Apple News Today – "The Unique Power of an American Pope"

April 25, 2026
Host: Sam Sanders (in for Shumita Basu)
Guest: Scott Detrow (NPR host, author of upcoming Pope Leo XIV biography)

Episode Overview

This episode explores the cultural, political, and spiritual ripples of having the first American pope, Leo XIV, nearly one year into his papacy. Sam Sanders and Scott Detrow discuss how Pope Leo's background shapes his approach to leadership, the complexities of Catholic politics in an election year, and the high-profile conflict between Pope Leo and President Trump over foreign policy and immigration. The conversation also digs into the resurgence of Catholicism in America and how church tradition and modernity are blending for a new generation.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Significance of an American Pope

• Unexpected Election:
  • "Growing up as a Catholic, you were told there was never going to be an American pope. The church would never want to give that level of power to an American because the country is already front and center." (Scott Detrow, 01:20)
  • Detrow recalls the shock and excitement of announcing a pope from Chicago live on NPR (01:45).

2. Pope Leo XIV’s First Year: Calm, then Conflict

• A Year Without Major Controversy... Until Now:
  • The Pope was seen as cautious and steady until his outspoken criticism of President Trump's war on Iran (02:46).
• Pope vs. President – The Iran Conflict:
  • Pope Leo’s public objection to attacks on Iranian civilian infrastructure:
    • "Attacks on civilian infrastructure is against international law, but that it is also a sign of the hatred, the division, the destruction the human being is capable of." (Sam Sanders, summarizing Pope Leo, 04:15)
  • Trump’s response was personal and combative:
    • "I'm not a big fan of Pope Leo. He's a very liberal person and he's a man that doesn't believe in stopping crime." (Donald Trump, 04:33)
  • Detrow notes that Trump’s usual approach to creating feuds hasn’t diminished the Pope’s standing:
    • "I think in a lot of ways it really backfired on Trump in a way that we haven't actually seen that much." (Scott Detrow, 04:41)

3. Pope Leo’s Unique Appeal and Style

• Deliberate, Cautious, Accessible:
  • Leo is methodical in public statements—even during informal press gaggles (05:47).
• Straddling Progressive and Conservative Ground:
  • He upholds tradition (ceremonies, vestments) important to conservatives, but also continues Francis’s social agenda on issues like immigration (06:19).
  • “He knows in ways that Pope Francis would just dismiss… that a lot of traditionalist Catholics care about the traditions, care about the ceremonies, care about the pomp and circumstance of the Mass. And Pope Leo does.” (Scott Detrow, 06:39)
• Relatability:
  • Pope Leo loves Peeps, plays Wordle with his brother, is on Duolingo and WhatsApp, lending a relatable, human side (08:11).

4. The Pope & Politics: Beyond Left and Right

• Not Easily Categorized:
  • Catholic doctrine overlaps with both left and right: pro-life/anti-abortion (aligns with Republicans), but also pro-immigrant and anti-death penalty (aligns with Democrats) (09:28–10:28).
  • "There are core Catholic beliefs that line up with the Republican Party... but also a core Christian belief is being kind to the immigrant, welcoming the stranger." (Detrow, 10:34)
• Immigration as a Central Issue:
  • Pope Leo has consistently opposed Trump’s harsh immigration policies and supported Catholic leaders who speak out and take action (11:28–12:10).

5. The Resurgence of Catholicism – New Converts and Traditions

• Conservative Draw:
  • Young conservatives are increasingly attracted to the Church’s traditions and stability amid global uncertainty (13:39–13:54).
• Tradition’s Return:
  • A renewed passion among converts for older practices (Latin Mass, veils, kneeling), echoing pre–Vatican II customs (15:45–16:55).
• Cradle vs. Convert Catholics:
  • While cultural Catholicism is distinct, converts are energized and intentional about their faith (17:14–18:13).

6. Catholic Power in the Trump Administration

• Prominent Catholics in Government:
  • J.D. Vance and Marco Rubio among several Catholic leaders; 2/3 of the Supreme Court also Catholic (18:42–18:48).
• Blending of Evangelical and Catholic Agendas:
  • Administration’s increasingly overt religious messaging, blurring church–state separation (19:30–20:15).
  • Evangelicals and conservative Catholics converge in policy focus, especially on war and social issues; Secretary of War Pete Hegseth cited for crusader-like religious rhetoric (20:48–21:26).

7. The "Catholic Vote" and Political Consequences

• Potential Shift:
  • Catholic voters often mirror the broader electorate, but discontent with Trump’s policies (especially on immigration and Iran) could shift votes away from the GOP (22:24–23:06).

8. Who "Owns" Christianity?

• Religious Conversation Broadening:
  • Detrow reflects on reclaiming Catholic and non-evangelical Christian voices in public life (23:42).
  • Pope Leo’s inclusive approach:
    • “It’s not just the priests who get to say what’s what… It’s everybody who comes to church. It’s everybody who believes in God.” (Detrow, 24:20)

9. Pope Leo’s Global Perspective and Ambitions

• Focus Beyond the U.S.:
  • Despite his American roots, Leo prioritizes the growing Church in Africa and Latin America and won’t attend America’s 250th anniversary celebrations (26:06).
  • “He’s a Midwesterner… but he is a Peruvian citizen as well… that is where the heart of the Church is right now.” (Detrow, 26:12)
• A Pope Who Understands American Politics:
  • Leo’s fluency in English, experience voting in U.S. elections, and grasp of the system signal a new era (26:44).

10. Looking Forward: The Pope and New Challenges

• What Does Pope Leo Want for the Church?
  • Detrow would ask about his long-term goals: “What specifically do you want the outcome of your Papacy to be? Cause I think he’s really intentional about that.” (Scott Detrow, 27:36)
• Upcoming Focus on Artificial Intelligence:
  • Pope Leo plans to issue a major encyclical on AI and morality, echoing Pope Leo XIII’s work during the Industrial Revolution (28:22–29:49).
  • “This is a tech literate Pope who wants to weigh on artificial intelligence.” (Detrow, 28:59)

11. Memorable Moment: Catholic School Flashback

• Lighthearted Close:
  • Sam Sanders: “I have one question for Pope Leo. Why did y’all change the Mass from saying ‘peace be with you’ and ‘also with you’? It’s so nice.”
  • Scott Detrow: “And with your spirit.” (30:08)
  • Sanders: “No, Pope, we gotta fix it.” (30:10)

Notable Quotes by Timestamp

• On the American Pope’s unexpected rise:
  • “I'm announcing that the pope is a guy from Chicago. And it was just like the most shocking, surprising, exciting feeling I'd ever had on the radio.” – Scott Detrow (01:45)
• On Pope Leo’s criticism of Trump and the war on Iran:
  • "This is not acceptable. You cannot do that. This is wrong." – (Paraphrased from Pope Leo, 04:09)
• On bridging Catholic traditions:
  • “He knows in ways that Pope Francis would just dismiss… that a lot of conservatives, a lot of traditionalist Catholics, care about the traditions, care about the ceremonies, care about, like, the pomp and circumstances of the Mass. And Pope Leo does.” – Scott Detrow (06:39)
• On the complexities of Church politics:
  • “It kind of depends what the politics of the moment are, whether it feels like the church is on one side or another side, even though it’s multifaceted.” – Scott Detrow (11:28)
• On the rise in Catholic converts:
  • "It just feels like a very uncertain moment. And I feel like a lot of people seem to be drawn to this institution in this moment that's been around for 2,000 years." – Scott Detrow (13:54)
• On the current religious climate in the White House:
  • "There's this kind of unapologetic, hardline conservative view of religion that is driving a lot of the Trump administration's policies right now." – Scott Detrow (21:26)
• On the Pope's inclusive vision:
  • "It's not just the priests who get to say what's what... It’s everybody who comes to church." – Scott Detrow (24:20)
• On Pope Leo’s focus:
  • "I think Pope Leo is looking at the world as a whole. He’s not obsessed with America... The fact that this American pope knows American politics, I think, is a new factor." – Scott Detrow (26:44)
• On upcoming papal priorities:
  • "This is a tech literate Pope who wants to weigh on artificial intelligence... That’s one of the reasons why he picked the name Leo, because Pope Leo XIII really issued key documents trying to frame the morality of the Industrial Revolution. And he wants to do the same." – Scott Detrow (28:59)

Timestamps for Major Segments

• [01:20] Rise of the first American pope
• [02:46] Pope Leo’s first year and Trump conflict
• [04:15] Pope Leo’s comments on the Iran war
• [06:39] Pope Leo’s approach to tradition and reform
• [09:28–10:28] Complexity of Catholic political stances
• [11:28] Catholic Church’s public opposition to immigration policy
• [13:54] Surge in Catholic converts and stability
• [15:45–16:55] Return to traditional practices among young Catholics
• [18:42–20:15] Catholics in government and overt faith-based policies
• [21:26] Evangelicals and crusader-oriented rhetoric in politics
• [23:42] Who "owns" Christianity—broadening the religious narrative
• [26:06] Pope Leo’s global vision; skipping U.S. anniversary
• [27:36] What is Pope Leo’s long-term plan?
• [28:59] Forthcoming encyclical on AI and morality
• [30:08] Memorable Catholic Mass phrase debate

Tone & Style

• Conversational, knowledgeable, and insightful, with moments of humor and relatability.
• Clear focus on accessible explanations, real-life anecdotes, and a generous blend of both personal and analytical perspectives.

This episode is a must-listen for anyone interested in the crossroads of faith and politics, the evolving identity of Catholicism in America, and the power and challenge of spiritual leadership in an age of global change.