Our Summer Backlist Reading

Summary

Podcast Summary: "Bad On Paper"
Episode: Our Summer Backlist Reading
Release Date: May 14, 2025

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Introduction to Backlist Books

In this episode of Bad On Paper, hosts Becca Freeman and Olivia Muenter delve into the world of backlist books, discussing their significance and sharing personal insights on their reading habits.

• Becca Freeman explains, "A backlist book is basically defined as a publisher's older books in their catalog that are still in print. So usually this is something that is over a year old" ([04:36]).

• Olivia Muenter adds, "There's something cozy about a book that, you know, you can just roll up and request it on Libby or wherever and it'll, it won't be as long of a wait" ([05:35]).

Frontlist vs. Backlist Reading Habits

The conversation shifts to the differences between frontlist (new releases) and backlist reading preferences.

• Becca admits, "My percentage of backlist is so low. Like I would say I'm reading 5% backlist, 95% front list" ([06:18]).

• Olivia counters with her own habits, "I don't read much Backlist. What about you?" ([06:14]).

Challenges of Incorporating Backlist Reads

Both hosts discuss the challenges and pressures associated with reading backlist titles, such as feeling the need to keep up with trends and maintaining opinions on popular books.

• Becca shares her struggle: "I feel a pressure to have an opinion on books that are coming out, to be able to recommend to people" ([06:18]).

• Olivia reflects on her evolving reading strategy, "I'm a mood reader... I kind of want a little bit of each one. And there's something about that as like an eldest daughter, like, you know, good student, that feels really wrong about that" ([10:43]).

Listener Voicemails: Backlist Book Recommendations

Becca and Olivia play voicemails from listeners, each recommending a backlist book. Highlights include:

1. Kate from Houston recommends "The Great Believers" by Rebecca Mackay, praising its emotional depth and portrayal of the AIDS crisis in 1980s Chicago ([21:09]).

2. Abby from Houston highlights "Country Club Murders" by Julie Mulhern, noting its engaging setting in the 70s and compelling family dynamics ([22:29]).

3. Gigi Collins suggests "The Cave Dwellers" by Christina McDowell for its satirical take on Washington's elite families ([22:29]).

4. Grace from Seattle recommends "Wrong Place, Wrong Time" by Gillian McAllister, a thriller involving time loops and a mother's desperate attempt to prevent her son's violent act ([22:29]).

5. Sarah from Connecticut introduces "Una Out of Order" by Margarita Montemore, a time-travel narrative exploring a woman's life through her birthdays ([52:46]).

Hosts' Personal Backlist Picks

Becca and Olivia share their own favorite backlist books they've read and those they plan to tackle this summer.

• Olivia discusses "Saint X" by Alessandra Torre and "Seawife" by Amity Gage, highlighting their unique narratives and personal impact ([13:27]).

• Becca mentions "Greenlights" by Matthew McConaughey and "Early Morning Riser" by Katherine Heine, expressing mixed feelings based on content and personal preferences ([27:03]).

Summer Reading Lists and Goals

The hosts outline their plans to create and adhere to summer backlist reading lists, aiming to balance new releases with timeless classics.

• Becca outlines her list, including "Happy All the Time" by Laurie Colwyn and "Giovanni's Room" by James Baldwin, emphasizing the importance of exploring literary classics ([40:41]).

• Olivia shares her intent to read "Parable of the Sower" by Octavia Butler and "Poisonwood Bible" by Barbara Kingsolver, planning to deepen her understanding of diverse literary voices ([52:55]).

Obsessions and Current Reads

Transitioning from books, the hosts discuss their current obsessions beyond reading.

• Olivia is enamored with long walks and birdwatching using the Merlin app, finding joy in identifying different bird species ([59:21]).

• Becca reveals her obsession with the musical "Happy Ending", praising its tender storytelling and exceptional staging. She recommends it highly and expresses excitement for Olivia to join her in experiencing it ([60:55]).

Final Book Recommendations

Both hosts provide additional book recommendations, emphasizing diversity in genres and themes.

• Olivia praises "She Used to be Nice" by Alexia Lofata for its multifaceted storytelling and emotional depth ([63:02]).

• Becca recommends "Audition" by Katie Kitamura, highlighting its exploration of performance both on and off the stage ([70:42]).

Conclusion and Community Engagement

Becca and Olivia encourage listeners to share their backlist reading lists through their Facebook and Geneva groups, fostering a community of book enthusiasts eager to explore beyond current bestsellers.

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Notable Quotes:

• "I feel like one of our most frequent pieces of feedback is from library readers who want to follow our book club picks and then go to their library. And there's a 300 person wait, which I totally get that that's frustrating." — Becca Freeman ([04:36])

• "I feel like I get to experience different writing styles more. I get to, like, discover new authors." — Olivia Muenter ([10:43])

• "I am staying fresh. Staying fresh mentally." — Olivia Muenter ([12:51])

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Upcoming Topics:

The episode wraps up with a teaser for upcoming discussions, including a potential backlist book club pick and more in-depth explorations of listener recommendations.

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Connect with Hosts:

• Becca Freeman: Instagram | Newsletter
• Olivia Muenter: Instagram | Substack

Follow them on Facebook under Bad On Paper Podcast and join their Geneva group to engage with the community and share your own backlist favorites.

Transcript

[Becca Freeman]

Hi, everyone. Welcome back to Baton Paper Podcast. I'm Becca Freeman.

[Olivia Mentor]

And I'm Olivia, Mentor.

[Becca Freeman]

And today we are talking about Backlist books.

[Olivia Mentor]

Yes, it is pouring rain outside right now, very gloomy, and it feels like the perfect day to just chat about books that we can all go to our local library and hopefully check out right now.

[Becca Freeman]

Oh, yeah. Big library energy weather today.

[Olivia Mentor]

Oh, yes. Well, let's get into some highs and lows first. Tell me your high.

[Becca Freeman]

My high is just that I've had a really fun week of social plans. I went to go see a really great new musical on Tuesday, which we'll get into in Obsessions. I had fun lunch plans with a friend who's between jobs. I had another friend visiting from out of town and we got mani pedis. I went to go see a friend's new apartment last night. Like, I just feel like I've had all of these fun social plans, but I'm managing to do it alongside getting good book writing done. And I feel like all of my plates are spinning and in the best way, in a way that I feel like I've found really difficult for the past. Like, since the beginning of this year. Like, I feel like I can only do one or the other. And so, yeah, I feel really good.

[Olivia Mentor]

Good. I love that feeling when you, like, go to sleep at night and you just feel like life is so full and you feel, like, tired. In a good way. You know, you're like, my brain is tired, my body's tired. Like, I feel loved going to sleep. It's a good feeling.

[Becca Freeman]

Yeah.

[Olivia Mentor]

That's so great.

[Becca Freeman]

What about you? What's your high?

[Olivia Mentor]

My high is, like, kind of the opposite, actually, in a way. But it's just that I've had a really boring week, and I had a few social weeks before that, which were great, but it's just been very quiet. It's been a lot of days of rain. Some pretty days, too. Just a lot of days sitting in my laptop watching the rain fall. The garden is so green because of all the rain, which is so nice. And it's just been nice. Like, I said no to some things, some social plans, which felt like the right choice just to sort of hunker down and work. I am currently reading the draft of my book Out Loud, which is painstaking and slow. So it's been nice to do that and just kind of be alone and chill. It's been nice. Oh, good.

[Becca Freeman]

Do we have lows to speak of?

[Olivia Mentor]

I don't think I do.

[Becca Freeman]

I don't think I Do either.

[Olivia Mentor]

Good.

[Becca Freeman]

Look at us.

[Olivia Mentor]

Great. Look at us go. We're off to a great start.

[Becca Freeman]

Well, let's take a quick ad break and then let's get into some book chat.

[Olivia Mentor]

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[Becca Freeman]

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[Olivia Mentor]

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[Becca Freeman]

All right, Olivia, let's get into this episode. So we're talking about backlist books, and maybe some people don't know the lingo of what a backlist book is, but a backlist book is basically defined as a publisher's older books in their catalog that are still in print. So usually this is something that is over a year old. And we wanted to talk about this because I feel like one of our most frequent pieces of feedback is from library readers who want to follow our book club picks and then go to their library. And there's a 300 person wait, which I totally get that that's frustrating. Although I will say one of the good parts of a podcast book club is that whenever you get off the List, the episode's waiting for you. But today we want to, we want to talk about some more library friendly reads.

[Olivia Mentor]

Yeah, there's something cozy about a book that, you know, you can just roll up and request it on Libby or wherever and it'll, it won't be as long of a wait. At least you know, you only have a little time if there is a wait.

[Becca Freeman]

I mean, the other thing about reading back list versus front list is that I feel like opinion has really settled on books by then. So you're not just like taking a chance on something buzzy for the most part you're like, I understand, you know, maybe your opinion differs from the masses. And you're like, this was not for me. But like you kind of know what you're getting into.

[C]

Yeah.

[Olivia Mentor]

What percentage of your reading would you say is front list versus Backlist?

[Becca Freeman]

My percentage of backlist is so low. Like I would say I'm reading 5% backlist, 95% front list. I feel a pressure to have an opinion on books that are coming out, to be able to recommend to people, hey, here's what's coming out that you should pay attention to that big buzzy book that everyone's talking about. Here's what I think about it. Like I really want to act as like a source of discovery for people. And there's so many new books coming out. Like, I feel like I cannot keep up with them. So I almost feel guilty when I read Backlist, even though this is totally made up in my head and nobody is expecting me to have an opinion on every book or you know, know it's self imposed pressure. But yeah, I do not read much Backlist. What about you?

[Olivia Mentor]

No, not much. I don't know, I would say maybe it's like 85, 15, like percentage wise, 85 new books, 15 older books, books a year or more old.

[Becca Freeman]

You know what I associate you with? I associate you with discovering an author and then the becoming a completist and going back to their whole back catalog.

[Olivia Mentor]

You know, I have been doing this more. I don't know. Part of my philosophy with books in life is like when I find something I like, I'm going full speed ahead. I'm just like all in. I will talk about it nonstop because I don't know, especially with books, it's like I would love nothing more if a reader did that with my work one day.

[Becca Freeman]

Oh, sure.

[Olivia Mentor]

And it's just, it feels, I don't know, it feels so comforting to be like, I understand exactly what I like and what I like is this. And it speaks to me. It feels like solidarity with another human in some way. But yeah, I have been doing this more typically I haven't and I don't do it every time. Like for example, I loved and we'll talk about this in a minute, but I loved Demon, Copperhead and like everyone's like, you need to read all of her other books. I love her and I just, I put it off sometimes. Cause I'm like, well, she has a great back catalog.

[Becca Freeman]

Barbara King Solver.

[Olivia Mentor]

I know. And it's also intimidating. Like where do I start? And then to your point, there's books we read that we might be blurbing. Or to your point, there are books that we have to read for book club. We have to screen them. There are books that we are going to be talking about that everyone else is reading. We're just curious. I literally have zero self control when it comes to buying new books because it's a business expense. And also you'll never catch me in an independent bookstore not buying something. I feel compelled in my soul. And so I have all these new books and I'm like, well, I guess I'll read them. And also like, of course, like occasionally, you know, you're asked to blurb books and then you're reading more. It's like even the newest of new books. So it's hard, it's just like logistically hard to make time for backlist, I think, which is a problem I love for myself.

[Becca Freeman]

Do you know what I heard secondhand recently? Oliver Berkman, who, who wrote Time Management for Mortals, has a follow up book called Meditations for Mortals. And I haven't read the second book. We did the first for book Club, January of 2024. And I've heard that in that he talks about prioritizing your reading and to think of your to read list as a river as opposed to a bucket. So. So it's not this thing that is constantly getting fuller and fuller. It's a river that's flowing past you and you can pick and choose a few things, but you let the rest flow past. And I really like that. I feel like that has slightly relaxed me from some of the pressure I put on myself and or like I'm never gonna get to every book. It's just impossible. And so I'm just letting them flow past. And I'm not stressing about. I'm like, okay, well now I'm onto the summer titles. I missed a bunch of spring ones. Whatever.

[Olivia Mentor]

That's really interesting. You Know, I was just thinking about something similar last night because I traditionally have been a completist when it comes to reading. If I start a book, I'm going to finish it 100%. And I think there's a common point that people bring up with that that you've talked about really skillfully. Like, if you don't like a book, you should not keep reading it. There are so many other books.

[Becca Freeman]

Yeah.

[Olivia Mentor]

But actually, I find what I've been doing more lately is it's not that I stop reading because I don't like the book. Just like, I am such a mood reader. And sometimes I'll read a hundred pages and then I'll move on to something else. And it's not because I don't like it necessarily. It's just that there are so many other books and, like, I kind of want a little bit of each one. And there's something about that as like an eldest daughter, like, you know, good student, that feels really wrong about that. But ultimately, like, I feel like I get to experience different writing styles more. I get to, like, discover new authors. I can go back to the books. Do you wanna hear about the really unhinged reading habit that I've had recently that Jake was like, actually, what are you doing right now?

[Becca Freeman]

Obviously, Yes, I do.

[Olivia Mentor]

Okay. So I've been doing this thing where I bring, like two or three books to bed, and I sit there and I alternate between them by chapter. So I know it's. It's so wild. It's so weird. It's so weird because in the past, what I've done is I really like bringing a bunch of books to bed and then paging through them, kind of like scrolling Netflix.

[Becca Freeman]

I'm like, do I want to testing them out?

[Olivia Mentor]

Let me try it. Exactly. It feels really fun. And then with the two books that I currently have, they're very different. And I was like, oh, I'll read one chapter of this one, one chapter of the other. And I read a hundred pages that way between the two of them, and it's chaotic. But honestly, it's kind of fun. Like, in a way, I really like it.

[Becca Freeman]

How does your brain keep the story straight? Literally alternate? Like, I feel like I would conflate it into one mega book.

[Olivia Mentor]

They're so different, which helps, but in a weird way, it's like, it's helpful for me to understand, like, what works about each of them, you know, like, from a writing perspective. I don't know. Like, it's not something I'll do all the Time. Just, like, when I'm feeling kind of bored or, like, wishy washy or antsy, I've been doing this and it's kind of fun. It's weird. I'm sure there's gonna be a lot of people like, what's wrong with you? I don't know. But I do feel like it's kind of like doing Sudoku. Like, my brain. I feel like I'm actively fighting Alzheimer's, you know, Like, I. I'm staying fresh. Staying fresh mentally.

[Becca Freeman]

I'm happy that you're happy.

[Olivia Mentor]

Try it.

[Becca Freeman]

I have no intention to try that.

[Olivia Mentor]

All right, well, someone try it and let me know.

[Becca Freeman]

Okay, so for today's plan of attack, we each brought some recently read backlist books that we read and enjoyed. But then we also have, like, a summer reading list of sorts for ourselves of backlist books that we strive to get to. So why don't we start with. Tell me some of the most recent backlist books that you've read and enjoyed and why you picked them up.

[Olivia Mentor]

Yes. So the majority of the books that I read backlist that I'm gonna talk about now are 2020 books, which really makes me think of, like, God, the 2020 books had it hard, but I'm glad that, like, they're getting their moment now, hopefully for me and other people. Anyway, Saint X came out in 2020. This is about a family that goes on vacation to this resort in the Caribbean, and the older daughter goes missing and eventually is found. And it's a lot about race. It's like a sort of dual timeline story. It's a lot about her sister who. Spoiler, sort of mini spoiler. But the girl who goes missing ends up found dead. And it's sort of about how her sister grows up dealing with the presence of the sister that she's lost. It's like, very reminiscent of the Natalee Holloway case. But I picked this up because I went to a book event in town at Kinderhook Books with Betsy Lerner, who wrote Shred Sisters, which is excellent, by the way, if anyone is looking for a book. And she was in conversation with Alexis, and so I obviously bought all their books, and that was one of them. And this is a very divisive book, but I loved it. It's also a show on Hulu that I've heard is terrible, but that's it. I really enjoyed it and this book.

[Becca Freeman]

Did you watch the show?

[Olivia Mentor]

I didn't. I watched the trailer and I just thought, mm, no, I'm not.

[Becca Freeman]

It's so funny. I was texting with my friend Peter the other day. Peter reads one book every two years. He was reading Verity for three years. He reads them on vacation. And we're going. We're going on vacation next week. And he. He got two books to bring on vacation. And I thought it was kind of interesting because they were both older books. He got the perfect Nanny because there's already a show slash movie. And then another book called Small Great Things by Jodi Picoult, which I was like, where did you find this recommendation? Anyway? He said, I got the perfect nanny because there's already a show slash movie and I'm a. For a screen adaptation. It makes me feel so proud. Like, I would have to lean over to the person next to me and say, you know, I've read this. So classy.

[Olivia Mentor]

The book was better.

[Becca Freeman]

So I was wondering if, now that you've read the book, if you need to go see the show and lean over to Jake and be like, you know, I read the book.

[Olivia Mentor]

No, you know, like, the thing about say Next is, like, it's such a beautiful prose that I feel like I think the Hulu adaptation is I'm pulling this out of somewhere that feels right, but could be wrong. It's produced by Drake. Like, I could be wrong, but it just didn't feel like. I don't know, it just feels like a book that its best form is in written form.

[Becca Freeman]

And it's also with a mystery. It's like, once you know the twists, there's no putting the cat back in the bag.

[Olivia Mentor]

Right? Yes. And I don't know, I would be so curious if other people have read this and they were, like, wanting to watch the show because I just. There's something about it that I was like, no, this won't work. I was like, no. The other book I read earlier at the beginning of this year, that's backlist, is Seawife by Amity Gage. It came out in 2020. I've talked about it a ton. I know a lot of people read it. Controversial and controversial. I saw that post. It did hurt my feelings a little bit. But, no, I'm glad everyone has their opinions. The one that was like, I usually trust Olivia's recommendations, but I despise this. But, you know, I remain confident in it.

[Becca Freeman]

You weren't lying. You loved it.

[Olivia Mentor]

No, I loved it. I stand by it. And to be fair, there were a lot of people who did like it as well. And it is not a book for everyone either. But I love this book. It's About a family who decides to live on a sailboat for a year. And I just thought it was such a creative and beautiful way to write a mystery.

[Becca Freeman]

And this was one of your dives. This was your Amity Gage dive after you read Hartwood at the end of last year. And then you were obsessed and you were like, I need to read all of this author's back catalog.

[Olivia Mentor]

Yeah. I also read her other book, Schroeder, which was very good, but she has two more I actually haven't read, but.

[Becca Freeman]

Oh, so you still have more. I love doing that. I feel like I only get obsessed like that once every few years and feel the need to do it.

[Olivia Mentor]

Katherine Center.

[Becca Freeman]

Katherine Center. Ellen Hayden.

[Olivia Mentor]

I remember.

[Becca Freeman]

So it's like a special glimmer when you have that feeling.

[Olivia Mentor]

It is a really special experience. It is. And then similarly, I read God Shot by Chelsea Beaker, which also came out in 2020. Actually, I was looking it up, and I think it came out, like, March 30, 2020, which is like, ooh, can't imagine something tougher than that. But this is a book about a girl who grows up in. Or not grows up, but her mother becomes part of, like, a very extreme religious cult in central California. I'm so bad with California geography, but it's in the middle of a drought. And anyway, so obviously I love cults and I love this book. It's just such an interesting portrayal of, like, girlhood. And. Yeah, it's great. Great cover, great cover. And then finally, I most recently read the Great Believers by Rebecca Mackay. And I had read. I have some questions for you. Which was her. It's kind of like a literary mystery that came out a couple years ago. I liked it. And then I went to another event with her and another author at the bookstore, and so I was like, oh, I'll buy this in paperback. And oh, my gosh, people love this book. Like, you mention it, people just lose their minds. They love it so, so much.

[Becca Freeman]

Well, I feel like this is a book that is kind of, like, career defining. Like, I feel like this might have been. I don't think I'm making this up. Like, this might have been on the New York Times Best books of the 21st century list. Like, this is a big book.

[Olivia Mentor]

Pulitzer or National Book Award nominee. I can't remember which, but, like, huge book.

[Becca Freeman]

Yeah.

[Olivia Mentor]

And I totally get why. It's about the, like, AIDS crisis in Chicago in the 80s. I didn't know anything about it. And just the character work. Like, it's just beautiful. But God, it's deeply sad. There's this one chapter. I've probably talked about this recently. I'm so sorry if I have. But there's this one chapter that is essentially one of the main characters. It's essentially one of the characters last moments and like the things going through their head and oh, it felt so real, but. And it was so beautiful, but it was really hard.

[Becca Freeman]

This is a book that I want to read, but I feel like I'm still recovering from my PTSD from A Little Life and needing to fall in love with characters and watching them die feels my book. Like, when am I in the mood for that? Like, when am I like, you know, I'd really love to get attached to some people and watch them die.

[Olivia Mentor]

Yeah. A Little Life is a backlist book that, like, you know, when it's like you're not actively refusing to read it, it's probably like your demon Copperhead, actually. Yeah, it's like you're not refusing to read it. It's just there's some mental block where you see it 150 times a year, but you're like, no, not now, later. But I'm here a little. Life is great.

[Becca Freeman]

So good. Sobbed my way through. I think it might be my sobbiest book that I've ever read.

[Olivia Mentor]

Oh, wow.

[Becca Freeman]

Yeah, wow.

[Olivia Mentor]

I need to choose a day and just cry.

[Becca Freeman]

Yeah, it's a long one. You might need to choose a weekend to cry a week.

[Olivia Mentor]

That's great. Yeah, especially if I'm reading other books while I'm reading it, like literally in real time. Well, let's listen to some voicemails from some listeners about their favorite backlist books.

[Becca Freeman]

Yeah, these are all going to be a surprise for us. We had to shuffle things at the last minute, so we haven't heard these voicemails yet. But we're excited to listen to them.

[C]

Hi, Becca and Olivia. My name is Kate and I want to recommend the Great Believers by Rebecca Mackay, which I believe Olivia mentioned she finished earlier this year. This came out in 2019 and I actually finished it while traveling home on a plane. And no joke, I was a total weeping mess. My seatmate, who I did not know, leaned over to ask if I was okay. That's how hard this book hit me. I honestly don't understand how this hasn't gotten the same acclaim that A Little Life has. The characters are so rich and real. I felt completely immersed in their lives. This is told in a dual timeline, one of them being set in 1980s Chicago during the start and height of the AIDS crisis. I've never read anything set in that time or about that topic in such depth and it was really eye opening for me. I actually learned a lot. But more than that, I really felt everything. It's really devastatingly beautiful. I recommend this with a warning that it will wreck you emotionally, but for those who have read and loved Kristin Hannah, it has the same kind of emotional pull. So if you're in the right headspace, you should pick this one up.

[Becca Freeman]

Thanks.

[C]

Hello, this is Abby from Houston and I love a backlist book, but I am here to make a desperate plea for more people to read the Country Club Murders by Julie Mulhern. It's about a woman who is just going through it. She has a teenage daughter and she keeps finding dead bodies and the first body she finds is her husband's mistress. There are now 19 books in the series. I read them all and they are just an absolutely delicious bite of time. Set in the 70s. Nobody has cell phones, everybody's smoking, people keep dying. It's just a really wonderful romp and I highly recommend. Thanks guys. Hi Becca and Olivia, this is Gigi Collins with a backlist book recommendation. I recently saw a post in the Facebook group looking for book suggestions about rich people behaving badly, and the first book that came to mind was the Cave dwellers by Christina McDowell. It's a really entertaining, fun satire about the lives of Washington's wealthy elite families, told from multiple perspectives. The author grew up just outside D.C. and this was her first novel following a memoir about her father going to prison for securities fraud. I highly recommend adding the Cave Dwellers to your summer reading tbr. Happy reading. Hi Becca and Olivia, this is Grace calling from Seattle. I'm calling to recommend the book Wrong Place, Wrong time by Gillian McAllister for the Backlog episode. This came out in 2022. It is a thriller and it begins with a mother who's up late waiting for her teenage son to come home. She's looking out her window, she's a little bit anxious. It's late at night and as she sees her son walking back towards the house, she sees him commit a very violent act against a random person and she has no idea who this person is or why her son would do this. But the police come, they take her teenage son into custody and she falls asleep. When she wakes up the next morning, it's yesterday. So this crime has not happened yet, and she's thinking maybe she can do something to prevent all of this from happening. But every day when she wakes up, she is one day further back in time. And so she starts to wonder if the answers to why her son would do this and who this person is lie somewhere in the past. So she needs to figure those answers out in order to stop her son from eventually doing what he does. It is twisty, it's unexpected. It will keep you reading. I highly recommend it and can't wait to hear the other recommendations. Hey Becca and Olivia, I am going to recommend the Calculating Stars by Mary Robinette Kowal as a backlist book that I love. I rarely hear anybody talking about it. I believe it came out in 2018 and it is, I think, a great book. If you loved Project Hail Mary, it's kind of like Project Hail and Mary meets Hidden Figures meets Age of Miracles by Karen Thompson Walker. I absolutely loved it because it combines a sort of trope that I love, which is alternate history. So what happens is a meteor hits Earth in a fictionalized 1952, and a woman who was an Air Force pilot in World War II basically gets like, called upon to work on the efforts of colonizing space basically to be an astronaut. It's a lot about feminism and sort of like women in stem, quote unquote. But it's so emotionally real and intense and also has kind of like the fun thrillingness of Project Hail Mary. And it was just unlike anything I've ever read before.

[Olivia Mentor]

Becca?

[Becca Freeman]

Yes?

[Olivia Mentor]

Tell me about your backlist books of this year that you've read and enjoyed.

[Becca Freeman]

I have like none from this year. This episode really drove home how few backlist books I've read. I went through all my books from this year and the only, only two that I've read that are backlist were Green lights by Matthew McConaughey, which somehow does not feel like it counts. It obviously counts. It came out in 2020. But I'm like, I'm dipping back into the archives to read Matthew McConaughey's book who does not need my praise or money.

[Olivia Mentor]

He's not struggling.

[Becca Freeman]

I don't think he's not struggling. I'm doing him no favors. So that was great. I read it because some of my friends that I play pickleball with were raving about it as their favorite kind of self help memoir after we all read Let Them earlier this year. And so I was just so intrigued and it really surprised me because I had pigeonholed Matthew McConaughey as a hot dumb jock with not a lot going on upstairs. And he was really thoughtful and he also had a freaking wild childhood.

[Olivia Mentor]

Oh yeah, there's a lot going on upstairs. I'm not really sure if I understand it, but he's got a lot going.

[Becca Freeman]

On, so I enjoyed that. And then the other one, I'm not. I didn't not enjoy it, but I'm not positive that I enjoyed it. And this is a book that's come up multiple times in the context of kind of an. A hidden gem or a hidden. A book that didn't get enough flowers that it deserved. And the book is Early Morning Riser by Katherine Heine, and that came out in 2021. And it's about this woman who moves to Boyne City, Michigan, and she's a teacher, and she starts dating this guy who's kind of like the town rake, if rake is a word that we still use in contemporary times. So he's kind of dated everyone, and she falls in love with him and he doesn't want to get married. And they kind of have this, like, long, many years relationship in different forms. And I liked it. It's a slice of life novel where there is a plot, but it's not super plotty. You're not following, like, what's gonna happen next? I don't know. There's a plot line about a man with mental disabilities. And I felt really uncomfortable with the plotline because I was not positive in the book quite where he was in terms of his capabilities. And at some points I was like, are you infantilizing him? I don't know. Like, I just. I was slightly uncomfortable with the plotline as a whole.

[Olivia Mentor]

Okay. Didn't work for you, that part?

[Becca Freeman]

Yeah. And it was. It's a big part of it. But I thought the writing was really beautiful. And I've heard that the Midwesterness of this novel is, like, dead on. Okay, so those are the only ones that I've read this year. But then I went back to last year and I actually read a bunch coming off of the New York Times Best book of the 21st century. And then I did a crowdsourced list, and I ended up reading a bunch off of that project. I'm actually not sure if the first one is, but I read Sorrow and Bliss by meg Mason, another 2020 book. And this one, again, had been recommended a lot of times as, like, a weird hidden gem book. And I loved this. It's about this woman who's very difficult. Like, she's just very persnickety, like, kind of in the way of like an Eleanor Oliphant, but in a snobby way. Like, in A different way than Eleanor Oliphant, but like really specific main character. And it's told in two timelines. In the first one, her husband is leaving her and she's like trying to figure out how to live her adult life without her husband. And she lives in maybe it's Manchester or like a second tier city in England. And she's like left her her job and she kind of has this like freelance job and her life just isn't ideal. And then in the past it goes back to when she was a teenager and she's diagnosed with an unnamed mental health disorder in the book. And so it kind of tells the story in two timelines. I thought this was like really interesting and surprising. And some of the writing, like a scene would just be two sentences. It would be like the most incredible, like cut to the bone of what you needed to know. Two sentences about a person or a situation. I was like, wow. And then the other ones that I read in the second half of last year, we read Bel Canto together as a group by Ann Patchett from 2001.

[Olivia Mentor]

Can I just say, I cannot believe that was last year.

[Becca Freeman]

November.

[Olivia Mentor]

If you were to ask me, I'd be like, that was a week ago. Time is flying.

[Becca Freeman]

And this was such an interesting reading experience because I liked the book, but I didn't love felt dated. However, I read the annotated version of that book too, which was a special edition that came out last year. And reading Ann Patchett reflecting on this book that she wrote early in her career was such a special reading experience.

[Olivia Mentor]

Yeah, I still haven't gotten the annotated book, but I was like you and not wasn't my jam.

[Becca Freeman]

I'm really interested to read more Ann Patchett. I've really only read Tom Lake and Bel Canto and then I tried to read State of Wonder and couldn't really get into it. So I'm really curious to read more of hers and also to read her nonfiction because I've heard that she writes a lot about writing in her nonfiction.

[Olivia Mentor]

Yeah, I was just about to say I would love to read that, like her books on writing so much.

[Becca Freeman]

The one last year that I read that I. I'd been avoidant of because I felt like it was overhyped but ended up just loving was the Invisible Life of Addie LaRue, which is also a 2020 book. And I feel like this is one of the things that's like the beauty of Backlist is like you can just go for the hits. You can go for the Gems. And I think this is on Kindle Unlimited too. Or it was when I read it. That's where I read it from.

[Olivia Mentor]

This is one of your favorites of last year, right?

[Becca Freeman]

I loved it.

[Olivia Mentor]

Am I remembering that correctly? Yeah, I loved it.

[Becca Freeman]

The book starts in the 1500s, which is very not me. And it's about this girl who lives in a French village and she's about to get married and she makes this bargain with God, some higher power that basically allows her to live forever, but she will be forgotten the second she leaves anyone's sight. So she can't have any long term meaningful relationships with familial friends, lovers, anyone. Like she is doomed to be forgotten. And so the book is told throughout her life. And then I guess I didn't expect that. There was also a contemporary timeline that I think is maybe in 2018 or something and in New York City and they're kind of like young hipsters. And I was like, oh, I love this.

[Olivia Mentor]

My mom also loved this book. She was like, becca recommended this book and I loved it.

[Becca Freeman]

Oh my gosh, Kim. It has some of the most like, beautiful, insightful theme nuggets. Like, you know, those, the underlined paragraphs. Oh my gosh. It has some of the most beautiful passages in it. Oh my gosh.

[Olivia Mentor]

Sorry.

[Becca Freeman]

Olivia's shoving Starbucks egg bites in her mouth.

[Olivia Mentor]

I haven't eaten and it's 10:30. Okay, I need a hearty breakfast. Okay, tell me your final recent ish backlist.

[Becca Freeman]

Yeah, my final one was from last summer. I read Never Let Me Go by Kazuo Ishiguro, which is a 2005 book and then became movie, which I have not seen with Andrew Garfield and Keira Knightley. And who's the other person that I'm not thinking that I can't think of?

[Olivia Mentor]

I don't know.

[Becca Freeman]

Oh, Carey Mulligan. Carey Mulligan.

[Olivia Mentor]

Oh my. That is a star studding. That is a strong British trifecta for me. I know, I've watched it. But wow, I might need to return to it because what a trio. What a trio of stars.

[Becca Freeman]

And this book is kind of sci fi. And I liked it at the time. I didn't love it at the time, but it has stuck with me. It is stuck with me in a way that few books do. And I think it's a book that's better gone into knowing nothing.

[Olivia Mentor]

Yeah, I agree. I haven't read it in like a decade, but I agree.

[Becca Freeman]

So I'm not going to tell you anything about what it's about.

[Olivia Mentor]

That's the type of book where if I see the movie and I'm like, oh, Andrew Garfield is in it and it feels like it matches like the quality of the actors and the production matches the like, tone of the book, then I'm in, you know?

[Becca Freeman]

Okay.

[Olivia Mentor]

It has to be like, it has to be the right balance. Yeah. Have you watched the movie?

[Becca Freeman]

No, I said you didn't. I don't know if I have the emotional fortitude to watch the movie, frankly.

[Olivia Mentor]

It's. Yeah, that's very fair. It's very fair.

[Becca Freeman]

So let's take another quick ad break and then let's get into our maybe self assigned summer reading.

[Olivia Mentor]

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[Becca Freeman]

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[Olivia Mentor]

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[Becca Freeman]

Okay, Olivia, so before we dive into more books, I need to know what your relationship is to summer reading. Like, were you assigned summer reading for school? Did you do it? Did you take it seriously?

[Olivia Mentor]

I. Yes, I'm sure I was. And yes, I'm sure I always did it because I, you know, wanted to be a good student. I do think I procrastinated on a lot of it and I can't remember any titles that stand out to me. What about you?

[Becca Freeman]

I'm sure I did have summer reading. I'm sure I did it. I'm sure I took it seriously. But what sticks out in my mind, as we've discussed, we are both big Barnes and Noble kids in suburban Florida. And Barnes and Noble had this reading list designed for high schoolers. I should have tried to see if I could dig it up. And I remember it being kind of classics type books and I fetishized that list. Like I thought this list was like the be all end all of becoming like a literate cultural citizen. This is how 17 year old me.

[Olivia Mentor]

In Florida, the, the AP LIT reading list.

[Becca Freeman]

Okay?

[Olivia Mentor]

I got every single book and I like kept them on a giant like a stack in my bedroom. And I remember just one summer maybe or like while prepping for the test, we just went through all of them reading all of them. Yeah, I get what you mean.

[Becca Freeman]

I kind of love the idea of whether it's like a season. So last fall I had really good intentions that fell apart. I decided last fall I was going to do this backlist fall reading project. And I set out probably like 20 books for myself that were older books because last fall, because of the election, there were very few new releases coming out. So I was like, oh my gosh, this is the perfect time where I'm not missing out on anything and I'm just going to dive back into books that I missed. And then the election itself happened and after the results, I was like, I can only read the fluffiest, most comforting books ever. So it kind of fell apart. I only read a few from that. But I really love the idea of kind of a self created reading list of, you know, holes in your reading or, you know, authors that you've become obsessed with that you want to dive backwards into their catalog. And like I picked five that I would like to read by the end of the summer, but if not by the end of the year, definitely, I.

[Olivia Mentor]

Think we can make this happen.

[Becca Freeman]

I think so too. I think so too. And I think by creating a list as opposed to just being like, oh, I should read more backlist, I think that makes it more tangible. And if any of our listeners create a backlist reading list for themselves, I would love to hear about it in the Facebook group or in the Geneva group.

[Olivia Mentor]

Me too. Tell us the list. I'm so curious.

[Becca Freeman]

The first one I have is Happy all the Time by Laurie Colwyn, which is from 1978. So Laurie Colwyn, as I understand it, was cookbook author, slash. She talked a lot about hosting, and she has these books. This book is not one of them. This is just a novel that are kind of like essays in cookbooks almost. And she also wrote novels, and they're very much like comedies of manners, like social novels. And this one is about two cousins who fall in love. And I specifically want to read Laurie Colwyn because Laurie Colwyn is Ellen Hildebrand's favorite author, who she mentions on every interview. And I'm like, wow, Ellen Hildebrand is one of my favorite authors. So it's almost like sorority culture, where it's like, does that make Laurie Colwyn my, like, grand big. So I have to read her to find out. And then recently, like, this week, there's this girl I follow on Goodreads. I don't know. Her name is Emma. She doesn't have a last name on there, but she's like. Has tens of thousands of followers, like a big Goodreads person. And she writes these kind of like, snarky reviews most of the time. Sometimes she really loves things, but they're usually, like, more snarky. And she just read this book, Happy all the Time. And she compared it to. She was like, this was the 1970s Sally Rooney, which made me even more interested in reading this.

[Olivia Mentor]

I don't know if this is correct, but I feel like I've seen maybe Michelle Martin on Substack write about this author.

[Becca Freeman]

Yes, I think so. I think she recently read something by her.

[Olivia Mentor]

So a lot of signs point to.

[Becca Freeman]

A lot of signs are pointing to Lori Colon.

[Olivia Mentor]

Great choice.

[Becca Freeman]

Yeah. I don't know if this is her most popular. I think that the one she's best known for is Home Cooking, which is one of the cookbooks and essays. It's like part cookbook, part memoir. But I wanted to read one of her novels. So I think I'll start with Happy all the Time. And then if I like that, I'll go to Home Cooking. The second one is Giovanni's Room by James Baldwin, which is from 1956.

[Olivia Mentor]

Wow.

[Becca Freeman]

I know. Going way back.

[Olivia Mentor]

Our deep pick, our deepest pick.

[Becca Freeman]

So I feel like James Baldwin gets cited as an inspiration to so many authors I admire. And so this book is about a man's experience that I think it's maybe kind of a Romana Clay type novel based off of his own experience of an American man moving to Paris and his relationships with men. Their sexual relationships with men. Yeah, I just. I feel like so many People cite Baldwin as this masterful pillar, that they aspire to his writing that I'm like, I need to read this. It's very short. So, yeah, this is also on my list.

[Olivia Mentor]

That sounds great. There is a bookstore called Giovanni's Room in the Gayborhood in Philly. Oh, fun fact.

[Becca Freeman]

Great, great bookstore name.

[Olivia Mentor]

Yes, excellent.

[Becca Freeman]

Very. If you know, you know.

[Olivia Mentor]

Yeah. Talk to me about your next pick because I want to talk about this author. So please.

[Becca Freeman]

Okay. So my next one is American Wife by Curtis Sittenfeld. And I feel like I've read most of Curtis Sittenfeld's books, but I did not read this one. And I really like a Curtis Sittenfeld. I don't, across the board, love them, but I generally really like them. So this is a hole in my back catalog for her. It's a Ramana Clay novel about Laura Bush. And so it's about a small town librarian who falls in love with the son of a political dynasty who goes on to become president. And I think maybe more than any of Curtis Sittenfeld's other books, this is a book that people are like, this is the one. This is my favorite, this is the best one, etc. And I kind of have a block against it because of our current political times where I'm like, I don't really want to humanize or have empathy for Republican politicians right now. And so I feel like I'm worried about being triggered by this, even though I'm sure I probably won't be. So I just have like a mental block I need to get over to read this.

[Olivia Mentor]

Yeah, I understand that. Also, like a political novel in any sense doesn't appeal to me pretty much. But I was going to say the only Curtis Sittenfeld book I have read is romantic comedy.

[Becca Freeman]

Okay.

[Olivia Mentor]

Which you didn't like, but I loved.

[Becca Freeman]

I did not like.

[Olivia Mentor]

And she just had a book of short stories released, which I've heard great things about. I loved her writing in that so much. She has such a great back catalog. And I just like, I've never read Prep.

[Becca Freeman]

You should read Prep.

[Olivia Mentor]

I know Prep is a book for.

[Becca Freeman]

Me that it's like, I saw this meme this week where it was like, is this book great or was I just incredibly 19 when I read it? And that is Prep for me, where I remember Prep as incredible.

[Olivia Mentor]

Maybe I'll add that to my list because I really. I listened to an interview with her recently and I was, like, very charmed by her and I just thought she was so funny and smart and like, very down to earth. So, yeah, I'm with you. More Curtis Enfeld.

[Becca Freeman]

Okay, so my next book that I have is I Need to Read an Ellen Hildebrand. So Ellen Hildebrand, I mean, she has like 24 books, so her back catalog's really big, but I'm trying to work my way through it. But it's something that I probably only want to do in the summer because it's very summer books. So this year I kind of have two that I'm debating between. One is Summer of 69, which is set in 1969. That's her 2019 book. People seem to really love this one. I think it's maybe like the most loved one that I haven't gotten to yet. Or potentially Summer People, which is from 2003. Which, if I'm reading in order and I've read her first and second book, this would be the next one. I'm unsure which I'm going to do.

[Olivia Mentor]

You could do both. Go wild.

[Becca Freeman]

I could. I think it really depends how much time I'm going to spend on beaches.

[Olivia Mentor]

I get that. I get that. That actually affects my reading consumption quite a bit in general.

[Becca Freeman]

Yeah.

[Olivia Mentor]

I'm like, am I like. I'm either gonna have plus or minus 10 books, depending on how much time I spend sitting on a beach alone drinking wine.

[Becca Freeman]

Yep. Because that's the Ellen mood for me.

[Olivia Mentor]

Oh, yeah.

[Becca Freeman]

And then the last one I have is the Most recent one, 2022. Cleopatra and Frankenstein by Coco Melors. After reading Blue Sisters, this was her debut, and this is about a relationship, which maybe is like a dynamic I'm more interested in than a sister book. Although I loved Blue Sisters and it's a much older man, younger woman. And I'm very intrigued to read this.

[Olivia Mentor]

This is also on my list in my pile. I bought it right after Blue Sisters and I was like, I can't wait. I found that she is a very divisive author. Or Blue Sisters maybe is divisive.

[Becca Freeman]

Oh, I don't feel that way at all. I feel like she's like, gets a lot of talent of a generation buzz. Like almost the Sally Rooney type buzz.

[Olivia Mentor]

I agree with that. I mean, like, when I talk to people about that book specifically, I always expect everyone to be like, I loved it. And it's just. It's very mixed in my personal, anecdotally experience. But yes, I agree she gets a lot of buzz. And in my opinion, it's well deserved.

[Becca Freeman]

Well, let's take a break for some more listener voicemails to Hear what other Backlist books listeners recommend.

[C]

Hi, Becca. I'm Olivia. Love the pod. I was thinking about a book that I would recommend that's over a year old. And honestly, I had a little bit of a hard time because I can't remember which books I've gotten from you guys and which ones I haven't because I've gotten so many book recs from you guys. But one that I was thinking about was Lazy Ten Circle Woman, which is a really good book. It's about 15th century Chinese family and about a woman who becomes a physician and she learns from her grandmother and grandfather. And there's like, a lot of, like, feminist tones going through it. It does give a little bit of Memoirs of the Geisha vibe, which is one of my favorite books ever. I would highly, highly, highly recommend it. It's a great historical fiction book. A lot of character development, and one of my favorites. So that's my recommendation. Again, love the pod. Love both of you, and have a great one.

[Becca Freeman]

Hi, Olivia and Becca.

[C]

This is Kara in New Hampshire. I, for the Backlist episode, want to recommend Geek Love. I know a lot of people are rediscovering this book. It's from the 1980s and I just finished it, and it is such a ride. The writing is like nothing I have ever read before.

[Becca Freeman]

It was just a really good reminder.

[C]

That I should read books that are more than like one or two years.

[Becca Freeman]

Old because it just was written in.

[C]

A way that I don't think books are written anymore.

[Becca Freeman]

It's about a family of circus performers.

[C]

There is family drama.

[Becca Freeman]

There is a little bit of romance that's a little uncomfortable.

[C]

There is violence. There is a lot of body horror.

[Becca Freeman]

So, you know, it's not for everybody.

[C]

But I just. I just think Olivia in particular would really love it, and I just think everybody should read it. Okay, thanks. Love the pod. Hi, Olivia and Becca. My name is Isa. Longtime listener, first time caller, here to talk about a backlisted book. The book I've chosen to talk about is the Good Part by Sophie Cousins. I don't know if I'm late to the party or the book didn't get much hype, but it's one of my favorites. It's one of those books that, once you've finished, makes you want to stare at a wall and question everything in life. Not sure if that's a good thing or a bad thing, but it definitely stuck with me. Have a good day. Bye. Hi, Becca and Olivia. My name is Sarah and I'm in Connecticut. I have a lot of backlist books that I love, but I tried to pick one that I don't think was talked about on the podcast like Shark Heart or Wish youh Were Here were that I loved. So the backlist book that I'm recommending is called Una out of Order by Margarita Montemore. I love a time travel book and this one is about a woman named Una who experiences her birthdays out of order. She time travels and kind of like jumps to a different age each year and experiences that year up until the next birthday when she time jumps to a totally different age again. I love it so much. And you kind of can't think about how the time jumping works too much or you'll get kind of lost in the time travel spiral. But it's so good. I really loved it. Anyway, love the podcast as well. And I love how this feels kind of like how the kids would recommend books on Reading Rainbow. Very fun. Hope you have a great day. Hi Becca and Olivia, this is Jen from Albany, New York. I am calling to tell you about a backlist book that's been rolling around in my brain for the last recent while. It's called the Nine Lives of Rose Napolitano by Donna Freitas. And I've been thinking about it recently because it reminds me a lot of the names by Florence Knapp that's been everywhere. It's a Reva Jenna pick. Anyways, back to Rose. She is grappling with whether or not to have children. Her and her husband are fighting about whether she should start taking prenatal vitamins, and the book follows the different choices that she makes and how those could spool out over nine different lives. So it has a similar premise to the names by Florence Knapp, but it's not as dark and heavy, but still deals with some really emotional things and some really serious decisions. And I think your community would honestly really love it because the choice whether or not to have children is something that so many of us grapple with. And I thought it was really great and fascinating to read and I recommend it. It was published in 2021 also, so definitely count as a backlist. Anyways, talk to you later.

[Becca Freeman]

All right, Olivia, what would you say is on your summer this year backlist reading list if you're assigning yourself a syllabus?

[Olivia Mentor]

Yes, if I'm assigning myself a syllabus. So the first one, I have it already. It's sitting in my little stack of books. Parable of the Sower by Octavia Butler, which came out in 1993, I have never really read Octavia Butler at all. For those who don't know, she usually writes, like, sci fi, dystopian, which is a genre that I don't read in a lot, but I like generally. And for that really short character, like, writing workshop class I did, we read a short story by her called Speech Sounds, which I think you can find online. And I liked her writing style so much. It's just. It's very different. I don't know how to describe it. It was just very different. But I really connected with it. And I do love dystopian stuff. And so, yeah, this, I think, is one of her most popular titles. I don't know anything about it. I'm assuming it's dystopian sci fi. And I'm really looking forward to opening it at some point this summer. We're going to make it happen.

[Becca Freeman]

So I'm unsure, but this feels like potentially a book that I was assigned in high school or college and I did not read.

[Olivia Mentor]

That's. It seems like a very, like, assignment book. Assignment Y book.

[Becca Freeman]

Yeah. Huh.

[Olivia Mentor]

I'll report back. I don't know.

[Becca Freeman]

Please.

[Olivia Mentor]

And then the next one, which we've already sort of mentioned, is Poisonwood Bible by Barbara Kingsolver, which came out in 1998. She has so many books, and I've heard great things about all of them, but this is the one, like, the one that everyone talks about. And. Yeah, I know it's at my local library. Although given my completely out of control spending habits around books, I'll probably just buy it. And I'm just. I'm really looking forward to whenever I get to it. Hopefully it's this summer.

[Becca Freeman]

This again feels like a school book.

[Olivia Mentor]

It does. I don't know if we're gonna do a backlist book club pick this year, but maybe it would be a good one for that. I don't know.

[Becca Freeman]

Oh, I love that.

[Olivia Mentor]

Have you read it?

[Becca Freeman]

No. I love the idea of having, like, our traditions. Like, it feels like in January. We're now doing a nonfiction book. July, we have our listener pick book, and maybe November can be our backlist book club.

[Olivia Mentor]

Yeah, I would love that. I don't know whose turn it is to pick then, but we'll check.

[Becca Freeman]

Okay.

[Olivia Mentor]

I think it's yours.

[Becca Freeman]

Oh.

[Olivia Mentor]

Anyway, I love that idea, too. Next up, we've talked about this on recent episodes, but Migrations by Charlotte. I did listen to an interview recently, I have to say, where they said Charlotte McConaughey. And then I thought, actually phonetically, that does make more sense. Ooh. So makana question mark. But Charlotte, I am dying to read this based on how much I loved Wild Darkshore and everyone's just love of it. So that's very high up on my list. I can never find it in bookstores. Weirdly, I looked for it a few times.

[Becca Freeman]

Oh, wow.

[Olivia Mentor]

And like, both at a Barnes and Noble and a smaller store, and I couldn't find it, which was really weird. But maybe now that Wild Dark Shore has been so huge, maybe they'll have it.

[Becca Freeman]

Oh, I was gonna say the opposite. I was gonna say maybe it's because Wild Dark Shore was so big. There's other people looping back and, you know, there's only one or two copies because it's an older book and they're selling it out.

[Olivia Mentor]

Last time I looked for it was before the book had come out, after I had read the advanced copy. So thesis disproven, I don't know. And then I put on my list next Ghost by Dolly Alderton, which came out in 2020 as well. I would read any of her earlier books. Like, I just love her. I love her. Writing brings me such joy. I need more humor in my life in general. You know, I read a lot of dark stuff, so I'm really looking forward to this one. I know that everyone loves it.

[Becca Freeman]

Well, this is her only other book, other than good material, which we read for a book club. This is her only other fiction book. Her other book, Everything I Know About Love is nonfiction.

[Olivia Mentor]

Okay. I couldn't remember which was which. So, yeah, I generally prefer fiction, so I think I'll go with this first, but.

[Becca Freeman]

Oh, I'm very excited to hear what you think about this because I strongly preferred this to good material.

[Olivia Mentor]

Interesting. Okay.

[Becca Freeman]

I liked good material and I think it was very. And I love good material that she went with a male narrator, but I just didn't trust him all the way through. And I think the ending of that book, where it loops back to the perspective of the girlfriend, really made that book for me. But I strongly prefer Ghosts, which is written from the female's perspective throughout.

[Olivia Mentor]

Okay, noted. I'll let you know. And then finally, I want to read Such a Fun Age by Kiley Reid, which came out in 2019.

[Becca Freeman]

Another career defining book.

[Olivia Mentor]

I feel like, yeah, like, I hear nothing but great things about this book across the board. I have zero reference to what it's about, basically. Oh, do you want school, kids? School?

[Becca Freeman]

No. It's about a black woman who is a. I don't remember if she's a babysitter or a nanny for a white family and she is at the grocery store with a child and she basically gets accused of kidnapping the child.

[Olivia Mentor]

Oh, okay.

[Becca Freeman]

Is definitely not. And so it's about racial injustice.

[Olivia Mentor]

Oh, great. Well, the people that love this book I trust implicitly. So I'm looking forward to that one too. Looking forward to all the books all the time. Honestly, I wish I had more time in my life to read.

[Becca Freeman]

I know. I'm very excited for us about these little lists. I feel like we'll have to check back in. I feel like there's a bunch of things we have to check back in on later this year. Like our pop culture predictions from the beginning of the year, our backlist books.

[Olivia Mentor]

Well, maybe when we do the backlist book club episode at the top of it, we can check in on this.

[Becca Freeman]

Oh, good idea. Good idea. I need accountability to pull me out of the new releases, but I think I own all of these. Like, I physically own copies of these books. So maybe I just need to put a pile somewhere in my site.

[Olivia Mentor]

I think I own only Parable of the Sower, but I think that just writing them down and, like, having them really top of mind is helpful. Cause when I do go in bookstores, which is too much, I will, like, have them more top of mind rather than just floating around in the ether of my brain.

[Becca Freeman]

Love that. Well, let's get out of book talk. Very excited for futurists to hear the voicemails, though. Let's talk some obsessions. What are you obsessed with?

[Olivia Mentor]

I'm obsessed with going on really long walks recently.

[Becca Freeman]

Even in the rain?

[Olivia Mentor]

Not in the rain. Let's not push it.

[Becca Freeman]

Well, you're. You said it's been very rainy this week, so I was like, oh, wow.

[Olivia Mentor]

But like, in between the rain, I've been going on long walks. I wish I was like, it's not about the weather. It's about how you're dressed. But I don't have a good rain. I'm not that person anyway. Maybe I'll be more Scandinavian. That feels very Scandinavian to me somehow.

[Becca Freeman]

I agree.

[Olivia Mentor]

But no, in the nice weather, I've been going out and it's been really beautiful. And I've talked about the Merlin app before. It's like this app where you press play and it records the different bird sounds and then it identifies them for you.

[Becca Freeman]

I don't know if we've talked about that. We've certainly talked about your bird, buddy.

[Olivia Mentor]

Oh, yeah, this is different. It actually, I think it's more fun, the Merlin app, and it's free. But it is so, so fun to walk around, to have the Merlin app going and then to look at the birds. And every time I see a new bird, it's. It's so thrilling. Like, I saw I had an osprey the other day, and I'm really thinking how much I talk about birds on this now, to be honest.

[Becca Freeman]

You are one of actually a little bit strange. You are one of multiple friends who have gotten really into birds as they've gotten older.

[Olivia Mentor]

You know, I didn't think it would come from me, the bird obsession, but it came for me and there's something great about it. I don't know. But anyway, this app, it's just great. It's just great. And thank you to Cornell that developed it, I guess.

[Becca Freeman]

Thanks, Cornell.

[Olivia Mentor]

Okay, well, you hinted at this, but tell me what you are obsessed with.

[Becca Freeman]

Oh, my God, Olivia. So I'm obsessed with this musical I saw on Tuesday called maybe Happy Ending, and it's on Broadway right now, but it was originated in South Korea in 2016, and then it traveled around China and Japan and won a bunch of awards in Korea, and it came to Atlanta for a really quick, like, month long stint in 2020. And then the pandemic happened and I feel like it kind of just got lost, but it's making its Broadway debut right now. Darren Criss from Glee is in it right now. And then the woman's name is Helen Shen and this is her first Broadway role. And it's a very small cast, four people. It is one of the best musicals I've seen in such a long time. And it is about two retired helper robots who fall in love. It is so cute. It is, like, very surprisingly tender and emotional. It's adorable. I am obsessed with this also. It has the best staging of a musical I've probably ever seen. Like, the staging was incredible. And I guess it came to Broadway. It opened in, like, October maybe, and I hadn't heard much about it, but a friend had recommended it. And then when I saw the Last five Years with Nick Jonas the other week, it was at the theater next door and it reminded me of it. And so my friend Jenna and I decided to go. And since then, it got nominated for 10 tonys, so I feel like it's about to explode.

[Olivia Mentor]

You got in there at the right time.

[Becca Freeman]

Oh, my gosh. It wasn't that expensive when we bought tickets either. Oh, my gosh. I am so obsessed with this. I actually feel like, Olivia, this is like, you would love it. If you come to New York at any point, we should go see it.

[Olivia Mentor]

I would love that. That sounds. I haven't been to a musical in a long time, so I would. I would really enjoy that. And I love. I love robots.

[Becca Freeman]

I was gonna say robots falling in love. Just. I don't know why, but that does say Elizabeth.

[Olivia Mentor]

It's very me. It's birds and robots falling in love. The most exciting woman on earth right here.

[Becca Freeman]

Well, also a very well read woman. Tell me what you've been reading recently.

[Olivia Mentor]

Oh, wow. That transition.

[Becca Freeman]

Thank you.

[Olivia Mentor]

Flawless.

[Becca Freeman]

I've been doing this for seven years. Sometimes I'm good at it.

[Olivia Mentor]

Meanwhile, I'm like thinking out loud. Like, I've been talking about birds a lot lately, haven't I? Anyway, so I read she Used to Be Nice by Alexia Lofata. And this is about a woman who is a victim of a sexual assault in college. And a few years later she's really struggling in the city, like, using sex and alcohol to really, like, cope with the trauma of this. And her best friend gets engaged. She becomes the maid of honor in this wedding and finds out that the best man is. Her attacker is this man who committed this horrible crime. And so she has to sort of process that. And I was sent this book to blurb to be completely transparent. And I put off reading it for a really long time because I was just convinced it wasn't gonna be for me. And I finally did and I was just blown away by like, the layers of everything in this book. Like, there is a propulsive plot that feels almost thriller. Like, there is a very charming romance. There is social commentary. Like, it's just a very impressive feat that the author managed to combine this all. I'm not surprised that it already has excellent reviews on Goodreads. And like, I think this is a book that many people would get a lot out of. And it's weird to say enjoy because the subject matter is so heavy, but. And of course there are trigger warnings like, please read those. But anyway, hats off to Alexia. I just. Very impressed. I believe it's an indie publisher. And so that makes me just want people to go out there and support her even more.

[Becca Freeman]

You were talking about this off mic and you were so passionate about it when you were talking about it that it was like this, like, kick your heels romance, but also this, like, very important and like, heavy subject matter. And how that was combined that I like requested on NetGalley on the spot when you were pitching it to me.

[Olivia Mentor]

It has something for everyone. In a weird way, it's just like a very compelling read.

[Becca Freeman]

And this comes out in August?

[Olivia Mentor]

Yes, this comes out in August. I also read the Colony by Annika Norlin. I literally just finished it this morning. I was like, speed reading the end of it because I wanted to talk about it. This is a Swedish author and the book just got released in the US and it's about this woman who's experiencing intense career burnout. And so she goes to these woods in Sweden and lives in a camp by herself, trying to recalibrate her mind and find peace. And she starts to come across this very strange group of people by the river who are, like, dancing and singing and they're all different ages and they're, like, having sex with each other. And so the story is a lot about all of those people and how they came to be in this group called the Colony. And it's also about, you know, her eventually meeting them and what happens. I really love this book so much. It's just like every character is so complex and it really makes you think about how someone becomes a part of a group like this and, like, makes you have such. I don't know, it's like when you see someone, you're like, well, how did you become a member of this very extreme cult? You kind of have this level of judgment, but it just. You had such empathy for all of them, even the ones that were, like, the most flawed in different ways. And, oh, it's a lot about, like, how someone becomes a leader of one of these groups and what that means. And I just. I love this book.

[Becca Freeman]

This feels extremely Olivia coded.

[Olivia Mentor]

It is extremely Olivia coded. I will say. The only thing is that there's a long stretch in the middle of the book where it's all backstory and it got a little tiny bit slow, but I still loved it. But if that's something that's a deal breaker for you, then just keep in mind. But I thought it was great. And the writing style is really interesting. I don't know if that it's translated and it makes it a little bit different, but it made me think a lot. I'm still thinking about it.

[Becca Freeman]

Okay.

[Olivia Mentor]

And someone, by the way, in their Facebook group was like, the colony. I'm like, I hate ants. It's really not that much about ants. There is an ants plot line, but there's an ant on the COVID But it's not, like, heavily about bugs if you're. That's not your thing. But what have you read?

[Becca Freeman]

So I read this Book called Maggie, where a man and a woman walk into a bar by Katie Yee, which comes out in July.

[Olivia Mentor]

We have talked about this, and, like, I cannot stop thinking about what conversations happened internally at this publisher about this title.

[Becca Freeman]

Yeah.

[Olivia Mentor]

Because Maggie could have been a solid title, but then they were like, we're gonna make it weird. And I appreciate weird always, but, like, there had to be some people going to the sales team being like, here is why this is gonna be the title.

[Becca Freeman]

And honestly, I think the title was probably what most drew me to this book. I was like, this is such a unique title. The COVID is just the title in, like, a very large, bold font treatment. Yeah. So I read this, and it's about a woman who goes to a restaurant, not a bar, with her husband, and he tells her that he's having an affair and he's leaving her. And then subsequently in, like, the next week, she goes to the doctor and she finds out that she has breast cancer. And it's a very interior novel. It's, like, very much like her inner monologue. And, like, there are scenes, but it's like, it's a very interior book. And it reminded me so much of a Catherine Newman book who wrote Sandwich and we all want impossible things. Like, it was, like, her interior monologue is, like, very specific, very funny, and very, like, gallows humor y of, like, dealing with something really awful and hard, but, like, having all these kind of, like, funny or sometimes inappropriate thoughts about it. So it really reminded me of, like, a younger Catherine Newman, the woman in the book. Her children are, like, 4 and 7, so, like, probably in her late 30s is the character. So I really enjoyed this. Again, a really short book. Like, just like our book club book for this month, like, this was also 208 pages, so it was really quick. And, yeah, I'm excited to see what happens with this book.

[Olivia Mentor]

You have me sold at Kathryn Newman. And also, I love a weird title.

[Becca Freeman]

Yeah.

[Olivia Mentor]

So done. Sold.

[Becca Freeman]

As I just alluded to, if none of those appeal to you, we do have our book club this month coming up, and we are reading Audition by Katie Kitamura, which is a weird literary book that I cannot stop thinking about. Again, 208 pages. It's quick. The writing is very tight. It's not hard to read at all. It's about this woman who's in her 50s, who is an actress, and she is in rehearsals for a play. And the first scene, she is at lunch with this much younger man. And it's very unclear what their relationship to each other is. And the whole book is unpacking who they are to each other. Do I know what happened in this book? Not 100%, no. But thematically the book is very much about how we perform in our lives and for the character. She's both an actress so performing is her job but also how she performs in her roles as like woman, person of color, wife, mother. And I cannot wait to discuss this book with all of you.

[Olivia Mentor]

It's on my calendar, it's in my stack. I'm ready.

[Becca Freeman]

Can't wait.

[Olivia Mentor]

If you want to talk to us about backlist books or any books, you can find us on Facebook under Bow and Paper podcast or in our Geneva group under Bat on Paper podcast. We are also on Instagram @batonpaper podcast and I am on Instagram and substack@oliviamentor.

[Becca Freeman]

I'm on Instagram ecamfreeman and my newsletter is at becca freeman.substack.com and we see you next week.

[Olivia Mentor]

Bye.