Jennie Garth

Summary

Armchair Expert with Dax Shepard

Guest: Jennie Garth
Date: April 13, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode features actress and cultural icon Jennie Garth, best known for her role as Kelly Taylor on Beverly Hills, 90210. Dax, Monica, and Jennie explore her life journey, personal challenges, and growth, touching on themes of fame, self-worth, addiction, motherhood, and healing. They also dive into the seismic cultural impact of 90210 and discuss Jennie’s memoir, I Choose Me.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

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Jennie’s Early Life and Family Background

[03:17 – 10:00]

• Jennie grew up on a 25-acre farm in Illinois as the youngest of seven children in a blended Brady Bunch-style family. Her father was an educator and began adult education programs for illiterate adults in Illinois.
• Family moved to Arizona due to her father's heart condition and harsh Midwest winters.
• Jennie’s mother was a dedicated participant in multi-level marketing—driven, people-oriented, and always hustling to support the family during her father’s illness.
• Jennie experimented with dance and pageants as a teenager, leading to an encounter with her long-time manager, Randy James, at a pageant in Nevada.

"I was just the baby and the cute one and the one that everybody wanted to like, take and pick up and squeeze cheeks of."
— Jennie Garth, [15:28]

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Navigating Self-Worth and Early Career

[11:25 – 18:09]

• Dax and Monica probe how Jennie’s early "adored" status influenced her identity and relationships.
• She reflects on the complex feelings of validation through appearance versus other qualities and the desire to be recognized for more than looks.
• Acting wasn't an original ambition, but Jennie followed opportunities with commitment and work ethic, moving to L.A. at 16 with her mother’s support.
• Landed first acting gigs shortly after moving to L.A., including a memorable one-line part (“sticky, sticky, sticky”) on Growing Pains.

"Anytime I've ever seen an opportunity in my life, I go for it and do my best. I have a very strong work ethic."
— Jennie Garth, [15:50]

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Breakthrough: Beverly Hills, 90210

[20:11 – 30:00]

• Jennie met Jason Priestley on Teen Angel Returns before 90210. She discusses the grueling, isolating early years of filming and never having time to watch her own show.
• Dax contextualizes the massive cultural phenomenon of 90210: “You can’t imagine how big this show was unless you lived it.”
• Jennie and Monica reflect on adolescence spent under intense scrutiny and the onset of agoraphobia due to crowd hysteria at public appearances.

"I started to develop agoraphobia. Like, I never left my house."
— Jennie Garth, [38:07]

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Fame, Isolation, and Coping Mechanisms

[31:25 – 46:56]

• Jennie moved her parents to California to maintain stability, skipped out on much of the cast’s partying culture, and leaned on family during the whirlwind of fame.
• She shares the tension between seeking stability and the fear of being left out, the pain of public narrative (e.g., cast rivalries), and the impact on real relationships.
• The "girl against girl" narrative between her and Shannon Doherty’s characters was fueled by writers and media, affecting their real dynamic.
• Jennie discusses seeking love and security in early marriage, the patterns of giving excessively, and hard lessons about boundaries and personal value.

“There’s just this invisible string that connects us all.”
— Jennie Garth, [23:52]

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On Loss, Love, and Self-Discovery

[46:56 – 56:47]

• Jennie details her relationship with Luke Perry—her first real love—and the confusion, heartbreak, and eventual lifelong friendship that followed.
• Addresses cast departures, on-set challenges, and what she learned about herself and others as she matured.
• Describes difficulties in her marriages—seeking stability, conflating family love with romantic love, and the challenges of young parenthood.
• Finds purpose and grounding in motherhood: “Having kids saved my life.”

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Life After 90210: Transition, Anxiety, and Therapy

[56:47 – 78:55]

• End of 90210 brought unexpected uncertainty—financial and existential. Jennie experienced loss of structure, purpose, and battled anxiety.
• Began therapy and outpatient programs after divorces and personal lows, including a pivotal night mixing drinking and medication that landed her in the hospital.
• Jennie’s journey through shame, group therapy avoidance, public vulnerability, and slow rebuilding of self-worth.
• Buddhist classes and mindfulness became instrumental for her healing, helping her realize the universality of suffering and fostering connection with herself and others.

“The suffering’s coming from you trying to force a different reality than the one you’re in… That’s attachment.”
— Jennie Garth, [91:06]

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Healing, Growth, and New Love

[78:55 – 91:47]

• Opens up about scarcity mindset, loss of her father, fears of instability, and letting go.
• Discusses the challenge and reward of self-compassion and personal responsibility, influenced by experiences like Landmark and Buddhist teachings.
• Finds joy and laughter with her now-husband Dave, after years of work on herself and surviving another relationship crisis.
• Shares about learning to “mother” her inner child, no longer striving for a different reality but finding peace with what is.

“I started to become her best friend again. Like, I started to mother her like I did my own daughters.”
— Jennie Garth, [90:18]

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Reflections on Fame, Connection, and the Memoir

[92:24 – 93:44]

• Jennie’s memoir, I Choose Me, aims to help others feel seen and less alone, to offer substantive connection beyond the superficial adoration fame brought.
• Dax admires her vulnerability and journey: “For you to publicly put out your whole roadmap, I think is awesome and admirable.”

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Fact-Check/Light-Hearted Closing

[93:44 – 146:24]

• Monica and Dax share neighborly stories and riff on city versus rural community differences, bringing humor and relatability.
• A fact check covers pop culture references (e.g., Growing Pains, 90210 ratings, Gabrielle Carteris’s age on set) and recommendations for movies and podcasts.
• Casual banter about aging, vanity, and social awkwardness—mirroring the messy, human themes explored earlier.

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• On Validation & Identity:
  “You go to that like a heat-seeking missile, but at the same time, it repulses you.”
  — Jennie Garth, [14:26]

• On Watching 90210 for the First Time Years Later:
  “It was really moving because I had so much sympathy for that young girl… The nervousness, the insecurity, the fear—all the things.”
  — Jennie Garth, [22:13]

• On Coping with Show’s End:
  “We knew it on set… But then I had a baby and I was like, I gotta go milk my boobs in the trailer.”
  — Jennie Garth, [55:13]

• On Recovery:
  “I felt like if you want to be in my family, it has to be a team effort. We have to all work together to make this work in whatever capacity we’re able to.”
  — Jennie Garth, [43:16]

• On Inner Peace:
  “Once I started to do that, I just felt at peace and capable of taking care of her, me, us.”
  — Jennie Garth, [90:18]

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Important Timestamps

• Early Family & Pageant Years: [03:17 – 11:43]
• Forming Identity, Validation & Acting Beginnings: [13:15 – 16:17]
• Landing 90210 & Its Cultural Impact: [20:21 – 34:25]
• Fame, Anxiety, and Agoraphobia: [36:41 – 38:07]
• Cast Dynamics & Rivalry: [28:18 – 29:16, 49:06 – 52:05]
• Relationship with Luke Perry: [45:13 – 48:03]
• Marriage & Motherhood: [52:05 – 54:50]
• Addiction, Breakdown, and Treatment: [69:02 – 78:55]
• Buddhism, Healing & Personal Growth: [79:07 – 91:06]
• Reflections on Memoir & Enduring Connection: [92:24 – 93:14]

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Tone & Style

The conversation flows candidly, marked by Dax’s signature curiosity, Monica’s warmth, and Jennie’s self-deprecating humor and raw honesty. The vibe is intimate and reflective: no topic—be it fame, pain, or embarrassing moments—is left untouched.

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For Listeners Who Missed the Episode

This episode offers a nuanced portrait of Jennie Garth—not just as a 90s icon, but as a human being still finding her place in the world. With laughter, vulnerability, and wisdom, Jennie’s story will resonate with anyone who’s ever struggled with self-worth or navigated the aftermath of life’s tornadoes. Her honesty, coupled with Dax and Monica’s gentle probing, provides both nostalgia and practical insight into the journey of self-discovery and healing.

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Recommended: Listen to highlighted segments using the timestamps above for Jennie’s reflections on fame, anxiety, recovery, and finding peace.

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“We think we’re so uniquely terrible. It’s all an illusion—if you think you know someone who’s done it perfectly.” — Dax Shepard, [93:19]

Transcript

[Dax Shepard]

Welcome, welcome, welcome to Armchair Expert. I'm Dax Shepard. I'm joined by Monica Padman.

[Monica Padman]

Hi.

[Dax Shepard]

Today we have. Boy, we were just saying in the fact check if you would have told me in 95 this day was going to happen, I just wouldn't have believed you.

[Monica Padman]

Never believed it. Jenny Garth, Donna Martin graduates.

[Dax Shepard]

She's not Donna Martin, of course, but yes, we love Donna Martin graduates.

[Monica Padman]

Yes.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. Jenny Garth is an actor, a cultural icon and an Advocate. Beverly Hills 90210 and we'll get into it in the episode but if you're listening and you're under 30, you don't know how big this show is. You can't. There is no show as big as this show is currently to compare it to.

[Monica Padman]

It's wild.

[Dax Shepard]

Also 90210, what I like about yout, A Kind Hearted Christmas. And she has a memoir that we are going to talk about extensively called I Choose Me.

[Monica Padman]

She's got a life, man.

[Dax Shepard]

That's a line from an episode of Beverly Hills. Remember, there's a love triangle between her and Dylan and she chose her. Wow. Please enjoy Jenny Garth. Thank you to our presenting sponsor HP for supporting this episode. Their HP Smart Tank printer is the last printer you'll ever need. Oh, here we go. Monica with a refillable ink tank and up to three years of ink included. So you get thousands of pages of cartridge free printing. Hallelujah. To learn more, search for HP Smart Tank. We are supported by Quints. Your wardrobe should make getting dressed effortless. But building a thoughtful wardrobe can feel impossible, especially when quality outfits cost an arm and a leg. That's the beauty of quints. Their everyday essentials mix well from season to season and last. I've been building my collection with their pieces and it's transformed how I get dressed every day. Clothing that's rated between 4.5 and 5 stars by thousands of people. Polos, sweaters, pants and shorts made of purple. Premium materials like Mongolian cashmere and European linen without the luxury price tag.

[Monica Padman]

I have one of the beautiful cashmere sweaters. They're very soft and they're very stylish, chic and simple.

[Dax Shepard]

Simple? Yes. Mine looks classic. You know, almost like I'm Steve McQueen or something.

[Monica Padman]

That's what you want.

[Dax Shepard]

Quince only partners with factories that meet rigorous standards for craftsmanship and ethical production. These pieces are built for daily wear, the kind of clothing that becomes part of your routine because it's reliable. Right now go to quints.com/ for free shipping and 365 day returns. That's a full year to build your wardrobe and love it. And you will now available in Canada too. Don't keep settling for clothes that don't last. Go to q-u I n c e.com dax for free shipping and 365 day returns. Quints.com dax. You were going to bring Monica something.

[Jenny Garth]

Well. And you.

[Dax Shepard]

It's all right if it's Monica.

[Monica Padman]

Oh, I do love Mer.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, you're a slave to Mer.

[Jenny Garth]

I really am.

[Monica Padman]

I really am.

[Dax Shepard]

Where were you coming from?

[Jenny Garth]

Pasadena.

[Dax Shepard]

Is that where you live?

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

I like Pasadena. Have you gotten interested in the history of Pasadena since moving there?

[Jenny Garth]

There are so many historical, amazing estates, buildings.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

In Houston, it's historical.

[Jenny Garth]

Oh, yeah. I've never been there. You haven't?

[Dax Shepard]

What is wrong with you? Why are you boycotting Houston?

[Jenny Garth]

I don't eat meat.

[Monica Padman]

It's okay. Well.

[Jenny Garth]

But my husband really wants to go there, so I think maybe we gotta go. No.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Jenny Garth]

It's okay.

[Monica Padman]

They have great salads. They have.

[Dax Shepard]

I was just thinking, the sushi's great.

[Jenny Garth]

Dip.

[Dax Shepard]

You wouldn't think it, but the sushi's outrageous.

[Monica Padman]

It's so good at Houston's. Yeah. You'll be sure.

[Dax Shepard]

All right. You're giggling. It's counterintuitive.

[Jenny Garth]

I mean, I don't eat sushi either, but I'm sure you find something.

[Monica Padman]

You're going to find something. Going to love it. How strict are you on your vegetarianism? Because I go with two of my friends and one of them is a vegetarian. We would always get the spinach artichoke dip. She could have that, and it's the best thing on the planet. And then one day she came and she said, I think there's chicken stock in this. And then she asked and there was, and now she can't eat it doesn't have stock.

[Jenny Garth]

It really stinks. When you find foods that you love so much, you're like, wait, this has some hidden dairy in it.

[Dax Shepard]

So stock we don't mess with.

[Monica Padman]

Draw the line.

[Jenny Garth]

I don't eat hardly anything. You guys, you know, you're done.

[Dax Shepard]

You're post eating.

[Jenny Garth]

I'm done with it. Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Like, I'm over it from it.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

Too much work, a lot of energy.

[Jenny Garth]

I've never been a foodie, so that's helpful.

[Dax Shepard]

Are you vegetarian or vegan?

[Monica Padman]

Vegan.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, my God. All the way. For how long?

[Jenny Garth]

If you're going to do something, do it.

[Dax Shepard]

How long have you been doing it?

[Jenny Garth]

On and off for years and years. But I went off of it when I had kids, so I was eating for them. Eating chicken and stuff.

[Dax Shepard]

That was Kristen's first meat. She was pregnant and she called me. I was at a restaurant and she said, order me the bison meatloaf sandwich. I was like, you haven't eaten meat in 32 years. She goes, delta wants a bison meatloaf sandwich.

[Jenny Garth]

You gotta give them what they want.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, yeah.

[Jenny Garth]

I wanted Chicken McNuggets.

[Dax Shepard]

Out of health or concern for animals?

[Jenny Garth]

Both. I grew up on a farm in Illinois where my dad would kill our pigs for the dinner table. I just never loved that. But I ate pork chops because I was told to. And then I just got to the place where I'm like, nobody's telling me what to eat anymore. So when I was away from the home, I would eat Lucky Charms and Taco Bell constantly. Because then I was just like, woohoo. Freedom from my mom who only let us eat healthy things. Now just as an adult, I feel like at this phase in my life, I just want to take the best possible care I can of myself. I'm so scared of dying. So when you have sudden loss around you, unexpected, out of nowhere loss, it just happened again this last week, you really go, whoa, okay, priorities. I want to take the best care of myself I can. And I love it. I love feel clean and healthy and waking up clear.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. Okay. Back to Illinois. Yeah. You were on like a 25 acre farm. You're the youngest of seven.

[Jenny Garth]

Yes.

[Dax Shepard]

But you're the only child of your dad and your mom. Yeah.

[Jenny Garth]

Yes, very Brady Bunch. And then I was like Oliver.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, you were Oliver. Okay.

[Jenny Garth]

He wasn't even theirs, but yeah, I was the only one by both my parents. So I was the baby.

[Dax Shepard]

What was the relationship with the siblings?

[Jenny Garth]

They loved their new dad so much, My father. And they were very happy. They were excited to have a little baby.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay, good.

[Jenny Garth]

I was everybody's little baby.

[Dax Shepard]

The oldest one was what, 20 some years older than you or something?

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

And dad didn't have custody of those six kids or did he?

[Jenny Garth]

He had his own children. He had two sons and a daughter and he ended up adopting my mom's kids.

[Dax Shepard]

I got it. So your mom had kids as well? It was a true Brady Bunch.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah. She had three girls and he had two sons and a girl. Oh, wow.

[Dax Shepard]

So you had a mix of steps. No, they're all half, but two different sets. Well, this is some permutation you guys move when you're 13 or something to Arizona, to Glendale. What prompted that move?

[Jenny Garth]

The weather in Illinois. Is really harsh, very hard winters. And my father had developed heart disease, cardiovascular disease. So they determined that that was too hard on his heart, the cold weather. And he liked to work outside, and it was just too much for him.

[Dax Shepard]

What do you do for a living?

[Jenny Garth]

He was an educator. Both my parents were teachers. He taught adult education. He actually started adult education in the state of illinois in the 70s. And he loved what he did. He loved teaching adults who had never had the opportunity or the privilege of learning how to read.

[Dax Shepard]

These people like getting their ged, Is that what that is?

[Jenny Garth]

They're people that just want to learn how to read.

[Monica Padman]

Okay.

[Dax Shepard]

Wow. Not even any necessary goal in mind?

[Jenny Garth]

No, I just think to have a better life.

[Dax Shepard]

So when you guys move to Arizona, did they both get jobs as teachers in Arizona?

[Jenny Garth]

No, my mom had done Shackley. Have you ever heard of that?

[Dax Shepard]

It's very long vitamins.

[Monica Padman]

Yes.

[Jenny Garth]

Yes.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, yeah. It's a multi level marketing.

[Jenny Garth]

Yes.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Jenny Garth]

She got so good at it that she ended up getting a pink Cadillac from the company.

[Monica Padman]

Well, they also rarely do.

[Jenny Garth]

Isn't that weird?

[Dax Shepard]

They were like, it works at Mary Kay.

[Jenny Garth]

Don't need to reinvent that. Oh, my gosh. But she left that and then she started another MLM in Arizona. I don't remember what that one was.

[Monica Padman]

So is your garage just filled with items? That's what we learn about people in MLMs. Their garage is just like, filled with the vitamins or the drink.

[Dax Shepard]

The stock.

[Jenny Garth]

My mom had a whole stock room. I loved to organize things from a very young age. So I would go in there and organize all the vitamins and the packets and the soup packets and the shake packets.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, Those vitamins have a distinct smell.

[Jenny Garth]

Jackly.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. Someone, of course, got my parents in their target. We own Shaq. I don't think anyone ever took them. But when I would just open the cabinet where the Shackleys were, it's like I was hit with this mineral smell. Distinct, fragrant.

[Jenny Garth]

Especially the soup.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, so was it Shackley making the soup as well?

[Jenny Garth]

Yes. Powdered soup. I actually liked it.

[Monica Padman]

You did?

[Dax Shepard]

It was good.

[Jenny Garth]

What flavor? Like, it was like cream of chicken or something.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, wow.

[Monica Padman]

Powder.

[Dax Shepard]

I don't think that's an intuitive extension of products. They could make vitamins and go to soup. Maybe a shampoo and conditioner that had vitamins in it.

[Monica Padman]

Well, maybe the soup had the vitamins crushed up.

[Jenny Garth]

Maybe. It had to have been good for you. Yeah, it had to.

[Dax Shepard]

And was she making money? Because we've had an MLM expert on and the percentage of people who actually make money is very, very, very small. But was she crushing? Was she making a lot of money?

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah, she was making enough money. I don't think a lot of money was ever made. But she loved doing it. It made her feel alive. And she's really great with people. So she loved it.

[Dax Shepard]

When you move to Arizona, he's not taking a teaching job there. She's the primary and only breadwinner at that point.

[Jenny Garth]

At that point, yes. Because he had had a massive heart attack. Which prompted us to leave Illinois. So for a while she was taking care of supporting him and me. The other girls were already out of the house. She's a hustler, so she did what she had to do for sure.

[Dax Shepard]

When do you start dancing and entering pageants?

[Jenny Garth]

That must have been my eighth grade or my freshman year. There was like a little dance studio on our corner. Well, we forgot about this. Okay. My mom and dad got separated. I never really understood it. Cause I was so mad about it. But he moved up to Prescott, Arizona.

[Dax Shepard]

I don't like how they pronounce that.

[Jenny Garth]

Just Prescott. Prescott.

[Dax Shepard]

Prescott. They say Prescott, but it's spelled Prescott. But they say Prescott.

[Jenny Garth]

Prescott like it's a biscuit. No, I didn't ever like it either.

[Dax Shepard]

But he went up to Prescott.

[Jenny Garth]

He went up to Prescott, had his little farm up there and was living a quiet life. He didn't.

[Dax Shepard]

You don't have any sense of what prompted that.

[Jenny Garth]

I really stayed out of their relationship. And I had a room upstairs. I try to stay away from it. I don't like to get into other people's business unnecessarily.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Monica Padman]

Were they fighting?

[Jenny Garth]

I never really saw them fight. No.

[Dax Shepard]

I am so curious. Something can't be going on and I don't know what it is. Like I have to know what's going on. And if dad left, I'd say to mom, like, what just happened?

[Jenny Garth]

I think I was a teenager. Like I was pretty self absorbed in my own world, in my own head a lot.

[Monica Padman]

Maybe it's a self protective mechanism too. Because if you find out, maybe the answer is something you really don't want to know. And maybe you knew that on some level. Like, I don't really want to know.

[Jenny Garth]

I think so. And I was upset at my mom. But then I would go spend time with my dad up in Prescott and I'd be so bored.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

So this makes a little more sense. Because when I learned that you and mom moved to LA at 16. Something precedes that. You're At a pageant and you meet a manager and this again and you say it in the book. By most accounts this is a dicey scenario. Right. So explain what happens at the pageant.

[Jenny Garth]

I was like 15 and I was in a pageant like a one time deal. I thought it was for a dance scholarship so I could go to college and become a dance teacher or dancer. Turns out it wasn't that good. But I did dance as my talent in that show and it was in like Laughlin, Nevada or something. He was one of the judges. Somebody had called in a favor to him and said, can you come be a judge for me? I can't do it. He lived in New York City. He was the head of casting. So he said to his wife, yeah, let's go do it for my friend and we'll have a trip out of it. So he had brought his wife, which made it a little less weird. Yeah, but he did come up to us.

[Dax Shepard]

Scott, what's his name?

[Jenny Garth]

His name's Randy.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, Randy.

[Jenny Garth]

Randy James. And we call him Mr. Showbiz, but he's a legend. I've been with him ever since, since I was 15 years.

[Dax Shepard]

That's crazy. And he says, I think you could be in showbiz. But this is a middle aged man saying to a 15 year old girl in a pageant, I think you'd be in showbiz. Like alarm bells are normally going off for sure.

[Jenny Garth]

My mom was right there with me and his wife was right there with it. It was actually her. Kelly's idea for him to approach me because he was in casting. Like he was always looking for the next thing.

[Dax Shepard]

I have a question. If you're the baby of the family and you're blonde and cute and then you go into pageants, do you start sensing your value is your cuteness and what does that do? Have you explored that to be the object of such affection in that way and to be kind of getting told your values, this cuteness, how does that set your own self esteem and identity?

[Jenny Garth]

It does affect it for sure. Once I moved to Hollywood and started becoming a success so young, that's when I really started to recognize it and have a lot of thoughts in my head about it.

[Dax Shepard]

I think every kid should get adored. And I also think you can be too adored. I think it can be dangerous to get too adored.

[Jenny Garth]

It is. I don't like being adored.

[Dax Shepard]

And also I can imagine like once the family adoration stops, it's like there's this big hole that you've only been formatted for that you now need that.

[Jenny Garth]

Right. I needed to go seek it from boys. I wanted to get it from girls. That never really worked out in junior high and high school. So I was just isolated and would really just try to get it from the boys. I had a boyfriend.

[Dax Shepard]

What grade? Right out of the gates.

[Jenny Garth]

Freshman year. He was a senior.

[Dax Shepard]

No. In middle school. Junior high.

[Jenny Garth]

No. Well, I did kiss Ray Padilla.

[Dax Shepard]

Congratulations, Ray.

[Monica Padman]

Good for Ray.

[Dax Shepard]

Was he your age or was he older?

[Jenny Garth]

He was older. Much older.

[Dax Shepard]

28.

[Monica Padman]

That was Randy's age.

[Jenny Garth]

He was already in high school. He was hot.

[Monica Padman]

That's fun. But then, yeah, you're in a loop of getting validation. You know, that's where you can get a quick hit.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah. You start to seek that, I guess. Of course, as much as you hate it, it's this weird dichotomy because that's what you think your worth is like. You go to that like a heat seeking missile, but at the same time it repulses you.

[Dax Shepard]

You want to be appreciated and adored for other qualities, but that's not what's being offered.

[Monica Padman]

We all want what we don't.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, we want what we don't have.

[Jenny Garth]

Grass is always green.

[Dax Shepard]

But I, the thing that was rewarded to me, I'm a little bit more in control of it. Right. Like I can generate comedy.

[Jenny Garth]

Funny.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. And comedy doesn't have a shelf. Although it does a little bit in general. I can pursue that. So it's interesting. The thing I wanted. I guess I'm probably more grateful that the only thing I got really applauded for was being clever.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah, I would have rather be applauded for being clever.

[Dax Shepard]

I wish I was just hot.

[Monica Padman]

Same.

[Jenny Garth]

I didn't know what I was other than that I did okay in school. So I wasn't like the smart one, but I was just the baby and the cute one and the one that everybody wanted to like take and pick

[Dax Shepard]

up and squeeze cheeks of.

[Jenny Garth]

Right. You know when you're trying to figure out who you are as a young teen, that starts to really happen. I think. I didn't get a sense of who I was outside of that.

[Dax Shepard]

But then this career path presents itself, which is perfect. You've kind of been hand built for you to be good at this thing. So he says this, you could have a future to your credit. You take it serious, you start taking acting classes.

[Jenny Garth]

I don't know why. I had never wanted to be an actress. I never thought, oh, I wanna be famous. I didn't play in theater at all. I didn't know anything about it. But I guess I just saw it as an opportunity. And anytime I've ever seen an opportunity in my life, I go for it and do my best. I have a very strong work ethic from my parents and growing up on a farm like that, so I just really throw myself into something. And my mom was supportive and said, oh, that could be interesting and fun. Let's do it. And she moved out here with me.

[Dax Shepard]

That explained. The separation's not in the book. And I'm like, how did dad handle that? Mom's moving to el.

[Jenny Garth]

They did a lot of back and forth. They were separated, but then he was unwell again, so she moved back to be with him and take care of him.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay, so you get to la. Is it exciting or terrifying?

[Jenny Garth]

I didn't know enough to be terrified, honestly. I'm from a farm in Illinois and I lived in Phoenix for a couple years, but I didn't know what I was getting into on any level. I had posters of Madonna in my bedroom when I was little and Michael Jackson and Mary Lou Retton.

[Dax Shepard]

She was the queen.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Remember her McDonald's commercial? She was in a Corvette. Yes. Yeah.

[Jenny Garth]

I didn't really know about fame or acting or the whole world of an actress or an actor. I just jumped in and pretty quickly.

[Dax Shepard]

You were on Growing Pains before you were 18, right? I mean, that was the show.

[Jenny Garth]

I think that was my first or second job.

[Dax Shepard]

Did you interface with Kirk Cameron?

[Jenny Garth]

I did, in a very odd way. I was a girl in a car next to him and his car and with his buddies. I had one line in the whole show. Well, it was actually three words. Sticky, sticky, sticky. No idea why that was my line.

[Monica Padman]

Okay.

[Dax Shepard]

Also, what a blessing. As far as the first line. You gotta memorize just the same one word. You gotta memorize one word and hopefully you remember it three times. Is it four times or two times? It's three times we told.

[Monica Padman]

Oh, my God.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah, so that was my first. And then I did a Barbara Eden show where I played her daughter, which I was beside myself with excitement because she was Jeannie, you know?

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, yeah.

[Jenny Garth]

I grew up watching her on I Dream of Jeannie.

[Dax Shepard]

Also, I would imagine you're drawn to, like, matriarchs. Your mom's a breadwinner. Then you meet this woman. She's the star of her own show. She's had this other success. I'd imagine it's appealing to see women being self sufficient.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah. I was so inspired by my mom and her. They made life happen.

[Dax Shepard]

Back to Kirk Cameron. There wasn't A girl in America that didn't think he was cute. Am I right?

[Jenny Garth]

I don't think so. I wasn't even a fan of the show.

[Dax Shepard]

They were ruled dead. The ones that didn't find him to be cute.

[Jenny Garth]

I wasn't like big Kirk Cameron fan or anything.

[Dax Shepard]

Well, you aren't.

[Monica Padman]

No.

[Jenny Garth]

I watched the Brady Bunch, I Dream of Sydney, Gilligan's Island, Green Acres. Green Acres. Beverly Hillbillies.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. Great programming.

[Jenny Garth]

Oh, my gosh.

[Dax Shepard]

Also, I have no clue when those originally aired, because when we were watching them, they were reruns in the daytime when you stayed home from school. I didn't know if they came from the 30s or the 60s or the 40s.

[Jenny Garth]

No idea.

[Dax Shepard]

Still don't know when it probably should look like Beverly Hillbillies. It was in black and white until it wasn't. When the fuck was that show made? Because I was watching it in 82.

[Jenny Garth]

It had to be in the 70s. I think the Brady Bunch was probably

[Dax Shepard]

70s, at least stylistically, it's a giveaway. Full 70s, orange everything. Shag carpet, the haircuts, the fucking bell bottoms. Yeah, but these other. Like a farm show, you can't set it with the style. The Beverly Hillbillies, everyone's dressed in tuxedos or silly hillbilly clothes. Yeah. Grapes of Wrath clothes, like Bewitched.

[Monica Padman]

That was probably the 50s, right?

[Dax Shepard]

I think 60s Darren looked very 60s mod, didn't he?

[Monica Padman]

He did.

[Jenny Garth]

Very mod. What's that show nowadays?

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, Mad Men.

[Jenny Garth]

Mad Men. Oh, yeah, yeah. Thank you.

[Dax Shepard]

Also, weirdly, you did a show that Jason Priestley was on before 90210.

[Jenny Garth]

Yes, yes.

[Dax Shepard]

What was that?

[Jenny Garth]

We met on a set called Teen Angel Returns.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, say it again.

[Jenny Garth]

Teen Angel Returns. He was a Teen Angel.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, he was.

[Jenny Garth]

Who would come down and help people?

[Dax Shepard]

Sure.

[Jenny Garth]

Usually girls.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, he's really beautiful.

[Jenny Garth]

There was apparently a Teen angel one. This was his teenager turns.

[Monica Padman]

Okay.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah. So I met him on that, and we instantly fell into this great rhythm of brother, sister energy.

[Dax Shepard]

He's older than you. Or a similar age.

[Jenny Garth]

He's a little older.

[Dax Shepard]

He was a little more seasoned. Yeah, yeah.

[Jenny Garth]

I mean, star of the movie. He was a Disney movie, for God's sakes. But he was just cool. He was just so nice. He's the nicest guy on Earth.

[Dax Shepard]

Well, now, here's where I want to back up the book. Weirdly is an outgrowth of a podcast, which is weirdly outgrowth of rewatching 90210.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Explain why you didn't watch it originally.

[Jenny Garth]

Well, first of all, we were always working 16, 18 hour days. You go home, you sleep, you get up at five and you come right back. Everyone was pretty much there every day.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. I imagine they weren't being helpful. Like if they bring in all day

[Jenny Garth]

long and we had no say in anything. So we just sit around and wait in our little dressing rooms or our little honey wagons. And I think they wanted us together all the time, which probably really helped. The energy between us.

[Dax Shepard]

Helped and hurt, I think, as we'll find out.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

A little bit of both.

[Jenny Garth]

A little bit of both. So I never watched it.

[Dax Shepard]

You didn't?

[Jenny Garth]

I would see dailies sometimes. That would be plenty for me. Like, I've never been one to love sitting down until recently, but I would just get too in my head, feel too insecure.

[Dax Shepard]

Broad jokes.

[Jenny Garth]

Yes. Feel like who? I don't know her. What is that?

[Dax Shepard]

What am I doing? Am I making any choices? So you sat down to watch it because you were gonna do a podcast. A rewatch podcast. My first curiosity is like, we all have this real in our head of what things look like and felt like from our past. And it's very, very unique to be able to, like, if I could go back and watch myself at 18, I guarantee it wouldn't match that well with what my memory has corrupted it to be now. Were you having any kind of disjointed, like, oh, my God, this is not.

[Jenny Garth]

Well, it's weird because I. Yeah, I was going back and looking at my younger self, but that wasn't me. That was a character in a world that was, you know, it's weird to watch. Yes. That's me playing that character as a young girl. But also that girl had no idea who she was. It's hard for me to really identify. But when I did go back to watch the very first episode, it was really moving because I had so much sympathy for that young girl because I could see past the character, past the scene, to the core of the person you were seeing.

[Dax Shepard]

The nervousness.

[Jenny Garth]

The nervousness, the insecurity, the fear, just all the things.

[Dax Shepard]

How about even physically, were you like, oh, I look different than I thought I looked at that time?

[Jenny Garth]

I don't think so. I had definitely a better appreciation for those years of hotness. I was like, wow, look at her go.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Like, here's my example. I was always like, I gotta get in better shape. Right. This is constantly. And then I'll see pictures of myself at like 19. I'm like, you were in great body. You look like an Athletic.

[Jenny Garth]

I know. I always worry about, oh, is my butt too big? Or what's it? My body's not right.

[Monica Padman]

You can look back and say, like, what a waste of energy that was, but I don't think you can escape it.

[Dax Shepard]

And I wasted that.

[Monica Padman]

You have to feel that, like, even worse.

[Dax Shepard]

You're like, I should have been enjoying that.

[Jenny Garth]

Strutting around in a banana hammer.

[Dax Shepard]

I should have worn more Speedos. Absolutely. What were those? Board shorts? Similarly, I watched Parenthood with my kids. I hadn't seen it in probably eight years or something or nine years. And when I watched it and they laughed the entire way through, I just cried the whole time. I just remember how much I loved Peter and May and all these people and Craig T. Nelson. I was just like, oh, my God. I got to spend, like, the most precious time with these people. And I just was overwhelmed with what a sweet thing that was. And I just was so emotional for, like, the first three episodes. I couldn't get over. Were you having any of those swelly feelings?

[Jenny Garth]

Definitely. Because what a great group of people. And we all took for granted that we got to live that life together. And also, there's just this invisible string that connects us all.

[Dax Shepard]

And two of the cast members have

[Jenny Garth]

passed at that point. One of them had passed.

[Dax Shepard]

I believe Shannon had.

[Jenny Garth]

No, not yet.

[Dax Shepard]

Luke had. Okay, so. Yeah. When you're seeing him, is it heartbreaking?

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah, it was definitely very hard to watch. I couldn't really watch. But then I started to get really sucked in to the storyline.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, the plot was.

[Jenny Garth]

And then all I wanted to see was Dylan.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. I want to see. Woo more girls.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Jenny Garth]

So good at it. I remember they wouldn't see me for it. I didn't have that much resume, you

[Dax Shepard]

know, Angel Returns wasn't out yet.

[Jenny Garth]

Enough Wasn't enough. Apparently Growing Pains didn't get me in there.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. What was your three words? Sticky, sticky, sticky, sticky, sticky. What if you sent that tape?

[Jenny Garth]

I forgot.

[Monica Padman]

I know. You would not have booked it.

[Dax Shepard]

What if you sent that tape, though, and they put it in? Sticky, sticky, sticky. And that was the end. The real. I don't care. I don't care. She's on the other side of the planet. Let's get her.

[Jenny Garth]

No, but Mr. Showbiz Randy, my manager, was friends with Tony. I can't remember his last name, but he was the head of spelling casting, so they were friends, you know, in business. And he called Tony and said, I heard you. You don't want to see her, but please. He was like, do this for me as a friend. So I went in to see him in his office. And then from his office, we went into Mr. Spelling's office.

[Dax Shepard]

Wow.

[Jenny Garth]

Where there were like, I don't know, it felt like 50 men, but it was probably 10, maybe eight. Probably.

[Dax Shepard]

And did you audition in front of

[Jenny Garth]

him and all those people? Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

How nerve wracking was that?

[Jenny Garth]

Extremely. Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. How do you suppose you did well enough. That seems overwhelming at that stage.

[Jenny Garth]

I don't know. I was just so distracted. There was like bowls of cigarettes out.

[Monica Padman]

This is so old school.

[Jenny Garth]

Yes. And then him and his pipe and them all just like staring and I don't know, I just went into some sort of beast mode and did my scene.

[Dax Shepard]

I wonder if you disassociated a bit.

[Jenny Garth]

Oh, yeah. I like to do a lot.

[Monica Padman]

It can be helpful.

[Jenny Garth]

Yes. But I remember leaving that building with Randy. We were walking back to our car and I heard someone say, hey, Jenny. And I turned around and it was Aaron hanging out the window. He went like that, like thumbs up. Aw.

[Dax Shepard]

Thank God he didn't fall out the window.

[Monica Padman]

I know.

[Jenny Garth]

It was like a big opening too. And he's a tiny man.

[Dax Shepard]

And this is back in the day, obviously. You went and did a pilot and then you got to wait to see if it gets picked up. It sounds like you're very naive. Did you have a sense of what was coming? Did you even consider, like, what were the goals at the time? Like, oh, I hope they order 13 so I get paychecks.

[Jenny Garth]

I had no understanding of the workings of the business.

[Dax Shepard]

They explained this is a pilot.

[Jenny Garth]

And then now we'll wait and see. Okay, cool.

[Dax Shepard]

Was it fun making the pilot? Like, what are your memories of that?

[Jenny Garth]

Really fun. Because I just stepped into a whole new world of people my age. We were all there creating something together, which I had never really experienced, and all doing our parts individually. And it was just really cool, really inspiring. Like, I thought, this is a nice world to be a part of.

[Dax Shepard]

And there were varying levels of experience between all of you. You say in the book Jason Priestley was pretty immediately like the patriarch.

[Jenny Garth]

He came from Sister Kate, which was a big show back then. And Shannon had worked on Heather's. She was on Little House on the Prairie, for God's sake. So she had a lot of experience.

[Dax Shepard]

But had you seen Heather's? I was obsessed with Heather's.

[Jenny Garth]

I had not seen Heather's.

[Dax Shepard]

You were on Brady Bunch still.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, I didn't.

[Jenny Garth]

I wasn't supposed to swearing and Heather,

[Monica Padman]

but that's probably Helpful because I think that would allow for more fraudulent feelings. If you've been like keeping up and you've seen Heather's and you know what's going on, I think you could show up and be like, I don't belong here.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

But it's also a lot to ask a lot of 17, 18 year old, 19 year old, 20 year olds to wield their experience ethically. So like, if I were Shannon, I might think I'm too good for this. Do people come with attitudes?

[Jenny Garth]

The people that had experience definitely felt as if they knew what they were doing a lot more. I did feel green. I felt lucky to be there. I did feel probably less than or inferior to some of the people on the cast just innately.

[Dax Shepard]

But you were good at learning how to be the baby of a scenario. Like, were you able to own that and let them take care of you?

[Jenny Garth]

Um, I don't feel like there was a lot of taking care of. It was kind of like man for himself. It was dog eat dog.

[Dax Shepard]

Uh huh.

[Monica Padman]

That's what I was curious about. The dynamics between all the people.

[Dax Shepard]

It's a lot of attention to share when you're that age.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

And it's ensemble.

[Monica Padman]

So many eyes on that show and people's favorites and so much going on.

[Jenny Garth]

It got really difficult as the show went on. After the first season. They started really sort of taking my character and Shannon's character and pitting them against one another in storyline and then that would in turn turn the media and in turn turn the audience. And so that's when the whole girl against girl really became apparent that that's what we're doing here.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. They honed the sword on that. And then when Desperate Housewives came along, they were like, we know how to do this.

[Jenny Garth]

Make them all fight all the time.

[Dax Shepard]

Sometimes though, even though it's not based in anything, once it takes on a life of its own, it can start impacting the real dynamic between you two. No.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah. Unfortunately we were young. I didn't know how to deal with that and I thought it was real and I'm emoting and then the camera cuts and it's a little odd because we just had a fight or some sor. Really ugly words to one another. There was no Internet then. It would have been a lot worse.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, can you imagine?

[Jenny Garth]

But it was so supported by the continued writing and then the fans because they used to send us out a lot. They used to send me out. I don't know if Shannon did a lot, but I would go out the Guys would go out a lot and do signings. Car shows. Remember the days when they would send you to a car show to sign autographs?

[Dax Shepard]

Sure, sure.

[Jenny Garth]

I was stoked because I got a free car out of one of those.

[Dax Shepard]

You did?

[Jenny Garth]

I did.

[Dax Shepard]

What did you get?

[Jenny Garth]

Oh, my God. It was a gorgeous, sparkly, emerald green Corvette. Oh, wow.

[Dax Shepard]

No, you didn't.

[Monica Padman]

Oh, my God.

[Dax Shepard]

They gave you a Corvette.

[Jenny Garth]

Yes.

[Dax Shepard]

I know that color. That green. This would have been like a 92 Corvette or something. Mm. Stay tuned for more armchair expert if you dare. We are supported by hp. My mental to do list is already full. Fix something around the house, refill prescriptions, remember to text someone back, keep track of a million little life things. The last thing I want on that list is. Oh, don't forget printer ink.

[Monica Padman]

No, it's horrible.

[Dax Shepard]

It's the bane of everyone's existence. What if you could just take that off your list for years?

[Monica Padman]

The dream.

[Dax Shepard]

That's the idea behind the HP Smart tank printer from America's most trusted printer brand. Instead of those tiny cartridges that always seem to run out at the worst time, the HP Smart Tank uses a refillable ink tank. And it comes with up to three years of ink included. It's built to be simple, the easiest tank printer you'll ever use with the best print quality, period. It's the last printer you'll ever need. I've definitely been in this situation where something that should take two minutes turns into a whole thing. Like I need to print tickets and get out the door. But then I realize I'm out of ink and have to deal with it right then. With the HP Smart Tank, that's just not something you're dealing with all the time. It's one of those things that just works when you need it to. If you want to take one more thing off your mental to do list, search for HP Smart tank. We are supported by Allstate. Checking Allstate first could save you hundreds on car insurance. That's smart. Not checking your phone's battery before heading out. That'll get you every time. Of course, your phone dies on the way to meet someone, leaving you wandering around quietly panicking about being in the wrong spot. Yeah, checking first is smart. So check all state first for a quote that could save you hundreds. You're in good hands with Allstate. Potential savings vary subject to terms, conditions, and availability. Allstate North America Insurance Company Affiliates, Northbrook, Illinois. We are supported by the HBO original show Euphoria. Oh, am I happy that this is back if you thought HBO's euphoria was intense in high school, saddle Up Starring Zendaya, Sydney Sweeney and Jacob Elordi Season three of Euphoria Pixar up five years later and life looks very different now. These characters are on their own with the freedom to make choices that can build them or break them. No matter what they're chasing money, fame, power, love or redemption, no one can escape their fate. Don't miss the third season of Euphoria, starring two time Emmy winner Zendaya. Premiering April 12th on HBO and HBO Max with new episodes every Sunday. This podcast is brought to you by Squarespace, the all in one website platform designed to help you stay, stand out and succeed online. From websites and online stores to marketing tools and analytics, Squarespace gives you everything you need to build and grow your presence in one place. When we first got the Armchair Expert website up and running, Wabi Wob used Squarespace and honestly, it made sense right away. It looked polished, it was easy to navigate, and it didn't feel like we had to become web designers just to make something good. What I like about Squarespace is that it gives you a lot of flexibility without making things complicated. You can start with one of their beautiful templates and customize it so it actually feels like you whether you're building a portfolio, a business, or just finally making the thing you've been meaning to make. And once it's live, Squarespace also has built in analytics, which is great because you can actually see what people are engaging with instead of just guessing. So head to squarespace.comdax for a free trial and when you're ready to Launch, use code DAX to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain. I want to attempt to explain the size of Beverly Hills 90210. I was saying to my kids, they often ask me who I'm interviewing, or maybe they heard me say to my wife, I was interviewing you. My wife goes like, oh, 90210. You guys was so big you can't imagine K pop then plus some. So I looked up all the numbers and to put it in reference, you guys maintained an 11 share for most of the 10 years, right? So currently the NFL, which is the biggest show on television by a factor of five, gets like a two eight two, a three two. Grey's Anatomy gets a 0.4.

[Jenny Garth]

That's wild.

[Dax Shepard]

Yes, you guys got an 11. You had 20 million viewers a week for like five of the 10 years. There's no real comp in modern television.

[Jenny Garth]

No it doesn't work that way anymore.

[Dax Shepard]

So it's like, when you're listening, you kind of gotta imagine, you know, it's in the Taylor Swift era. It's like a cultural phenomena that also

[Monica Padman]

lasted way beyond it. So, like, I watched it.

[Jenny Garth]

You watched it? How old were you? Were you not supposed to be watching it?

[Dax Shepard]

Came out when she was three.

[Monica Padman]

I watched reruns.

[Jenny Garth]

Okay.

[Monica Padman]

So that's what I mean. Like, it still held its value. My generation watched it.

[Jenny Garth]

Cause your mom probably watched it.

[Monica Padman]

Maybe.

[Jenny Garth]

Maybe. And then I hear that all the time. Yeah, it's my mom's favorite show.

[Dax Shepard]

I was obsessed with it. I love it.

[Jenny Garth]

Why were you so obsessed with it?

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, my God. I was in Detroit. Right. It came out when I would have been 15. It was such a glitzy world. The poor kids driving a 65 Mustang convertible. Jason Priestley. Dylan's driving a fucking convertible. Porsche collector edition. The mansions. Everyone's hot, the dudes are cool. Like, it was such wish fulfillment.

[Jenny Garth]

So many bathing suits.

[Dax Shepard]

Yes. If you're, like, in any place other than California, it's so exciting because you

[Jenny Garth]

didn't have access to knowing what any of that world looked like.

[Dax Shepard]

Exactly. There's no Instagram. You're not seeing other people live this life. If you don't see it on TV or you don't take a vacation there, you don't see it. So your options were Baywatch and then this show, to understand maybe what California, this dream place was like. And I was so captivated. I remember on a trip to LA when I was 20 years old, Aaron, and I wanted to see what the Viper Room was. And all of a sudden, coming out of the Viper Room, amber Thiessen at peak 902-10-things. And then she booted in the parking lot. Some guy from the show's screaming at us to give him some privacy, but we don't care. Like, I now, like you, have compassion for people who treat me terribly. I'm like, these people, they're on tv. What's going on in this parking lot? I couldn't believe how exciting it was. So I was part of the problem, for sure.

[Jenny Garth]

People tell me I moved to America because of your show, because they saw what they wanted to live. And they were like, I'm going there.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. They thought all of America was. Was that.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. So I didn't look up the international numbers, but I bet they're absolutely shocking because I went on a Eurail pass when I was 19 and I was at hostels and they played Baywatch and 90210. So it was a hugely international show, too, right?

[Jenny Garth]

It was. We had so many different languages dubbed into our mouths.

[Monica Padman]

Wow.

[Dax Shepard]

Yes. Okay, so after the first year, how are you adjusting? You're clearly getting recognized everywhere you go. How is that, that experience?

[Jenny Garth]

They sent me out on a couple events.

[Dax Shepard]

Talk about the zoo. One with you and Luke.

[Jenny Garth]

There were just thousands of people. We definitely were animals in a zoo. That's what we felt like. And they had us in, I think it was the bird enclosure to get to the signing area where they had set it up. And we went. And it was impossible because it was dangerous. The kids were pushing and shoving and screaming and fainting.

[Monica Padman]

Oh, my God.

[Dax Shepard]

There were lots of melees at these signings that had to get canceled. So many of them got canceled.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Like, 10,000 people showed up at one mall.

[Jenny Garth]

Terrifying. Because you're on those little riser things they put you up on and, like a folding table and it's just shaking and rocking. People are sweating and crying and passing out. And like, literally the medics are carrying people.

[Monica Padman]

Oh, my God. Yeah. Remember when people would faint because of hotness? Because of looking at someone hot? That's, like, done.

[Dax Shepard]

No, I see people at concerts dropping out still.

[Monica Padman]

I think that's because they're on drugs.

[Dax Shepard]

Rock stars can still.

[Jenny Garth]

Like, when fans of the original show meet us, they don't know how to handle it.

[Dax Shepard]

Well, yeah. From your point of view, if you didn't know the context and you're just looking out at the sea of people, you could only conclude there is a natural disaster happening outside. Right. Like, you'd have to think there was like, a 8 earthquake happening or something.

[Jenny Garth]

It was pandemonium. And after that started happening, I started to develop agoraphobia. Like, I never left my house.

[Dax Shepard]

Right.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

How could you?

[Jenny Garth]

I wanted to go to the mall. I wanted to do things that at

[Dax Shepard]

the food court, young people were doing.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah. But I just didn't. I got scared.

[Dax Shepard]

And then also. Which could help or hurt you. So your father's heart condition gets worse and you get a place in Santa Anita's valley. A ranch.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah. After a few years on the show, I got a ranch there.

[Dax Shepard]

And you move them to the ranch?

[Jenny Garth]

They came from Arizona. They moved.

[Dax Shepard]

So now, did they get back together for this?

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah, they were back together. Since my mom had gone back and she was taking care of him. They had found this new empty nest or rhythm, and it was working for them, and they seemed very happy. And then I uprooted them and Said, I need you. I need something to keep me grounded and feeling like I know anything. And so they moved two hours north. And then I would go there all the time. Instead of going out partying, I would go be with my parents. Wow.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. So you said you kind of missed all the weekend debauchery that would happen with the other cast members. The upside of that is, like, you didn't get in any trouble really. But would you get to work on Monday? Did you not have fomo or would you be trying to find out, like, oh, who did what?

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah, I think there was internal FOMO that I really didn't even know what that was, but I felt like. But inside rationalizing it, like, I don't want that, so it's okay. And that sounds like too much for me. I didn't know how to handle more.

[Monica Padman]

That's wise at that age.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah. It was just like instinctual, I think, from where I came from.

[Dax Shepard]

But even though it's a contradiction, I can see it being very natural, which is like you've removed yourself from that. And then also you could feel like they're not including you.

[Monica Padman]

Right, right.

[Jenny Garth]

They're not including you or you're not cool.

[Dax Shepard]

Did you have those feelings? Like, oh, they're cool, and I'm not built for this.

[Jenny Garth]

It was hard because I would hear about what happened on the weekends and I would even see it in the press.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Jenny Garth]

And I would think, wow, I wonder what that's like. But also, I don't want that. That seems scary. I don't want to lose myself into that world.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. Reading between the lines a bit from your book, you don't explicitly say, but it sounds like you are in desperate need of some mooring to anchor to something. It's obvious from your actions that you felt like you were sucked up to a tornado.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Because you get married really young.

[Jenny Garth]

Yes. So many.

[Dax Shepard]

You meet a drummer. Is he on the show? How do you meet the drummer?

[Jenny Garth]

It was through a friend that invited me to see his band and I went and he was the drummer. And we just sort of hit it off. And yeah, we got married. I don't even know how that happened.

[Dax Shepard]

Like, how quickly after meeting.

[Jenny Garth]

I think I was 21. If my daughter came to me and said, I'm 21, I'm getting married, I'd be like, no, you're not.

[Monica Padman]

It was a different time. A little bit. People got married younger, I think a little bit.

[Dax Shepard]

Then the whole world. Why would this 21 year old on this show be getting married in Retrospect,

[Jenny Garth]

he was a big guy. He had the presence of my father, who I thought was gonna die any minute. I was trying to replace that sort of tethering, that sort of.

[Dax Shepard]

You're looking for stability. He embodies physical stability.

[Jenny Garth]

Right.

[Dax Shepard]

Now, here's the part you don't dig super deep into, but I'm curious. So he moves into your house. You build a recording studio for him. You buy him harley. There's something in there.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. What do we think is in there?

[Jenny Garth]

I am very giving. I like to make people happy. I like to make money so that I can make other people happy. In my family, I like to give things. My dad a truck and bought the ranch for them to live on. Like, I help other family members. I feel like I am given this position to make money for other people's benefit a lot of the time.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. But it's almost impossible, and especially when you're young, to proceed that way and not be resentful at the people that you're doing all this for. Cause you're like, I'm doing all this for you, and you're drunk and don't give a shit. Like, was there not also some resentment?

[Jenny Garth]

No, it wasn't resentment. It was sadness even. That wasn't enough for you to not go and drink all night with your friends or why would you want to do that?

[Monica Padman]

When I'm here, I battle some of that too. Like, if I'm being very generous, I have to think, am I doing this so that they can't leave me?

[Dax Shepard]

That's what I'm circling.

[Monica Padman]

Look at what I've done. You know, I've invested in you, or I've given you so much. You can't leave me. And then they do or they go do their own thing, and then you feel, like, really hurt.

[Jenny Garth]

In my mind, it never felt like, I'm investing in you. I'm doing this so that you won't leave me. But that was probably the under.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Jenny Garth]

I was never, like, at the end of that relationship when it was falling apart, and I was never like, look at all I've given you. And you still. I never thought that way. But I think now, as a woman who really understands how hard it is to make a living, to support your family and how hard you have to work. I do have more of a connection with. I work really hard. And I feel like if you want to be in my family, it has to be a team effort. We have to all work together to make this work in whatever capacity we're Able to.

[Monica Padman]

To.

[Jenny Garth]

But back then, I didn't know anything about that.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Well, at the risk of really opening up a wound because you have the cute appeal that also wears off for all people because you wanted more of a substantive attraction to you, do you think also there was some reality of, like, yeah, he thought you were the cutest thing in the world. And then six months later, that wasn't as exciting, and there's no second gear for this relationship.

[Jenny Garth]

Yes. My life maintained its ridiculous schedule. And having no real life of my own outside of work, because I had to get up so early every day and be there so long, I think I wasn't as fun as he thought I would be.

[Dax Shepard]

As advertised.

[Jenny Garth]

Right. Or as one would assume, if you're

[Monica Padman]

watching the show, you have an idea about all of you guys. And I bet you're like, I'm a person.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

I'm not that girl.

[Jenny Garth]

And by nature, I'm not a person that's walking around with rainbows flowing out of my ass. I was born blue. I don't know if a lot of people know what that means, but just not rainbowy. Built, more thoughtful, introverted, tiny bit melancholy. Yeah. Tiny bit blue. You know, my dad would always say, are you feeling blue? And I would say, yeah, I don't know why I was a kid. And then he would take me for ice cream. So then I figured out, oh, that's a reward for feeling blue. So I must have reinforced it. But I'm not like a yippity skippity person all the time.

[Dax Shepard]

If you're searching for stability, even this shitty version of stability is going to be more stable than when you pull the plug and you're back to the drawing board. I can imagine you measuring those two things and feeling like, well, it's better than zero stability, which will be the outcome.

[Jenny Garth]

I think I was just blindly brave at that point. Like, I didn't know what that would feel like, so I just was able to do it. So we separated. And then, of course, I met somebody during that separation. And that made it a lot easier. It always makes it easier when there's someone else.

[Dax Shepard]

Yes, yes, yes.

[Jenny Garth]

So then I finalized the divorce and started a relationship with my second husband.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay, let's talk about Luke for a second. Cause he's in the book you describe, basically, him shining his light on you and how powerful that was.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah, that light. I thought I was the only one that felt it. I really did. I was such a sucker.

[Monica Padman]

No, that's part of that. That's part of that. Personality.

[Jenny Garth]

Right. But I came to soon realize that he shined that same light on everyone. And that was just the nature of Luke.

[Monica Padman]

Why?

[Jenny Garth]

People gravitated towards him and loved him, and they felt so seen and appreciated by him.

[Dax Shepard]

Him. But you admit in the book you were pretty in love with him.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah, he was definitely my first real love.

[Dax Shepard]

What do you think kept it from escalating?

[Jenny Garth]

Probably he kept it from escalating because he had a real strong moral compass. At the same time, he loved me, but he didn't want to ruin me. And I think that he knew if we got involved, it was.

[Dax Shepard]

He knew he wasn't gonna be able to commit to you.

[Jenny Garth]

I don't think, under those circumstances. No.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. When I was reading it, I gotta be honest, I felt a little maybe defensive of him. He's just this person moving through life and the way he is, people are falling in love with. It's not disingenuous of him that he interacted with you, just the way he interacts.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah. But it was a little more than that. Okay. I'm sure in order to maintain that chemistry for the show, for the cameras, and he liked to have chemistry with who? So he would put a lot of effort into it. As naive as I was, I thought that that was him loving me. I felt like he really valued me. And I didn't see him doing that with everyone else until later.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. This sounds terribly painful. You had to watch then over the next few years, different co stars come in and out and him create that with everyone.

[Jenny Garth]

Right. Whether I was mistaken and just stupid, I felt that we had something really special. And I have every belief that we did have something special because we were friends all our lives after that. I think anybody that was around us probably could tell that's a blessing.

[Dax Shepard]

He didn't go all the way. Cause that allowed you to stay friends, I'd imagine. Yeah.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah. I was very conflicted with my friendship after that point because I guess I was heartbroken, honestly. Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

And you felt betrayed, I assume. To some degree, maybe.

[Jenny Garth]

I guess. Yeah. It really instilled in me even more of a feeling of you can't trust

[Monica Padman]

people and you can't trust yourself.

[Jenny Garth]

You can't trust yourself because look what you've fallen for. I don't know. I mean, if he had, we would have probably, definitely dated. We never really dated. We were always at work together, but it was always a very strong flirtation. Always.

[Dax Shepard]

And you got to kiss in scenes.

[Jenny Garth]

We're constantly making up.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, my God. Wasn't that fun?

[Jenny Garth]

Grumping each other. It was so layered.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Jenny Garth]

I wasn't experienced at that point with making out with guys on camera and knowing that that didn't translate into real life at all. And then also being like, of course, stupid. That's not real. You're acting. But it felt real. And now I'm very clear. Because of those learnings of getting it blurry. It's very easy for me to have chemistry in one second with somebody and then just the next second and be normal.

[Dax Shepard]

Dead to them.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

What was your name?

[Jenny Garth]

It's easy for me to define now.

[Dax Shepard]

Boundaries. I guess that's what they're called.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah. You learn those now.

[Dax Shepard]

People left the show, and I'm curious what that did to the little microcosm of the world. Like, Shannon left after the fourth season. I did get to read a little bit about things that were going on, which is. She was perpetually late. Didn't care when she was late. They kind of wanted to get rid of her. She wanted to leave. But then she had second thoughts. She cut her hair in the middle of an episode.

[Jenny Garth]

Oh, wow.

[Dax Shepard]

That was the final straw.

[Jenny Garth]

I think there was some decisions just to be like, fuck you. I can do what I want. And I was watching from the sidelines going, wow, she really can do whatever she wants. Like, that's so cool.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. Was it cooler? Were you trying to figure out, like, what's her problem with all this?

[Jenny Garth]

As fellow Ares, there's that part of me with the horns that understands it, because we don't like to be told what to do or what we can and can't do. And sometimes in the face of being told what we can't do, we're like, oh, really? Watch me. And being both incredibly independent women from such a very young age, she also had a dad with heart problems, and she supported her family and took care of her family. They were her first priority at all times. And there was a lot going on for her that no one knew. There were all the struggles of trying to figure out how to have healthy relationships and be in her position. Not easy. Very difficult to navigate. That confusion, I think caused some defiance or anger, naturally, trying to control some things.

[Monica Padman]

Anything you can.

[Jenny Garth]

So I think, yeah, when she was late, it was annoying for everyone. We were all there on time, ready when we were supposed to be ready, and the crew was waiting. That that was hard to work with. And I didn't know then a lot of what she was going through until we became women and discussed it more openly. I heard her saying, like, People didn't really understand what I was going through at the time. And I never really considered that at that young age. But I did have this sort of respect for her, like an unknown, non understood respect for her also.

[Monica Padman]

I mean, you guys are young and you're the stars. I can imagine being young and a star and like, you're not telling me I'm the reason this show works. We're the reason this show works. Not you telling me what to do. Like, I could see that getting very out of hand with these stars of the biggest show ever.

[Dax Shepard]

And it sounds like they were like, oh, these are young kids. We can kind of have them here nonstop. That's what's crazy that you're on ensemble and you worked as much as you did. That's generally the gift of an ensemble. The other thing that blew my mind is I didn't realize you guys did 32 episodes a year since I don't think any. Like, now we marvel at shows that did 24, but you guys did 32. How many months a year were you shooting the show?

[Jenny Garth]

We had two and a half months off in the summer and then maybe a month ish off at Christmas. So it was a lot. We were there a lot.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Jenny Garth]

I always joke and say it was like we were kept in jail because it was this isolated sound studio in Van Nuys, California, which was just industry. It's not nice.

[Dax Shepard]

It was like a commercial park, right?

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah. There's like car crushing on one side and a porn studio on the other side of our stages. People didn't go there. That's what they wanted. And we were inside this building that they had transformed into a sound studio. Even though you could hear every airplane going into Van Nuys airport all day long. Never held for planes more in my life. I felt so sequestered, so confined.

[Dax Shepard]

You meet your second husband and then you guys have your first daughter. Pretty quick. 97.

[Jenny Garth]

Yep. She was born in 97. That was a surprise.

[Dax Shepard]

That makes sense. Cause you get married in 01.

[Jenny Garth]

Yes. We were not ready. We. I say we. We were not ready to get married yet. I think the analogy was our boat wasn't strong enough to survive the ocean. So I waited for the boat to get stronger. But I had a baby. I was a brand new mom. I was so focused on keeping the baby alive.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, you're 25, 24. I think everyone else is like, out at the Viper Room throwing up in the parking lot. Dax shepherd and Aaron Winkley or gawking at them, but you're ra there's challenges, but I would also imagine this is finally the tether you're probably looking for in life. Right. Where you have an identity that's outside of this other quite confusing identity.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah. And I felt like this was my purpose. I didn't know my purpose within that world of acting, the show, all of that fame, but I knew my purpose immediately when I had a baby.

[Dax Shepard]

And what do you think that inoculated you against that other cast members were dealing with, that you were relieved?

[Jenny Garth]

Just the tabloids. I was exhausted in a different way, but not from partying, which is a very different kind of exhaustion.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Jenny Garth]

I think mostly I was not focused on myself any longer. I always think that having kids saved my life. Having Luca, my first daughter, saved my life because I could have seen me going into this self important swirl of, you know, a spiral where all you think about is yourself and your business and your worth and all that stuff. And I didn't think about that until.

[Dax Shepard]

I do think that's the huge gift if you're in this business that kids give you is they don't give a shit about whether or not your movie open.

[Jenny Garth]

They don't care.

[Dax Shepard]

They're not gonna be sympathetic. Yeah, you gotta get up and do whatever. You gotta go to travel town and take them to see the trains whether the movie opened or not, which is

[Jenny Garth]

good for you as an actor. People assume that we're very self absorbed. And we are very self absorbed to a certain degree.

[Dax Shepard]

Well, it requires you to concentrate on. On getting it and maintaining it. It becomes your entire. It's all you.

[Jenny Garth]

See, I always said, I'm the CEO of me. I have to run my business. This is my business, I guess. Okay.

[Monica Padman]

Therefore, you have to think about you.

[Jenny Garth]

You have to think about you a lot. I get so fucking bored with myself and irritated that I'm having to like, think about me. I'm doing it a lot more now in my life than I ever have because my kids are out of the house. So I'm able to focus on things that I need to focus on a little bit more or want to focus on. But it was a interesting time. I remember doing one scene, I felt very different. And Gabrielle had had a baby, I think a year or two before me on the show. But then she ended up leaving. And she was older than all of us.

[Dax Shepard]

She was like 36 or something.

[Jenny Garth]

I don't think she was 36.

[Monica Padman]

Everyone always said, they're like, she was so old.

[Jenny Garth]

I don't think she was quite old.

[Dax Shepard]

Rob, look up how Old. She was. I'm almost certain she was 36 at some point on that.

[Monica Padman]

Maybe at 10 point.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

I want to say for the record, she's still a babe. I thought she was a smoke show. I didn't care.

[Jenny Garth]

She was 36, was SM.

[Dax Shepard]

But I do remember going, like, when you find that out, it's very exciting gossip, right?

[Jenny Garth]

Because you don't think it when you're watching it. But we knew it on set. Like, she had, you know, an older vibe, different priorities. But then I had a baby and I was like, I'm still in the group. I gotta go milk my boobs in the trailer.

[Dax Shepard]

How did they shoot around that? You were clearly pregnant.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah, I was pregnant in season nine. I don't remember.

[Dax Shepard]

It would have been 790 to.

[Jenny Garth]

I just watched it and I can't remember.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, yeah, season seven.

[Jenny Garth]

And we hit it. We called it Bob. I can remember when Jason, he was doing some directing at that phase of the show, and he would be like, how are we gonna hide Bob in this? And they'd just give me, like, something to carry or giant clothes.

[Dax Shepard]

Now, when the show ended, did you feel relief or did you have a moment of. Well, I just had security for a decade. At that point, a third of your life, you had had major financial security. Were you at all panicked after that first year?

[Jenny Garth]

You know, when you get that kind of financial security so young, you don't really think about money.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay, well, that's great to hear.

[Jenny Garth]

I mean, you don't really think about it coming and going. You just have it and then you spend it and then you get it and then you spend it. It seems so normal. But then when you're like, wait, you're

[Dax Shepard]

watching it just go down.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah, the money's not coming in anymore, but I'm still spending it. It was really scary. I didn't think I would have such an adjustment. But we all went through. I didn't know when to go to the bathroom. You were led around by a leash. Basically, when you're an actor, they, like, say, go to the bathroom and then come out. We'll go to the thing. And then here's your lunch, and in 10 minutes I'll come back to get you. Here's what you wear, here's what you say. Here's your makeup. Look.

[Dax Shepard]

They talk about the depression that follows most professional athletes and people think wrongly, it's about the fame and money, but it's always about, they lost their community, they were on a table team, and then they lost their routine, everything's scheduled for an athlete, and all of a sudden they're in the world with no schedule and no community.

[Jenny Garth]

It's like willy nilly. You're like, what do I do?

[Monica Padman]

I'm overwhelmed. Should I eat now?

[Jenny Garth]

Am I hungry?

[Dax Shepard]

I don't even know when are they putting down lunch?

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Jenny Garth]

Why is there no craft service in my kitchen?

[Dax Shepard]

So when you got what I like about you, that was a show you then did for four years. Four seasons.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah, four seasons. I was very lucky. I was so happy to get that show because there's a huge stigma that followed. All of us as actors, people weren't really willing to see us do other things. I really wanted to do a comedy. I had no idea how to do a comedy. Cause I was always doing so much drama on 90210. But I got called in by Will Calhoun, who was one of the head executives of Friends, and he was doing a new show with Amanda Bynes. And another guy was also executive producing it. I selectively forgotten his name at the moment. He was part of that big scandal.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, okay.

[Jenny Garth]

Dan Schneider. Oh, oh, oh, oh. Oh, my gosh.

[Dax Shepard]

Yes.

[Jenny Garth]

Dan Schneider. He was the other producer. He was kind of the Amanda side of it. Cause it was starring myself and Amanda Bynes.

[Dax Shepard]

She was coming from Disney on a show.

[Jenny Garth]

She had worked with him a lot on the Amanda show and all the things. So he had hooked his wagon to her.

[Dax Shepard]

Were you getting bad vibes?

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah, I was. To the point where I said to Will, like, I would rather just communicate solely with you. I trust you. I think that you have my best interest, and I don't feel that way with your partner, so I'd rather just be with you. And he was like, no problem.

[Monica Padman]

And did you see Amanda getting, like, kind of destroyed by him?

[Jenny Garth]

Not specifically him. There were a lot of problems in this ecosystem of her.

[Dax Shepard]

How old was she and how old were you at that time?

[Jenny Garth]

When we did the pilot, I had just turned 30 and she had just turned 16. We have the same birthday.

[Monica Padman]

Oh, that's sweet.

[Dax Shepard]

So did you feel like you were perfectly equipped to help her navigate this since you did it so young? You did not.

[Jenny Garth]

No, no, no. And also, I didn't know how to be around a teenage girl. She taught me so much. I was kind of afraid of teenagers because everyone was like, oh, you've got a kid and wait till they're a teenager. They're going to be a nightmare.

[Dax Shepard]

They love to say that, right?

[Jenny Garth]

They love to say that.

[Dax Shepard]

That's their favorite thing to say.

[Jenny Garth]

That Is so not true.

[Dax Shepard]

People go, do you have kids? I go, yeah, I have two girls. Oh, wait till they're teenagers. I go, go fuck yourself.

[Jenny Garth]

Right? You don't know. I've just told that to someone recently. They were asking like advice for teen. I said, don't accept that narrative. Yeah, accept it. This is how I want it to be with myself.

[Dax Shepard]

What's really going on that I have compassion for. Cause when I've gotten little bouts of. It is like they're dealing with heartbreak. You have this little person who thinks you're the greatest and then they must go through a phase where they don't think you're that cool. And you're like, wait, but what happened? We're best friends. I understand they're dealing with heartbreak.

[Jenny Garth]

It is sad.

[Dax Shepard]

It's just not the thing to tell new parents constantly.

[Jenny Garth]

No, you're setting them up for failure.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. Because also what are you going to do about. There's no solution in that. Like, what's the point?

[Jenny Garth]

Just scaring people. You're fucked.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, exactly.

[Dax Shepard]

You're right. It becomes a little bit of a self fulfilling problem because when there's a blip of it, you're like, well, here we go.

[Monica Padman]

Exactly.

[Dax Shepard]

This is what everyone's doing.

[Monica Padman]

This is what they mean.

[Dax Shepard]

Like, I think I even had that. And I was like, oh, no, that passed. That was like a month.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

And now everything's hunky dory.

[Jenny Garth]

You got lucky. I was very lucky.

[Dax Shepard]

Well, I'm like, I never went through that with my mom. I was always delightful.

[Monica Padman]

I wasn't either. I was bad, but I was always kind of bad.

[Jenny Garth]

I was bad. I could lie like nobody's business.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, well, you were acting. I guess I was meant to be an actor. Exactly.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay, so you guys proceed to have three daughters from 97 till I don't know when your last baby was born.

[Jenny Garth]

She was born in 2006.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay, so nine years of getting pregnant every few years and then having a baby. The relationship's not in a great state. Was it something that had precipitous fallen or was it doomed and you were getting through it for a long period of it or when did it start to feel untenable?

[Jenny Garth]

Early. My view of it was that he wasn't ready to become a father at 21. Obviously not.

[Dax Shepard]

A ton of dudes are.

[Jenny Garth]

Nope. And he didn't know who he was yet. I didn't know who I was yet.

[Dax Shepard]

He's trying to create a career. He's an actor.

[Jenny Garth]

He wants to be an actor. And he's doing the work. It's hard to even imagine, but I feel now as if, and this is no shade, no blame, nothing. I'm kind of a realist. Like, I don't think he was ever truly in love with me. The kind of love that it takes to be married, to sustain a long term relationship.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. To have to roll up your sleeves and do all the terrible work that's required.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah. He was focused on other things, his career, and I was focused on the kids and my career, trying to do both. And now if I could go back, the writing was kind of on the the wall. For some reason my now husband Dave doesn't understand. Well, why'd you keep having kids with them?

[Dax Shepard]

Because you kept having sex.

[Jenny Garth]

Well, yeah, it happens when you're, you're married and you have sex and you're

[Monica Padman]

like, oh, it sounds like nothing was that bad. Like nothing was so bad that you had to be like, we really can't keep going. Is that right?

[Jenny Garth]

It wasn't. We functioned and we loved being a family. We loved our daughter so much and we would do a lot of fun things and it just felt normal. But I didn't try to make it this way. It just showed up as that white picket fence story. All of a sudden you're like, wow, okay, this is what I'm doing. And then it didn't have what it needed to sustain. That's hard to leave.

[Dax Shepard]

Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert if you dare. Thank you to our presenting sponsor, HP for supporting this episode. Their HP smart tank printer is the last printer you' ever need. Oh, here we go. Monica. With a refillable ink tank and up to three years of ink included. So you get thousands of pages of cartridge free printing. Hallelujah. To learn more, search for HP Smart Tank. This episode is brought to you by Apple. There's nothing like your first Mac. When I got mine, I remember opening up and immediately feeling like, oh, this just makes sense. Everything felt intuitive and instead of fumbling around trying to figure it out, I could just get right into what I was was doing. Writing, creating, getting things done. It all felt easy in a way that really stuck with me. That's how I felt with my first Mac. How will you check out the all new MacBook Neo, an amazing Mac at a surprising price. Find out more on apple.com Mac we are supported by Klarna. Here's something nobody tells you. When you become an adult, paying for things gets weirdly complicated. Like nobody sat you down and explained how to actually manage cash flow. When life doesn't line up perfectly with your paycheck. If you've ever wanted more flexibility in how to pay without the stress or confusion of traditional credit, this is worth knowing about. Klarna lets you pay now, pay later, or pay over time and the whole thing is built around transparency. You see exactly what you owe and when. No hidden fees, no mystery math. It's about flexibility that fits real life, giving you options for how and when you pay without surprises. It works across all kinds of purchases. Things like groceries, travel, tech and everything is managed in one place in in the app so you're not juggling a bunch of different accounts. And get this, you can also unlock cash back in deals just by shopping through Klarna, which is honestly a nice bonus when you're already buying something anyway. The whole point is to give you options and keep you in control of your budget without the pressure. Download the Klarna app today or visit klarna.com to learn more. That's Klarna K L A R N A.com CA resident loans made or arranged pursuant to a California Finance Law License NMLS Number 1353190 Klarna Balance Account required to be eligible for cash back points Limitations Terms and conditions apply. This episode is sponsored by BetterHelp. So we're in March, which means it's a moment to celebrate women. And I want to take a second to acknowledge some incredible women in my life. My family of course, and Monica obviously, who I get to work with every day. The women on our team, the women in this industry who are constantly juggling a million at once. They carry so much. They're managing work relationships, family dynamics, and about a thousand invisible responsibilities that nobody sees or acknowledges. And here's what I've learned. Taking care of everyone else is exhausting. Setting boundaries, creating balance, making space for yourself. That's not selfish, that's necessary. And therapy can be a really powerful tool for that. It's a space to work through the pressures, the expectations, the roles we all play. Betterhelp makes it easier to get started. They match you with a licensed therapist based on your needs and if it's not the right fit, you can switch anytime. Your emotional well being matters, find support and feel lighter in therapy. Sign up and get 10% [e-mail] Dax that's better. H E L P.com Dax. Also, there's an illusion of the equation of A equals B and B equals CA equals C. Like you both love these girls songs and you can talk about that Love, and it's a creation of you two. And that can feel maybe like that's compensating for the love that's actually not going in that direction. It's confusing. I'd imagine. Love has created this thing that we love so much.

[Jenny Garth]

Right. So we must love each other, but we don't. I guess we didn't.

[Dax Shepard]

Like, it's interesting because you focused, I think in the book that, yeah, he wasn't in love with you, but are you sure you were in love with. With him?

[Jenny Garth]

I don't know. In the beginning, we were mad about each other for, I think it was six months. Then we got pregnant, and then it just got real complicated.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, it's pretty easy to be super into someone for six months. Most beginnings of relationships are pretty hot and heavy.

[Jenny Garth]

Maybe even longer than six months. But things got real, real fast. I've talked about before, like, I feel like my life has just swept me, you know, it's been a constant, like, flow, flow, things happening, coming to me, dealing with it, surviving it. Then the next thing, incomes. I never had any point where I was like, this is what I want. This is what I'm going to work hard on getting. Things just happened, and I was constantly just trying to tread water to figure it out.

[Dax Shepard]

It Sounds like from 1990 to 2012, you were reacting to whatever new scenario arose. So here's this show. I'm going to react and try to figure out how to respond. I'm pregnant. I'm a new mom. Oh, my God. There's two more. Oh, this Mary marriage isn't what I had hoped. You think at some point the way to salvage all this is all of us to move up to Santa Naz, to the ranch, and then let's do a reality show for cmt. It was called Little Bit Country.

[Jenny Garth]

Right. Well, I had wanted to move up to the ranch a. To be closer to my family, my mom and dad. When my second daughter was five, my dad died. I'm not a good griever. I just go hard, go deep, go full in. And I have to get through it slowly. I have to go really feel the feelings. I remember on his death, deathbed, we were going through separation and my dad was losing oxygen to his brain, so he was saying things that weren't his nature. One of the last things he said to me was, I don't think this is a good idea. You're old and you got two kids. Who's gonna want you now? That just stuck with me so profoundly.

[Dax Shepard]

What a lovely party.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah. But that wasn't him. He was never mean to anyone.

[Dax Shepard]

He was afraid for you. Cause he loved you. And it came terribly like that.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah. Like, I guess maybe he thought I shouldn't get a divorce.

[Dax Shepard]

I'm presuming he just wanted to make sure you were okay, safe. And then in his mind, you were better off in a shitty marriage than you would be trying to find someone else.

[Monica Padman]

Well, in that generation tend to think that way.

[Dax Shepard]

I know you have a lot of anxiety. When do you start? I'm presuming you were on some benzo, you were on Xanax or something. When does that trajectory start?

[Jenny Garth]

That started when we separated. I just didn't know how to cope with all the feelings and all the responsibility that I suddenly felt. I've always supported myself, even in my marriage. And we split. Everything was never like, oh, how am I gonna survive? Kind of thing. It just was. I was broken. I didn't know how to be alone and deal with it all. And, yeah, we moved to the ranch because the paparazzi were just nuts. We lived in Toluca Lake, and they just were really bad.

[Dax Shepard]

When you're with your kids.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah, it's brutal. And so I just wanted to get them out, out of there and have, like, a normal life with them. So they went to, like, the local school and we walked to school, and it was just Mayberry, usa. It was perfect. And then the show presented itself as something that he and I would produce together. About us moving to the ranch and kind of having both worlds fish out of water.

[Dax Shepard]

You guys are leaving Hollywood to live in the country.

[Jenny Garth]

Really? I was back to my roots. I wasn't out of water at all. I was happy.

[Dax Shepard]

But when the show was bought and originally conceived, you guys were going to go there as a couple.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

And then by the time production starts, everything had changed. You're not a couple.

[Jenny Garth]

No. I'm drinking wine at night and taking medication.

[Dax Shepard]

I would be embarrassed.

[Jenny Garth]

My marriage felt it was very embarrassing.

[Dax Shepard]

Yes.

[Jenny Garth]

And then I felt like such an asshole for being embarrassed. Like, that's ego.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, but we're not there yet. You're not the healthy Jenny yet. So at the time, if my marriage is falling apart in my first. First step is going to be to be in a reality show where I acknowledge that. No way.

[Jenny Garth]

I don't even know.

[Dax Shepard]

That's gotta be out of body.

[Jenny Garth]

Who that was, I have no idea. That era of my life, I just remember being prodded out of bed. I would take the girls to school. I would go back to Bed. And then the crew would show up, and I would be like, I can't get up. I don't know. And they would talk me up and get me out, and I would end up doing it just because that's what you do.

[Dax Shepard]

Were you just, like, completely disassociated throughout the whole process? I would have just gone to a place in my mind and watched this unfold, like, holy shit, what's happening?

[Jenny Garth]

It was very surreal. It was very out of body and. But then there were moments of levity, which helped me feel better about the girls experience because they were getting distracted by the crew and the fun people. And then they would be doing fun things that they created for the show. And I was like, this feels good. Everybody's laughing and feels normal for this moment. And then they would leave, and then the reality would be like, oh, this is what they.

[Monica Padman]

Normal.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. He came to visit at one point and said, let's go talk in the RV while the show's being shot.

[Jenny Garth]

I don't know if the show was being shot at that time. I don't think the crew was there. I think it was over.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Jenny Garth]

You know, y', all, this is my story. This is my recollection of it. I have literally no idea what his story is. I'm curious. We've never really sat down and gone through the beat by beat of it all. I don't think I really need to. But my remembrance is that we went into the RV and the kids were outside playing on the farm because it was safe and they were running free like kids should be. And that's where he told me that he wanted us to get a divorce.

[Dax Shepard]

And then he said a very fateful sentence, though. He said, yes.

[Jenny Garth]

He said, jen, someday you'll thank me for this. And that infuriated me. That pissed me off.

[Dax Shepard]

So then we go to. For me, what would be a bottom, which is you decide you should try marriage counseling in Phoenix.

[Jenny Garth]

I had heard about this expert, and she happened to be in Phoenix. So he was on a shoot, and I said, let's fly there and meet there. So we both flew from different places in Phoebe.

[Dax Shepard]

I have to say, having never met him, that part feels very standup that he was willing to come do that.

[Jenny Garth]

I feel like he needed backup or he wanted someone to really make me understand because I'm. I will try. And I was in denial, and I was unwilling. I didn't want it. Maybe that was just for the girls, but I didn't want that to happen.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, Again, you're going to be completely untethered again.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah. So we went there and that's where everything sort of hit the fan. Even more than the rv.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. You get to the therapy session and he's already there.

[Jenny Garth]

He's already there. Which I found was weird. He was already inside the office with the therapist. So I felt like, oh, she, she knows stuff already that she should have found out from both of us in that situation.

[Dax Shepard]

Like the jury's been compromised.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah, exactly. We sat down and honestly, two minutes into it, she said, jenny, why would you love someone when they don't love you? Why would you love someone who doesn't love you? Like, it's echoing like, I'll never forget it. There's a few things in my life. I've already told you three of them now that I'll never forget. That that just gutted me and I was like, yeah, no shit, give up.

[Dax Shepard]

Like it's time it broke through. And then you got up and split. You started walking down the street and

[Jenny Garth]

there was like no idea where I was going. It was hot as hell.

[Dax Shepard]

This part, sorry, is mildly comedic. They roll up in a Toyota Corolla.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. Looking for you.

[Jenny Garth]

Like a sand colored one, you know,

[Dax Shepard]

the Golden Roll up his Toyota Corolla. They come looking for you.

[Jenny Garth]

He's in the passenger seat.

[Monica Padman]

This is very movie esque.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Monica Padman]

This is very cool.

[Jenny Garth]

And I'm walking, angry, crying, all the things just like out of my mout mind. And they are just like kind of keeping up with me in the car and saying, get in the car, let us take you to a hotel. Jen, come on, get in the car. Like a friend. And I was like, why would I get in your car? No. But somehow they got me in the car and then they took me to a hotel. Took us to a hotel. He checked in separately and I was like, well, I guess I'll check in. And that was the parting moment.

[Dax Shepard]

And then that night you drank a lot.

[Jenny Garth]

Well, as much as you can drink of the mini bottles, but like, you know, chug, chug, just stop this pain.

[Dax Shepard]

And then mix with benzos mixed with

[Jenny Garth]

medication that I've been given for flying purposes or divorce purposes. Yeah, like people really like to give people medication.

[Dax Shepard]

So you wake up in the hospital after that night?

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah, I blacked out. I passed. Passed out on the floor. And I had my best friend on the phone with me, I think while that was happening, so she knew I was in danger.

[Dax Shepard]

Thank God she called your assistant in la. The assistant flew to Arizona and she got you to the hospital. And when you woke up, you're looking at your assistant.

[Jenny Garth]

I'm looking at my assistant. And whiteness and doctors, and everything's very fuzzy. It all came back to me, and all I wanted to do was kill the pain some more.

[Dax Shepard]

I'll get personal with you. This was the pain. Cause you write. It still shames me to write this, and it feels like it still shames you a little bit to talk about it.

[Jenny Garth]

I think the shame really came from letting the girls down and from being a bad mom by letting myself go to that place. I could have died in that hotel room.

[Dax Shepard]

But again, this is the beginning of a journey that you are destined to take. Whether you did it in 2012 or 20 or you died miserable. But this is like the time you jump off the fucking diving board. Like, this is when life starts in a bizarre way. So as much shame as you might feel, like your transformation doesn't exist without waking up in that hospital.

[Jenny Garth]

Right.

[Dax Shepard]

You go to LA and you go into treatment and I'm mad at you. You leave in six days.

[Jenny Garth]

I wasn't good with the group environment.

[Dax Shepard]

And you go on a yoga retreat with a woman to Bali, and you don't stay with all the other people, you stay with her. And so I think if you're one of those group members, you might think like, oh, she thinks she's hot shit because she was on tv. Were you not nervous?

[Jenny Garth]

I honestly didn't care. That wasn't my motive. It wasn't the reason I was isolating. And I think most of of them, if not all of them, were really understanding and respectful of that and kind.

[Dax Shepard]

What do you think prevented you from participating?

[Jenny Garth]

I just wasn't ready to open up to strangers. And just like in group therapy at the rehab, I had spent so much time being private and carrying it all in silence and hiding it from the world, I wasn't ready.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

Were you also worried people were going to find out like this?

[Jenny Garth]

Very worried people were going to find out that I was in rehab.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Jenny Garth]

Because I didn't want my kids to have to deal with that publicly.

[Monica Padman]

I think that prevents a lot of people from going, which is very unfair.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. And it's funny too, because so, yeah, I know what you're talking about. You have all these secrets and you're carrying all this shame. And that's precisely why group things work, is that you go into this group, you put out on a platter these things that you think make you unlovable and unworthy, and they go, oh, yeah, I did all those too. All right. That's actually the magic is this thing that you're holding that you're certain will make you unlovable once exposed in that light. It turns out that's not the case because you're looking at these other people who've done the same thing and you're like, oh, no, you're so lovable. You're so likable. You have so much value. I know that's true for you. It might be true for me.

[Jenny Garth]

I probably missed out on a lot of that growth and it took me longer because of that to get where I needed to get.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. So you start taking some steps that you get an apartment, you leave Sant Inez, you do dedicate a month that had been etched out out for treatment and you start doing an outpatient program. You meet this woman, you go to Bali on the yoga thing.

[Jenny Garth]

The outpatient program felt like it was full time, though.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. You said it was like nine hours a day or something.

[Jenny Garth]

And sitting in a room by yourself and people come in every different kind of therapist.

[Dax Shepard]

I was curious. Yeah, because you just do therapy session, therapy session. Did you leave with diagnoses? Like did they start telling you you're this or that?

[Jenny Garth]

I'd already had diagnoses of depression from a very young age that I was always using medication to balance and then going off of it because I didn't think I needed it. Being embarrassed because I had to take and then not taking it when I was pregnant and just dealing with all the ups and downs of that. And so I was already there. They didn't really give me any kind of diagnosis. They were just really helping me hear the words that I needed to be hearing constantly and hearing the messages of value and worth and listening to your instinct and just trying to get me back in my own body.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, yeah. So in order of the things that were very effective, I'm fascinated by this. And funny enough, you took talk about joining this Buddhist group and going every Monday night. And I wrote down the name of it.

[Jenny Garth]

Kadampa.

[Dax Shepard]

Kadampa.

[Jenny Garth]

It's right down the street.

[Dax Shepard]

So I wrote down the name of it. Cuz I'm like, oh, I want to start taking classes there on Mondays. And then I'm taking a family walk with my kids. Yeah, you can walk there two days ago. And we like. I look at a sign and I go, oh my God, this is impossible, you guys. I just wrote down the name of this from reading Jenny.

[Jenny Garth]

Literally you are meant to go.

[Dax Shepard]

And then my 11 year old's like, I want to go with you.

[Jenny Garth]

It's so fun. You know, they do for kids too.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, they do?

[Jenny Garth]

Oh yeah, yeah. I just drove by it on the way here and thought, oh, I miss going there when I need to get back.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. What things were you picking up that were helping you tether yourself to yourself and what were the building blocks that helped you most come out of this?

[Jenny Garth]

Gen Rigpa, the leader of the class, he was so relatable. Like he translated the teachings of Buddha into like present day usable stuff that we're all dealing with. Road rage and heartbreak and hesitation for reaching for your goals, all the things. So I was hearing it in just a different language. It just came in differently and it just resonated so much. And I had seen a friend of mine that had gone through the stages of the Buddhist teachings.

[Dax Shepard]

You met someone on set, right? It was another actor.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah, another actor. I was like, wow, you are so cool and level headed and just like a piece all the time. I want what you have. What's wrong with you? Like, where'd you get that? He's the one that told me about it. But I was just sitting there listening to the teacher teachings and I took copious notes because I tend to have to write things down in order to remember them. And I just have those books with me. I go back to them all the time. Also, the just human connection that you said I was perhaps missing by not going to the group therapy and realizing that all these people were there for the same reason. And one of the main teachings of Buddhism is that we all want to be free from suffering. And that was just revolutionary for me. Started me thinking outside of my own pain and realizing that we're all carrying our own pain and it's through connecting and then recognizing that in each other that the healing really happens.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, talk about the scarcity mindset a little bit. I thought this was a great section.

[Jenny Garth]

I think I've always had it. Just growing up very modestly and having been independent my whole life and having to pay all of my bills and other bills. You worry about things like what if it's not there? Like I would keep clothes that I didn't need because I thought maybe someday I'll need that and maybe I won't have enough money to buy it. In your mind when you are so self sufficient, it's scary.

[Dax Shepard]

I love that you say in that mindset too, you're scanning for short term wins because you have so much anxiety and they're not long term wins. I can relate to this so much like, as an actor, it's like, oh, that movie failed. Shit. I don't think I'm getting hired again. I guess I'm going to consider these other things that I never wanted to do. But they're on the table, so I should take them because those will go away too.

[Jenny Garth]

If I don't do it, somebody else will. And I had to make money. I had to support myself and my girls. And I was accustomed to a certain kind of lifestyle. Sure, yes, we could have moved into an apartment. But I really wanted, probably for myself too, because I'm really at home. At my home, like, that's my place. I wanted to have that sort of security for my girls and always be able to provide it. But the scarcity just keeps you living in fear of not having. And I think especially with money, because I spent all those years not worrying about money, it'll come, it'll happen. It magically appears. I don't know who does what with it, but it's all good. Then all of a sudden, I was forced to really think about, how am I gonna do this? I don't have that backup. Even if we were sharing things equally, the feeling of having that kind of backup. Support was gone, and my dad had died, and I felt a lot more responsibility. And I just never worried about money. And then all of a sudden, I started worrying about money. I started worrying about, when am I going to get enough to pay. And my business manager was really scaring the shit out of me all the time. Said, you need to sell your house. And actually, you need to sell the ranch too. So I just built a home for my daughters. And he said, you need to sell it now while the real estate is at its height, because it's going to change. I was like, okay. And I didn't have a sounding board on the other side of that. And then he said, you need to sell your ranch. And I did that too. And I regret both of those decisions, decisions, because the minute you start worrying and holding on and attaching to the outcome of the money coming and going, that is when, for me, it stopped coming. I, like, clenched my fists around it and strangled it with worry. And that was a real life lesson.

[Dax Shepard]

You gotta kind of take a leap of faith.

[Jenny Garth]

And even, like, going back to my relationship with the girl's dad, young, insecure me, was worried that he would leave me or he would cheat on me. He's an actor. He's going to make out with beautiful women. And that was very difficult. And I got really concerned about it, and I made it happen. And I remember him, too, saying, at some point, you're gonna make this happen. I didn't understand that. And I also kind of thought that was a little bit manipulative. Because you're saying, I'm gonna make you do something.

[Monica Padman]

Right. There is some element of that, but

[Jenny Garth]

I get it from the other perspective, too. Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

It's like, if I'm always in trouble for cheating or I'm always under scrutiny, then I might as well be having fun, because I'm dealing with this, and I'm not having that. I'm paying the price as if I were.

[Jenny Garth]

There was a lot of that in our relationship because I was. Was just insecure and unstable and not connected with myself like most of us. Yeah. I felt like it took a long time for me. Like, I didn't get there until, like, 50, late 40s, where I really started to understand myself more and love myself to the point where I could comfort my own self and be my own anchor.

[Dax Shepard]

Well, I admire how much you tried and fought.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. Like, you did landmark.

[Jenny Garth]

Did you ever do landmark?

[Dax Shepard]

No. But our friend did the whole thing.

[Monica Padman]

He loves it. He still talks about it all the time.

[Jenny Garth]

It's like a Kool Aid situation.

[Dax Shepard]

He doesn't participate anymore, but I think he was great at extracting. Of course, there's really great principles in there, or it wouldn't be so successful.

[Jenny Garth]

I still live by one of them today. You have a choice in the world every day. You are a person that either loves chocolate ice cream or vanilla ice cream. Which is it? And you're like vanilla. So to really get in touch with your internal. Answering a question without doubt. So I've always go back to that one, too.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. My understanding of it that I like a lot is it's a lot about personal responsibility. Like, the world's not happening to you.

[Jenny Garth]

No. You're not a victim.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. You're not a victim. It's not happening to you. It's happening for you. And how do you want to navigate it?

[Jenny Garth]

And while you're at it, go clean up all the shit that you've already destroyed.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Jenny Garth]

Which was really beneficial. I think that helps a lot of people so much because so much happens when we. We know we've messed up something or made a mistake or didn't do well regarding the other person's perspective or feelings. So it really does pinpoint those moments for you. And then you go back and meet with that person. Hopefully. Or write them a letter or whatever it is.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. This is the ninth step in the program, which is like, clean up your records again so you don't have to walk around with shame. Because you can't afford to walk around with shame.

[Jenny Garth]

It's like a bucket. If you have a bucket full of water, and the water being all those moments where you messed up and you are beating yourself up over it and it's full, and you just have to put your foot right in it and let the water overflow. Because you will never get past it if you don't.

[Dax Shepard]

Let's talk about David. Because you also found a way to find love again. As you titled the chapter in the book. How did this one differ from previous ones?

[Jenny Garth]

It was weird. I was trying dating. I'd never done that. I didn't know what kind of guy I liked. I tried all different sizes and shapes and locations. Usually they were out of town, which was nice because I could come home and be a mommy. And then when I didn't have my kids, I would go try to date someone.

[Dax Shepard]

And if you have a hard time establishing boundaries, a geographical boundary helps.

[Jenny Garth]

Yes, definitely. I had really come through a lot of intense therapy at that point with my therapist, Wade. And I was feeling this freedom and this positive feeling of, like, I can handle everything now. And right when that happened, I met Dave. I built my house. And I was doing a photo shoot for the, like, unveiling of the house. Cause it was on hgtv. And I was thinking, like, this is the best. I'm here with my dogs, in my home, the way I want it. And that night, had a blind date with somebody. My friends at school had set me up. It was like a blind double date. That's when I met Dave.

[Dax Shepard]

Wow.

[Monica Padman]

I love it.

[Jenny Garth]

And I remember walking in because I didn't know who he was. So I did look him up on the Internet. I was busy all day, so I was like, help me look this guy up. And a Chippendales dancer came up with the same name.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, exciting.

[Jenny Garth]

So I texted my friend. I was like, he's not a Chippendales dancer.

[Monica Padman]

Right?

[Jenny Garth]

She's like, no. He didn't have a big footprint at all on the line. So I just kind of went into it blindly. And I walked in, he was this tall, handsome, actor looking guy. And I was like, oh, no, thank you. Bye. Bye. So, so completely detached the whole dinner, Just thinking, this is such a waste of my time, but trying to, you know, get through it. And then he made me laugh a few times. And women are a sucker for laughter. Thank God. Right. Because I didn't have laughter in my life. And I was like, oh, this feels really good. And I thought, I want this for my girls, too.

[Dax Shepard]

You didn't have joy in your life?

[Jenny Garth]

I didn't have joy in your life.

[Dax Shepard]

No light.

[Jenny Garth]

No. I was just plugging along, and he brought that to our household. I just fell in love with it and him.

[Monica Padman]

That's lovely.

[Jenny Garth]

We've been married for 10 years.

[Monica Padman]

Wow.

[Jenny Garth]

I call it nine because we did spend a year of separation when the sparkles faded again in the relationship after, like, that first year. When it's not what you thought it would be.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. Well, when the work is now required.

[Jenny Garth]

Yes.

[Dax Shepard]

And neither of you have experience or the confidence. Can I challenge this without being on?

[Jenny Garth]

And he had never been in a relationship like that. He all of a sudden had three stepchildren.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. It's a lot.

[Jenny Garth]

Four dogs. So he stepped into a big world. And we took a year off. We were getting divorced, actually. And we had the paperwork signed on my end. He hadn't signed it yet. And it was in a yellow envelope in the back of his truck. This truck that he bought after we broke up as, like, a sign of defi. Like this giant tundra. And he lived on the itty bitty streets in Silver Lake. And it was all scraped up and dented. He. He loved that truck. But he had the paperwork in the back of his car. I noticed it there months after we had gotten back together. And I was like, this has been in your car this whole time? He's like, yeah, I'm gonna keep it around. Cause it reminds him like, I have free will. Like, I cannot be in this relationship if I don't want to.

[Dax Shepard]

I choose to be in it.

[Jenny Garth]

Right. I think it helped him kind of come to terms with that. But he had a lot of growing to do. I had to go back to the drawing board because it was just like ripping a band aid off a real fresh wound.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. Were you like, oh, my God, again?

[Jenny Garth]

More attacking my own internally for what is wrong with you? And then the narrative in my mind had become and was really concreted was you are not able to have a healthy relationship. There's just something about you that you can't do it.

[Dax Shepard]

You're permanently flawed.

[Jenny Garth]

Okay. I guess that's me. And I'll just live that way.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, I'm defective.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah. Some people just can't do certain things. And maybe that's mine.

[Monica Padman]

How'd you get out of that therapy?

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah. It was after the. That divorce or separation slash Divorce that I went to Bali and started doing a lot more work right back into it. Like, I cannot let this derail me.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, you can't wake up in the hospital again.

[Jenny Garth]

And so I just started working right away and learned even more about myself during that time and really came to peace with what is and stopped trying to fight everything. And that combined with the Buddha classes that I was going to to really just brought me peace in whatever situation I ended up in. Like, it will all work out. You will be fine. Also, that opportunity to really connect with sounds so woo woo. But like that little girl inside of me, that little person that is so afraid and so like something's wrong with me and nobody can really love me. Nobody knows me. This person, I started to become her best friend again. Like I started to mother her like I did my own own daughters. And once I started to do that, I just felt at peace and capable of taking care of her, me, us.

[Dax Shepard]

Well. And in Buddhism, right, the suffering's coming from you trying to force a different reality than the one you're in. The reality is not actually that painful. It's the desire to have a different reality around you that is so uncomfortable,

[Jenny Garth]

Afraid of the unknown. Yeah, that's attachment. That's one of the core beliefs, is not having attachment. And you know, if you are full on Buddhist, you don't have attachment to any things. But in this modern world, they taught it in a way that there are certain things that it's okay to have and love and be so grateful that you have them. But then there are certain things that you're attaching to that are not benefiting you and sort of really deciphering what those are and learning how to unattach.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. Well, I choose me as the book and I think it's a very brave book. And I think a lot of people, like, even as you're saying right now, you felt like, how is this happening again? It must not be for me. When I interviewed my mom, I was like, it's so inconsistent with who you are to have been with a guy that was beating you up. How were you, this gangster of a woman with a guy that was beating you up repeatedly. And she said the thought of failing again was more painful. I couldn't accept failing again at this. And I think a lot of people, people relate to that for whatever reason,

[Jenny Garth]

the shame or the, the inevitable pain that you know you're going to go through.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. So for you to publicly put out your whole roadmap, I think is awesome and admirable. And I think it's great.

[Jenny Garth]

Thank you.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Jenny Garth]

I think that learning how to connect with other people, especially as an older woman, learning how to connect with other women has just brought me such a desire. Desire to keep doing that in hopes that someone sees themselves somewhere in my journey.

[Dax Shepard]

Yes. If someone comes up to you and they offer adoration to you because they wanted to be you on 90210 versus someone that comes up to you and is like, I have experienced the same thing as you. And I feel so seen and connected are two dramatically different things. They're the thing you wanted. They're substantive. They're not. You're a cute baby. They're. Your story has made me feel less alone.

[Jenny Garth]

Right. It made me feel seen, less alone. Because we just internalize everything as humans.

[Dax Shepard]

We think we're so uniquely terrible. It's like all of us are. All of us are an illusion if you think you know someone who's done it perfectly well. Jenny, great meeting you. Thanks for coming. Good luck with the book. Everyone get. I choose me. He is an armchair expert, but he makes mistakes all the time. Thank God Monica's here. She's gotta let him have the facts.

[Monica Padman]

I have a story.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, great.

[Monica Padman]

So this is like right after you left. So this was like two months ago.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay. I was going for a week just to be.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. But it feels like it was a really long time ago. Ana and Anna parked her car at my house. Okay. We were going to walk to Cara. But before we walked to Cara, we were going to drop something off at your house.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay. Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

So we stopped by your house. We're chit chatting. Kristen Delta. I. Oh, I dropped off a vintage shirt for Lincoln for her birthday. Birthday.

[Dax Shepard]

Which one was that?

[Monica Padman]

Willie Nelson.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Great. Great. Tea.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. And so then we asked if anyone wanted anything from Cara. Delta wanted a salad.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

The gems. Halid.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. So then we walked to Cara. Have a great time.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

Get the salad, walk back to your house to drop off the salad.

[Dax Shepard]

Everything's looking good.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. Well, so far. And. And it's like 8:35. I would say we'll drop off the salad. Deltas asleep. And so then we start walking to my house. Now, for the listener who doesn't know or remember, my house is 80ft. Yeah, I was going to say 15, but that's because I don't know measurements.

[Dax Shepard]

It's. You know, there's two options you can try. You can go down your driveway or you can go up the hill to where your front door is.

[Monica Padman]

Yes, exactly.

[Dax Shepard]

Probably equally distance, right? Yeah. But within a couple hundred feet.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. I mean it's so close.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

Okay, so we're walking. Oh and we have Mona. This is a big part of it. Mona is Anna's dog and pretty much dog.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. She looks like almost like a wolf.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. But like not a scary one.

[Dax Shepard]

Not a wolf like in the forest. Like a wolfhound.

[Monica Padman]

Right. Just. But like so like she's so nice. Nice and kind of dumb looking.

[Dax Shepard]

Like I love her and I'm, I'm not drawn to dogs so much but I'm like in love with her.

[Monica Padman]

Same. I like she's, she's a good. Yeah, I'm not gonna say, I'm not gonna say love. Anyway. Okay, so we're, we have Mona. We're walking back to my house and we see my nemesis coyote.

[Dax Shepard]

Coyote in the street corner.

[Monica Padman]

On the corner. Just looking, just looking at us. Okay.

[Dax Shepard]

I love to look.

[Monica Padman]

And I was like, okay, I know. I think you're supposed, you're supposed to just keep walking and look and be

[Dax Shepard]

not directly in the face go, what's up? Even just them hearing what's up.

[Monica Padman]

No, I don't want to talk to them.

[Dax Shepard]

It scares them.

[Monica Padman]

Okay. So I was like you're supposed to be non phased and just be like you own the streets.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. Yeah. Well you're six times the size.

[Monica Padman]

Oh no, no, it, no they're big and maybe not six, but I mean, I mean they're like my size. If I got down on all fours, they're my size. Anyway.

[Dax Shepard]

You're 100 pounds. They're, they're probably 40.

[Monica Padman]

40 pounds but they're all muscle, they're all hair. I'm mostly boot so I don't know what my chances are. Anyway, he was looking at us and I was like okay, I know we're supposed to keep going but and, and normally I'm scared and Anna's not scared of things but she was scared so this wasn't a good combo and she was really worried about Mona because coyote easy dogs much bigger than small dogs. Yeah. But still we were like getting, we were starting to get a little panicky.

[Dax Shepard]

We should add Mona's extremely beta.

[Monica Padman]

Exactly.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. Like, like Frank would have gone after, he would have lost but he would have gone after the coyote.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, yeah. And it's like what do you prefer? You know? I don't know.

[Dax Shepard]

I can tell you right now what I.

[Monica Padman]

Well so I was like, oh no, I don't know what to do. And I was like me there and we just were stuck standing still. And I was like, okay.

[Dax Shepard]

Like deer, they freeze.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

So you really look like prey because now you're frozen.

[Monica Padman]

Yep. The opposite thing of what you're supposed to do. And then I was like, okay. And I knew that I was like, we're not supposed to be like standing here like this. We gotta like. I don't. And I was like, let's go back. So we turned our back and kind of walked quickly back to your house. Okay. And. And then we just stood in that little. Well.

[Dax Shepard]

Uh huh.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. But the packages come.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. Where the package. We just stood there and I googled, what do you do when you come across a coyote? Basically, first thing it says is, don't stop, don't turn around, don't run. You know, everything we had just done.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

And I was like, fuck. And then it said, you know, be loud.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, sure.

[Monica Padman]

Throw rocks.

[Dax Shepard]

Absolutely. Yeah.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

But there were no stand throwing. So it's like you're a thing and all of a sudden you got projectiles.

[Monica Padman]

Okay, interesting. But they didn't.

[Dax Shepard]

I think you just yell at it. We have them on our street all the time. And that's all Natalie does. She just.

[Monica Padman]

It was dark.

[Dax Shepard]

I know, but they're white.

[Monica Padman]

You don't understand.

[Jenny Garth]

You've never been.

[Dax Shepard]

Natalie's not white.

[Jenny Garth]

Oh yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

They're city coyotes.

[Monica Padman]

I forgot about that. Okay, so. Okay, so it's like throw rocks that. We didn't see any rocks. But it was like, be loud. Loud. I was like, okay, so we'll just. And we're starting to like, get unhinged. Like our ideas were bad, you know, I was like, okay, I'll just put on this podcast. It'll be loud. Okay. And I'll turn on my flashlight on my phone. So turn on my flashlight, turn on the podcast. I'm listening. Which is Aaron and Sarah's podcast. Aaron Foster and Sarah Foster's podcast that I've become kind of weirdly obsessed with. She's just like turned it on. And it's just their voices, like, you know, know, talking normal. It wasn't that loud.

[Dax Shepard]

I don't want to be critical, but when choosing a podcast, maybe like, go Rogan. I mean, now's the time for the manosphere.

[Monica Padman]

I agree. I agree. Aggression. But it's just, he's like two ladies, you know, and sound delicious. Yeah. These like attractive women. And so I'm just like walking, holding it. And I real. You know, we're three steps in and we look up three coyotes.

[Dax Shepard]

Now they've Gremlin on you.

[Monica Padman]

He got his friends. He said, oh, I have the per. These. These girls will not stand a chance.

[Dax Shepard]

Easy pickings. But I'm gonna need help because this is too much for me to eat. Yeah. Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

And they just stood there staring at us. It was so scary. So then we really. We turn, and we ran back to your house. Like, we spray.

[Dax Shepard]

You should have hung baloney on your back while you were running.

[Monica Padman]

I mean, we were from cars. Like, we probably smelled like food.

[Dax Shepard]

I'm sure. Yummy.

[Monica Padman]

So we run back to the house, and this time, we run into the house, and I say, mom, we don't. We don't know what to do. And she said, I'll. I'll go with you guys. And then Lincoln popped up from the couch, said, I want to go.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, yeah. She get her numcha.

[Monica Padman]

She's very you in that way. She really wanted to be part of the bravery. Yes, exactly. And I was like, no, no, no. And you know, too, because then you have to walk back by yourself. I don't want that. And. And so the solution I came up with was to take Kristin's car, drive it to my house. The problem is, I don't like driving other people's cars.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh.

[Monica Padman]

So then we drove Kristin's car to my house. I got in my car, followed Kristin's car back. Ana drove Kristin's car back to your house, and I followed to drop off her car. And then Ana got in again.

[Dax Shepard]

A reminder to the listener, 100ft.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. And then Ana got in my car, we drove back to my house, and she got in her car.

[Dax Shepard]

This became the fairy riddle.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, it's a riddle.

[Dax Shepard]

You got some chickens, you got a fox, a bag of grain.

[Monica Padman]

I know.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

So it all worked out.

[Jenny Garth]

And then.

[Monica Padman]

And then I got home, and I. I panic. Bought so much stuff, so I bought wolf pee.

[Dax Shepard]

That's a deterrent that you're gonna put where, around your doorstep?

[Monica Padman]

I think around my front, but I don't want it to smell bad. Exactly.

[Dax Shepard]

As opposed to going like, hey, what's up? Like, your options. Your options are scatter urine all over the place or go, hey, what's up?

[Monica Padman]

I just don't think they're gonna do to me what they haven't tried.

[Dax Shepard]

I can't conclude that yet.

[Monica Padman]

If I try it and I get eaten, what are you. How are you gonna feel?

[Dax Shepard]

You. You cannot find me a story of an adult, Rob.

[Monica Padman]

Look it up.

[Dax Shepard]

An adult getting eaten.

[Monica Padman]

A female, 5ft, brown, at night. Okay.

[Dax Shepard]

By a coyote. Specifically, yeah, go ahead and Indian, but college educated.

[Monica Padman]

Indian. Don't put college educated. Don't you put that small, high, wealthy, high voice. Because maybe it won't care if I say what's up.

[Dax Shepard]

There was a 2009 case, but that was the last. What happened? In 2009, Taylor was hiking in the national park. She was attacked by two coyotes and died from injuries and blood loss.

[Jenny Garth]

Oh.

[Monica Padman]

Oh, my God. Oh, my God.

[Dax Shepard]

Having you look this up.

[Monica Padman]

Oh, my God. 2009, I graduated college, so that's sim.

[Dax Shepard]

It does say it is extremely rare.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, but I don't care. I don't want to be the one. My life is very rare. I've had really rare. Good.

[Dax Shepard]

I wonder if she's taking a nap.

[Monica Padman]

This is the.

[Dax Shepard]

It's the only confirmed case of an adult human being killed by coyotes. The only is this woman.

[Monica Padman]

I don't. I'm very special.

[Dax Shepard]

In the woods, taking a nap with.

[Monica Padman]

She's not taking that. Don't you say that about her.

[Dax Shepard]

Snacks.

[Monica Padman]

Rest in peace.

[Dax Shepard]

Anyway, anywho, I'm sorry you got spooked like that.

[Monica Padman]

Oh, my God. So then I bought the wolf pee. I bought some air horns. Turned out. I bought too many. I bought like, nine. I don't know how that happened.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

And then I bought.

[Dax Shepard]

You're good at flashlight, but you're bad at Amazon. It's interesting.

[Monica Padman]

I don't know what happened. I got flashlight. Flashlights. A little one that goes on my keychain. I got. And I got this really mean wolf mask thing that I think you put on your fence, and it has lights, and it, like, looks really scary.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay. Did you think of getting one for yourself to wear? That's what I thought she was saying. Gonna be in her purse. And she was gonna. So I was thinking, like, why would you have the gumption with a mask on? To be aggressive.

[Monica Padman]

Well, I would if it's like a scary wolf with it's like scary red eyes. A flash.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay. But I think what's scary is that you are three feet above them.

[Monica Padman]

I'm like one foot up, but they're tall.

[Dax Shepard]

I'm like. I think we're seeing different things out of our eyes.

[Monica Padman]

Think of how tall they are. Average coyote, two feet. Okay, then I am three feet taller. Yeah, but they know. They have instincts.

[Dax Shepard]

Well, they do know you're scared of them. Yeah, you've made that clear.

[Monica Padman]

I am scared. I am scared.

[Dax Shepard]

But I don't know if this is one of these situations where you don't really. You're not. You're not looking for any advice or anything. Well, because here's what I'll say is you can't not be scared of them by just thinking about it. Right. That'll never happen. You're going to be thinking about.

[Monica Padman]

Exactly.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

You can't think your way out of being scared of.

[Monica Padman]

Yes. Correct.

[Dax Shepard]

But I promise you, and I know for sure, if you can one time run at them and scream, they will run. And then you will know permanently. Oh, yeah. That's how I can do that. So it's either we gotta try that or we gotta be afraid. They're in the neighborhood. There's a ton of coyotes in our neighborhood.

[Monica Padman]

I know.

[Dax Shepard]

Have you heard them go berserk yet?

[Jenny Garth]

Yes.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. They go. It sounds like they're having a Sam or like. Or like a. Yeah. Devil worshiping orgy. It'll be like, who wouldn't be scared of that? Seems like 15 or 20 of them. And they're. The noises they're making. It makes laughing hyenas sound inviting.

[Monica Padman]

It's really bad.

[Dax Shepard]

And you wonder, are they eating an old lady? That's what you wonder when you're in your room. It's only happened once ever. Yeah, you wonder.

[Monica Padman]

Record it.

[Dax Shepard]

You Wonder, was it 2009 when you hear that?

[Monica Padman]

I don't like them at all. Your hair looks like it's getting longer.

[Dax Shepard]

It is. I'm growing it out.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah?

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. What do we think? It's in the crazy phase. You sure?

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. So your thing's working.

[Dax Shepard]

What's that?

[Jenny Garth]

You're.

[Dax Shepard]

You're topical.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Does it look thick? Well, I mean, long doesn't equal thick. Right. Kind. It would have always grown long. Just how dense would it have been as it was growing long?

[Monica Padman]

I guess I think it.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. I'll tell you, every guy I know has seen this. This probably hasn't reached your algorithm. No, that's. That's hair transplants.

[Monica Padman]

Right.

[Dax Shepard]

There's a uc like I keep seeing this goddamn meme on Instagram and apparently you see a like has a full on topical cure for baldness that what completely wakes up all dormant follicles.

[Jenny Garth]

Really?

[Dax Shepard]

Yes. I was talking to another person with they. They had long hair. And I was saying, I'm growing my hair out. It's going to be hard.

[Monica Padman]

Right.

[Dax Shepard]

Were you wearing hats? Blah blah. And I wouldn't have even thought this about him because his hair looks very robust somehow. This UCLA thing, I go, have you heard about. And he goes, the UCLA thing? I go, yeah. I go, yeah. How do I get in the trial he goes, I look looked into it.

[Monica Padman]

Can you.

[Dax Shepard]

There were like 500,000 applicants for a trial of like 200 people or something crazy. Every single guy was like, I need in on this trial. But apparently it's. It's like, it works. And now I'm just waiting.

[Monica Padman]

Do you think that you should be able to jump the line because you went there?

[Dax Shepard]

I think there's a lot of reasons I should jump the line.

[Monica Padman]

Okay.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay. I'm a tall white male and I'm totally disenfranchised. And it's time that I get a little legal together.

[Monica Padman]

But really, you went there? I kind of think alumni should kind of get a leg up.

[Dax Shepard]

I mean, I'm obsessed with this. Not only do I want the product, but I gotta figure out how to be an investor in it before it goes anyways.

[Monica Padman]

Interesting.

[Dax Shepard]

So you've never seen that, right?

[Monica Padman]

No.

[Dax Shepard]

UCLA invents. Exactly. And every single guy I've brought it up to has seen it.

[Monica Padman]

Right.

[Dax Shepard]

Well, the algorithms are so good.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

They really know.

[Monica Padman]

It probably works for women too. Women.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. It's not like you guys have unique follicles that can't be woken up from dormancy.

[Monica Padman]

Although I'm having the opposite situation.

[Dax Shepard]

Too much.

[Monica Padman]

I think I'm having new hair growth.

[Dax Shepard]

Like, what do you think is coming down?

[Monica Padman]

Like a werewolf, not like a coyote.

[Dax Shepard]

Maybe you have to start shaving.

[Monica Padman]

No. The other day I was like looking in the mirror and I was like, what is this poof of hair that's just like. It's just like sticking out. And I asked a hairstylist and she was like, I think it might be new hair growth. And I was like, new hair growth. That makes no sense.

[Dax Shepard]

That makes no sense.

[Jenny Garth]

Sense, but.

[Dax Shepard]

Because the only thing different in your life is that you're on triz.

[Monica Padman]

Do you think creatine.

[Dax Shepard]

Wouldn't it be even on creating for like four minutes? Right. Like, but. But I wouldn't even be surprised if you had another off label observation of tirzepatide is. Oh, by the way, it makes your hair grow back. Because every single thing you read is, like, positive.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, maybe. I don't know. But I don't really get your teeth whiter.

[Dax Shepard]

You're not looking for more hair.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

You're in a unique position.

[Monica Padman]

I know. And I don't want it to have a little puff like this. That looks weird.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. It's hard to style.

[Monica Padman]

It's like when people are pregnant, often this happens. Like, they lose a lot of hair and then when it grows, it's like, grows back and it's like in little patches. It looks kind of weird.

[Dax Shepard]

Uhhuh.

[Monica Padman]

I mean, it looks great, but, you know, good save.

[Dax Shepard]

Really good save. It's as if he didn't say, even say weird.

[Monica Padman]

So. Yeah. So I. Yeah. Ha. Okay. Well, would you ever consider going to Turkey and getting new hair? I mean, you don't need it.

[Dax Shepard]

I don't think. I don't think I need to do that.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, but if you went. If you were like, oh, fuck, like, it's going.

[Dax Shepard]

You know, this is a great topic. I mean, I. There's a. There's a lot of battles happening in my head, and I think they're age related and so. And I think I spoke on it a little bit with when Zach Braff was here year, which is like 85% of the time I'm like, yeah, we're getting older. And I mean, you look fine.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Maybe your hair's thinner and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Maybe you have more wrinkles. 85% of the time I feel that way.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

And then 15% of the time I can make a very solid argument. And here's how the argument goes. I use whitening toothpaste. I want my teeth to be white. I use moisturizer on my skin. I put drops in my eyes so they're white before I. I'm on camera. I do all this stuff.

[Jenny Garth]

Stuff.

[Dax Shepard]

So why am I drawing this arbitrary line between. I wouldn't do this. I mean, I am vain. It's not like I'm not vain.

[Monica Padman]

Right.

[Dax Shepard]

And then I go. And I have the means to. So what do we do? Like, what's the hang up?

[Monica Padman]

Right.

[Dax Shepard]

And then I go back to like, I don't give a. And I think it's cool.

[Monica Padman]

It's cool to not give a. Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

And I think. I think even specifically for men, probably, it's probably a better look in general.

[Monica Padman]

I mean, I want everyone to do what they want, but it's not weird.

[Dax Shepard]

If you.

[Monica Padman]

Not weird, it's great. But I agree that there's something, like, cool, attractive about not about someone not caring that much. I mean, caring like putting yourself, like,

[Dax Shepard]

not smelling like, together.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. Oh, ding, ding, ding. I want to bring up something.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay, you smell right now.

[Monica Padman]

And. And so, yeah, I'm kind of. I'm with you on that.

[Dax Shepard]

Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert if you dare. We are supported by hp. My mental to do list is already full. Fix something around the house. Refill prescriptions. Remember to text someone back. Keep track of a million little Life things. The last thing I want on that list is, oh, don't forget printer ink.

[Monica Padman]

No, it's horrible.

[Dax Shepard]

It's the bane of everyone's existence. What if you could just take that off your list for years?

[Monica Padman]

The dream.

[Dax Shepard]

That's the idea behind the HP Smart Tank printer from America's most trusted printer brand. Instead of those tiny, tiny cartridges that always seem to run out at the worst time, the HP Smart Tank uses a refillable ink tank. And it comes with up to three years of ink included. It's built to be simple, the easiest tank printer you'll ever use with the best print quality, period. It's the last printer you'll ever need. I've definitely been in this situation where something that should take two minutes turns into a whole thing. Like I need to print tickets and get out the door. But then I realize I'm out of ink and have to deal with it right then. With the HP Smart Tank, that's just not something you're dealing with all the time. It's one of those things that just works when you need it to. If you want to take one more thing off your mental to do list, search for HP Smart Tank.

[Monica Padman]

Would you rather this is back to the poop? I mean the smelling, like, okay, okay. Do you think it's great, grosser to not? Well, I think I know how you're gonna feel, but try to be objective. I guess. Do you think it's grosser to be with someone who never gets their teeth cleaned? Never. Or has skin marks?

[Dax Shepard]

Well, we need some fa. I need some follow up.

[Monica Padman]

Okay, okay. Okay. Okay.

[Dax Shepard]

Is their mouth like a rat's nest or does it look complete? Is it mine? Because I don't go to the dentist. You know, I know this the wrong person.

[Monica Padman]

I know, but I wanted to.

[Jenny Garth]

OK.

[Dax Shepard]

But two times in 20 years.

[Monica Padman]

I know that that is wild. But also I too don't get my teeth cleaned enough.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. And they look great. So it's like there's nothing about your mouth that I'm going, yuck.

[Monica Padman]

Right.

[Dax Shepard]

But if you had shit marks all the time in your unders, Right. I'd be like, gross man, wipe your hiney.

[Monica Padman]

Exactly. Okay, so I'm with Jess, obviously. And he, I don't know. Oh, he spilled chocolate ice cream everywhere. Right. And it looked disgusting.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

And he said it looked like skidmet. And I said, do you get skid marks?

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

And he said a lot less.

[Dax Shepard]

A lot less.

[Monica Padman]

I just said, no, no, no. The answer should be no, I don't.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

And he said, well, no, like, I said let. I said let. I was like, I know, but you shouldn't. You shouldn't have any.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay. I'm gonna. I'm gonna try my hardest. Um, I'm not gonna say who this is, but you'll know. But I have a friend who has. He'll. He'll say, dude, I put the bar of soap up my asshole. Like, I clean my asshole so thoroughly in the shower.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

And then I get out and I dry off, and then I can wipe my butt. And there'll be. And so I don't know about, like, if that's not my scenario. Right. I don't have, like, I guess, a leaky keister.

[Monica Padman]

I know.

[Dax Shepard]

Thank God. I mean, there's so many things to be grateful for that we're. That we should be all day long.

[Jenny Garth]

It's true.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. I'm not leaking sewage.

[Monica Padman]

Thank God.

[Dax Shepard]

Thank God.

[Monica Padman]

I know.

[Dax Shepard]

So it's not weird.

[Monica Padman]

It's. It's not weird. It's great.

[Dax Shepard]

It's very attractive.

[Monica Padman]

Then he came back. His retort was like, well, you don't get your teeth cleaned.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

He felt a little defensive, understandably. Sure.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

But you. Oh. Because I guess Anna and I recently had said, like, yeah, we, like, barely get our teeth. Go to the dentist.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

And he goes to the dentist regularly.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

And for real cleaning. And you should go like, look, you should go to the dentist. Right.

[Dax Shepard]

Everyone will put in the comments. Brain infection. We know. We know, we know.

[Monica Padman]

And heart disease. Like, yes.

[Dax Shepard]

Infectious. We know. 80% of diseases emanate from the mouth.

[Monica Padman]

That's right.

[Dax Shepard]

Got it.

[Monica Padman]

That's. They do. We should be getting our teeth cleaned every six months, and we're not doing it. And so for him, he was like, that's worse. And he said. He said, that's worse. That's more disgusting.

[Dax Shepard]

Wow.

[Monica Padman]

So I didn't know where everyone landed. I mean, I did feel like you probably were on my side about this.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

Because you also don't get your teeth cleaned and you don't need skid marks.

[Dax Shepard]

Nothing really bums me out, as you know.

[Monica Padman]

Sure. Yeah. You're down with anything.

[Dax Shepard]

I'm pretty much down with everything. But if you saw a big skid mark.

[Monica Padman]

I can't.

[Dax Shepard]

As you were taking someone's garments off.

[Monica Padman]

I know.

[Dax Shepard]

Just before you were perhaps going to be down there. Be down there.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

You know, I don't know. Is that. Is that what you want to see immediately, before you might go, let's reschedule this portion of it.

[Monica Padman]

Oh, my God.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, okay. Okay. That one. One question I had that I was excited to hear about was. So we were gone for, I guess, five days. They were. I was gone for longer. I was in Austin. You're Mark that you and Anna were neighbors?

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

So Anna was staying here at the. The house?

[Monica Padman]

Yes.

[Dax Shepard]

What was that like to be neighbors?

[Monica Padman]

She didn't come over.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, my God.

[Monica Padman]

I didn't go over.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, what?

[Monica Padman]

I know. I think.

[Dax Shepard]

What's wrong with you guys?

[Monica Padman]

No, no, she had family in town.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, she did?

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. That was the whole. She had.

[Dax Shepard]

She planned a big family reunion at my house while.

[Monica Padman]

Oh. Oh, my God. I'm not. She's gonna be, like, angry at me.

[Jenny Garth]

That

[Monica Padman]

I'm sure. I think.

[Jenny Garth]

I'm sure.

[Monica Padman]

She asked Kristen. And anyway, the. She had two cousins in town, and so she had, like, plans with them, and so she didn't. And like, one day I was outside in my. On my beautiful deck, and Jess was there, and we FaceTimed her, and I was like, come over. Like, bring your. Just come over.

[Dax Shepard]

Bring your whole family reunion.

[Monica Padman]

We're, like, gonna get in the. I'm like, what? And then Jess was like, well, we could go over there and. And then I said. Said I don't. I don't want to go over there when. When Dax and Kristen aren't there. I feel kind of weird about it for some reason. And so then we just never saw each other. He's funny.

[Dax Shepard]

You'd say that. Because I remembered I wanted to ask you about this on the. This program.

[Jenny Garth]

Oh, okay.

[Dax Shepard]

I want to see, like, what was, like, being neighbors. Was it fun?

[Monica Padman]

Right? No.

[Dax Shepard]

And then I. When I. I was. I knew I wanted to ask that. It sounds fun because you guys have hang so much, right? Yeah. And then I thought, what if she came over and went in the sauna?

[Monica Padman]

You'd be mad.

[Dax Shepard]

Then I was like, yeah, I think I've invited you, like, five times to come in the sauna, and you have it. And then I go out of town, and then Anna invites you, and then you go. That crossed my mind.

[Monica Padman]

I was like, oh, my God, I

[Dax Shepard]

might feel, like, a little hurt. Like, oh, you're not gonna come over when I invite you, but when Anna invites you, you go over.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, well, I didn't.

[Dax Shepard]

Right. Like, what if you had invited. Invited me over for breakfast like, five times at your house? I don't. I can't go for all these reasons. And then Aaron's staying at your house, and he invites me over for breakfast. I'm like, yeah, I'll be there in five.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, right. No, I don't actually know if I would. Because it'd be one thing if I never came over here. I come over here. I'm here every day. Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

So, you know, I think that's a little different maybe because if you came over to my house all the time, but you just weren't coming over for breakfast, and then Aaron was staying at my house and he invited you for breakfast, I think I'd be like, oh, well, it just worked out timing wise.

[Dax Shepard]

But also you have. Somehow breakfast has to include, like, I got a brand new, very special breakfast nook. Like, I got a very. And I love how social it can be.

[Monica Padman]

Oh, okay, I'll call her.

[Dax Shepard]

And then you don't come. And then. And then I leave. And then you're like, hey, you call on. And you're like, dude, I'm dying to go.

[Monica Padman]

I've been dying.

[Dax Shepard]

I just finally Dax is gone.

[Monica Padman]

So let's know, like, okay, let's pull back the curtain. I feel like you guys can invite me over way more

[Dax Shepard]

maybe just not the sauna.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. You know, you just don't want to invite me. You only invite me over to sauna.

[Dax Shepard]

And it's like, that's all I do.

[Monica Padman]

Right. But it's like, that's so sweaty.

[Dax Shepard]

I can tell you my evenings exact, just like my breakfast and morning. You know, my. My evening is the exact same every single night. I sauna at 5 o', clock, I cold plunge, I get in the hot tub with the girls, I hear about their day, then we have dinner, we watch TV and go to bed. So the only time to be social in that scenario is the big sauna block.

[Monica Padman]

I guess. You can invite me over for dinner.

[Dax Shepard]

You could come over for dinner. That makes a lot of sense. That's. That's very traditional, actually.

[Monica Padman]

I mean, like, I guess TV.

[Dax Shepard]

TV's in bed, which we're already at capacity. We go into the room.

[Monica Padman]

Fine.

[Dax Shepard]

I don't need to do four of us in the one bed. It's already a little tight.

[Monica Padman]

I get it.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. So you guys never hung up. That's the point. And that's interesting.

[Monica Padman]

I definitely didn't go in the sauna. Do not worry. Do not worry about that. And I'll come over to sauna. I just, you know, I just don't like the sauna. Well, I do like it. There's a couple of hurdles. One, you have to be in a bathing suit in the sauna.

[Dax Shepard]

You could wear full. You could wear this outfit. You don't sweat it. You could. You actually have the freedom to wear anything in the sauna. Sweat.

[Monica Padman]

Well, I do sweat in the sauna. It's actually the only place I sweat. It's why I do enjoy it. I do feel good after because I've sweat. Yeah, but you have to wear a bathing suit, and that means you have to be, well, kempt.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay. And you won't kempt. Is that you don't want to kempt.

[Jenny Garth]

Well.

[Monica Padman]

Okay. Kempting is tricky because I don't like to shave. It's like, all. That's, like, not.

[Jenny Garth]

Let me make a pitch.

[Dax Shepard]

Can I make a pitch?

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Bathing suit, boxers, shorts.

[Monica Padman]

Oh, that's, like, so ugly, but. Oh. I mean, it's great.

[Dax Shepard]

It looks great. And if that's how you like the sauna, you're even hotter for it. All right. Can I tell you the other tension in my head?

[Monica Padman]

Oh, yeah, sure.

[Dax Shepard]

So that's one battle's waging the. My aging.

[Monica Padman]

Okay.

[Dax Shepard]

85% of the time. Who cares? Let's go. Bring on the wrinkles.

[Monica Padman]

Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Bring on the thinning here. 15% of the time. Let's throw everything we can at this. Let's get a facelift. Let's do it all.

[Monica Padman]

Okay.

[Dax Shepard]

I know. That's like 15% time.

[Monica Padman]

I know.

[Dax Shepard]

Anyways, the other tension, and this is. I don't really. I don't know where. This is so confusing to me. When I'm in Nashville, I'm so happy.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

I can't tell you. It will make no sense to you, but I cannot tell you the amount of joy I get from doing stupid tasks around the yard.

[Monica Padman]

That's great.

[Dax Shepard]

And in the garage and with the cars and the boat, like, I'm just so. And. But I'm not, like. It's all useless. Right. It's just like. I mean, it's not important. It's just, like. It's just me staying busy.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. And gardening is good for, like. Oh, brain.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. It's good for me for sure. Because, like, just to be moving and

[Monica Padman]

doing and there's, like, studies on that.

[Dax Shepard]

I accomplish little things, and I feel good about it. And then I stroll. Like, I really am becoming friends with my neighbor Nate, who I really like a lot.

[Monica Padman]

Right.

[Dax Shepard]

And so, like, I'll stroll over to his house, or he'll stroll over, or. This was my favorite part of the whole trip. His boat was stuck. His boat is on a lift that comes so you can take it out of the water at night and he lowered it, and our lake is a little low right now, so when he lowered it on the lift, it wasn't floating. He couldn't get it off of his lift, and he wanted to take it in for service.

[Monica Padman]

Okay.

[Dax Shepard]

And I. I said, how about I hook up my pontoon and see if I can jerk you out of that? Well, that sounded weird.

[Monica Padman]

Jerk.

[Dax Shepard]

You can have me jerk you off. Lift.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

And he was like, no wonder you like him.

[Dax Shepard]

He's like, I don't. Yeah. You think it'll break the. And I'm like, it wouldn't be fun if there wasn't some plausible threat of me ruining something. So, sure enough, hooked up some ropes, punched it on the pontoon, and pulled the boat right off the thing. Glorious. What? I mean, again. What? Nothing. That's not productive. And I felt like a champion.

[Monica Padman]

You helped someone.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, but I'm just saying, like, it's not productive in the traditional sense. It's just like, I got someone's boat off a thing. But it was like, I. We didn't know if it would work. I had to improvise. It was all very rewarding.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

I loved it. So, yeah. I stroll over there, I chat with him. I'm like, oh, I'm gonna drive my dirt bike around the yard. I remember dirt bike. For I am so happy. Happy. And then I go, what am I supposed to do in life?

[Monica Padman]

Okay.

[Dax Shepard]

Am I supposed to work till 70 or am I supposed to hang out and do that? And I don't know. Yeah, it's a. I mean, it's a blessing. What a enormous blessing that I could get to even.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Evaluate that.

[Monica Padman]

Yes.

[Dax Shepard]

But it's an interesting.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Thing where it's like. Well, I also love. I come back here, and I love what we're doing right now, and I love interviewing people. And that's really, really fun.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

And being productive is fun. And being engaged is fun.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

But, man, that's really fun.

[Monica Padman]

I know.

[Dax Shepard]

And, like, at some point in your life, you gotta decide. I think.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. You gotta decide.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

I. You'll know.

[Dax Shepard]

I guess I'll.

[Monica Padman]

I think you'll just know.

[Dax Shepard]

I don't know if I'll know. I think you just have to commit to one thing or the other.

[Monica Padman]

I don't know about that.

[Dax Shepard]

You don't know.

[Monica Padman]

Okay, I'll tell you. I had the complete opposite situation.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, tell me.

[Monica Padman]

You were gone. And then. Then also before you were gone, we had a light week. Very light week. And then you were gone. So we've had, like, two oh, two weeks of like kind of not doing a lot y. And yeah, I still have to edit. There's meeting, whatever. There's things. But the actual like us doing this wasn't really happening. And you know, I've been just like listening to this other podcast nonstop. But at one point I was like, oh my God, like, we have to get back, back to work. I cannot do this. Like. And I was also in meetings. Like, we were pit.

[Jenny Garth]

We're.

[Monica Padman]

I'm in pitches and we had a ton of those. And at first I was like so annoyed. I was like, oh, I was supposed to have the week off. Like, I shouldn't be. I shouldn't have scheduled any of this stuff. And then like, thank God I did because I don't. I need to be working. Like, I just am not good without that.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Monica Padman]

So.

[Dax Shepard]

But if you had gotten a part time job while I was. Was gone.

[Monica Padman]

You saw me at Mar. Saw me at Maru.

[Dax Shepard]

I don't know if this is a. I can't. I don't know if this is. Well, you could tell me you lived in Atlanta.

[Monica Padman]

I lived in the suburbs, though.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, that's true. What I'll say is in 30 years in LA, it might be a. I don't know. I was very friendly with my neighbors in the one bedroom apartment for 10 years. We were very close together and we saw each other in the stairwell all the time.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

I went to the birthday parties every. But since I've owned a home. So since 2006, 20 years of living in LA, in a home, neighbors here, everyone has a fence.

[Monica Padman]

Everyone has a fence in here.

[Dax Shepard]

Which I'll be. I can defend. Like I was talking about fences with people in Nashville and they're like, just in general there. It's rude. Which I get. It's like, it just seems rude.

[Monica Padman]

It's also different.

[Dax Shepard]

Yes. My argument in defense of it is like we're so packed in. You'd have to take all of Nashville and smash it in to like, you know, for not the square mile thing.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

So when you don't have any space. Yeah. You want a little compartment where you feel anonymous or not, where you don't see people.

[Monica Padman]

Right.

[Dax Shepard]

I think so this stress of the city kind of brings.

[Monica Padman]

City brings that out different. Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Yes. It's just so different.

[Monica Padman]

It's like it's completely different.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. And, and, and I love, like, I already love some of my neighbors in Nashville and I think it's so interesting.

[Monica Padman]

But I do think what's interesting is like you can have that here especially, Especially here. This neighborhood isn't. Is as close as you can get to that.

[Dax Shepard]

LA is not very neighborly. I'll just say that like it's not like, it's not like I'm sitting it out and everyone else is in the streets chatting. That's not the truth. I'd say I'm even maybe the high water mark in the neighborhood. Like I am chatting with Pari and I, you know.

[Jenny Garth]

Right.

[Dax Shepard]

And I'm starting a hayride thing, you know. But it's not a neighborhood. Neighborly city.

[Monica Padman]

It's not a neighborly city, but I actually think this neighborhood is fairly neighborly. So much. So this doesn't sound good for me, but I went on a long walk yesterday. Uploads feel, you know, I went like around, not in the neighborhood. I went out and when I was coming back I was like, which entrance do I go in so that I don't see anyone.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, wow.

[Monica Padman]

I didn't want to see anyone. That moment I knew. I knew I was going to and I did.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

And so like, you know, like I actually think this neighborhood I like I've seen Casey, front of the pod, My new friends, Pari. I saw Pari the other day and then he, he was, it was really cute. I was walking, I saw him, we chatted. And then when I was continuing, I saw him. He was inside somebody else's house. Like he was hanging out with.

[Dax Shepard]

He's very neighborly.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. And my neighbor, my actual neighbor talked to them yesterday. Like it's. I feel like people are.

[Dax Shepard]

So here's my, like my question, but I guess I already have an answer because Aaron lives in a pretty liberal neighborhood and his neighbors are very commingling and no one has fences and everyone's in everyone's backyard.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

But there's only two things I can observe that I know specifically. One is it's conservative there and it's liberal here. That's like one thing I know about the differences from where I'm at in Nashville and where. And then it's more rural versus city.

[Monica Padman]

I think it's more that.

[Dax Shepard]

And it's funny because those two things are related in general. Like cities are more liberal than rural and I just don't know which thing is which. And I'm curious.

[Monica Padman]

I think that's why the suburbs are a good thing to look at because they're not rural and they're not city. They're like so specific. And normally you do know like a couple neighbors and they're, they're A nice

[Dax Shepard]

middle ground too, I think, of super conservative and super liberal suburbs.

[Monica Padman]

It's like more. Yeah. I would say when you're in the.

[Dax Shepard]

Depending on when you're in the country, in the farm, you're very Republican.

[Monica Padman]

Yes.

[Dax Shepard]

And when you're in downtown New York City, you're very Democrat.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, you're very. Yeah, probably. And. And then. Yeah. You kind of maybe don't know as much when you're in the suburbs. So it depends on where you are, obviously. But. Yeah, like, my county where I grew up is a blue count went blue.

[Dax Shepard]

Right.

[Monica Padman]

So. Yeah. Anyway. And you know, like, some of your neighbors kind of, but not the Padmans weren't dialed in. Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

But were you seen as you drove through your neighborhood, like a bunch of other neighbors in someone else's garage, or do you see them congregating together there you were trying not to be seen.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, not really. Like my very, very first house when I was a baby.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

My dad. I feel like people would do that a little more and like, my dad would hang out with the neighbor a little bit, but not. It's also. If you have kids, it's different.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

Kids definitely go hang out with friends in the neighborhood and then that starts that thing, you know? So like. Like my. One of my best friends who lives in Georgia lives in a suburb and like, her kids go next door and they come. So, like. Yes. If there's kids involved. Yeah, yeah, I think that.

[Dax Shepard]

But that doesn't happen at all in la. I mean, virtually at all. I don't know anyone in our pod whose kids hang out at a neighbor's house.

[Monica Padman]

Well, no, Erica's. Erica's kids go down the street to the next neighbor's house.

[Dax Shepard]

Do they?

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. And then, like, they sometimes all come over to her.

[Dax Shepard]

The Richardson's don't and the Hansens don't and we don't. Calvin's got a friend down the street.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

He does some people and he walks over there.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

That's great.

[Monica Padman]

I think it just depends. Yeah, I think it depends. But also, you know, what's a big part of it? I'm just putting two and two together. Schools a lot in the suburbs. You're on the school bus to get. Like, everyone's going to public school.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Monica Padman]

So the kids in the neighborhood go to the same school.

[Dax Shepard]

Yes.

[Monica Padman]

And then they come and they hang out with each other and stuff and

[Dax Shepard]

they take a bike ride.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. Like hang. I mean, I used to. In my neighborhood. My best friend Ashley lived in the neighborhood and we hung out every day and I walked to her house every day. And like we went to this other girl can.

[Dax Shepard]

Great.

[Monica Padman]

I think that's. I loved it. Yeah, it's great. But it's a result of the school bus in school. Like it's. The problem is not problem. But some people go to all different schools.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Monica Padman]

So scattered.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. I don't have any judgment over either side or think. But I will say I do think it's nicer to be neighborly. As I've experienced it. I think that's preferred. And you just. The little ways we're looking out for each other. Like there was a dog death.

[Jenny Garth]

Oh.

[Dax Shepard]

Of a. Of a very good friend's dog. I get a text, hey, is it cool if we bury the dog on your property? Of course we're going to dig a hole. And now I'm going, that's not going to happen.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

It's all granite. Like, we had to blast. You have to blast anything. Like if you're going to put a pool and you got to blast granite, it's just all granite. So I'm like, yeah, go ahead. And in my mind I'm like, they're not going to be able to dig a hole out there, but I'm not going to get in the way of this. Their morning. I'm staying out of it.

[Monica Padman]

Okay.

[Dax Shepard]

And then sure enough, they went over to bury the dog and they had some picks and stuff and they were working for quite a while. And then my buddy Nate, whose boat I pulled off, he saw what was going on.

[Monica Padman]

Oh. And he went to hell.

[Dax Shepard]

He's in construction.

[Monica Padman]

Oh, that's nice.

[Dax Shepard]

And he had little front end loader.

[Monica Padman]

That's very nice.

[Dax Shepard]

And then he said, can you guys want me to bring the machine over? And. And he did. He spent a bunch of time digging a hole.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. That's very sweet.

[Dax Shepard]

It's like, it's so lovely. And then, you know, he can't get his boat off and I'm there and I say, hey, you want me? Like, I just. It's very beautiful. It's very nice.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, I think it's really nice. Yeah, I do.

[Dax Shepard]

I like it.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. I. I don't think it can't be that way here. I just think it's not. Not as. It's not as set up.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. Like, I'm not trying to say, oh, people in LA are bad, or liberals are bad. I. I'm. I'm just curious on what forces create these different outcomes. That. That interests me.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

And I like this outcome.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

Well, you can also have a bad neighbor.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh.

[Monica Padman]

And that really sucks.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

And it really sucks if you don't have a fence. Like, if you just have neighbors all over. Over the place that aren't.

[Dax Shepard]

If you're. If you're at war with your neighbor and you have to see them all the time.

[Monica Padman]

Yes.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

It can go bad.

[Monica Padman]

It can go bad. Yeah, it can go bad.

[Dax Shepard]

But I think that's the thing I like about it. It's kind of like relationships a little bit. It's like you enter a neighborhood going like, these aren't people I picked to be friends with. I got assigned this, but I know we all live together, so I'm gonna have to be a little extra patient, a little extra kind, and a little. All these things.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

And I think those are good virtues to just be practicing and have on display.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, for sure. Just not everyone does it and then it. It's tricky.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay, one, do some facts.

[Jenny Garth]

Oh, yeah, let's do facts.

[Monica Padman]

I forgot. Okay, these. These are for Jenny Garth. So did the Shackley soup have. I looked up Shackley soup because I was like, why would they go into the soup game? Right. But then they had like, seven day healthy cleanse. Like, I think they're including the soups as, like, this overall health thing.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay, that makes sense. Is the soups are part of a cleanse.

[Jenny Garth]

Yep.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Monica Padman]

Okay. I looked up her part in Growing Pains.

[Dax Shepard]

What are you doing?

[Monica Padman]

I forgot my comb.

[Jenny Garth]

Betty, you buying paste?

[Dax Shepard]

What do you need your comb for? Hey, you never know. You're gonna be running into a couple of babes like them. Not a shot. Well, hello.

[Monica Padman]

Hi.

[Dax Shepard]

Well, how are you two ladies this evening? Okay, okay. You underestimate yourself.

[Jenny Garth]

Oh, we're just buying a little paste. Sticky, sticky, sticky.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, she just said sticky, sticky, sticky.

[Monica Padman]

Yes. Oh, and then they walked away. So she was right. She did say hi first, though.

[Dax Shepard]

So she had multiple lines.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, she had multiple lines.

[Dax Shepard]

Do you think they kept it under seven or five?

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Sticky, sticky, sticky. Hello. They probably were the surgical.

[Monica Padman]

Hi. Sticky, sticky, sticky. Yep.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, wow. For people don't know there's categories. You have to pay you a certain amount. If you say over, I think, yeah,

[Monica Padman]

maybe it's changed, but that. Okay. You know what's funny, though? So this was, you know, a family show. I loved it.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

This is how things have changed. Like when he says they showed the girls, there's a pop up that says two available girls.

[Dax Shepard]

Babis Americanus.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah. And then.

[Monica Padman]

And they're like, doing like, boing sounds. Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

You had to back then. You didn't know it was comedy.

[Monica Padman]

Okay. Then they show him and it says,

[Dax Shepard]

dudas hornus ben siever dudis hornius. That's pretty good. It's funny.

[Monica Padman]

But it's that, like, that.

[Dax Shepard]

It wouldn't be on today.

[Monica Padman]

It wouldn't. It wouldn't.

[Dax Shepard]

I think they could bring that back. That's. That's pretty good.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, it's funny. Okay, when was beverly hillbillies made? 1962 is when it premiered.

[Dax Shepard]

Wow, that's an old show. Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

Brady Bunch, 1969, Choice, Green Acres, 1965, and Bewitch, 1964.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay, so all 60s.

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

That's pretty wild.

[Monica Padman]

I know.

[Dax Shepard]

And I was watching. I was home from school sick in 82.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

So 20 years after the Hillbillies were.

[Monica Padman]

And it held up.

[Dax Shepard]

Really did. Also, there was no other options, Right? Exactly.

[Monica Padman]

Okay, how old was Gabrielle Carter in 90210? Ah, she was 29. And then when it was over, she was 34. Or when she left, she was 34. Okay, so she was.

[Dax Shepard]

She was older.

[Monica Padman]

She was older then.

[Dax Shepard]

A high school student.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, she was playing.

[Dax Shepard]

So it's not weird.

[Monica Padman]

It's great.

[Dax Shepard]

It's great.

[Monica Padman]

It's great. It's great.

[Jenny Garth]

Okay.

[Monica Padman]

We talked about shame, and you said, like, the beauty of. Of group therapy is that you say something like that you think is horrible that you've done, and then, you know, people are like, no, that's fine. Like, I've done that too. Have you seen the movie the Drama?

[Dax Shepard]

No, what's that?

[Monica Padman]

Okay. Zendaya and Robert Pattinson. It's out. Out now.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Monica Padman]

I can't say anything about this movie, like, at all.

[Dax Shepard]

Everything would be a spoiler.

[Monica Padman]

Yes. But I recommend it.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Monica Padman]

And it.

[Dax Shepard]

It's called the Drama. Okay.

[Monica Padman]

And it flies right in the face of that concept.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, really?

[Monica Padman]

Yes. Oh, it's really interesting.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, I want to see it. Did you see it at the Vista?

[Monica Padman]

No, I still it at the Americana.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Monica Padman]

It's only an hour and 45 minutes. God bless.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, really? Because it's too intense.

[Monica Padman]

No, I just hate movies that are too long now. I, like, can't do it.

[Dax Shepard]

Oh, wow.

[Monica Padman]

I was supposed to see Project Hail Mary. I really wanted to see it. And we're driving there and I was like, I don't know if I can sit for that long.

[Dax Shepard]

How long was that? I saw it. It didn't feel long.

[Jenny Garth]

Hours.

[Dax Shepard]

Didn't feel like it at all. Great movie.

[Monica Padman]

I want to see it. But I'M not.

[Dax Shepard]

Not gonna. Will you watch it at home?

[Monica Padman]

Yeah, I think I will try to watch it at home.

[Dax Shepard]

It's being in a theater for two hours.

[Monica Padman]

I don.

[Jenny Garth]

Know why.

[Monica Padman]

I'm just like, mad. I'm like, guys, can we please just get movies back to two hours?

[Dax Shepard]

It's funny you say that. I think that's a very common opinion. But when I think of if I did my top 10 movies of all time, they're generally longer.

[Monica Padman]

Really?

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. Pulp Fiction's long.

[Monica Padman]

That's the number one movie.

[Dax Shepard]

You know, most Tarantino movies are long. Once Upon a Time is long. And I want more.

[Monica Padman]

I mean, goodwill hunting. Hunting is like 90. Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

On the dot.

[Monica Padman]

Perfect.

[Dax Shepard]

I wonder how long that is. How long do you think it is before you look?

[Monica Padman]

Okay, good question. I think it is. I think it's a hundred minutes, give or take.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay, let's look it up. Two hours and six minutes.

[Monica Padman]

Oh, okay.

[Dax Shepard]

Two hours, 126 minutes.

[Monica Padman]

Okay.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Monica Padman]

Two hours is fine.

[Dax Shepard]

Well, this is two hours and six minutes. It's your favorite movie of all time. 25 minutes. 20 minutes shorter than Hail Mary.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. I just can't. It's different also now when you go to the theater, It's a full 30 minutes.

[Dax Shepard]

Commands.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. When you're from your call time at certain theaters.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

At. At The Americana, it's 30 minutes. I. I've been testing it. I've been looking and testing it and I'm annoyed.

[Dax Shepard]

That's nuts.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

It should start at the time.

[Monica Padman]

Start at the time.

[Dax Shepard]

Hotel works at the Vista.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. They don't do anything. Previews and it's great.

[Dax Shepard]

I mean, I guess I need to be sympathetic. It's hard to keep these exhibition halls open. No one goes to movies. They got to figure out how to keep them awake. I understand, but it's annoying.

[Monica Padman]

It's a bad cycle, though, because it prevents people from going.

[Dax Shepard]

The experience isn't as good. Yeah, you're right.

[Monica Padman]

So it's tough.

[Dax Shepard]

Short gain for a long term loss.

[Monica Padman]

That's right.

[Dax Shepard]

Shame.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah. So anyway, I would. I recommend that movie. I wanted. I would love to know your thoughts on it when you see it.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, I can wait.

[Monica Padman]

And I'll see anything with Zendaya. I know she picks well. She's great. Robert Pattinson's great in it.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. He's something else, isn't he?

[Monica Padman]

He is.

[Dax Shepard]

I was like, he's a special dude.

[Monica Padman]

Anyway, check that out. Actually, don't check it out until they come on the podcast. Then check it out as a reward. Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Monica Padman]

And that's it.

[Dax Shepard]

That's it.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

All right. Well, I enjoyed Jenny Garrett, Martha, Kelly, Kelly.

[Monica Padman]

I loved Kelly.

[Dax Shepard]

Just really at the height of my consumption of Beverly Hills 90210.

[Monica Padman]

Could you ever have imagined?

[Dax Shepard]

No, I just truly. Even if you try to explain all the little steps that would lead to that I would be like.

[Monica Padman]

You'd be sitting on the. Sounds preposterous from Kelly. Asking her questions.

[Dax Shepard]

Yes. Never inappropriate. So well behaved. The universe waited till I could be trusted with the opportunity to talk to Kelly.

[Monica Padman]

Kelly's been through a lot.

[Dax Shepard]

She. She has. Yeah.

[Monica Padman]

That's a weird. When you said 11 share.

[Dax Shepard]

No, it's not. Again, I don't. No one today can really comprehend any young person they can't comprehend.

[Monica Padman]

That's so nuts.

[Dax Shepard]

The ever presence in popularity of certain television shows in the 80s and 90s when there was nothing else.

[Monica Padman]

Totally different beast.

[Dax Shepard]

There were CDs and there were four networks to watch shows on which 902

[Monica Padman]

and zero have been like Emmy nominated.

[Dax Shepard]

I don't think so.

[Monica Padman]

So what shows were like considered West Wing back then? Yeah, I thought it was. I thought Westwing was like more.

[Dax Shepard]

I feel like won the most amount. I know that Tommy Schammy won the most amount of directing Emmys of any director on.

[Monica Padman]

That was definitely like prestige television. I feel like that was like the kind of beginning of prestige television. But like 9200 feels before that 30

[Dax Shepard]

something was winning, you know, all the dramas still.

[Monica Padman]

Oh, interesting, interesting. I want to look it up real quick. Who Emmy nominations, what year again?

[Dax Shepard]

That's what's. That's what's happened in this, this upside down world. Which is before when winning an Emmy was less impressive because there was only seven comedies to choose from. There were 24. Four dramas. Right?

[Jenny Garth]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

Now there's one. 150.

[Monica Padman]

Exactly.

[Dax Shepard]

And then conversely in movies, it's not quite as impressive to win something there because there's a third of his amount of movies to pull from. It's all upended. Now if you win an Emmy, like that's a shootout. Only surprised by if you win a golden goal for podcast.

[Monica Padman]

Of course I should have known in 95. So that was in 99. 20 know. But you know, whatever I picked up for 10 years. Yeah. NYPD blue, of course, Frasier, boom. They were the winners.

[Dax Shepard]

I think Seinfeld won a lot for the comedy.

[Monica Padman]

Right. But I guess, yeah, okay. It was X Files. Law and Order. Law and Order would never be.

[Dax Shepard]

No, it wouldn't be. That's a procedural that there's 16 of them and it would never.

[Monica Padman]

And same with NYPD Blue, probably.

[Dax Shepard]

Although that one was a big bit groundbreaking.

[Monica Padman]

Right. The X Files, Law and Order, NYPD Blue, Chicago Hope, er.

[Dax Shepard]

Now, I didn't consume both like you have.

[Monica Padman]

Yeah.

[Dax Shepard]

The Pit's better than er, Right? Are they the same?

[Monica Padman]

I don't want to get in trouble. I think ER is better.

[Dax Shepard]

Okay.

[Monica Padman]

Simple, maybe, simply because.

[Dax Shepard]

Bigger cast, more years.

[Monica Padman]

Yes. Huge cast. The way they're shooting that show is like a movie, and there's so many episodes and it's so high, it's so intense. They're like, you know, coming in. In one room and moving into. It's like. It's a. It's so well done.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah.

[Monica Padman]

And all the characters and, like, the drama and the. No comedy and so much aids.

[Dax Shepard]

Yeah, plenty.

[Monica Padman]

Like, the Pit doesn't leave the er.

[Dax Shepard]

Right.

[Monica Padman]

And they did leave the ER in er, and I love it. Sometimes I went after the Pit, it immediately goes to er.

[Dax Shepard]

You love it.

[Monica Padman]

All right, that's it. Love you.