Earlier this year journalist Ben Makuch caught a glimpse of Eric Schmidt, the former CEO of Google, dancing at a club in Kyiv. It was a surreal moment, a snapshot of a tragic war that the West thinks is defining the future of conflict. Tech executives have flocked to Ukraine, courting the country in an attempt to get at a resource more precious than gold: data. Makuch was just there and has written about what he saw for The New Republic and he’s on the show today to talk about it.

Some light smoking banter
Ben’s timeline
Google’s CEO dancing in a bar in Kyiv
Ukraine as laboratory for war tech
The JSOC era is over
In defense of the majestic American turkey
The great America vs China speculation
War, cheaper
On the actual frontline
Wheat fields of fiber optic line
The buzz of the drone
Life in the bloodlands
The human suffering of living in Ukraine
FPV-made propaganda
“Never underestimate human innovation when it comes to killing other humans.”
What’s Erik Prince doing in Ukraine?

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Google’s Former CEO Is Dancing in Ukraine