A (2:30)

That's one.

B (2:30)

Yeah. I've been sort of like, working half days while on little one stuff and just trying to get Everything organized for the new year. And I. I feel good. I feel really good.

A (2:42)

That's great. What good energy to bring into the New year.

B (2:45)

Thanks. Yeah, I feel like we both had just, like, very chill, very relaxed, restorative times, and now we're ready to just focus. But tell me about your high.

A (2:55)

My high is just that I'm feeling so restored after taking a little holiday break. I was not working half days. I was straight chilling. I was home, I was reading, I was going on little New York adventures with friends. I just feel so restored after being offline, being off work. Like, I truly feel like. I feel like most times in January I come in and I'm like, I'm so tired. I'm drained, you know? And this year I feel great. I feel really restored. So I. I've said restored seven times, but that's how I feel. And I am.

B (3:35)

I also said restored. So we are very restored.

A (3:38)

We're restored. And yesterday, Sunday, I just really filled up with New Year's energy.

B (3:46)

What did you do? Anything in particular that got you there or.

A (3:50)

Well, I woke up feeling New Year's energy, but I. I finalized my goals for this episode, so I did some journaling and I was, you know, I'd already had a list going since maybe October, but I cemented my goals, put them on a big post it note above my desk, and then I made my mood board for this year, which I always love, and I made it my desktop background.

B (4:12)

So, yeah, Ready to go.

A (4:15)

Ready to go.

B (4:16)

Well, what's your low?

A (4:17)

My low is also that I'm ready to go.

B (4:20)

My secret transition, starting strong this year.

A (4:23)

I know, I know. Well, I had a really terrible last transition of last year, so I'm making it up to myself. I have to move apartments. I found this out. I actually found this out last summer. I found this out in July, about an hour before the lobster roll off started. And then I cried, and then I won the lobster roll off. But it's definitely been an adjustment to get used to. My landlord sold our building. We were originally told that the new owner would want to keep the tenants in place. And then immediately after the building sold, she was like, nope, we're kicking everyone out and renovating and jacking up the rent. So I've spent all of the fall trying to find a new apartment, which has been its own struggles. I think I'm set. All the people who want to know where I'm going to move stay in here. I'm not quite ready to talk about it yet because I don't want to jinx anything until it's officially official. Official. But this has been a big story stressor through my fall and I was really bummed about it because I love my apartment so much. I've decorated it the way I wanted, was, I guess, in some ways, my first. It's not my first grown up apartment, but it feels like my first. I don't know, it feels like home in a way that no other apartment I've lived in has. So it was a real bummer. But I. I do think I've, over the course of the past five months, turned the corner to being excited for what's next. But, yeah, I am gonna have to move probably later this month.

B (5:55)

Well, I am excited for you, but that is a long period of time to have this in the background, which, of course, we've already talked about this. But I'm excited for you. You love fresh starts.

A (6:05)

I do.

B (6:05)

I think that's gonna be exciting.

A (6:07)

I do. It adds a layer to this year of fresh start energy.

B (6:11)

Yeah. New book, fresh start. It's exciting. But I'm also excited for you just to not have this on your mental plate.

A (6:19)

Oh, yeah. I'm really excited to do the damn thing and actually move instead of thinking about having to move and all of that. And I'm excited to purge all of the junk I've accumulated in this house and donate a lot of stuff and organize everything.

B (6:34)

It's gonna be stressful in the moment, but afterwards I think you're gonna feel, dare I say, restored.

A (6:43)

Hope so. Hope so. What about you? What's your low?

B (6:46)

I have two. First, is that early December, I got a pimple. And you know, this is something that just happens, obviously, but it was just one of those annoying, stubborn, very deep cystic pimples. And usually if this happens to me, it lasts for maybe a week or so. It would not go away for weeks and weeks. It has only just now started to fade on my chin. And I have a scar now. Cause of course I couldn't leave it alone. But it was just through all the holidays. I had to go back through my pictures and be like, when did this begin? Why is this still here? At one point I was like, is it skin cancer? Of course this is me. But we're good. It's going away. It's just. It haunted me. It haunted me. It was the worst thing and it was right on my chin. And anyway, is. That was a low. That was the part one of two of this low.

A (7:37)

Well, you too have a fresh start.

B (7:39)

It's true. I am reborn.

A (7:41)

New year. New chin.

B (7:43)

Yeah. Gosh. Thank God. Honestly, I was. It was bad. Second Low is my hottest hot take, I think, ever, which is that I hated Marty supreme more than I have hated probably any film I have watched in the last five years.

A (7:59)

I don't know that that's a super hot take. I feel like I've seen very mixed reviews for it. I've seen a lot of bros singing the praises, but I don't know that I've seen uniformly positive reviews.

B (8:11)

Maybe this is just what I've seen on Letterboxd, which I am a new user on Letterboxd. I've been enjoying it, but it just feels like even people who are like, oh, the movie was fine. Are like, I thought Timothee Chalamet's performance was incredible. There's a lot of talk that he's gonna win the Oscar. He just won the Critics Choice Award. I thought, this is just two and a half hours of me watching Timothee Chalamet be annoying. Like, I. At no point was I, like, I am watching this. This guy named Marty. I could only see Timothee Chalamet. I thought it was. I just. I don't need to sit through two and a half hours.

A (8:45)

About two and a half hours is too long for a movie.

B (8:48)

I.

A (8:48)

Our collective attention spans are shorter than ever. Yeah. We need to keep movies ideally 90 minutes, but definitely under two hours.

B (8:57)

Definitely. And it's just like, he's a bad person from start to finish. He hurts everyone around him. There's a dog that gets hurt kind of repeatedly. I just thought, I don't get this at all, but did you see Uncut Gems?

A (9:10)

I didn't.

B (9:11)

Okay, I didn't either. Which is also by this director. And now I won't be seeing it because maybe just not for me.

A (9:19)

Did you see the movie with Jake or with other people?

B (9:22)

I saw it with Jake, and he also hated it.

A (9:24)

Okay. I was gonna say, was this contentious with your viewing partners?

B (9:29)

No, he hated it probably as much as I did. I was like, did you hate it more than Materialist? Because Materialist is the movie that Jake talks about is, like, the worst movie he's ever seen. And he was like, it's close. Wow.

A (9:40)

So, yeah, I don't think I was gonna see this to begin with, but now I definitely am not gonna see it.

B (9:46)

Don't. Don't see it. Don't see it. But, yeah, that's my love.

A (9:51)

Well, we have a lot to get to today. Should we take a quick ad break and then get into the meat of this episode.

B (9:57)

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A (11:41)

Okay, so first stop, we're going to review 2025 goals and how we did. But before we do that, I want to know how you felt Overall about your 2025.

B (11:52)

I feel good about it. I think this was a very good year for me personally. Yeah, that's the simplest answer. I guess we'll probably get more into it when we go through these goals. But how did it work for you?

A (12:03)

I felt really good about 2025, separating out world events, politics, et cetera. But on a personal level, I had a really tough 2024 on basically every front. Career, personal, et cetera. And 2025. I kind of feel like I came out of the haze. I got some confidence back. Things were going much better. So I feel good about 2025.

B (12:29)

Good.

A (12:29)

I don't feel scared to do this check in the same way that I feel like at the beginning of last year's episode I was like I'm terrified, I don't wanna. Or even at mid year I was like, I don't know how I feel.

B (12:39)

Did you listen to the original goals episode from last year and or the mid year goals check in?

A (12:46)

No.

B (12:47)

You didn't listen to either of them?

A (12:48)

No, I had all the goals written down. I get a little too in my head about re listening to episodes that's.

B (12:56)

I mean it's a lot to listen to yourself. But I just listened to the mid year one which was really helpful. But if there's anything interest you said or I'll bring it up if you forgot.

A (13:06)

Okay. So let's start with personal goals. Olivia, how did you do?

B (13:12)

I think I did pretty good. I did pretty good. I had started it pretty easy just with my now I guess tradition of writing a letter to my future self, which I did. I actually haven't reviewed that yet. I plan to do that this week to read that one from last year and also write my new one. But check I did this. No problem. The next thing was an exercise routine which I wrote that I wanted to exercise four to five days a week. I think I do this. I do this. Yeah, I'm in a pretty good routine. I'm doing three times a week. I do a weight routine, like a strength training routine, which is the only time I have done this consistently in many years. So it feels like second nature now, I guess. Or at least something I. At the very least it's something I really look forward to. So that's great. I feel good about it. I don't beat myself up if I miss a day or something. But I feel strong. I can like feel a difference in just how my body like moves.

A (14:10)

So.

B (14:11)

So yeah, I check did this. And similarly I also had daily walks with Winnie here, which I definitely am doing. I kind of combine this with the exercise routine. I guess sometimes we go on shorter walks, sometimes they're very long, but this is definitely a thing. I think she's been benefiting from it. I definitely have. I've loved doing this in all seasons. I actually did get a long puffer this year that goes to my ankles and that has made a huge difference. I love it.

A (14:40)

I'm so impressed that you're getting out there in these arctic days.

B (14:44)

It's pretty bad. As long as the driveway is not icy. I, I do my best to be out there and the cold is actually, I think, really refreshing. But it's about the outerwear, you know, it's like I have my hat, I have my bonnet, I have my gloves. I like gear up and it usually is fine. So this next one, I think is my first fail, which is to plan for a Japan trip. And it's really funny because I re listened to the mid year goals episode and I was so confident this would happen. I was like, this is happening. It hasn't happened yet, but this is gonna happen. And no, no plans have been made whatsoever.

A (15:22)

Do you still want to go on a Japan trip?

B (15:25)

I do. I desperately want to go to Japan. But I just looking at my next year, I do not foresee it being a thing that is feasible either time or money wise. So I think I may have to push this off for a future year maybe. Okay, the next one I did succeed and that was to give up Jarlic.

A (15:45)

And I feel like we need a round of applause. Sound effect.

B (15:48)

Thank you. Thank you. I'm very proud of this. Yeah, I got a garlic press, which was really just the only thing I needed. So it works and I really enjoy using it. It's very satisfying. So I did this. Next thing was to get the library bookshelves done. And with the exception of the ladder, which we still have to order, it is done. They are done. They are installed. I haven't been great about organizing the books, but eventually I will get there.

A (16:17)

Have you done both sides? I knew you did one side that you've been showing and then is the other side empty, waiting for books or we just don't see that side.

B (16:25)

The other side is maybe like a quarter full and I could even them out. So. So truthfully, the plan was to really purge my entire book collection before I started filling up the shelves and to get rid of a bunch of books. And then I had a photo shoot at my house and I thought, I have these shelves. I don't want to have two books on them. You know, 10 books. So I kind of styled one half of them for the photos, and now I have not purged them. That's just a bunch of books that I was going to get rid of that now I am keeping. But eventually I will do that.

A (17:03)

Eventually you'll get to the point where it's one in, one out.

B (17:05)

Yes. That might be what just has to happen at this point.

A (17:09)

Yeah, that's where I am. I was doing my reading stats for 2025 yesterday, and I read so much on E Reader this year, way more than in any past year, because I'm on a one in, one out policy.

B (17:21)

Yeah, it's smart. They add up quickly. They really do. So the next one, I don't think I did this really, which is to. Well, maybe I half did it. And that's to save aggressively for a kitchen renovation. Did I save money? Yes. Did I save aggressively? Probably not. I. In general, and we'll get to this in the goals for 2026, but in general, I am horrible with budgeting. Like, very bad and very undisciplined. So I would like to change this. But I did save money, but, like, not probably as. As much as I would.

A (17:59)

Not kitchen money.

B (18:00)

Yeah, necessarily.

A (18:02)

I'm very excited to see if kitchen is on the docket this year.

B (18:05)

Well, we'll see. Certainly not kitchen and Japan. I'll say that.

A (18:08)

Oh, okay. Yeah.

B (18:09)

The next one was to take a break on major house projects and just thoughtfully furnish rooms. And I think we did this. I mean, in general, I think we took a break from almost all house stuff for the most part. And it was really nice because the first two years we were just doing stuff constantly. And yeah, we got some stuff here and there, but in general, we just kind of relaxed, and I think that was a great choice. And our new bed is arriving soon, so that was one thing we did invest in that was long overdue. So I'm very excited about that. And then this last one I added in June, which is that I was thinking about getting ankle weights. Cause I was going on these very long walks around my town, and I wanted to find a way to level them up. And I did not get ankle weights. But I have been doing these strength training routines three times a week, so I think we can call it a win. Even if I didn't get the ankle weights, I feel like some weights.

A (19:06)

I feel like there's a lesson here that maybe we shouldn't add mid year goals because we don't really mean them. Because I did not do any of my mid year additions.

B (19:14)

Yeah. Also, I think any goal that requires me to purchase something that I may already have a version of is probably not a worthy goal. And that, except for getting the garlic breast, which was worth every penny. But, like, I already had an adjustable weight dumbbell set. Like, I could have just been using those, and I did. So I actually feel better about that than buying something I probably don't need. Let's get into your personal goals. Did you learn to roast a whole chicken, Olivia?

A (19:42)

I sure didn't. Starting off with a big L, which is fine. I like, added this goal because I thought it would be fun. I wanted to have fun goals. And When I found out I would have to move, I kind of just felt so overwhelmed by the idea of hosting in my current house because I felt like I might have to move at any minute. I didn't want to plan anything until I had certainty around moving. I did get it together to host Friendsgiving, but this one went out the window. I also think that I realized I really appreciate the aesthetics of a roast chicken when I see it on tv. When I see it on Instagram, I'm kind of grossed out by chicken. I don't want to put my hand in there. I want someone to roast me a chicken.

B (20:26)

This is something that came up in the mid year episode as well. I was like, have you done this? And you were like, no. I'm afraid of the inside.

A (20:31)

I'm afraid of the inside of chicken. Like the outside of chicken sometimes grosses me out.

B (20:37)

It's not the best texturally. Let's just be honest. It's. I mean this sounds fine. It's not for you, you know, it's. It's spiritually not aligned with you. And I think that's fine.

A (20:48)

Maybe at some point I will retackle this. But not.

B (20:52)

I mean it's always there. As I said in the mid year episode as well, the chicken is always there for you. So anytime you feel inspired, maybe in your new kitchen, maybe, but okay.

A (21:04)

The rest of them I feel good about. I continued my five year journal and long form journaled. I said once a week. I don't think it was always once a week, but I filled up, I would say 60% of a large journal, which makes me so happy. And I feel like both of these habits have become cemented. And I went through all of my 2025 long form journal entries on Christmas Eve and I was so grateful to have them. And the specificity around how I felt at certain points during the year around certain things that happened. I was like, I love having this record. So I feel like that reinforced the habit too.

B (21:47)

That's a really nice Christmas Eve activity.

A (21:50)

Yeah, it wasn't intentional but I was just writing in it and I had some time and I was like, let me go back and read all the other entries. My next one is screen time under four hours. I don't know if I did this. I did this sometimes for sure. I feel more relaxed about it. I do not feel like my phone was an impediment to writing and work this year the same way that it was in 2024. So I don't know if this is huge. Yeah, I don't know if this is a check, but I feel good. The next one was to work on my mindset, which I remember saying in the mid year episode that I wasn't sure if I actually specifically did anything. I talked about it in therapy. Obviously, I think this was more circumstantial that I was having a better year by the luck of the draw. And so my mindset improved. Although I did start reading the Courage to Be Disliked, which is a Japanese philosophy book. And I heard about it of all places on Call Her Daddy. She did an episode about people pleasing. And so I started this over the winter break and I'm only maybe a quarter of the way through, but I feel like this maybe is a tactical thing that I am doing to further this goal.

B (23:01)

Oh, that's good. What's like the biggest takeaway from it so far, do you think?

A (23:06)

I'm not sure yet. It is basically introducing a school of philosophy that I'm not ready to talk about it yet. I don't feel like I can talk in any type of educated way about it.

B (23:18)

Okay, that's fair. Well, I feel like if your mind is feeling better no matter how you got there.

A (23:23)

Agree.

B (23:24)

Great. Take it.

A (23:25)

Couch pillow makeover. I did this, I think in January or February. I do feel like it made a huge difference to how my living room works. I'm excited to bring these pillows to the new place. We'll see how they fit into the design. My next one was skincare routine. I felt like I didn't have one and this one I did. I experimented with a lot of products. I feel much better about the texture, health, moisture of my skin and I feel like I have products that I like. So check. I added a new one mid year to figure out fancy slash going out makeup routine and I wow, did I not do this? Although on New Year's Eve, my friend Elizabeth was wearing this glitter eyeliner on her bottom lash and then on the top lash it was a cat eye black liner. And then they met on the outside and the glitter went under the black and it was so cool. And I am not the best at liquid eyeliner, but I do want to try this at some point.

B (24:25)

That sounds very cool. I actually repeatedly get this targeted ad of glitter eyeliner. I think it's a French brand or something and it always looks so pretty. I must have clicked on it once, stayed there a while or something because man, I am target number one for them.

A (24:39)

I think I bought a couple from Urban Decay, but I can't say that I really played with them outside of using them to give my friend's child tattoos on his arm.

B (24:49)

A worthy cause, I think.

A (24:51)

Yep.

B (24:51)

For sure.

A (24:52)

Okay, my next one. I already knew that this was not really feasible, but I said, have a relaxing, potentially solo beach trip. I didn't do this. I did go on a beach trip when I was in Sicily, so I got the beach trip part of it, but it was many people, so partially, I just always feel most relaxed when I'm near the ocean and I'm at a beach. And I think that's what I wanted to accomplish.

B (25:16)

So I'm right there with you.

A (25:18)

And I also added a new goal mid year to continue French Duolingo and maybe add a class or watching a TV show or listening to a podcast in French in the fall. And I completely fell off this when I found out that I had to move. Bilingo went out the window and Street Easy took its spot of my daily routine. So I did not do this. I would like to get back to French duolingo. I don't have any plans to go to France, but I do feel like I was learning it. So I feel like I'd like to continue to build this, but not so much that it's a goal.

B (25:53)

Maybe get through moving. Yep. And then, you know, once you're settled, return to France via the apps.

A (26:01)

Yeah. What about professional goals? Tell me about how you did on those for 2025.

B (26:07)

I think I did pretty good overall. Definitely some room for improvement. But the first one was just to finish little one and to plan promo for it. I will say that I have been fanatical about doing stuff to promote this book.

A (26:23)

Oh, I thought you were gonna say that you weren't doing this. And I was about to, like, bring my pitchfork and tell you how good a job you're doing at this.

B (26:31)

I have been nuts about this and it's mostly because I just feel better about everything when I'm doing something. We were just talking before we started recording about Andy Bartz's newsletter, and she had a recent post about how, like, there are most things you do when it comes to promoting a book. Will not move the needle at all, but it still feels good to do them. And I do find it, like, very engaging and interesting and fulfilling to create content and essays and all kinds of stuff that feels like authentic to who I am and also promotes the book. And that's actually a quite a challenge to find that balance. And it's a lot of work, but I enjoy it and it's my job So I really have done this as much as I possibly can. I had this goal to plan and pitch a lot of essays pegged to this book. And I will be totally transparent. I wrote an essay that I was so proud of that I pitched to Modern Love in the New York Times and I have not heard back, so I guess that was a rejection. But I am really proud of myself for doing that because I like had to send it to my agent, I had to send it to my team, and then of course I had to send it to the New York Times and you know, maybe they didn't even read it, but I'm proud of myself for trying. And I still will share the essay eventually. And yeah, I guess I've put this towards making this like little side podcast project instead, which is sort of like an audio version of essays. I'll talk more about that in my goals. But instead of doing essays, I guess I've chosen to do this other limited series thing that felt like it would be something new and different and interesting to promote the book while feeling true to who I am. So yes, I think I have done this as much as I could.

A (28:23)

Absolutely, you've done this.

B (28:25)

Thank you. This next one, I mean, so I had on here promote the paperback of Such a Bad Influence, which at the beginning of the year I thought was gonna come out in May. It ended up coming out in December, so just a few weeks ago now. And to be honest, I have not done a lot. I've posted a few things here and there, but I have been actually shocked at the amount of people that have sent me photos of the book in bookstores and airports. Airports especially has surprised me so much because it didn't really happen that much. With my first book, I saw it in one airport. There's one copy in a Chicago airport bookstore. And I think partially that's because it was a smaller publisher and blah, blah, blah. But to see it in so many stores now and to have it have this little resurgent people be tagging me in stories is like something I really did not expect. So that's been cool.

A (29:16)

That's so exciting.

B (29:18)

The next one was to explore teaching opportunities, which I did that writing seminar week long workshop thing at a high school in the spring. And I really found it so rewarding and interesting. That's all I did. I think that checks the box. Yeah, check. So this next one I had two, which was to sell book three and then to finish one to two full drafts of it. I have more about this I can share soon, but I can tell you that I did one of these things and I didn't do the other thing. So take that as you will. Take that as you will. I will have more to share soon and I'm excited to share. Okay, so the next one was to be better at screening books for the podcast, which basically involved just doing more research about what books were coming out when and getting copies of those books and just making sure that every book club pick that, you know, fell on my month was something I felt like head over heels, very passionate about. And I think I did this for the most part. I will say the end of the year got a little busy for me, so I might have fallen off a little, but I definitely got better at this and I hope I will continue to get even better. I also wanted to get new headshots, which I did get them. So check easy and then let's see. So then I had keep up with Substack Edit calendar which again started very strong. And then towards the end of the year when I was like very heads down working on book three and at one point the most intense book three stuff was happening alongside the beginning of Little One promotion. And I will say that the Substack Edit calendar did sort of fall apart, as did me planning desk tours ahead of time. So I did okay at this, but like definitely not a full gold star for me here.

A (31:05)

Okay, but some still counts.

B (31:07)

Some, yes, it's. I will count. That I will count. I've already started it for this year and I'm gonna try to do my best even as I have a crazy next few months. So the next thing was to plan another upstate book fair, which I didn't do. I kind of talked about this in the mid year episode, but I just. It wasn't going to work out for a lot of different reasons. So I didn't do this. But instead I put my energy into planning and launching and hosting an upstate reading and writing retreat, which I did. It sold out, which I was super excited about. And I think it was a success overall. So it was. I was really proud of that just because I had the vision for it a long time ago. And to see it come to life is like the most magical thing to me. And it was so nice to connect with people and just hang out in a cozy cabin in the woods. And then finally something I did not do was a website redesign and a substack redesign. And I meant like a professional redesign. I did clean up my website and I think it looks a lot better than it did in the past, it's still diy, but just goes to show you, you know, you can work with what you have, save a little money and, yeah, I think it works. I'm proud of myself for I'm really not good at Squarespace. Like, I'm really bad at Squarespace, But I figured out how to do merch. I figured out how to launch the reading and writing retreat through the website. I have better landing pages for my books and my different projects. So, you know, in a way, I'm proud of myself for doing it on my own. Even if it's not as pretty as I would have liked, it works. God, there were too many of those. I, I, I will tell you, I cut down this year.

A (32:45)

When you're, when you're talking about not doing things, I'm also, like, you had an incredible amount of disparate goals on here. Like, different buckets of things.

B (32:54)

Like, thanks too much. I think lesson learned. I am proud. Tell me about your professional goals and how everything went.

A (33:02)

Okay. My first one was to figure out my newsletter paywall strategy, which I feel like I did. I had at least one and mostly two paid newsletters every month. And I feel really good about them. I feel good about the quality. It's definitely still something that I struggle with because, you know, it's not as if I have, you know, if you have a cooking newsletter and then, you know, you put recipes behind the paywall. And so I'm really commoditizing my privacy and or writing tips, which I don't know that I feel comfortable giving. I'm not an expert. And, you know, there's so many people who say, I just want to support your endeavors and who want to subscribe just to support me and, you know, to support the free content. But I don't feel comfortable with that exchange. I want to give value. So I think I did a better job with this than I did in 2024. I feel solid about this, but not perfect.

B (34:07)

Well, I, I mean, from the outside in, you're doing great. And I also have to say, like, I went through all my substack paid subscriptions last night as I'm trying to be a better spender of money. And it was really interesting to see. And I probably am a paid subscriber to close to 30 subs.

A (34:25)

Same.

B (34:26)

And to go through and really assess, like, why I'm a paid subscriber for the different ones is very interesting because for each one, it's a little bit different. And it's not necessarily. Some of it is like, this is a real value to me as a writer. Some of it is like, I just really want to support this person who I'm a huge fan of it. Some of it is like, this person doesn't maybe post as much, but when they do, it's like I can tell that they really went above and beyond on this in some way. And it's just, it's different across the board. And it really made me think differently about like paywall strategy and what you're offering and is it enough and all those questions that I think everyone who is making some sort of an income on Substack has. But as I said from the outside, you are doing incredible and always producing just top notch content. So thank you.

A (35:13)

I'm very proud of my consistency with it. I think 2026 might be easier in some ways because I think a lot of what will be behind the paywall is probably moving and decorating content and then also, you know, in some ways maybe cataloging my process, my progress on Book three in a tighter group before I feel comfortable telling people more broadly about it.

B (35:41)

I'm sure people would love that. We'll see.

A (35:44)

My next goal was to 2x substack paid subscribers. I didn't hit this. That was growing by 750 and I think I grew by 550. So I got close, but no cigar. I think it definitely got harder to grow on Substack this year. There's just so many great options. So many traditional journalists left their outlets and started their own shingle. So it's just gotten more competitive. I came up with this goal based off of a revenue goal and I need to close out my books later today. But I think I got within spitting distance. I think I was pretty close to the revenue goal, like within 10%. So in that way it accomplished what.

B (36:24)

It was trying to also, I mean, I don't know the stats on this, but I would not be surprised if you are within like the top single digit percent of people who are year over year gaining paid subscribers. Because it is very hard to grow on Substack, like very hard. I think there's a lot of turnover generally and you're doing it, so you should be really proud. Thank you.

A (36:47)

My next one I feel great about it was to figure out my income situation. I came into 2025 realizing that my book two was going to take much longer than I had anticipated and that the payments for that book were gonna be spread out over a longer time than I had thought when I signed the contract. And this feels like I have fully transformed it throughout the year. Part of that was the substack goal of growing my paid subscribers. Also introducing a little bit of sponsored content in my newsletter, which I've done in a way that I feel good about and hopefully is aligned and not disruptive. And honestly, the biggest game changer here has been starting to use affiliate links more strategically again in a way where I'm never endorsing something that I don't actually love or believe in. But, you know, it's taking photos of my outfits sometimes before I leave, which is uncomfortable for me to do. And I don't think that I'm a fashion icon, but I'm a regular person who wears clothes and, you know, sharing what I'm wearing. It's also, you know, the other thing that's really big about affiliate that I was being stupid about talking about things I love when they're on sale. I was like, oh, everyone else is talking about sales. I don't need to talk about the sale. And I was like, no, that's when you make money. It's like when the thing that you already love is on sale.

B (38:02)

So that is true.

A (38:03)

Yeah. I feel like I cracked that sometime in the first half of the year and I was like, oh, okay. So, yeah, I feel really good about where my income situation is and the share that books contribute versus other things. And it has taken so much stress off of book writing.

B (38:23)

That's incredible.

A (38:25)

Yes. I feel so good about that one. That was probably the most important one. And I feel really solid about it coming into this year. I mean, hopefully the economy doesn't crash and then I don't know what the fuck I'm gonna do, but, well, always.

B (38:37)

A possibility in this day and age. But I think this is amazing and what a way to start the year. Totally both all the things.

A (38:46)

My next one was to have certainty around book two. I, at the beginning of the year, had submitted a huge revision where I probably changed 50% of the book. And I was not sure how it was going to go, if somebody was going to say, good effort, but put this in a drawer, work on something else or what ended up happening was, you know, it made a big step forward. And then I did two or three more rounds of edits on top of that and got the book to where it is today. And so I wrote have Certainty because I really thought there was a chance that this book got killed and it didn't. And I'm so proud of how much effort I put into this book and how far it came and what the final product is, and I'm so excited to share more with you about it and be able to tell you all details instead of just vaguely calling it Book two very soon.

B (39:36)

I'm excited to hear more too, even though I do know more than the listeners, but still, I'm excited for all of it and I can't imagine anything feeling more rewarding than working like as hard as you have on this and seeing it come to fruition.

A (39:51)

So yeah, this book taught me some lessons, taught me some things about myself.

B (39:57)

So they always do, don't they?

A (40:01)

Next one didn't do write or finish a draft of something new. Book two was more encompassing than I anticipated, but I'm so glad that I spent the time there and I don't feel bad about not finishing a draft of something new. And the last one is to keep the pod fun, which it is with the exception of my Reddit wobble. I love doing the podcast and it is such a bright spot in my week and the community around it is such a bright spot in my day to day. So I feel great about this.

B (40:32)

I agree with you. Good. Well, I think we did pretty well. I think we really did.

A (40:37)

I agree.

B (40:38)

Go us.

A (40:38)

There's none of them that I didn't accomplish that. I'm like oh man, I feel you.

B (40:43)

Don'T close your eyes at night and see a roasted chicken. Just taunting you.

A (40:46)

No you shouldn't. Silly goal and not accomplishing it is fine.

B (40:51)

Well let's take another ad break and then we will get into our goals for 2026. This episode is sponsored by Wayfair. The New year is here. And spoiler. Becca and I both have some home decoration related goals this year and as I get ready to redo our kitchen also spoiler. I am thinking long and hard about how to find all the perfect elements and I have actually already been browsing Wayfair to get inspiration. They really do have absolutely everything from appliances to cabinet hardware to more. And in fact our last major renovation was a few years ago and it was a bathroom upstairs. And to this day the thing about it that I get the most compliments on is the marble tile on the floor, which is kind of unique. And surprise, we got it on Wayfair and at an incredible price too. So I am looking forward to returning to the site and finding new deals as we search for backsplashes and stoves and all the things.

A (41:50)

That's so interesting. I wouldn't have thought about Wayfair for tile flooring. They really do have everything so as I mentioned up top, I'm getting ready to move. So there's going to be a lot of shopping at Wayfair in my future. And one of my first stops is going to be all of their organization finds. You name a size, a shape, a space to organize, and they have it. Personally, I'm starting with my bathroom and my kitchen. Wayfair's huge selection of home decor items makes it easy to find exactly what's right for you.

B (42:19)

Get organized, refreshed, and back on track this year. For way less, head to Wayfair.com right now to shop all things home. That's W a Y F A I R.com Wayfair Every style, every home.

A (42:37)

All right, tell me. I mean, I think we've already said this. We're feeling restored coming into 2026, but how are you feeling about the year ahead? Are there boogeymen? Are you excited? Are you nervous?

B (42:50)

All of the above. I think we're recording this less than four weeks out from Little One coming out and you know, it's a nerve wracking time. And I also think I am feeling a little bit of fatigue just in terms of asking people to pre order and talking about myself, filming myself, like all the things and I'm just sort of ready to like hunker down and just be quiet. But I went to make these goals and it was so interesting because it feels like so much less than in past years. And I think partially it's because there are things that I have consistently had on my goals lists that have now become sort of second nature, which feels really cool. Like I don't feel like I have to battle with screen time anymore. I feel like I figured it out. Like I don't feel like I have to beat myself up about going to the doctors and going to appointments because I spent this year like doing all that stuff and like taking care of myself in that way. And that's really cool. Like it just, it feels really cool to be able to see that difference. Not that I have everything figured out or something, but anyway, I'm feeling good. Like we said, restored, ready to go. A little anxious, but how about you?

A (43:59)

I feel great. I feel like I have this triple fresh start with the new year, new apartment, new book. I feel really proud that I have a book coming out this year. I feel just incredibly optimistic. I'm also turning 40 this year, so like that's a big turn the page. I don't have really any feelings about the aging part of it. I'm excited to celebrate and turn the chapter. So I feel really optimistic. And you know the other thing kind of going off, what you were saying about that you've made things, habits, I mean, journaling. Yes, I definitely feel that way. My skincare routine, et cetera. I also feel like I have more clarity coming into this year versus past years about what matters. The roast chicken doesn't fuck matter. And I caught myself over the break. At one point I ordered a sizing kit for an aura ring. I was like, I'm track my sleep. I'm going to get so into this. And I was like, you know what? No, this is stupid. Are you tired? Go to sleep early. Like you don't need an app to tell you how you are sleeping. And I keep going back to that Jemima Kirk. I don't know if it was a TikTok or what, where she's like, I think you're all thinking too much about yourselves. And I'm like, yeah, like, get my fucking boot off my neck. Like, I am fine.

B (45:19)

Oh my gosh. I've thought about the Oura ring so many times and I always come back to that same thing. But like so many times I want the sizing.

A (45:26)

Can I have one?

B (45:27)

I. They have it at Target. It's so. Because they have it right there and then. But this is sort of a side note, but Casey Lewis on substack, she did a post about like what teens got for Christmas this year. And one of them was the aura ring. And it horrified me for some reason. I was like, come on. Like, do we need to be tracking our steps? Sleep, like, whatever as a 14 year old, like, come on. It just made me sad. But anyway, I totally hear you and I think that's. It's great. Yeah, we can just check in with ourselves.

A (45:57)

Yeah. I feel like finishing this book has just lightened something for everything and I feel able to give myself much more grace.

B (46:04)

Good.

A (46:05)

I don't need to have a perfect sleep score. Not important.

B (46:08)

Yeah. Yes. I mean, I feel like that like the act of giving yourself grace has unlocked so many things for me and made them habits that they wouldn't. They weren't in the past because everything was like punishment and discipline and yeah, it's huge. Like I feel like if someone could give themselves one goal, this one could kind of change everything in a positive way.

A (46:30)

Okay, let's get more specific. What are your personal goals for this year?

B (46:34)

So this one is really simple, but I would like to continue my strength routine and to scale to heavier weights like throughout the last Year, I've just sort of taken the mindset of like, I start working out two days a week, then I do three. I walk a tiny bit farther each time or, you know, I do five more minutes of weights, whatever. So I want to move from 10 pound weights to 15, and then in June I'd like to move to 20. So I just enjoy the challenge and like the feeling of getting stronger and it's been so energizing. So I would love to do that. My next one is I really want to either start or join volunteer with some sort of a young writers program in my community. Because I keep coming back to this thing of my younger self and writing and how much it's meant to me forever. And I felt so inspired by that week of talking to high school students, even though they were absolutely terrifying in some ways. But I just think that I know how impactful it has been to me when I was younger just to have someone see me in my writing. And I would love to be able to be that for other kids. And so I don't know if that's, like I said, joining one that exists or starting one at like my local library system or the public high school or something, I don't know. But I want to look into this in the spring and hopefully get something going.

A (47:57)

This is an incredible goal. This is so inspiring. I love this.

B (48:01)

Well, we'll see if it happens. But yeah, it feels like something that could be really cool. So we'll see. And then I have a few house related goals. And the first one is the kitchen renovation. I should say that there are a lot of question marks when it comes to this. And one like, we have to make the plans and then we have to get the contractor to come in and then we have to get the quote. And so we haven't done any of that. So it's totally possible that one of those things happens and we're like, oh, actually this is completely unfeasible. I really want this so badly. It is a kitchen, but it's essentially like there's also right now we have a toilet basically in our kitchen, where. No, you don't. Yes, we do. So we have. It's. You could call it a bathroom, but there's a door. So it's just a toilet, but it's in the kitchen. Like if you are washing your hands, you can hear someone peeing. I don't want that in my life. It's. And it's not a door, it's a pocket door which feels kind of like a Fake door. Okay, so it's a fake bathroom, it's a fake door. It's all. It's just. I'm ready. I'm ready. It's cavernous, it is dark, there's no light. I'm ready.

A (49:09)

Do you have a vision for it? Is there a Pinterest board? Can you see it in your mind or is this still part of the exploration process that you need to figure out what you want?

B (49:20)

I have the vision. Okay. I don't necessarily have every detail. Like, I don't have paint shades, I don't have, like, materials. But I have the vision, I have the layout, I have the ideas for it. I have the Pinterest boards. I really like Duval kitchens, the sort of like country English style kitchens. It's just a matter of. Of whether it can happen. Yep. But it is the dream. You know, this has been the dream since we moved in three years ago. So we'll see if it does happen. It wouldn't be until summer, so got some time. These next two things might be things that we could do if we don't do a kitchen or potentially in addition to it will depend. But we need to refinish all of our floors downstairs because they are just absolutely scuffed up in the worst way possible. The previous owner was like, elderly and so there are a lot of plant water stains everywhere. So giant circles of water stains. It was just not taken care of. They're very orange. So that's a big undertaking.

A (50:22)

Is this something you'll do yourselves or is this something you'll bring in somebody to do?

B (50:27)

No, we'll definitely bring in someone. It's quite an undertaking. Just because of the moving of all the furniture. Absolutely. And like, if we were smart, slash had the money, we would have just done the whole house, all the floors when we moved in. But we were not and did not. So we've kind of done it piecemeal. We also need to refinish the stairs. And then I want to get a stair runner so badly because, like, I really worry about our stairs falling down them. Winnie needs some traction, you know. So those are the three house goals. We'll see which of them happen.

A (50:58)

I love this. I cannot wait to follow along in real time. I mean, more so with the kitchen than your floors. I would be happy to follow along in real time with your floors too.

B (51:07)

But the floors are more of a. More of a thing than anyone else noticing. But thank you.

A (51:13)

I will tell you, there was one point in the fall where I got so into home diy reels. And I watched so many videos of people refinishing floors that I feel overly confident that I could do this, which I absolutely could not.

B (51:27)

Well, I mean, you. Honestly, you probably could if you rented a sander. And then to me, it's just the fumes, the time. It's. I don't know. It's not worth it to me, but it does make a big difference, so I'm looking forward to that, maybe. And then the final one is sort of both. It's sort of related to the previous three, which is that I really, really want to tighten and be more thoughtful about my spending habits. I just went through all of my accounts to kind of gather all of my business expenses, which shows you how organized I am, because I literally just have to go through every purchase for the whole year and find the business expenses and make note of them. But doing that, I see, like, how mindlessly I buy things. Like, I.

A (52:14)

Is there a category that's your. Your trigger? Is it clothes? Is it home? Is it going out to eat?

B (52:21)

It's kind of all of the above in. In equal measure. It's not really like that anything is totally out of control. It's more just like, I go through these phases where I'm like, oh, well, I just won't think about it, and I'll put it on a credit card. And it's just. It adds up so quickly. So I hesitated putting this on the list because this is certainly the kind of thing that I would abandon by February, But I made this document, and I know there are, by the way, like, apps and other things that help you do the same thing, but it helps me to do it myself, which is I want to keep track of every single thing I buy, including down to, like, if I buy a clothing item, I want to keep track of how many times I actually wear it, or if.

A (53:00)

Oh, intense.

B (53:00)

If I get to the end of the month and I'm like, I immediately regretted buying that. Like, I want to make a note of it. So then I remember later, and yes, we are less than one week into the year, but I have found that it is helpful even just in small things. Like, I tend to get, like, a beverage every time I leave the house, you know, And I still want to do that, but I don't need to do that every single day of the week.

A (53:23)

Can I offer you one tip that I saw that I've done in certain cases and found to work really well?

B (53:30)

Yes.

A (53:31)

So I think I got this from Nora McInerney for anything online shopping and I don't always do this. Like, I absolutely do not. But when you see something that you want to buy online specifically, put it in a note in your phone and then wait two weeks and see if after two weeks you still feel as strongly for it. Because oftentimes I just like, it's the dopamine of adding it to the cart. It's that I'm bored, I'm online shopping, I think I need something because of who knows why. And then at two weeks it just, it doesn't feel as exciting. Or if it does feel as exciting, buy it.

B (54:07)

Yes, I actually, I started doing this too. I don't know if it was from her or whatever. I started it just as a habit of like trying to keep. Like. I tend to think of things and totally forget that I actually do need to. So I'm kind of using it for both things. Yeah, I think any way that I could just keep track of what I'm buying is great. And I. I also have started this new rule, the self imposed rule that when I go to Goodwill to look, I have to bring something to donate, even if it's just one item. Like before I leave the house, I have to grab something that I don't use or don't need and donate it. And so, you know, maybe I go to Goodwill 50 times in a year, I can donate 50 things at the very minimum. So I generally just want to as like we have these potentially big projects with the kitchen and stuff and I have stuff coming up that's just gonna involve a lot of traveling and running around and like mindless spending if I'm not careful. I just wanna be really tuned into how I'm spending money in a way that I haven't been before. To my detriment, I think. So that's my goal. That was a long one. I'm sorry.

A (55:10)

That's okay.

B (55:11)

Well, talk me through your personal goals.

A (55:14)

Okay. So I think my biggest slash hardest one is that I want to kick my phone out of my bedroom. I've intimated this before. I got the hatch alarm clock on Black Friday. So I can set it from my phone, but my phone doesn't have to be in the room. It has the snooze function. I figured out how to use it. Last night was night one of one, because I believe that the new year starts the first Monday of the year.

B (55:41)

So how's it feel?

A (55:42)

You know, I slept like shit last night, but not because of that. I think I just, I had Sunday scaries. Getting back into a routine is Hard. So it had nothing to do with the phone. I will say it's almost 11 right now. I woke up. I didn't take my phone off the charger in the kitchen. I glanced at it. I replied to texts on my computer when I opened it. But I feel good. I mean, I think the reason I have this goal is because all of the most mindless scrolling I do that I find I regret. I get sucked into a hole and I'm like, where did that hour go? Is before bed during the day. I'll look here and there, but it's before bed that I'll. I'll get sucked into watching reels and I feel bad about it. So the phone is getting kicked out of the bedroom.

B (56:31)

I love this one. Maybe I'll copy you. I would really like to do it, but. We'll see. But I think this is going to be great.

A (56:38)

I do too. I do too. My next one is I want to take an in person multi session art class. So I have to do some research on this. My most ideal class that I would like to take is a class on watercolor portraiture. I don't know if I can find that, but I kind of assume if anywhere I could find it, I could find it in New York. Otherwise maybe just a general watercolor class or potentially some type of figure drawing or I guess I don't care about bodies as much as just, I mean, I guess general portraiture.

B (57:15)

That's really cool. I love this goal and I'm sure you could find something.

A (57:20)

I'm really excited. Watercolor was the biggest surprise to me last year.

B (57:23)

Something.

A (57:24)

And I feel like I'd like to be taught now. Like I've experimented a lot and now I like someone who is an expert to teach me things.

B (57:32)

That's cool. That's like a way to level up the hobby.

A (57:35)

Yeah, I'm excited. My next one is that I said I'm turning 40 this year in September and I want to plan my 40th birthday day. So I'm going on a trip with all of my college friends for our collective 40th birthday in June. So we're going on this trip and that's the big thing. But then my birthday usually falls. It's September 1st. It usually falls around Labor Day. And it's really hard to get everyone that I want to celebrate with together because people are off on vacations. They have like annual traditions for anyone with kids. It's usually like the weekend before kids go back to school on the East Coast. So all sorts of reasons, but I really want to plan in advance and you know, even like just a dinner in New York and do something that I'll be excited about. So I have no firm ideas yet, but I want to make sure that I feel good about celebrating this milestone. Bertha.

B (58:37)

Yeah, of course. What a fun plan, though. I love the idea of having a trip, but then also having just a special day for just you.

A (58:44)

Yeah. My next one is that I want to decorate my dream office. I think moving into my new place, my office, is the first priority because I think it's the most doable. I think I have a really clear vision for it. It's also a space that I'm going to use every single day. Not that my bedroom isn't, but, you know, it's. Yeah. I've pinned everything on the office to start with. I'm really excited and I think it's going to be blue.

B (59:11)

I cannot wait to see it. I think this is one of the absolute best parts of moving. Just the constant fantasizing about the new spaces. This is gonna be so amazing. New book, new office.

A (59:22)

Yeah, that's really exciting to be like, okay, I'm starting my new book. I'm not starting book three in January. I have my copy edits incoming this week. And then I assume moving will kind of take up a lot of my life. And then, you know, with the newsletter and podcast, I'm like, I don't think I'm starting a new book until I'm in the new place, but I'm like designing this space from which I will write book three and subsequent books. I'm so excited. Oh, my next one is I've started making hand painted cards for loved ones for their birthdays. And I want to continue this year. It has brought me so much joy. It's just like a little act of sitting down. It usually takes me an hour or two. And I go on Pinterest and I find a design that I think they would like or I create something and I, I make a little hand painted card for them.

B (60:08)

That's so sweet. I really like that.

A (60:11)

The first one I sent, I was a little salty because it was for my friend Ashley's 40th birthday. And like, she didn't say anything, she didn't thank me. And I was like, huh? And she didn't realize that I made it. I was like, which is a huge compliment that she thought it was professional. And then she saw, I think I included a photo of it in my newsletter or something. And she was like, wait, I'm sorry you made this card.

B (60:32)

Oh, that's so funny. That's so cool.

A (60:34)

But yeah, it's something I've really enjoyed doing, so I want to continue that. And then I want to start doing weights three times a week. I have fallen off of any workout regimen and I feel like for the sake of my old lady body and just, you know, turning 40, I'm like, oh, long term mobility and strength. I'm like, we need to get into a habit. And so it's going to be at home, it's going to be light, Pilates, ish, weights probably to start. But like I just want to get into the routine of doing something. Did I have this on my calendar for this morning and already moved it? Yeah, I did, but it's only Monday.

B (61:14)

I think at one point in my life I was doing the first thing like wake up workout. I can't do it anymore. I have to do something else first. I find before lunch, but not before. Everything is the time that works for me. But. Well, I love this one. I'm right there with you.

A (61:30)

Okay, moving on to professional. What do you have in store for 2026?

B (61:36)

So as I already have mentioned, I, you know, want to get Little One out in the world and finish the promo of everything strong and just sort of focus on gratitude and confidence and not worrying about stupid stuff and just enjoying it as much as I can. I am still actively working on putting Little Pod out in the world in a few weeks. So I'm, I'm really excited to share. So that's definitely gonna be coming out in January later this month, but there are quite a few things still in flux. But I've been having conversations and interviews and recording different things and it's just been some of the most rewarding conversations I've had and it's very personal and close to my heart. So it's sort of a cross between a vlog or a podcast blog plog of the emotional experience of writing a book and putting it out in the world, set alongside conversations that kind of redirect me from what isn't important and back towards what is. Which to me is writing and making things. So that's a little preview. But if you would like a sneak preview, you can go to my website and submit a receipt of your pre order. And I want a sneak preview. I will be in your inboxes.

A (62:51)

I've pre ordered your book probably three times. I gotta find one of these receipts.

B (62:55)

I'll send it to you. It should be ready this week.

A (62:57)

Oh, I'M so excited.

B (62:58)

And then I also have a tour, a book tour coming up, which I haven't officially announced yet just because there are a lot of moving pieces with organizing those dates. But I will be going to Wayne, Pennsylvania, which is a Philly suburb, New York City, DC, Raleigh, North Carolina, Chicago, Louisiana, Charleston, Clearwater, Florida, and some upstate stops as well. There may be some places I forgot, but if you're in one of those places, stay tuned because I will be releasing the dates and more info soon and I'm really excited to just meet people and hang out and get the book in the world.

A (63:36)

Oh my gosh, that's so exciting. I bet our listeners are freaking out right now.

B (63:40)

Please come, especially if you're in la, because I have no idea if people will show up. But I'm really looking forward to it and I'm really grateful that I can go on a tour. And I am also very much looking forward to my next goal, which is to, as I said, return to my writing cave after Tor is over and just dedicate every second of my year to book three and to just working on that nonstop.

A (64:04)

That's kind of nice about having a Feb pub date where you get the publication out of the way, all that mental space.

B (64:10)

Yeah. I'm really grateful that like, I love both of them. The things, you know, it's like when you've been alone for months and months and months working on something, it's like, all I want is to share this with someone. And when you're sharing it and sharing it, sharing it, you're like, all I want is to just be alone in writing. So I love both of the things and I'm grateful that I love both of the parts of the job, but I think both is necessary. One without the other would be unsustainable, I'm pretty sure. Third goal is I would like to nail down a concept in a one page synopsis for book four.

A (64:41)

Wow.

B (64:42)

Which is a crazy thing to even say out loud, but yeah, I think I would feel good.

A (64:48)

And Career Author Olivia Mentor Book four I'm really trying. Like book four is like, this is not a fluke, folks. That is so cool.

B (64:59)

Thank you. I really do feel like I'm doing it, which is really cool. So yeah. But I only have the most faint idea, like the faintest whisper of an idea for book four. So we'll see what happens.

A (65:12)

You don't need to have it yet. You a whole year.

B (65:14)

No, I have a lot of other things to do. And then for the podcast, my goal is to continue screening books efficiently and really championing my favorites. I'm happy to say that I have finally gotten a netgalley account.

A (65:26)

Welcome.

B (65:28)

Yeah, to make this easier, which is partially inspired by my desire to spend money more thoughtfully or spend less money. And as much as I will always be buying books, I probably don't need to acquire a hundred a year. Maybe I could balance it out with some netgalley reads. And at the same time, I could be screening for book club. So I have my first two downloaded, ready to screen for the spring. And then my final goal, I think, is a really long shot. But I would really love to plan a reading and writing retreat in the Cotswolds. I have a vision. I have a place. Will I have the time to make this happen? I don't know. So this might be a 2027 thing, to be honest, but if I decide to make it happen, I think I will. But it's just a matter of whether I want to add that to my plate this year, but maybe more long term.

A (66:21)

Okay, I like that and I like the realisticness of this can happen. This cannot happen.

B (66:27)

I was really, like I said, I. Seeing how much I put on my list last year, which I think was fine. Like, I just. I don't want to do that again if I don't need to. But I do really like planning them. And this place I found this place is just. I want to be there with my friends. So, anyway, one day. But tell me about your professional goals.

A (66:49)

Okay. My first one is aggressive, but I think, slash, hope I can do it. I'd like to write two drafts of book three. I have an idea. I have, I think, around 25,000 words that do need to be reworked pretty significantly. You know, that's faster than I've ever written a first draft, if we assume six months and six months, which, you know, who knows how it shakes out? But for my first book, I wrote a first draft in a year. For my second book, I think I did it in 10 months. And we will see if this is too aggressive, but I would really like to do two drafts of this book. And I'm hopeful with everything I've Learned in book 2, I can maybe move a little quicker.

B (67:33)

I love the school.

A (67:34)

My second one is that I want to curate more lightness around writing. I want to have fun. I want to not be mean to myself, and I want to be consistent. In some ways, I think book two really got away from myself. My confidence was so shaken, and then I stopped having fun. And then I Stopped being consistent and it felt like this big boogeyman. And so I really want to remember first of all that I got through a really tough book, that I can do this, have confidence in my skills, understand what habits are not serving me in terms of just endlessly rereading. And I want this to be fun.

B (68:19)

Is there anything specifically you're planning on changing or doing differently to make this happen?

A (68:25)

I mean, the first thing is I want, and this sounds the opposite of what I should be doing is I do want to be stricter with myself in terms of, you know, sitting down, touching the work, working on it four days a week, being in it, understanding that it might not always be perfect, kind of just loosening my grip a little on what the output is maybe. And then I really do want to break my habit of rereading. I think I seek reassurance in I get to a tough part and then I'm like, well, let me reread and remind myself that it's not all bad. I don't think that serves me in any productive way. So I really want to break that habit and just push forward even though it's uncomfortable. I think also, you know, having this journal from last year and being able to revisit that and, you know, continuing my journaling practice and kind of getting some stuff out there and then coming to the page is a good habit that I've half developed.

B (69:21)

Yeah, I love all of that.

A (69:22)

The next one is very easier said than done. I would like to approach my book two publication as a celebration. I have already done the hard part. I have finished this book. I'm so proud of it. And look like I would be lying if I said that it doesn't matter how it does, but I really want to approach it as I have already done the hard part, the biggest part, and now this is joyful. It hopefully finds people who love it like it does matter how sales do. But I want to also recognize that I can only move that needle so far. I want to promote it, I want to do everything I can, but I also want to loosen my death grip on outcomes. And also I think some of this is maybe naturally baked in that I think I struggled so much with the publication cycle for my first book anxiety wise because I don't thrive in uncertainty and I didn't know what to expect and some of my expectations were just so fucking misguided. And then some of them I just, I didn't have any frame of reference for, you know, like, I think I really thought that, you know, Pub day, everyone would sit down and read the book. And of course, that's not realistic, you know, and so I think just having some frame of reference for what to expect will help me more joyfully approach this publication.

B (70:54)

Yeah, that's such a good goal to have. I think that, like you said, there's so much you can't control, and so we just try to control what we can. And I think sometimes in that personally, I lose the fact that, like, I can also control just enjoying it. Yeah. Like, I can also control just being like, hey, I did this, and this is really cool and really fun. But I think, like you said, that death grip is so tempting because there are so few things that you can manipulate or push or whatever. So, yeah, I love the idea of just celebrating because, like, you know, this is the coolest thing. You're publishing books like, what a joy.

A (71:32)

And the hard part's already done. You know, I wrote the book. I wrote the book, and I'm so excited about it. And this is the victory lap.

B (71:41)

Yes, absolutely.

A (71:44)

My next goal. So for the podcast, I think I do not as good a job as I could promoting our podcast. Book club picks. I love our book club. I think it's so special and I think it's somewhat unique. And we're both so passionate about the books that we pick. And I really want to do a better job spotlighting our book club. And so, you know, every month I want to do Instagram stories about what it is, not just reposting the bat on paper. Here's the pick. I want to maybe do a grid post every month, and a lot of times I'm reading the book on E Reader, so I don't really have anything to take a picture of. So I already bought Best Offer Wins. After this, I'm gonna do my stories, do everything for it. So, yeah, I want to also feature it in my newsletter. So I want to do a better job drawing attention to our book club because I think that's also a great entree for new listeners where it's like, it's overwhelming to step into such a big back catalog, but, you know, you can just step into a book club discussion for something that you've read.

B (72:48)

This is so smart. I could probably. I don't do this at all. I probably should and could. So that's a great reminder to be better about it, but very smart.

A (72:58)

My next one is simple. Don't read mean things about myself on the Internet. Again, easier said than done, but I feel really committed to it. Yeah, that's All I need to say, I am really craving more writing community and I think more informal writing community. You know, I have you, I have a few writer friends that I speak to really regularly, but I want like a water cooler of authors at a similar stage. So like post debut, mid list authors. So I don't know what form this takes, but it is something I'm thinking about.

B (73:33)

I feel like I've developed more this year and I wasn't really trying to, but it really does make a huge difference. Like mentally, just co workers. So helpful in a world where not many people that you speak to will really get it otherwise. Not because it's, you know, the most complicated, important thing in the world, but because it's very nuanced.

A (73:55)

It's so idiosyncratic.

B (73:56)

Yes, exactly. So, yeah, this is a great one.

A (74:00)

My next one is I want to grow my substack free subscribers and revenue by 20% and I think that some of that might come in the form of focusing on sponsorships rather than paid subscribers this year. So exploring that more heavily again in a way that hopefully doesn't feel disruptive to the content, but allows me to grow the revenue without convincing more people to part with their hard earned money.

B (74:31)

Very smart. Yeah, I think you're right. It's a great strategy and I think.

A (74:34)

The 2025 paved the way that I do think a lot of brands started to test into newsletter for the first time. I think like education was a big, you know, from other people I've talked to. I think education was a big hurdle for getting brands into the space. Okay. My last one is I would like to show up joyfully and unapologetically on social media. I think I've had a block on this. Well, definitely since I read all the Reddit stuff about myself. But even before that and just kind of overthinking and like I am kind of a silly person and I, I do love sharing things. I'm. I love to. Yeah. So I, I want to show up more. I don't know, I. Joyfully is the word I keep coming back to on social media. And that specifically includes promoting my book too. Something I read. God, I need to stop reading mean things about myself on the Internet. It isn't something I seek out or do regularly, but it really sticks in there. One thing I read was just with my first book, people were really turned off. Some people were really turned off by how hard I promoted it. And it's like, well, babes, that's the name of the game. That's the expectation of my publisher, and that's being a good partner to them, and that's securing my future as an author. If you don't like it, feel free to leave. But I am really. I'm so proud of this book. I'm so proud of how hard I worked on it. I really want it to find its people, and God damn it, I'm gonna talk about it.

B (76:06)

Yes. I mean, it's your job.

A (76:08)

Yeah.

B (76:09)

Yeah. And I think there are definitely. Maybe part of what builds that feeling is there are certainly some authors who can afford to not do that at all.

A (76:19)

Oh, yeah.

B (76:19)

You know?

A (76:20)

Yeah.

B (76:20)

Who can sit back and enjoy having an established readership that exists or knowing that buz happen no matter what. And, God, if we don't all aspire to be those and to have that option, like, speaking personally, I don't have that option to just do nothing. You know, I personally do not. And even if I thought I might, in some world, why would you have to fight for every single thing in publishing? Like, you really have to push as hard as you can push. And you and I, like, we have the skills and the audiences to push the books, and, like, that's what we're going to do. Other people might have other things, you know, other ways of promoting them maybe, or other kinds of networks, but this is what we have. We're just trying to be good at our jobs, you know? Yeah.

A (77:04)

I read this newsletter that I linked to in Sunday Sundries yesterday about how we culturally mock women who try and then we applaud them when they're successful. And, you know, it's just. I think Bowen Yang has the thing of climbing Cringe Mountain. It's just like, you know what? Like it or don't, I'm going to promote my book. That's how it works.

B (77:25)

Yeah. Yeah. You should be proud of it and all of the work that you've done. It's an incredibly hard thing. So I support all the promotion. Thank you. I'm out here doing the same thing. Thank you.

A (77:36)

Why don't we get into some n matter, because I think we both have quite a few books we read on our podcast break.

B (77:46)

Well, what are you obsessed with?

A (77:48)

Okay, so the real answer is that I didn't think it was possible, but my heated rivalry obsession has grown even stronger over our break. However, I'm gonna save that for our three things next week where I'm just gonna talk to myself because I don't think you want.

B (78:05)

Do you need me to watch it for it? No.

A (78:07)

No, you don't have to. But I. Olivia, over the break I got really into threads because that was where the heated rivalry conversation was happening. Like, I am off my rocker.

B (78:18)

Well, I do have to tell you that I went to the New Year's Eve party and like I, you know, at a party you kind of go between the little groups of people conversations. I would like be in a trio of people. They'd be like, are you watching Heated Rivalry? I turn around, talk to someone else. They'd say, are you watching Heated Rivalry? It happened like five times. So you're not alone and I need to watch it clearly.

A (78:38)

Well, if you do it before our next episode, we can talk about it. But anyway, what I will highlight as my obsession is that I bought a puzzle from a new to me brand called Le Puz and it's all miniature, like dollhouse items on a gradient background. I did it over break. I got so much joy from this puzzle and it was irregular shaped pieces and it was also a jumbo sized puzzle so the pieces were quite large so it was easier to see everything. Big convert, big fan of this brand. I'm definitely going to be checking out some more of their puzzles.

B (79:15)

That sounds great.

A (79:16)

It was great. Tell me about yours.

B (79:19)

My obsession is the documentary Come See Me in the Good Light, which is a documentary about the poet Andrea Gibson and their partner Meg as they navigate Andrea's cancer diagnosis and prognosis. And I love Andrea Gibson. I've talked about them on here before. I started reading their poetry when I was in high school. And so when they passed away this past year, it was really devastating to me and I knew that this documentary was going to absolutely wreck me. So I really put off watching it for a while. But I finally watched it last week and it is just one of the most beautiful portraits of life I have ever watched. It's sad, of course. I was truly crying before the intro credits were even rolling.

A (80:11)

Help level set for me. On a scale of 1 to 10, how much will this emotionally wreck me?

B (80:17)

10. But it is sad, but it feels like you are just overcome, or at least this is how it was for me. I was overcome with just complete and total gratitude for being alive. Like I was. Like, I have never been happier to be myself on this earth in this moment. In a way I'm like, was this created for me? It's about their, their relationship and how beautiful it is and how selfless. But it touches on this idea of body image in relation to a diagnosis like this and how little your hangups about how you look matter when you're sitting across from someone who's like, I just want to be alive. You know, I just want to have a body. Oh, wow. And I mean, it's also like, there's a lot about Andrea growing up and being queer, and they go back to their high school and give a speech, and they're really emotional about that. And of course, I was just crying throughout it, but I just felt so like, we're given this one life and it's brief. And it's because it's brief that it's so beautiful. And it encapsulates that idea, which is not exactly groundbreaking, but I think in such a special way. I really suggest that everyone watch this. Like, it's so wonderful.

A (81:32)

I need to pick my moment, but I. This is something that I'm very interested in.

B (81:36)

If you need a good cry, you know, it's great for that. It felt really cathartic, and it's more. For me, it was more of like, a steady cry throughout than like a there's one moment where you're just gonna be heaving, not able to breathe kind of sadness. Well, what have you read?

A (81:52)

Okay. I'm so excited about this first one. I read this book called into the Blue by Emma Brody, which is coming out July 14, so not for a while. And this is coming out from Jenna Bush Hager's new imprint. And I would describe this book as a literary romance that is tomorrow and tomorrow and tomorrow meets my Oxford year meets Audition by Katie Kitamura.

B (82:18)

That is a strange mashup.

A (82:19)

It is a strange mashup. It's told in, I think, four parts. It starts off when the main characters are kids. She is this kind of improv obsessed comedy geek, and he is the son of this very famous acting family. And they learn to act together. And then it goes as they start their own careers in Hollywood in very unexpected directions. I never knew where this book was going to go. It is kind of like Deep Cuts is for music nerds, as this book is to improv nerds, perhaps.

B (83:03)

I'm intrigued by this.

A (83:05)

It is one of the most unique books I've read. I sobbed. The ending was exhilarating.

B (83:14)

Oh, okay. I'm gonna crisp this on NetGalley.

A (83:18)

I know you're gonna hear more about this from me. This might be so far for 2026. This might be my Deep Cuts.

B (83:24)

Oh, wow. Okay. Yeah, okay. On my radar.

A (83:27)

I'm really excited about this. So that's into the Blue by emma Brody, out July 14th. Then I went for a comfort read and I read in youn Dreams by Sarah Adams, which is the fourth book in the Rome, Kentucky series. And it was just a warm hug to go back to these characters. It's about their interconnected romances, about four siblings. And so this was the last sibling, Madison, who's a chef, and the grumpy neighbor, slash, older brother's best friend, James. And it was just such a treat. Small town romance. The series started as Closed Door, and now it's Open Door. I love this series. This series, to me is, you know, I feel like on the spectrum of putting your brain in a bath, like the Pumpkin Spice Cafe books are like the Hallmark movie of that. And then this is like the Netflix version of putting your brain in the path.

B (84:21)

It's a good description. That's a good way to think about it as someone who's not in the romance world. Totally. That really. That actually paints a perfect picture for me.

A (84:29)

Yeah. So I loved this. And then I read Colored Television by Danzie Senna, which I actually bought at your local bookshop when I was up there for the book fair two years ago. And this has been sitting in my pile for forever. And I have a weird block sometimes on reading Backlist because I'm like, oh, I should be screening for the podcast, or, oh, I should be reading forthcoming releases so I can recommend things from the newsletter. Over the break, I was like, it doesn't matter. Do whatever you want. So I picked up this book, and this book I have mixed feelings on. I really enjoyed it. However, it did give me that curb your enthusiasm, nervous stomach feeling when a character is just digging themselves into a hole of their own making and you know it's gonna blow up in their face and you're like, oh, God, stop doing that. Don't do that. What are you doing? It had that feeling. So it's about this woman who's married, has two kids, lives in la. She's writing this kind of, like, disastrous second novel. The portrayal of the sophomore novel of it is probably the thing that I appreciated the most. And it's just like, really gotten away from her. And it's taken her 10 years, and it's like 160,000 words and, like, can't see the forest through the trees, whatever. And alongside that, she kind of gets sucked into the Hollywood TV writing world, developing a comedy series about being biracial. And it's literary, it's very plotty. There is a lot of backstory, but it's not the kind of, like, quiet character study I sometimes think of when I think of literary fiction. I don't know if this will be for everyone, but I was really glad I read it and I really enjoyed it, especially the portrayal of writing life in a way that I maybe haven't seen before.

B (86:16)

I didn't know this had anything to do with writing life, but it makes me want to read it more now. I remember this got so much buzz when it came out. It did.

A (86:23)

And I don't want to identify this writer by her husband, but I do just think it's an interesting fact to point out that Danzy Senna, who's an established writer in her own right, is married to Percival Everett, who wrote James.

B (86:36)

I did not know that. What?

A (86:38)

That is interesting writing marriage. That must be.

B (86:42)

I have so many questions.

A (86:44)

Tell me about what you read over the break.

B (86:46)

So I read Mothers and Strangers by Corey Anne Haydu, which comes out at the end of March. This is literary fiction about two girls who grow up together and become really close best friends. And in turn, their mothers become really close in their own kind of way. And it's a dual timeline story. And we kind of learn in the present timeline, as they are adults, that they have had this falling out. And so I don't want to give too much away, but it's kind of like emotional suspense. There are some big twists. There are some things that surprised me. The writing is really gorgeous. I loved this one. It was literary fiction, but it was. I don't want to say it read like a thriller because that's not right at all, but it just. It was very fast paced and I thought it was just beautifully written.

A (87:33)

Oh, this one really appeals to me.

B (87:35)

Yeah, I think you would like it. It was really good. Like, I can see a lot of people talking about this one. I can see this being a huge hit in book clubs. I was reading it to blurb and I think I said it was superb or something. And it really was. It hit a lot of marks. It was just very beautifully done.

A (87:51)

And when does this come out?

B (87:53)

March 31st.

A (87:54)

Okay, this is just me clickety clacking on NetGalley right now.

B (87:59)

I also read Notes on Infinity by Austin Taylor, which came out, I don't know, maybe six months ago. It's actually. It's kind of like tomorrow and tomorrow and Tomorrow meets the Elizabeth Holmes story. Okay, that's. That's a perfect description of it. But essentially it's about these two students who meet at Harvard who are really into chemistry. They end up starting this business together that is centering around stopping the aging process or reversing it.

A (88:25)

Oh, very timely.

B (88:27)

Of course, they have this really intense connection and these very different backstories. And so it is a romance. But I would say it felt a little long to me. I was really in it for like the first 75% and then I just felt it got a little slow. But I have just heard so many people who I love and respect absolutely raving about this book. And I totally get why. I think to me it felt so different too than a lot of things I had read recently. And so if you like Tomorrow and Tomorrow and Tomorrow, if you are interested in like startups and that kind of energy that sounds so businessy, but like, no, I love a startup seen explored. Yeah. And the science stuff was a lot for me as someone who's not science y but it really was interesting. And the author went to Harvard and if I remember correctly, has a degree in both English and physics or chemistry or something, which I'm like, wow, good for you. Also licensed pilot. I'm like, must you do everything?

A (89:27)

Leave some for the rest of us.

B (89:29)

And a musician, by the way. I read her bio out loud to my mom, actually, when I was visiting them because I was like, look, listen to this person. Look at all the things they do. Wild. Yes. And then finally I read Reckless Girls by Rachel Hawkins because I was visiting my parents and I was out of books, so they have a little like neighborhood library. And I went and I picked this up because I wanted like a sort of like a candy thriller. And this certainly delivered on this, you.

A (89:55)

Know, I love Mia. Rachel Hawkins.

B (89:57)

Yes. It is about this couple living in Hawaii. The man in the couple owns this boat and basically meets these two young women who offer to pay him $50,000 to take them to this private haunted island. And this I was like, so in for, like, most of it because I just thought it was so fun. It was so, like soap and juicy. And I really love an island. I love a boat story as we know. The ending didn't feel satisfying to me at all and I sort of didn't understand what happened. But in terms of like a fun beach read, I think checks all the boxes.

A (90:38)

Okay, well, I mean, that was a lot of book recommendations, but we also have our January book club pick, which is Best Offer Wins by Marisa Cascino. And this is a real estate thriller. It's about this woman who is a PR exec in Washington D.C. and she is trying to get pregnant and she is trying to buy a house with her husband and neither is going well. And she gets a lead on a house that's about to hit the market, and she decides to go through some pretty shady measures to try to lock it in. And this is very much like a woman on the edge, unhinged main character type story. This was wild. I couldn't stop turning the pages. It's pretty short. I think it's like 288 pages. I was so seated for this and I saw in the BFF group that there was a thread. Somebody started off by saying that they stayed up three hours past their bedtime to finish it.

B (91:42)

I can't wait to read it. I have it. I've purchased it.

A (91:45)

I'm very excited.

B (91:46)

I'm excited.

A (91:47)

If you would like to share your goals with us, please come to the Facebook group. Come to the BFF group. You can also follow us on Instagram atonpaperpodcast. I am on Instagram ecamfreeman and I. I mean, I don't want to promise, but I think I'm gonna get a little more active there this year. And my newsletter is at becca freeman.substack.com.

B (92:11)

I am on Instagram and substack liviamentor. And if you would like to pre order my book, little one, please consider doing that if you can. It comes out on February 3rd and I will be so grateful for your support.

A (92:25)

We'll see you next week for three things.

B (92:27)

Bye.

A (92:27)

Bye.