out of the whole deli? Say it. What was it?

[Andrew Schulz]

Fanta.

[Oz Perlman]

Fanta. And you guys did fnt. Did you think of Fanta also?

[Akash Singh]

No.

[Oz Perlman]

No.

[Mark Agnon]

Oh, no.

[Oz Perlman]

What are the letters? It's not fn. T. No. What are the letters?

[Andrew Schulz]

L, G, R. What was a word?

[Akash Singh]

Logger.

[Andrew Schulz]

Are you serious?

[Akash Singh]

There's a beer in there, dog.

[Andrew Schulz]

I'm.

[Akash Singh]

Don't. Don't do this. Don't do this.

[Oz Perlman]

Yo, you know what you said? How do you make this legendary Forget Fanta. We got for you right over here.

[Andrew Schulz]

Hold on. That's going to go everywhere.

[Mark Agnon]

Get a sip.

[Andrew Schulz]

Dude.

[Oz Perlman]

What? You got to sit my man out.

[Kiana]

No.

[Andrew Schulz]

No way. I just broke my sobriety 20 years down the grade. Oh, no. That's a logger, though. That is a good logger. Holy.

[Oz Perlman]

Hold up. I want to show you one thing. I want to show you one thing. Are you ready for this? Hold up. I want to show you one thing.

[Andrew Schulz]

How the magic.

[Oz Perlman]

Hold on, hold on. Where's that marker?

[Akash Singh]

Al probably got it too, cuz he wrote. Wrote last. Wait, how you got that marker?

[Kiana]

No, I handed him.

[Oz Perlman]

Here's a marker. Here's a marker. Take a look. I want to see something. Yeah, you could have said. You could have picked anything, right? I don't know you. You said Fanta. F. Yeah. A, I. I believe you said F, A, N, T, A. Is that right? First words out of my mouth. You've had a podcast since 2019. Very successful podcast, in fact. And you picked any three letters or L, G out of here, dude. Everything we have done has brought us to this moment. And F, L, G, A, R, A, N, T flagrant is exactly.

[Akash Singh]

That is so fine. Iron. Holy, bro.

[Andrew Schulz]

I was struggling to put a word together with those three.

[Akash Singh]

I saw you, boy.

[Oz Perlman]

I saw you.

[Andrew Schulz]

I came up with grail switch. The order longer is hard. That's why. How the. Did you guys.

[Kiana]

It's okay.

[Oz Perlman]

How the.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yo, that's crazy.

[Oz Perlman]

Wait, wait.

[Mark Agnon]

And so you guys could have picked.

[Andrew Schulz]

Wait, hold on. You guys could have picked any letter. You guys could have picked any letter matters. Yeah. Why? Why?

[Oz Perlman]

Oh, God. I would deconstruct tonight. Keep going.

[Andrew Schulz]

I can't, I can't, I can't, I can't.

[Oz Perlman]

We can't continue that one.

[Andrew Schulz]

I can't. No, we can continue, please. So we can be here all day. That was unbelievable.

[Akash Singh]

Also 20 years of sobriety. 20 days.

[Andrew Schulz]

I drank last night. I drank last night. It's not worth it.

[Oz Perlman]

Oh, boy.

[Andrew Schulz]

That was. That was unbelievable. Wow.

[Kiana]

How'd you get a lot into the unopened Fanta?

[Akash Singh]

Who bought the Fanta?

[Andrew Schulz]

Which is missing that.

[Akash Singh]

That was an unopened Fanta.

[Oz Perlman]

What the is going on?

[Kiana]

He's a witch.

[Akash Singh]

So you brought the Fanta with you?

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah, you can have it. It's all yours.

[Akash Singh]

I don't drink. I would love of Spanish.

[Andrew Schulz]

I don't drink either. Holy.

[Kiana]

We would have burned this.

[Oz Perlman]

I feel happy for Alex because he finally let the fart out. It just happened. Finally let it go. Go. I appreciate that.

[Mark Agnon]

You know?

[Oz Perlman]

You know. Holy.

[Mark Agnon]

How many of these.

[Oz Perlman]

Mark is still thinking about Jordan, by the way. Tell me, tell me, tell me how many.

[Mark Agnon]

How many of these moves are completely proprietary, that you created them.

[Oz Perlman]

I have a very good sense of how to put things together. Right. I call it Fiji Water. I can repackage water in a bottle. Shouldn't have made people billionaires, but it did. Why? The feeling you got. The visuals, the images, the whole story. The whole thing. The more you're going to think about that one. I hope you spend a day year two. It's going to get crazier and crazier to think that she could have picked Fanta. You could have picked any letters. All of it combined, all meant to be. I think that that's what's fun about it is that you don't see where it's going.

[Andrew Schulz]

How the fuck did you guys not pick different letters? That's what I don't understand.

[Akash Singh]

Yeah. How get. How do you get me to the L? How do you get you to the G? How do you do the R? How do you get her to the fantasy?

[Andrew Schulz]

You guys just chose whatever letter, you wrote it on your hand, right?

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah. Yeah. So I'm telling you, you know what the craziest part is?

[Akash Singh]

Would the white woman have picked a Fanta? I don't think so. I think you went to the minority on pur.

[Oz Perlman]

First Martin Luther King, then this. Frankly, I'm offended by the show.

[Andrew Schulz]

And are you doing a different set? I mean, you have to do a different.

[Oz Perlman]

My corporate set. And what I do for air quotes. A living when I'm doing events.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

Is I typically have like an A show, B show. And I don't want to call it a C show because we're like C show. But it's just different material.

[Andrew Schulz]

Right.

[Oz Perlman]

But we live in an era where I don't need to change what I do. Very often comedians have a much higher.

[Andrew Schulz]

Every time we're in a market.

[Oz Perlman]

Well, you've got a. You burn a special, it's gone.

[Andrew Schulz]

But when you come on a pod like so you can do maybe a variation of this that has the same tools.

[Oz Perlman]

Yep.

[Andrew Schulz]

But they have to present themselves differently. I've seen a lot of your stuff and I haven't seen you.

[Akash Singh]

But if you don't crack the code, you're down to see him do it twice.

[Andrew Schulz]

I would watch you do this 14 more times. And if it was Fanta, I wouldn't even care. Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah. Next one's grape soda.

[Andrew Schulz]

Okay.

[Mark Agnon]

You ever done an effect someone then they are intentionally obstructive. And how do you handle that?

[Oz Perlman]

That's always the best. Like, I. I went in one time and I did the. I did the Bengals. I did Joe Burrow and the Bengals, which is one of my most viral clips. And he's not. He wasn't. He wasn't. This is really funny because a guy hit me up on Facebook messenger and he told me he was in the grocery store with Joe Burrow. And he's like, I have to share this to you. I was just Joe. And he told me, Joe. We were talking about it, and he goes, oh, I saw this mentalist. I'm a huge fan of his. Do you remember him? He goes, remember him? He goes, I spent eight months trying to figure out how the hell he did that to me. And I thought I knew how he did. Did it. And then at the Super Bowl, I saw him backstage and he did something else to me. And I realized I had no idea because everything I thought was completely like, I had this theory and it was all wrong because he did it to me again, but with nothing. Like, I.

[Andrew Schulz]

But what do you do? I think what Mark is asking when someone lies.

[Oz Perlman]

No, but I want. It's important to understand. So that got into his head. But I never was able to meet Joe Burrow before. So most people think. Which I go in fresh to most of these things. I'll do an event with 5,000 people. I didn't meet all these people. You can't throw a Frisbee to somebody 26 rows, they stand up. I guess the name of their dog and they were 7 and, like, have set that up. Unless you think that I got Tom Brady throwing frisbees. Like, how could that be? Yeah, so it's. It's. It's not set up. You have to be able to do this with anybody or you'll run out of career really quick. With Burrow, I was not allowed to see him. I was told he would not be in the show. So they literally said to me, kind of the pr. It's like, I don't. Joe doesn't want to be in. He doesn't want to do it. And I go, okay, let me do what I do. You do what you do. I'm gonna get in there. I'm going to get everyone fired up. I'm going to get him excited. I'm going to show that he's the leader, the team wants him to do it, and he's going to buy. I guarantee you. Same way that I walked up to tables When I at Z when I was 14, and people want nothing to do with me, two minutes later when I'm leaving are like, please stay. Yeah, right. That's the best feeling in the world. You don't want me now. You don't want to let me go. And so that's how you win over an audience, both in entertainment and anything you do.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

In the attention economy. So I got him up and that was something where I. I told when I was on Joe Rogan, he's like, how long were you planning that? I go, two years. Two years. I was thinking how I was going to execute the ultimate football trick, which is quarterback. All my eligible receivers stand up, look at them, look at me, and I tell you who he's going to throw the ball to.

[Andrew Schulz]

Every time I saw the. Josh Allen. Yeah.

[Akash Singh]

Josh Allen was crazy.

[Andrew Schulz]

Unbelievable.

[Oz Perlman]

Thank you.

[Andrew Schulz]

Okay, so two years you're planning the execution of that trick. So that means right now you are planning a trick that might come to fruition five years from now.

[Oz Perlman]

If not five years is. I don't have that kind of scale right now because I'm so busy again. It's knock on what's a good problem to have. But I just have so much coming up.

[Andrew Schulz]

But is there somebody that you're planning a trick for that you can let us know? That has been in the homes for. How long have you been working on this one?

[Oz Perlman]

I met him two years ago and I've been pretty much planning it since. And I know what I'm gonna do.

[Andrew Schulz]

It's gonna be nuts.

[Oz Perlman]

So viral.

[Andrew Schulz]

And is there. Is there a specific thing?

[Oz Perlman]

Oh, yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Can. Okay. Do you have a plan when that's gonna come to fruition?

[Oz Perlman]

I sure knock on wood. If they see this. Hopefully this summer. Wow.

[Akash Singh]

Yo, Pat. Come on. Flagrant.

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

I mean, holy. I saw a clip and I think it was. You were on the Joe Button podcast.

[Oz Perlman]

I was on Joe Button.

[Andrew Schulz]

And you did a. You. You guessed the producer's like, nickname for his friend or something when he was challenged.

[Oz Perlman]

Me too. He's like, I don't call him that. I go, you don't call him that. Goes, no, don't call him. And I. I nailed it.

[Andrew Schulz]

How.

[Oz Perlman]

How elders see the God. I mean, how. There's a lot of house so far.

[Akash Singh]

You know what I do like about what you do? I think what magicians did when we were growing up and what the mentalist. We had a mentalist at a restaurant that we were all eating at. The three of us.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Akash Singh]

And we figured out his within like, three minutes. But it was a lot of, like, hours for me. They sell this illusion of magic. Oh, this is a mystical thing. We're all connected. Whatever thing they use is like a. You don't do that. Which I like.

[Andrew Schulz]

You kayfabe.

[Akash Singh]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

They don't break the kayfabe. Like, it's like wrestling is real. That's what they're doing with a lot of magicians, which is also cool because you want to submit yourself to this. But I think because they. You don't have the props, it almost.

[Akash Singh]

Makes it more impressive.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Akash Singh]

And it's less like, I have to. I don't have to submit myself to this idea that magic exists. I just submit myself to the idea that there's someone who's really good at reading people and situations and whatever. And that's an insanely unique, cool skill to have.

[Oz Perlman]

Right.

[Akash Singh]

That's all I have to say.

[Oz Perlman]

Verbal skill.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

People always ask me, like, were you born this way? And I go, absolutely not. I've learned. I feel like I'm not showing you any love. I keep looking that way.

[Andrew Schulz]

No, no, it's cool, it's cool.

[Oz Perlman]

Mark's. Mark's scared of me still. Is there something hurt my feelings? Like, I'm a cop feel guy, not a mentalist guy. Cut me deep, Mark Agnon. So I fully, again, not to hype the book, but, like, I'm. I figured out over years, because I get asked the same question all the time, which is, how do you do this? How can I learn this? And I go, you don't actually want to learn this and be like, what do you mean? Yeah, I do. And I go, no, you don't. Because let's say I showed you how to, you know, have someone pick a dollar bill and have it be the phone number somebody just thought and all this. Well, why would you do that? Well, I really wouldn't do that because I'm not an entertainer. I go, what do you do for a living? And I go, well, I, you know, customer success manager at a startup. I go, great. What would you like to achieve in the next two years? I want to get a raise. I want to do this. I'm going to show you how to do that. And I'm going to make your percent chance of doing that 50, 60, 70% higher. Because what is all about relationships, how to read people, how to utilize kind of knowledge for that. Like, how do you walk in the room and take charge? The same thing I'm doing. If you could do it in your life, not perform Performing, I assure you, you would see major results. Yeah.

[Akash Singh]

And then the scale of what you do monetarily is probably way higher because a sales company will be like, pay this guy whatever.

[Mark Agnon]

You know what I mean?

[Oz Perlman]

Well, how do you know? When do you approach somebody to ask for a raise? That's such a simple question. But if you go to them on a Monday after they went vacation, they're all. Timing is everything in life. Something I learned so early on. When do I hold on? You ask me, am I waiting? Yeah, I'll wait two years, I'll wait four years. But when I do that thing for my homes, it's going to be mega viral because it's all about picking your moment. And I think I learned that in the restaurants. I learned that in other parts of life. But that skill applies to everyone and everything.

[Akash Singh]

So the Joe Burrow thing, did you put it off? You got an opportunity before that? You said no, that the opportunity took two years.

[Oz Perlman]

The opportunity took two years. And I also didn't burn it on someone else because I could have tried to. But Joe Burrow is notoriously media shy. Not knocking. He's just. He's a shy guy. If you actually meet him, he's super nice.

[Akash Singh]

Very likable thing.

[Oz Perlman]

Very likable, but very. He's just. Just not. Some guys in front of the camera. Boisterous. He doesn't really give a lot off. So when you see him losing his mind, frazzled, it's. He also signed a $275 million contract the day before that hit. So everyone in the comments. My best comment, the one that got run up with like 30,000 likes was some guy goes, dude, he paid him off. And I go, I wish to God I had enough money to pay off Joe Burrow to do this. After his $275 million contract mic drop, I was like, I wish there's no paying him off.

[Andrew Schulz]

Does that frustrate you at all?

[Oz Perlman]

No. I love that.

[Andrew Schulz]

People trying to discredit.

[Oz Perlman]

That's the number one thing you can could say. People say, this was staged. That's the biggest compliment there is.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

And it's also the funniest because I've had hundreds of TV appearances. Have I staged it with every single person? Is it. Did I find some way to get, you know, a billionaire to. To do this and Andrew Schultz to do this and Joe Rogan to pretend he gave me his pin code?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Akash Singh]

I use racism to guess things about audience members on stage sometimes, and they'll accuse me of it being staged.

[Oz Perlman]

And I'M like, no, I'm just gonna start doing a beverage thing where he goes whiskey Fanta.

[Akash Singh]

I can tell you right now who's picking what.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

He's put to me on Kom. It was very offensive. Like I live in Brooklyn, but I'm not Brooklyn, bro.

[Andrew Schulz]

Do you remember the first magic trick you ever learned?

[Oz Perlman]

100%.

[Andrew Schulz]

What was it? And can you do it?

[Oz Perlman]

I. I don't do it anymore, cuz. A gimmick.

[Andrew Schulz]

Got it.

[Oz Perlman]

So it's like a, it's a trick deck which I don't want to reveal. But there's. When you're younger you, you start learning with trick things. So you know, it's kind of a.

[Andrew Schulz]

Magic quarter that bends.

[Oz Perlman]

It looks like you like things that, that you learn the trick. Cuz the thing is the trick, right. If I gave it to you, you could do the same trick.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

Versus if I gave you two books, you could not do the same trick as the hope you need to. I am the trick.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

So I am the show. I could get dropped off with no luggage and do a show for 5,000 people by going to Staples for 10 minutes. That's where I want to be. Like, I want to have. I don't want people to think that box. When I see Copperfield, love Copperfield. But I go, if I had that box, could I do that thing? That's the thought that goes in my head. I'm like you. I'm just like you. I want to figure out how the hell it works.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

And that's how I became a mentalist.

[Kiana]

In recent times. Has anyone ever figured out how you did the trick? Like right after you did it?

[Oz Perlman]

If you're on YouTube, it's just like the power of the Internet. Somebody will dissect it. But it's after. It's amazing because 99% of them are wrong and they're so entertaining to listen to. But then you always find that one hidden one that has no up likes. And I'm like, yep, everything right. Like boom, boom, boom. Here's what you did. Here's what you did. You. You misdirected them. Here. This is when you did that at 2:30, you said that one thing. He knew that. And then you. And I'm like, yo, this is he. You know, you know what you're talking about. So in YouTube there's enough consolidation of people, but in a show on stage it's impossible because there's a. There's not enough continuity of information. So what I mean by that is on stage, not Everyone can look at the same thing at the same time over and over and over and over. You, your, your memories are malleable, right? So honestly, what I really do for a living is I create memories. And I don't mean that in a hoy toy like new age way. Like literally what I do is create memories. The way you remember this and the way you're going to tell it has been engineered. I've said certain things, I've done certain ways. There's ways that I'm getting you to retell this moment. And certain things get erased and certain things get highlighted. And there's a way you can do that.

[Kiana]

So you said sometimes you take a long time to develop the trick. Did you watch a lot of flagrant footage to get prepared for any of the tricks you just did today?

[Oz Perlman]

Yes.

[Andrew Schulz]

So you're doing your research.

[Kiana]

Have you ever mentioned Jordan before?

[Oz Perlman]

Never. He never has. So look it up, okay? The Internet will find that out.

[Kiana]

All right.

[Andrew Schulz]

All right. How the could you figure out Jordan was Jordan? The girl with the gigantic tits you always talk about only fans.

[Akash Singh]

Oh, that girl.

[Andrew Schulz]

Cuz you keep talking about this girl.

[Mark Agnon]

Was a huge, huge, huge.

[Andrew Schulz]

And you always would bring it up. Now it makes sense because you talk about it so frequently despite being married with a child.

[Mark Agnon]

I wasn't in college, you know, I mean, I can look, I can look in college. I just had a girlfriend back in college.

[Andrew Schulz]

Okay? Okay.

[Oz Perlman]

She has an only fans. I think so her dad missed one volleyball game.

[Andrew Schulz]

One volleyball game. It's all it takes. It's all it takes.

[Oz Perlman]

You said if I've done my research. Hell yeah, I've done my research.

[Andrew Schulz]

All right guys, let's take a break for a second. We got to talk about the best coffee and energy drinks on the planet. Black rifle coffee. Okay. When there's a riot that breaks out in downtown Los Angeles, who do you think? The Marines? The National Guards.

[Akash Singh]

You think they're drinking some lib coffee? They're not just Seattle, Starbucks, FIFA coffee. Get out of here, dude.

[Andrew Schulz]

Black rifle coffee. Okay? Defending Waymos. If you're out there defending whoos. Do you think you're doing that on some. Some blue bottle? No, no.

[Akash Singh]

Barista coffee with a heart in it. Get out of here.

[Andrew Schulz]

Happening. Okay? Your patriotism relies on one thing. It's caffeine. Okay? This is from award winning farms. We're not going to mention where those are then. Roasted domestically.

[Oz Perlman]

That's what.

[Andrew Schulz]

Domestically roasted roast. So the coffee is fresh when it hits your mug. Okay. They also just dropped black rifle energy A new sugar free energy drink available in four flavors.

[Akash Singh]

Those coffee beans actually come here legally.

[Andrew Schulz]

So they say.

[Oz Perlman]

So they say, if you don't have.

[Mark Agnon]

A vis, they say, where are your papers? You say, hey, I have a black rifle. And they go, oh, it's fine. You're an American.

[Andrew Schulz]

Thank you. Thank you very much. So head over right now to Black Rifle Coffee.com flagrant. Use the code flagrant for 30% off your purchase and your first order. That's Blackriff Coffee.com flagrant. Use THE GO FLAGRANT. You can also find black rifle, coffee, energy drinks and gear in a grocery store and convenience store near you. Now let's get back to the show. All right, guys, let's take a break for a second. Talk about your mental health. Just like your physical body needs exercise, your mental health needs maintenance and attention. The better your mental health, the better your physical health and vice versa. And Talkspace is the number one rated online therapy, bringing your professional support from licensed therapists and psychiatrists that you can access anytime, anywhere. Life is all about how we are in relationships with one another and communication is key. Talkspace can help you identify obstacles and create new meaningful connections. Talkspace makes getting the help you need easy, accessible and affordable. Plus, most insured members have a $0 copay. Let me tell you more about why I love talkspace1. Because they were the pioneers of this online therapy. Before that, you would go into some stupid office with fake art on the walls and sit there uncomfortably in the smell of your therapist. Now you no longer have to do that. Nobody thought it'd be possible that we'd be doing this on Zoom. This is the only way people go to therapy. I don't even think therapists have offices anymore. They use a part of their house. You could hear their dog barking. You could hear their wife crying. There are things that are happen happening in that house that we want to know about. They normalize you and your problems. Okay, as a listener of this podcast, you're going to get $80 off your first month with Talkspace. When you go to talkspace.comflagrant enter the promo code SPACE80 that is S P A C E 80 to match with a licensed therapist today, go to talkspace.comflagrant and enter the promo code SPACE80. Now let's get back to the show.

[Mark Agnon]

I'm curious, do you find it unethical if a clairvoyant or a tarot card reader tries to speak with the dead using similar tactics? Basically creating false memories for selling them the experience of Having some type of.

[Oz Perlman]

Supernatural phenomenon unethical is tough because the person. It takes two to tango. So it's kind of like if that person's paying them and they want to believe in it, then I think there is a value proposition there where there's. What are you getting out of that? Like, some people go to therapy for 10 years, don't get anything out of it. Was that therapist ripping them off? I wouldn't do it. Am I going to judge people that do that? No. But I'm also going to call BS when I, I see it. And so it's funny because on Rogan, I, I, he asked me about telepathy tapes. Yeah. I've been getting some heat from people who are like, it's real, it's real, it's real.

[Andrew Schulz]

And you're like, there's no clear.

[Oz Perlman]

No, I said very clearly. I go, I can't speak to whether it's real or not.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, sorry.

[Oz Perlman]

Let me see who that is planted. I knew it. I knew that would happen right then. I can't. I said specifically, I can't. It's like me saying, if there's God, it's so ridiculous for me to tell you. I said, but what I see in videos I can explain through things that I understand that have to do with the five senses. Do you understand? The same way that people will watch me if you got a scientist and the room. I know how scientists think. I could fool a scientist so easy.

[Andrew Schulz]

Really.

[Oz Perlman]

Scientists are actually easier to fool than dumb people in my instances because. Because they have a certain way that they. There's a regimented thought pattern. Right. If you have an algorithm, and this is how it works, once you learn an algorithm, you can, you can, you can cheat the algorithm. Right? Like I can tell you what certain.

[Andrew Schulz]

Videos, their thinking is more predictable.

[Oz Perlman]

Their thinking is so predictable. This is the first thing. Oh, well, not this. A to B. A to B. In fact, that's why I'm saying it not in a weird way. Certain people that are dumb or unpredictable are actually harder because see what I did? You look there. You all looked. He looked later. I know exactly what's. I understand how misdirection works. So. No, but he's still focused.

[Andrew Schulz]

On more impressive than elders. You just said pick a random word and you guessed it.

[Oz Perlman]

Wait, but wait. So if you know how people people think the best poker players are unpredictable. They don't matter. They do crazy stuff at weird moments and you can't pin them in. So where I was going with this is with the telepathy tapes is I can't tell you if you are. If you're a parent and your child's doing this and you're like, that's an amazing feeling to have hope and joy. And I'm telling you right now, if it works for you. Amazing. Where it crosses the line is when you start selling to the public and paying and then you go into the public realm of. I'm not debunking, but let me watch it and let me see what I think based on what I see. See, Could I. Could I do that with my methods? And the answer is yes. I could have it seem like I'm not communicating and I could show. So, again, is it real? Are there psychics that are real? I'm sure there might be, but I've never. I haven't witnessed anything in person yet. Not secondhand. People always tell you stories. It's different.

[Mark Agnon]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

Because psychics are very good at engineering memories the way I am.

[Mark Agnon]

Right.

[Oz Perlman]

They erase the misses, they highlight the hits.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

So you forget all the things that went. Right. Wrong. Right.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

And there's like a recency bias and there's things that get. There's just a lot of skills that are involved. The same way a callback hits, the same way comedians take the audience on a journey.

[Andrew Schulz]

Right.

[Oz Perlman]

So I can. I can. I know what things will be remembered. I know what he's going to talk about. I know what little things. Like, I. A lot of those are planted.

[Mark Agnon]

It's very clever. Like the way you would do a magic trick and you would, you know, like, move a hand here and actually do something here. That's what it's all about being done verbally.

[Oz Perlman]

Right. It's verbal misdirection.

[Mark Agnon]

Yeah, it's really clever.

[Oz Perlman]

Verbal misdirection. Time misdirection. Something called dual reality, where people experience things in a different way.

[Andrew Schulz]

What do you mean?

[Oz Perlman]

That's like. That's what it is. It's multiple realities. Like, I create different memories for each person because they see in a different way.

[Andrew Schulz]

So Alex is experiencing a different thing than I'm experiencing.

[Oz Perlman]

He'll remember things differently in certain ways. For sure. Have.

[Andrew Schulz]

Have you ever done it with somebody who guessed in real time who was not a mentalist or didn't have any magic background?

[Oz Perlman]

Oh, I. Yeah, parties. I. I'll never forget there was this one dude who was a Russian rocket scientist who was. Sounds smart. And he was. And he. He just, like, came up to me afterwards and he was very polite and he just explained everything. I just did And I was like, yeah, that's right. Oh, wow. What are you gonna say?

[Mark Agnon]

You would tell him?

[Oz Perlman]

I would in that case, because it's a thing of respect. And also, I. He didn't come at me with this energy vibe of, like, I got you.

[Andrew Schulz]

Right.

[Oz Perlman]

It was more. It was very factual. And I said to him, have you done mentalism before? And he's like, no, he just has an incredibly. He has a. Just a mind that cannot be misdirected. Where he just locked in. He just locked in and he just think of Occam's razor and what's the simplest solution? And if it wasn't the simple solution, what is a simpler solution he was really good at. I don't know how to describe it. Like, I do math with my kid. With fractions, you keep wanting the lowest common denominator. If you're smart, you can keep whittling away until you find the only method. So with me, I can find. When I watch other people do this, I know how they're doing it. I know all the methods, and I keep, like, looking to see which one it is. And when they mix methods, that's where it gets hard. Once you start doing, like, five different things and you jump from method to method.

[Andrew Schulz]

Hard to track.

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah, it's hard to track.

[Mark Agnon]

Who fools you? Who is a person or an effect that you saw that you were like, oh, just.

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah.

[Andrew Schulz]

Who saw who?

[Oz Perlman]

Darren Brown.

[Andrew Schulz]

I saw his show.

[Oz Perlman]

Who's. Who's great. I don't want to say fool me, because again, I don't want to. Like, I know how it's all done.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

Because we're in the same business. But I loved it.

[Andrew Schulz]

He had a fantastic thing happen during his show that I still can't explain. At one point in time, like, he tells you to look at this person on stage, and we're, like, supposed to look at them, and they're just standing there and I could be, like, butchering them this. At one point, the person, like, just turns into someone in a monkey costume, right? And then they're just there and he goes. And you guys didn't even notice that they're in a monkey costume. And then the whole audience looks over. They've been on the stage the whole time. Like, how do you garner the entire audience's attention and direct it at one part of the stage and get us to completely ignore the other part of the stage?

[Oz Perlman]

It was.

[Andrew Schulz]

It was brilliant. And I. Amazing, because I. Before that was going, I'm not leaving that guy.

[Oz Perlman]

Right.

[Andrew Schulz]

Like, I'm Going, I'm not getting tricked. I'm just staring at that one person on stage because something's happened and then they turn into a monkey.

[Oz Perlman]

Yep.

[Akash Singh]

It is a little disappointing how easily led you are when.

[Andrew Schulz]

Whenever you.

[Akash Singh]

That's the thing that I'm like, oh man, I went to the exact fucking dollar bill he knew I was going to go to. How did I do that?

[Oz Perlman]

That's. That's part of it. But also the fact that that's how scammers work. So like I. My best. If I were to switch careers, I could be a scammer tomorrow. I could do psychic stuff stuff. But you, what do you do when you get.

[Kiana]

I got a few.

[Oz Perlman]

Con man Alex is like, let's talk offline.

[Mark Agnon]

I mean, I mean the change breaking scam is like an all time great.

[Oz Perlman]

Sure.

[Mark Agnon]

Like I'm sure you're familiar with this. I don't know if explaining it is. I mean it's a scam.

[Oz Perlman]

So I don't know. Yeah, I don't think. Explain it. Yeah.

[Mark Agnon]

I mean you might be able to.

[Oz Perlman]

Do a better job when you exchange the money and you count it different ways.

[Mark Agnon]

Exactly. So basically like going to a cashier saying like, hey, I have a 50. Could you break it? And then they break it. And then basically three. Through kind of sleight of hand, but also sleight of, you know, tongue, you're basically able to get, you know, $70 from them. So you give them 50 and they give you 70 and multiple 20s. You take a 20, say, hey, actually you could I get tens? Instead they take it back and you keep on switching.

[Oz Perlman]

You confuse them.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

It's a method of confusion and they don't really know. And it's at that moment. Again, we create memories. Right. When they're supposed to do something, you shift their mind and your mind can only focus on one thing in a certain way at the same time.

[Andrew Schulz]

And all this money is out and they're not sure which is yours and which is theirs.

[Mark Agnon]

Do you have a background in hypnos at all or do you understand?

[Oz Perlman]

I don't do hypnosis in my show, but I, I've done hypnosis.

[Andrew Schulz]

Oh, really? How hard was that to learn?

[Oz Perlman]

Very easy.

[Andrew Schulz]

Really.

[Oz Perlman]

What I used to do, I had this weird thing when high school. In high school I did a.

[Andrew Schulz]

Can you try to do. Are any of us not kind enough to do it?

[Oz Perlman]

I'm not good enough at hypnosis because I don't.

[Akash Singh]

I try to.

[Oz Perlman]

Mostly auto hypnosis. This sounds like I'm Hypnotized yourself to.

[Andrew Schulz]

Get into a meditative state or something.

[Oz Perlman]

It's more of. I used to. Lucid dreams. Yeah, you put a belt around your neck. Nothing weird.

[Mark Agnon]

Hypnotism myself. Don't come in.

[Akash Singh]

No, I tried that, I think for sleep or something, for insomnia. It's not that I'm too smart or I'm just so in my head and, like, confused if I'm doing everything correctly that I couldn't even work.

[Oz Perlman]

Progressive muscle relaxation. So I did this. In senior year, I did a project on lucid dreaming. Do you know what that is?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, of course.

[Oz Perlman]

And I learned how to lucid dream multiple times a night. And it was the coolest thing ever. And it's very interesting. There have been shows on it since, but it's like that movie Inception almost, you know, where he would spin the thing and. Yeah, spinning.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

So what I learned to do is once as you go to bed, you just literally squeeze every muscle for 10 seconds and then let go and keep relaxing your body. It wasn't that hard. And you would tell yourself, getting more tired, more tired. When I count back and you count your head and you do this for like three or four minutes. And then the last thought before you go to bed is the one that slips into your subconscious. And the way you can feel, it's called the hypnagogic stage, is if you're. If you put your arm up while you're sleeping like this, this. It's when you jolt. You ever do that next to your wife? You just jolt, and she feels that you were sleeping or you're watching a show. If you can control that jolt, because your arm will fall and you'll feel it right then. If you can tell yourself something as you're going to bed, it. It gets. It slips from your conscious to your subconscious very effectively in those last few seconds because you're in that state with your brain. And so what I would do. This is a weird thing I did in senior years, I would check my watch OCD style all day, every two or three minutes during the day at school, every day, two or three minutes, I would look at my watch. And after about a week and a half of doing it in my dream, I started doing it. And so in your dream, if you look at your watch, you look away and you look back. There's all different ways. It's always a different time. So in your dream, I would now go, I'm dreaming. And I try not to wake up because usually if you feel it, you Wake up if you got good at it. And I still do that five, six times a night and do crazy stuff. So I got erotic.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, I've had some lucid dreams before, and what I thought was interesting is that I don't have complete autonomy in some of them, right. So I've had the one where, like, I'm dreaming and what I would do is I would just, like, pinch myself, because that's what I always heard. I was like, oh, if you pinch yourself, you'll wake up. And I would pinch waking up and be like, oh, shit, am I actually dreaming right now? I am dreaming. And I remember distinctly one, I was like, I think I can fly. And I flew. I think I can make things grow, and I made them grow, and it was pretty awesome. And then I've had ones where I was like, I'm dreaming right now. But I was too scared. Scared to jump off of something and use the powers, so. Which is just like being alive, which is kind of boring, right? You know?

[Oz Perlman]

So he checked his 401k right there.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, I'm limited, yet I'm still in my dream. So have. Have you had both versions of those lucid dreams?

[Oz Perlman]

I haven't done it because I have a lot of kids now. And so, like, sleep is at a premium and I don't sleep enough. But I wanted to. I remember during COVID I did it for about a week or two. I got that muscle memory back.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

And I thought it was fun.

[Andrew Schulz]

Every time you could do what you wanted or you were limited in some.

[Oz Perlman]

You wake up. So the problem is, if you get. Because your brain tries to convince you. I can't tell if it's a weird, boring conversation, but your brain tries to snap you out of it. Right? Because it's the same way if you ever hear an alarm, it gets worked into your dream as some sort of thing, like, oh, so why is the guy honking the horn over and over and over? Oh, and then you wake up and you realize it was that you ever get out of a dream where you want to get back in? It was so good. You're like, I need background sometimes.

[Andrew Schulz]

You can get back in, though.

[Oz Perlman]

You can get back in. That's the thing with lucid ones where you get back in. You're like, oh, my God, I'm back in it. And that's when you. That the thing that. That trips you out is that's when you realize, are we in a simulation? Because now if a dream feels that real, you can control it in your own mind. You know, what is this? Yeah. You guys took the mushrooms too, right?

[Andrew Schulz]

We all took the mushrooms, yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah.

[Mark Agnon]

The hypnosis thing I find really interesting. I read this book, Reality is Plastic. I don't know if you're familiar with it.

[Oz Perlman]

I think I've seen. I haven't read it.

[Mark Agnon]

Well, there's a few that actually I want to ask you about. Also the Full Facts of Cold Reading by Ian Roland.

[Oz Perlman]

That's a great book. I know. Yeah.

[Mark Agnon]

I mean, it's so cool.

[Andrew Schulz]

But can I pee real quick before we get into this? And we're back. Okay. You're talking about.

[Oz Perlman]

Yes, I cleaned up the money. I cleaned up the money.

[Akash Singh]

Thank you.

[Oz Perlman]

Gosh, was trying to steal it all.

[Mark Agnon]

So, yeah, those two books I find really interesting. And the Reality is Plastic I found fascinating because it kind of puts hypnosis on a spectrum.

[Oz Perlman]

Right.

[Mark Agnon]

That with stage hypnosis specifically, you have some people that are sort of like going along with the act. You know, they're hearing hypnosis and they're kind of like doing improv. And then there's sort of like a middle ground where you're sort of in like a dream and things make sense. When you're on stage and you know where you are, you are. And you're in this sort of consensus reality, but you have this feeling where you're like, yeah, no, I am afraid of this water bottle. And then there's another version of like full on hypnotherapy where you're not really in your conscious mind in any capacity.

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah.

[Mark Agnon]

And those people come out of it and they say, I have no idea what happened.

[Oz Perlman]

They also have physical sensations are created by their mind, which is like the Matrix type stuff where they've shown people where they're completely hypnotized and you'll touch them with an ice cube and they'll get a burn mark. They'll have a physical burn, which seems impossible. Impossible because their mind creates. It's like, you know, it's like in the Matrix. And he goes, well, what if happens if you die in the Matrix? The body. The body cannot live without the mind. And they'll get a burn because they, they think that they're being burned with a hot poker with an ice cube.

[Andrew Schulz]

And it will physically show up or will be the.

[Oz Perlman]

I've seen that. I mean, I haven't seen it in person. I've seen some of the funniest things, some of the funniest shows I've ever seen in my life, even blow away standup comedy. Are Are really good hypnotists. Yeah, I was. I think I was 17 and I went to Windsor. I lived outside of Mexico. Metro Detroit.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

And this is a hypno. Hypnotist that I knew. It was like an X rated show. They let me in and he had a guy on stage. I'll never forget this as long as I live. I was in the front row. The guy on stage is wearing like khakis and he's very buttoned up, you know, like a corporate guy. And you did not expect this room. And they. He gave him. He had balloons next to him and he kept saying you're pregnant and you're. And he kept giving different balloons to put in it. Oh touch my baby. And he pretended to be like a pregnant woman. And then it kept going, kept going until he had this. And then he gave him bigger balloons and he kept. You know, they have a people in line and they do different stuff bits with everybody and they keep coming back to each guy. Do you know what I'm saying?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, of course.

[Oz Perlman]

And so they come back to this one guy and he's finally, the baby's coming. Are you ready? And they put his legs up and this guy, I'm in the front row and this is my buddy doing it. He goes push, push. And I heard this.

[Andrew Schulz]

His.

[Akash Singh]

Oh, wow, that's good.

[Oz Perlman]

I'll never forget as long as I.

[Andrew Schulz]

And I see my by his face and we both.

[Oz Perlman]

And you. I'm not close enough to smell it but I can definitely see there's like the pants look full. You know what I'm saying? And this is free cell phone, man. I'm like, I'm like 42 and so this is. I didn't even have a cell phone. Then I asked him after the show like a day or two later and he's like, yo, man, that guy stayed after and he was like, he was really mad and he goes, why? He didn't remember anything. He's watching one of the single like top five funniest things I've ever seen in person in my entire life. I'll just never.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, the hypnotism shows are incredible.

[Oz Perlman]

And it's just the noise like a.

[Andrew Schulz]

Wet like pushing us. Why do you think that's not a bigger art form? I don't know why.

[Oz Perlman]

I don't know why. Because the people that do it really, really well kill it. I have a buddy, Chris Jones shout out to my buddy in Chicago who's incredible. Fellow runner. We are on America's got Talent together. He did A thing thing where he shook Howie Mandel's hand. Do you ever see that? Howie Mandel's notorious germaphobe.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

And he hypnotized him. He had gloves on so he started shaking everybody's hands. Never done it before. It kind of looks like Drake. He's gonna love this plug. But he's awesome. I've just. There's so many hypnosis I've seen.

[Andrew Schulz]

Oh he hypnotized Howie.

[Oz Perlman]

That was his name to fame. Like he blew up. It went so crazy years ago. Because Howie won't shake anyone's hand. He'll fist bump.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

And it's like ingrained. I mean it's a phobia.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

This is like a.

[Andrew Schulz]

Why does he think that the germs can't on the outside?

[Oz Perlman]

I, I, I don't have an answer to that question. That's like I'll never forget when during company we had to stand. You use but at the bank line we'd be two feet apart and I'm like thank God the disease can't. Thank God it can't go horizontal. I don't know the logic I guess cuz you don't touch stuff with the back of your head.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Mark Agnon]

Do you know the function of the disruption of a pattern? So like with a lot of hypnotism it'll be like a handshake and then a snap. And now you're asleep.

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah.

[Mark Agnon]

And what is that?

[Andrew Schulz]

If you just put him asleep right.

[Oz Perlman]

Now that would be.

[Kiana]

I know.

[Andrew Schulz]

Oh my God. My God. Tell us all the tricks.

[Oz Perlman]

Open my eyes.

[Andrew Schulz]

I'm like wait, wait. You're saying go.

[Mark Agnon]

But do you know what is happening there on a.

[Oz Perlman]

On a. I wish I, I'm, I'm not nearly yeah. Attuned enough to know it's not like my field of specialty versus so excited to have friends that know this that could like go into major depth on this subject because they know what. What it does and what it does. Some of it actually affects your brain. There's actually a jarring level of you move and that that there's a force to it that quick induction techniques like that. That but some of it. I think some of it's fake.

[Andrew Schulz]

Really?

[Oz Perlman]

Some of the videos on the gram. Yes.

[Andrew Schulz]

Really?

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah. Who does it. You have an incentive structure that's aligned where let's go viral together. Some of it's real. But I've seen some where you you almost want them to over there and go like give a little wink. But most of it's real. There's when the incentive structure is not aligned. Right. When that's on stage and they desperately.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, exactly.

[Oz Perlman]

Typically not.

[Akash Singh]

Yeah, yeah.

[Mark Agnon]

Have you ever gotten a negative, like a negative reaction specifically on a cultural. Cultural level?

[Oz Perlman]

I've had. So I've had things go wrong at cultural levels. I've had things.

[Andrew Schulz]

Where.

[Oz Perlman]

Have you ever done a trick for.

[Mark Agnon]

Like a Caribbean person, like a West African person that has voodoo in the culture? And I used to do a lot.

[Oz Perlman]

Of stuff for the mafia, so I did a lot of mafia owned restaurants.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

When I moved to New York City. When I moved to New York City, I did. I still worked at restaurants. I worked on Wall street for about two and a half years. And then I was doing this as a side hustle.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

And so I worked restaurants to give out business cards and to get parties, but to meet. And a lot of the top Italian joints are. They were mafia own. They were mafia run. So I would do parties. When the guys would get out, it was straight Sopranos, like, straight up, like, guys get out and they have a party there.

[Andrew Schulz]

They believe all this, though.

[Oz Perlman]

Some of them do, but some of them don't like the challenge. So right there, there's a, like a, like a dick measuring competition where, you know, something I don't know right now.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

And you know, Stupid. Exactly. There's as if it's exactly that. As if I just made you look stupid and I need to show my authority over you.

[Andrew Schulz]

And did you have.

[Oz Perlman]

I've never had altercations. I had a buddy who actually had a switchblade pulled out and he has a ponytail and it was brought back and they said, if I, if you don't tell me how you did that, I'm going cut off your ponytail. Which is crazy story mine. I'm always able to get out of it because of humor. Like, I, you know, I can rib, I can roast. I can self deprecate and find a way out of it and misdirect it. It's, you know, it's. If you try to take it head on, you're going to lose that battle.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

If you can make people move in a pattern and see what is at the core and that they want. They want to not be made to look bad. They want to feel like they're part of it. And I go, you know what? You know how to do this stuff? Let me show you something right now. And I go, oh, you can diffuse it by saying, I know that you get it. You totally know how this is done. Let me show you how different ones don't. Come here, let me show you. So you, like, take them out. You don't. You show them something stupid, and then they feel like they're good. They're like, that was amazing, right? You didn't kill me. I'm very happy. Wow.

[Andrew Schulz]

How did you meet your wife?

[Oz Perlman]

JDate.

[Andrew Schulz]

Get out of here.

[Oz Perlman]

JDate.com. old school.

[Andrew Schulz]

How do you break to her? Yeah, how do you, like, tell her?

[Mark Agnon]

Old school.

[Oz Perlman]

I had the best pro profile ever. No, I mean old school, like now. Like, if it's not Tinder. Like, we didn't even. There were no swiping back then. I had the best profile ever because I had quit my job and I was working, but I wasn't. I wasn't really successful yet. You know, this wasn't like, I've been on tv.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

So I go, oh, I workshop this. I was like, quit my job in the. Quit my job in finance to pursue my dream and open my own business in the entertainment industry. Which sounded either like, you're a porn star, or I don't know what. It was really flowery and sounded great. And then when she met me, she's like, so what do you do? I'm like, I'm a magician. She's like, no, no, but seriously, what are you doing? I'm like, no, no, for real, I'm a magician.

[Andrew Schulz]

And then how did she grapple with.

[Oz Perlman]

That, starting from like. Like minus 20?

[Andrew Schulz]

That's the thing. Like, how does a girl grapple with that? Like, did you have to convince her that this was going to work out? Were you successful at that time? Like, what?

[Oz Perlman]

I wasn't not successful, but I was not. The other amazing part about it's hard.

[Akash Singh]

To see the upside is I got.

[Oz Perlman]

Adult braces, which is really a panty dropper by itself, but I got them off three days before I met her.

[Andrew Schulz]

Oh, God.

[Oz Perlman]

I've literally looked at my children and you remember, like, in Back to the Future, where you see the photo disappear. Like, the photo. I'm like, all of you. If I had just had them on for five more days. None of you. She's told me straight up, you had braces on our first date.

[Andrew Schulz]

Was there ever a part where she was like, I'm not going to date a struggling magician and start a family with.

[Oz Perlman]

She's like a venture capital firm. She somehow saw this. She. I put this in the book. Like, I tried to dump her, which is the stupidest mistake I ever, ever made in my life.

[Andrew Schulz]

Wait, why?

[Oz Perlman]

I'm just immature. I wasn't Like, I'd been in a relationship from college sweetheart, and then I'm going to another relationship, and I'm like, you know, I'm in my 20s. I. I can't get locked down like this. Meanwhile, I had a winning lottery ticket. I just didn't know it. And she pretty much. She's smart. She's way smarter than me. Mature. She's like, no. And she deconstructed like a mentalist while I was breaking up with her. I'm like, that's not right.

[Andrew Schulz]

You know, like, you just wanted to get some now the fifth, but you got some excess. You want to watch to Cape man. Superman got five.

[Mark Agnon]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

So I was being stupid. And then. And then it flipped. The whole dynamic flipped. Where. When I was like. When she. When we didn't break up, and I was like, can you do that? Can you say no to a breakup? And then I wanted her more. And I'm like, can you move in with me? She's like, let's slow it down. I'm like, whoa, she's about to dump me.

[Mark Agnon]

I only have two minutes.

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah.

[Mark Agnon]

Your own games.

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah. No tipping. The owner brought me in. That's hard.

[Andrew Schulz]

She probably realized that you need the chase.

[Oz Perlman]

She did. It was very good. She's. She's the brains of the operation. I did a trick I always had. Like, I had my tricks. So I have certain tricks that I did when I was, like, a teenager that were designed for certain situations. Like, I had the stoner trick. I had certain tricks I did when people were stoned or high. Like.

[Andrew Schulz]

What do you mean?

[Oz Perlman]

Visuals. They're like, things that mess you up visually. Okay, I was in this. A great story. So before weed was legal in Amsterdam, did you. Are you with anybody from that era where you'd have to go to Amsterdam and so smoke weed if you wanted to legally. It was, like, a fun thing that you could actually smoke in a cafe. And it was like, a thing. This is 20 years ago. So I stopped there on the way to a flight, and I go into a Bulldog cafe. I'll never forget this place. And we have been. Yeah, you know that place. And you can do mushrooms there. And so there's a table with all Americans. I find them, and one dude's on mushrooms. Who you can tell. Like, you could tell. And then everyone else, Americans. And we smoked weed. I'm not a big weed guy. Like, I don't really like any more, but at the time, big pothead. And so that's a different level of high. He's Fully tripping balls. And I bring out. I do card tricks for them, but I bring out, like, the one that I'm going to do for this guy, and this is a very specific trick. I can't do it for you. Now, I apologize. Where I say to somebody, take any card out of a deck of cards, and he takes it. I would have been prepared. I could have done this for you. I just don't do it anymore. I don't do as much. Like, slight hand. He holds it here, and let's say it's the four hearts. I take the rest of the cards. And the only way I can describe this, because I just. Again, I don't mean to. To tease you, is he's holding it tight with two hands. I go, whatever you do, don't blink and don't let me touch it. And I move the cards around. I go, don't blink. And I go like this. And I go back, and the card is now 18 the size. It is shrunken.

[Mark Agnon]

I would.

[Oz Perlman]

And so I. I'll never forget this guy's face. It's like it's so imprinted on my memory. He looked at the card and he kept blinking, right? Because he didn't know, because you understand. And then he looked around at us, then he looked at the card, then he put it down, and then he left. And I had to go because I was on a layover. So I only hung out with these people for, like, two hours. But he still wasn't back. And I felt really bad, but I also was like. That was pretty much the most epic reaction of all time.

[Akash Singh]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

So I'm like, I don't think he's dead. I like to assume he just. I don't know what he did, but that was.

[Andrew Schulz]

Do you remember what you said to that group of strangers to get them to allow you to do magic for them?

[Oz Perlman]

Oh, dude. There was not. We're just Americans. Like, in that situation, you're just like.

[Mark Agnon]

Yeah, you're high in Amsterdam. Like, yo, you have tricks.

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah.

[Mark Agnon]

They probably asked, would you say, hey.

[Andrew Schulz]

Do you guys want to see a trick? Or.

[Oz Perlman]

I just was like, are you guys. Oh, you guys are American. Like, I heard them talking.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

And I'm like, can I hang with you guys? And they're like, you know, don't. You don't want to smoke by yourself? It was awkward.

[Andrew Schulz]

So that's a yes or no question.

[Oz Perlman]

Which one?

[Andrew Schulz]

Can I hang with you guys?

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah, I was in. I was in.

[Mark Agnon]

Yeah. He was feeling it.

[Oz Perlman]

Tell me your dream as A seven year old. No. Psycho and creepy. No, it was. It was just a vibe. It was very fun, very fun day and I'll never forget that.

[Andrew Schulz]

Is there any, Any just card trick that you could do? I know you've done the big ending, but is there any card trick?

[Oz Perlman]

I love card trick from a. From this. I'll do a card trick offline, but I can't. The card trick's not going to compare to Fanta, lgr and Flagrant. I can't, I can't. I can't go from the closer to. To just lackluster.

[Andrew Schulz]

What's up?

[Kiana]

So you said you did some prep. Can you tell us things about us that help you perform tricks on us? Like maybe something you notice he does something you notice. I do. Can you divulge that or you like to keep those in?

[Oz Perlman]

It's not, it's. It's. I can't quantify it out loud. Right. A lot of it's on a field basis. A lot of it is if I can get to a place early and meet people and see what I'm gonna do. But I could come in here and do this podcast fresh. We could have walked in the door. And I literally come from being outside pouring rain. Even though I had to dry off. When I got here, we were both soaked. And so having 10 minutes to decompress, say hello, shake hands, kind of feel people out is helpful. But when I go on stage for. For hundreds and thousands of people, I can't meet anybody. There's not possible. So at that point, you're doing a lot of the cold reading in the moment.

[Andrew Schulz]

Got it.

[Oz Perlman]

And so a lot of the secret sauce, when I walk out in the crowd, it's kind of like crowd work is crowd work. As you see someone, you're going to see what's funny about them and then see what you can get from them. Mine is a version of crowd work. When my crowd work is going to be like, it's a puzzle. It's a puzzle. How do I turn it this way, this way, this way, and then unlock what they're going to think? And I like going to the person who's going to sometimes give me the over the top crazy reaction. I sometimes like the quiet, my God, slowly and then explode and freak out. Like there's going to be all different kinds of laughs, all different kinds of amazement. And I can calibrate pretty well. What kills me is when I get something wrong in a show and I don't know why I got it wrong. So you said get it wrong. Sometimes I get something wrong, but I figured out what happened so I can kind of get out of it. But I've gotten stuff wrong where I don't know what happened.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah. Give me example.

[Oz Perlman]

I did a show for. I'm not going to say the client because they're probably going to hire me again, but a very large payroll provider. Biggest one in. I opened for Alicia Keys and it was. It was awesome. Great show. She does a great show in, like, Hollywood. I think it's a Hollywood bowl or somewhere. I don't know, several thousand people. And I know what this guy was thinking. Do you understand? I can tell you for a fact, I understand it. Everything about it. I knew what he picked. I knew what he was thinking of in this moment. I would have bet my life on it. And yet he insisted 100% that that's not it. And so what are you going to do? Right. Because the show is at end. The end of the day is. Is. I. I mean, if he would have. The piece of paper could have showed you that he. That he wrote down the word fart so we could have pieced it together. But what if. What if he didn't? What if I. And the other word is in the book. How could we even know that? What if he just said, no, that's not the word. It's not the word. It's not tourist. It's not this. What could I do right? If. But I can normally tell who's going to lie, who's going to be a stick in the mud, who's opposite. I completely misjudged this guy. It's like if you were dating somebody and you found out they were a serial killer, you're like, I can't believe I was. I missed all that. I couldn't understand how went wrong. And then I'm like, flop sweating, trying to reconstruct it. And then sometimes I dig in. That's the worst. If you dig in, it's like crowd work to somebody who's not responding and keep trying to get it. And then you should just let go.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

At that point.

[Akash Singh]

Sometimes them. Sometimes.

[Mark Agnon]

Then it's you, though, because now you're digging in the audience.

[Oz Perlman]

You. Yeah, I can't, like, light the ship on fire. This isn't like a mark Marin. Like, I'm just going to f. You know, I've seen him go in the audience and just like, let it go. I. I love that there's some element of that that you enjoy, but for me, I have to be kind of likable or it makes it so I can't do the rest of the stuff.

[Andrew Schulz]

So did you figure out where you messed up with it?

[Oz Perlman]

Never. Never figured out.

[Andrew Schulz]

To this day. Are you kind of confused about it.

[Akash Singh]

Or you think he just lied?

[Oz Perlman]

I don't know if he had a psychotic break. I don't know. I can't explain it.

[Mark Agnon]

Must make you hand shy going into the effect another time.

[Oz Perlman]

So that's what's, that's what's nerve wracking. Because if you go on tv, I did one before the super bowl one time and like before the Super Bowl, I had coach Rex Ryan use a stopwatch. How do you tell the coach, like, can you practice? Do you know how to use stopwatch? He goes, yeah, of course I know how to. Like, just make sure you know how. And he was supposed to time something we did. It was a big part of it was to time it and he fat fingered it. So like when he hit it, he hit it twice. So we did all this stuff. How much time was he going, oh, it's at one second. I think I hit it twice. I'm like, what the fuck?

[Andrew Schulz]

So what do you do?

[Oz Perlman]

So I. You have to think really quick on your feet with tens of millions of people watching.

[Andrew Schulz]

Watch it.

[Oz Perlman]

And, And I, I pulled it out, but I didn't think it was great. It was suboptimal. It was like a plan B. But I always plan for everything that can go wrong. And I never thought that an NFL coach would not use the timer correctly.

[Akash Singh]

So like former NFL coach.

[Oz Perlman]

That's true, that's true. I don't blame twice. I don't blame him. It's not his fault. But man, oh man, did it throw me under the bus.

[Andrew Schulz]

Did it ruin the trick?

[Oz Perlman]

It just ruined the phase.

[Andrew Schulz]

Got it.

[Oz Perlman]

So again, I tried to sweep that under the rug real quick, focus on the other stuff. But people are like, some people like, what happened to the timer?

[Andrew Schulz]

It's like, okay, for that final reveal right there, what if they all chose? What? Chose L, he chose L and he chose G. That could have very real happened.

[Oz Perlman]

I didn't. Wouldn't have worked. That's the whole beauty of it. You never know.

[Akash Singh]

He primes me to pick an L, he knows I'm here. He primes him to pick a G. Primes how? I don't know.

[Mark Agnon]

Has anything ever gone wrong in a public setting and one of your mentalist friends hits you on the side and goes, yo, I saw like, good save. And no one else picked it up.

[Oz Perlman]

But they did I have some people like that work on shows that are like an assistant that's not really doing anything, but that's watching like a video person who, if I had like a residency for two years, who's seen the show a hundred times, like my wife back in the day would see the show. And so once she's seen the show enough, she can tell the rhythms and she can see when something goes wrong. She doesn't watch my show anymore ever, but she used to.

[Akash Singh]

And so isn't it funny how tired of it they get?

[Oz Perlman]

Oh my God. Especially when you pretend like something just happened off the cuff and you're like, oh no, I know that that's a bit you do.

[Akash Singh]

Every time I asked my wife recently to come if you want to come to the show, she goes, literally, I would rather do anything else in the world.

[Oz Perlman]

Jesus Christ.

[Akash Singh]

Also, she knows she's seen it a thousand times.

[Mark Agnon]

You know what I mean? I spoke to a magician friend and I asked if he knew another person that was a little bit farther along in their career and he goes, oh, I actually helped with his show.

[Oz Perlman]

Oh yeah.

[Mark Agnon]

And I was like, what does that mean? He's like, ah, you know, I just help out. Are you able to inform me a little more what does that mean when a younger magician helps out with a bigger magician's show because he wants to do that.

[Oz Perlman]

Is this a interview right now that.

[Andrew Schulz]

We'Re having for job?

[Mark Agnon]

The internal dynamics of, of comedians is very obvious to me because I've been in the game so long. How does it work? I like you would see someone's effect and say, oh, you should actually add this to tighten it for sure.

[Oz Perlman]

Just like that. You punch up an effect, punch up the effect, structure it differently, kind of all the things surrounding it. So I, I, I'm a big presentation based guy. So when I go on like I was on ESPN this morning and I go on and the whole thing was themed around the fact that it's the NBA playoffs, it's the finals, I'm not going to go on ESPN and do, no offense, like a trick about Fanta and Scrabble towels. Doesn't make sense. This came together for you. It was a custom designed piece. It makes it interesting, right? And stuff that's a little more risque in this room versus if I go for a corporate. So I would watch and see what's the story you're telling. Because most people that do what I do and the reason that they can't really get to a certain point is because their end of their show is always, look at me and what I can.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah. It's not about.

[Oz Perlman]

It's not about the. The audience. So when you make it about the audience, you can expand your reach. That's why, like, I've been on CNBC several dozen times. Nobody ever. No other magician or mentalist ever has been on that network. How can that be? It's like one of those crazy things. Doesn't make sense. You'd always think there'd be outliers. It's not just because I worked on Wall Street. There's other mentalists who've worked on Wall Street.

[Akash Singh]

How long did you prepare your Joe Rogan trick with the envelope? And then how long do you prepare this flagrant thing?

[Oz Perlman]

Ooh, is this, like, to decide which.

[Akash Singh]

No, we know the answer to that.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

Love you, Charles. The Rogan has been in the back of my head for several years because I have been assessing Joe, and I also listened to that podcast for a really long time. Big into the alien stuff. I listened to you guys for a while, too, for the record, but it was more of a, what would I do with Joe if I got in that room? Also, this is so much easier because there's four of you.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

One on one is brutal. Yeah, it's brutal.

[Andrew Schulz]

Nothing to play off of.

[Oz Perlman]

There's no play off of. There's no. It's a. It's a stone wall.

[Akash Singh]

Can't distract us.

[Oz Perlman]

You can't. There's no setup. There's no. Like, I got there, and there was zero. You can't do anything. It's like, we got in there. Get in the studio, like, you know, so.

[Andrew Schulz]

Oh, wow.

[Oz Perlman]

I mean, not in a bad way. I'm not saying it was mean. It was just. There's no real. There's no foreplay.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yes.

[Oz Perlman]

So.

[Andrew Schulz]

So you can't really learn a lot beforehand.

[Oz Perlman]

Very little. My interaction with Joe was minuscule before we were on air, but the idea.

[Andrew Schulz]

About the ATM pin code happened potentially years ago.

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah. I do that a lot, though. The ATM pin code, you explained to him how to.

[Akash Singh]

Maybe he gives him an envelope at the beginning of the end.

[Andrew Schulz]

I saw the eclipse.

[Akash Singh]

The 14 is crazy.

[Oz Perlman]

He doesn't believe that he gave anything away by what he said. And it was. It didn't want to be confrontational. I'm like, that's what I do. I reverse engineer. So in a lot of instances, you're like, you couldn't reverse engine. I'm like, yeah, you could, though. Because if I suddenly told you how many six letter names Are there. That could be for a female, but that could also be for a boy. Because he was confused when I said, look up how popular this name is. And he goes, well, it could go. Oh, it could go either way. Now, there's a much limited set of names that could be. Is it Pat? Is it Patty? Is it like, there's all different ways? And now, once I knew R and D, which he doesn't believe, but I knew the D, I figured out the R.6 letters. If you literally put in a computer, there's six names at that point, and now you could stack which ones are the most popular? How do I do it? People don't believe it, but I figure things out. It's not a psychic power.

[Kiana]

Can you turn this off?

[Oz Perlman]

I usually don't have it on. It takes.

[Kiana]

Okay, let's say hypothetically, you have five kids. You ask your oldest, like, oh, did you brush your teeth?

[Oz Perlman]

And they lie. Oh, I know. If they're lying. Easy.

[Kiana]

And then do you point it out?

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah. Oh, yeah.

[Kiana]

Oh, okay. So it's.

[Oz Perlman]

That's always. I think most parents know that.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

Can't you tell? You can tell their rhythms. You. You can benchmark people pretty easy. That's like part. Part of my book is, how do you. Because the best way to analyze is. I can't just right now say, all right, tell me everything. Tell me how you do it. You can't, because you have to compare people to themselves, not to other people. Anyone who tells you otherwise goes, nlp. You look up here. This does this. This is. It's flowery. It's not true. It's the same with, like, a lot of body language reading. Yes, there's patterns, but once you know how it works, you need to compare people to themselves.

[Andrew Schulz]

Right.

[Oz Perlman]

Do you understand? It's the same way that blood doping.

[Andrew Schulz]

That's your baseline.

[Oz Perlman]

You have a baseline. You have to have a baseline. And the more time you're around people. That's why I told you the Rogan was hard. I wasn't really around him that much, and I needed to hook people in because that's a long podcast where I felt like if I don't do something cool at the beginning, people go, I don't know who this guy is. Boom. Next. Next. So I need to hook you in instantly and have you stay around till the end.

[Andrew Schulz]

Your. Your new book, read your mind, comes out October 28th.

[Oz Perlman]

Damn. Are you reading my mind?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yes, the. Can you pre order it now? Is there. Is that available for preorder? And then is it Your website. What is the best price? Okay, everyone, it's Oz.

[Oz Perlman]

Mine looks like. It looks like Oz. It should be Oz.

[Andrew Schulz]

It's Oz.

[Oz Perlman]

Ozperlman.com Got it. So it's O Z P E A R L M A N dot com, but everything go on social. It's thementalist. That's where all my stuff is.

[Andrew Schulz]

The book itself, is it. Obviously you're not divulging this information, are you? Showcasing how it can be helpful for you in your life.

[Oz Perlman]

I call it Proven habits for success.

[Andrew Schulz]

So it's more self help, if you will.

[Oz Perlman]

This is if you were to take that book, how to win friends and influence people, which is honestly one of the best books I've ever read in my life. And I'm not saying that book is dated. It's terrific. Everything it does still stands to this day. But if you put that through the lens of somebody whose entire job is to read people for a living and see what tactical advantages I can give you on how to supercharge your memory. Memory is one of those things where you don't realize how much of what I'm doing right now relies on memory and awareness of things and remembering them. And honestly, in my life people give me credit for reading their minds and half the time it's purely memory. I just know a lot of stuff.

[Andrew Schulz]

What is that thing called? It's like memory palace or something like that. What is that term?

[Oz Perlman]

Memory build. You build stories.

[Andrew Schulz]

I don't know if that's what it is.

[Mark Agnon]

Like moving through a physical space and then ascribing different ideas to rooms in order to memorize.

[Oz Perlman]

So you can do that.

[Andrew Schulz]

Is that what you're doing or.

[Oz Perlman]

No, my stuff is. That's so much more complex. I like to dumb it down. I. The whole book is techniques you will master in 10 minutes and still be doing in 10 years. Like anything of you. Oh, I got to do this, I got to do that. I got a journal. Screw that. I want things that are easy, compact, that you can do, do not like hear about and not do.

[Andrew Schulz]

What's a thing that we can supercharge?

[Oz Perlman]

I'll tell you right now. So memory, one of the big ones. This is a good one for people in day to day life. You meet a lot of people, right? You all meet a lot of people in your industry?

[Akash Singh]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

How often have you met somebody and three seconds later you don't know their name?

[Akash Singh]

99.

[Oz Perlman]

Right. And so it's very awkward. In many instances you can avoid it and be like, oh my guy, my Guy, right? Or you try to find somebody near to introduce. Be like, oh this is Andrew and you're like nice to meet you. You're like, nice to meet you. So that I can make disappear forever. Disappear forever. So I did this in a TED talk and I explained it this way. You want a hook, you want something you're going to remember. The back of every bottle of shampoo says three words. Lather, rinse, repeat. Have you heard that? Lather, rinse, repeat. Lather, rinse, repeat. Here's what I call it. I call it listen, repeat, reply. Remember that. Listen, repeat, reply. The first reason that you are not remembering someone's name has nothing to do with memory. You never knew it to begin with, not even listen. You never knew it.

[Akash Singh]

I just want to get the handshake right.

[Oz Perlman]

So you got to get the handshake right. That's key.

[Akash Singh]

You miss web to web. What's fucking?

[Oz Perlman]

Oh done, done. And you've got written on your hand.

[Akash Singh]

Right now there's got a woman's hand. It's just a whole fucking.

[Oz Perlman]

There are short fingers. But you have other good attributes, Akash, don't put yourself down, is that you need to listen to the name. The number one thing I can take away is 95% of the time if you make your mind a blank right, you, when you look at them and, and, and you name, you instantly repeat it. Listen, repeat. So I go Alex. Is that Alex? It's so funny. So right away I say the name twice more and if you can at that point, Alex, great to meet you Alex. You say it twice, your chances right away of forgetting it have already gone down by about 90%.

[Andrew Schulz]

Wow.

[Oz Perlman]

So right away, and if it's, if you can listen, make your mind a blank. Do not think about what you're going to say next. That's what everybody does. You turn, oh your job guard, listen, repeat the name at least twice and then reply, reply is some sort of hook. So one of the big ones is a compliment. Be like Alex, man I love that necklace. Alex. Where'd you get that necklace? Alex? You say it two more times and now you've connected it with something physical. Alex with the necklace. Now I'm not trying to remember your name for days but I will remember you for the next 10 or 15 minutes. Another good one. Compliment is one. How do you spell it? Akash. Is it Akash or W? Double A in the middle. Akash. I don't know a lot of caches that spell it that way. Now I've got the spelling.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

Or the third one is you create some sort of connection where I'm like, Mark, dude, that's so funny, man. My sister's husband's named Mark. That's so hilarious.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

And I go, my sister's husband is not named Mark. Liar. But now I'm gonna remember you. Like you do something. And this is a trick that you. I've shown it to people for years. And if you just try this today with somebody, you'll see right away, you don't forget their name. You will remember, remember their name for the next, at least 10, 15 minutes, typically for the next few hours.

[Andrew Schulz]

And that will get you out of that social situation.

[Oz Perlman]

Gets you out of that situation. And then a lot of other tricks on how to read people effectively, how to time things, how in those situations, same way in a restaurant, how I learned to know what people are thinking and use it to your advantage. How do you do that at home? How do you do that in relationships?

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, I'm so curious with this like opening statement. The opening statements, the biggest one, I think that's massive. Do you talk a lot about that in the book? I think that's so interesting. I think that's great. Great for just socialization in general and like building momentum in a social environment. I think a lot of people like can get crippled. Like I remember just being younger, you're going out for the first time. If I walked up to a girl with, when I, when I first walked into a bar, even if it didn't go well, I just got the monkey off my back. It was so much easier for me to socialize that. But if I just held up the wall for about 15, 20 minutes, you're.

[Oz Perlman]

Locked in that you're frozen.

[Andrew Schulz]

Exactly. Yeah. So it's like building that, that social momentum especially so crucial and just having little tricks of the trade to help with that. Wow, that's. Yeah, that's really great. I like that idea of not imposing yourself on a group of people, not only through body language, but even the way that you're talking and not creating these like yes or no questions. What was it?

[Oz Perlman]

It was an open, open ended, something that.

[Andrew Schulz]

Giving value. What was it? It was like dopamine, curiosity and open ended.

[Oz Perlman]

Right, right.

[Andrew Schulz]

Can you give another example? Just in life, it doesn't have to be with magic trick. It's like, like what would be, you're walking up here, you see a group of us in a park or something like that. You just kind of, you're in a new country, you want to say hi, maybe meet Some friends. What would you say?

[Oz Perlman]

So you mean just an opening line?

[Andrew Schulz]

I know you're reading people in the.

[Oz Perlman]

Moment, obviously I don't know for social situations I always like to do point out the obvious. So if you're in a situation, think about this. Why is it that if you're in an elevator, right. Especially if you're in Manhattan, you'll never talk to anyone. But if that elevator get stuck, we're.

[Andrew Schulz]

Chatting it up later.

[Oz Perlman]

You're best friends, right? Everybody knows that. Why is that. Or you're in a subway. Why is there this release that when everyone's in a situation together, we now open up socially, right. There's some sort of thing that changes in us. Why didn't we say that before? Is it cause of the time limit? It's cause we were only going to spend 20 seconds in the elevator and now we might be in there for two minutes and we're like, oh man, can you believe this crap? Oh, where'd you like you open up to those people? There's something about it. So I think there's something to be said where if I've been at of a lot, a lot of parent like environments with other parents at school and it's like you don't know these people, what are you really going to say to them? And I think you just go in there and rather than do the regular small talk, oh, what's your kid, what's your this? What? Like if you can say something that nobody's really thought of about the school and been like, I absolutely love this about the school, how do you feel about that? And it gives you something to run with and it's positive. I try to go with positive energy rather than negative energy because I don't that that's typically what I do. I try to point out positive things and give open ended to see if they agree. And if they don't, well, we have some fun riffing there too.

[Andrew Schulz]

Right?

[Oz Perlman]

Right. But that, that's what I've done. Rather than just hey, what's your name? Where do you work? What do you do? Like I don't want, because I don't want to ask. Then they ask me what I do and I don't want to go down that path. I try to avoid as much as possible.

[Andrew Schulz]

I can see that.

[Mark Agnon]

Yeah, I've heard that asking really finite questions is challenging for people and then asking open ended or time based questions is actually more helpful. So instead of asking you what's your favorite favorite movie?

[Oz Perlman]

Right.

[Mark Agnon]

Saying what are some movies you like, or what is the most recent movie you've seen?

[Oz Perlman]

Yeah.

[Mark Agnon]

Is typically easier for someone to answer. And like, creates more lubrication socially.

[Andrew Schulz]

That's a time based question. Like, what is the most recent?

[Mark Agnon]

Yeah. What's the first movie that made a big impression on you?

[Oz Perlman]

That's a good one.

[Mark Agnon]

And so it can create like a little bit like less apprehension where it's like your favorite movie. You're just sitting there like, man, I don't know. And then it creates like kind of like a stall barrier a little bit.

[Andrew Schulz]

What if you're starting a show, what would. What were your opening line be when you started Start a show?

[Oz Perlman]

My opening line is pretty much is acknowledging the fact, the obvious statement between me and the audience, which they'll see my sizzle reel, my hype reel.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

And I go, I see it. And you know what I'm calling bs. Like, I just want to. Everyone in the audience sees this and what do you think? This, there's no way this is right. Right. I can't read minds. And that's why I say I can't read minds. I read people. That's what you said. Like, if you're going to have all this flowery language, you're not going to break the fourth wall. I'm going to break the fourth wall and say to you, I learned how to do this. I've trained myself for years. This is a skill, not some sort of ethereal gift. Light didn't shine upon me. I've taken a set of skills and I've developed them. And a lot of them are transferable to other people. And it's kind of like music. Some people are incredible at playing the guitar or the piano. They have an innate gift, but it's not supernatural. Jimi Hendrix could do that. So the same thing applies where people could do what I'm doing, but most of them won't put in the time, get through the hard bumps because I wasn't as good years ago. I can assure you, if you would have seen it, things would have gone wrong. This would. And like, it's really tough to get over when you screw up a lot.

[Andrew Schulz]

Yeah, yeah.

[Oz Perlman]

That's why there's less mentalists. There's more magicians because of exactly that reason. He can tell you magic tricks, if you practice them endlessly, they typically work. You can perfect them on your own mentalism. What I just did for you, like the thing with the flagrant, this I've never done before. I've never ever done that before. And I will never do it again. So all of it was thought out in advance, and it wasn't really practiced to anybody. I just practiced it in my mind over and over and over.

[Andrew Schulz]

Thank you so much, brother. That was amazing, man. Go check out his new book.

[Mark Agnon]

Thank you so much.

[Oz Perlman]

Coming out.

[Andrew Schulz]

Go pre order right now. Read your mind comes out October 28th. Thank you so much, brother.

[Oz Perlman]

Thanks for having me.

[Andrew Schulz]

Thanks for having.

[Oz Perlman]

Great job.

[Akash Singh]

Great, dude.

[Andrew Schulz]

Thank you so much, bro.

[Oz Perlman]

A blast.

[Mark Agnon]

This is awesome.