AUA: How Do You Tell Leadership The Truth Without Getting Fired?

Summary

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Episode Summary: “AUA: How Do You Tell Leadership The Truth Without Getting Fired?”

Podcast: At Work with The Ready
Hosts: Rodney Evans & Sam Spurlin
Date: July 6, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this “Ask Us Anything” (AUA) mini-episode, Sam Spurlin and Rodney Evans tackle a listener’s daunting dilemma:
How do you let senior leadership—specifically, multiple levels above your boss—know that they’re not hearing the truth about an important initiative, without putting your job at risk?
The co-hosts unpack the nuances of corporate communication hierarchies, strategies for coalition-building, how to communicate difficult truths, and techniques for minimizing personal risk, all with their distinct mix of candor and humor.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. The Risks and Realities of “Sending the Email”

• Situation: The listener wonders if directly emailing their “great grand boss” (boss’s boss’s boss) is a safe or smart move.
• Sam’s Immediate Take (01:02):
  • “Well, it depends. How long do you want to stick around?”
• Rodney’s Addition:
  • “Do you like your job?”
    Both raise the stakes and underline the risk of going over multiple layers of management.

2. The Whistleblower Perspective

• Sam references legality and whistleblower protections (01:09):
  • “Isn’t this like why whistleblower laws exist… I don’t know if it’s rising to that level of malfeasance, but hey, maybe that’s an option.”
    The hosts are clear: unless the issue is illegal or unethical at the whistleblower level, there are safer in-house methods.

3. Ally and Coalition-Building

• Sam suggests leveraging internal allies (01:25):
  • “Do you have an ally, kind of at that level or closer to that level, that you can confide in?”
    Having someone already closer up the ladder as a sponsor or voice is a classic move—but the very asking of the question suggests that’s likely not available.
• Building a coalition (01:36):
  • “Test whether you’re the only person who sees this… as a group, you can figure out what to do.”
    Addressing issues collectively, especially with colleagues from different areas, reduces personal exposure and increases credibility.

4. The Power of Peer-to-Peer (Fact-based) Dialogue

• Rodney’s consulting playbook (02:35):
  • “When you do that… I don’t talk about it very emotionally… I just talk about them as facts. ‘Do you see this? I see this. Do you see the same thing?’”
  • “When you are the person who can take the emotional charge out of a situation, first of all, it gives you a lot of power… it gives them an ability to engage in a way that feels safer.”
• Advice on avoiding emotionally charged, accusatory language:
  • “If you go to someone and you’re like, ‘Hey, director-level buddy, isn’t it crazy how fucked up the C team is?’… 'Get out of my office. This conversation never happened. You’re on your own.’” (03:16)

5. Preparing for the Fallout

• Sam’s “ahead of the curve” strategy (04:22):
  • “If you see this thing that’s going to happen… can you just get started on preparing for the fallout that you’re pretty sure is going to happen, in a way that you are more prepared for that inevitability?”
    Acknowledge the possible limits of influence and shift focus to mitigation and readiness.

6. Influence Reporting and Data

• Rodney on shifting the data narrative (04:48):
  • “A lot of times what’s happening is that the grand boss in this situation is receiving some kind of information about what’s happening... it’s just incomplete or it’s spun to look better than it is.”
  • “Is there anywhere that you can influence the way the information is being reported?”
    Suggests adding neutral, helpful data—such as leading indicators—which can make issues clear without emotional confrontation.
• Practical tip:
  • “Bring data or reporting, and say, ‘Hey, I have seen this reporting, and I think the way it’s being produced might be creating some blind spots… here’s what I’d suggest instead.’” (05:12)
    Present new data as a tool, not an indictment.

7. The Humor of Going “Martin Luther” on Leadership

• Sam’s joke (04:11):
  • “My last idea was anonymous screed nailed to the CEO’s door. Martin Luther style. Probably not that.”
    Adds levity, but also subtly reinforces why more subtle approaches are typically wiser.

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Notable Quotes by Timestamp

• On the risk of radical transparency:
  • Sam (01:02): “Well, it depends. How long do you want to stick around?”
• On coalition-building:
  • Sam (01:36): “It’s a lot different if you as a solo individual email that person versus if you and 10 other people… have a concern.”
• On fact-based peer discussion:
  • Rodney (02:39): “When you are the person who can take the emotional charge out of a situation, first of all, it gives you a lot of power… it gives them an ability to engage in a way that feels safer.”
• On prepping for inevitable consequences:
  • Sam (04:22): “Can you just get started on preparing for the fallout that you’re pretty sure is going to happen…”
• On exposing blind spots through data:
  • Rodney (05:12): “Here’s what I’d suggest instead… a lot of times, just getting people to look at the same thing without telling them what it means will do the work for you of unearthing the issue or crisis.”

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 00:22 – 01:12: The real risk of emailing up the chain and whistleblower framing
• 01:13 – 01:55: Exploring ally options and coalition-building within the company
• 02:35 – 03:45: Peer-to-peer, emotionless dialogue, and how to avoid drama
• 04:11 – 04:22: Martin Luther joke and the perils of radical moves
• 04:22 – 04:48: Accepting you might only be able to prepare for fallout
• 04:48 – 06:33: Using data and reporting to reveal truths constructively

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Memorable Moments

• Martin Luther Joke:
  • The image of nailing an anonymous screed to the CEO’s door (04:11) provides comic relief and a reminder of what not to do.
• “Do you like your job?”
  • Rodney’s rhetorical jab at risky moves sets the episode’s candid and pragmatic tone (01:06).

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Actionable Takeaways

• Test for allies or coalition, don’t go solo if you can help it.
• Keep emotional charge out—stick to facts to make others feel safe engaging.
• If you can’t influence the outcome, prepare for fallout.
• Where possible, shift the reporting or data being presented up the chain to reveal blind spots naturally.
• Avoid dramatic gestures; subtle influence and shared ownership are generally safer and more effective.

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Conclusion

This episode offers practical, nuanced advice for anyone stuck in a dilemma of “speaking truth to power” without risking their position. By focusing on fact-based, coalition-driven communication, and strategic reporting “hacks,” Rodney and Sam equip listeners with alternative approaches to making organizational truths surface—without burning bridges or careers.

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Transcript

[A]

Hey, everyone. Welcome back to At Work with the Ready. I'm Sam Sperlin and I'm joined as always, by Rodney Evans.

[B]

Hi, Sam. Hi, everyone.

[A]

Every other week we're tackling one tough, thought provoking listener question and sharing a few ideas that might help. So let's dive in. Rodney, what you got for us this week?

[B]

What is your best move for signaling to upper management? Think skip level above your boss's boss that they aren't getting the truth on an initiative or important project. Assuming sending an email is an unprotected means of communicating that it's fubar. Wait, what does FUBAR stand for again? Fucked up beyond all recognition.

[A]

I believe so. Yes.

[B]

I think that's right. Yeah. Okay, great. Skip level above your boss's boss.

[A]

It's way up there.

[B]

So your great grand boss. Okay, got it. All right, yeah. Should you send an email to your great grand boss saying this project is fucked?

[A]

Well, it depends. How, how long you want to stick around?

[B]

I mean, do you like your job?

[A]

Yeah. I mean, there's so many things going on in this question and one of the things that just came to mind that I even write down in my notes is like, because I don't, I'm not an expert in the legality of all this, but isn't this like why whistleblower laws exist for various reasons. So like, I don't, I don't know if it's like rising to that level of malfeasance that you're, that you're, you know, trying to figure out what the law is or the rules are around whistleblowing, but hey, maybe that's an option, assuming that's not what we're talking about here. There's two things. One is, I think probably a bit of a grasping at straws because it seems like the obvious thing, if this were an option for you is like, do you have an ally kind of at that level or closer to that level that you can confide in and then that person who is kind of closer to the great grand boss can go and have that, that conversation? I mean, that seems obvious. And if it were the case, you probably wouldn't be writing in an answer to us. But just in case you hadn't thought of it, that's the first thing. The second place where my brain goes is kind of testing whether you're the only person who sees this. Assuming you are not. Build a coalition of other folks who are on the same page with you and you as a coalition, as a group can figure out what to Do I think it's a lot different if you as a solo individual email that person ver you and 10 other people from various parts of the organization or various parts of the project have a concern to go to that person. What about you? What are you thinking about with this one?

[B]

Yeah, I would add to that that I've had success in these situations doing the peer to peer move, which is sort of like the coalition building, like talking not hierarchically about what's going on. And my tip is that when you do that, this is one of my go to moves in consulting too is like, I don't talk about it very emotionally. Like, I'm not like, can you believe that they are lying to these people and that they have created this campaign for the emperor to have new clothes? I really, when I talk about things that I think are potentially dramatic or really screwed up, I just talk about them as facts. I'm just like, do you see this? I see this. Do you see the same thing? And I think that when you are the person who can take the emotional charge out of a situation, first of all, it gives you a lot of power because people are like, oh, maybe this is not as terrifying or dramatic as I thought it was. 2. It gives them an ability to engage in a way that feels safer. Because if you go to someone and you're like, hey, director level buddy, isn't it crazy how fucked up the C team is? Do you think we should tell them 8 out of 10 people are gonna be like, no. And also, get out of my office. This conversation never happened. You're on your own. So like to the extent that you wanna build coalition or talk to peers, speak in facts and try to take the charge out of this situation, I think that can help.

[A]

Yeah, that's a lot better than my last idea, which was anonymous screed nailed to the CEO's door or whoever.

[B]

Wow,

[A]

Martin Luther style. Probably. Probably not that. I mean, the only other actual thought that I had is, all right, if you see this thing that's going to happen and there's nothing you can do, that means you are kind of ahead of the curve in terms of thinking about the fallout of that.

[B]

Right.

[A]

And can you just get started on preparing for the fallout that you're pretty sure is going to happen in a way that, you know, you are more prepared for that inevitability?

[B]

Yeah, I think that's right. The one other idea I had before you get to the inevitable fallout is a lot of times in a lot of work design problems when people are like, we have this issue and we see it all different ways. And, you know, we all believe that our version of the truth is the real one. A lot of times I will push a team or an individual to just start bringing some data and some reporting to look at and investigate, because my assumption is that the grand boss in this situation is receiving some kind of information about what's happening on this project, and it's just, like, incomplete or it's spun to look better than it is or whatever. And so my provocation to the listener is like, is there anywhere that you can influence the way the information is being reported? And just like, add some data or add a leading indicator or add something to the data story from the posture of being helpful and supportive and like, hey, I have seen this reporting, and I think the way it's being produced might be creating some blind spots for people who aren't close to the work. Here's what I'd suggest instead. A lot of times, like, just getting people to look at the same thing without telling them what it means will do the work for you of unearthing the issue or the crisis. And so I'm like, is there a way you can get in there before you get to, like, you know, nailing the screed to the door? That's just like, hey, do you guys. Do you guys want to look at a leading indicator? Here's. Here's a couple ideas for, like, what might help. It's also a little less risky.

[A]

I like it. All right, that is it for this mini. If you've got a question of your own, hit us [e-mail] we will see

[B]

you back next week for a full episode of At Work with the Ready. Thank you for being a listener.