Podcast Summary

Betwixt The Sheets: The History of Sex, Scandal & Society

Episode: History's Worst F*ckboys: Raphael

Host: Kate Lister | Guest: Professor Jill Burke

Date: September 9, 2025

Overview

In this lively episode, sex historian Kate Lister continues her miniseries on “history’s worst f*ckboys,” turning her sights on Renaissance painter Raphael. Joined by Renaissance expert Professor Jill Burke, author of "How to Be a Renaissance Woman," the conversation explores Raphael’s life, reputation, and whether he truly deserves his legendary womanizing status—or if he’s been unfairly maligned by history and salacious rumor.

Key Discussion Points and Insights

Introducing Raphael: The Renaissance "F*ckboy"? (03:43–07:10)

• Kate opens with playful skepticism: “If I met someone today called Raphael, my first thought would be f*ckboy. I wouldn't even need him to speak. I'd just be like, oh, I bet you write poetry. And I bet you go to India to find yourself.” (05:11)
• Professor Jill Burke admits to a “soft spot” for Raphael, describing him as “notoriously charming” compared to grumpy Michelangelo and mysterious Leonardo. (06:07)
• The episode defines “f*ckboy” via Urban Dictionary: a boy who plays with girls’ feelings for sex or personal gain. (06:48)

Raphael’s Origins & Artistic Brilliance (07:27–10:13)

• From a painter family in Urbino (“nepo baby,” jokes Kate), Raphael quickly became a prodigy, training under Perugino, moving to Florence at 21, and absorbing techniques from Michelangelo and Leonardo. (07:38–08:57)
• By 1508, Raphael was in Rome painting the Vatican Stanze for Pope Julius II, achieving widespread fame before dying young at 37. (09:00–10:08)

Renaissance Rivalries: Michelangelo vs. Raphael (10:13–12:58)

• Michelangelo “really hated” Raphael, largely out of professional jealousy, going so far as to write “sarky” letters to the pope and compare Raphael's apprentices to “capons (castrated chickens).” (10:25–11:08)
• Raphael copied elements from Michelangelo and Leonardo but innovated and personalized his style, which both annoyed and impressed peers. (11:33–12:38)

Raphael’s Reputation: Where’s the Womanizing Evidence? (12:58–15:23)

• The evidence for Raphael as a notorious womanizer is thin. Vasari suggests he died young “partly because he exhausted himself through having too many lovers,” rooted in Renaissance medical superstition. (13:13–14:19)
• Renaissance medicine believed too much sex "weakened the constitution.” Kate quips: “You can't die from too much sex, can you?” Jill explains the old beliefs regarding “evacuation.” (13:29–14:00)

The Roman Sex Culture & Courtesans (15:23–18:08)

• Rome in Raphael’s time was teeming with “single men in holy orders” and a flourishing population of sex workers (possibly 10% of the city’s population). (15:23–15:38)
• The rise of the "courtesan" in Italian culture, especially under the scandal-laden Borgia papacy. (15:54–16:04)
• Raphael was reputedly acquainted with famed courtesans, notably Imperia, for whom he allegedly painted a nude portrait displayed on her house. (16:04–17:04)
  • Kate’s astonished reaction: “That’s a hell of a move, isn’t it? Here are my tits. Behold.” (17:15–17:18)

Inventing the Female Nude: Raphael’s Artistic Legacy (18:08–19:16)

• While male nudes dominated Renaissance art, Raphael and Titian revolutionized the female nude as an artistic genre, using live female models. (18:08)
• Raphael’s workshop environment, its sexual atmosphere, and the production of “the first printed porn”—a series of erotic drawings/prints called "The Positions," ultimately banned by the Pope. (19:16–20:25)

Life Models: Professionalism or Predation? (21:09–22:52)

• Kate, reflecting on her experience as a life model, asks about power and consent for female models in Raphael’s workshop—Jill confirms that boundaries and protections were almost nonexistent in the period. (21:09–22:29)
• Evidence exists for payment to women for nude modeling, but also stories (like Cellini's memoirs) highlighting coercion and exploitation. (22:31–22:43)
• Raphael’s most famous reputed model and lover: Margarita Luti, the “Baker’s Daughter.” (22:52)

Margarita Luti and La Fornarina: Reality or Romanticism? (22:52–30:14)

• “La Fornarina,” Raphael’s sensual painting, possibly depicts Margarita Luti, though hard evidence of their relationship is scant and mostly constructed posthumously. (22:56–23:07; 27:09)
  • Kate observes: “Looking at her, he clearly fancied her. She's beautiful and erotic and charged.” (28:58–29:12)
• The portrait features a blue armlet inscribed with “Raphael of Urbino,” which Jill muses could symbolize love or possessiveness: “This is kind of like a mark of ownership.” (23:54)
  • Kate: “If you are with a man and he asks you to wear a bracelet with his name on it, I think that’s a red flag, personally.” (24:26)

Was Raphael Actually Well-Behaved? (30:14–32:24)

• The evidence indicates a respectful, perhaps long-term relationship with his model rather than serial womanizing. “From what we can see, it seems to be. I mean, it's a low bar, but he's being quite respectful.” (30:14–30:28)
• Engagement to another woman (of the Bibiena family) was likely more political than personal and repeatedly delayed. (31:03–31:48)
  • “He was just a bit of a social climber, Raphael. Right. So he's taking advantage of anything he can get in order to secure his role.” (31:03)

Salacious Rome: The Chestnut Game and Papal Parties (32:38–34:46)

• Jill explains the notorious "Chestnut Game" of 1501 at the Vatican, where courtesans crawled naked to collect chestnuts, with prizes for “those who knew the greatest number of those prostitutes carnally.” (32:43–33:47)
  • Kate quips: “When I have my friends over, we have pasta.” (33:47)
• The licentious climate of Borgia Rome may have contributed to Raphael's posthumous reputation, but direct evidence is sparse. (34:11–34:46)

Raphael’s Death & Legacy (34:46–36:38)

• The cause of Raphael’s death is unknown (speculated from disease to overwork), but his passing was mourned with a grand funeral fitting for a “massive loss to Rome.” (34:47–35:53)
• Jill’s verdict: “Raphael is great. He's a really good painter... a little bit underappreciated nowadays, I think.” (36:00–36:24)
  • Kate: “I think I probably would have shagged him if I was around at the time, honestly. Without a doubt.” (36:24)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Kate Lister (on Renaissance feuds):
  “Like a bitchy old queen, isn’t he, quite frankly. Really?” (11:08)
  On Michelangelo’s jealousy.
• Professor Jill Burke (on artistic rivalry):
  “Raphael was a bit of an intellectual magpie... he’d take whatever he thought was best, which at that time was Leonardo da Vinci, was Michelangelo, and he’d kind of incorporate it into his own style.” (11:58)
• Kate Lister (on the lack of evidence):
  “Why does he have his reputation then as this absolute dog with two dicks running around Italy, can't get enough of it? Because from what you’re saying, he sounds reasonably well behaved.” (32:24)
• Professor Jill Burke (on the licentious Vatican):
  “The Pope was watching people have sex with prostitutes and giving prizes.” (34:04)
• Kate Lister (on the verdict):
  “I think we're going to have to let Raphael off the hook. I do.” (36:00)

Timestamps for Key Segments

• Show Theme & Introduction to Raphael: 03:43–06:48
• Raphael’s Origin Story & Early Career: 07:27–10:13
• Renaissance Rivalries: 10:13–12:58
• Debunking the F*ckboy Reputation (Vasari & Roman Sexual Culture): 13:05–15:23
• Courtesans, Female Nudes, and Artistic Legacy: 15:23–21:09
• The La Fornarina Mystery: 22:52–24:39
• Examining Raphael’s Relationships: 30:14–32:24
• The Chestnut Game Party: 32:38–34:46
• Raphael’s Death & Final Verdict: 34:46–36:38

Overall Verdict

This episode strips back the myth of Raphael as an insatiable Renaissance Lothario, presenting a nuanced portrait of the artist. Despite tales of “excessive lovers” and steamy Roman society, historian Jill Burke finds little compelling evidence to brand Raphael as a “f*ckboy”—instead, he emerges as innovative, charming, maybe a touch romantic, but “well-behaved” by the wild standards of his milieu.

Further Resources

• Professor Jill Burke: University of Edinburgh faculty page; "How To Be a Renaissance Woman"
• Artworks Discussed: “La Fornarina,” “Donna Velata,” Vatican Stanze

For more playful, insightful looks at the sex lives of history’s scandalous figures, subscribe to “Betwixt the Sheets.” Next up: Alexander the Great, and then Nero!