Podcast Summary: Apple News Today
Episode: The Hidden Dangers of Being Pregnant in America
Date: November 8, 2025
Host: Shamita Basu
Guest: Irin Carmon, journalist and author of Unbearable: Five Women and the Perils of Pregnancy in America
Main Theme
This episode investigates the persistent and often hidden dangers facing pregnant people in America. Through stories from Irin Carmon’s new book and data-driven insight, host Shamita Basu and Carmon examine the structural, cultural, and historical failures of the U.S. maternal care system, highlighting threads of systemic disrespect, racism, legal obstacles, and historical context that contribute to the dire state of maternal health.
Key Discussion Points & Insights
1. How Pregnant People Are Treated in America
- Irin shares a revealing anecdote from a preschool picnic, where moms characterize how America treats pregnant women:
- “Somebody said, ‘Like a child.’ And somebody else said, ‘Like an animal.’ And Maggie said, ‘Like a child animal.’” (Irin Carmon, [00:36])
- Carmon identifies a “common thread” in the stories she gathered:
- “America...has failed to see us as fully people, as fully human who are in possession of our full faculties and instead as a means to an end or a vessel.” (Irin Carmon, [01:18])
2. The Data: Maternal Mortality Crisis
- America is statistically the most dangerous industrialized country to be pregnant in, even when measured conservatively.
- “According to the CDC, 80% of maternal deaths are preventable.” (Irin Carmon, [01:50])
- Basu shares her personal perspective, currently pregnant with her second child and reflecting on her first experience ([02:06]).
3. Why Pregnancy is Treated Differently
- Pregnancy is loaded with gendered expectations and can evoke powerful social, cultural, and religious responses.
- The medical system often dehumanizes pregnant people, exposing them to disrespect and neglect, especially those who are marginalized by race, income, or insurance status:
- “The experience of giving birth for many people is...putting people into contact with a kind of dehumanization in the medical system...” (Irin Carmon, [03:40])
- Pregnancy is also the most common reason for hospitalization among women in the U.S. ([02:57]).
4. Racial Disparities and Systemic Inequity
- Black women are disproportionately affected by poor maternal care and higher mortality rates.
- “One of the factors that makes a black woman more likely to die is the hospital that she goes to.” (Irin Carmon, [05:28])
- Hospitals serving mainly people of color are underfunded and understaffed, contributing to worse outcomes.
- C-section decisions are sometimes driven by profit and convenience, disproportionately impacting Black patients:
- “When the same doctor was faced with a low-risk white patient and a low-risk black patient...the black patient was more likely to have a C-section.” (Irin Carmon, [06:44])
- Many U.S. counties lack any maternal healthcare provider, creating “maternal care deserts” ([07:13]).
5. Historical Context: Roots of Modern Gynecology
- The story of J. Marion Sims:
- Sims, hailed as a pioneer, experimented on enslaved Black women without anesthesia, laying a foundation that pushed out midwives and created a hierarchy with white male doctors at the top ([07:52], [08:54]).
- “This was the birth of modern gynecology, was the suffering of countless women, three of whose names we know: Anarcha, Betsy and Lucy. And they were the mothers of gynecology.” (Irin Carmon, [08:27])
6. Stories of Maggie and Christine: Systemic Failures in Practice
- Maggie’s Story:
- Sought respectful midwife care, transferred to under-resourced Woodhull Hospital, nearly died from an improperly closed C-section incision—her husband’s persistence saved her ([10:09]).
- “Only her husband’s screams being heeded saved her life because she needed a full body blood transfusion and had lasting hormonal damage.” (Irin Carmon, [11:01])
- Christine’s Story:
- Longtime Brooklyn resident, history of foster care, sought to give birth at Woodhull due to positive prior midwife care.
- Experienced disregard and neglect, resulting in her preventable death from the same injury and doctor as Maggie, four years later ([14:20]).
- “By the time doctors finally realized what was happening with Christine, it was too late to save her life.” (Irin Carmon, [14:33])
- Her fiancé, Jose, was harassed by hospital security and later became a maternal health advocate and doula ([15:09]).
7. Litigation and Accountability Barriers
- Victims and families face arduous, narrow, and emotionally draining pathways to legal recourse.
- “It’s a very American way of doing things that when you are harmed by a system so much bigger than one bad doctor, it also falls on the person who’s been victimized to go through a grueling, expensive, sometimes traumatizing, dehumanizing legal process.” (Irin Carmon, [16:51])
- Damage calculations often don’t compensate emotional distress or future earning potential, and advocates like Jose are fighting to change this ([18:01]).
8. Burden on Partners & Need for Advocacy
- The responsibility to advocate often falls on untrained partners during emergencies, which is stressful and traumatizing:
- “Your partner, if you have a partner, is not trained in any of this...what does that say about the strain on our systems at this time of deep vulnerability?” (Irin Carmon, [21:44])
- Retaliation against patients and partners who challenge the system is a real risk, especially for those perceived as “difficult” or marginalized ([19:57], [21:02]).
9. Advice, Resilience, and Hope
- Despite systemic failures, Carmon sees hope in stories of advocacy and perseverance, and the need to reclaim pregnancy as potentially beautiful and supported for all:
- “It’s precisely because these moments in people’s lives are so intimate and personal and can be so beautiful and so joyful that we need to expose what’s wrong...this can be a source of beauty, this can be a source of joy.” (Irin Carmon, [23:10])
- She wishes safety, joy, and love for anyone who wants to be pregnant, while stressing things “could be so much better than what we have right now” ([23:55]).
Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments
- “According to the CDC, 80% of maternal deaths are preventable.” — Irin Carmon ([01:50])
- “The experience of giving birth for many people is actually kind of putting people into contact with a kind of dehumanization in the medical system.” — Irin Carmon ([03:40])
- “Just having one person advocate for you and be a set of eyes in birth can make a difference between whether you suffer major physical trauma in addition to what might be involved in your birth.” — Irin Carmon ([21:44])
- “It is traumatic for them [partners] in its own way.” — Shamita Basu ([19:57])
- “It’s so much bigger than just one quote, unquote, bad doctor. It’s also a level of disinvestment that we’ve tolerated that surfaces at moments like this.” — Irin Carmon ([18:53])
Timestamps for Key Segments
- [00:36] – How mothers describe being treated in U.S. pregnancy care
- [01:18] – Central theme of dehumanization
- [01:50] – U.S. maternal mortality statistics
- [03:40] – Pregnancy as exposure to the medical system’s failures
- [05:28] – Racial disparities in care and outcomes
- [07:52] – Historical roots: J. Marion Sims and modern gynecology
- [10:09] – Maggie’s birth experience and near-fatal error
- [12:11] – Christine’s story of neglect and preventable death
- [16:51] – Systemic challenges to legal recourse and accountability
- [19:57] – Effects and burdens on partners and advocates
- [22:45] – Advice for prospective parents, hope for change
Tone and Closing Thoughts
The episode maintains a tone of urgent empathy, with frank discussions about systemic harms balanced by moments of inspiration and hope. Both Basu and Carmon share personal perspectives, connecting journalistic investigation with lived, deeply felt stories. The episode calls for recognition of shared vulnerability and the potential for real change.