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- [00:00]
Nada Bashan
Fame never interested me. Being on TV never interested me. When I got married, my pictures went viral. An agent called me and he's like, listen, why don't you try it out? I was like, of course not. I'm not a model. During that period, I get a call, why don't you become a TV presenter on NBC? I was like, of course not.
- [00:17]
BiohackIT Host
You, as a Saudi woman, being one of the biggest TV presenters in the country, how your career changed and evolved.
- [00:22]
Nada Bashan
All I do every day on my show is to preach that you need to be financially independent as a woman. You cannot leave a bad husband if you have no money, if you don't
- [00:30]
BiohackIT Host
say the traditional namaz, even if you stop and pray for five minutes within yourself, but to connect to something higher than yourself.
- [00:37]
Nada Bashan
Exactly.
- [00:37]
BiohackIT Host
I want to leave our audience with a tip that you have for women listening about how to take the power back in their lives. Nada Bashan, welcome to biohackit.
- [00:58]
Nada Bashan
Thank you so much for having me. I'm so happy to be here.
- [01:00]
BiohackIT Host
Thank you for flying down from Jeddah to be on the show and go for dinner with me tonight.
- [01:05]
Nada Bashan
I'm excited, actually, about the podcast and the dinner tonight. We have a lot to catch up on.
- [01:09]
BiohackIT Host
So I came across your profile through our common friend, Mimi Gandur. I think it was like a year and a half ago, two years ago. And I've been dying to interview you because I'm just fascinated with Saudi women and how the country's evolution has changed and how Saudi women have becoming out onto the forefront of everything going on. So I want to ask you a little bit more about how the cultural shift happened in Saudi and you as a Saudi woman, being one of the biggest TV presenters in the country, how your career changed and evolved.
- [01:38]
Nada Bashan
Okay, first of all, I'm so glad that Mimi is our common friend, who's actually a classmate since I was in school, you know. So Mimi's someone that's not just a friend. She's like. She's like home. You know what I mean? She's family. The transition, like, from before to now has really, like. I don't think Saudi women are on the map today. I think just the map is on Saudi today. That's why there's a microscope now looking at women there. But I think we've always been strong. We've always been working. We've always been doing so many things. I just think the careers have changed. Before, we had only certain. How can you say, fields? We used to work in education, medical, certain fields. Now with our new Accountants. Women are working in every field. There's so much opportunities. Personally, when I started, when I was growing up, I never thought I would go to the States. For example, I studied in Saudi. I went to Saudi school. I think when I, when I thought of college, I thought I was going to study in Saudi or Europe. The first time I went to the States was when I was actually 17 years old to actually go to college. Like any Saudi father, my father wanted me to be the typical banker, lawyer or doctor. And to him or engineer, there were like four sectors that were like, you know, the safe ones that they would want their daughters to actually, you know, pursue. To be honest, at the time, I didn't even know what I wanted. And he was like, I think if you want to do something different, you should study speech pathology. And I was like, what's speech pathology? And at the time, that was very in. And like, you know, especially ED was very like, the government was really pushing women to study that field. I got there, I got to Boston and I started studying there. And my dad only sent me to Boston because 10 of my friends were going to an all girls college.
- [03:17]
BiohackIT Host
He's like, she's gonna have a tribe with her. She's a tribe.
- [03:19]
Nada Bashan
Yeah. And it was an all girls college for him to be comfortable. And that's how it started. And I went Boston, and we were all Saudi girls from the same school and we all went to different colleges there. And this was a start. Like, it's not like very common for women to go and study abroad. It was kind of new. So I think this is early 2000. Like 2000. It was actually 2000. So this is a shift. These young girls going to study abroad to the US for my, my flight to Boston was the first time ever to go to the States. And obviously while I was there, I realized speech pathology is not really my personality. Clearly, when you sit with me, you do know that is not the field I, I will pursue. I have a double minor in IT though. I didn't know what to do for two years. And then I studied marketing and pr and then I did my master's in management, all in Boston. Leaving and packing my five and a half, six years there was so hard. Packing every box was just, you know, painful. Painful. You know, I met a lot of friends. And when you talk about the transition of me moving from Saudi to the U.S. like, what was so beautiful about it was meeting people from all over the world. Like, I went to summer schools and I met people like for three, four weeks in the summer and we'd meet and we kept in touch. And a lot of them actually went to college in Boston. But the friendships you make in college are very different than the friendships you make in school because first of all, they last. You experience a lot more with friends and growth with the friends you meet in college. There's like this more mature friendship. And I really, till today, I actually have friends from all over the world from college that I'm in touch with, that our kids are friends. And this is such a beautiful. This is such a beautiful time in my life. When I look back at Boston days, like from 2000, 2006, it was the best time. I think that there was no problems at the time. You only thought about, like, where to have lunch and when are you going to submit your essay and if you're going to pass this class or not. These small things were such the beautiful memories. And then I moved back to Saudi. And where do you think I worked? You tell me.
- [05:16]
BiohackIT Host
I mean, you got a corporate job, obviously.
- [05:18]
Nada Bashan
I got a corporate job. I worked in banking for 10 years. 10 years. That's what I was researching.
- [05:23]
BiohackIT Host
I was like. So she went from being a banker, being in finance to being like, I'm going to go on TV now.
- [05:27]
Nada Bashan
I know. You know, it's so weird because, like, I never thought I would want to fulfill my father's dream. I think he really liked the banking and finance field. And I started off in hsbc, in corporate banking. And then they told me, neda, I don't feel that you're like, the bank told me, really think you could be in private banking and investments. So then I moved to the Saudi French bank and then I went to the family office, which is a wealth advisory firm in Bahrain, obviously. While I did all this, I opened a boutique and I called it Newbury because I love Newbury street in Boston. And that was where, like, I would shop. And it was such a nice memory. So my partner and I opened it during my banking time. And so I was, I was always buying. So I'd fly to New York on the weekend and go back to work on Monday on Sunday. At the time, actually it was Thursday. Friday was the weekend. So I'd go for the weekend, do the buying, come back and have a full job, a full day job. And I managed both. And after 10 years in banking, I really felt that I like, gave it my own and there was no interest anymore in the field and I wasn't going to give more. So I decided to continue in retail. And I said as a as an owner of one boutique, I don't think that's really enough knowledge. So I went and worked for a company called Bindawood. And they were like, they had the biggest department store in Jeddah at the time. And I did all the buying for them. Kids, women's, men's, and home. And I went to China and it was on a much bigger scale. And that's when I also opened my boutique, which I called the Huntress. And that stayed. Stayed. That lasted for like, the whole field of retail for me. Stayed for like, I. I've had stores for like 25 years, and I think that was when I closed the doors. Because, you know, boutiques have a shelf life. It's like you cannot really have a boutiques. Boutique that lasts longer than 25 years. With all the changes in the market as well, and online, it was very hard to compete in the end. So I decided it was a time to close at a high, then close with losses. But in general, I've been someone that jumps from, like, we can say one field to another. And I've always.
- [07:24]
BiohackIT Host
Effortlessly as well.
- [07:26]
Nada Bashan
Shockingly, I. I never really thought I would jump into, first of all, retail, and then media for me was very. Something that was out of the question to me. That was not something I ever. That ever interested me. Fame never interested me. Being on TV never interested me. I just drink. When I got married, my pictures went viral, and I had a boutique at the time. So I was like, oh, my God. So, okay, you know what? So let me move this following to my boutique to sell more, to increase sales. This is what I. At the end of the day, why would you want to be on social media if you don't have a product to sell?
- [08:01]
BiohackIT Host
This is how I. Yeah, because it's not a vanity.
- [08:03]
Nada Bashan
Exactly. And a lot of people, like, like it to just show off and to like, you know, to just like, have this perfect image. Image. But to me, it was just more about sales. I come from a trading family, so to me, I just wanted to, like, you know, make people know more about my business and what I do. And then after that, I started getting calls about doing ads. So I didn't understand the concept of why would anyone call me to do an ad? To me, it was just so foreign. And then I. An agent called me and he's like, listen, why don't you try it out? I was like, of course not. Like, I'm not a model. Why would I take pictures of myself? It's so stupid. I was like, I come from a Serious job. Like, I'm a corporate person, I'm an entrepreneur. This is so shallow. This is a shallow field and I'm sure it still is too many.
- [08:47]
BiohackIT Host
I think from the cultures that we come from, we view it as very shallow.
- [08:50]
Nada Bashan
Yeah, exactly. Like both of us, like we look at a page and we see this girl, like she's posing in clothes.
- [08:55]
BiohackIT Host
It's like, what do we do? For me, I still struggle with being. I see myself as a founder and an entrepreneur, not as a content creator. And it's like you see other people online, it's so easy for them to just batch out content. And I'm just like, I really don't have time for this at times and exhaust me. And I was like, I'm here to do business and if this can grow my page for work. But beyond that, I'm not here to batch out content for no reason.
- [09:17]
Nada Bashan
Exactly. For me, this is a business. You either make it a business and you make it an income generating business. But the sad thing about also social media, that people cannot perceive the real you. So in the beginning when I started, I said, I'm gonna give it one year. And in this year, in this year, if I don't make enough this, say, let's say this amount, I will not continue. And then Covid happened. And what did I do during COVID I did what you're doing now. I love the medical field. I think I should have been a dermatologist in another life. Your next career evolution, I will not study anymore. I'm done, I'm done. So I was like, you know, I really have this fascination and interest in plastic surgeon. And you know, like, as women, we all want to look beautiful. We all want to know more about beauty and longevity. And this is what you do a lot. So I said, I'm going to email these very famous doctors in California and New York and I'm going to do lives with them on my Instagram page. And I did 100 lives, I swear, for free, just because I was bored during COVID Do you know that's how
- [10:13]
BiohackIT Host
I started the podcast. I would do biohack. It used to be at one stage I was just doing Instagram lives. During the pandemic, I was like, wait, I wanna meet people in person and have these conversations.
- [10:22]
Nada Bashan
Exactly. And it's so nice how this evolved. And then, and then after the lives, I started getting a lot of requests, more requests on like just doing ads. And then at the time, I was having my kids. Like, I had my first son, my second son, to be honest, I was struggling with my weight so I didn't feel like I fit the fashion business at the time. You 20 kilos above my weight between each pregnancy, two kids between three and a half years, four. So I was getting a lot of mommy in me, which is not my, my Persona I think on Instagram. So I just started doing what I'm doing, focused on my business. I had my, I had my store, I opened the Paddle Court. At the same time I have a home service spa. So all this was growing.
- [11:01]
BiohackIT Host
So you were always very entrepreneurial?
- [11:03]
Nada Bashan
Always. And I don't know why I always like to do work on startup startups. Although everyone like, you know, tells me I should start investing more in stocks, but it's not my thing and I just like really seeing something small being built from scratch and like, you know, I like building like private equity. If I come to invest, this is the kind of investments I, I like. So basically then I started getting a lot of business in terms of like the fashion business and beauty business. As I started evolving in the field and started creating, how can you say, content creator, clean page with a good aesthetic, I started understanding the business more. What the brands are looking for, who am I, what I'm going to do, what am I targeting? During that period I get a call again to try another field. Why don't you become a TV presenter on NBC? I was like, of course not.
- [11:49]
BiohackIT Host
And how long ago was this?
- [11:50]
Nada Bashan
This is three and a half years ago.
- [11:52]
BiohackIT Host
Just when Saudi had started opening up.
- [11:53]
Nada Bashan
No, but even, even after like Saudi has really opened up quite for like more than like I think now, eight years. Like I used to work, when I started working in banking, I was one of the few women that worked in corporate. It was more, more of a fee, it was more of a male field. So I was one of. Actually we were only three women in the whole corporate floor. So from my time to now, I think there's a huge transition and I'm really thankful to see that. I, you know what's also so nice as a Saudi woman is because I come from like, you know, I went to college 2000 and now we're 20, 25. So to see the transition in exactly 25 years, it's huge. And living the transition from someone from my generation, you see the gap and you see how amazing it is to see such a country grow so much and do so much for women and for what's happening and like the whole world is looking at Saudi now and I'm so glad you came and Visited us recently.
- [12:46]
BiohackIT Host
I thought it was absolutely incredible.
- [12:48]
Nada Bashan
What did you think? You tell me.
- [12:49]
BiohackIT Host
I thought Saudi is like evolving and shaping and changing so fast. And the fact that, and I always say this, I was like, you look at people, a country like Saudi Arabia, the Kingdom, you look at the uae. Not every country needs democracy because you look at the success these countries are having and how they're scaling their people. They're getting on a world map, they're evolving, they're shifting, they're changing. And at the same time, really, you talk to the citizens of the country and they're so proud. Saudis are so nationalistic, they're so proud to be Saudi. And I think that's embedded in your culture.
- [13:21]
Nada Bashan
It really is. And this is, I am so proud to be Saudi. Especially now, like, you know, when I travel and I feel like you have to be like an ambassador for your country and talk about it because it's so impressive. Where I've been, everybody looks at Saudi as a old country, but Saudi is a very young country. So when you come and compare it to like the US or like for example, places like Europe, you can't really compare. So where we are today is something really amazing. People don't realize how short notice this has happened.
- [13:46]
BiohackIT Host
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- [15:19]
Nada Bashan
And what's amazing about Saudi is when you're in Saudi, you're sitting among Saudis, you're eating among Saudis. You get into the Uber driver, he is a Saudi. You go to McDonald's and you. You order. The guy behind the counter is Saudi. So this is not a country that's just. We're 33 million, if I'm not wrong today. And what's amazing to see is that we are in every field, we're in every sector. You really meet the people in the country. You're not meeting foreigners in our country. And we are people that are so hospitable, and we love foreigners to visit and we love people coming in. And in Arabic they say, which is we are hospitable. That's what I'm trying to say. So let me go back to the TV story of my life. So this agent called Hadi Hajjar, who's quite famous here, has a company called HU Management. And he's like, neda, why don't you try tv? I was like, honestly, my Arabic is not the strongest. I studied in Boston. I haven't tried. I haven't. Like, I'm not on the level of. Of a tv TV presenter. I'm quite liberal. I don't know if I can say, if I can talk, like, be censored because, you know, this is a live show.
- [16:20]
BiohackIT Host
Yeah.
- [16:21]
Nada Bashan
And he's like, neda, this is what they want. They want someone that speaks their mind. They want someone more modern. And I was like, are you sure? And he's like. He's like, why don't you just try it out? And I just sent him. My name is Nada Bashan and I'm from Jeddah, and this is me and good morning or something. So just like a basic. And then they come for a casting. I was like, what's a casting? He was like, a casting is when you come with other people and they try you out. Of course I read the lines on the screen all wrong. I didn't. I said, they were obviously not call me back. They called me back like an hour later, and they basically five days or one week later, told me, please, we want you on the show. And it was amazing. And I was like, you know what? What's the worst that can happen in life? It's nice to try new things. And it's a celebrity, basically. It's like the show I'm on is called Kalam Nawam, and it's like the view of the Middle East. So we have four women sitting on a table, and we have a celebrity every week and a success story. It's all in Arabic. And we get people from all over the Middle east, like, from, like every Arab country, of course, has to be speaking Arabic, speaking, you know, guests. And what's been so nice is that you meet so many people from all across the world. And this door has opened a lot of interviewing opportunities for me. So I've. I presented the JOY Award several times. I presented the Red Sea Film Festival, which is all new to me. And I really am someone that believes that it's nice to. To. To give it a try.
- [17:43]
BiohackIT Host
Why not?
- [17:44]
Nada Bashan
Why not? What's the risk? What's the worst that can happen? Right?
- [17:48]
BiohackIT Host
Do you. Out of everybody you've met or interviewed on your show, who has impacted you the most in a personal level, plus a professional?
- [17:56]
Nada Bashan
To be honest, I'm not someone that really can tell you there's one person that impacted me. I'm gonna be honest with you because I feel that there are certain things about each person that impact you in a different way. A story could, for example, someone can tell you a story that could really impact you, and then someone can tell you another experience. So from all the guests that we've got on the show, each one had the story. Like, for example, I remember one story from one actress, and she said that basically she spent all her 30s trying to. To basically find the right man. And when she found the right man, she couldn't have kids. And she wasn't really pushing for her to have kids, although he didn't have any. And she thought he didn't want to have kids because he wasn't really into her and he didn't want to have a child from her. And then he told her, I don't want to have a kid because look at this world and that this world is so harsh and hard that I don't feel like I really want to have a child in this world. I would rather be a father to many. And this is a story that really, like, this is a very famous actor, actress.
- [18:53]
BiohackIT Host
Where was she from?
- [18:54]
Nada Bashan
Egypt. And it was really nice to hear such a story. Then you hear other stories about women struggling in the field and cinema and. And how they really worked so hard to basically get to where they are. And you think you're actually working hard. And you see that's even harder. So many stories like that impact me in different ways. And you take these hardships and things you learn, and you basically learn from them.
- [19:19]
BiohackIT Host
What has been probably one of the hardest things in your career that you came across, especially in this evolution and
- [19:26]
Nada Bashan
career or personal life?
- [19:27]
BiohackIT Host
Both.
- [19:28]
Nada Bashan
Okay. Career wise, it's the hardest thing. As a mom, I think of two and two young boys. Like, my son is seven and the other one is just transferring four, actually, before yesterday. So during this whole period of growth for me, I was trying to manage being a mom and a wife and managing three businesses and flying in and out. When I started the this TV show, it was flying weekly to Dubai. And I'm based in Jeddah. So the past seven, I've been married for nine years. And nine years we've moved. I've moved, let's say. You can say I've moved two times. I've had two kids and during COVID And at the same time, my husband moved to another city. So my husband lives in Riyadh, I live in Jeddah. We both commute on the weekend. I'm commuting for work. Two kids below the age of seven. Right. It's not easy.
- [20:16]
BiohackIT Host
How did you meet your husband?
- [20:18]
Nada Bashan
I met him here in Dubai, actually.
- [20:21]
BiohackIT Host
And he's Saudi?
- [20:21]
Nada Bashan
No, he's from Kuwait, actually. So now you have the international. So basically this is the hard part. Like the mom side. Managing my. Managing being a mom and not feeling guilty sometimes because, you know, I think we all have guilt. But at the same time, I don't want to be this mom that just, you know, I'm just a mom. Because I feel like as a mom of two boys, it's nice to let your boys see a mom that's working, that's achieved. They learn from that. Yeah, of course. This is one. My dad was very unwell. The past four years, my dad has been unwell. And that has given me such a heavy heart, you know, like seeing someone that used to be your best friend can't speak anymore and he can't be. He can't be who he is. So for me, my best friend and my confidant is just basically not there anymore. Like, he's there, he's present, but he's just not there. So that, for me was, I think, my biggest pain. I think aside from just being away from my kids sometimes my father, technically I lost my dad, but he's still there. So that is actually, I think, the hardest. I think it's the Hardest thing any girl. I'm the eldest daughter, so I'm sure I don't know if you relate or. Father figure is totally different. Like it's something else from. For a woman.
- [21:36]
BiohackIT Host
I lost my father four years ago. We had a difficult relationship towards the end. But I will say that having that bonding connection with that first male figure in your life is so important. It really shapes you, become who you are and teaches you a lot of really strong values systems.
- [21:49]
Nada Bashan
Your father is your backbone. He's your strength. Not every, not. Not in every case, obviously, but in my case, he was like my best friend, my backbone. And I always say, no matter what, your husband always is a husband. But your father is different father. So this was very hard for me. This is the hardships, the kids and how you want to go back to where I met my husband.
- [22:10]
BiohackIT Host
No, I want to ask you what happened to your father because you and I connected over wellness as well. Is that what kind of sparked your interest in wellness and health?
- [22:20]
Nada Bashan
To be honest, actually, I didn't link it. But now that you're talking about it, this is actually the time I started focusing more on my health because my dad got diagnosed with like. It's called cbs. It's like dementia. It's like one of the dementia and Alzheimer, you know, diseases, you can say. So it's the time I actually started focusing on like eating better, sleeping better. I started reading a lot more about how. What I should take and what I shouldn't take. What I started doing things so differently. I sleep early, I wake up. I started doing weightlifting, which I never did before. I just thought I should always work out. And cardio. Cardio. I started taking NMN and nad and I started taking resveratrol and I started looking into sleep. It's actually. People talk about biohacking so much, but mainly biohacking is what. It's discipline. It's actually discipline. It's waking up early, sleep, sleeping early, avoiding your phone at night. It's taking the right medications and pills. It's a way of life. It's become trying to be more calm and meditating.
- [23:18]
BiohackIT Host
Absolutely.
- [23:18]
Nada Bashan
Which I never did before. Actually, the meditating part started very recently. I didn't even start three years ago. I was always a person that's always on the go and on the run. So it's also spirituality. It's a combination of many things. So that's when I started. But I don't think I realized it until you asked me now.
- [23:35]
BiohackIT Host
Yeah, something always sparks it. The one thing I will say When I was in Saudi, I noticed is a. The country consumes a lot of sugar, a lot. And so if you look at things like Alzheimer's or Parkinson's and dementia, a lot of these things are sparked from bad microbiome health. And sugar degrades that and speeds that up. One thing. Second thing I noticed is a lot of Saudis, they sleep super late, very late, and they wake up then, therefore, late, so their circadian rhythm is blown up off. When your circadian rhythm is off, you don't have good mitochondrial health. And in Saudi Arabia, people in this part of the world, Generally, people are 80% more susceptible to diabetes. It's a really big problem here because everything has sugar in it.
- [24:16]
Nada Bashan
Everything. And when you eat, even if you're not eating sugar, you're eating carbs, a lot of carbs.
- [24:21]
BiohackIT Host
And that turns into sugar.
- [24:22]
Nada Bashan
And no protein, not enough protein. The intake of protein. Protein is low. The mentality of working out is so different. Like. Like, it's. Women always have this theory that if I weightlift, I'm going to be bulky, not at all. And they don't look at the, like, the side effects that, like, what happens to you if you don't actually weightlift? You get the osteoporosis. And to me, I actually think I look way better in my 40s now than my 20s and my 30s. I'm healthier, I'm better quality of sleep. And to me, now, when I say I need to sleep early, it's not just because, like, you know, I just want to wake up early tomorrow morning. It's one day a week. No, it's actually a lifestyle.
- [24:56]
BiohackIT Host
Yeah. You know, and so going back to. I think everybody would want to know, how did you meet your husband?
- [25:02]
Nada Bashan
Yeah. Okay. So I met him in Dubai. Okay. It was actually the day of my birthday, which is weird. And I was. I. I planned to move to Dubai at the time. I actually rented an apartment here. I wanted to move my. My retail business here, and I opened a company. And the day I rented the apartment, my neighbor, who was a good friend, who was with me also in college, was living above. And so I went over because they were cleaning my apartment and I went for lunch, and then we were chilling, and he's like, nadia, this really handsome guy is coming. I was like, oh, come on. Whatever. All your fans are terrible and a disaster. I'm not gonna waste my time. I'm. I'm here. Let's just chill. And then he comes in and we just start talking. And, you know, I was In a phase in my life where I just really wanted to focus on work, and I wasn't really concentrating on that I wanted to meet anyone. Like, I just really wanted to. Like, I wanted to be in Dubai to live my life, and that's it. And if I didn't even think. If anything comes along, I don't know why. I was in a very concentrated phase, let's say focused. Focused on. On my career at the time. And then the next day, he called me. He's like, do you want to have lunch? And I really had nothing to do. I was like. I was like, why not? And I went to lunch, and he started calling me. And then he came the weekend after to Dubai, and the weekend after and after. And then. And then he defined it, and he wanted to define your relationship, the relation. To me, this is, like, music to my ears. I was like a man calling me all the time. Is there anything wrong with him? I think when you see someone that is very nice and open, you find it very hard to believe. Right. It's not. It's not something you see come across every day. Yeah, yeah. And it just worked out, and it flowed. And then he met my mom, and then he met my dad. And then my dad was not very happy that. That he was from Kuwait because he didn't want me to move to Kuwait. And he felt that that was so far. It was like an hour and a half away. And then he met him, and he really liked him. And this is how it evolved. I got married in Dubai because that's where we met, and was a good middle for our friends and his friends. And it turned out that, like, 80%. Like, not. Not 80%, but, like, we had so many common friends that we realized we had. That we never knew, but we never knew each other. Right. So when on our wedding day, like, our whole wedding list was almost mutual friends, which was beautiful because he studied in Miami, actually, and I studied. Sorry, Florida. And I studied in Boston, although we never knew each other. He came to Boston. I never met each other.
- [27:19]
BiohackIT Host
And you guys are the same age?
- [27:20]
Nada Bashan
No, he's. He's 81, and I'm 83. So we're like, a year and a half apart. So it's nothing. Yeah, it was. It's so. So I think this is how the story began.
- [27:29]
BiohackIT Host
I want to ask you, being a Saudi woman married to a Middle Eastern guy, and knowing that a lot of my audience is obviously North American and they listen to the podcast. How has it been for you building the career and how's the support being at home with your husband.
- [27:45]
Nada Bashan
Luckily, I've always had a very supportive father in terms of business and career and a very supportive husband. I don't think everybody gets lucky with that especially, but I think not just in the Middle East. I think worldwide. I think it has nothing to do with the country. I think it has to do with the man you're with. Some men love a working woman, and they love a woman that's independent. Some men find this very intimidating. I think most men find women that are very achieved or very on the go or excited to have a business intimidating, and very few men actually accept it. But my husband is from Kuwait, and Kuwaiti women are known to be very entrepreneurial and very strong. And his mother is a strong woman. She has a massive master's degree from back in God knows when, and she was teaching in the university. His dad is the first architect in Kuwait as well. And I think also me coming from a father that also was very pro education. Like, my aunts were all working women. My mom wasn't a working woman, but my. All my aunts were working.
- [28:44]
BiohackIT Host
Yeah.
- [28:44]
Nada Bashan
So my dad didn't really have this belief. Like, when I went to college and came back, he's like, so where are you gonna go? Work? And he cut my credit card, and he's like, now you came back. Now it's time for you to find a job. To me, all my other friends didn't really have that pressure. That pressure or urgency. My dad is like, I didn't send you abroad to just, like, do nothing.
- [29:01]
BiohackIT Host
Were you the first in your family to go abroad for college, a woman?
- [29:06]
Nada Bashan
No. My aunt went to the American University of Beirut. My dad was in the American University of Beirut. Then he went to the University of Petroleum and Midlers after the war in Lebanon at the time. But no, my aunts went to college in Lebanon at the time. The time. Back in the day. But college abroad, as in, like you're talking about, not Middle east, like the States. Yes. I was the first one to go to the States from my father's side. Yeah, I was the first grandkid as well. So, yeah.
- [29:31]
BiohackIT Host
I was gonna ask you which beliefs from your upbringing have stood the test of time, in which have you had to reimagine beliefs, beliefs, values, programming that you were given growing up?
- [29:45]
Nada Bashan
My. My father is someone that is extremely, extremely. He really believes in having a goal in life. And my mother is the woman that really wanted me to be married and have kids, and she wanted me to have all the degrees but she wanted you to be and do all the, all the hobbies. Like you know, she wanted me to play tennis and she wanted me to have a master's degree and even if PhD, she wouldn't mind. But at the same time she wanted me to be married with. Because this is her priority in life. My father didn't have that belief system, although he was Saudi and he's like a very conservative man in many ways, but he was a very true liberal at heart. Like he believed a woman should always have her own money and she should be independent and that she should actually make sure that she can take care of herself. And this is something, I don't know why. I come from a comfortable background. So to me I don't understand why he really pushed so hard on that level.
- [30:37]
BiohackIT Host
I think maybe he wanted you to know that even if he's not there and God forbid the time that he's not there because you know, life is a circle of life, you will still be able to stand on your own two feet and not rely on somebody else.
- [30:48]
Nada Bashan
And you know, honestly there's somethings have happened in my life which I can't share so much. But like, to be fair when you know and say something like something really difficult happened in my life and I actually had to rely on myself for like a period of time and I wouldn't have been capable or where I am today if I didn't have the education he gave me. He was a bit harsh on the backbone like he was. So the values I learned was to basically be independent. He preached that so much. You had to make your own money, you need this and you need that. Like it was a bit much, I think. But today all I do every day on my show is to preach that you need to be financially independent as a woman. Because realistically you cannot leave a bad husband if you have no money. You cannot build on your own if you have no money. And how do you make money and education? You have a career and a lot of women, sadly, and I think this is all over the world. Not again. Saudi Arabia or Middle east. They get married to a well off man or a rich man. They get very comfortable. He finds a younger woman or he cheats or he cheats or, or not even that. You just grow out of love. You're unhappy and you just stay in the marriage because you have no roof over your head and you can not do anything. And this is our mother's generations, a lot of women stayed. Why does this generation have to, to do the same if you're independent, you don't need to stay with a man that doesn't treat you well or you're unhappy. You can actually just leave. And women that can leave are more threatening for men, and you scare them so they respect themselves more.
- [32:11]
BiohackIT Host
Yeah. I think as a woman in today's day and age, no matter what culture you come from, you need to always be able to stand on your own to some capacity. Because a man needs to know that this person's not going to accept my show. And she can be an amazing wife, she can be an amazing mother, but if I cross a line, she has the strength to walk away. Even if she decides to slow down her career or even have this amazing career and then decide, okay, I'm gonna be a housewife for a little bit and raise these children. But at the same time, you have the strength to be like, I can pick the pieces back up and leave if you disrespect me.
- [32:41]
Nada Bashan
I so agree with you. And so in terms of values, this is what I really believe in. Like. Like making your own money, being independent. The things I actually feel like I wasn't really doing the early. Like, not early, like in. And, like, say, in my 20s and my 30s, I wasn't very spiritual, I think, I feel. And this is something that.
- [32:57]
BiohackIT Host
But that's a lot of us, because I think religion has thrown down on us so much while growing up. Like, my mom was super religious, not conservative.
- [33:06]
Nada Bashan
My mom wasn't very. She was decent. That's normal.
- [33:08]
BiohackIT Host
But my mom did the hajjat. Like, it's like, you know, she was like, super religious. And I finished the Quran three times and. But she was very liberal at the same time. So I grew up.
- [33:18]
Nada Bashan
It was a nice middle.
- [33:19]
BiohackIT Host
Yeah, yeah, she was a nice middle.
- [33:20]
Nada Bashan
But it was.
- [33:20]
BiohackIT Host
They were so conservative in some ways. And I grew up in a household that women should be independent and really push for education, but really also pushed religion down my throat. And so say that namaz. Do this. I'm like, I don't wanna do it. You know, leave me alone.
- [33:32]
Nada Bashan
Pushed so much, you don't want to. And I think all of us at a certain point in our lives were really, like, pushed. Cause you have to do this. You have to. But it's really weird when I'm telling you spirituality, this is something I got into, like the past three months. So new. So new. Like, you know what I mean? And I just feel sometimes when you. When you go through, like, hardships in life and stuff, sometimes you don't know how to deal. And I'm not someone that always likes to go to. I'm not a person that does therapy and stuff like that. I know a lot of people believe in it, but I would rather vent to a friend. And that's your therapy? That's my therapy.
- [34:00]
BiohackIT Host
That's your therapy.
- [34:01]
Nada Bashan
And sometimes I feel like therapy takes a different level. It doesn't always go the right way, in my opinion. But what I like is, like, sometimes having this time with myself, Like, I don't know if you call it meditating, whatever you do, and like, giving yourself that time with yourself. It could be reading the Quran, reading the Bible, reading whatever. But to me, this just gives me that sense of serenity and peace and whatever does that for you. Go ahead. You know what I mean?
- [34:25]
BiohackIT Host
I think we all need to connect to something beyond us and connect with the divine. Whether you call it Allah, you call it God, you call it Moses, whatever it may be to you. But you have to believe in something much greater than yourself. And you have to believe that there's a higher power out there who's taking care of you, who's looking out for you. And even if you just. Just if you don't say the traditional namaz, even if you stop and pray for five minutes within yourself, but to connect to something higher than yourself.
- [34:51]
Nada Bashan
Exactly. And this is so important. I think it gives you a balance in life. Sometimes we're always on the go. On the go. Like, look at you, traveling, coming here and there. Sometimes you just need to, like, take
- [34:59]
BiohackIT Host
a deep breath and just.
- [35:01]
Nada Bashan
I take the scum shot sometimes.
- [35:04]
BiohackIT Host
Which one is it?
- [35:04]
Nada Bashan
Happy Aging. And I take it before the show. Story time. And sometimes, like, have. And now I have a ritual before the show. What I do.
- [35:12]
BiohackIT Host
What is the ritual?
- [35:13]
Nada Bashan
Like, I pray.
- [35:14]
BiohackIT Host
Okay.
- [35:14]
Nada Bashan
I started praying and. And I read the Quran every day now. And it's something I never did before. Like, I did it only, like, during Ramadan, and I did at certain times of. In, like in a year. But this is something new. And I don't know how it started or what. What has driven me to start it, but it actually has given me so much peace. That's the word, peace. Giving me peace.
- [35:34]
BiohackIT Host
Things in life will find you when you're ready to receive them.
- [35:36]
Nada Bashan
Exactly.
- [35:37]
BiohackIT Host
People will find you. Opportunities will find you. Religion will find you when you're ready to receive it. So when our frequency changes, because we are built on energy and frequency and we align with different things, those things come into our life. That is why it's so important. I'M getting into a place in my life. It's so important to start slowing down a little bit and making room for new relationships or friendships or the ability to create and find new things.
- [36:00]
Nada Bashan
That's amazing. And you are right, like, sometimes, like, I made a decision this year, early this year. It's so funny. I think we are the same age, so this is why we're in the same. I think we're in the same phase. Yeah. So I said, this year I'm going to work smart, not hard, and I'm going to cancel a lot of work trips that to me, I've done before that could be unnecessary and spend more time with my friends, more time with my kids. And this is my priority this year. And this has actually what I've done. This is only I've been doing this the past four months and I swear to you, my work has been better. The amounts and budgets I'm getting are better and I'm working less.
- [36:36]
BiohackIT Host
You need to say no to more things in life to create room for yeses.
- [36:40]
Nada Bashan
On another note, you said, who impacted me? We just had a celebrity that was so sweet on the show a few days ago and her name is Sara Abi Kanan. And she's so sweet. And she was saying that she is a people pleaser and she doesn't know how to say no. And to her, saying no is like she's being rude. So she just started recently also trying to get out of this phase of learning how to say no, no. And to her, this is very hard. And who has helped her is her husband. And it's such a nice story that I heard this week, in addition to the fact that she's a stepmom to a girl and that she and that how she was talking about how being a stepmom is not very easy, but at the same time how she really has loved this child because of her love for the man. Yeah. So this was a nice story to hear. You can watch it.
- [37:24]
BiohackIT Host
Somebody asked me, you know, do you want to have kids? I said, I love children, but I don't want to have kids for the sake of having kids. I have to love my partner so much that I want to have a child with him.
- [37:35]
Nada Bashan
But I like, I like your answer because, you know, sadly, in our part
- [37:38]
BiohackIT Host
of the world as well, it's pushed on you.
- [37:40]
Nada Bashan
It's pushed on. No, no, no. It's not just it's pushed on you. What's pushed on you is the concept of marriage that everybody has to be married by this Age, everybody has to have. Or you're old or you're unhappy. Yeah. Some women.
- [37:50]
BiohackIT Host
Something is wrong with you. Why are you not married right now?
- [37:54]
Nada Bashan
Something is wrong. It's either what's wrong wrong with you. I remember back in the day in Arabic, a person told me, I got married at 32. So that was not young for Sal. So he's like, should he, like, it's like, push harder. Like work harder to get married. Yeah. And it was a father. He asked, he told me. I was like. And in my head I was like, work harder. What a comment. But honestly, what I don't like is how the perception of women has to. They always expect a woman to be married with kids, and this is happiness. But not every. And I'm not going to say this is for the. That marriage is not for everyone. Children are not for everyone. There are women that really don't care
- [38:27]
BiohackIT Host
to have children and they shouldn't have them.
- [38:29]
Nada Bashan
But there are people like, for example, like a friend of mine, she's like, no, I don't believe a woman can be happy if she doesn't have kids. And I disagree. I say not everyone is born to be a mother. Everyone is born. We're all different. I love my boys, but to be honest, before having my kids, I didn't stand kids, really. I couldn't stand kids before my children. I love my boys, but I'm still not that mother that is like into every child I see. I'm not gonna lie. I love my kids. I like to give them my time. But I'm not that extra maternal. I don't have that extra maternal instinct. I still hate going to parks with my kids and I don't enjoy kids activities, but I push myself for my children. So not every mother is born to enjoy all these things. I enjoy taking my kids to Cipriani and having taken them to a nice lunch.
- [39:16]
BiohackIT Host
I treat him like little adults.
- [39:17]
Nada Bashan
I treat them like little adults. And I don't think. I think it's so. It's. It's okay not to be married. It's okay not to have kids, and it's okay to be divorced, and it's okay to get married more than once. And it's okay to love again and again and again. It's a cycle of life.
- [39:30]
BiohackIT Host
You have to have the ability in yourself to do what feels right to you.
- [39:33]
Nada Bashan
Exactly.
- [39:34]
BiohackIT Host
And we live in a part of the. Our part of the world is so quick to judge and be so judgy and.
- [39:40]
Nada Bashan
But by the way, not. Not just our part of the world. It's worldwide, trust me.
- [39:44]
BiohackIT Host
Yeah, I think it is worldwide.
- [39:45]
Nada Bashan
South America, if you go to certain countries, if you go to like, like many other countries, you will see that they have an expectation. I think it's only like Scandinavian countries that are like very chill about marriage and children. But like, really, they all have an expectation of marriage. Like at least, okay, maybe not early 20s, but at least in the 30s, after 30s, like, when are you gonna get married? Egg freezing. It all becomes a topic.
- [40:09]
BiohackIT Host
It all becomes like, it's, it's fear mongering. This is what I believe. You have to do things at the alignment that is ready for you and not force yourself into situations. And if you are in a situation that does not align with you any further, have the courage to walk away.
- [40:22]
Nada Bashan
And you know what I don't like as well? Sadly, a lot of women jump into marriages that are so like, toxic. And some of them, from the beginning, they know this guy is not.
- [40:30]
BiohackIT Host
Oh, yeah, of course, she just gets
- [40:31]
Nada Bashan
into it because the pressure and because she says, I want to have kids. I never forget once actually I was sitting with a girl and she was so unhappy in her marriage. And this is back in the day. And you know what she told me? She's like, I just want to have one kid. And I was like, why? She's like, better be divorced with a kid than no, than no kid. And I was like.
- [40:51]
BiohackIT Host
And she was Saudi.
- [40:52]
Nada Bashan
Yeah. And this was a long time ago. And I was like, why? She's like, because, you know, I don't know if I'll ever remarry. And I told her it's actually, it's actually not true because divorced women have a better chance lately because they usually know what they want. They're more attractive. And I never forget that she was a very young girl. And I, I don't know what happened to her, honestly. I met her at work and it was a very wrong answer. Yeah, I really hope she didn't have a kid because honestly, if the marriage wasn't working out from the first year and a half or year, you don't. You actually wait.
- [41:22]
BiohackIT Host
Yeah.
- [41:22]
Nada Bashan
So sadly, you see a lot of women like that or a lot of women as well because they have no finances, financial independence. Independence. So she's like, if I have a kid, he'll support me and the kid.
- [41:30]
BiohackIT Host
Which is also not the reason to have a child.
- [41:32]
Nada Bashan
Exactly.
- [41:33]
BiohackIT Host
For our audience listening, what is one impression or reality that you want North America to know about? Saudi women today?
- [41:41]
Nada Bashan
Saudi women are, I think, very strong personalities. They are actually women that are working women. They're mothers, they're. They're in every field. They're empowered. The sad thing is, like, when they look at Saudi, they always look at us like, you know, behind a veil. They look at us as if you see the veil. They actually look at Saudi as that. But Saudi is full of culture, full of like, I don't know. There's not. I don't even know what to say because look at me today.
- [42:06]
BiohackIT Host
Yeah.
- [42:06]
Nada Bashan
And I'm like, one of many. And I'm achieved. I study, I worked, I built a career for myself. Imagine me with so many more stories like, imagine one of me. And like, there are so many stories like me. And I just sometimes really wish that people were. Remove them. The perception of women in the Middle east as not just Saudi, like, everywhere that we're like, just so close. We're not liberal. I really think even when we don't even not Saudi, like Kuwait. I'm going to give you a story. Kuwaiti men were. Because we know, my husband's from Kuwait, were pearl divers. And that's how they basically made the money. So the men used to go to sea for six months and they would basically go to dive to collect pearls. And who would run the household?
- [42:49]
BiohackIT Host
The women.
- [42:50]
Nada Bashan
The women. So this is. We're not talking on back in the day. So imagine a woman running the house, running the farm, running the kids, running everything, and her husband comes back and goes back to sea for half a year. So it's the same thing with Saudi women. It's this. But it's just not the. The perception is. We don't look at it this way. Yes, maybe women did not work absolutely back in the day and. But they had a different, like, role. They were raising the kids. They were home. This is another story. But I'm just saying that right now, right now, it has changed so much. It's so impressive. And now the workforce in Saudi, like, women are such good multitaskers. I was actually in a meeting here in Dubai and I was like, oh, wow, what an amazing team. I was 60 women in an agency and they were like, we realized that women can multitask better than men. Absolutely.
- [43:41]
BiohackIT Host
That's their superpower.
- [43:42]
Nada Bashan
That's why they're hiring more females than males. So I was so impressed. And this is just an example of how women are. It's not just women in Saudi, women everywhere, which is pretty strong, I think.
- [43:54]
BiohackIT Host
You know, when there's a statement to be like, oh, you should grow a pair of balls, it's actually like, you should have ovaries. Because believe me, we are much more resilient. Emotionally resilient. Yes. As we age, of course, our hormones shift and we are less resilient to certain types of stress. However, we're more resilient to different emotions. We have the ability to hold more, we have the ability to give more. We have so many different roles that we can play at the same time.
- [44:19]
Nada Bashan
You know something? On my show last week, I was talking about how women have. We are. We're so strong to an extent that we are so. We have become so practical. So practical to an extent that like I was saying, and the story. I was saying, I was like, women now, sometimes when they're having. They have a heavy heart or they're having a very bad day, she's probably cooking while she's crying. But she doesn't want to show her kids. She's sad because she wants the household to look stable. She has a fight with. Fight with her husband. Yet she's. She goes, she goes back, sees her kids and as if nothing happened, she has a horrible day at work, comes back home as if nothing happened. Because she is the. I'm going to say she's the amood. She's. She's basically the one that holds the household together. So it's not easy being a woman because you're taught to be so practical sometimes and basically lose feeling because you're the one that's managing everything. And about the question about Saudi, sometimes I always get asked this question and it's so hard to answer it because as you can see, there's so much happening, and I don't think there's one answer that can give it justice, honestly, about women in Saudi.
- [45:23]
BiohackIT Host
One of the things I was so excited about doing all these Middle east episodes was the Western media and the Western world has gone out of their way to paint the Middle east and people from this part of the world a certain way, Whether it's in movies, whether it's after 9, 11. We have been demonized again and again and again. And I know you're friends with Muhammad Islam as well. I interviewed him in Riyadh when I was there. And I'm just really excited to take more Middle Eastern voices back to North America and showcase the beauty, the strength, the resilience, but also the tolerance that we have as people in this part of the world. You know, yeah, we didn't have it easy.
- [45:57]
Nada Bashan
Like, you know, with all the respect, like, you know, especially Saudis. No, like, as women like for you to shine for you. It took, it took, it took more time. We're not at where our country is developing so fast, which is amazing. You know, I remember one of the CNN reporters, I don't remember who it was, she said that Saudi is growing on a snail's pace. And I. What I don't know about her name, I forgot very famous Kapoor a while while back. So now when I, when I remember that interview, I always say I want, I always wanted to, I wish I knew who she was.
- [46:27]
BiohackIT Host
Look at us for sure.
- [46:28]
Nada Bashan
Look at, look at, look at, look at me now or look at us now. So it's so impressive. Like, you know, I just really wish I remembered her name. It was, I didn't forget that.
- [46:37]
BiohackIT Host
You have to send it to me. Maybe we can add it to the show.
- [46:39]
Nada Bashan
I have to find it. I have to find it. But honestly, I'm so proud of where we are today.
- [46:44]
BiohackIT Host
You also do a really good job on your show because I was translating some of the videos to English. But you always speak from a place of vulnerability, right? And you open up about yourself. Has it been easy opening up on camera, knowing so many people are watching you and watching your show and being vulnerable and sharing your own personal insights and background?
- [47:01]
Nada Bashan
To be honest, like, I do share, but I don't think I share enough. I think I'm still filtered like, like me saying that I met my husband, husband before I married. Maybe some people don't like to share that they knew their husbands before, but I think it's very normal to at this stage in my life. I got married when I was 32. Obviously I was working and meeting men. So obviously I'm not going to say
- [47:21]
BiohackIT Host
that I had an arranged marriage.
- [47:23]
Nada Bashan
I had an arranged marriage. I like to be public and open about it. I met a good man and I'm so happy in my marriage, alhamdulillah, you know, 10 years together now. But in general, the sad thing about being on. There's a negative thing about being on TV because every time I talk about, we talk about a lot of topics. We talk about divorce, betrayal, love, pain. So every time you talk about something, they assume that this is going. You're going through it yourself. Like I was the other day. I was on my Instagram and I was like, by the way, I am a TV presenter and we have topics on the show. And when I talk about certain topics, it doesn't mean that I'm going through it. It means that I'm giving my insight on it. And there are topics that resonate with me and I will actually talk about it to it but doesn't mean when I'm talking about like two episodes ago, I was talking about pain and I was talking about friendships that I don't like overbearing friendships and. Or friends that call and why didn't you call me? Why didn't you? When we have all busy lives, I try to, I tend to move away from friendships that push so hard, suffocate me. And then I talked about relationships and I said with relationships, I'm different, I am more tolerant. I try to my partner, I try to have. If there's something that goes wrong, I will try to make it work. I will. And then we started talking about like my friend Shireen on the show was saying that usually men, if they didn't respect you and give you the value while they were with you, they will never give you value after. And I disagreed and I told her, actually you might never know because if some men realize that the value you had after you leave, although they have probably have an ego and might never tell you, but he will value that relationship because he will probably compare you to others. So such things like, for example, like I was talking about, oh my God, are you in pain? That did you go through pain? Did anyone hurt you? Did anyone break your heart? Are you divorced? Like, I always get this comment lately specifically that are you divorced? Are you still with your husband? Because I don't show him on my social media because I decided I wanted to.
- [49:21]
BiohackIT Host
Some men, men don't want to be shown.
- [49:23]
Nada Bashan
He doesn't like to be on social media. My husband's very private. So I started, I stopped posting him. So since that happened, it's like always, oh my God, we're sure she's divorced. It's like a topic. And I don't know why I'm so important to be a topic. It's to me, it's so irrelevant and it's a private, my private life. But the advantages, I have such great topics on the show. The disadvantages is that they relate that every topic is related to you.
- [49:44]
BiohackIT Host
Yeah.
- [49:45]
Nada Bashan
And I have a topic every week, so I'm pretty excited, I guess.
- [49:48]
BiohackIT Host
I think you know what it is. And I will say that because women being on TV talking about things like this are still new to the region, relationships, relationships especially. And talking openly about it is still not. It's still so fresh that they don't know how to perceive it. You know, I was talking to a friend the other day and I said, listen, the man that you meet today is always gonna be the man that he is. Yes, they might make more money or this and that, but how they relate to stress, how they relate to work, how quickly they anger who they are, that man will never change.
- [50:18]
Nada Bashan
Yeah.
- [50:18]
BiohackIT Host
And people are like, what do you mean? I was like. I'm just talking about in general. That is a research, and that is what it shows, you know, that men are the way you meet them. They will stay that way.
- [50:26]
Nada Bashan
They will not change. And they're not projects. And don't take a project to fix. You cannot fix a man. This is how he is. And stop change.
- [50:34]
BiohackIT Host
Women, however we evolve and change so much from where we are in our 20s, 30s, 40s, and 50s, we go on these journeys with ourselves and we. We discover spirituality and friendships in ourselves. And we keep on discovering ourselves.
- [50:48]
Nada Bashan
We keep growing.
- [50:49]
BiohackIT Host
Right. And men are different.
- [50:50]
Nada Bashan
And that's why I feel like a lot of women after like, like say 20 years of marriage or 25, suddenly here she's getting a divorce. Why? They fall out of love. They change. You change. You're not the same person you were at 20. That's at 40 or at 40, at 60. And it's. And I think it's healthy sometimes to move away. Like, I'm someone that's not against divorce as well.
- [51:09]
BiohackIT Host
Yeah.
- [51:10]
Nada Bashan
I feel if it makes you happier, why not? I'm pro remarrying and meeting someone new because, you know, I. I don't feel it's correct and right to just stay in a loveless marriage as well.
- [51:19]
BiohackIT Host
100%.
- [51:20]
Nada Bashan
I really have this belief that you can love again and again.
- [51:23]
BiohackIT Host
Honor yourself.
- [51:24]
Nada Bashan
True.
- [51:25]
BiohackIT Host
You have to honor your core belief systems. And I think the closer we get to ourselves through religion, through spirituality, through rediscovering our own inner truth.
- [51:34]
Nada Bashan
Truth.
- [51:35]
BiohackIT Host
If the relationship you are in is not honoring that anymore, then why would you live inauthentically? Out of design.
- [51:42]
Nada Bashan
No question. Since I'm the interviewer and today I'm being interviewed. What about you? In love lately? Tell me.
- [51:46]
BiohackIT Host
I'm actually going to be going through a divorce. Oh, yeah.
- [51:49]
Nada Bashan
Now for how many years?
- [51:51]
BiohackIT Host
I've been with my husband for five and a half years. However, he is one of my best friends.
- [51:56]
Nada Bashan
Okay. That's amazing.
- [51:57]
BiohackIT Host
I have the most love and respect for this man and. And I admire him so much, but we have just grown apart. And I decided. I'm 42. I'm in a place that I want to have kids, but I don't want to have kids for the sake of having kids. And I love and respect him. We've been friends for such a long time, and I have so much admiration for him. But I said to him that it's not fair for either one of us to be in something unless we can really be in it 100%. And I have changed so much, and my needs have changed, and I think I've gotten closer to who I am and what I want to be, and it just doesn't work for me anymore.
- [52:34]
Nada Bashan
But you see, what I liked about you, he's. Like you said, he's my best friend. He is. What I love about that is that amicable divorce is something very hard in general.
- [52:43]
BiohackIT Host
It's a conscious uncoupling, which is where I'm.
- [52:46]
Nada Bashan
I like the word conscious uncoupling. Yeah.
- [52:47]
BiohackIT Host
Listen, if Gwyneth Paltrow did it, why can't I do it? And, you know, it's funny you asked me that, because no one's spoken to me about it, but I'm really open about it if somebody does ask me. I'm very close to his family. And so for me, when I was
- [53:00]
Nada Bashan
from the same origin as you.
- [53:01]
BiohackIT Host
Yeah, we're both Pakistani. We've been friends for a very long time. So when it came to me making this decision, I think it was a really hard decision because his family is my family, and I did not ever want to lose that connection. And in a way, I don't think we will. I was telling somebody the other day, I see him being in my life for the rest of my life. I see him eventually being with a different partner and me being married to some. Somebody else and still being in each other's lives as friends.
- [53:25]
Nada Bashan
You don't think it would hurt you seeing him with someone else after I'm. Now I'm interviewing.
- [53:28]
BiohackIT Host
Yeah, we saw the conversation. Nana, you have to understand that I am no one to. No. Because you have to understand that I don't see him in that dynamic anymore. Right.
- [53:39]
Nada Bashan
The more of the friends.
- [53:40]
BiohackIT Host
And he is such an incredible person. Why should I hold him back from his happiness?
- [53:44]
Nada Bashan
I know.
- [53:45]
BiohackIT Host
He is such a wonderful man.
- [53:47]
Nada Bashan
Okay. Do you believe that in relationships there's always one party that wants out and one that wants a bit in?
- [53:52]
BiohackIT Host
No. I think it just depends on who you're with and what your dynamic is and what you both want. I don't think you can stay in a marriage unless you both have the same end goal and same end vision, same end views. And I think that has to be aligned.
- [54:05]
Nada Bashan
You know, I applaud you for being brave Enough to actually, at 42, you know, actually at 42, a lot of women are fearful. Correct. Of leaving the marriage. Because then I'm, how am I going to meet somebody else? Men are looking for younger women. Like I have a friend of mine, she's like, she's, she always makes me laugh. She's like, basically if anybody leaves now, they're looking for younger women. They're looking. And then they give us the example of Jeff Bezos wife and it's her third marriage and she's in her 50s and she passed menopause. She's found Jeff Bezos. Look at that.
- [54:35]
BiohackIT Host
Yeah, exactly.
- [54:36]
Nada Bashan
And I keep telling them that, they're like, that's a one off case.
- [54:39]
BiohackIT Host
Now that I believe that the person for you is out there. There are 8 billion people in this world.
- [54:45]
Nada Bashan
There must be one.
- [54:46]
BiohackIT Host
Am I going to sit there and believe.
- [54:48]
Nada Bashan
But there might be as well. Like I always like to be realistic. Sometimes you might meet that person and sometimes you might not. But it doesn't mean it's the end of the world.
- [54:55]
BiohackIT Host
I don't. I think you have to do what's right for you.
- [54:58]
Nada Bashan
Yeah.
- [54:58]
BiohackIT Host
And I always say, in my case, it was beautiful that neither one of us has hurt each other. None of us is to blame for anything. It was, it's for me, for both of us, it's extremely amicable. There is love and respect. She's actually my co founder in the media company and our third co founder is my sister in law who's my best friend.
- [55:16]
Nada Bashan
So you're really. It's a family affair.
- [55:18]
BiohackIT Host
No, no, it's a family affair and it will stay a family affair. And I always approach it from that perspective. You know anybody who speaks to me about him, I speak. Why would I not speak highly of him? I adore the man. I think he's incredible.
- [55:33]
Nada Bashan
And so I'm sure you were married for five years. You were dating for how long?
- [55:36]
BiohackIT Host
We weren't dating for that long, but we've known each other and we share a lot of our best friends. So our friend group is very similar.
- [55:42]
Nada Bashan
It's always going to be the same.
- [55:43]
BiohackIT Host
It's not going to be the same. Our family is so interconnected.
- [55:45]
Nada Bashan
That's very mature. That's very mature. It takes a lot to be to handle this your way and I love that.
- [55:50]
BiohackIT Host
And people were like, you're 42, what about having a kid? I'm like, guys, it's not about just settling down and having a kid. You have to be fulfilled in the chapter of your life. That you're in and. And sometimes your paths start changing, changing, and you want different things. I'm in a phase in my life that I'm looking to move back to the Middle East. I want to be closer to my family. I'm going to spend my time Dubai, between Dubai and Miami. So, listen, I know what I'm doing is out of the norm. You know, I'm taking a step. I choose me.
- [56:18]
Nada Bashan
It's exciting. And I believe in life. Sometimes you need to take, like, these big decisions and you need to change and take a risk.
- [56:25]
BiohackIT Host
You have to believe in the unknown. We just talked about spirituality. I believe that God has a plan for each and every one of us, and we will end up exactly where we're meant to be. And you have to trust yourself and that you will guide yourself through this.
- [56:38]
Nada Bashan
No, I agree with you 100%. And it's. It's nice to see. I wonder. I want. I wonder where I'll see you next year. Probably between here in Miami, you know,
- [56:47]
BiohackIT Host
with a lot of this part of the world, and to. I'm excited to see where my career goes. I'm excited to see where my life goes. I'm excited to see an evolution of my friendships. You know, I'm mashaallah. Really grateful to have a really amazing support system. And so he has a great support system, too. And just to see where our lives go and to look back and be like, I know that I'm doing the right thing for both of our sakes.
- [57:09]
Nada Bashan
That's so exciting. And I, like, I'm really proud of you, actually.
- [57:12]
BiohackIT Host
Thank you.
- [57:13]
Nada Bashan
This is a. It's a. It's a bold move.
- [57:15]
BiohackIT Host
Yeah. So we reversed roles now, but I want to leave our audience with a tip that you have for women listening about how to take the power back in their lives.
- [57:28]
Nada Bashan
It's a hard question. Take the power back in your life.
- [57:31]
BiohackIT Host
You know, honestly, you know, because we all have moments in our life that we feel powerless or confused or lost. So how can we find that strength again?
- [57:40]
Nada Bashan
You know, take a step back. I think for you to be. To have a clear vision of what you really want and how you can grow again is you need to really take a step. Step back and look at things from the outside. I think we all go through part. Like I think we feel sometimes we're overworked or overdoing or overdoing, and we're not getting the result of what we're doing. I've been through this recently, and I took a step back. I went to Switzerland this summer, which is so funny.
- [58:02]
BiohackIT Host
It's beautiful though, with the boys. You must have loved it.
- [58:05]
Nada Bashan
Not my cup of tea. But in general, because I think I, I, I, I, I, I like nature to Evian so much. So I don't love nature so, so much. I'm more of a city girl. But I took a step back and there were certain things that I looked at in a different phase, but not there. That's the shocking part. I'm so bored complaining while I was there, really. I, I took a step back after the summer, like, I think in like by mid August, I think I came back from the summer. I was traveling for three months. I came back and I stayed in Saudi for a good three weeks in a row for the first time. And I took a step back and I started thinking what I want to do different recently. And I started actually, like, let's say, applying this in September and October. And I think now that we're hitting November, I think I feel I'm getting into a very good flow. The spirituality has increased in my life. I feel like my work has been better in ways I planned doing something that I'm actually working on right now that I've been planning for two years that I never did. I focused more on my, my businesses and a lot of operational things and my kids, kids, more time with my kids. I canceled a lot of things. I shouldn't have canceled for this because I felt it wasn't the time for them. And like, after my grandmother passed away, I felt I wanted to grieve and usually Neda would just jump in again. And I did take that time for myself and I got the very hopefully. Hopefully you'll see soon. But I can't say this now. I got a deal that I really wanted to get for the past five years in this influencer field, which I never thought I would get at 42. And I'm so proud of that with an international brand that's going to be big. And I'm filming it tomorrow, inshallah, God willing. So to me, a lot of things worked out after I took that step back. Yeah. So don't always, like, I am the worst. The biggest example of someone that rushes and I'm impatient and I'm a go getter. But I really think after all these years, this is the first time I took a step back. And I also think I there were some things that were happening that I feel like I undervalued myself. And now I'm learning how to love me again and value myself. Again, sometimes you go to a phase where you feel a bit insecure and
- [60:10]
BiohackIT Host
have imposter syndrome and all that self doubt.
- [60:13]
Nada Bashan
Self doubt. Insecure. You feel you're chasing. And I think, honestly, when I took a step back, I realized, what are you doing? Wake up. Look at you.
- [60:23]
BiohackIT Host
I think a lot of us in our 40s, especially, our hormones change, life changes all day. This stuff have to retake our power back. And what does that mean? Is very personal to each woman. But I think to stop. Create space. Re. Empower yourselves with things that make you feel good. Surround yourself with the right people. And all of us go through imposter syndrome.
- [60:43]
Nada Bashan
My son the other day told me, mama, look at you, Mama, you're so beautiful. You're smart, you're sweet, you're kind. You're rich.
- [60:54]
BiohackIT Host
I just think it's a priority.
- [60:55]
Nada Bashan
He says, I'm rich because I can't buy him toys. And I was like. And it was so nice he was telling me this, and I was like, you know, sometimes you really need. You hear it from a child.
- [61:02]
BiohackIT Host
Yeah.
- [61:02]
Nada Bashan
And like, you needed to hear it. So now I always look in the mirror and I tell him, you have to say these things to say I'm smart. I tell my son now to look in the mirror in the morning and
- [61:10]
BiohackIT Host
tell his future wife that as well.
- [61:11]
Nada Bashan
Yeah, I'm smart. I'm gonna speak Arabic more. I'm this, I'm that. And he does it in the mirror every time he goes to school. And I. I taught him that because I started doing it myself because it gives you that boost. Who did I see recently? Chelsea lately or something. And she said good morning to my amazing self or something, you have to do that more. You need to teach yourself to love yourself. Even sometimes when you're like, when you're in doubt. When you're in doubt. And we all go through this phase, we're not always strong.
- [61:36]
BiohackIT Host
No, of course not.
- [61:37]
Nada Bashan
We have moments that break us. Life breaks you.
- [61:40]
BiohackIT Host
And yeah, life will bring you down on your knees, only to rebuild stronger from where you were.
- [61:46]
Nada Bashan
Exactly. And really, thank you for having me on this podcast. We've been planning it for quite some
- [61:51]
BiohackIT Host
time, and it worked out by chance,
- [61:54]
Nada Bashan
you were going to be in the lobby. Of course we managed to get a date.
- [61:57]
BiohackIT Host
And I'm just so excited to share you with my community, share you with my audience, and show such a beautiful side of the Middle east and Middle Eastern women. Thank you.
- [62:05]
Nada Bashan
And I'm glad to share you on my platform as well, because I get to know you more I get to know more about biohacket. Honestly, not a lot of people also know much about biohacking in our part of the world, so I think you're what's amazing about your podcast is like, you were like, you can say you're going to be the eye opener to something very new, like longevity. Biohacking is very new in our part of the world. And I know you were part of the summit now in Saudi, so that's great. I'm looking forward to seeing more of you in our part.
- [62:30]
BiohackIT Host
Thank you for coming on the show.
- [62:31]
Nada Bashan
Thank you for having me.