Sasheer Knows That's Right

Summary

Best Friends with Nicole Byer and Sasheer Zamata

Host: Headgum
Episode: “Sasheer Knows That’s Right”
Date: December 4, 2024

---

Episode Overview

In this lively episode, Sasheer Zamata and guest co-host Kimmy Gatewood (filling in for Nicole) share hilarious personal stories, reflect on the unpredictable behavior of comedy audiences, talk about the quirks and perks of friendship, and answer listener questions about group dynamics and reconnecting after ghosting. The conversation bounces naturally between comedy industry anecdotes, self-reflection games, and heartfelt advice, maintaining their trademark mix of warmth, honesty, and delightful silliness.

Theme: Navigating friendship, audience dynamics, and personal growth—with a healthy dose of laughter.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Comedy Audiences & Unruly Behavior

• Sasheer recounts a recent show:
  • [01:21] “...I said something about Black people experiencing this thing more than any other race. And a Black woman in the audience went, ‘I know that’s right.’ ...She kept talking, like, in full sentences...”
  • Sasheer describes the awkwardness of wanting to appreciate an audience member’s support but being thrown off by the unexpected extended commentary.
• Kimmy brings up TI’s outburst at a comedy show:
  • [03:02] Kimmy: “TI was at a comedy show, and apparently the comic made a joke about TI that he didn’t like. So then he got on stage, grabbed the microphone, and started, like, screaming at her.”
  • They reflect on how audiences and even fellow performers are increasingly unruly, theorizing that post-pandemic social skills have deteriorated.
• Boundary-setting in performance spaces:
  • [08:13] Sasheer: “Yeah, you just watch. If you want to be a comic, you just be in the back and laugh… but don’t fucking heckle.”

2. Audience Interaction & After-Show Encounters

• Varied fan approaches:
  • [09:19] Sasheer shares a sweet interaction after a show, when a fan says:
    “...I understand that you’re probably tired and you want to go home and you can’t wait to sit down. And I was like, you are so right. Thank you for knowing me.”
• Different vibes for each host’s fanbase:
  • [10:19] Sasheer: “My audience will, like, send me articles and think pieces about my material. And your audience is like, sending you disgusting messages in your DMs.”
  • Kimmy (for Nicole): “That's so nice. I don't know that world. I don't know it.”

3. The Realities of Comedy Touring

• Travel exhaustion:
  • [12:13] Sasheer: “A couple planes in a row this past weekend… Indiana to LA… to San Francisco… and I gotta go back to Indiana Thursday...”
  • [13:16] “I love the shows. I just don’t like the travel. It takes up so much time—not just flying, but everything around it.”
• Dreaming of ‘jet life’:
  • [13:53] Kimmy: “One day we'll be on that jet life. Oh my God, that PJ life.”
• Celebrity sighting stories:
  • [16:35] Kimmy: “I saw Viola Davis on a plane. Dave Navarro. I love Ink Master...”
  • [17:17] They calculate the costs of private jetting to Vegas together, hilariously realizing it’s much pricier than they imagined.

4. Friendship Games & Toxic Traits

• The “I Hate / I Love During Sex” Game:
  • [18:00] Sasheer explains a party game—list things you hate, then incorporate them into the phrase “I love when people ___ during sex.”
    • Kimmy: “I love when people pick their noses during sex.”
    • Sasheer: “I love when people chew loudly during sex.”
• Buzzfeed ‘Most Toxic Trait’ Quiz:
  • [20:00] The hosts answer fun personality questions; results:
    • Kimmy’s result (for Nicole): “Judgment. You are quick to compare yourself to others... harbor some toxic judgment.” [27:49]
    • Sasheer’s result: “Overextending yourself. Your to-do list is never-ending... You feel constant guilt for not living up to expectations.” [28:37]
  • Both reflect on their results, with Sasheer candid about her busy day and tendency to take on too much, and Kimmy jokingly suggesting outsourcing chores.

5. Listener Questions and Friendship Advice

• Balancing Social Desires, FOMO, and Personal Limits:
  • [33:17] Letter from a listener struggling with wanting alone time but feeling left out from her new trio of college friends.
  • Advice:
    • Kimmy: “Encourage yourself to go out more. Sometimes you might surprise yourself by having a good time.” [34:54]
    • Sasheer: “Don’t beat yourself up for not going out... Remind yourself you can leave at any point... Respect your limits.” [35:12]
• Furniture Placement Tips:
  • [37:23] Caller recommends “floating” a couch to create zones, and “anchoring” chairs with art or a rug.
  • Kimmy & Sasheer humorously misinterpret “floating” before agreeing these are genuinely helpful tips.
• Body-Positive Adult Summer Camp:
  • [38:59] Email shares info about Camp Roundup—“the opposite of fat camp”—for plus-size babes.
  • Both hosts respond enthusiastically, expressing support and curiosity.
• Reconnecting After a Friendship ‘Ghosting’:
  • [40:06] Listener Christina asks whether to bring up a friend’s multi-year disappearance after she gets back in touch.
  • Sasheer shares a similar experience, explaining that sometimes friends disappear for reasons unrelated to us, and that direct but gentle communication (“Were you okay? I missed you.”) can open up honest dialogue without accusations. [45:54]
  • Kimmy adds that friendships have seasons: “If you can move past it and just be fine, there’s no need to bring it up. But if you feel yourself resenting your friend...be honest and open that conversation.” [45:17]

6. Support & Friendship Goals

• Mutual encouragement:
  • [49:02] Kimmy plans to take singing lessons, Sasheer promises support by taking swim lessons with her partner.
    • Kimmy: “I love you.”
    • Sasheer: “I love you, too. Sometimes someone just being somewhere when you’re doing something difficult is helpful.”

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• [01:21] Sasheer: “She kept talking, like, in full sentences...I knew she was agreeing...but I just needed to finish this thing.”
• [03:02] Kimmy: “TI was at a comedy show...got on stage, grabbed the microphone, and started, like, screaming at her.”
• [09:19] Sasheer: “Thank you so much for knowing me. I want this interaction to end and I want to go sit down.”
• [10:19] Sasheer: “My audience will...send me think pieces about my material. Your audience is like, sending disgusting messages in your DMs.”
• [13:16] Sasheer: “I love the shows. I just don’t like the travel. It takes up so much time...”
• [18:52] Kimmy: “I love when people pick their noses during sex.”
• [27:49] Kimmy (for Nicole, quiz result): “Judgment. You are quick to compare yourself to others...”
• [28:37] Sasheer (quiz result): “Overextending yourself...it’s abysmal for your mental health and relationships.”
• [35:12] Sasheer: “Remind yourself you can leave at any point...respect your limits.”
• [45:54] Sasheer: “You could also phrase it like, ‘Were you okay? I didn’t hear from you for years...’ It doesn’t have to be accusatory.”

---

Timestamps for Key Segments

• Audience behavior and TI story: 01:21–08:28
• Meeting fans and fan dynamics: 09:19–10:42
• Comedy touring/travel talk, celeb spotting: 12:00–17:22
• Dreaming about private jets: 13:53–17:22
• Friendship ‘hate/love during sex’ game: 17:46–19:46
• Buzzfeed toxic trait quiz: 20:02–30:41
• Listener mailbag: social group FOMO: 33:17–37:01
• More listener feedback (chairs, camp): 37:23–39:53
• Advice: friendship after ghosting: 40:06–47:05
• Friend support, singing & swimming lessons: 49:02–49:56

---

Tone & Style

The episode has the classic “Best Friends” blend: loose, honest, and deeply funny, with plenty of tangents and personal anecdotes, but also genuine wisdom about relationships, boundaries, and self-care. Kimmy and Sasheer both playfully rib each other and their audience, grounding the episode in a supportive, bestie vibe.

---

Summary Takeaway

This episode shines as a testament to how real, silly, and supportive best friendship can be—whether you’re dealing with hecklers, calculating the cost of luxury travel, or navigating tricky periods in your social life. Through it all, Sasheer and Kimmy show that laughter and honest conversation are essential, both on stage and off.

Transcript

[Sasheer Zamata]

If you want to hear today's top authors and change, makers of color, in deep, honest conversation, we've got an amazing new podcast for you. It's called well Read Black Girl, and it's the literary kickback you never knew you needed. Author and founder of the well Read Black Girl Book Club, Glory Etom sits down with your favorite writers for insightful discussions on art, culture, social justice and the power of the written word. Luminaries like Tarana Burke, Anita Hill, Gabrielle Union, Brit Bennett and more discuss how they found their voice, honed their skill, and composed some of the most interesting and impactful writing of the day. You'll meet black bookstore owners, literacy advocates, and members of the well Read Black Girl Book Club who chat about the literary legacies of the women who paved the way. If you're a total bookworm and aspiring writer or just want to peek behind the page of the brightest minds around, this show is for you. Listen to well Read Black Girl wherever you get your podcast. And stay tuned at the end of the episode because we're going to play a little clip from the show. Hello.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Hello. Hello. Hello.

[Sasheer Zamata]

I did a show last night and I said something about black people experiencing this. This X thing more than any other race. And a black woman in the audience went, I know that's right. And I was like, oh, I know that's right. Thank you. And then kept going. And then she kept talking, like, in full sentences, and it sucked because I knew she was agreeing with what I was saying, so I didn't want to, like, like, shut her down. But also I wanted her to stop talking. And I also couldn't clearly hear everything she was saying. She said, Joe Biden. I was like, how Joe Biden get in this. What are you talking about? And I also was like, at an energy level where, like, I could perform, but my brain was not firing at all cylinders, so I couldn't, like, improvise anything to make this, like, funny or like. Or, like, quippy. I was like. I was like, I'm sorry, I'm really confused. What are you.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

What is this?

[Sasheer Zamata]

And she's like. And I was like, what? I was like, how are you speaking full sentences right now? Are you responding to things that I just said? And. And she's like, yeah. I was like, I. We gotta talk after. Okay. It seems like you have a lot of insight about what I'm talking about right now, but I just need to finish this thing. And then she stopped. So it, like, didn't last long.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

And.

[Sasheer Zamata]

But I was just like, so, like, Taken aback. And I don't think it ruined the set because people were complimentary after. But it was just a weird moment where I was like, what is this? What is this?

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Was this out of town or in town?

[Sasheer Zamata]

Is in town.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Interesting. I just. I. Maybe. I don't know if you've always been on their worst behavior every time I've ever been on stage, but people are getting more and more just doing whatever the fuck they want. TI Was at a comedy show. Did you see this video?

[Sasheer Zamata]

No.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

TI Was at a comedy show, and apparently the comic made a joke about TI that he didn't like. So then he got on stage, grabbed the microphone, and started, like, screaming at her.

[Listener/Caller]

And.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

And then they were back at him. It was like. It was kind of wild. Wait, Kimmy, look it up. I'm not. I don't think I'm lying. I watch. I watched it last night, and I don't think it was a dream.

[Sasheer Zamata]

What if it was? I'd be crazy.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Imagine.

[Sasheer Zamata]

I saw him at a strip club in Atlanta. Imagine city. And he wrapped his head. He wrapped his whole face in, like, this white gauze, I think, to, like, be, like, incognito. But it drew more attention to him because we were like, you're the invisible Man. Like, you. It was like a mummy.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Who's this mummy?

[Sasheer Zamata]

Oh, it's TI As Tiny was there, too, so it's like, who's the mummy with Tiny?

[Kimmy Gatewood]

I guess it's probably TI that's very funny. How wild. Yeah, I mean, don't go out, I guess, if you don't want to be recognized. Kimmy, did I make this up? Was this a dream, The TI Thing? No, I'm just reading about it now, trying to understand it. But TI did yell at a comic mid show.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Damn it. I.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

People. People are acting the worst. Have people always been so poorly behaved, or is this, like, a new thing?

[Sasheer Zamata]

There have definitely been versions of people being poorly behaved at all times. I've definitely seen videos of people trying to fight comics on stage. You know, pre pandemic. But I really think it's like, people, like, don't know how to act in public anymore. Boy, oh, boy, he's been cooped up. And then they're like, I have something to say. I was recorded going off on a comedian who seemingly joked about the sexual assault allegations made against the rapper and his wife, Tiny, at an Atlanta comedy show Monday night. I. I want to know who this comic is. As many times as you joke. As many times as you joke on that. I'm Going to check your motherfucking ass as long as it takes. TI told the comedian. So wait, so. Oh, Lauren Knight. Oh, okay. So T.I. said that when you stop playing with me and mine, I'mma stop saying something. I mean, there ain't been no case. Ain't never been no motherfucking case. I ain't did nothing wrong and my wife ain't did nothing wrong. And if you keep on playing with me, I'm gonna continue to confront publicly, verbally.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Boy, oh boy. Wait, what Night then addresses the one night only. This is an open mic.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Why was TI at an open mic? I guess he's a comedian now, so maybe he's trying some time.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Does TI do comedy now?

[Sasheer Zamata]

Yeah.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

You didn't see that? I thought it was a bit.

[Sasheer Zamata]

I. I've only seen one video, but. So I don't know if he's doing wait a couple shows, but I think he was trying. Okay, he's trying to do stand up.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

On Tuesday night, Knight took to Instagram to address the heated incident. She said TI showed up towards the end of the event and delivered a 30 minute stand up routine. 30 minutes. He's doing well. Knight says after TI completed his set, she returned to stage to continue her hosting duties, but kept getting interrupted by TI's heckling.

[Sasheer Zamata]

I'm talking about marriage. And. And he keeps cutting me off, telling me to shut the up, calling me all kinds of heckling me. So I'm like, all right, come on, stop playing with me. It's crazy. Like, you keep going and I can't say nothing to you. Night says T. I then began telling her to take off her wig.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Why did. Why was this allowed to happen? Like, why what? Why don't people intervene anymore? Like, we're just all allowed to do whatever we want and nobody's gonna be like, you have to go.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Yeah. Wait, is this a video below this? We don't have to play it in the. Oh, so this is her recounting of.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Seems like there's audio and I can send this to you of it, but I don't know if this video. Wait, go down. Okay, here. So Knight said, ti, take off your wig. And then it was. That was the time that night decided to fire back at TI by bringing up the sexual abuse allegations. I said, all right, I'll take off my wig. Speak on the allegations. Boy, oh boy. Nobody was tight except for him. Nobody called him. Okay, Nobody called him rapist. I responded to him telling me in a room full of people to rip my wig off and made a joke Just like he did. So you got a problem with it? Not mine.

[Sasheer Zamata]

So then. So then. Okay, so at first I thought he was. He was going wild because she brought the allegations, but she brought the allegations.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Because he was already harassing her.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Well, why did he even start doing that? That's awful.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Yeah, Also, ti, we don't heckle other performers. You're the comic. You're a comic.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Yeah, you just watch. If you want to be a comic, you just be in the back and laugh. You can talk shit to other comics, but don't. Yeah, but don't fucking heckle them.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Wow, that's nuts.

[Sasheer Zamata]

That sucks.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Yeah, I don't like it.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Do not like, don't like it. Mm, rude. But what a story.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

What a story. I mean. Yeah, but I don't want those stories. I don't. You come see my show. You sit down. Please.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Please sit down and just enjoy it. Unless I ask you a question.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Yeah, yeah, but it's funny because I spent a lot of time on like my other podcast, why wouldn't you date me? Talking about shows and stuff and how people interrupt me. So when I started doing more crowd work, people were like. I'd be like, oh, come on, I really want to know. They'd be like, you're not going to tricking me. I don't want to hear about myself on your podcast. So it got to the point where I was like, I genuinely would love a response from anybody.

[Sasheer Zamata]

You.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

And they'd be like, okay, all right.

[Sasheer Zamata]

I had a show recently, and a woman and her mom waited outside for a really long time to talk to me, which is really nice. And the woman, we were talking and they were saying nice things about the show. And then the young woman who listens to this podcast was like, well, I understand that you're probably tired and you want to go home and you can't wait to sit down. And I was like, you are so right. Thank you so much for knowing me. I want this interaction to end and I want to go sit down. Thank you so much.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

That's funny.

[Sasheer Zamata]

And she's like, I wish you all the chairs in the world.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

And I was like, this is really sweet. That is nice. It's funny because people say nice things like that to you. And then people are like, I hope you get fucking railed and deep dick. And then sometimes I'm like, hahaha. And then sometimes I'm like, that was jarring. I'm literally just crossing a street.

[Sasheer Zamata]

I hope you get f. Okay, cool.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Okay. That is.

[Sasheer Zamata]

I was actually thinking about that the other day, because after my show, I was like, I've joked about this. Like, my audience will, like, send me articles and, like, think pieces about my material. And your audience is like, like, sending you disgusting messages in your DMs. But it literally happened the other day. Someone was like, what you said was right about this thing. And also, you should look up these. These other facts about that topic. And I was like, awesome. Thank you.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

That's so nice. I don't know that world. I don't know it. I don't know. Mateo posted a joke about pharmacists. You've heard his pharmacist joke?

[Sasheer Zamata]

Yes.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

And he just, like, wrote. He wrote in the caption. He's like, it's just a joke. I'm just kidding. Because I guess people have come for him on TikTok. So when he posted on Instagram, he was like, it's just a joke. I'm not trying to offend. And I wrote, Excuse me. Mateo Mayer, as someone who has seen pharmacists on multiple times and watch them work, I am deeply offended at this quote, unquote joke. You've lost a fan, you've lost a follower. I thought you were nice. And the amount of people who thought I was actually saying it was so funny. There were so. People were like, get out of this comics videos if you don't like jokes.

[Sasheer Zamata]

And, I mean, clearly you're also a comic. Also clearly your friends. Photo evidence. That's correct. Crazy.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

The world is S I L L Y is silly Silly, silly, silly, silly. Yeah.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Ain't that the truth.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Yeah. Are you here for a minute or are you traveling?

[Sasheer Zamata]

I am traveling. I leave Thursday night. Actually leave tomorrow night.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Tomorrow night. You've been on so many planes this week, it's sick.

[Sasheer Zamata]

It's pretty sick.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Yeah.

[Sasheer Zamata]

A couple planes in a row this past weekend. Like, went from Indiana to la and then was in LA for a day, and then went to San Francisco and then came back to la, and I gotta go back to Indiana Thursday. And then I come back. Oh, no, actually, I don't go back. Yeah, I'm going to Bloomington.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Oh, I see. I see.

[Sasheer Zamata]

And then I go to New Mexico for a show, and then I come back, but then I go away again to Seattle, and then. And then maybe then I come back. Yeah, it's just a lot. Where's my friend? She's gone.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

She's gone, girl. She's gone. Wait, Send me your schedule. That's insane. I'll just ask where you are every day.

[Sasheer Zamata]

I'll send heck isn't my schedule. Just so I know where you are, I gotta know.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Wow, that's like so much traveling. I'm exhausted thinking about it.

[Sasheer Zamata]

I know. I love the shows. I just don't like the trout. It takes up so much time. It's not just like flying, it's also getting to the airport, getting on the plane. Then you're on the plane, then you get off the plane. Then you travel to the hotel. You gotta check in. Hopefully there's food around. Then you got to get the food and then you got take a shower, take didn't get changed. Then show. Show's great. Go back to the hotel and then go to the fuck to sleep. Then you get up, go get on a plane and then go home. Maybe go home or go somewhere else. It is all. This is a lot.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

It is wild. I yeah, I'm happy to not to.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Not be down one day we'll be on that jet life. Oh my God, that PJ life.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

But here's the thing about a jet. I want the jet to pick me up at my door and take off and land exactly where I need to be.

[Sasheer Zamata]

I don't want to drive to the airport, put a helipad right on your roof.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Is can you do that? You can, Kimmy, can you Google, like, do you have to be zoned for it? Can I be anywhere? Will my neighbors be mad? They'll be so mad.

[Sasheer Zamata]

They're just like enjoying the day and they're like.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

And I'm like, the winter neighborhood.

[Sasheer Zamata]

God.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Blazer is to go also. A helicopter can't take me far, can it?

[Sasheer Zamata]

I guess the helicopter can take you to the private airport.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Oh, my God.

[Sasheer Zamata]

And then you can take the jet.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

I want to take a little jet to my destination.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Yeah, No, I don't know how to do that.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

I don't know how to do that either. I wonder how much private jets are. They're probably not. I mean, that's an insane sentence. They're probably not that much many. They're probably a lot of money.

[Sasheer Zamata]

There's a few companies that were. You can either rent a private jet or you can do like a jet ride share or like a. Like it's like you and a few other people. If you're all like going to Vegas, like, you and five other people can.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Go, oh, okay, yeah, that I could do. Yeah, yeah, let's start doing private jets to Vegas. Yeah, right. I don't know.

[Sasheer Zamata]

I think we.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Seems wild. How much is it, Kimmy? Kimmy, how much is it for A private jet to Vegas. From LA to Vegas, please. I'll look into it. I have a cousin. This is what she does for her living. So I can see. She's a jet. She's a jet.

[Sasheer Zamata]

She is a jet.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

No, she books private jets out of different airports for. For people. She works out up in NorCal. But, like, she books these for people, so. Oh, my God. I wonder what kind of, like, famous people she's had to book a jet for. Probably like Sandra Bullock. I'm sure she flies private. Probably.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Yes.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

I've ever. I've never seen her on an airplane. She flies private. Channing Tatum probably flies private.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Although sometimes I'm surprised. I was sitting. We both were sitting behind Rick Ross one time on a plane, right?

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Yeah. Yeah. That was fully wild. I was like, I can't believe you're here. Yeah.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Who else did I see? A plane. I feel like I. I want to say I saw Common on a plane.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

I saw Viola Davis on a plane. Dave Navarro. I saw on a plane. Ooh, I love Ink Master. I was stir. Str.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Jordan, who have you seen? I sat behind Chris Tucker on a plane.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Oh.

[Sasheer Zamata]

That'S fun.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

That is fun. Wait a minute. $12,000 for a round trip? That's. What's $12,000 divided by five? Still a lot of money. Yeah. That's $2,000 for a plane ride.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Well, sometimes plane rides are $2,000.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

It's so much money.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Yeah.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

I'm always trying to get someone else to pay for my plane rides.

[Sasheer Zamata]

This is true. Yeah.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

I'm cheap.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Cheap.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

I'm a cheap.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Did we take a quiz?

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Let's do a little quizzy poo.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Yeah, maybe. Okay. I was trying to think about. Okay, yeah, maybe I was trying to think of the game that I was trying to describe during our live show. The I hate game. Oh, yeah?

[Kimmy Gatewood]

What is it?

[Sasheer Zamata]

Maybe I figured it. I did. I forgot to ask my college friends, but maybe it's this. Okay, say, I hate when people do blank.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

I hate when people pick their nose.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Okay, Kimmy and Jordan, can you do the same thing?

[Kimmy Gatewood]

I hate when people interrupt. I hate when people are rude.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Okay, I hate. Did I do this right? Okay. I hate when people chew loudly. And then you're supposed to go back and say, oh, no, I think it's maybe I love. And then you say the thing that you hate. And then during sex. So I love when people chew loudly during sex.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

I love when people pick their noses during sex. I love when people interrupt during sex. I love when people are rude.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Okay, it Sometimes works. I think I'm still missing a factor, but then I think I'm getting closer to the game.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

We'll check in with you in a few episodes. Fun.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Please.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

This is a very funny game this year. Wait, I'm trying to think. What do I hate, hate, hate. I pet peeve. Picking up dog shit. But I have to do it because I have to walk my dog, so I love dog shit during sex. This game is wild to sheer.

[Sasheer Zamata]

I feel like I'm definitely missing a component because it usually is more like it makes more sense. Feel like mine and Jordan's made sense, but we can do better.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Oh, boy.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Okay.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

That's very, very funny.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Okay, let's do what's your most toxic trait? We've, like, read it every time. I haven't done it.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Thank God, because I was like, can we do your most toxic trait?

[Sasheer Zamata]

Oh, great.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Okay. Wow. Tell me how I'm toxic, Mama.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Life is hard, and sometimes we slip into patterns of behavior that aren't that great. In fact, some mental health experts might say these behaviors are toxic, ruining relationships and arresting our own growth and potential. But pinpointing our own shortcomings can help us stop toxic behavior in its tracks. So what's your toxic trait? Answer seven questions to find out.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

You just had the worst day ever. What happened?

[Sasheer Zamata]

Your BFF brought a new friend to cave night. Without asking you further, there are no bad days.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Every day is an opportunity to grow.

[Sasheer Zamata]

You just couldn't get anything done. Between work and family, there are too many things to juggle.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Where do you begin? It all started when the barista got your order wrong again. Wow. Speaking right to me, your BFF brought a new friend to game night without letting you know that they have other friends. I adjusted it for how I felt.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Yeah. Thank you for being honest. Maybe couldn't get anything done. This is too much to juggle.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Mm.

[Sasheer Zamata]

If you were a TV character, you'd be Olivia Pope. Hannah Horvath.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Horvath.

[Sasheer Zamata]

I've actually. I never heard her last name.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

That's really funny. From girls. It's so funny. Hannah. Kimmy Schmidt.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Eve Polastri.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Lucille Bluth.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Kelly Prenny.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Okay. Lucille Bluth.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Yeah.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Who would you be? Who would I be? Maybe Olivia Pope.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Oh, a fixer. Yeah, maybe. Yeah. Louis Pope. A guest wears a white dress to your wedding. You roll your eyes, tell her how amazing she looks, and take a photo with her.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Start hatching a plan to get her another dress asap.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Poke fun of it in your toes to the guests.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Oh, I'd probably Poke fun of it in the toast to the guests. Be like this. No, that doesn't sound like a joke. No, does it?

[Sasheer Zamata]

No. Hopefully you would punch it up by the time you get to the toast. I would probably take a picture with her. That actually happened to me my senior prom. I was wearing this red sparkly one shoulder dress and this girl. What was her name? Is her with a G and the exact. No, it was like something more. It was like a pretty girl name. She was so pretty. Gregory. Yeah, her name was Gregory.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Gabrielle? Gabriella, Gabby.

[Sasheer Zamata]

No, no, it's not a name I've heard since her.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Giselle. Oh, Jarvis.

[Sasheer Zamata]

It was like Janisa or something.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

I can't remember.

[Sasheer Zamata]

And. And of course not. Of course. But she looked fantastic. And I looked great too, but she was more developed than I was and, like, had some body. Adi Oddy. And I was like, well, it doesn't look like that on me.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Oh, no.

[Sasheer Zamata]

But we laughed about it and then took a photo together. And then I was like, we both look equally good.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

We both look equally good. Thank you.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Thank you. Okay, the number one reason you text your friend is to complain about everything. Check in and be the support. Check in and be supportive no matter what.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Gossip.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Make sure they know you're still alive since you're so busy.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

I like to, like, check in and gossip.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Yeah, I guess I'll do. Wait, which one? There's a check in and then there's a gossip.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Yeah, that's why I'm having trouble. But I think, yeah, maybe check in and be supportive no matter what.

[Sasheer Zamata]

I guess sometimes I do have to text to let people know I'm alive because I'll forget to tell people what's going on.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

You also love to just change that phone number and not tell nobody. Yeah, then I become the gatekeeper of who gets to talk to you.

[Sasheer Zamata]

But isn't that fun?

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Kind of. Which movie are you watching tonight? Hustlers Swallow?

[Sasheer Zamata]

No, I don't know that one. A Star is Born.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

The hate u give crazy rich Asians Bird Lady.

[Sasheer Zamata]

It's labor.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

What did I say?

[Sasheer Zamata]

You said bird lady. I thought you did it on purpose.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Sure didn't. Uh, sometimes my words get switched around. Um, I can't believe I said bird lady.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Yeah, with so much confidence.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

I'm looking at it and it says Lady Bird. Anywho, okay. Definitely watching A Star is Born. I'm constantly watching A Star is Born. It's a perfect movie.

[Sasheer Zamata]

I also would watch A Star is Born. I watched it a couple times already and I love it.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

I think we've watched it together.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Yep. I'm sure words you live by when.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Someone shows you who they are believe them the first time. Maya Angelou.

[Sasheer Zamata]

This too shall pass.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

YOLO and fomo.

[Sasheer Zamata]

It took me quite a long time to develop a voice, and now that I have it, I am not going to be silent. Madeline Albright.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Mm. Maddie, who are you gonna go with?

[Sasheer Zamata]

I think Madeline Albright.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Mm. I'm going with Maya because anytime I have not trust my instincts on a person, they end up being fucking trash. And they have shown who they are in the beginning, and I just chose to ignore it. So I'm gonna really keep that in my heart.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Mm. Pick a Regina George.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Okay. Regina George with holes cut out of her titties of a. Of a tank top.

[Sasheer Zamata]

That was when someone Was it when Katie cut her shirt, maybe.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Oh, in the plan to, like, depopulize her or something.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Yeah, but, like, then it became a trend. Then Regina George is looking kind of scandalized. I can't tell what the scene is, though.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

And then this one is the scene where she's like. So you agree she's leaning in, whispering.

[Sasheer Zamata]

And then there's the Santa performance where she's like, on stage.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

What are you gonna pick?

[Sasheer Zamata]

I like the purple bra moment because she doesn't get embarrassed, and she's just, like, owning it, like, whatever. I guess I have holes in my shirt.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Okay. I'm gonna pick Santa, baby. Cause I love that scene. It's funny.

[Sasheer Zamata]

It's funny.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

This is Nicole. Oh, my. Toxic trait judgment. You are quick to compare yourself to others, slow to welcome the new girl in the clique, and you're as solid as they come when it comes to wavering on your opinion. Yep, you harbor some toxic judgment. Join the club. It's super common. Psychotherapist Dr. Daryl Appleton says that judgment is deeply rooted in our brains. As a form of survival defense, a simple way to stop judgment behavior says to ask yourself, why am I seeing this behavior slash person as wrong or bad? Pausing for a little soul digging can excavate truths about yourself as opposed to whatever slash whomever you're judging. And why should you be so defensive about that?

[Sasheer Zamata]

Okay.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

This is the sheer. Wow.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Wow. My toxic trait is overextending myself. Your to do list is never ending. Your weekly yoga class feels like a chore. You feel constant guilt for not living up to expectations. Sound familiar? It does. You have overextended yourself. And while being a professional multitasker seems great on paper, it's abysmal for your Mental health and relationships. Aspiring for a perfect work life. Balance is a toxic fool's errand. Psychotherapist Dr. Darryl Appleton tells us the wild goose chase leaves us feeling less fulfilled and even more burnout. She says make boundaries between work and home. But what if I work from home? Set strict deadlines so you complete projects that belong in one space and don't carry them into the other. Damn. Today was actually a very busy day. I got up at like 7am I started doing laundry and then I got my car detailed and then I. What else did I do? Oh, my friend wanted to borrow a dress for an event, so I started taking pictures of a bunch of dresses from my closet. And then I started vacuuming and then I changed more laundry and then I had to go to the post office to mail some stuff and then I had to shred some paper and then I. I just did a lot of stuff.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Sounds like too much, my friend.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Yeah.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Wow.

[Sasheer Zamata]

I'm sorry, but I wanted to do all that stuff. It's not like I had to. No one asked me to do any of that stuff, but I just did it.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

You did it for your life? Different.

[Sasheer Zamata]

My life? Yeah.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

You could pay someone to do some of that stuff for your life.

[Sasheer Zamata]

I was thinking that. I was like, I can see why someone would pay someone to do this because then I could do the work that I want to do. I'm not doing the work because I'm fucking cleaning my bathroom like, as I'm doing all this other shit. So who knows? Maybe I'll do that one day.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Yeah, maybe. Should we help people?

[Sasheer Zamata]

Let's help people.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

I believe helping is the future. Let them learn and let them lead the way.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Actually, yesterday my man went camping over the weekend and then came back and the car was all dirty. And I like going to the wash. The car washes where you drive your car through and then you vacuum it and like, do stuff to it yourself. Just because I don't like sitting there while someone else is, like, doing that to the car. The logic, it probably doesn't make sense, but in my mind I'm like, this saves time if I just do it myself. But the car was so dirty that even after we cleaned it, I was like, I still is. Is still dirty. So that's why I got it detailed this morning. Because I was like, I won. It's never been detailed. But also, it just needs a deeper clean. But I was like, we should have just gone to a place where they just did all this stuff for us.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Did you? Why take it somewhere. I have someone come to my home to detail my car.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Oh, that's what happened this morning. Someone did come to my home. But yesterday we went to a place to drive it through and then vacuum it. And then I was like, oh, I just. We could have gone to a place where they just did all that stuff for you.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Yeah. I didn't realize that people could come to your home to wash your car and sell my neighbors. I was like, how is someone always washing their car? And I was like, and it's never my neighbor. Who is it? And then I like, locked the thing on the side of the truck, and I was like, they come to wash the car? Yeah. Blew my little ass mind.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Yeah, I think that's the way to do it.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Yeah. I did it the other day. And by the other day, I mean, like a couple months ago. My hair. My car is covered in dog hair. I should do it again. But it was just lovely. They came, they washed it, and I did other stuff. Boy, oh boy, it's great. Okay, here's a letter. Hi, everyone. So I'm a college student and for a while didn't have any close friends here. This year I met two girls and we hit it off right away. We're pretty close, but lately I feel less motivated to hang out with them. It's nothing against them. They're really great, and I'm so lucky to have formed this friendship with them. I just feel like I get in this mood where I really don't want to hang out with anyone.

[Sasheer Zamata]

The thing is, while I would prefer to stay home sometimes, I know I would feel left out after afterwards. To give some context to. To my relationships. I don't really have many friends in general. I have two friends from high school, but we don't really talk except when we are home for breaks, aside from Snapchat streaks. But that's not talking. That is why maintaining this relationship is really important to me. Because though I don't have many, I really value close friendships.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Do you think I should push myself more to hang out with them? To push myself more to hang out with them more, or do you think it's okay to not hang out all the times they do? How should I manage feelings of being left out? Trio friend groups are hard. Thank you so much. I think you guys are so cute.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Ookie Bay.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

It is tough. And I get like. I mean, there's times where I'm like, oh, I should just go out and go do this thing.

[Sasheer Zamata]

And I'm like, oh, I don't Want to.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

But then I go out and then I get home and I'm like, you know what? I'm glad I went out. I had a nice time. Very rarely do I go out and I'm like, yikes, that was worthless. Except for the time I went and saw the Nightmare Before Christmas on Halloween at the. At the Bonk of America Stadium. I wish I had stayed home and never forced friends to do that with me. It was the worst thing I've ever done. All these little gremlin children running around, these freaky deaky things on the screen. Everyone's like, this is a kids movie. And I was like, this man burst into worms. It was wild. It was sick. And I said it was sick out loud in this mansion around. He's like, I know, but yeah, I think you should, like, force. Not force, but just encourage yourself to go out more. Yeah.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Because sometimes you might surprise yourself. I would also say don't beat yourself up for not going out, because also, you know your limits. I. If I. I could see myself turning to a person, that would. It would be hard for me to get out of the house. It already is hard for me to.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Get out of the house.

[Sasheer Zamata]

So sometimes I had to be like, sasheer, just do it. And then if you are not having fun, you can leave. I think reminding yourself that you can leave any point is good as long as you go and try. But any moment, if you're feeling, like, uncomfortable or tired or anxious, you can get the fuck out of there and go home. That's always an option. But also, I respect when people know their limits. I remember when I was in college, I'm still friends with this person, one of my friends, she would just, like, go to bed early, which. And, you know, we be late, hang out late in the dorms. Not even, like, partying like crazy, just, like, hanging out. But she's like, okay, that's. That's time.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

I'm done.

[Sasheer Zamata]

That's it for me, folks. And I was like, what this crazy? Like, why isn't she hanging out? But then later I was like, well, that's her. That was her limit. She didn't want to hang out anymore. And that's okay. She's still my friend. I still like her. I'm still going to invite her to stuff, but that's just as much as you could take right now. And hopefully your friends feel the same way and can think like, yeah, she's. You're still great to hang out with, but sometimes you don't want to hang out. And that's okay. We'll just catch you when you're. When you're available.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Yeah. I have friends who I know will go home early. I am the late friend. I know, like, if there's a party going on, I'm not going to be there till very late, and nobody's mad at me about it. You know what I mean? And I usually go because I'm like, ooh, less people will be there. Or I have something to do during the day. But, yeah, I think it's. There is something to just being like, yeah, I'll go for an hour or two. And then sometimes you're like, I'm having a great time. I'll stay a little longer. But also you just go, okay, bye.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Yeah.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Solved.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Solved.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Yum, yum, yum. I'm hungry.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Give me another hungry for questions.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

My belly needs you for the questions. Boy, oh, boy. I think my period's coming because I've got a great big zit right here.

[Sasheer Zamata]

That's probably what that means.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

I wish. I wish it would go away. I don't want it.

[Listener/Caller]

Hi, to share. Nicole. Love the pod. I was just listening to today's episode about the caller who called in about chairs, and I also have some advice if you wanted to hear it. If you are able to float your couch, like, in the middle of the room so it's not against the wall, you could put chairs behind the couch so they're like, back to. Which creates different, like, seating areas. You can also create zones. So if you have, like, a bookshelf against the wall that's not in a corner, you could put it next to the bookshelf, anchor it with a piece of art or a rug. I love chairs. I have them everywhere. And Shashir is right. If you want to make it work, you can make it work. But those are two ideas that I had. Love the pod. Shout out to my friend Derek, who I haven't talked to in a couple months, but I know he listens to the podcast. So anytime I listen to an episode, I think of him. Hi, Derek.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Oh.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Oh, that's nice.

[Sasheer Zamata]

That's nice. Great ideas. Yeah, I love that.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Very good ideas. I love it.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Now I'm like, should I put some chairs behind my day bed?

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Honestly, you could. I could.

[Sasheer Zamata]

I also have. I don't know if I've heard that term before. Floating a couch. Like putting in the middle of the room as opposed to a wall. You fold your chairs when she said that. I do, but I guess I thought, like, like vertically.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

That's what I Thought I was like, this bitch has chairs floating in the sky of her home.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Just suspended from the ceiling.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

I feel like that's so wild.

[Sasheer Zamata]

But now I get it. Yeah. Great ideas. Thank you for sharing. We have an email. Hey, friends. I listened to an episode recently where y' all talked about adult summer camps. I wanted to share that my best friend and I have have started a body positive adult summer camp called Camp Roundup. It's the opposite of fat camp. On Labor Day weekend 2022, we hope to host 38 plus size babes at our retro rustic campground in Newark, Ohio, near Columbus. We'll have yoga, pool parties, dance parties, giant slip and slides, cookouts, bonfires, plus talks about breakout sessions on topics like fat liberation, fashion, fat media, etc, meals, unlimited snacks and non alcoholic drinks are included and BYOB is encouraged. So if you're interested in partying with some fat babes in the woods, we're the camp for you.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

That sounds nice.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Yeah, that is nice.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Yeah. If I was in Ohio, I don't even know where Newark, Ohio is. I even know there was a Newark outside of Jersey. Yeah, I'd be into it. Yeah.

[Listener/Caller]

Hi, Nicole. Hi, Kimmy. Hi, Sasheer. And hello, Jordan. It's me, Christina. So I have a question, a situation, a thing. So I had this friend that was, I'll say, pretty much like my bff. We were that close. We were tighter than a butthole. Yes, that close. But things happened, you know, she got into a relationship, I ended a relationship and booked it and left the state. But during that time, I attempted to stay in contact with her. And I'm thinking that maybe this was like her first partner because she literally chose dicks over chicks. And I was sending her messages like, hey, I know I'm in another state and you know, things are different now. Hope all is well and nothing. Like I was pretty much ghosted. But now I'm back home and wherever I live and I was still reaching out. I was like, hey, hi, hello, it's me. Hello. And then just literally out of nowhere, we ended up meeting at a party and she was there and she's like, oh, my God, I didn't know you were here. The devil is a liar. And apparently she a devil now. I. So I don't know what to do. I, you know, did my best to stay in contact with her and she was truly ignoring me. And now here we are at this party and she's all, hi, hey, hello. I've missed you, bitch. Did you really? Because I sent you multiple messages and I'm not feeling that same vibe. But anyways, here's the issue. We have been talking and reconnecting, and while I'm so happy that that's happening, I'm still very aware that she ghosted me for, like, years. And while I want to, you know, continue this friendship because, like, we were great together, I'm not sure if I just need to, like, bring it up and be like, hey, what was with the cold shoulder? Or, like, was good. So that's the question. Like, do I just start fresh from here and pretend like, all that ghosting and nonsense, you know, didn't happen, even though it obviously did? Or, you know, do I refresh this friendship by, you know, pulling out the red table and being like, yo, what the fuck? But, yeah, so that's. That's kind of the thing. Like, I miss the friendship, but I know I was being ghosted. Anywho, that's all for now. Love you guys. Love me more. Have a great one.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

What do you think?

[Sasheer Zamata]

This year, I have had friends who get in relationships and fall off the face of the earth. One friend is coming to mind. I think I just, like, let it go when it was happening. I was like, this sucks. I miss her. But, you know, I do have other friends, thankfully. And then she came back in my life. They broke up. And I don't think it was like, they broke up. And we immediately came back, you know, became friends again. But just, like, things in our life led us back to each other, and conveniently, we were talking about a different friend who was, like, hard to reach or hard to hang out with. And so I was like, actually, that was you at one point in time, and not even in a, like, shady way. Just like, yeah, there was a period of time where it was actually really hard to get in contact with you, and I missed you. And it was, like, straining. And she goes, oh, my God, I'm sorry. And then she's like, but that does make sense, because I did feel like I had to, like, just be home. Like, she would, like, just be home even if he wasn't home and they didn't even live together. Like, she just felt like she just had to be unavailable. Like, available for him, but unavailable for everybody else, even if that wasn't what he was asking. But that was what she thought she needed to do to be a good girlfriend. And she knew later that's not the case, but at the time, that's what she was going through. And, yeah. So it ended up being a good talk. I don't know if I would have brought it up if it wasn't, like, seamlessly led into that topic. But it was nice to be like, okay, it had nothing to do with me. She was going through her own shit. It also sounds like it wasn't healthy. Like, it wasn't, like, a good situation. Like, she was just in love and, like, loving it the whole time, and that's why she couldn't get to her phone. It was like, no. She felt obligated to be home and not talk to anybody else. And that actually sucks. So, yeah, I don't know. I'm. I mean, I would say I don't know. I am glad that we had the talk, but also, I feel like I still would have enjoyed our friendship if we didn't have the talk. Does that make sense?

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Yeah.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Like, it's not even necessary to rehash the old stuff if you're enjoying this person's company again.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Yeah. I think it's like, if you can move past it and just be fine with it, there's no need to bring it up. But, like, if you feel some type of way and feel yourself resenting your friend, I think then it's just like, hey, friend, you went away for a while, and I missed you, and I don't want that to happen again. If we rekindle our friendship. But also, friendships do have a. They have seasons. A lot of them do. Not ours. Ours is forever. You'll never get rid of me.

[Sasheer Zamata]

You could also phrase it in a way where it's like, were you okay? Like, I. I didn't hear from you because we. Maybe she wasn't. We actually don't know. You know, I haven't. I didn't hear for you for, like, a couple years during this phase. Like, I didn't know what was going on. What was. What was going on in your life? Were you okay? And maybe she'll be like, oh, I don't know. I was a little spacey. Or, you know, who knows what she'll respond with? But it doesn't have to be like a you did this to me situation. It could be like, I really don't know what was going on with you, and I missed you. Were you all right? And maybe she'll be more inclined to open up if there actually was something going on than feeling, like, attacked. Like, oh, I guess I'm a bad friend because I didn't pick up the phone when you called.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Also, yeah, it's not about you. You're not the reason why she wasn't speaking to you. It was the relationship. And then you don't know the ins and outs of that relationship. So I do think it's, like, really good and pretty cool to be like, were you okay? I mean, I personally missed you, but, like, were you okay during that period? I think that's the best thing to ask.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Solved.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Solved.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

And if you want your problem solved or talked about, you can email nicholasiamail.com or. Or you could call 424-645-7003. Feel free to email us a voice memo as well.

[Sasheer Zamata]

We also have [e-mail] Best friends.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Lastly, don't forget to rate, review, and subscribe. That's the easiest way to support this show. Wow. Well, I texted your friend about singing lessons. Oh. So I gotta. I gotta double check to see if she answered, because I'm gonna take them, and I'm gonna learn how to sing.

[Sasheer Zamata]

And it's gonna be the girl.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

I'm gonna conquer this fear, and it's gonna be so good for everybody. Everyone's gonna be like, she did it.

[Sasheer Zamata]

I'm so proud of you, I think.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Thank you.

[Sasheer Zamata]

I'm gonna have to take swimming lessons soon.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Why?

[Sasheer Zamata]

Because I told my man if he quit Twitter, I would take swimming lessons. And he just deactivated his account, like, a few weeks ago, but I really thought this would never happen.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Oh, no, you can't. He can't be out here making promises. He can't be cashing checks that the bank doesn't know about. That's not the phrase, and I have no idea what it is.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Was it cashing checks that you're something. Wait, that you can't. That your mouth can't cover? Cat.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Cat. We don't. We don't do checks anymore, so. This saying's obsolete.

[Sasheer Zamata]

This is very true. Yeah. My brain's like, what are you even talking about?

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Don't swipe the debit card if you don't have the funds. Maybe that's what it is. This is really. I love. I'll take a swimming class with you.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Okay.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

I mean, you don't need to swim, but if you would, like, support. I mean, I can support you that way.

[Sasheer Zamata]

That's really sweet. Yeah, I would, like, support.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

I love you. I love you, too. And I know that sometimes, like, someone just being somewhere when you're doing something difficult is helpful.

[Sasheer Zamata]

So.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Yeah.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Yeah.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Yay.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Hooray.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Hooray. We did it. We've done another episode of podcast. We podcast today.

[Sasheer Zamata]

We podcast and we podcast well.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. All right, everyone. Another podcast will happen next week.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Bye. Bye.

[Interviewer]

I want to talk more about just mindset, because you are amazingly vocal about your mindset, your joys, and your challenges. It's all there. It's in your book. And it also lives on social media, too. How do you, like, reconcile those two worlds, like the analog and the digital, and continue to keep showing up for yourself? This might sound a little silly, but I really think, like, there's, like, a Ziva aesthetic. Like, I love watching you on social. It really is, girl, because it's so bright and vivid and authentic. It's like, all of you in your joy and in your pain, and at least when I witness gives me, like, this boost that I can do the same thing, too. I can be just as honest, and I can be just as vulnerable. And Gazebo did it. And not only did she do it, she still looks so cute. You always look so fly. And, like, even when I came into this room, I was like, oh, she got the dream aesthetic behind her. She got her cute outfit on her hair.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Like, everything just looks so beautiful.

[Interviewer]

And it feels very effortless, but I know it's not. I know that you are so intentional about what you share. Can you talk about that intentionality and how you're able to.

[Kimmy Gatewood]

To do it?

[Glory Edim]

Yeah. And part of me, if I cry or get weepy, I am in a very emotional time in my life. But it's a mixture. It's many things. It's not just sadness, it's joy. But I see myself as many things. I am a writer, but I'm also a curator. You know, in a sense, that's what I'm doing on my Instagram page. And I've been thinking a lot about what it means to curate a life. You know, create this life for myself. I'm a Taurus. I'm very sensual. I love, love beauty. You know, these are the fundamentals of my personality. And I'm realizing that these are my superpowers, that these are the ways in which I make sense of the world, make sense of my life, and find that joy amidst the pain. And so the Internet, for me has always been about connection. There was a point, like, two years ago when Instagram, I was just like, what is this for?

[Sasheer Zamata]

Like, what?

[Glory Edim]

What is this? Like, what? I just have anxiety, you know? Like, I. Around that time, I had gained some weight, and I was feeling uncomfortable about my appearance.

[Sasheer Zamata]

Not.

[Glory Edim]

You know, I was just like, what is this place? Like, a place for me to go and feel anxious about posting a selfie. Like, this is not the connection that I'm looking for. And so it was through that. That discomfort and trying to figure out a way to get that same vibe I had as a kid and a teenager that I started doing my energy boards. People will DM me and send me, you know, messages about how much, like, they look forward to my Sunday energy boards and how, like, you know, these images have meant so much to them. And I love to hear that. And I think the gag for me is that same. You know, this is also feeding me as much as it's feeding other people. And that's. That's the thing that I go to the Internet for. That's the thing that keeps me going when I'm going through it, I can spiral, and then I can be like, you know what? I'm going to make a mood board about this. And it gives a shape. It creates context for what I'm going through. And again, I can post these images about what it means to struggle with your mental health and then get hundreds of messages from black women who are like, wow, girls, same. Thank you so much. I feel seen. That is what I think keeps me online. If that didn't exist, I'd be like deuces. Because I don't get it. Because I don't get it.

[Interviewer]

No, I'm the same way. I mean, the community and the response and the engagement, it fortifies you in such a real way. You speak to that clearly in your introduction. I have your book here is, like, highlighted sis, like, all the tabs. And there was this one line that, like, stood out to me. And you say all this to say, the essays in this book came together as I fell apart. And writing about black women is the thing that put me together again, that got me through, that helped me become reacquainted with the concept of joy and freedom. And I think that's all what you're speaking to the black women. Us together, collectively uplift each other, encourage each other, help us see the vision and affirm one another when it all seems bleak and dark and at times hopeless. You know, I would love to speak to that experience of just, like, the collective love that we have for one another and how you've been able to not only create this beautiful book and this career, like you have such a large body of work behind you as a cultural critic, but how your mental health is been able to be boosted, you know, and it feels like a simple thing, but it can be life saving.

[Glory Edim]

Yeah. Yeah, it really can. Because I think for me more than anything, what it gives me is purpose. Being someone who is in a state of depression, in a state of anxiety, I need purpose to sort of center myself amidst that storm, you know? Like, I know ultimately that when I write, it's something ancestral. It's something bigger than me and centering my writing specifically on celebrating and spotlighting and just like, expanding stories about black women. I know that that is my purpose here. And that is the thing that makes the writing worth it. Because writing is hard, girl.

[Interviewer]

It is hard, yes.

[Glory Edim]

If you don't have that thing that makes it worth it. And that thing could be whatever. It can't be, though I see now more than ever, it can't be money, it can't be clout. Like that can't be the reason that you write. It's not sustainable. It has to be about something outside of you, something that's not tied at all to your ego. And I think in the moments when I'm, like, the least attached to my ego, I'm able to see through my pain and my depression and get to the heart of the matter, if that makes sense.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, no, it makes complete sense because I like to think in that same vein, too, and think about the work that I'm doing as an act of service. Because when you are being of service, you cannot be tied. If you're truly doing it in a way that's genuine, you cannot be tied to your ego. And you can't have these artificial, like, ideas of what success looks like. It has to be genuine.