← Behind the Numbers: an EMARKETER Podcast
Behind the Numbers: an EMARKETER Podcast
Better Understanding LGBTQ+ Media Content—and What Brands Get Wrong About Queer Audiences, with Revry | Behind the Numbers
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- [00:01]
A
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- [00:25]
Hey gang. It's Monday, December 8th. Paola, Emmy, Damien and listeners, welcome to behind the numbers. New master video podcast may pop by Viasat ads. I'm Marcus and join me for today's conversation. We have two analysts who live in New York. One of them is called Paolo Flores Marquez. Welcome to the show.
- [00:42]
B
Hello.
- [00:42]
C
Thank you so much for having me on again.
- [00:45]
A
Of course, of course. The other one is Emmy Liedman.
- [00:48]
D
Hello. Thanks for having me.
- [00:50]
A
Hello to you. And a special guest for today, CEO and co founder of Revry Living Life in la, it's Damien Pellicione.
- [00:58]
B
Hi, everybody. Great to be here.
- [01:01]
A
Hello, fellow. Whenever we have a special guest on, we start, of course with a speed intro.
- [01:09]
So first question, just for Damian, because the folks have met Emmy and Paola before. What do you do? In a sentence.
- [01:16]
B
So I am the CEO and chief executive officer and one of the four fabulous co founders of Revry, the LGBTQ streaming network.
- [01:26]
A
Very nice. And what's a childhood hobby you wish you'd never stopped?
- [01:31]
B
A childhood hobby that I wish that I never stopped probably would have been continuing community theater. I used to do a lot of musicals when I was a kid. Loved singing and dancing, of course. That was my love for the arts and entertainment. And every year I would perform or at least audition for the local community theater musical. And then after I left, of course, my mom and dad started producing for the local community theater. But, you know, I missed that. It was always fun. It was always a lot of fun to put on a show.
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A
Do you have a favorite theater production at the moment that you've seen recently?
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B
Oh, my gosh. So I am going to shout out my friend Drew Droege's play that's off Broadway right now, messy White Gays, which is performing on 42nd street off Broadway. It has Pete Zias. It has. Drew wrote it, he starred in it. It's probably, I think, one of the funniest shows right now running off Broadway.
- [02:28]
A
Okay, very nice. Go see it, folks. Emmy, how about you?
- [02:33]
D
There was a season when I was a kid that I did gymnastics and I quit. It just didn't really stick with me in my busy schedule as a sixth grader. But I think it would be cool if I. Not at like the Olympic level or anything. Even professional. But if I could still, like, do a flip or something, I think that would be fun.
- [02:56]
A
When would you use that, though? Just, like, getting out of the car.
- [02:59]
D
Just to impress me on the way to the restaurant, you know, like every once in a while, like when you least expect it, I guess.
- [03:07]
A
Paola, how about for you?
- [03:09]
C
I wish I had never quit kickboxing. I really loved kickboxing. It was really fun to spar and, like, it just gave me a lot of confidence. I actually got out of. Someone tried to pick a fight with me in middle school once, and.
- [03:26]
I don't think they were actually scared of me. I think they saw me drop into a kickboxing stance and they thought I was so weird. They were like, you know what? I give up. I don't know what you're doing here, but this is not something I want to be involved with. So, yeah, shout out to kickboxing.
- [03:40]
A
These are fantastic. Anyway, now we know our guests a little bit better. They're the three folks we have for you for today's episode and today's real topic, why reaching the LGBTQ audience makes good business sense.
- [03:58]
All right, folks, let's start here. Damien, who is Reverie.
- [04:05]
B
So Reverie, we are the world's largest LGBTQ streaming network and we're also an ad tech platform. It was co founded by myself, Aaliyah J. Daniels, our COO, Christopher Rodriguez, our chief creative officer, and LaShawn McGee, board member at large. We started this company 10 years ago. It was really inspired by Apple TV when they created the TVOS operating system so apps could go open source and developers could develop basically their own application for the big screen as opposed to the small screen on your phone or your iPad. And we saw an opportunity, of course, to not just develop for them, but develop for Roku, which is already in market, and Amazon Fire, which was already in market. And of course, now our app lives on every single type of streaming device, mobile platform, web version that you can think of. And we sit around 7 million monthly active viewers with over a thousand hours of amazing content that you can watch at any given month. We license from Warner Brothers and Lionsgate and BBC, and then we also create original content, all underwritten by brands. So everything you watch is completely free, very much like Pluto or Tubi. The difference is, of course, this is all queer, queer adjacent or queer culture related content. And the real exciting thing is that we sit now at about 7 million monthly active viewers across all of our touchpoints. And then we also, on top of that, built Prism Riot, our ad Tech platform which connects to all of those amazing places that we distribute to. So we are able to sell and broker over 1 billion CTV video ad requests available for sale in any given month. And then beyond that, this year we debuted our dmp, our data management platform, just after Pride season, which I'm excited to say in September, won the Digiday Award, beat out Nexen and nexstar, two publicly traded companies. We were the only independent DMP on that list to win best data management platform of the year by Digiday, which was really exciting moment for our company. So that's us in a nutshell.
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A
Very nice. And you started the company because you were telling us you just couldn't find this type of content. And so that was the.
- [06:27]
B
Yeah, please, we couldn't. I think every good entrepreneur creates something for themselves. This has a very big social and impactful component to why we built this. Leah lashawn to black women. Aaliyah is an ally. Lashawn, a Army veteran. And both of us neurodivergent. Chris Hispanic gay man. Like, we really did not see a lot of our own stories kind of reflected, not in a way where you could have one platform that would accumulate kind of all those stories in one place. And so that was really the inspiration behind why we built Reverie. And from there, you know, a lot of the times we were seeing kind of, you know, on the ad tech side, why we built the ad tech was because we were getting roadblocks from us being able to really scale our inventory and think about how we were positioning and selling and marketing, you know, multicultural video inventory to buyers, to the agencies and the media planners and brands. And that was, I think, a real big opportunity because, you know, programmatically, again, like I was saying, we have over a billion CTV ad requests available for sale in any given month because all the partners that we went to, like the Samsung Zivos, the Vizios, all of our big platforms, said, hey, you are not great at selling multicultural. We're actually better at this because we are multicultural inherently, as a community. We are very intersectional, and we understand those nuances. And we have lots of buyers who are interested in this, in this type of inventory. So they all gave us a green light and said, God bless, keep going, here's a seat programmatically. And that allowed us to really scale our business. And then, you know, Emmy and I talked about this about a month ago on an IPG upfront, multicultural upfront, that she was so amazing at moderating with myself of Fireside about, you know the importance of this data being held by, for and by our community, which we can talk about in a little bit. But I think, you know, data, I believe, is a currency of the future as it relates to media. And we're seeing this, obviously, with the advent of AI and what data means to AI. And we are now the biggest proprietor of the first party opt in LGBTQ data from a CTV environment, which I think now, not even now, will be extremely powerful as we kind of continue to grow.
- [08:50]
C
Yeah, that's so important. Yeah, I know sometimes when I'm writing reports, it's like, what advice do I give.
- [08:58]
Advertisers and agencies and marketers? And it's like, hire people from these communities. But not everyone has a budget to hire people from those communities. Right. Like, some platforms are very small, so it's very, very important to have these dedicated spaces that are made up of people who are actually part of that community. That's what lends authenticity. And as we know, authenticity is a major aspect of.
- [09:19]
Is one of the main focal points that are desired amongst younger generations.
- [09:24]
D
I think something that we talked about a lot at this panel was this idea of what does it actually mean to show up for a community and when can you recognize when something is maybe outside of your wheelhouse or when it's something that you can do in house? Best example being the way that you approach creative as an organization. If you don't have the people in the room, if you don't have members of a community who can speak to what that experience actually is like and show you how to represent that in a creative, you can think about where you're buying your media and buying your media alongside networks and shows that are made by queer people and have that talent in house. So you can, you can kind of support the queer community in other ways in ways that your consumers pay attention to and appreciate. So I think that was an interesting mindset shift for me.
- [10:20]
B
Yeah. And just to add to that, I completely agree. I think, you know, authenticity, in my, in my opinion, humble opinion, breeds, you know, success, you know, and I think, like, regardless if it's on social media or irl, in real life, we know we can smell. Audiences can smell authenticity from miles away. And I think one of the biggest and most important things, kind of like to Emmy, to your point, is, is, you know, who are you buying from? Right? Like, are you buying from sources that actually are from that community? And I think this is where multicultural owned and operated platforms like Revry or Canela or Revolt tv, who cater to very specific audiences are really important.
- [11:04]
Factors in the kind of success of an ad campaign. Not just in the planning, not just in the creative. Because we understand the audience, because we are the audience.
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A
Damien, tell us a bit about what folks, advertisers in particular misunderstand about advertising on an LGBTQ streaming platform.
- [11:21]
B
Yeah, I mean, the first misconception, and I mean, I touched on this on our fireside too, was, you know, you do not need to have LGBTQ specific creative to be able to, I think, tap our audience or at least to start to spend money and test against our audience with your general, you know, creative. I think a lot of misconceptions or a lot of roadblocks that marketers and agencies and brands first think about when trying to dip their toe into like niche audiences, and I hate that word niche, but like specific audiences, I'm going to say, because we're not niche. We spend $1.7 trillion a year in the United States. We're the third largest consumer group right, outside of Hispanic and white. You know, that's the power of the LGBTQ$1.7 trillion. It's a huge white space right now in terms of brands being able to own their sector. And I think, you know, that becomes a roadblock that they think mentally is preventing them from actually dipping the toe to wanting to start to spend with the community. We don't need to see, you know, a gay couple, a lesbian couple, a trans person in that ad for us to know that you are actually supporting us. You just need to show up in environments where we are watching or we are existing. And Reverie is a queer environment in which you can have McDonald's, can have their general ad or Coca Cola can have their general ad. And I think one of the most important things from a creative standpoint is that you should show intersectionality. Right? And intersectionality, of course, is not one gender, not one race, not one language, not one sexual orientation like that. I think you should have in just general creative and in my perspective, for a successful campaign which then can run across all different platforms and you don't have to allocate or specifically create ads that are targeted Hispanic, black or lgbtq, just have a show up in general. And I think in that respect, if we see you showing up in environments like Reverie and it's 365 days a year, always on, all year round, we have now campaigns at least, and success stories at Revry of brands that are doing this, making true investments, 365 days a year, investments in our platform with their general advertising. And we can prove, you know, double, triple, sometimes roas on, you know, by comparison to what the average is in ctv.
- [13:49]
A
And it comes back to. I love this quote. You say there are multiple different things I can identify with in creative that speak to me and are not just about being queer.
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C
Yeah.
- [13:59]
I mean, there's a lot of things that come up to me as, like, as you're describing all of this. One of them is that the beginning of, like, the gay rights movement back in, like, this. Well, not the beginning, but like the big flashpoint in the 70s of, like, it was such a big deal to have corporate, like, entities that are very well respected show up in queer spaces because it signified you're safe. Right. Like, you will be accepted here. You will be welcome. Your business is welcome. Right. And obviously this has turned into something much more complicated now in modern day, and we have a lot of conversations about rainbow washing and all this other stuff. But, like, that sentiment is still, still there where if you show up for people, they will show up for you too. In the same way also, like, if you alienate them, alienate this group, they will organize and they will. They will boycott. But when you earn their loyalty, it is it. It is monumental.
- [14:44]
B
Yeah. And look, case in point. Sorry, I was going to jump in. Well, is like, Target, right? Like, Target's a great example of what you just said. And what's interesting is, like, they had the community for so many years, and then they turned against the community and the community revolted. Even whether it was black, Hispanic, and lgbtq, it was all minority groups that are like, hey, you took our products off the shelves. You took kind of. You took a blind eye to, like, supporting us. And now we are going to mess with your business by stop buying from you.
- [15:13]
D
And we know, we know that LGBTQ communities are especially sensitive to brands kind of pushing back or changing their DEI policies, and they pay a lot of attention to that. So going off of pow's point about how if you show up for them, they will show up for you. It's now 9.3% of the US population is LGBTQ and 23% of Gen Z is LGBTQ. We know that Gen Z especially has very low brand loyalty. Unless you give them a strong reason to keep buying from you, they will go on TikTok shop the next day and buy something that's half the price of what you're selling them.
- [15:53]
C
I would also add that it's not just the LGBTQ community itself. Right. It's the People who support them as well. Like, we have a chart in our. In our database that says like, 44%, over 40% of U.S. adults would increase support for a brand that stands for LGBTQ plus issues. If that were like, if they were made aware of it. Right. So it's like there's a large ripple effect coming from this.
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A
Yeah.
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B
This pushback on DNI has been a real threat to a lot of multicultural businesses. But it's interesting to see the brands that are actually pushing the opposite direction saying, no, we're actually going to double down. We're going to support and be more vocal for, you know, these multicultural kind of audiences, be it Hispanic, black, lgbtq, specifically API or anything else, even disabled, I think, or the ability community. I think, like, this is where, you know, in that case, they're. They're looking. Those are the smart brands that are looking at the statistics like Emmy just mentioned, that are like, oh, wait a minute. If we need to find net new consumers that we want to bring into our platform, maybe we need to be speaking to LGBTQ gen Zers. Right. If it's 23%, almost 1/4 of that entire population, which is a massive population, my firm belief is that you will not exist in five to 10 years because it's such a massive part of the population, the general population, that you need to make sure that you are addressing with your dollars, your advertising dollars and cents that these audiences, if you want to reach. Scale. True. Scale. Yeah, yeah.
- [17:32]
A
It's such a large community. As we've given out the numbers. A lot of this we're referring to is from Gallup. One in four folks in their 20s identifying as LGBTQ. Nearly one in 10Americans overall identifying as part of this community. Damien, it's interesting because you have folks who are in the community, but you also have viewers of your streaming service, I'm sure, who aren't in community. Right. Tell us a bit about that and also how you've been able to gain traction in a very crowded, highly competitive streaming TV universe.
- [18:04]
B
Yeah. So it's not easy. And I'll tell you so of our 7 million monthly active viewers, you know, I don't know if you noticed, but I did not say that they're all lgbtq, because we actually cannot quantify because we don't own. We say viewer, not user, because we don't necessarily own the user. If it's Samsung's user or Vizio's user or Roku's user, they do. We do have data points through our DMP in the exchange and obviously just our general performance and our content on our channel on who those viewers are and what they like to watch. And we can through lookalike marketing, obviously base assumptions or we'll target them. You know, QR codes and surveys like we did with our big hit show King of Drag, which did a simple QR code survey during in between a commercial break with no incentive other than want to see a season two. And we had over 20,000 people scan that QR code. So we got 20,000 data points from that one show, which was crazy. That was unheard of. That was our first time at that success level. Also impressive QR code.
- [19:01]
C
Yeah, A QR code is the most shocking part of that because people shock QR code.
- [19:05]
B
No, and it's like you had to hold your phone up and scan like there was, you know, I won't say that it was like the most well thought out, but like it works still. The fact that 20,000 people took that five question survey just for the sake that they were so into the content and they want and they had brand loyalty to Reverie, we were able to collect and obviously build more data points within that dmp. But we don't say that like you need to be queer to watch. We actually think that's a good thing. If you are an ally or you know nothing about our community and you just want to watch great, entertaining queer content so you could see what our culture is about. Queer is a culture and so that we are not just a demographic, we are not just a minority group, we are a culture. And I think that is the standpoint that Reverie really takes is how are we changing and affecting the conversation around culture even outside of our own community, where we could be seen as a safe space and kind of an educational tool and somewhere where you can just engage, maybe you just want to learn what pronouns are. And we have things like learn the words, you know, a great simple short show short series which you'll see sometimes in between our programming to teach folks on like how pronouns work.
- [20:17]
A
You know, I think also a big part of this is that, you know, prices are still top of mind for a lot of folks. And one of our big trends for next year, written by our video expert, Ross Benish, was that streaming subscriptions at 20 bucks a pop or more in a lot of cases will push viewers toward ad supported or free, Completely free alternative alternatives.
- [20:37]
B
Free queer tv. That is our catch line, right? It's like you do not need a credit card, you do not need a subscription. Now we do have a subscription for the super fan who wants to turn off ads. But that is a really small population of our users, and it's not something that we're marketing to. I always say it's like selling this T shirt, like that's what our subscription is. But our focal point and all of our marketing and all of our messaging is about free queer tv. We want anyone to be able to see themselves reflected, regardless of socioeconomic background.
- [21:05]
C
But I think it just highlights the importance of having this accessible to the people who need it, especially if they're in communities that do not prioritize it. And to have it be a little barrier to entry and have it be free.
- [21:17]
B
Exactly. And it's free all across the world, too. And we do have two localized channels. We have Reverie Latinx, which is all in Spanish, focused on the Hispanic American population, but is really big in Mexico. And we do have Revre Brazil as well. So there's lots of great content to be watched even just outside the United States.
- [21:39]
A
There's always been this relationship between price and paying for something and not paying for something and watching ads as a result of it. And I'm throwing this chart up on the screen for viewers, folks who are watching the podcast data from hub research. In 2021, 60% of folks said they would rather save money versus 40% who would rather avoid ads. By 2024, those scales are tipped further in save Money's favor at 66% to 34. So some data to support that point. Less end folks were talking. We touched on it a little bit, but I want to talk a bit more about kind of what have been some advertising success stories. Maybe other times where advertisers could have done something differently to hit the mark when it comes to queer representation in media. That goes to everybody. Any thoughts there?
- [22:25]
D
So, success story, I would say this is just a show that I feel like really encapsulates, like, the queer experience, especially around college. The show overcompensating. I don't know if you guys have seen it. It's on Prime Video. I just think it does a really great job at reflecting the fact that coming out isn't exactly a linear journey, which I think a lot of advertisers fall into. This trope of coming out is something from, like, point A to point B. You do it and then you're an out person, you're happy, and for the rest of time, everyone knows your sexuality before you even open your mouth. So we know that life doesn't work that way. So I think that show Does a really great job of underscoring that messy experience. And then this is a tiny little, like, promotional thing from a brand that I thought was interesting. During Pride this year, Lyft gave out coupon codes during the Day of Pride. That was something about, like, if you want. If you see your ex and you want to leave the party, like, here is this discount code. And it was. It was so simple. But I was like, that's such a real experience. Like, especially for queer women. Like, everyone is two degrees of separation away from each other. So it's just a very real experience. And it was. All it was was just a stupid, like, coupon code. And it was so effective, and it wasn't pandering, and it was just, like, on the nose. So those are my two examples. It relates it targets. I think it's, like, the best advertising, because if you're within that community, you will especially appreciate it. But I think everyone can relate to it to some degree.
- [23:57]
C
Yeah, I was in. So I have two, I guess, like, one, I was in Mexico City this summer, and I saw Levi's campaign there, and I think I loved it because of that subtlety as well, where, like, you looked at it and you'd just be like, this is just an ad. But, like, you look closer and it's like, definitely, like, the current trends going on in queer communities, which I appreciated. And also, I was in Mexico and, like, coming from the middle of nowhere Mexico, like, in a space where they just. They literally, like, they just had their first Pride parade, and it was just them in their cars, like, driving around town, which is really cute. It was, like, really special. But also.
- [24:31]
As.
- [24:33]
Like, a solid millennial, broad city for me, will always be an excellent representation, a good representation to queer media. Because I think, again, to Emmy's point, it was very frank. Not just about how coming out is a constant thing, but also the conversations that you have with friends, even amongst the queer community, about what does that look like and how are you feeling and the discomfort, but also the understanding and the support. I love Prod City, and it's so funny and so cute.
- [25:03]
D
So good.
- [25:04]
B
So I'm going to give a bad one and I'm going to give a good one, and I think the bad one. This is really funny. Like, Emmy and I were talking about, this was like the new season of Just like that, which was so sad because I'm like, we had this whole conversation in our prep call, actually, for the. For the IPG up front, and then we even brought it up on stage, which was kind of fun, but it's like, you know, who. Which character do you identify with? But unfortunately, I think that they, like, you know, they missed the mark on some of those characters. And I'm really sad because it's like Sex and the City, which is so nostalgic. And then I think, like, a real good example, and I'm going to shout out our company right now. But one of my favorite brand integrations that we did this year, outside of Elf Cosmetics and King of Drag, which was great, and they had lots of great success, was McDonald's with our international Vogue League, our World Pride Ball that we did in D.C. but McDonald's sponsored two different categories, the Runway category and the face category. And, of course, it's all about fashion. It's all about the look. And it was an open to all category, which means that, like, anyone from the community can sign up and walk and try to win $1,500. And it's a round robin, of course. They face off against each other until we get down to the final two, and then there's a winner. And in the. In the Runway fashion category, these kids brought this. These iconic looks with the nostalgic red and yellow kind of iconography and the golden arches from McDonald's, but in these, like, real cool, hip, modern ways. I judged this category, guest judges category, and it was really hard to select the winner. And we found out afterwards. Bang. Garcon, who is the father of the House of Garcon in D.C. is a professor at Howard University for Fashion and Fashion Design, and made a lot of his kids make this look as their vinyl project. So, like, we were getting these, like, fashion students coming and walking, and they were serving such an amazing look and so much amazing, like, you know, energy and attitude that it was real. Real tough to. To. To judge. But, I mean, the fashion was so on point, and that was a great example of a brand allowing the audience and allowing our community to be creative on their own.
- [27:16]
A
Wait, wait, I forgot.
- [27:17]
C
I. I forgot to give a bad one, which is.
- [27:20]
D
Yeah, I was like, are we, like, wait, we're in, like, a weirdly amazing mood, and we have nothing negative to say.
- [27:27]
C
I have a general one. It's not. I'm not gonna call anyone out, but I will say that if you're. If your pride merch is lazy, that's homophobic. Do not just slap a rainbow on something and hand it to me. No, absolutely not. Like hate crime. So don't do that. Put effort into it. Make it cool. Automatic slay. Sorry, that's it. That's mine.
- [27:46]
B
I agree.
- [27:48]
A
So, one thing I wanted to mention, I think this goes not across everybody's, but I think it's kind of something that comes up every year. And.
- [27:57]
I think folks still haven't caught on to this, which is that advertising only in June is painfully transparent. And it's contributing to this perception that people have. 70% of LGBTQ adults thinking customers participating in Pride Month participate in Pride Month because it's going to help their business. You can see from this chart on the screen those numbers is from Pew Research Center. 35% think companies do it because they feel pressured. That's the only reason. And 16%, only 16% think they do it because they genuinely have a genuine desire to celebrate this community. And so, yeah, just to mention, Black history still matters after February. Black History Month, Women's history still matters after March. Women, Women's History Month, Arab American things, you know, happen not just in April and so on and so forth. Hispanics, you know, all the. All the communities who have their specific months, LGBTQ Pride community, have things to say outside of June.
- [28:56]
C
I would also say that one way to demonstrate that support year round is to support causes and, like, donate, even if you don't want to make an explicitly, like, queer campaign. And that's, you know, whatever is appropriate for your brand. Like, by supporting these institutions or these other efforts that are happening externally, you are signaling that to your customers as well.
- [29:14]
A
Yeah.
- [29:15]
D
And also working with queer creators because they have definitely reported a dip in business after the month of June or in just. Just in general. They're so busy during the month of June, and then everything slows down. That is a way. Just. Just working with someone who talks about queer things or is queer and has a platform.
- [29:37]
And is. Is like offering representation. You don't have to work with them on a queer campaign, but just showing up and funding their work is important.
- [29:44]
C
Yep, yep, yep.
- [29:45]
B
Yeah.
- [29:45]
A
Very nice.
- [29:46]
B
I always say that I am still gay after June. That's kind of the way that I, you know, I'm still buying cars, I'm still buying products for my house. I'm still buying fashion, I'm still buying, going out to eat, like, so just to try to message to me and my community in an editorial moment, which is really what they are looking at. They're looking at Black History Month, Women's History Month, Hispanic Heritage Month, Pride Month, as, like, editorial moments. And Emmy made actually a really good point when we were on the panel, too. I'll go back to something that she said. Just about. It's the most competitive time to be messaging to our community. So why do you want to compete against everybody else who's trying to slap a rainbow flag on it where you actually could own July or August or September or Trans Day of visibility or Trans Day of remembrance or Pride, History month in October, national coming out day in October. There are so many other editorial moments throughout the year or opportunities for you to be like, owning a specific day that our community pays attention to. Like, there's so there's a day for everything. And I think, like, brands are not necessarily thinking about outside of those editorial moments. And I think it's a real shame because, look, when we look statistically at whether or not you are supporting us as a cause or if you are just thinking about how to bring net new consumers and think about good business sense to be able to be messaging to us, you know, in the United States, about 39% of folks who are conservative or identify as conservative will support LGBTQ marriage and LGBTQ organizations. So even the other side of, like, the community that may or may not, you'd think, like in red states support us. There's about 40% that are supportive of our causes and like our community and our culture, and that number is only growing again with the younger generations. So regardless of if you don't support a social, economic kind of platform or a demo like us, I think one of the most important things is to be thinking what is good business and how do you support that.
- [31:50]
From your investment, from your spend.
- [31:53]
A
Yeah, excellent point to end on. Thank you guys so, so much for being part of the conversation. Thank you. First to Paola.
- [32:00]
C
Goodbye, everybody. It was nice to see all of you. Well, it was nice for all of you to see me.
- [32:04]
B
Bye.
- [32:05]
A
Thank you to Emmy.
- [32:07]
D
Thanks for having me. This was great.
- [32:09]
A
And thank you, of course, to Damian.
- [32:11]
B
Thanks so much. And Definitely check out Reverie.com for all things Reverie.
- [32:17]
A
Yes, indeed. Thank you to our whole production crew and to everyone for listening in to behind the Numbers Market video podcast made possible by via sat ads. Make sure you subscribe and follow. Leave a rating and review. I'll see you on Friday, but on Wednesday, you can hang out with Susie David Canyon on our reimagine retail show as she explores what Thanksgiving told us about this holiday shopping season.