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- [00:00]
A
Did you know that parents rank teaching financial literacy as the toughest life skill? That's where Greenlight comes in. The debit card and money app made for families. With Greenlight, you can send money to kids quickly, set up chores, automate allowance, and track spending with real time notifications. Kids learn how to earn, save, and spend responsibly while parents have peace of mind knowing smart money habits are being built with guardrails in place. Try Greenlight risk free today@greenlight.com TryGreenlight that's greenlight.com TryGreenlight.
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B
It's bigfoot collectors club with michael and riley. I know a story of highest rangeness or two. Let's do this.
- [00:58]
C
Hey, everybody. Welcome. Nice. I was gonna. I was gonna go with, like, rolling in from a conversation that we were just having, but I was like, I don't want to. Whatever. And then I. I overcompensated by hitting the intro way too hard. Hey, everybody. Like Beetlejuice.
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B
Incredible.
- [01:22]
C
Oh, God, we're a little punchy. Riley was working Grammys all last week, so. Yes, you know, we're hanging in there. But I'm so excited because we have an awesome guest that we're. I'm. I'm truly. I've been looking forward to this. This episode for a few days now. Hi, everybody. Welcome to Bigfoot Collectors Club, the show where we talk to amazing guests about their personal paranormal history and share stories of high strangeness. I'm Your host, Michael McMillan, and with me always is the Exorcist. E gg s o r C I.
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D
S I don't understand the egg connection, but I will.
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C
You hate eggs. You're the eggsorcist.
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D
Oh, well, just hard boiled eggs.
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C
Oh, just hard boiled eggs. I thought it was all hard boiled eggs are.
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D
I mean, they're acceptable, but hard boil, it's. It's. That's a hard pass.
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C
Okay, that's good.
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D
Riley Bray. Hi, guys.
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C
Hi, Riley. That was submitted by Derek Cole Draws over on the Discord.
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D
You got Derek.
- [02:15]
C
Nice, good buddy. He also called you the poultry guys. That was an alt. Okay.
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B
Okay.
- [02:21]
C
That's also good. We're going to skip right past Club Housekeeping. We're going to get right into the welcoming. Our guest this week is a writer, psychic, and initiated witch exploring spirituality, spirituality, the occult and the paranormal club. Scouts of all timelines, Please welcome Celeste Mott to the clubhouse. Celeste, hello.
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B
Nice to meet you. Hello. Wonderful to be here. Super excited. I love how quickly this all came together.
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C
I know.
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B
Timelines aligned. It was great.
- [02:54]
C
It Just sort of happened. It's one of those rare things where I don't even know why I hadn't seen any of your stuff before, but I was going through that old. For you on the. On the BCC Instagram. You popped up. I think I watched one, like, half of one of your things. I was like, okay, I'm in. We gotta get. We have to talk to this lady.
- [03:16]
B
The system's working, I guess. Yeah. I went to ground for a while there. Like, last year. I was not posting a whole ton. I got real burned out on social media. So I was hiding from you on purpose, you know?
- [03:28]
D
Yeah.
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C
You thought 2025 was bad. Get ready for 2026. Well, let's. Let's just get right into it. First of all, tell us a little bit about yourself, where are you from and where are you right now, and a little bit about your work. But I have question after question after question for you.
- [03:46]
B
Perfect. Yeah. So I was. I'm not from America originally. I've been in the States for about. It'll be 14 years this August, so, like a chunk of time at this point. But I was born in the UK, lived there until I was about 10, and then I moved to Australia. So I spent most of my teen years and young adulthood in Perth on the west coast of Australia, which, if anyone's ever been, is really fucking boring. There's not a lot going on there at all for a weirdo, anyway. You know, there's a beautiful beach. Lots of beautiful beaches. But as you can tell, that's not as divine that tan, I could say. Right? I know I fry when I go outside in the sun, so, yeah, that's sort of my lineage, I guess, in terms of where I've been and bouncing around. Came to New Orleans, which is where I live now in 2012, and I've been here ever since. It's the only place in the US I've ever lived.
- [04:40]
C
Celeste, I need you to do me a big favor.
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B
Yeah. Am I vulnerable?
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C
Don't listen to any of our Australian accents that we may have done on the show over the years. Just don't.
- [04:52]
B
Just. They're probably beautiful and amazing. Honestly, it's not a hard one. It's not a hard one to do. You just gotta.
- [04:59]
C
I'm, you know, better. I'm better with a Kiwi accent, but Australian still avoid. Yeah, but I'm not gonna do any right now because I don't want to insult anybody.
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B
I'll slip into it. You just gotta get it up in the top of Your throat and like, it's fine. Yeah.
- [05:15]
C
I love that. When you go, do you go back to Australia much?
- [05:20]
B
I haven't been back a whole ton, I would say, since I moved, maybe three times. It's such a long, arduous flight and it's, like, expensive to go back, you know, and just finding the time to get off work and out of responsibilities. But when I go back, yeah, the accent hits me like a ton of bricks immediately. I was on that phone call to a client the other day who was from Australia, and I warned her. Four minutes in, I was like, listen, I'm not making fun of you, but it will come back just talking to you. She was like, it's fine.
- [05:49]
C
Did I ever tell you, Riley, about the time when. So the psychologist that I'm going to marry, she and I were talking and I was teasing her because she has. She was born and raised in Burbank, so she has a bit of a Valley girl accent, and I was teasing her about that. And she goes, oh, I'm from Kansas. And she goes, well, you. Sometimes you sound like a hick. And I was like, fair enough. It's true, you know, especially when I go back to the Midwest. It was very funny.
- [06:20]
B
About accents, really. Like, they do, they. They slip and they slide all over the place. And I think, because I've been in three sort of major places with very different accents and culture across the course of my life, it's just all over the place. So people in my comments all the time are like, where are you from? What's going on? Somebody in the comments recently of a YouTube thing I did said, she's lying. She's not from Australia. Why would I lie about that? Of all. Of all the things to make up, that's. That's where you're going, all right, yeah.
- [06:50]
C
Yeah, I'm a witch. Why would I lie about being Australian? This makes no sense.
- [06:55]
B
That's the unbelievable part. All the other shit you said about vampires, supernatural. Yeah. But Australia, Australia.
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C
So tell us a little bit about how you got initiated into this world. What was your path in becoming a witch?
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B
Yeah, so, I mean, I've had a very strong interest in the paranormal and witchcraft from a very, very young age. I would say, for me, it definitely felt like sort of what I would call initiation by spirit from a really young age. And I think part of that was I grew up in a part of the UK that was very rural. I lived in, like, a tiny little village in the Cotswolds. Very fairy tale, you know, the kind of stuff that Americans like jizz their pants over. They're like, what is that? Oh, it's the real England, you know, and in the 90s, so very quiet, very rural, very connected to the land. And I spent a lot of time, you know, playing in the woods and walking around and investigating all these really historic sites of high strangeness, you know, fairy rings and stones and stuff like that. So from a young age it was sort of resonant with me. And then as I got a little older, I started thinking, well, I mean, is it just stories or is there more to that? And, you know, you graduate to bigger and better libraries the older you get with like scarier and weirder books. So finally being able to find more material that was, you know, speaking to the real experience of witchcraft, rather than just these as storybooks about or folktales or mythology. And so really just absorbing stuff that way. It wasn't until I moved to America probably that I found a really concrete in person community because again, where I grew up in Perth, especially in the 90s, was pretty, just pretty isolated from other people. I mean, Perth technically, like by mathematics is the most isolated city in the world. So. Yeah, so especially sort of in the early Internet time, there was just not a lot going on. There were pagan communities, but a lot of them were kind of sketchy, you know, so a lot of old men being like, come to my skyclad ritual, babe?
- [09:10]
C
No, thank you.
- [09:10]
B
Oh, you're 14? Yeah, no, thank you. Right. Bad times. So I kept to myself a lot until I moved out to the US and then at that point I wound up in New Orleans and obviously massive occult community down here. And I was fortunate to connect with a lot of really, really cool people.
- [09:27]
C
And this whole time, are you absorbing folklore from place to place as you. I mean, obviously you said you were growing up near fairy circles and all of that stuff, because Australia has a lot of that too. You know, they have the yaoi and they have all sorts of the dreaming and all of that stuff. So are you, are you coming in? I know you mentioned like you got into a little bit of the darker and scarier stuff as you got older, but in terms of like the local folklore and like the energy of where you're at, are you picking up and tapping into that as you're, as you're moving from, from place to place? Because then you end up in New Orleans, which is like.
- [10:04]
B
Yeah, right, Like a hundred. Yeah. Down here things are crazy. I will say for me personally, and I feel kind of bad saying this But I had a really hard time adjusting to being in Australia. It wasn't really my choice, you know, I was 10 when I moved. It wasn't my choice to relocate, obviously. Neither should it be a 10 year old's choice whether or not I moved somewhere. Mother, father, we are going to Perth, right? Let's up sticks right now. But yeah, I felt very uprooted. I felt very disconnected actually from like my culture and my kind of personal mythos and the spirits, I guess in retrospect that I had felt most connected to really weren't present in the same way in Australia. And it's, it's sad because like you said, there is such a rich, rich mythology and folklore on the land, especially with indigenous Australian stuff. You know, it's, it's incredibly vibrant and powerful, but I didn't feel very connected to it. And I think, you know, it kind of makes sense in some ways because that's not my stuff, right? It's not my people's stuff. So it tracks that I wouldn't immediately mesh with it. But yeah, Perth felt very spiritually dead for me in a lot of ways. And I think that's a big part of what motivated me to try and leave. Basically I was like, I gotta get out of here because I need to reconnect with what feels visceral and feels connected. And I just wasn't feeling it in that way pretty much. I mean, I obviously was into the occult and studying witchcraft as a teenager and a young person. But in terms of connectivity, it did not feel particularly vibrant for me down there.
- [11:39]
C
You mentioned being initiated, you felt sort of through spiritual means. Then you said you missed the spirituality that you were connected to in the uk. Was that Fae energy? Was it something specific to you? Is there a story there? Did you have a guide of some sort that, that you could talk to?
- [12:01]
B
Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. So it's funny because I think with a lot of high strangeness experiences, right, especially if you start having those experiences as a child or for a young person, we don't really know what to do with them and we don't know how to categorize. So I was having all these experiences from a young age. And then it kicked into gear when I was a teenager, which ironically, at that point I was detached from the land that I consider kind of my, my land, you know, and. But I didn't know what to do with them. I didn't know what framework to put on them. It was an experience, but I didn't understand it. And I was trying, trying Desperately to find a container that made sense. So it's funny that you ask because at the time I wouldn't have considered it fae necessarily or like connected to fairy. I think I was drawn to that stuff as a, as a small child. I mean, what small child is not entranced by fairy tales, right? But I didn't think of it that way. It got instead grafted onto this whole vampire mythos.
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C
Ooh, interesting.
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B
Okay, but, but then, you know, in, in 2020, 2019, 2020. I weirdly enough got swept back up into the what I would call like the high strangeness current. And I started to realize that a lot of what I had experienced was. Was fairy. So I call my practice now. You know, it's somewhere between folkloric witchcraft, traditional witchcraft and fairy faith. And that's sort of where I fall on the spectrum.
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C
That's cool.
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B
I mean, I think it's been a journey.
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C
I think there are. I could be wrong. I can't. You know, I did do some vampire research at one point in my life, but I do think that, I mean there is some like connection between vampires and the fae and them sort of being like a branch of the fae, at least their magic or dark magic, however you want to call it. You know, there's the dowing she that I think have a little bit of, you know, relationship to what, what we would modernly call a vampire in some aspects. But what, what were these experiences that you were having? Specific. Can you talk specifically about them?
- [14:05]
B
Yeah, absolutely. So from a young age I had a lot of problems with sleep. I was struggling a lot to sleep at night. I was having a lot of weird sort of lucidity in dreams, but also kind of out of body experiences. Stuff that also in retrospect I look back and I go over the beats of the experience and I think, well, that's really similar to abductee experiences as well. You know, waking up in the night with lights in the room, waking up with not sleep paralysis but a sense of like fear and you know, a visceral sense of something being very wrong but not really knowing what the wrongness is or where it's coming from because there's nothing viscerally that makes sense. And repeated dreams of, you know, a figure, a spirit, seeing shadow figures, things like that. A lot of it's a little bit nebulous when I was younger, but the older I got, the more concrete it became. Until in my sort of mid to late teens I started experiencing a lot of hypnagogic hallucinations. I was seeing, you know, lights very frequently. I remember one time in Perth, I woke up in the middle of the night, turned over and there was just a being, almost like a cookie cutter of a man shape, you know, but very, very tall, you know, like 8ft tall, but like it had been punched out of reality and it was just full of light. There was no discernible feature. It was just this being of light. And I remember rolling over, looking at it, assessing whether or not I was awake and concluding that I probably was. And at that point so many weird things were happening that I literally just went, I nope, nope, I'm not dealing with that today. I rolled over, I was like, fuck you, I'm going to sleep, goodbye. But it was recurrences like that over and over again over the course of, you know, my young adulthood. And it really started to make me question my sanity, to be honest, especially as a younger person. I, you know, I saw neurologists, I saw doctors, I said, I'm having these weird experiences. Oftentimes they are linked to, they are linked sometimes, you know, to being in bed or being almost asleep. So is there something wrong with me neurologically? I was waking up in the morning, I was talking about this recently on, on the Internet. But waking up and feeling like something had been removed from my brain, it's.
- [16:39]
C
Whoa, it's the weirdest thing.
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B
I don't know if you guys have heard anybody else talk about that. If so, I would love to hear from them.
- [16:46]
C
No, it's usually the opposite. Like they implanted something in me. You know what I mean?
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B
Yeah. And I mean, not physically, I guess. I mean, hopefully not. Right. But this feeling of something has been taken and I don't know what it is, but I know that something's missing that should be there. Almost like that feeling of when you walk into a room and you think, oh fuck, I came in here for something, but what the fuck was it? It was like that, but dialed up to like a thousand, very disconcerting. And so I went to see a neurologist and I said, I feel like something's wrong with my brain. And everything came back totally clear.
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C
So you were obviously telling the adults in your life to get to a doctor, like, hey, something's going on with me and I can't figure it out.
- [17:31]
B
Yeah, absolutely. And you know, my mom is a very, she, I would say she's an open minded person, but she's not, she's not. Woo. Really. You know, she was raised Catholic, she left the Catholic church, but definitely is Still a, a God botherer, as she would put it. You know, doesn't go to church, but definitely believes in Jesus. But she was having some weird experiences in some of the houses we lived in in Australia as well.
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C
Really?
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B
Yeah. So it's hard to say, you know, where does that come from? Was it, is it the place and the space, or is it something that's generated sometimes from an individual in that space? Where does the high strangeness come from? I guess that's been a lifelong question for me.
- [18:15]
C
Well, let's hold that question and we'll take a quick break and come right back. So the question of high strangeness and, and what might actually be going on now. Do you have, have you ever. I want to dip back to this light being for a minute because it's so rare, I feel like, to go from seeing shadow people to light people, you know, But I, but also as you were talking about the shadow people and, and, and the like frozen and all of that stuff and the stuff that we talk about when we get into sleep paralysis again. Correlation between vampires and aliens as well. They, you know, you know, Count Dracula comes through the window the middle of the night. You're hypnotized, you're glamoured, you're not able to, you know, you fall under his command. You can't, you can't move. There's he. Vampires draw blood from you, you know, aliens do experimentations on you. So there's like all sorts of parallels working here, just making notes as we go along for everybody at home. But this light being, has this light being come back in any form?
- [19:30]
B
Not that I'm aware of. It really was the strangest thing. I've never seen anything quite like that since. And the really weird part was this was at this point in time I had moved out by myself into this apartment that I was living in, in Australia. I was living on my own and I was really into the goth scene, going out and doing goth clubbing a lot. Super fun time. And I remember I was at this party, I must have been about 21 or 22, and I was at a party one night in my same kind of general neighborhood at a friend's house was the wee hours of the morning, you know, everyone's wasted. And I was telling this story about the light being to just this group of people. And this girl who I'd never met before leans across the table and is like, shut up. What the fuck did you say? I said, yeah, it was really weird. It was just this big man shaped thing of light. She said, where the fuck do you live? And I said, oh, you know, I live down on York street in Inglewood. And she said, I lived down the street from you 10 years ago, and me and my sister saw that same thing. No. Yeah. And I don't know. Never had a conversation with this girl before or since. Don't know who she was. Really weird. Really, really weird.
- [20:40]
C
We're gonna do a quick googs Light being man Perth, Australia. See if anything pops up on the search there. R. Maybe you can take. Take that over. See if you can find anything but light being stories in Perth. You never know stuff. Yeah, do a quick go. So being in the goth scene, did that ultimately take you to New Orleans? Is that what kind of sort of like, okay, I'm a witch, I'm into goth stuff. And you're getting into vampires. Is that what brought you to New Orleans? Were you just like, it's time to leave Australia?
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B
Yeah. You know, when you punch enough things off the bingo card, Goth into vampires, they actually just transport you to New Orleans. So, like, that's where you supposed to. They just come get you.
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C
There's like a loopholes in your ticket.
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B
Yeah. They black bag you. Yeah.
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C
They like send you a box of beignets and then instructions on how to get your stuff to the French Quarter.
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B
So kind of, in a way. Yeah. So, I mean, I guess being in the goth scene in part was how I came to be so, like, enamored of the work of Anne Rice. I mean, I discovered Anne Rice when I was pretty young, like about 13, 14. But that definitely coalesced with all the goth stuff and then that plus this weird vampire cult situation that I was in that I know we're going to talk about eventually. Plus, yeah, just really being overpowered, never really feeling. I mean, I had such a truly do have some wonderful friends still who live there and I love them dearly. And the goth community down there, like, surprisingly, considering it's a very hot, dry place. Goth community in Australia, but Perth, particularly Chef's Kiss. Beautiful. Go to goth clubs down to Perth, everybody, if you ever. If you're there. But yeah, I just never felt at home there. It didn't feel like where I was supposed to be. So I knew, you know, pretty early on that I wanted to go to New Orleans. I had visited a couple times. I told my mom, I was like, I'm gonna move there. I'm gonna relocate. She was like, yeah, okay, okay, Mitch, how are you gonna do that? And then, yeah, I made it happen. I did a Ritual, actually, a witchcraft ritual to open that doorway for myself. And then about seven years after the ritual, I made it happen. So.
- [23:00]
C
Nice reminder. Be patient. Sometimes rituals don't happen in a week.
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B
100%, you gotta be patient. You gotta do the material, mundane work on the back end. But you do all those things, miracles can happen.
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C
So what was the miracle to get you there?
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B
Graduate school.
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C
Yeah. Nice.
- [23:22]
B
Yeah. So I applied. I'm a writer, as I said, and I wanted to go do an mfa, largely just because I wanted time to write. I was working, you know, a series of shitty retail jobs and, like, hating my life and didn't want to just rot away beachside for the rest of my life, so. Applied to a bunch of graduate schools in America. Figured, okay, anywhere in America is closer to New Orleans than I currently am, so let's just try it. But the only program that accepted me with a full ride scholarship, no cost to the tuition at all, was the University of New Orleans.
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C
No way. That's where the spell came in handy. Wow. Full fucking ride. That's so cool.
- [24:04]
B
Cost me basically nothing.
- [24:06]
C
Wow. Wow, that is really cool. Riley, before we move too far into New Orleans, any hits on the Light man of Perth, Australia?
- [24:15]
D
I can't say that I found it.
- [24:17]
B
Where's the Light Man? Okay, if anyone's listening to this and they know about the Light man, gotta holler at us.
- [24:23]
C
Let's just. We're gonna. Now that we've said this, we're gonna get like three more encounter stories. You know, we'll. We'll have occurred just because we spoke about it on.
- [24:32]
D
On.
- [24:32]
B
That's right.
- [24:33]
C
On the podcast. Yeah. Okay, so you're in New Orleans, you're in school, and I know at some point you become aware of an Anne Rice vampire cult.
- [24:45]
B
Yeah, so that. Actually, that happened before. That happened when I was back in Australia. I joined that. That cult when I was like 6, 16, 17.
- [24:54]
C
No way. Okay, so we're still in Perth, Riley. If anything else pops up in the Light man, just keep us abreast. Okay.
- [25:00]
D
Okay.
- [25:00]
B
Stay on the light.
- [25:01]
C
Stay on the light.
- [25:02]
B
Really important.
- [25:03]
C
Leave a light on for the Light Man.
- [25:06]
D
I'm on the Reddit Earth page right now.
- [25:09]
B
There's some great stuff on there. I'm sure he's gonna get something.
- [25:13]
C
Okay, so you. You. You join a vampire cult based on Anne Rice's work in Australia? Like, not even. Like, I would just assume that. And I did just assume that happened in New Orleans, but no.
- [25:29]
B
Well, I mean, it was American based. This is this beautiful thing about The Internet, right? So everything's so global and we're. And we're talking Y2K Internet, which as I've been stress, everybody younger than me is not the same as the Internet of 2026.
- [25:43]
C
So you were on websites that were all black pages, written in like red, cartoonishly bloody fonts, gifts of blood dripping.
- [25:52]
B
Down and little flaming torches. Yeah, all that. The midis that just looped and looped and looped. So you wanted to like, punch your speakers out of your window. Yeah, good times. But it was, you know, it was an interesting space to be on as a young person because again, like, I was a weird kid, right? I was a little weird goth kid who was into witchcraft and ghosts and the paranormal. And most of my town was like blonde surfer chicks who spent all their time outside. So I was not the same as them, shockingly. And the Internet presented this opportunity to connect with people who felt like they understood me. It was this beautiful sort of realm of possibility where everything seemed a little spooky. The Y2K Internet was a little spooky just by default because we didn't have the same sort of surveillance that we have now. And it wasn't so commercial and advertisement based and stuff.
- [26:50]
D
Yeah, more mysterious.
- [26:51]
B
It was kind of mysterious.
- [26:53]
D
Uncovering corners and things like that.
- [26:55]
B
Yeah. And kind of DIY in a way that I feel like the Internet is not as diy. I think we're trying to bring it back. I think people are trying to reclaim the DIY ethos of. Of the early Internet. But yes. So I was poking around, you know, vampires real. Are vampires real? And rice Vampires real Vampires real on the Internet, you know, is Lestat out there?
- [27:14]
C
Can he kiss me near me?
- [27:15]
B
Yeah, pretty much, yeah. Hot vampires in my area was the vibe. And I came across, you know, a bunch of weird forums that at the time there were so many sort of weird little fringe groups popping up and, you know, groups of sanguinarian vampires who are people who really do drink human blood. And there were these websites and forums telling you, like, oh, if you're. If you're a weird teenager who experiences the following symptoms, maybe you're actually a vampire, like all sorts of crazy shit. But in the midst of all that.
- [27:45]
C
Like, I do hate the sun.
- [27:47]
B
Yeah, I hate the sun. I'm a little anemic to keep talking. Tell me more. Tell me how I'm special. But yeah. So in the midst of all that, I found this website that was claiming to be run by like the real Anne Rice vampires. And, you know, even as A young child. My knee jerk was like, yeah, okay, all right. But I was interested, you know, I was like, let's see what it's all about. Who wouldn't be? And you know, I'm a card carrying member of the nerd club. I play D and D. Like, I understood the concept of role playing. This is a critique that's been leveled against me on the Internet recently since I've started talking about that. Do you not understand what role play is? Like, look at me. Do I, do I understand what roleplay is? Please, come on, let me get my 20 sided dice out. You don't want, you don't want that from me. But this was different because they were saying, you know, no, this like explicitly saying, this is not a roleplay site, you know, and you weren't allowed to join and pretend to be a character. I couldn't join and say, oh yeah, I'm a 500 year old vampire too, bro. Trust me, bro, you had to just be you. And then the moderators of this forum were the vampires. And you know, I joined, I was intrigued, but still highly skeptical. But there were so many people on this website, people much older than me, people who had real jobs, people who had grandchildren and children, you know, who were saying, no, this is all very real. We've met the vampires in real life. You know, here's the proof, here's the evidence, here's the marks on my body from where this vampire bit me. Like this is the real deal.
- [29:24]
C
And is all the lore just Interview with vampire, Vampire, Lestat, Queen of the Damned? I mean, is it, Is that what the lore is? Or is it. Has it. Did it branch out of the books into its own thing?
- [29:37]
B
It definitely branched out into its own thing. The Anne Rice lore was sort of the foundation of everything and then it grew from there. So at the time that the forum was created, which I think from memory was around 2001 or 2002, I don't think Anne had even published like Blackwood Farm was the book, I think that came out in 2004. So it was, she was mid. Still writing the books at the point in time that this forum emerged. So they were taking the canon, if you will, but definitely building upon it. I mean, they started bringing in original characters and all sorts of stuff. And the lore itself on the website and the forum in the cult got very convoluted. It became, you know, over a course of, you know, the decade that I was involved, very strange. And the weirdest part, and this is something that, you know, I Was excited to talk to you guys about because you understand high strangeness and not everybody does, but they were talking about tulpas and they were talking about, you know, Tibetan mysticism and all sorts of things that. But as an adult who's now studied the occult in depth, I'm like, wait a second. That's really weird. Why would this roleplay forum you know of, that's just a fan forum of old women pretending to be vampires on the Internet. Why are they talking about tulpits? Why are they talking about egregors? Why are they do. Like, is this entire thing a narrative magic experiment? Is it a psyop? Like, what are we doing here? It got very strange.
- [31:14]
C
And is it. Would. Is it women running it? Were women running this? Who was in charge, really? Okay, yeah. Give us some of the. Give us some of the real world, like, backstory of what. What was going on here? What made it a cult?
- [31:28]
B
Yeah. So I knew none of this, obviously, at the time. I think, like I said, I joined when I was about 16 and I was in it until I was in my sort of mid ish twenties. So you're.
- [31:38]
C
You're just online or are you going to meetups? Are you being all the way in Perth? Did you have any physical connection with.
- [31:45]
B
With the group, go into meetups? So the number of times that I traveled to New Orleans before finally moving here were all for cult meetups.
- [31:54]
C
Wow. Okay.
- [31:55]
B
Yeah. Yeah. And granted, I don't know that any of the people who actually ran the joint were ever there, but it was sort of a control mechanism. You know, I think it was like, well, we've created this space, this digital third space, this imaginal narrative magic hyper sigil. What can we make people do? Can we through our control, essentially, and the stories we're telling make a bunch of people from all over the world meet up in New Orleans? And can we generate for them experiences that they're going to report? Because half the people in this cult were reporting. Yeah, I saw someone in my room last night. I've been waking up with bruises on my body. We would be in New Orleans together and we would, you know, see things as a group. We would have experiences. And in retrospect, I look at it and I say, well, the power of the mind and the power of human consciousness is incredible. Like, that's, in my opinion, a large part of why magic works. But what was that? You know, like, did we create high strangeness by the power of generative belief? Like, is that what happened? What was occurring here? It was very, very weird.
- [33:07]
C
Was it stuff that you were seeing, like, intentional calling upon in some kind of ritual, or is it just stuff like we're all hanging out, we're doing vampire stuff, and then we look across the room and we see, like a glowing orb. Like, what kind of stuff are you seeing?
- [33:21]
B
So mostly the sort of second example is closer. You know, we would all be out and about, running around the French Quarter, having a great time, hissing at people. Hissing at people. Chewing people's ankles as they walked by. You know, you get it. Yeah.
- [33:39]
C
I know.
- [33:39]
B
You've been there. We've all been there, so. We've all been there, so. Yeah. But we would, you know, we would be going to these places, going to New Orleans, going to, you know, other places in the United States. I went to New York a couple of times with these people as well, because some of the vampires supposedly lived in New York.
- [33:59]
C
I knew there were some New York vampire clubs that was like a big city.
- [34:02]
B
There are. It's true. Yeah.
- [34:04]
C
2000S especially.
- [34:05]
B
Absolutely. And so we would do all these things, and I think collectively we would be expecting to see something. I mean, we would have the vampires in the cult, the leaders of the cult. Right. Telling us, oh, we're there too, and maybe you'll see us. We're going to follow your group around. We're going to kind of stalk you from the shadows. Sometimes these people would go to the extent of leaving people roses in their hotel rooms or sending people, you know, books and things when they were visiting the city to kind of further that fictional narrative that we were all participating in. So we would. We would see shadowy figures, we would sense, you know, people following us. We would. A couple of times we would see people out in the French Quarter and be like, holy shit, that really looks like, you know, Lestat, or that really looks like Armand.
- [34:57]
C
So you think. So at this stage, the leaders are Armand Louis Lestat, characters from. From the books. That's. That's what. That's what everyone is. That's the agreed reality. Agreed upon reality. And were you at this point fully buying into it? Or were you like, okay, this is weird, because I know this to be fiction, but it's also. Now it's crossing over into reality. Is this a. In other words, are you experiencing what you think is a fictional incursion of some kind of. To borrow a term from our friend Joshua?
- [35:34]
B
Joshua Cutchen. Yeah, man, I gotta tell you, when Fourth Wall Phantoms came out last year and I got a copy of it, I was like, shut the Front door. Holy shit. I messaged him on Instagram. I was like, josh, I need to talk to you. I have many feelings. I think that it was something like that in retrospect. But again, it's strange. At the time, I really wanted to believe it, and I wanted to believe it because my life was not that great. I was not having a great time being alive on planet. Planet Earth. And so the idea that vampires were real and hot vampires were in my area and interested me talking to them.
- [36:12]
C
They're on my fighter and I'm right, right?
- [36:17]
D
And.
- [36:18]
B
And, you know, I thought I was told that they were coming into my room at night and, like, sucking my blood and that I had vampire blood and that they were in love with me. So it was a very compelling narrative to believe. I wanted to believe it. But I think the whole time I was involved in the culture, I just really couldn't take that final step into complete unquestioning belief. And so that always put me on the back foot because it was uncomfortable to have to live in these two realities simultaneously. The reality where I bought into it because I wanted to, and the reality where I was like, hey, wait a second. And also, they didn't like me for that. You know, there was a lot of pushback from the leaders of this group. Well, why don't you believe what's wrong with you? You've seen it with your own eyes, you know?
- [37:04]
C
And are these all coming to you from, like, emails, from, like, shoot.
- [37:09]
B
Private messages, DMs, you know, in the DMs. Yeah, on the. On the old Timey forum. But the fictional incursion thing, you know, I think that is. So now I have come to realize that if anything was happening that's closer to what it was, you know, or the phenomena. Right. Using a skin or a costume or a foil that it knew was going to appeal to me, because, as I said, in retrospect, some of these experiences that I've had, that the time I was vampire coding, I've now come to kind of code in a different light.
- [37:45]
C
Interesting.
- [37:47]
B
Yeah.
- [37:47]
D
So at what point did you sort of decide, like, okay, this is a cult, and I don't really want to be a part of this? Like, was that a gradual process or was there like a specific sort of moment where you went, went, hey, wait a minute. This isn't really what I thought it was.
- [38:00]
B
Wait a second, wait a second. I'm not getting vampire married. This is a scam. So I think it was probably more of a slow process, and it was Very sort of back and forth, in and out. A lot of the people in my real life were really seriously worried about me. I mean, I wasn't making it a secret to my normie friends that I was having these experiences. And God bless all my friends, they were very understanding and very lovely about it, but they were also like, are you losing your marbles, girl? It seems like you might be losing your morals, which fair. You know, it was definitely doing a. Doing a number on my mental health. It was consuming a large chunk of my life and, you know, getting pretty emotionally distressing. They were telling people to not go to the doctor when they were sick. They told me that when I was really, really unwell, it was because I had vampire blood. They told a friend of mine to not give bone marrow to her aunt who had cancer, because if she gave bone marrow to her aunt, you know, it was vampire blood in her veins and it was gonna fuck the aunt's life up. Or so, you know, bad stuff was happening and that was a bit of a red flag, right? But I think that ultimately what got me out was that there were people who had already left who had started doing this digging and had uncovered some harsh truths, shall we say? And those people, right? Hmm. And those people.
- [39:22]
C
My favorite part of the story is when we pull off the mask.
- [39:26]
B
Mask, right? It's like the Scooby Doo vibe. It was the gold guy who ran the amusement park all along. But, yeah, these people who had left before me were sort of speaking to me and saying, girl, like, here's the evidence. Here's, you know, Facebook profiles, real pictures, chat logs. We can show you where people have confessed things like, you need to get out of this. You are being taken for a ride. And then ultimately, what did it. The final, final nail in the coffin. Not to, you know, pun about it, but. But I traced IP addresses and I found out that the IP address of, you know, Armand and Lestat was the same as. As this supposedly girl around my age who had also been my friend on this forum. But surprise, I find out last year in 2025, that the girl around my age, who was very clearly Lisette and Armand actually at the time, was a 48 year old ex Canadian military veteran. She's now like 68 years old.
- [40:28]
C
Whoa. And did you hit. You hang out with her in person.
- [40:31]
B
Or just that lady I didn't meet in real life?
- [40:34]
C
Yeah, I didn't know. Maybe she was just passed. Passed for being young, you know?
- [40:38]
B
No, she. She kept herself. As far as I know, she never Met anybody. She kept herself very much, you know, detached from everything, but she's still around. She threatened to sue people for talking to me last year. So if she listens to this, she'll be pissed off.
- [40:53]
C
Come as ex Canadian military lad.
- [40:58]
B
Yeah, girl. Get it.
- [41:00]
C
That is wild. Okay, unfortunately, we have to pause again, but when we come back, I got a couple more questions for you, and then I got even more questions for you.
- [41:08]
D
So many questions.
- [41:16]
C
All right, we're back talking to Celeste Mott. So obviously this whole thing turned out to be a ruse. I also love that, that the. They were defeated by. It's kind of like the btk. Like, defeated by, like, not knowing knowledge of just like basic early computer science. Like everything's traceable, you know?
- [41:36]
B
Right.
- [41:38]
C
But so. So obviously the, like, the structure, the infrastructure, all of this stuff was created by. I'm curious if you know why they started this other than to amass power or why did this start?
- [41:53]
B
I don't know for sure. I would love to know. You know, I've been saying on every interview I do about this, like, girl, hit me up if you want to talk about it all these years later, sneak into my DMs. She won't. What I have learned since I had somebody on Instagram actually come into my messages not even that long ago, a couple of weeks ago, and this girl was like, oh, my gosh, is the woman you're talking about? Because I've been using a code name. She said, is. Is. Is Ju. The woman who ran the vampire cult. She said, is it? Is this her real name? And she gave me a real name. And I said, holy shit. How do you know that? And this woman was like, I was on a bunch of different forums with her. She ran a Smallville forum and a True Blood forum.
- [42:39]
C
Of course.
- [42:40]
D
Yeah.
- [42:41]
B
And this girl, you know, had never had anything to do with Anne Rice stuff or Vampire Chronicles stuff, but this woman I was talking to said, yeah, like, I ran into her and all these other parts of fandom, and she said she was always just really controlling and really took everything really, really way too seriously. She ran a charmed for him that she took way fucking too seriously. So it's just her deal, I guess, is like, this is what she's done with her life.
- [43:06]
C
It is such a fascinating. I mean, listen, this person is ill intended and. And I. I would say someone like this would need, you know, needs to get some. Some help. But it is kind of smart too, because you're like, oh, there's already built in groups. I Now have a tool to organize all of them in one place. And now let's see if I can get them to do my bidding. You know, it's, it's a wild swing but like again also sort of like early inner, you know, monkey point poking at early technology like what can I do with this? You know what I mean? And not, you know, I don't know, it's really fascinating to me.
- [43:49]
B
It's got more trick and I think it's escapism too. You know, I don't. Obviously I never knew her. All of the conversations we ever had over a 10 year period. I have no idea who she actually is or what she's really about because everything was a lie. But I assume that just like for the rest of us it was in part escapism. It's just unfortunate that she used it to kind of control and manipulate other.
- [44:14]
C
People and then it obviously got out of control at some point.
- [44:18]
B
Right.
- [44:20]
D
So you've come out of this on the other side and you have all these foundational experiences and then you've been sort of like led astray by this ill intentioned person. But also in that process had more of these experiences and more exposure to the subculture. And also the thing itself, however this high strangeness is presenting itself, how does that then lead you to where you found yourself now and like with your witchcraft practice and latent psychic abilities and all these things like, what's that next bridge like?
- [44:50]
B
Yeah, man, it's been a weird time. It's been a wild ride. So I think what's funny is I was looking back on some old. I keep everything. I'm a meticulous archiver. So all the materials from the cult, like chat logs, aim chat logs, pictures, videos, I have it all on my hard drive, which it's a lot to unpack back but I was going back through some of it last year and it's so funny because there are these chat logs between me and the vampires and other people in this group and they're all saying, you know Celeste, you're a witch. Like you're obviously a witch. You could, you, you're very psychic. And my ass is like, no, I don't think so. I don't like, that's not, that's not a thing. I'm just a silly little guy. Like I was really not. And I am a silly little guy to be clear. But are right. The best people are. But I was not claiming it at all. I, I really, you know, part vampire. Sure. Which, so that journey was weird. Because I got out of the cult. Actually, that kind of coincided right around the time I moved to New Orleans. So I was already out by the time I moved here. And then I kind of put everything away in this lockbox. You know, it was so traumatizing for me, everything I had been through and the way that my legitimate experiences had been sort of leveraged for this narrative. Even thinking about magic or high strangeness or the paranormal was kind of activating. And it didn't feel safe because I was like, wow, this really pushed me to the brink of my, like, my mental health snapping, so I need to put it away. And so I did for quite a while, with intermittent periods of weaving in and out. I was still reading tarot professionally and stuff like that, but I wasn't really engaging fully in my personal practice. And then through a series of sort of strange back and forth events toward the end of, I guess, 2017, 2018, I started coming back into my personal practice more. And then 2020 hit. And this. This was the weirdest thing. I got a reading done by a woman I had been connected with online. We didn't know each other well at the time, which is important context, because she didn't know anything about me. She didn't know this vampire cult stuff, anything like that. But she gave me essentially a mediumship reading, a scrying session. And at the end of this reading, she paused and she said, I am seeing something around you, and I think you're gonna think I'm crazy if I say it, but I really need to tell you that it's there. Is it okay if I say it? And I. Something I. All of my muscles just contracted. I was like. Because I kind of knew intuitively what she was gonna say. And she said, I can see this spirit around you, and it's this, you know, this guy, and he's got, like, auburn hair and, you know, amber eyes, and he's about this tall. And she was like, he seems kind of vampirey. And I was just like, fuck off. Because everything she described was exactly what I had been seeing in dreams and hypnagogic hallucinations for years.
- [48:09]
C
So you had seen or encountered this spiritual figure, this being before?
- [48:15]
B
Yeah, for years and years. And even prior actually to being involved in the cult, I had seen this thing. But when I was in the cult, it got cast into that light, you know.
- [48:25]
C
Right, right. And so what did you do with that information there? And where is this thing now?
- [48:32]
B
I had a mental breakdown about it. I did not. I didn't process It.
- [48:36]
C
Well, fair.
- [48:37]
B
I mean, fair. Not legitimately, but, you know, I spent a good couple of weeks going back through my old journals and, like, feeling a little crazy because it really felt like something that I had tried to ignore, really, and had tried to bury had just come clawing back to the surface of the earth, you know, like the undead, you know, I'm here, bitch. I'm not gonna die, and I'm grabbing your ankles to pull you back to hell. So it was really alarming. But I went and I got some other divinations about it from people that I trusted, people who didn't know anything about me or the situation. And it was verified multiple times. And then I started intentionally trying to reconnect. So around this same time, you know, 20, 20, 2021, at this point, I also got sucked into high strangeness proper by coming into contact with the work of people like Nathan Isaac and Tenny and, you know, Dana and Greg Newkirk and what they were doing with Hellier and which, you know, that's a whole nother thing, because I feel like that's another example of, like, narrative magic, hyper sigil, stirring up high strangeness.
- [49:47]
C
Yeah.
- [49:48]
B
And it felt suddenly like it wasn't the same as being in the cult, but I was like, wow, there are echoes of what I went through that are being mirrored in what's being stirred up in my life now. And all these people I'm coming into contact with. I went down to Kentucky, to Somerset, to do some investigating with a dear friend of mine, Manna Aylin, who has the real Witches of the End Times podcast. And she and I hung out with Nathan and we did, you know, went to the cave down there and all sorts of other. The mind, all sorts of weird shit, and all of it started plugging in to what I had experienced. So what is. Is that spirit that was seen around me? I don't know. You know, I have. I have a skin for it and an identity for it that I relate to it through. But can I conclusively say what it is? No, I don't think we can with. With these experiences of high strangeness. You know, I think that we try our best to understand them cognitively, but I think they resist cognitive classification in some ways, you know, or, like, hardline classification. I was just hearing you talk about it, actually, Michael, on one of the. One of your podcast episodes recently that I was listening to. But that idea of, you know, what is the innate form of these things? Is it just light? You know, what is it? It's Just lens, right. And, you know, he tried to talk to people about it, and they look like. Like you've lost your fucking mind. But I will probably never have an answer of what this all is. But I will say that 2019, 2020 and 2021 were very big years for everything opening back up for me. And I started having insane lucid dreams about, like, Men in Black and figures that looked like the Tulpa entities from Twin Peaks. The Return, like, I call them the Shadow Cops. Like, Smokey Guys in.
- [51:46]
C
The Woodsman. Like, the Woodsman stuff. Oh, that's scary.
- [51:51]
B
I have a. I have a crazy story to tell you about that, actually, if you want to listen to it.
- [51:54]
C
But let's hear it, obviously.
- [51:56]
B
Okay. All right. So all of this gets stirred back up. I go really far down the rabbit hole again around that time again.
- [52:03]
C
Also, like, this timing is also like, thanks, global Pandemic, for giving us so much time to peer within ourselves and.
- [52:11]
B
Beyond the Veil 100%. And I really think, you know, in retrospect, I think that horrifically imposed breathing room that we all got, you know, or many of us got during that time, and like you said, the ability forced, in some cases, to sort of turn within for people who were fortunate.
- [52:32]
C
In that situation, I should say.
- [52:34]
B
Right, exactly. Exactly.
- [52:36]
C
Had the luxury and the privilege to be able to be like, okay, everybody, everything's slow now, so.
- [52:40]
B
Right. God bless all my friends who still had to go to work on their service industry jobs and in healthcare. But I think with so much of the population paused, essentially, I do think it stirred up something in the phenomena. I mean, the phenomena looks at you, if you look at it. And if you have hundreds of thousands of people who are stuck in their houses with not a whole lot going on, and a lot of them are Googling weird conspiracy theories and, like, weird occult shit, it's gonna look back at you. So around that time, I got really into that whole current. I was looking into fairy faith more. I was starting to pick up some of my roots that I had forgotten, connected back to sort of British traditional witchcraft and stuff like that.
- [53:25]
C
Cool.
- [53:27]
B
And as part of all of this, some friends and I, some of my discord people, we all went to Mount Shasta, California.
- [53:34]
C
Hell, yeah.
- [53:37]
B
Which was so great. I mean, I just. I would go to Shasta again in a heartbeat. It's just such a great area, and, of course, epicenter of high strangeness. So we went down there just to kind of do some weird magical experimentation. We were like, fuck it. Let's just see if we can see some UFOs. Let's go do some weird shit in caves. Let's just have a good time.
- [53:55]
C
Yes.
- [53:55]
B
And we went to Plato's Cave, I think that's what it's called, like the place right outside Shasta, and did this beautiful ritual inside this cave. We were just sort of setting an intention and trying to kind of call forth. We had been talking through the spirit box to all these entities for about a year prior. And Shasta was supposed to be the kind of like opening of that, of that current, the true form of connection. So we did this ritual in this cave, really beautiful time. And as we're walking out, we start hearing this weird, like, ritual drumming. We're like, where the fuck is that coming from? So we're walking out of this cave system and we come across this kind of middle aged, you know, hippie looking white dude and this similarly middle aged hippie looking lady.
- [54:42]
C
Not in Mount Shasta.
- [54:44]
B
Can you believe it's so weird Playing this sort of ritual drum and they've got, you know, like a crystal skull set up and like all of this other shit. And it's very kind of New Agey. But the drumming was really beautiful. And so we're walking through and one of the members of our group, Jess, paused and said, hey, do you guys mind if we just stop and listen to the drumming? I think all of the rest of us were like, jess, don't talk to the weirdos in the cave. What are you doing? But these lovely people were like, of course, participate. Come sit down, tune in. So we did that. It was really lovely. Probably only hung out with these people for 15 minutes of that. And when they were finished with their drumming, we had a brief conversation and they said, oh, you know, what are you doing here? We said, oh, we're super into high strangeness. We're kind of doing some weird occult stuff. They were like, dope. And we exchanged, you know, we exchanged Instagram handles or whatever. But we really like to stress we did not have a long conversation. There was not a lot of personal info exchanged. It was just a kind of like, hey, how are you?
- [55:47]
C
Totally.
- [55:48]
B
So. So we leave. This whole year prior, I had been having these recurring dreams about these figures that I call the intergalactic cops. Who are they? I don't know. I will tell you that since I've started talking about them on the Internet, a lot of people have said, oh, yeah, I see those guys too. So that's alarming. No, yeah, I don't like it or affirming.
- [56:09]
C
Depending on.
- [56:09]
D
Yeah.
- [56:10]
B
Affirming and alarming. So they're. And in my dreams anyway, they're these. Yeah. Kind of like the sort of smoke, black smoke in a, in a person suit. They're sort of half men in black, half sort of shadow, smoky figures, very indistinct facial expressions, but very much sort of John Keel esque men in black also. And in my dreams, they're usually coming for me in some way and I typically have to either escape or repel them. I've had dreams where I've been able to like do weird magic in the dream and make them go away.
- [56:44]
C
Fun.
- [56:44]
B
So. Right. So fun, but also horrifying. So that had been happening for a while. Go home, back to the Airbnb we're staying at, you know. And the next morning I get a message from the guy from the cave. And he was like, I am not trying to be weird, but I had a dream about you last night. Which I gotta tell you, when a strange middle aged man you meet in a cave tells you that you're just not sure where that's gonna go as a young woman. So I was like, you know, okay, okay. He said, can we talk about it on the phone? And I was like, that's the weirdest.
- [57:21]
C
Part of it all. The phone.
- [57:24]
B
Can you just tell me the message? But something compelled me. I was like, okay, sure. So we get on the phone and he said, he was like, look, first of all, I'm not a weirdo.
- [57:35]
D
I was like, that's what a weirdo would say.
- [57:38]
B
Yeah, exactly.
- [57:39]
C
A crystal skull in a drum circle at a kid.
- [57:43]
B
You're a weirdo, sir. Sorry. But he said, look, he said, I smoke a lot of weed and I don't dream. Really. He said, I've kind of lost my ability to dream because I smoke so much marijuana. And he said, but I had a dream last night for the first time in literal years and you were in it. And I said, okay, what happened? He said, well, I was part of some sort of opposing group. Like I was part of some kind of police force or something and we were coming for people like you.
- [58:16]
C
Whoa.
- [58:17]
B
And you were my target. And we broke into this like little kind of church area and you were in there with a bunch of other people and I found you and I touched your sleeve and when I touched your sleeve, something passed between us and I realized I couldn't hurt you. I feel emotional talking about it because. And I haven't spoken to this guy since, by the way. I had no idea who this guy is. Is. Can't remember his name. He said something passed between us and I knew I couldn't hurt you and I had to get you out of there. And he said, so I helped you escape. And then my team, these weird shadowy cop figures, were coming for me because I had betrayed them, and I knew they were going to kill me. But it was more important that you got away. So I told you to run. And then they. They. Then they came for me. And I woke up.
- [59:08]
D
Whoa.
- [59:09]
B
And I was like, what? Holy no. No answers to that. Don't know what that's about.
- [59:19]
C
Did you tell him, or did you just keep it to your.
- [59:23]
B
No, I did. I said, I've had. I've had many, many dreams about these shadow cops. And then, yeah, he was just like, well, they. There's clearly maybe a reason that we met. I said, yeah, maybe so. And then literally have not spoken to this guy since he's still on my Instagram. I think if he's listening to this, say hello.
- [59:40]
C
But yeah, drummer dude.
- [59:42]
B
It was not a bit, you know. Cause I was like, is this a bit. You know, is this a weird. Like a very convoluted pickup line?
- [59:48]
C
But literally, how would he know to admit all that stuff? That's so strange. And wouldn't it now? I mean, I can't believe we're already like an hour in. I've barely scratched the surface. This always happens. I'm so bummed. But what. What is. How would you describe yourself as a psychic? Because we've, We've. We've mentioned it a couple times. We've mentioned a couple times in the. In the show. But are you intuitive? Do you see things in the future? Are you a medium? Are you dreaming? What happens? What. What. How are you a psychic?
- [60:24]
B
How.
- [60:26]
C
How. Teach us. How does it manifest? I guess I should say.
- [60:30]
B
Yeah, like all of the above, I guess, in a way. Typically, if I'm working with a client, I'll either do trance, mediumship, and scrying, or I'll use, you know, an external medium, like a tool, like tarot. I like to use tarot because people are at least a little bit familiar with it, usually. And it's a good way to kind of anchor. People get a little creeped out if you just start telling them things. They don't like that. So it's. It's better to use something concret, I find. And it's a good way to channel, you know, what I'm picking up and pulling through. But sometimes, I mean, really, I just kind of know things Oftentimes, and obviously more so if I tap in purposefully, I do see things in trance. Oftentimes it's more spirit perception or perception of ancestors. Sometimes it's future events. Sometimes it's just weird things from people's past that I can pick up on in that trance state. I do talk and connect to spirits in that state as well. Sometimes I have precognitive dreams. I lucid dream a lot. I astral travel in my dreams. So it's a little bit of everything, man.
- [61:39]
D
Is this something that's sort of going on all the time and you focus it in or is it more like you sort of tap into it and turn it on?
- [61:47]
B
Yeah, at this point, it's more kind of a switch that I can flip on and off.
- [61:53]
C
Yeah, it's like a PlayStation Now. You just like, I'm gonna hop.
- [61:59]
B
Because if I have it too open all of the time, which I think was more the case when I was younger, it's very overwhelming. I mean, I don't straight up, I don't leave my house very much. I am kind of a weird shut in. I get all my groceries delivered, I pretty much go see my boyfriend and that's it. And I think part of it is because being around people is very noisy. Even if I have the switch turned off, you know, it's just. It can be pretty overwhelming energetically. So. So, yeah. But I can tune in or tune out and some people are really hard to read. I will say that I've definitely had clients before and for whatever reason, they're just very shielded or blocked and they're harder to. It's harder to pick up on stuff.
- [62:39]
C
You're like, ya, boring.
- [62:42]
B
Yeah, okay.
- [62:44]
D
Not much going on there.
- [62:45]
C
Yeah, boring around. We do have to start to wind this down, but before we get to our closing segment that we have to play because. Because I forgot in the last time we had Chad Lewis on, we ran out of time and then I forgot people got upset. Since we're in the dreaming space and this might be a little bit too. Too much to cram in. I am so intrigued by this concept that you talk about on Instagram about Mall World. And can you tell us a little bit about Mall World, please?
- [63:22]
B
Yeah, I'll keep it as succinct as I can so that we don't, like, piss off all your subscribers. Yeah.
- [63:29]
C
So it wouldn't be the first time. Like I said, you're already mad at me.
- [63:33]
B
Mall World. So, I mean, I certainly didn't come up. I didn't coin the term. But Mall World is this term that people are using to designate shared dream space. And I think, you know, Mall World refers to more than just a shopping mall. It's this interconnected series of dream locations that it turns out a lot of us have dreamed about, and it seems to be particularly common. This is where my tinfoil hat comes on. But people who have ever been involved in a gifted and talented program in high school or elementary school seem to have more dreams about Mall World. So Mall World itself, the main location, is essentially a shopping mall. For me, it tends to look pretty 1980s. There's kind of a sort of. Of neon glass and big ferns.
- [64:19]
C
Starcourt mall from season three of Stranger Things.
- [64:22]
B
100% exactly. I was gonna say that. And then for other people, it seems to be more sort of backrooms esque and kind of creepy, silent, hilly, abandoned mall. Okay. And then there are other locations connected to it. So you've got Mall World. But Mall World usually connects to an airport. The airport's almost like, inside the mall. You have elevators in the mall that are going all over the place, and they can, like, shoot up through the roof like in Cholli and the Chocolate Factory, and they move sideways and move weird. You have Toilet World, which is the landscape of disgusting, gross toilets, which I've.
- [64:53]
C
Never been to Toilet World.
- [64:54]
B
Thank God for that. It's a horrible place. Don't go to Toilet World. And then, you know, beach resort people have. It's very lynchy in the next one, but, like, the thrift store by the highway, which I thought was just a me thing, but people in the comments were like, oh, yeah. And that feels very sort of David lynch coated to me. A lot of these liminal dream locations feel kind of Lynchian, actually. So it turned out, you know, on TikTok last year, this whole conc blew up, and people all over the place were like, holy shit. I thought it was just me. And we're realizing that there's this sort of collective unconscious dream architecture that seems to be common to a massive amount of people. Maybe it's connected to this gifted and talented gate program thing. Maybe it's not. Maybe we're all secret CIA sleeper agents. Maybe we're not. I don't know. Someone accused me of that in the YouTube comments recently. And I was like, I'm not getting paid by the CIA.
- [65:47]
C
We still haven't been accused of being CIA operatives. And we're in year nine of the show now. I'm very upset.
- [65:52]
B
It's only a matter of time. But, yeah, so I decided it would be fun to run essentially a mutual dreaming experiment. I love dreamwork. It's a big part of my practice. I fully believe that we can meet each other in high five in dream space. And I thought, wouldn't it be cool since everyone's already very tapped into this idea of mall work world, if we kind of run a little experiment and just saw what happened when we all tried to. To tune in? So I created a little travel guide with a sigil to use and a meditation to do. And there are 650 people in my Instagram chat doing the mall world experiments. So it's been fun.
- [66:33]
C
Did. And any results?
- [66:35]
B
Yeah. So we're trying to do it as scientifically as possible. I obviously am not a scientist. Shocking, I know. Can you believe? Not a vampire, not a scientist. Not Australian either, apparently, and not in the CIA. Very key, but yeah. So we haven't fully released all the data. Last night actually was our round three. We realized we needed to give people a couple of tries, really, to kind of get in there. But what we have noticed from the data is because since starting the work, the group work, like, 75% of people who responded to my survey said that they have had an increase in lucidity and dream recall and dream vividness. So that was the main finding. The second finding is that of the people who have been really engaged, a huge number of them have, on the appointed nights, dreamed of mall world. So obviously, the power of suggestion and comes into play there a little bit. But I personally, I don't think that's not magic. I think these things are, you know, related. And then a smaller number have seemed to have some overlap with each other in the dream world. Something we did last night. It was suggested to me, someone in the group chat said, hey, what if we also made a little symbol or something that we could all use in the dream or try and sort of bring forth in the dream? So if we see someone who has a. That symbol going on, we know that's one of the group. I said, yeah, cool. All right, let's use a moth or a butterfly. If you see anything to do with that, you see the word written down. You see butterfly wings. Someone's got a butterfly tattoo. That's one of us. That's how we're gonna clue into each other. So there was someone in the group chat who hadn't even read that message. And this morning when she woke up and weighed in, she said, I had the weirdest dream. There were just all these people wearing butterfly wings all Over Mallworld World.
- [68:27]
C
Whoa.
- [68:28]
B
And then she went back and she read it and she went, what the. Because she had not read that message prior. She had no idea that that was the new, like, signal we were using.
- [68:39]
C
That is wild.
- [68:40]
B
Pretty crazy.
- [68:41]
D
That was a very interesting collective experiment in the sort of parallel.
- [68:45]
C
Is it too late for me? Yeah. Can we.
- [68:47]
B
No. Join in? I'll send you. I'll send you guys the PDF. We're gonna do it again. Let's do Mall World. You can report back on the podcast and see what happens.
- [68:54]
C
I would love to, too. It was very funny. I had a synchronicity before this record last night. I was out with a buddy, and then we ran into another acquaintance, and he was like. And I don't know why this man shared this, but he's like, I had the weirdest dream last night. I was in a mall, and I was, like, fighting a bunch of people. Like, there's, like, these people trying to take over the mall, and I had to fight. Fight them off. And out of all the things for them to come up and say, I was like, this is really wild because I'm literally going to interview some. Somebody tomorrow who's been talking about.
- [69:26]
B
About Mall World.
- [69:27]
C
Mall World, a place you go in your dreams.
- [69:30]
B
And that's interesting, too, because this idea of Mall World being a space where, like, where kind of violence takes place or where people are in a kind of struggle. I mean, intergalactic cops turn up for people in Mall World alone.
- [69:43]
C
Exactly. This is why I'm also, like, now, I didn't know about that part, you know, So a couple synchronicities. And this.
- [69:51]
B
This.
- [69:51]
C
This is. This is like somebody who works at the. The bar we were at, and we'll. We'll chat whenever I'm there, but it's not like we, you know, have this, like, close, close rapport. So it was just very funny that they're like, I gotta. He was like, I gotta tell you about this. It was very weird. You know, I really.
- [70:08]
B
I really think it's another point of high strangeness. Truly, I think something's stirring up in the collective unconscious. I don't know what it is. I don't know what it means. I had a message. I. I won't say who it was from, but an actor who's been in a bunch of cool stuff messaged me a couple of days ago and said, oh, my God, I followed you because of this Mall World stuff. And they were like, I'm also someone who is in the GATE program, and I think Something's going on with Mall World. I said I agree.
- [70:38]
C
Something's going on with Mall World. Something's going on with Mall World. All right, well, we're going to take a break. When we come back, we're going to play a little game and send Celeste back into the realm. Realm of lucid dreaming.
- [70:51]
B
Nice.
- [70:58]
C
Okay, Celeste, there's a game that we like to play with all of our guests. If I remember to do it, I'm gonna run down a list of phenomena. Rapid fire. If you're open to it, you're gonna say. Believe it. If you're not open to it, you're gonna say. Now's the time. You gotta make a call. One way or another.
- [71:19]
B
Mother. Okay.
- [71:20]
C
You can always circle back after you're done and say. I do. Want to add a little amendment. Yeah. Some context for this. This is a game that we call. All right, Celeste Mott. On your mark. Get set. Ghosts.
- [71:41]
B
Believe it.
- [71:42]
C
Bigfoot.
- [71:43]
B
Believe it.
- [71:44]
C
UFOs.
- [71:46]
B
Believe it.
- [71:46]
C
The Loch Ness monster. The Bermuda Triangle.
- [71:52]
B
Believe it.
- [71:53]
C
Tarot cards.
- [71:54]
B
Believe it. 100.
- [71:56]
C
Manifestation.
- [71:58]
B
Believe it.
- [71:59]
C
El Chupacabra.
- [72:02]
B
Believe it.
- [72:04]
C
Ouija boards.
- [72:05]
B
Believe it.
- [72:07]
C
Seeing the future.
- [72:08]
B
Believe it.
- [72:09]
C
Out of body experiences.
- [72:11]
B
Believe it.
- [72:12]
C
Dog man.
- [72:17]
B
Believe it.
- [72:19]
C
Goat man.
- [72:20]
B
Believe it.
- [72:21]
C
Sheep Squatch.
- [72:24]
B
I don't know what that is.
- [72:25]
C
It's like a big muscly. Sounds like sheep man. Maybe Bat Squatch.
- [72:34]
B
Oh, Believe it. It sounds good. Good.
- [72:37]
C
Life on other planets.
- [72:39]
B
Believe it.
- [72:40]
C
Life after death.
- [72:41]
B
Believe it.
- [72:42]
C
Wow. Well done. Really good. And really, thank you for sticking to the rules. I really appreciate when guests do that. That was really, really good. Okay, let's circle back to a couple of these. The Bermuda Triangle. Hard believe. What? What's up? What's up with the Bermuda Triangle for you?
- [72:59]
B
Well, I just. I just don't know enough. You know, I don't know what. I don't know about the Bermuda Triangle, but I will say, you know, my partner. My partner works in environmental science and in. In GIS mapping. And I've just learned a lot of weird shit from him. You know, I think that there's a lot of weird stuff going on with electromagnetic fields and weird tidal currents. And I think there could be a Bermuda Triangle explanation that is not paranormal.
- [73:26]
C
Right.
- [73:26]
B
But I definitely think something odd is going on there. And also, I don't trust the government straight up, so. Well, yeah.
- [73:33]
C
More Goatman. You jumped in on a. Believe it. Very quickly. And then we got to Sheep Squad and you're like, what's that? So it's sort of the same thing. But what What. What, What's. Who is Goatman? What does Goatman mean to you, Celeste?
- [73:51]
B
He's a tender lover. No, I don't. I don't know. I don't. I don't have a lot of Goatman stories under my belt either, to be honest. But I think because I had heard more about Goatman than Sheepman, it seemed more plausible. Also, I think God, goats are inherently very strange. They're connected to sort of the current of magic and high strangeness innately just by virtue of being goats. So I'm like, I could believe. I could believe Goatman. That seems great.
- [74:18]
C
Great. I think that's a very fair answer. All right. Well done. So fun to talk to you. I didn't even get to ask you to explain to me what alternate reality games are. I guess I'm going to have to follow. Follow you on Instagram or we're gonna have to have you back at some point.
- [74:36]
B
Have me back. I have more weird to tell you at some point, I'm sure.
- [74:41]
C
Where can people find you everywhere?
- [74:44]
B
In the dreaming. In the dream mall. You can find me all over social media. And your for you page pissing you off, probably. I'm at Celeste Mott Mott on Instagram. I am at Celeste Moth M O T H on TikTok. Celeste Mott on YouTube. Really trying to push my sub stack right now because that's kind of the platform that's waning and I am a writer, so. Celestemot.substack.com okay, great.
- [75:13]
C
And these are all if. Do you have a link tree I can grab? I can put your link tree.
- [75:19]
B
Yeah. Honestly, put in the show my link tree. I will send it to you. I can't remember what it is because I just got a new one, but my website is celestemont.com too, so that's got all those.
- [75:29]
C
Okay, great. Yeah. I'll link all of these in the show notes so people, after they're done, can come find you. And I assume you do readings and stuff like that for people you've mentioned.
- [75:37]
B
I do, yeah. Yeah, you can hire me. You can. I do scrying sessions for people. I do tarot card readings for people. You can hire me to do spell work for you. If you've got a problem you would like to solve with the. The. The magical current, I can do that for you too.
- [75:51]
C
Great. I love it. Okay. Thank you so much, Celeste. You are awesome. Riley, do you want to. Do you have anything to plug before we bounce? You got any shows or anything coming up here? Want people to know about.
- [76:05]
D
This Tommy show coming up but I think this.
- [76:07]
C
Comes out after this will be out next week.
- [76:10]
D
Oh then yeah. If you're in Malibu, come on down to Dreamland on the 20th and see.
- [76:14]
C
Dreamland of all places.
- [76:16]
B
Synchronicity.
- [76:18]
C
Come on. Yeah. So dreamland. February 20th you said? Okay great. Yeah plenty of time. Go see Come on down Tomy or pom poms. I can't remember what you said.
- [76:28]
D
That's Tomi.
- [76:29]
C
Okay okay great while too so good one. Oh God man Tommy is a fun show. Seen Tony to me it's blast another unplug right now just why don't you come over to the other side which you can find at BCC Clubhouse. Get some bonus episodes. Get some ad free channels. Ad free episodes. Get get get some cosmic tracks from Riley. You can find all of that@bcc.supercast.com Celeste MOD thank you so much for being here. Go find all of her work. Go give her a follow on Instagram. I guarantee you you're gonna have an interesting, fun magical time. We will be back next Wednesday with an all new episode. Until then, good night and go get regressed. Bye. See you in my world. In high school, in high school we made a plan to all meet in our school atrium in in a dream and fly around. And did it work? No, we needed more sigils and stuff but it was a weird. We gave up pretty quickly. But we're like we're all going to fly in the atrium on Friday night. You know I love it didn't happen. Just a bunch of theater kids. Just a bunch of theater kids with big wishes.
- [77:32]
D
Yeah, kid can dream.
- [77:34]
B
That's all it is in the occult really is. A bunch of theater kids with big wishes.
- [77:37]
C
So it's true. It's true. Bigfoot Collectors Club is executive produced by Riley Bray and Michael McMillan and engineered and edited by Riley Bray. Our theme song is Come Alone by Suneaters courtesy of Lotus Pool Records. For ad free listening and bonus episodes Every month join BCC Clubhouse on bcc.supercast.com Want to see us watch video episodes and exclusive content on YouTube.com advitbookcollectors.
- [78:16]
E
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