Mental Health, Stalkers, and Pussy Popping with Da’Vinchi

Summary

Podcast Summary: "Mental Health, Stalkers, and Pussy Popping with Da’Vinchi"

Podcast Information:

• Title: Baby, This is Keke Palmer
• Host: Wondery (Hosted by Keke Palmer)
• Episode Title: Mental Health, Stalkers, and Pussy Popping with Da’Vinchi
• Release Date: January 21, 2025

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Introduction

In the episode "Mental Health, Stalkers, and Pussy Popping with Da’Vinchi," Keke Palmer engages in a profound conversation with actor Da’Vinchi. The discussion delves into the complexities of mental health, personal growth, the challenges of fame, and the importance of community support, particularly within the Black community.

---

Mental Health Stigma and Evolution of Dialogue

Keke Palmer initiates the conversation by addressing the shifting perceptions of mental health across generations.

• Sharon Palmer reflects on the past stigma:

  “In the black community where I was raised... it was embarrassing to admit that you had postpartum depression. Like, what the hell is that?” (03:02)

• The dialogue has evolved, with younger generations embracing terms like "triggered," signifying increased awareness and acceptance.

• Keke Palmer emphasizes the normalization of mental health discussions:

  “It's as if somebody is broken or you know, someone is stronger than the others... some of us just have coping mechanisms that the world deems as okay or normal.” (04:26)

---

Personal Stories and Family Impact

Sharon Palmer shares her personal journey, highlighting how motherhood transformed her perspective on life and mental health.

• Sharon Palmer discusses the unconditional love from her children:

  “What my kids taught me was to love unconditionally... that money wasn't important and loving each other is more important.” (08:00)

• The importance of family as a support system in combating mental health struggles is underscored.

---

Coping Mechanisms and Therapy

The conversation explores various coping strategies and the role of therapy in maintaining mental well-being.

• Keke Palmer shares her journey with therapy:

  “I started therapy when I was 17... now I'm 30.” (10:39)

• Sharon Palmer highlights the value of listening and support:

  “My mother listened to me... I raised my kids the same way.” (11:56)

• Da’Vinchi discusses practical steps for mental health maintenance:

  “Start meditating, start writing down what's making you mad and why... switch your mental diet up for like 30 days.” (50:51)

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Da’Vinchi's Journey with Fame and Stalkers

Da’Vinchi opens up about the challenges that come with fame, including encounters with stalkers.

• Da’Vinchi candidly talks about dealing with invasive fans:

  “I dealt with stalkers... almost a year of straight non-stop messages.” (19:31)

• The impact of fame on personal life and mental health is a significant theme.

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Importance of Community and Support

Both Keke and Da’Vinchi emphasize the critical role of community in supporting mental health.

• Keke Palmer stresses building a supportive network:

  “You have to create a community, you have to communicate... you don't feel alone.” (10:39)

• Da’Vinchi reflects on the necessity of discipline and self-preservation:

  “Without discipline, a man and a woman don't stand a chance against life.” (41:08)

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Environmental Influences and Personal Growth

Da’Vinchi discusses how his upbringing and environment shaped his perspective and led to personal transformation.

• Growing up in a challenging environment in Brooklyn:

  “I got arrested when I was 13... but moving to Florida changed me completely.” (27:59)

• The transition from a tumultuous past to academic excellence showcases resilience and growth.

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Advocacy and Breaking Generational Trauma

The episode underscores the importance of addressing and overcoming generational trauma within the Black community.

• Da’Vinchi links historical oppression to current mental health struggles:

  “Slavery... created a narrative that basically black people are biologically inferior to white people.” (22:06)

• The need for systemic change and education to heal from generational wounds is highlighted.

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Final Thoughts and Advice

In the concluding sections, both hosts offer actionable advice for listeners grappling with mental health issues.

• Da’Vinchi advises seeking support and limiting negative influences:

  “Find somebody to talk to... limit your distractions like social media.” (50:51)

• Emphasis is placed on self-awareness, gratitude, and proactive mental health practices.

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Fun Interaction: "Here for it or Not"

To lighten the mood, Keke and Da’Vinchi engage in a playful segment called "Here for it or Not," where they respond to various scenarios humorously.

• Examples include:
  • Astrology: Da’Vinchi responds with skepticism but humor.
  • Ghosting: Affirming its value for mental health.
  • Daily Journaling: Both show enthusiasm for the practice.

This segment underscores the hosts' chemistry and adds a relatable, entertaining element to the episode.

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Conclusion

"Mental Health, Stalkers, and Pussy Popping with Da’Vinchi" offers a deep dive into the multifaceted challenges of mental health, particularly within the Black community. Through candid conversations and personal anecdotes, Keke Palmer and Da’Vinchi provide valuable insights and practical advice, emphasizing the importance of community, self-compassion, and proactive mental health practices. The episode serves as both an informative and inspiring resource for listeners seeking to navigate their mental well-being amidst societal pressures and personal struggles.

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Notable Quotes:

1. Sharon Palmer on Past Stigma:

   “What do you mean she can't get out the bed to take care of her kids? She's lazy.” (03:02)

2. Keke Palmer on Coping Mechanisms:

   “When you're nervous or when you're anxious, you start telling jokes... that's a socially acceptable one.” (04:26)

3. Da’Vinchi on Fame:

   “You start realizing that you've entered this spotlight... I dealt with stalkers.” (18:43)

4. Sharon Palmer on Therapy Support:

   “Finish what you have to say. Say whatever you want to say.” (11:56)

5. Da’Vinchi on Generational Trauma:

   “Slavery... created a narrative that basically black people are biologically inferior to white people.” (22:06)

---

This summary captures the essence of the episode, providing a comprehensive overview of the discussions while highlighting key moments and quotes for deeper insight.

Transcript

[Keke Palmer]

Hello, my lovelies. This episode is brought to you by Airbnb. Of course. And if you are in need of New Year rejuvenation, remember to check out Guest Favorites, a collection of the most loved homes on Airbnb to find your next winter retreat. Now, let's start the show. Hello, it's your girl, Keke Palmer here. And let me tell you, listener, you're in for a good time, as always. Today I have the lovely actor Da Vinci with me, and we're getting into the topic of mental health and getting to know who exactly Da Vinci is. I want to know all about his approach to advocating for mental health as well as his own personal story. I mean, this is gonna be fun because, baby, this is Keke Palmer. No matter what we doing in the car, just chilling pop on Amazon music, sit back and listen. Life, love, sex, science, hovering it all, especially the bag of money always evolved no matter what it is we gonna make it make sense Nothing else to do but kick it with homies and king to grab you a drink and a snack you enjoy and get into the vibe that only you know it's your girl. This is kicky, baby, this is Kiki K. Hello, Sharon.

[Sharon Palmer]

Hello. Hello.

[Keke Palmer]

I really love this because I usually don't get to be here with you.

[Sharon Palmer]

You look so pretty. I.

[Keke Palmer]

Thank you. You always look beautiful.

[Sharon Palmer]

Thank you so much. I'll be trying.

[Keke Palmer]

So I'm excited to talk to Da Vinci. Are you familiar with him?

[Sharon Palmer]

I am not. The name sounds familiar. Give me a little back.

[Keke Palmer]

So Da Vinci is an actor. I actually met him with Trevor years ago when he was on. He's done a lot of different shows, like Grownish, All American. He's also done a lot of talking recently just about mental health for young black men. He's our age, and so I'm excited to talk to him about that, but also get to know him a little bit more because he's continued to rise as a talent and it's been a long time since I've spoken to him. So it's going to be a lot of fun to just see what he's learned and how he's grown in this industry since then.

[Sharon Palmer]

Yeah, that sounds cool.

[Keke Palmer]

Yeah. Yeah. But speaking of mental health and getting into this topic, I think it's changed so much. I mean, obviously, I didn't grow up in your time, but just when I hear you talk about things, when it comes to mental health, it seems as if there was a different dialogue surrounding it in your generation than it is now.

[Sharon Palmer]

Absolutely.

[Keke Palmer]

What would you how could you describe how it was for you guys back then when it came to the concept of mental health?

[Sharon Palmer]

Well, I just think, first of all, I'm very happy and excited that your generation is, like, not afraid to use words like triggered.

[Keke Palmer]

You always bring that one up.

[Sharon Palmer]

I don't even know what the hell that even meant. Triggered. You know, my mother used to say, you getting on my nerves. Go outside and play. You know what I mean? And I think that there's. I think culturally, it has a lot to do with it, too, because I know, just like in the black community where I was raised and outside of Chicago, it was embarrassing to admit that you had postpartum depression. Like, what the hell is that? Get up and take care of your kids. You know what I mean?

[Keke Palmer]

Damn, y'all was tough as hell.

[Sharon Palmer]

Yeah, it was like, what do you mean? She can't get out the bed to take care of her kids? She's lazy. What's going on here? You know?

[Keke Palmer]

Oh, my gosh.

[Sharon Palmer]

So. And then also to say you're crazy. Well, you know, that's your. That's her crazy cousin. You know what I mean? So it was a very much a. A stigma with saying you were depressed or you weren't feeling your best. But I actually had a couple of cousins who would check themselves into the hospital for rest.

[Keke Palmer]

Really? Yeah.

[Sharon Palmer]

Now that I think about it now, like, back then, we would just go, well, you know, so and so's in the hospital for exhaustion. They just.

[Keke Palmer]

I didn't mean to laugh at that, but it's the way you're saying it.

[Sharon Palmer]

And we would just. We would talk about, like, what, you could just check yourself at the hospital because you're tired. Well, you know, it's the psych ward, but, yeah, they'll evaluate you for a few days, and they just said they needed a break from their kids, and they needed a break. So that was kind of like the first time. And I was a young woman in my early 20s, and that was the first time I had heard you could check yourself in the hospital for rest. But I thought it was absolutely crazy.

[Keke Palmer]

How did you and I.

[Sharon Palmer]

No pun intended, but I just thought, like, how did you. I just thought, like, all of us are tired. You know what I mean? We all have kids.

[Keke Palmer]

We all have friends, but let's be honest, it's tough. You know what I mean? Think it's really cool what you're bringing up, because I think the concept of mental health, it's. It's. It's as if somebody is broken or you know, someone is stronger than the others, but really, some of us just have coping mechanisms that the world deems as okay or normal. What I mean by that is when you're nervous or when you're anxious, you start telling jokes. That's me. Yeah, that's. I become performative when I'm nervous or when I'm anxious or when I'm going through a stressful time. The way that I dealt with it, it created an entire career for. Or being a workaholic. You know what I mean? That's a socially acceptable one.

[Sharon Palmer]

Absolutely.

[Keke Palmer]

So I think the. The thing is, like, it's not so much that some people deal with it better. I mean, yes, some people do have the tools, but if we're thinking about in this era where people didn't have the tools per se, especially inner, you know, inner city or impoverished communities.

[Sharon Palmer]

Right.

[Keke Palmer]

Some people just had coping mechanisms that were socially acceptable.

[Sharon Palmer]

Absolutely.

[Keke Palmer]

You know, a man, maybe he has a lot of sex. Maybe he's a sex actor.

[Sharon Palmer]

Absolutely.

[Keke Palmer]

That's something that. Oh, it's socially acceptable. Actually, it's a problem.

[Sharon Palmer]

Or a workaholic. What?

[Keke Palmer]

Exactly.

[Sharon Palmer]

Now with me, I've just become more defensive. Like, what do you mean? What are you trying to say? Or what? Those sounds like fighting words. What's going on here? So, no, and you're right. And I guess, like, also with my generation is so and so is crazy, and you think they'll never be better. You know what I mean? So the whole concept of you can go and get help and actually be better, that's new to me.

[Keke Palmer]

Yeah. You can actually feel better. Yeah. I think that's a big thing because sometimes you don't know that you're not feeling good. I remember something big. It was a big phrase with grandma, and it was a bit of a big phrase with you, is you're making my nerves bad.

[Sharon Palmer]

Yeah. You're on my nerves. Getting on my nerves.

[Keke Palmer]

Getting on my nerves. My nerves is bad. And obviously we know that now. It's most likely it was just anxiety being triggered. You know what I mean? I'm anxious. I'm feeling a little bit uneasy.

[Sharon Palmer]

Absolutely.

[Keke Palmer]

And a lot of times, you. People go through their whole life feeling that way and not knowing that there's another way that they could feel right now.

[Sharon Palmer]

Like with my mother, my mother had been molested as a child. And so everything around our growing up was about molestation. It was about, watch this person, watch that person. Don't go along with this person. When you're walking on the street, don't walk too close to doorways, blah, blah. It was always so everything was about. You could be potentially attacked.

[Keke Palmer]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Sharon Palmer]

And so that brought anxiety. And guess what? I told you the same thing.

[Keke Palmer]

Yeah.

[Sharon Palmer]

So it's like generational anxiety, you know.

[Keke Palmer]

Yeah. So when it comes to your kids, how did that affect your mental health? Like, if you think about who you were before then and when you started being on the receiving end of your own love that you were pouring into us, how do you think that changed you, Your. Your. Your state of mind?

[Sharon Palmer]

My kids changed me for the better. I was not the woman that, oh, I'm going to get married and, you know, have a picky fence and all these kids. I was the woman. Like, I'm not having any kids. I came from a family of seven. I was the baby. So it was like, I'm not having any damn kids. And then when I met your father in college and we, you know, got started dating and he wanted kids and I was like, okay, I guess I could have one or two kids or whatever like that. But what my kids show me is that how loyal I am, what a loyal person I am. And so once I started having you, I became loyal to being a mother. I became loyal to that role and what my kids.

[Keke Palmer]

You ate that one thing. You ate that rivalry.

[Sharon Palmer]

And what my kids taught me was to love unconditionally, no matter what's going on. You know, there were times when we didn't have any money and we had to go to the payday loan place and your dad would give the title to his. He would give the title to his car. We would go to Blockbuster. We would go to Blockbuster and get movies and little Caesar pizza and we would sit in the living room and you guys would be so happy.

[Keke Palmer]

They thrilled. So thrilled.

[Sharon Palmer]

Yeah. So that's. My kids taught me that you can have fun and you could raise your children in a way that money wasn't important and loving each other is more important. And if you got 2 cents, use those 2 cents to bring whatever peace and happiness to your children. And so that's what you guys taught me, that you don't need a lot of money.

[Keke Palmer]

I love what you say, you don't.

[Sharon Palmer]

Need a lot of money for your kids to have fun. You just need a plan. You need a plan. So we had a plan. We would every so often, we would take the title to the car. We would get like maybe $250, $300, and we would go to Blockbuster. Sometimes we would take you guys to the movies.

[Keke Palmer]

Yeah, we loved it. That was a big part of our lives for us. Yeah.

[Sharon Palmer]

My. Even now, Lawrence, my son, he would say, mom, let's go to the movies.

[Keke Palmer]

Yes.

[Sharon Palmer]

You know, and so he and I go on a date to the movies, and I love it. And I knew that was because as a kid, we taught you all that you can escape.

[Keke Palmer]

Yes.

[Sharon Palmer]

In movies.

[Keke Palmer]

Yes. Y'all did you. That we could. That we could. That we could, like. But I want to pull even further into what you're saying, which I think is important when we're talking about mental health is, you know, we maybe didn't have therapists and maybe didn't have the words, but I think one of our greatest sources of combating what you guys were dealing with, being in poverty, having to work over, you know, crazy hours of the day, being away from your kids, trying to pay for the school, was community. I think community is a big thing. That also, when we talk about the Internet, that a lot of times that is impacted and that also affects our mental health is having somebody having. Being able to have those people to sit on the Leto couch and watch a blockbuster movie with.

[Sharon Palmer]

Right.

[Keke Palmer]

I think that also helps with what you're dealing with in life is being able to have somebody to lean on and call on. Having your family. Like they ask me a lot of times, what is it that helps you get through whatever you. Stage ground. It's my family, you know what I'm saying? And I think that it's important that we do have these tools, right? Like, you know, going to, you know, saying a prayer, meditation, yoga, therapy, et cetera. But let's get down into it and really say, you got to create a community. You have to communicate. You have to create a community, because we can't do it alone. And I'm not saying you got. If you were not a church, you ain't got to go to church if that's not your religion, whatever. But the point and the concept of it is to commune with people so that you don't feel alone. You know, I started therapy. I remember when I first told you guys that I wanted to do therapy when I was 17, you know, then I've been in therapy since I was 17, so now I'm 30. But obviously, when I started my journey of therapy, I also tried to pull the whole family into therapy with me. So I want to hear about what your initial thoughts were then and then what has your experience been with therapy since then.

[Sharon Palmer]

Right. I don't know if I can remember my initial thoughts. I just knew you Were in, you know, anguish and you wanted therapy. So I've just.

[Keke Palmer]

Anguish is a great word.

[Sharon Palmer]

Yeah. So I just support that. You know, my mother listened to me. She would always say, finish what you have to say. Say whatever you want to say because, you know, I want to hear it. It may not change my opinion, but I want to hear what you have to say. So I did, you know, I raised my kids the same way. Say what you have to say and, you know, we'll go from there. And so I just know, I remember supporting you, trying to support you, even though maybe I didn't understand it, you know, but I tried to support you. And for me, I started going into therapy when your father was going through the diaconate program. So we actually had to do a lot of one on one therapy.

[Keke Palmer]

I didn't know that.

[Sharon Palmer]

Yeah, it's like a four year course of, you know, retreats and couples therapy. Then later on I started having like one on one therapy with a nun. Her name was Sister Mary Kay. And I used to call Sister Mary Kay. And we would talk for maybe.

[Keke Palmer]

Yeah, I remember her from church.

[Sharon Palmer]

And she just, to me, was a very kind person. It's funny because Sister Mary Kay read your first book and she told me to tell you to protect yourself. And I said, what do you mean by that? She says, because she has such empathy. And when people have so much empathy, people try to take advantage of that. And she told me such an eerie thing.

[Keke Palmer]

Well.

[Sharon Palmer]

Well, I just took it as she read your book and she saw how kind you are and she, you know, whatever, premonition or whatever, you know, I'm not gonna put words in her mouth. She just wanted me to tell you to protect yourself. It's okay to be kind and empathetic, but everybody don't deserve that kind of attention from you. When I used to talk to Sister Mary Kay, I still talk to her, but, you know, not as much. But one of the techniques, and I know now there was a technique. At the time, I didn't know it was a technique, but she would go, oh, okay, so let me get this straight, Sharon, this is what you're telling me. And then she would repeat back to me, right.

[Keke Palmer]

What it was I was telling her, that's important.

[Sharon Palmer]

And then for me to hear it coming from her, I was like, man, that is what I said. That's not. Something is wrong with that.

[Keke Palmer]

Right though. But that's important. So.

[Sharon Palmer]

So that was a technique that she was using. And I didn't even think of it as a technique. But then I saw it in a movie, and I was like, sister Mary Kay used to say that to me.

[Keke Palmer]

She's good at what she does. She's been a sister for so long. I remember I used to tell her, but if God is up there, why can't I get to him? What did she say? She just. Oh, Kiki. Okay, I'm gonna get into it with DaVinci. Thanks, Mama.

[Sharon Palmer]

But shout outs to Sister Mary Kay.

[Keke Palmer]

Yes. Okay, y'all, I'm here to spill the tea on how to level up your 2025 travel game. Listen, as we step into the fresh new year, it's time to shake things up and try something different. You know what they say. New year, new adventures. And let me tell you, some trips are better in an Airbnb. As you guys know, I was recently tucked away in a fabulous lakeside cabin only a couple of hours away from the glitz and glam of Los Angeles. It had the works. We're talking game room, panoramic views of the mountains, a fully stocked kitchen that Tabitha Brown would be proud of. Okay. And my fave, A Jacuzzi on the balcony. Yes. Yes. Now you best believe me. And the fam had the epitome of cozy posted up, sipping on hot chocolate by the fire without a care in the world. And because we found this stunning house on Airbnb, we were super close to Big Bear proper and got all the tea from our host about the best spots in town. Child, we was hitting the slopes, popping downtown for shopping in the village or for dinner at Sweet Brazil Bistro. Yes. Get into it. We were right in the th of things, and our host knew what they were talking about. Now, if you're feeling inspired and decided to hop on over to Airbnb to book yourself a little something something, let me put you onto the truth. Guest favorites. Okay, these are the cream of the crop stays that other travelers are raving about. We're talking places with charm, character, and that special je ne sais quoi that'll make your 2025 unforgettable. That's how I found this gem. So go ahead, book that stay and make 2025 your year of exploration. Trust me, you won't regret it, baby. This is. This is Kiki. Today's guest is someone who has really skyrocketed into the public eye over the last few years, thanks to his role on the hit sitcom Grown Ish. And more recently, his role as Southwest T on Black Mafia Family. Not only is he an amazing actor, but he's also outspoken about A cause that's important to me as well. Mental health. Welcome to the show, my old friend, Da Vinci.

[Da Vinci]

I appreciate you having me Keke.

[Keke Palmer]

Now, guys, I am so excited to have Da Vinci on the show because I've actually known him for a really long time. We haven't seen each other in a minute, but I met him right at the beginning of him jumping on grownage. Do you remember that?

[Da Vinci]

Yeah, yeah.

[Keke Palmer]

With Trevor.

[Da Vinci]

Yeah, right.

[Keke Palmer]

When's the last time you seen T?

[Da Vinci]

Honestly, it's been a minute too. It's been a minute too, actually. But we still, you know what I'm saying, hit each other on a gram show.

[Keke Palmer]

But, I mean, you be working a lot, man. You always got a gig. I mean, all American. I watched you on there. You killed it on there. I love that show. And then recently, I know you just finished, what is it, the fourth season of bmf.

[Da Vinci]

Yeah, yeah, fourth season.

[Keke Palmer]

So how are you feeling? How is that? How's that been going? I mean, the success has just continued to be successing. Like, what's. What. What are the vibes? How are you feeling as of late?

[Da Vinci]

I mean, it's a blessing. I'm not gonna lie. I'm really grateful that, you know, I'm able to be four years in on the show. You know, I. I started this business like six, seven years ago, and given how it usually go for most people, I'm like, man, I'm really needing ax or someone above is looking out for me. It's been great. It definitely has its pros and cons. You know what I'm saying? It's not all great and beautiful, but. But overall, I wouldn't trade this for the world.

[Keke Palmer]

I know. That's right. And it's so true what you said with this, you know, because, yeah, six years is a short amount of time to have the success that you had. And I know it's going to continue, but how has it been adjusting to that? You know what I'm saying? Like, what. What kind of has been the journey of just, like, seeing how life. Your life has changed not only for you and your workload, but also how you're interacting with people because people also, you know, are impacted by your success.

[Da Vinci]

I think fame is an interesting thing, and it has a strange effect on a lot of people.

[Keke Palmer]

Yeah.

[Da Vinci]

And. And it's like when you're. When you're becoming, you know, famous or like a celebrity, as they call it. I kind of hate that term celebrity, because I don't feel like I'm celebrity. I just Feel like I'm a regular person, just notoriety. But it's like you start realizing that you've entered this spotlight because how people around you start treating you, how your family start treating you, how everyone start looking at you and you really can't move the same anymore, like at all. You know, I've dealt with stalkers. I dealt with, you know, people just having sick fantasies in their head, you know what I'm saying? And they're persistent as hell. Or like when you, when you're running, like now, boy, when I'm outside, I'm.

[Keke Palmer]

Now, wait a minute. Tell me about this stalker because I feel there's a story here.

[Da Vinci]

I don't even want to give this crazy person light on your show because I don't even know who it is, but I just feel like, you know, if I, if I feed the beast right now that probably watch this interview and then just be like, oh, I'm back. But, but no, I think, I think she learned the lesson because we know exactly who she is and the feds will be on her ass if she's trying that shit again. So. Okay, but, but yeah, nah, it was, it was annoying, bro. It was like. It was like almost a year of just straight non stop messages. Sick person and a whole family got involved, like their whole family. And it's just like, it's just crazy to think like grown ass mothers and daughters will all be in on a sick, you know, thing. Yeah, it's, it's why I didn't want to give.

[Keke Palmer]

I mean, I always feel like it's so unique with guys, like, especially when it comes to the whole heartthrob gag. I mean, obviously we have women that are sex symbols, heartthro, everything like that. But with guys it does seem different, you know, Like I remember even thinking about like just B2K when we was kids and they videos and it's like girls are screaming and jumping and you know what I mean? So this whole heartthrob energy, I'm sure it does have, you know, comes with the strong suits, but clearly, as you just mentioned, it comes with some of it, some of its negatives too. When, yeah, when the girls is.

[Da Vinci]

I tell my friends that all the time. I'm like, bro, it's different from girl, from girls and guys. Like, I feel like if you take like a Justin Bieber and Selena Gomez and they both huge and do really well in their, in their fields, but it's like, I think Justin Bieber probably got a little more crazy psycho fan. I don't Know, like it's. I think, I think a girl just feel like she could get away with more. And it takes like if my big ass is going to a police officer and report something, 6, 3, 200 pounds, like, yo, this girl is. They're like, ah, second, you know what I'm saying? It's kind of just like, you know, but then if something wild happened and you get in trouble, you kind of. You damned if you do, damned if you don't. And it takes a while for people to take it serious. More so, you know, when you take it the proper protocol.

[Keke Palmer]

Oh, man. Okay, so we got crazy new workload. You know, quick success, but obviously well deserved. We got some crazy stalker fans. And then we have you really coming forward and speaking on I think an issue that is so important, especially for people that look like you. You know what I mean? A young, handsome black man saying, hey, I want to talk about mental health. I want to advocate for that being something necessary for us to all start kind of like putting our attention towards what made you want to start being vocal about that?

[Da Vinci]

I think when you really dissect the communities that we come from and you really just break down why we're struggling so much. I mean, of course because of, you know, slavery being a huge factor. I mean, there was an entire system put in place, right. To keep us oppressed. They had certain laws and rules around that time frame to where everything was coming together to create this narrative that basically black people are biologically inferior to white people and we can't do this, we can't do that, we can't do that. So I think when you look at our history in this country especially, you can't talk about them without realizing the traumatic stress that we went through. Right. People don't really take into consideration when you have a group of people publishing articles and you have a neurosurgeons and doctors and psychologists saying certain things that repeated by social Darwinism like, yo, black people are biologically inferior to white people. Black people can't do this with more.

[Keke Palmer]

Get propaganda to justify slavery a business.

[Da Vinci]

Exactly. And then, and then also the, the one rule that they had was one of many. Like black people, you can't build wealth, you can't have a mortgage, you can't pass it down. So those things were literally created to keep us in this stress, traumatic environment, state of survival. Yeah, exactly. And then now that you know, we're free, so to speak, it's like we don't really know what to do with that because we got so much Trauma still, you know what I'm saying? And the thing about problems is, like a problem can happen for a day or a week or four years within. The trauma from that thing lasts generation and generation and generation. So I think because we're still dealing with the trauma of that and how, you know, the media portrays a lot of us and the lack of access to education information that we have, I realized, I'm like, yo, we are like kind of. And a lot of people are, you know, the mental health crisis in this country has become. It's not just a matter of black people anymore, it's just everyone that's getting it. You know, a lot of Asian kids are suffering from. In everyone. But, you know, looking at those statistics and looking at my community specifically, and coming from where I come from, you know, I was fortunate enough to see two different dimensions in this world. And not many people get this opportunity to just come from straight poverty. And then you make it out, you see that inside. And as you're trying to enjoy the fruits of your labor here, you're kind of looking back like, damn, like we are, you realize that, you know, you could give a man a fish, he eats for a day, but if you teach a man fish, they eat forever. So it's just like, you could give back all you want, but it's just.

[Keke Palmer]

Like, yeah, but you gotta figure out the system in which they can actually get it from the root.

[Da Vinci]

Exactly. And that's when you start understanding the mechanisms in the mind and what mental health is, you know what I'm saying? And when you start breaking that down, it's just your ability to, how your social and emotional well being is. And a lot of, a lot of us don't think about that. So I just started understanding psychology, how it works, understanding the basic mechanism. Right.

[Keke Palmer]

Well, so much of what you said was also important in terms of, like, it's hard to even stop and think about stuff like this or in this way when you're in a constant state of survival. And I do think it's important as an entertainer, somebody like you said, a celebrity, whatever, people want to look at us as, you know, if, you know, if somebody does not have the resources to that education or to that information, well, hell, if they're watching BMF or they may be checking into the baby this is Kiki Palmer podcast, then maybe we can at least share the information, you know, from the resources that we've been able to have to at least shine a light on, on something that may click or that may resonate in that way, you know, and then, you know, I love also what you were saying about Harriet Tubman says something. I might butcher the quote, but, you know, somebody was like, oh, how many slaves you freed? Or it's amazing how many slaves you freed? And she said, well, I could have freed thousands more if they knew that were slaves.

[Da Vinci]

Right.

[Keke Palmer]

You know, and it's like Kanye said, the unpopular version. But ultimately, it's the idea that, yeah, you can't know what you don't know. And if you've never truly known mental freedom, if you never really knew what it felt like to actually just, like, know that you have a choice. Once you have all these options, all these choices, you still have to learn the mechanisms of how to activate it, how to know that. You know what I'm saying? And that's. That's what you're talking about in terms of, you know, we can help all we want, but how can we strap you with the tools? And I think that's something that any one of us, you know, that come from a sense of community, that are in this position are constantly trying to figure out, like, how can I. How can I share this? How can I. What can I do?

[Da Vinci]

Exactly. That's why you have a lot of entertainers, whether athletes, musicians, actors, whatever, you know, they come across X amount of dollars and they end up broke because they don't have the tools. It's like, there is no way you should make X amount of millions and you end up broke. Like, you start building wealth. Yeah, but we don't know that. So we just get the money and we. We just buy a whole bunch of liabilities because we wasn't taught a certain thing. A lot of times people look at us like, oh, my God, they're ignorant because they don't know. It's like, nah, if you was in our shoes, bro, you would have done the same thing. You just don't know better. You don't know what you don't know.

[Keke Palmer]

Yeah, you don't know what you don't know.

[Da Vinci]

That's why I feel obliged to educators, man, let people know that whatever you're doing at any given moment, you physically modifying your brain and become better at it. So just know, like, whether it's bad, whether it's good, your brain is like, yo, I'm gonna make you an expert at doing nonsense. I'm gonna make you an expert at doing this. So it just really behooves all of us to just keep a. Keep a sound mental diet.

[Keke Palmer]

I want to get more into that and more into how you've found a sense of community that supports you in that. But before going there, I want to talk about the community that you're from, because I know you're also, ha. Haitian American, your family's from Haiti, and you grew up in Brooklyn. Talk a little bit to me about, like, how you grew up.

[Da Vinci]

Yeah, so I, you know, first generation Haitian. I was raised in the house with my grandpa. She didn't speak a lick of English. That's why.

[Keke Palmer]

Wow. So wait a minute. What do you. What all do you speak?

[Da Vinci]

I speak French, French Creole.

[Keke Palmer]

You better go off.

[Da Vinci]

Wait, wait, wait.

[Keke Palmer]

So real quick, tell me, hey, girl, what's up? How you do that?

[Da Vinci]

Hey.

[Keke Palmer]

You ate that. That is so dope.

[Da Vinci]

Yeah, yeah. It's funny because a lot of people don't know that, but. So, yeah, I grew up in that environment, and I grew up with, you know, I grew up with straight monsters, man. I grew up with people that. That was just not monsters trying to outdo each other in cruelty from where we from, that's just all we knew. You know what I'm saying? When gangsters is just like, like, I'm gonna show you how much balls I got. Or like, yo, nah, you want to be down, you gotta do xyz. And I just think that was just a reality, you know, I mean, that the media. What the media was showing up was portraying. We was just looking up to all the gangsters. And me being the youngest, it's like I had to prove myself that I can hang. So, I mean, and that led me to, you know, a lot of things that I wasn't proud of. I got arrested when I was 13 years old. First time I got arrested, the juvenile detention center, the court, and all this stuff. But again, it wasn't because I was trying to be cool. It's just. That's all, you know. And I think Napoleon Hill, one of my favorite authors, he was like, nature forces upon the minds of men, the influences of their environment. So I was just being influenced by my environment. But after I started getting a lot of trouble, my dad, he. He took me in with his second family, me and my other brother. And we were the two youngest. And that right there, that changed me completely. I moved to Florida. That was a predominantly white school. And I stopped getting in trouble. I stopped getting D's and F's. I ended up graduating high school with a bubble 4.0 GPA. But, okay, yeah, it was literally because of my environment and probably because I was scared to get my ass beat by My pops, but it was just like, but I just watched that change. But yeah, I grew around the wolves, man, and the people that all these rappers be talking about, like they my, I really grew up around that. And that's why I'd never try to promote that. I never try to perpetuate that. A lot of times people look at me, they're like, yo, you seem like a good kid. You come from a two parent household, da da, da, da da. I don't come from none of that shit, but I just knew I was like, yo, if God bless me and be in this position, I'm not gonna perpetuate this stigma that I didn't create, that we didn't create. You know what I'm saying? We're perpetuating something that have nothing to do with us. That's not our culture.

[Keke Palmer]

What I'm hearing in, in your words is not only accountability in how your surroundings influenced your actions, but also compassion in the ways in which you've addressed it. How did you kind of find the way to have that compassion for yourself? Because I think what happens a lot of times, especially what I see in our young black man, is, you know, people always talk about or zero in on the day, don't have no accountability. They don't have accountability. But it's hard to have accountability when there is no compassion that can then be accompanied with it, you know, and everybody deserves to define self compassion. So it becomes difficult to call yourself out if you don't know the tools to have compassion for your actions. When you know, you maybe just didn't know you could make a better choice or didn't figure out how to make a better choice or didn't know why that was a choice you made to begin with. How did you find your path to being able to be accountable but then also say to yourself, look, I was doing my damn best, you know, and I'm going to do better. But you know, how did you find that?

[Da Vinci]

I, I think the, the reason why I develop a lot of compassion and, and I hold myself accountable is because when I see my brothers, you know, when I see my brothers, cousins and my friends that, you know, they literally lost their life, man. Some of them in jail until forever for the rest of their life. Some of them died of. Some of them because of the streets and because of drugs and self medicating, when you're dealing with our problems, you know, be smoked out, do whatever and they, God forbid they should get laced and some traumatic effect happens which affects them on a neurological level. And then they go on a trip and they never come back. So now they fiends, now they enable a fiend. I think when you just see the origin story of how it come out, it's like you're like, nah, I can't perpetuate this, bro. It's just like most likely your life expectancy is probably like 21. Or if you hit the right lick, maybe they say 25. But the amount of paranoia you got, cause it's ill gotten games. And you get hit, bro, you get hit with football numbers, baby.

[Keke Palmer]

This is Ike Palma. Yeah. Calling all lover girls, boys and non binary friends. Our time has come. The Bachelor is back, baby. And I couldn't be more excited to introduce y'all to Grant Ellis, season 29 certified heartthrob. Now, fans of the franchise may recognize him from Jen's season of the Bachelorette. But this time, Grant and his super charming smile are back for a second shot of love. And of course, I'm rooting for him for obvious reasons, but aside from the fact that Grant is an incredibly handsome 65 former basketball player who works in finance, the man is genuinely looking for the love of his life. Okay? He's earnest and wholesome, just like I like him. Now, y'all know I live for this franchise, right? The drama, the romance. It's a roller coaster of emotions, and I am strapped in for the ride. There's nothing else like it on tv, honey. And it's a classic. So tune in to watch the Bachelor premiere this Monday, January 27th at 8.7central on ABC. Plus you can stream the next day on Hulu. Don't miss out. There will be a quiz next week. All right, so you, you were talking about. Cause I was asking you about how you, how you found, you know, yourself having self compassion. And what it sounds like to me is you was having compassion for how you seen some of your brothers in the community, you know, have troubles. And it almost sounded like you, you started to have compassion for yourself out of necessity, you know what I mean? Almost like a coping mechanism. Like if I'm seeing my brothers in the community struggling like this and I'm seeing the pathways in which, how that happened. How can I look at myself and how can I maybe even like love on myself and like reroute and find solutions so that I don't turn to the same things they did. I literally was having a conversation about that with a close friend of mine not too long ago, a guy friend. And, you know, we were kind of going back and forth on that debate of like, you know, guys need to be able to free. Free to have more emotion and guys need to be. And he was like, I don't know if it's so much that guys need to have more emotion or they need to be telling everybody their feelings. I think it's like compassion, there needs to be more compassion in there. And I was like, damn, I never even really thought about it like that. But I think when we're talking about sometimes these romantic or platonic relationships back and forth with men and women, a lot of times what's missing is compassion because they're not necessarily able to know how to show compassion to themselves.

[Da Vinci]

Yeah, exactly. Exactly.

[Keke Palmer]

How can I show compassion to you, man, woman or otherwise if I don't have compassion for me?

[Da Vinci]

Facts.

[Keke Palmer]

That's deep. When is the first time that you heard someone mention mental health and you actually felt like you could see yourself in the conversation like where somebody you felt you related to?

[Da Vinci]

Probably, just probably a couple years ago. I think this was probably like, like maybe like three, four years ago. And, and I think it's because I was realizing what mental health actually is. Mental health is just making sure you're just balancing your emotional well being in your head. You know what I'm saying? You're making sure there's a healthy balance or you're relieving stress properly. You're not holding things in too much and it's just like physical. I love working out, you know what I'm saying?

[Keke Palmer]

I do. I agree with you so much on that. Working out will help your mind too, too.

[Da Vinci]

For a fact. For a fact. And then, and then if the more you work out and just make life easier, if you gotta go up a flight of stairs, it's easy if you got to go walk your dog, it's easy if you got a long day on set, you know what I'm saying? You gotta do xyz, you gotta walk to wherever it's, let's say your car breakdown, it's just easier to just move and you're not out of breath. And I just think when you start taking care of your mental health, it's the same way. But now mental illness is a different thing. And said when your mental health isn't at a healthy state anymore, so now there's is an actual illness there, you know what I'm saying?

[Keke Palmer]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's true. I'm so excited at the way that we are finding new ways to destigmatize what that means because we always talk about physical health. And physical illnesses, but you know. Yeah, like, really destigmatize and say, look, man, mental health is just keeping your mental in a good space. When your shit start going crazy, you start being hella negative. Your vibrations is low. You ain't got nothing good to say about nobody. You may be sick, motherfucker. There's no silver lining. Shit, you need some help fast. Nah, that's. Let me actually go deeper on that then. Like, what are some ways when you know your mental health may be struggling? Like, what's the dialogue in your head that lets you know, oh, shit, I gotta get myself back right real quick.

[Da Vinci]

I think, I think when I. When I get into a negative space and I don't see the silver lining or nothing, you know what I'm saying? I think when you lose gratitude for a second when you're not. When you're just. You're so, so present in your problem that you can't see the big picture, you know what I'm saying? Because sometimes your problem is just a speck of dust. But if you don't have the ability to step outside, like, you know what, bro? I'm healthy, I can walk. I got my bills paid. I'm the risk. Or if you don't and you can't, there's always something you could be grateful for.

[Keke Palmer]

That's right.

[Da Vinci]

It's always. I don't care what level you're at in this world, there is always something you can be grateful. And if you really, when you're able to see that, that's what is good. But then when you can't see that at all, I think you're really going through it. And it's usually when I'm going through that, I'm probably gonna go work out. I'm probably gonna call someone, vent if it's so bad, you know what I'm saying? I'll go back into, you know, in therapy, just let things out. But. But usually that's when I realize it's like when I'm highly stressed and I'm just mad as hell every little day.

[Keke Palmer]

Yeah. Yeah, I love that. Speaking of, like calling somebody to vent, I mean, you said something important earlier that, you know, when you move from your. Your older neighborhood with your grandmother and started living with your dad, and that kind of impacted your life positively. Positively. You started kind of changing from the street influence to just like, where is my life going to go now? Like, how am I going to evolve from here? You know, I think that's one of the most difficult things for people to do in terms of leaving the streets is there's a sense of community there, right? Like, you think about why people join gangs or get involved with anything, it's really a sense of, like, I need to have some type of community around me because I feel alone. There's so much loneline. And the way that we deal with that, it ranges, but it's not always necessarily positive. Even. Even still, it's hard to leave that community behind because they did help you to some degree. So how was that for you, stepping away from maybe some of those people and those habits that was once your community to maybe a community that was more serving to where you're trying to go?

[Da Vinci]

Well, that is a beautiful question, Kiki. That is a great question. Be honest. I struggle with that every day. I think that's one of the hardest things about success. And it's. And it's bittersweet, you know? But I think, again, understanding psychology, right? It was just simply understanding how your brain works. You understand that the human mind do not like change. Because back then, change could have resulted in. You're probably gonna die if you leave your tribe. Like, we've been cavemen and like, prehistoric dinosaur thinking human beings for way longer than we have been in this new society where we're exposed at a rate that no, every. No other human being has ever been exposed. Nowadays, you can go and just fly to China. You'll be in an entirely different culture. Back then, if you would have done that, you're gonna die in a different crime. You don't need to try. You don't have the same tattoos. You don't have the same color. It's a rat. So naturally, we don't like change. So I had to learn that and go against the grain. Cause we are so evolved now that it's so different. So it's like I told my body, like, yo, bro, like, you, if you don't make it out, this is your life. Like, you see your life, you see the most successful hood nigga, got a couple GS in his pocket, wilding, doing XYZ. But he's probably gonna end up dead or in jail. Ugh. You know what I'm saying? I'm like, that is my reality. And I want kids. So do I want my kids to go. So. So I think what was. Was my want and my purpose and my goal overrided that feeling, that animal instinct of wanting to stay. Sometimes you got to override your animality through purpose. And once you have a purpose, it becomes energetic. It's like this adrenaline, that rush in your body just. It supersedes everything else. It's just like, yo, as much as I have cookies and cupcakes and da, da, da, da.

[Keke Palmer]

Yeah, it's self preservation.

[Da Vinci]

It's like.

[Keke Palmer]

It' is what you're describing, an immense amount of self love.

[Da Vinci]

I love all my cousins and my brothers, but it's just like, nigga, I got to go. Because if we all fuck our lineage, our bloodline is done. And I looked at it like that. I'm like, yo, if I stay in this too, our bloodline is finito. So I'm just like, what I can do is get the fuck out of here. And in doing that, y'all might be mad for a little bit, but now all the mortgages are paid, all the bills are paid. You see what I'm saying? So if I would have paid, it would have been a ride. And I just.

[Keke Palmer]

Yeah, you had to learn to see the forest from the trees, see the bigger picture. But to that point, to any. Anybody that's listening, like, what do those. What I mean, you have to list every step. But what does some of those steps look like? Stepping away from habits and people that maybe aren't currently serving you in the best way. Like, is that just not picking up the phone this week? Is that being communicative and saying, hey, look, man, I can't do this?

[Da Vinci]

I would say, first off. First off, you gotta have a good relationship with God. And what I've learned. What I've learned.

[Keke Palmer]

Come on.

[Da Vinci]

What I've learned in my struggle. Not trying to preach, but it's just right.

[Keke Palmer]

You got preach, brother, preach.

[Da Vinci]

You gotta hit rock bottom. Because when you hit rock bottom, you know who the. Who's the rock at the bottom, which is God. And then the minute you get to that point where you at that level, none of your friends matter no more. None of your friends and family don't matter.

[Keke Palmer]

Family either.

[Da Vinci]

Yeah, your friends, family don't even matter anymore. And. And I think. And that's what. That's the. You know, when I'm ignoring all the calls, someone call, Hang up. Someone call, don't pick up, Change my number, block them. You know what I'm saying? But. But to me, it's just like, I got the relationship. I got my relationship with God. No matter what happens, I'm straight.

[Keke Palmer]

We have to pull this out because what you're speaking to is so important in, I believe, helping us resist external confirmations and validations, which are sometimes so necessary. We're human beings, right? We Want to see things that we. We want to have things we can touch, see and feel that let us know we're on the right track or that we're not alone, or we feel comfort, et cetera. But. But in the words of Lacan, I mean, he maybe never said these words, but obviously his teachings are about language. His teachings are about language. And I know language can be difficult for people. So I'm not saying you got to be this kind of religion, that kind of religion, but when we talk about God, we're talking about that. That thing that lives in each and every one of us that's deep, deep inside, that is always there for you, whether you want to lean into it or not. And when you absolutely go through rock bottom and the external validations are no longer confirming you to be who you think you are or who you want to be, there's no other way or other place you can go than inside. And then you realize, damn, it was always there all along. And I wish that I could articulate it further than that, but that's why we say God. We say God because that's what. That's what it is. That's that feeling. That's that thing. And 100%. I couldn't agree with you more, man. When I have gone through the most horrible times of my life, I remember as a kid when me and my family, they didn't understand what I was going through. I remember when I got a call from Will Smith saying, look, I've been through the same thing. You're going to get there. You're going to be. When you're the first person in your family, when you're stepping out, you're breaking generational curses. When you're doing something different, it feels lonely, but you're not alone. And all I had was me, my journal, and that inner voice, that inner thing that I can never be disconnected from. And that's God for me. And so I agree so much, man. It's so true. And it really. It's hard. It's unfortunate that sometimes, you know, you have to be stripped to some degree to get to that point.

[Da Vinci]

But.

[Keke Palmer]

But every. Everybody has a version of it.

[Da Vinci]

Yeah. Discipline is the key. I think without discipline, a man and a woman don't stand a chance against life. You gotta be disciplined. You gotta be disciplined. And sometimes, the same way you say no to other people, they don't realize that you're saying no to yourself. You know what I'm saying? But they don't even have the level of consciousness to understand that type of thinking. So to them it's just like the coolest thing about being humans is. Is. Is a cool thing, but it's also a scary thing. It's like if you have 10 giraffes, you have 10 giraffes, you have 10 zebras, you have 10 zebras, 10 dogs, you have 10 dogs, you got 10 humans. It's not 10 humans. The only human beings are just built different, bro. You can't talk to them like. Or you could talk to this human being on a way you can talk to yourself. You just. I had to come to terms with that in peace. Like, I'm like, oh my, that's tough. Even though we both speak in English, we speak a different level of English to where it's just like your ones and needs. And my ones need is completely different, bro.

[Keke Palmer]

Yes, yes. It's so true. That is, that is. That's the like whole coexisting gag. It's so. I don't know if you saw Deadpool recently, but I love this little moment. Did you see Deadpool?

[Da Vinci]

No, you didn't?

[Keke Palmer]

I'm not.

[Da Vinci]

I didn't watch it. I want to watch. I heard it's good.

[Keke Palmer]

It was really good. I've seen it like twice now. But anyway, another. Another conversation for another day. Somebody we have in common that we both love, who taught me a lot, just about like self awareness, self power, manifesting your dreams, like not always being a product of where you're from is Tupac Shakur.

[Da Vinci]

Oh my God.

[Keke Palmer]

I know he's somebody that you really love, that you speak about as well. If you could pick one thing or a couple of things like that, his story or his music or who he was as an artist, how it impacted you, like, what would it be?

[Da Vinci]

So, okay, wow. You asking questions? You asking some good ass questions. I think I gotta start this out. I think if I was born in a different family, I probably would have been a scientist because my ability to observe and draw conclusions and come up with different type of hypothesis and theories and xyz, it's like, it's my greatest asset. And I studied Tupac closely and I watched how he was when he was in high school. That drama kid, innocent kid, and how he was just talking and he was just talking about his arts. He was so flamboyant and just like different theater kids then to him turn into the. Hit him up, you know what I'm saying? Pac was completely different. Pac. And it was just his environment, it was a matter of his environment that completely changed this guy had a really good heart, but he went out into the world, he was around certain gangsters. He started seeing a certain side of life that kind of turned his heart. So I looked at that and I was like, I gotta make sure no matter what I do in this world, no matter where God take me, me, I keep my heart the same way it's been in the beginning, right? I can't. I can't change that. Also, when Pac was arrested and when he was locked up, he was reading a lot. Like, pop is the reason why I started reading books because he made it look cool to read. And the thing is, just like, you know, when you come from a certain environment, nobody's reading, bro. You're not gonna do that. But if you see a gangster reading, you're like, oh, like, they read too. Like, and then you start realizing and you know when people say certain things like, you want to hide something from black man? Put it in a book. So I just started. I started reading a lot because I started learning about our history, where we come from and why. Why? Like, you know what I'm saying? That the system was set up the way it is. Why Pac was saying certain things like, oh, we all run around suicide strapped. And how we. When him saying certain things like, stuck niggas is lucky if we bust out the shit.

[Keke Palmer]

What's that mean? What's that mean?

[Da Vinci]

He said, we all run around suicidal straps. You know what I'm saying? And then.

[Keke Palmer]

Oh, yes.

[Da Vinci]

And then he was. And he was. And he was also saying, like, he was stuck niggas is lucky if we bust out this. He was just saying, like, bro, there's an entire system put in play for you to be stuck. Like, you really have to understand this. And like, a lot of times when people listen to music and we're really not getting it, but we're just like, yo, like, there was an entire nation. This is so deep. The ones who founded this country said, we have to keep this group in bondage no matter what. You know what I'm saying? And he talks about that all through music, which that made me like, yo, let me start doing research. What is he talking about? We stuck. You know what I'm saying? Like, how are black people that are you going to get like, oh, well.

[Keke Palmer]

I mean, that's the foundation of what? Of how. I mean, James Baldwin speaks to that a lot. But he also speaks to the reality that if I treat one people this way, then you also won't realize how badly I'm treating you. And I Think that's what a lot of people are waking up to is because it's easy to be like, oof, who are they treating? Black folks crazy. Glad I'm not black until you realize that they're treating black people crazy. But they're also treating me poorly. But they wanted me to focus on just this so that I wouldn't actually start focusing on this. And that's why it's so important that we come together, which, you know, I think we're. We're in interesting times where that could be a possibility, where I have people that are like. I remember as a kid, like, you know, going to school and the conversations around blackness. And what I was up against was just not even a conversation. And then we had move movies like Dear White People, and now we have conversations like the one we're having right now. And so, you know, it's like, I didn't even know words like microaggression existed until, like, six, seven years ago. So it's like, you know, people are waking up to the realities that I think a lot of people like Tupac Shakur, you know, in his way, in his fashion, just like James Baldwin, you know, just like Toni Morrison, you know what I'm saying? With racism being. Being meant to be a distraction, you know what I mean? Like, the country is built on something rudimentary, which is ultimately slavery of all.

[Da Vinci]

And only a few have sex because of capitalism, man. I'll be telling my friends. I be telling some of my white friends this. I'm like, bro, you a nigga too now, right?

[Keke Palmer]

Like, we. Like, we all.

[Da Vinci]

I'm like, we're in this together. We should really team up.

[Keke Palmer]

Like, no, for real. Like, we really need to power range this shit.

[Da Vinci]

It's not about color no more. But we was just the first. Like, we was just the start of this. It's really capitalism, you know what I'm saying? That's really what it is.

[Keke Palmer]

Last question. What is something that you would say to someone that's having trouble figuring out, and I'll say specifically black men. You know what I'm saying? Obviously, everybody's struggling with mental health for a million, every little different group, many marginal, we all have something. But as a black man, I think it's important to hear from other black men. How would you assist in words or tangible practices that can help a black man that ain't never ever to, you know, partook in nothing like this before figure out how to approach his mental health?

[Da Vinci]

I. I would say, first off, I think you need to Find somebody to talk to, whether. And you could be a good friend. You don't even got to pay for therapy. It could be a good friend that you guys hold each other accountable. And if you don't have a good friend around, then definitely look for a therapist. And if you cannot afford that, go on YouTube, type in your favorite celebrities or authors, or just type in motivational videos. Start listening to some human beings speak on positivity. Start doing that. That is very important. And if this, if church don't resonate with you, if pastors don't resonate with you, look for a motivational speaker, look for something that you like and then just start diving into that world. I think we have a lot of access to information in this day and age to where it's like, like if you can't have someone to talk to, you can't go to therapy, you can't do, for whatever reason, try to go on YouTube. And I'm sure one of those options are probably going to work. And in doing that, then just start, start being honest with yourself, start. I would write down what's making you mad and why. And then, and then just, just, just write it down. Because a lot of times writing it down is the first way you could actually see the problem. You can see the problem and just try to find solutions to with. Then start, start meditating, start, start, you know, just taking in a lot of positive things, start cutting negative things out of your circle. Whatever's bringing you sadness and making you mad itself, start removing that out of your circle. And I think you, you gotta switch your mental diet up for like 30 days. And I swear you're gonna start seeing results. And that's from me, what I do, I meditate a lot. That's guided meditations on YouTube. You can literally type in 10 minute meditation for exotic, 10 minute meditation for depression, 10 minute meditation for whatever. And then boom. And it's a guided meditation. And then I started reading certain books, certain movies, certain songs, certain things I don't even watch no more.

[Keke Palmer]

And honestly, so I'm hearing self reflective journaling, inundating yourself with positive things, whether it be books, specials, YouTube documentaries. I'm hearing using the Internet as a source of self discovery, which is like something very personal to me. I remember when I was 17, I started going into this website called thinkexists.com and you just click a word like for me, I would put in like stress or anger or sadness and then all these amazing quotes from amazing philosophers would come up. And that's how I Discovered Aristotle and really teachings of Buddhism, like all of that. So I really relate to that. And I'm also hearing, you know, find somebody that you feel safe with. Like when you said you don't have a friend or somebody to talk to.

[Da Vinci]

Right? And then yeah, and most importantly, just, just limit your distractions. I think social media, it's a big tool to be stressed, have a lot of anxiety and then just suffer a lot mentally. So I personally after, if I'm not posting for like fan engagements or whatever, I'm not on social media, I delete it all the time. It's just not good to keep looking at different images that have nothing to do with next and comparing yourself to people and then just all that stuff. It's just like that's not where you should spend most of your time because that right there is too many. There's too much information out there that's leading to that making a lot of human beings depressed and sad. So I'll just limit that out. You cut the distractions out and then you start focusing on what really matters.

[Keke Palmer]

Da Vinci, I could talk to you for hours. I actually feel like we did talk for hours the first time that we had met. I feel like I remember us going off on some deep ass distractions. Right.

[Da Vinci]

That's a fact.

[Keke Palmer]

This brought back memories. So we're gonna have to really do this again. I don't wanna keep you too long, but, but, but, but I'd love to finish our conversation with a little quick game. Is that okay with you?

[Da Vinci]

Let's do it. Let's do it.

[Keke Palmer]

Okay. The game is called Here for it or not and it's pretty simple. I'll name something and you just have to tell me if you hear for it or if you not ready. Okay. Astrology here for it or Nah, nah. So you don't know your rising or your moon?

[Da Vinci]

Nah, I think it's cancer. I think it's.

[Keke Palmer]

Oh my gosh, you're so hilarious.

[Da Vinci]

I think there's this, there's truth in it, but I don't think we have the accurate truth to something that powerful that you could predict. Xyz. The way they make buying a fucking house so goddamn hard in this country. Ain't no fucking way that that information is just so damn accessible that it could really help you. Ain't no way.

[Keke Palmer]

You literally sound like an air sign saying that. Okay, ghosting, as in you ghosting someone else here for it or no.

[Da Vinci]

Air sign saying that I'm a.

[Keke Palmer]

You do air signs say like that? Are you an air sign.

[Da Vinci]

I'm a Libra. I don't know.

[Keke Palmer]

Yes, you're an air sign. Yes, you are. That's like the air sign. Y'all are always so in the wind and so above it all.

[Da Vinci]

What was the second question?

[Keke Palmer]

It was ghosting. As in you ghosting someone else. Are you here for it or not?

[Da Vinci]

I'm here for it. For my mental health. Absolutely.

[Keke Palmer]

I already know. Come on. Mental health. I had to ghost you now. That's good. Now that's t, boo. I love that one. I'm gonna have to steal that. Look, honestly, for my mental health, I just have to. You know that's why you ain't talked to me in 10 years, right?

[Da Vinci]

You ghost me in mental health. I ain't mad at that.

[Keke Palmer]

Okay. Hmm. Oh, daily journaling. Here for it or. Nah, I'm here for it, period. I know. You said. I figured you were gonna be here for that because you give that and you said that that's what you do. So amazing. Same here. Dating other famous people. Here for it or not?

[Da Vinci]

Nah.

[Keke Palmer]

Literally nah.

[Da Vinci]

What? That is like two crazy lines. Like, somebody has to be saved.

[Keke Palmer]

Bingo. I was like, I feel like we both have that same vibe where it's like we're trying so hard to straddle what we do for our jobs and having that grounded, simple simplicity, like just being able to feel real and not everything being so heightened.

[Da Vinci]

Like, I don't think. And this is very unpopular and I might get shit for that, but I just don't think it's conducive to a healthy life. Like, human beings, we're creatures of habits. Right. Whenever you're not in a state that is a habit, there's a system already. You're not going to be happy. This is going to be depression. It's going to be anxiety. So we fly all that shit. Like that's already playing with our brains. Like that's not healthy one. Right. We're supposed to be still somewhere else. We know what's happening on Monday, Friday, Tuesday, next week, da, da, da. Tomorrow you could be in Australia still in a damn event. You know what I'm saying? So one person in this situation gotta be safe, whether it's the man or the woman, Whatever.

[Keke Palmer]

I never kid is done.

[Da Vinci]

The kid is done.

[Keke Palmer]

I don't think I was really able to articulate that, what you said right then, but that's exactly what it is. It's the stability factor. You know, we don't have any stability. We gotta be just thoot, thoot, thoot. Thoot and my family for me, like that is what I always look for too in a romantic partner is what I had in my family. They was my stability. I knew I could count on them. I knew this and that. I knew. You know what I mean? As opposed to just how we both on two different sides of the world. That's just too much. That's what I'm saying.

[Da Vinci]

It's like two kids, like one person got a. You know what I'm saying? And the thing is, there is nothing wrong with that job either. And I do. I will say this. I hate when men be like, oh, my God, why my wife agreed, divorced and she's trying to take half. Yeah, she deserve it. She deserve it. If she was handling what she was handling, she's the reason why come on that mental piece to do xyz. But they're just so dumb and they're not aware that they can't even think about it for. But yeah, she deserve it because that job is just as important as flying and filming whatever fucking Marvel movie you're filming.

[Keke Palmer]

So I will say that they are literally going to be starving the way you ate up this podcast. Okay. They are going to be starving because you're eating down. Okay. All right, last one. I know you haven't really done this yet, but I'm just curious. Directing and producing here for it or not?

[Da Vinci]

I'm here for it. I'm here for it for sure.

[Keke Palmer]

Period. I would totally be in your movie because I can already tell by you, by your. You would be able to really give some good direction and some insight to the character. I could already see you directing. It's coming from you naturally. Oh, oh. But I feel like I've got to ask this for the girls. This is the one question that I knew I had forgotten. I'm glad I remember before I let you go, which is you said, and you say often, that you really want kids. I'm curious, and this is for the ladies listening. Is your interest for kids just as strong as your interest in being married?

[Da Vinci]

Absolutely.

[Keke Palmer]

Okay. Why so this is not a trick question. I'm just curious.

[Da Vinci]

No, I just believe in a family nucleus. And I think having a mother and father in a household just increases the success chance of the. Of a child. And another reason why that for a long time they was destroying the family nucleus in black households because they understood that there's a mother and father in the house that increases the chance of that slave kid, that Negro, to become successful. So you got to destroy that. You got to make the woman ahead of the household and emasculate them out. Like this was, this was a science that you can look this up. Like this is what they realized, you know what I'm saying? That's why for a while in America, even with the welfare system, that if you had a man in the house, you can't qualify. A man has to be out the house, you know. Yeah, there's different games.

[Keke Palmer]

We did section eight.

[Da Vinci]

We had to destroy the family nucleus. But that's the most important thing in this world. That's why a lot of other countries that when we're looked at as a laughingstock of the world, they. They value that. A lot of other countries value family. I think without a family nucleus, there's. There's nothing you do. Like, you need a team in this world. You need a team. You need just like, just, I mean, hell, just like an entertainer. You got their manager, agent, lawyers. That's what mother, mother and father, and that's what that is. You need a village, you know what I'm saying? So. So I definitely understand importance of that. And I watch what that did to my family. Not having both of that in my house. You know, a lot of my, my brothers, a lot of stuff would have been avoided if it was both things in the house. You know, both parents in the house. So I definitely value that and I respect that a lot. I think that right there could single handedly help the black community tremendously if we stop promoting promiscuity and n. Mother and father in the house. And you twerk on your damn husband. Do that. I think right there.

[Keke Palmer]

No more pussy popping on a handstand, you said?

[Da Vinci]

Yeah. If we promoted that like to say equal with the promiscuous that we promote, man, I think we'll see a huge change in the black community.

[Keke Palmer]

I'm here for the equalness. I'm here for the equalness. We can have some pussy popping.

[Da Vinci]

Yeah.

[Keke Palmer]

Yeah, we can have some. You know, I just think it needs.

[Da Vinci]

To be right now. It's here. This is pussy popping. I think it just needs to be the. Like here at least.

[Keke Palmer]

You know what I'm saying?

[Da Vinci]

Pussy popping is fun. You need a little bit.

[Keke Palmer]

I love how the pussy popping is still slightly above but like closer.

[Da Vinci]

Yeah, you can have that. Like, it's good to have Doritos and cakes and cookies and shit like that. But you need the greens, you need your water, you need your. You know what I'm saying? You need both to have a good world. That's a garden, right There, you know? And you only have one.

[Keke Palmer]

I am beyond here for you. Okay, Da Vinci. And I'm just so glad that you've never changed. You're still that same person that I met those six years ago. So even with all your success, and I know it's going to continue, I can't wait for us to both keep riding this wave together and see where else we meet again.

[Da Vinci]

No, thank you so much. I appreciate all that. And by the way, I gotta give you your flowers. You are a legend. Like, I grew up watching. Stop to be here right now just having this conversation with you. I mean, we talk outside of this, but this is kind of crazy. Like, I managed to bust my ass so hard in life that I'm sitting at the table right now talking. You know what I'm saying? You are a goat. You're not even thinking you're a goat. Like you. You're a legend. So, honestly, kudos to you and your family and everyone that contributed to your success because you a legend, bro. For real.

[Keke Palmer]

For real.

[Da Vinci]

So thank you.

[Keke Palmer]

That means the world. Thank you. Thank you. I feel like Daventry is such an old soul and I really respect him for speaking about the causes that are important to him and sharing his views. I'm always going to be cheering him on, and I hope you will, too. Well, that's a wrap for this one. But don't worry, don't stress. I'll be back next time because you know, it's your girl. Baby, this is. This is Kiki. Baby, this is Kiki Palmer. Yeah, enjoy. Baby, this is Keke Palmer on the Wondery app. Wherever you get your podcasts and now on YouTube where you can watch full episodes. Subscribe to the wondery channel on YouTube and don't miss any episodes. You can listen to Baby, this is Keke Palmer early and ad free on Wondery. Join Wondery in the Wondery app or on Apple podcasts. Baby this is Keke Palmer is hosted and executive produced by me, Keke Palmer. Lucas Seagal is our post producer. Music supervisor is Scott Velasquez. Our original theme song was written and performed by me, Keke Palmer for Team Keke. My producer is Sharon Palmer for Wondery. Our managing producer is Olivia Fonti. Our producer is Tristan McNeil. Senior producers are Lizzie Bassett and Candice Manriquez Wren. Our executive producers are Dave Easton and Marshall Louis.