Betwixt The Sheets: “Sex Lives of Presidents” – Episode Summary
Podcast Title: Betwixt The Sheets: The History of Sex, Scandal & Society
Host: Kate Lister
Guest: Eleanor Herman, Author of Sex with Presidents
Release Date: November 5, 2024
Introduction
In this compelling episode of Betwixt The Sheets: The History of Sex, Scandal & Society, host Kate Lister delves into the intimate and often controversial sexual lives of U.S. Presidents. Joined by Eleanor Herman, an esteemed sex historian and author of Sex with Presidents, the discussion navigates through the tangled web of power, infidelity, and historical legacy associated with America’s most powerful men.
Power and Sexuality: The Hubris Syndrome
Lister opens the conversation by posing a thought-provoking question about the correlation between political power and sexual infidelity:
Kate Lister [08:43]: "Why are presidents so reckless and entitled when it comes to sex, risking their careers and personal lives?"
Eleanor Herman introduces the concept of Hubris Syndrome, a psychological disorder recognized by the psychiatric community in 2009, characterized by excessive pride and the belief in one's invincibility, particularly prevalent among long-term holders of power.
Eleanor Herman [06:55]: "Hubris Disorder is triggered by wielding power over time and subsides once power is lost. It affects both men and women, but manifests differently."
Herman explains that while female leaders exhibit signs of hubris through domineering behavior, male leaders often display sexual recklessness, leading to scandals that can jeopardize their legacies and administrations.
Historical Case Studies
George Washington: A Monogamous Myth?
Lister begins with George Washington, the first U.S. President, challenging the popular myth of his purity:
Eleanor Herman [09:32]: "The alleged affair between George Washington and Sally Fairfax is more of a 'nothing burger.' Washington wrote affectionate letters but never acted on his crush. He married Martha Custis and maintained a seemingly monogamous relationship."
Herman concludes that Washington was likely "very boring sexually," debunking rumors of infidelity and emphasizing his commitment to his marriage.
Thomas Jefferson: Troubled Legacy
Transitioning to Thomas Jefferson, Herman paints a starkly different picture:
Eleanor Herman [11:01]: "Jefferson, despite his brilliance, was not a decent human being. He fathered seven children with Sally Hemings, an enslaved woman, starting when she was just 16."
Lister probes the societal context:
Kate Lister [12:01]: "Was Jefferson’s relationship with Hemings scandalous at the time, given he was a slave owner?"
Herman explains that while such relationships were not uncommon among slave owners, Jefferson faced criticism in non-slaveholding regions. DNA evidence later substantiated Jefferson’s paternity of Hemings’ children, solidifying the historical account.
John F. Kennedy: The Archetype of Presidential Infidelity
No discussion on presidential sex lives would be complete without addressing JFK, whom Herman identifies as the worst offender:
Eleanor Herman [15:52]: "JFK epitomizes sexual depravity in power. His numerous affairs, including high-profile mistresses like Judith Campbell, were reckless and jeopardized national security."
Lister emphasizes the pathological nature of Kennedy’s behavior:
Kate Lister [24:29]: "JFK was sexually morally repugnant, using women as a conveyor belt without regard for their well-being."
Herman details the implications of JFK’s actions, highlighting security risks from his interactions with women who might have been spies, and the internal chaos it caused within the White House.
LGBTQ+ Presidents: Breaking the Binary
Exploring beyond heterosexual infidelity, Lister introduces the topic of LGBTQ+ relationships among presidents:
Kate Lister [27:02]: "Has there ever been a gay president?"
Herman discusses James Buchanan, the only lifelong bachelor U.S. President, speculating on his relationship with William Rufus King:
Eleanor Herman [27:18]: "Buchanan and King were lifelong partners, often socialized as a couple, but definitive evidence of a romantic relationship remains speculative."
Regarding Abraham Lincoln, Herman debunks rumors of a homosexual relationship with Joshua Speed, attributing their close friendship to the era’s common sleeping arrangements rather than a romantic bond.
Female Leaders and the Sexual Scandal Gap
Lister questions why female leaders seemingly lack similar sexual scandals:
Kate Lister [39:15]: "Why haven’t female leaders experienced the same sexual scandals?"
Herman attributes this disparity to societal double standards:
Eleanor Herman [39:28]: "Women in power face vastly different standards. A female Prime Minister with multiple partners wouldn’t be tolerated the way male counterparts have been."
She underscores that while men’s overweening sexuality in power positions attracts scandal, female leaders remain largely scandal-free, highlighting the persistent gender biases in societal expectations.
Modern Implications: Will History Repeat?
As the episode concludes, Lister and Herman ponder the future of political scandals in the digital age:
Kate Lister [37:20]: "With the internet and tabloid journalism, will modern presidents learn from historical lessons, or will they continue their reckless behavior?"
Herman remains pessimistic:
Eleanor Herman [37:50]: "Hubris Syndrome is too ingrained. Modern scrutiny hasn’t significantly curbed the entitlement and recklessness of powerful men. Additionally, voter priorities have shifted, often overlooking personal scandals in favor of political interests."
Concluding Insights
In wrapping up, Lister and Herman highlight rare instances of presidential fidelity and strong marital bonds, citing Jimmy Carter and Ronald Reagan as examples:
Eleanor Herman [39:58]: "Jimmy and Rosalind Carter had an 80-year marriage—one of the sweetest political partnerships. Similarly, the Reagans adored each other, with their strong bond not attracting scandal."
Herman emphasizes that such relationships, free from infidelity, stand out precisely because they defy the prevalent patterns among powerful men.
Final Thoughts
This episode of Betwixt The Sheets provides a nuanced exploration of the intersection between power and sexuality in American presidential history. Through Eleanor Herman’s scholarly insights and Kate Lister’s engaging questioning, listeners gain a deeper understanding of how personal lives can both influence and reflect broader societal norms and political dynamics.
For those intrigued by this discussion, Eleanor Herman can be reached at eleanorherman.com for more information on her research and publications.
Produced by Stuart Beckwith and edited by Tom Delaghi, this episode is part of the Betwixt The Sheets series by History Hit.